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- [00:01]
Michael
Ray Ban Meta lets you explore the world without a screen getting in the way so you can stay present in the moment.
- [00:06]
Joanna
Hey Meta, tell me what kind of dessert this is. That's a Stroopwafel, a Dutch waffle with spiced syrup in the middle. Is it sweet? Yes. Perfect for a snack or dessert.
- [00:18]
Michael
Mmm, delicious. Get answers on the go without interrupting your flow. Ray Ban Meta Iconic Style meets Meta AI Available at Walmart and other authorized retailers. This episode is brought to you by Fox 1. Watch all 104 matches of the FIFA World cup live in 4K for just $19.99 a month with three days free. Build your own multiview. Choose up to three streams and follow player spotlights. Stay on top of every moment with live stats, highlights and instant replays. The FIFA World cup streaming live on Fox One offers a subject to change. See fox.com for complete terms and conditions. Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this, but anyone can get the same Premium Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have one of your assistant's assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to do@mintmobile.com
- [01:18]
Joanna
Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month Required intro rate first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees, extra fee, full terms@mintmobile.com this
- [01:31]
Michael
is top his agenda. This is taking more time within the White House than any other issue. This is more important than the war. This is more important than immigration. This is more important than the midterms. Washington is the legacy that I leave. It's a particular Trumpian response. It's him imposing himself. He's inescapable, unignorable, ubiquitous. He is creating a Washington that will forever evoke his name. Donald Trump. I was here.
- [02:17]
Joanna
Michael.
- [02:19]
Michael
Joanna. You're in the uk in your childhood bedroom again.
- [02:28]
Joanna
Well, this is not my childhood bedroom. This is my father's study. It would be weird if I had all these cricketing almanacs in my childhood bedroom. I'm back in the uk. What?
- [02:38]
Michael
What is in your childhood bedroom? I think we might be curious about that.
- [02:42]
Joanna
Do you know what's in my childhood bedroom? Just piles and piles of books. Actually. I, I now look back and think, actually I did do something as a kid. I, I read a lot. I read a lot. So that's that. The, the only thing that's really remaining is is books.
- [02:57]
Michael
So today we're going to do. Well, of course we're going to do the Iranian deal. Deal. Even the word deal, is it a deal or is it just a.
- [03:08]
Joanna
No, it's a memo of understanding. And I think you and I should have a memo of understanding. I don't know what would be in it, but I think we could have a memo of understanding.
- [03:17]
Michael
And we're gonna do, of course, the UFC fight and the 250th birthday of the United States of America, which apparently is now going to become a celebration of Donald Trump. And then the remaking of Washington, D.C. which is also apparently becoming a monument to Donald Trump and his fight with the Republican leadership in the Senate. Why he would go to battle with his allies. Well, it is Donald Trump.
- [03:55]
Joanna
And I would like to discuss Pete Hegseth's change of wardrobe. He dismounted his plane wearing a sort of plaid shirt and a strange sort of tabard on top of it and a trucker hat. A trucker hat. Michael, this is a man who went to Princeton and who was a co host on Weekend Fox News, and he's wearing a trucker hat and a weird plaid shirt, trying to look as if he's come straight from the Iowa State Fair. Great.
- [04:26]
Michael
Well, let's do it.
- [04:28]
Joanna
And just to remind you, please hit the subscription button. We are trying to get to 700,000 subscribers by the end of the month. We're almost there. Actually, I think we might get there. So if you haven't subscribed, please do and share the podcast with your friends. There's always lots to discuss and you may feel free to shout at whatever device you're listening to this podcast on or watching this podcast on and disagree with us. And please put your comments in the comment field. We love to read them. And I've not been as good as I usually am at answering them, but I'm getting back into the rhythm of it and I hope to join our premier conversations again once the podcast drops, when I'm back on American time zones. Michael, do we need a memo of understanding? I like the idea of just memos of understanding. What are our understandings of anything, really?
- [05:23]
Michael
A memo of understanding that appears to understand nothing or no one understanding, understands each other, or there is nothing to understand, or that's what we have. What has this war produced? It has produced neither peace, nor an advantage to us, nor anything else that gets us anything except the memo. We now have a memoir.
- [05:58]
Joanna
We have a memo. I mean, nobody wants the memo. Nobody likes Memos.
- [06:02]
Michael
Well, it's interesting because I had a conversation yesterday with a White House person, and I was trying to pin them down because this certainly seems like nothing is what it seems like. It seems like an embarrassment. It seems like Donald Trump has acceded to the inevitable. The Iranians have squeezed him and won. I mean, that's what it seems like. So I pressed someone in the White House and I said, okay, come on, give me the bottom line on this. I mean, how are people in the White House seeing this? And this person says, and I quote, it is what it is. Now, I can't think of a real, of a more depressing interpretation of the end of a war. It really is a capitulation. It is what it is, and it is obviously nothing. So here we are.
- [07:14]
Joanna
Well, here we are. We're in a worse position than we were when we went to war with billions of dollars, tons of arms, worse off than we were. And Trump promised total, you know, he wanted total surrender by the Iranians. And in fact, that's what we appear to have done. We're in a worse position than we were before we started the war.
- [07:38]
Michael
I mean, I think it is. And there's a lot of people trying to parse this, and they're parsing it in a way that certainly recognizes that we're not coming out with anything much on this. But I actually think that most of the parsing kind of gives Trump slightly the benefit of the doubt. Well, it's not what he wanted, it's not what he said he was going to get, but it is at least an end, and at least the Strait of Hormuz is open. But. So I don't think anybody has quite gotten to the real nut of this, which is that we are paying to open the Strait of Hormuz. So they closed the Strait of Hormuz, and in order to open it, we have given them what we've been that we've refused for years to give them, which is all of the Iranian money that we have froze that existed in US Banks, which has been frozen. Now, we are saying, okay, you know, uncle, we're going to give you this money if you just open the strait. So we have bribed them to open the strait. Could there be a worse outcome?
- [09:02]
Joanna
Well, there could be a worse outcome. I mean, the one thing you can say is that the loss of American soldiers lives has been really limited here. I mean, it's still devastating, of course, to the families involved. But, Michael, what I want to know what is going on inside Trump's head here, he flies off to the G7, he announces that the war is over. The G7, the heads of the G7 are all like, oh, Mr. President, you're brilliant, marvelous resolution. Meanwhile, they're all shaking their heads at each other. They does he know that? Does he know this is a total capitulation, that it's in effect a surrender?
- [09:48]
Michael
Yeah, no, I think that that again makes the, that's the fallacy that Trump has self awareness. He has no self awareness. So this is just finished. I mean, and I think he has the capacity to block this out. This is in the past, it's over with no, no regrets, no second guessing, no thinking what I should have done instead of what I did. Which is why, which is what kind of makes Donald Trump, Donald Trump. There is no, at no point does he question himself. And that's what I mean, I think it will just be, I think we won't see this again. We now have a 60 day deadline to, to finish, to get a final agreement which will never happen in 60 days. It won't happen in 90 days, it won't happen 120 days. It will just roll down and will essentially be forgotten. So what we have now is what we're going to get. There will be no real agreement on, on the Iranian nuclear capacity. The Strait of Hormuz will be open, but we have basically tacitly agreed that they'll be able to charge fees for the passage to the Strait of Hormuz, which was never done before. And most of all, well, certainly it's a significant outcome. The Iranian regime stays in place. And I want to make a point about this because another point which I think nobody is making, which is that there was an opportunity here to change the face of Iran and the Middle east. And that occurred last December when masses of Iranians took to the street and Donald Trump said, if you shoot them, if you threaten them, we're gonna come and get you. Which he did not do. That was the moment in which real change on a historical level was possible. And Donald Trump punted. And so just to go back to, I think the fundamental point is that he doesn't know how to do this. He's an incompetent in this respect. I mean, many respects, but certainly in terms of foreign policy, he blew this at, at every point. Everything that was, that could be done wrong, he did wrong. And here we are.
- [12:50]
Joanna
Well, and do you remember when he truth socialed out to the Iranian protesters, Help is on the way. Is this what he meant by help? He's now paying the Iranians to reopen the Strait of Hormuz, as you just said. And the regime change while it has, the leadership has been changed, but it appears even harder than it was before.
- [13:16]
Michael
Yeah, no, he has solidified the regime. So the exact opposite. So nothing here. And so the question, the bet he is now making is that people will forget about this or they will forget about it enough by the time the midterms come around. And in a way, this is also a cynical end to the war, which is, okay, we gotta end it now because it's making me look bad. So forget about whatever goals that we had, because the overriding goal is that I not look bad.
- [14:01]
Joanna
Will he pass it, do you think, as a success? I mean, because he does have that capacity to just say things. How am I even asking that? Okay, he'll tell everybody we won. It was a huge success.
- [14:18]
Michael
Yes. Everything that he does is always. And it doesn't matter what it is, how terrible, how bankrupt, all those bankruptcies it is, everything is a success. And he manages. I mean, it's a kind of a. A modern life lesson. You know, you just say it enough and enough people appear to believe it.
- [14:40]
Joanna
I wonder what they made of Pete Hegseth coming down the stairs of his plane to a NATO summit wearing a plaid shirt and a trucker hat. I mean, I've never seen anything quite so weird. And given the sort of hassle that J.D. vance and Trump gave Zelensky when he turned up in the Oval Office in his black fatigues, his black suit. But, you know, as he said, he's never going to wear a suit until the war in the Ukraine is done. Hegseth sort of sallied down the steps as if he was going to the opening of the Iowa State Fair.
- [15:22]
Michael
It remains a mystery to me. I think it remains a mystery to most people how all of these clowns are tolerated and maybe they're not. I think, and I think actually that is part of what's going on now is that the American people see the people who surround Trump and realize that they are at the very least unfit for the jobs that they have. And that this, again, one more thing that can contributes to everything that is going wrong around Donald Trump and nothing. I think it's important again and again and again to make this point. Nothing is going well for Donald Trump. Donald Trump just lost the war, but he is losing everything. And that's why we're going into a midterm election that I think everyone expects and has a right to expect. Will be a catastrophe for Donald Trump.
- [16:31]
Joanna
Okay, so let me ask you this, though. Is he winning? Was UFC on the torn up south lawn of the White House actually a win for Trump? I know a lot of people thought, oh, this is terrible. But in terms of the culture wars.
- [16:49]
Michael
In terms of the culture wars, I don't know. In terms of. In terms of the culture, that is to say, the entertainment culture. Yeah. I mean, and we're also going into this, the 250th anniversary of the United States of America, which is now becoming a kind of Trump show all about Trump. And I think that he sees this. He sees. He sees the advantages here, the advantages of a spectacle. You know, I can't run the government, but okay, I can put on a show. And remember, this is a key part of Donald Trump, of Donald Trump's skill set and his identity. I mean, he is a promoter. I mean, I think I've discussed this before, that I once asked him what he would be. What's the best job you could ever conceive of yourself having? And he said, as a sports promoter. And I think he is now falling back on that. I can do this. The other stuff is complicated. The economy, complicated. Immigration, complicated. War, complicated. But, damn it, I can put on a show. And there's another aspect of this, of Donald Trump here, which is that he genuinely believes, and he may not be wrong, that he can channel the tastes of the American people. And he has always, always thought that. I mean, the buildings that he puts up and the gold that he encrusts, the casinos in Atlantic City, even though they went bankrupt, the. The fights that he has promoted, the wrestling that he has been involved with now the ufc, and of course, reality television. I mean, he has. I mean, there is. He has demonstrably channeled the taste of the American people. So is he falling back on that now, and will that have a positive effect for him? Well, I think he's certainly falling back on it now. Will it have enough positive effect? Yeah, well, maybe. I don't know. It's hard to imagine that that UFC fight on the lawn of the White House sends a positive signal to enough of America to help him out of the hole that he's in. But, you know, God knows, I mean, I don't understand the UFC thing anyway, so that's my limitation. And, And. And Donald Trump's advantage. He does see this Spotify. It's Jay Shetty. Are you one of those media strategy people scrolling through spreadsheets, searching for an audience that pays twice as much attention to your ads than they do in on social. Let me introduce you to fans, and they're here with me on Spotify. Trust me, I know fans. They don't skip, they stay for hours. They don't move on. They manifest. They're not a demographic group, they're fans. Spotify advertising, you're among fans.
- [20:21]
Joanna
Well, and I can't figure out whether or not we're just looking at this through the lenses of elitist glasses. And actually for a certain group of Americans, certainly the group of Americans that voted him in, some of whom had also voted for President Obama, incredibly, that, you know, watching these fighters padding their way barefooted through the tiled floors of the White House actually feels egalitarian in some way that appeals to people. And, you know, having monster energy on top of the 90 foot claw actually speaks to people and makes them feel part of Washington. And this whole thing that politicians don't do anything for us, I'm not part of that world. It's so separate. Whether or not his trying to close that gap actually might be effective. So let's just talk about how he's using Washington as a larger state stage set here because you obviously, we've talked incessantly about reality television. We did a special on it recently. It's an incredibly interesting background for a president. Now he appears to be taking the whole of Washington City and turning it into Trumptown.
- [21:41]
Michael
Well, I have some insight here from the White House, which is that this is, this is top of mind for him. This is top of his agenda. This to him, this is taking more time within the White House than any other issue. This is more important than the war. This is more important than immigration. This is more important than the midterms. And thinking about that, this is his primary focus. What I can do for Washington. Washington is the legacy that I leave. And it's curious because Donald Trump doesn't think about legacy in the way that other presidents do. And you might conclude that therefore he doesn't think about legacy. That is the legacy in law, the legacy in the structure of government, the legacy as an abstraction. But so what he does is think about this as legacy in concrete. I am going to change things, things that I am going to create a physical change here. And it's a particular Trumpian response to. It's him imposing himself. He's inescapable, unignorable, ubiquitous. I mean, so there will be. He will, in his mind now, he is creating a Washington that will forever or at least for the next decades or a hundred years. Evoke his name. Donald Trump. I was here. No one will ever forget that I was here. This is central to him. This is what is in his head. Now. I have less than two and a half years in order to accomplish this. And we are going to spend a good part of every day in this White House addressing this. And the efforts of his opponents and the caretakers of Washington to frustrate this, to slow it, to impede it, to deprive him of his. This right to put his name on everything has become. These are significant political issues for him, more significant, in fact, than the war in Iran.
- [24:24]
Joanna
So the first, most obvious one is the ballroom, the East Wing, that was traditionally the home of the first Lady. We know there is no real first lady at the moment, certainly, as far as we can tell, present in the White House. So that got ripped down. We have the reflecting pool, the sort of long strip of water that he wanted to repaint, I guess as American flag blue, but which has unfortunately gone American green. It's full of algae, which the White House is saying is because that's just algae that was sort of populating itself in the pipes while they were waiting for this pool to be done. And let's not forget that this giant reflecting pool was not put out to tender. It was not given to people who understand how to do this. It was given to a building company that Donald Trump has a relationship with that had nevertheless never done anything like this before. Again, my analogy, it's like inviting a dentist in to do cardiology.
- [25:38]
Michael
Algae is a leftist lefty thing.
- [25:42]
Joanna
Algae is a lefty thing. What's that mean? Is it algae or algae?
- [25:46]
Michael
It's in the United States. It's algae, but go with, what do
- [25:51]
Joanna
you mean it's a lefty thing? What does this mean, algae is a lefty thing?
- [25:54]
Michael
Well, that's what he's blaming.
- [25:56]
Joanna
Look at it.
- [25:57]
Michael
They're blaming this. That's the joke in the White House that they're blaming this. They're blaming it on that algae is a lefty conspiracy.
- [26:07]
Joanna
Well, it's not. I mean, when you go down to the pool, and I've talked to two people who've gone down to it over the last couple of days, it's definitely green. It's got algae in there. And the White House is definitely looking for more people to come and help sort this problem out, because they can't have July 4th and the reflecting pool being green and not blue, especially given Trump's nailed his colors to the mask and said, I want American flag blue.
- [26:33]
Michael
Right and of course, this makes him. So he blames this. This is a problem. This is not a problem of nature. This is a problem, a conspiracy against him.
- [26:44]
Joanna
They're putting tons of a really powerful sort of bleach in it, basically, to get rid of it. Who knows if it's going to be successful. All right, so we have the reflecting pool, which at the moment appears to be problematic. Let's say it's not worked out exactly as they not reflecting po what he
- [27:01]
Michael
wanted it to reflect.
- [27:03]
Joanna
Right. In fact, it's reflecting his incompetence. And then we have the arch, which blocks the view between the Lincoln Memorial and Arlington Cemetery, which, of course, he doesn't want to think about Arlington Cemetery because it's full of suckers and losers. And he managed to avoid going to do any kind of military service because he had bone spurs.
- [27:25]
Michael
I would only slightly defend him on that basis, that a generation avoided military service because of our bone spurs.
- [27:37]
Joanna
Did you have bone spurs?
- [27:38]
Michael
I had. I think I had flat feet, which I do have, actually. But at a certain point in time, although actually then when I was. When this might have been relevant to me, then they converted the draft to a lottery in which I would have actually have been drafted. Except that as soon as they converted it to a lottery, which meant that everyone would be drafted on a fairly equitable basis, then they got rid of the draft.
- [28:17]
Joanna
Let me just get this absolutely clear, because I know this is going to provoke all sorts of comments. You, in fact, avoided the draft because of timing. By the time you would have been drafted, they'd stopped the draft.
- [28:30]
Michael
Exactly. Okay, but it was there. The sequence was because everyone was avoiding the draft because of bone spurs. They then changed the law to a lottery system. And if you got a low number, you were. You were drafted. If you got a high number, then you probably would not be drafted, but that was a more equitable arrangement. Therefore, the people who could afford to go to college and graduate school and have doctors write them letters instead of them being the ones who got excused, you would be excused on this more equitable basis of a lottery. You would either have to go because of a low number or. Or perhaps not go because of a high number. But at that point, that was exactly at the point at which they got rid of the draft because. For probably precisely that reason, because the sons of people with power might be drafted.
- [29:41]
Joanna
Okay, so we have Brand Washington Trump slapping his name all over Washington, though happily his name has come off the side of the Kennedy Center.
- [29:53]
Michael
But that's an interesting thing too. Because they have not unveiled yet the lack of his name. So the curtain is still up. So you can't see that Trump's name is no longer there. Comcast is delivering extraordinary experiences in live sports through the incredible broadcast and storytelling from NBC, innovative and personalized viewing, features on Xfinity and Peacock, and the country's most reliable WI Fi. Viewers can enjoy every game changing play faster and more seamlessly than ever, all in a network built to deliver unforgettable moments as close to live as possible. The ultimate experience for the American sports fan. Learn more@comcastcorporation.com sports do you think that curtain remains up?
- [30:40]
Joanna
I mean, the whole center now seems to be mothballed for extensive work which he claimed he wanted to do, but now he's pushed it off onto the government to finish off. I mean, he is the government, but
- [30:54]
Michael
the court has just asked for a plan to keep the Kennedy center open. So this is another one of those things which is filling him apparently with rage. I mean, everything fills him with rage, but this, particularly everybody trying to get in the way of his remake and rebranding. And by the way, that's what they're calling it in the White House, the rebranding of Washington. And he's referring to these projects that he's putting up as my monuments. There is this whole kind of Caesar kind of thing, this Roman kind of things, which is obviously the spectacles, the UFC fighting, you know, is this Roman like spectacle, obviously building these buildings, these victory arches, Roman in. Feeling and sentiment. And there was a thing there, I mean, he did a. Let me see if this. There was a post, I think, last night, which is. He was quoting a presidential historian, somebody named Dave King. I'm not exactly sure who that is. His post was this Dave King said, donald Trump is without question the most powerful man that the planet has ever known by a long way. Historically, powerful people were characterized by brutal conquest and the fear that they instilled in the populations that came under their influence. Common names that would come to mind are Alexander the Great, the Caesars, Genghis Khan, Attila the Hun, Napoleon, and more recently, Hitler, Mao and Stalin. Now, so Trump quotes this and adds, sounds good to me, which is. It actually reminded me, remember when the Beatles said they were more popular than Jesus? So he's kind of saying he's more popular than Hitler. Here we are.
- [33:22]
Joanna
Or Stalin or Stalin.
- [33:24]
Michael
Why?
- [33:25]
Joanna
I mean, Stalin, you know, in terms of the monstrous ranks right up there with, with Hitler, if not beyond. I mean, who is Dave? Who is Dave King. Who's ever heard of a historian who calls himself Dave, by the way? I mean, that just seems, it seems super doubtful. But listen, I want to come on to my friend. Of course, I've never really met him, but I feel that if I did meet him, I would prefer him. I would prefer him above other Republicans, John Thune, who's struggling to keep the Senate together. Can we just talk about this?
- [34:03]
Michael
We can, we can certainly talk about. But before, let's talk about your preference for John Thune.
- [34:09]
Joanna
Well, I just think that John Thune is one of those people that, you know, when Trump got caught with his grab and by the pussy tape, John Thune was like, this guy's gotta stand down. He's not one of us. He is not suitable to be President of the United States. And how, how right he was, how incredibly right he was. And this is the guy that took down Tom Daschle.
- [34:31]
Michael
Yeah. I mean, I think you're giving him perhaps some credit that he doesn't necessarily deserve.
- [34:39]
Joanna
Well, hold on. At least he's not an election denier. Right. And he stood by those. I'm not saying that he's the most liberal of Republicans. Absolutely not. But at least he seems decent.
- [34:52]
Michael
Well, he is functionally an election denier. He certainly didn't vote for Trump's removal on this basis. I mean, January 6 came. The Senate could have removed him. The Senate could have ensured that Trump would never be able to become president again or hold any office. John Thune was happy to go along with other Republicans who were not about to do that to Donald Trump.
- [35:26]
Joanna
Totally fair point, Totally fair point. But let's just talk about the fact that Trump has now got him in a kind of chokehold.
- [35:34]
Michael
I was just trying to move you to say that your affection for him was because he looks the part of a decent Republican.
- [35:47]
Joanna
Well, he looks presidential in a way that Donald Trump, whether or not you see him as a bison or a giant shrimp, or however you see Donald Trump with his moldy hair and his peculiar skin and his swollen tree like legs, at this point, he seems more presidential than that.
- [36:09]
Michael
Yeah, no, no, the guy is great looking. So. But let's frame the issue now, which is that Donald Trump, everything is a crisis around the guy right now. Nothing is going well for him. Everything is politically to his detriment at this moment. So at this moment, instead of trying to, to make sure his allies are his allies, he is directly attacking the leadership in the United States Senate, the Republican leadership. I mean, basically, John Thune has said, John Thune who's the majority leader in the Senate, has said there's no circumstance on which he would agree to get rid of the Senate filibuster. Donald Trump is saying, you have to get rid of the Senate filibuster. So he's putting John Thune in a pretty difficult, if not politically untenable situation. So why would he do this at this point? And I don't know the answer to that. I do know that the background here is John Thune with. Was Mitch McConnell's person. So John Thune is in this position because Mitch McConnell put him there. There was a kind of group of Senate leaders around Mitch McConnell who were very much a thorn in the side of Donald Trump. And Donald Trump and Mitch McConnell came to have a terrible relationship. So terrible that they actually stopped speaking to each other. And John Thune, basically, to Donald Trump, in Trump's head, is just an extension of that relationship. So instead of, and this is a particularly Trumpian thing, instead of putting. Saying, okay, let's put that aside. I really need these guys at this point. He's not putting it aside because he can't put anything aside. This is in his head, hey, I hate Mitch McConnell, and therefore I hate John Thune. And that is going to be above any other consideration, even any other political consideration that might be to my advantage or that I might need. Remember, it is perfectly possible that the midterms will come around and the Democrats will win the House and will win the Senate and that there might be an impeachment and there might be a trial in which he would be dependent. His life and career would be dependent on the support of the Republican leadership in the Senate. But is that anywhere on his mind? It isn't.
- [39:18]
Joanna
So can you. Can you just explain for people what Trump actually did this week with Jay Clayton, who he decided he was going to put up as the permanent, not the acting head of the Office of National Intelligence. So he put up Bill Pulte to be the acting head. Bill Pulte, who doesn't even. Who has less. Who has less likelihood of being able to run that department effectively than you and me. He's got less experience with intelligence than you and me. And both Republicans and Democrats do not want him anywhere near the intelligence office, where he would oversee 18 different intelligence agencies, including the FBI and including the CIA, et cetera, et cetera. So Trump then said, I'm going to put up Jay Clayton. Jay Clayton was running the Southern District of New York. Explain for people what's happened.
- [40:18]
Michael
He was the Justice Department prosecutor In the, In. In the Southern District. He was the U.S. attorney in New York. Yes.
- [40:28]
Joanna
Which is a job that Rigi Giuliani once had.
- [40:31]
Michael
Yes. No. And it's a, you know, you know, I mean, incredibly powerful job. And, and, and he was one of the prosecutors. This is in Trump's takeover of the Justice Department. One of the ways he's done this is to put his guys in these positions, guys who are abjectly loyal to Donald Trump. And Clayton is one of those guys. But Clayton is somewhat more credentialed than Bill Pulte. For instance, it was pretty much guaranteed, and there was pretty much a bipartisan consensus that they would approve Clayton for the NIA job. But Trump then, in a fit of peak, pulled this. And here I can't exactly figure out the logic of this, but he is basically saying, I'm not going to give you. I'm not going to submit this nomination until you get rid of the filibuster and you pass. There are a couple of key pieces here of legislation in, including most of all, his voting reform, which would not be reform at all, but which would be changing voting rules.
- [42:10]
Joanna
This is his Save America Act.
- [42:13]
Michael
Yeah. So that would give him more control over the midterm voting, and it would
- [42:19]
Joanna
ensure that people had to turn up with photo ID to vote and all sorts of restrictions for people actually voting, none of which have ever been problems before, because, as we know, there's very little evidence of fraud in American elections, something which Donald Trump keeps banging on about even though we know it's not true.
- [42:37]
Michael
Yes. And we should get to that, because that remains. I mean, we should begin to come back to that again and again and again, because that is a central threat. That is the way he is running. That is his campaign for the midterms. So his campaign for the midterms is not to convince people they should vote for Republicans, but his campaign for the midterms is to campaign against the election itself.
- [43:10]
Joanna
That is such a good perspective on this.
- [43:13]
Michael
Just to return to that point about, about the Senate is. I don't understand what he's done. This. This is just his peak. I'm gonna take my marbles and go home if you don't give me what I want. I didn't think the pain from the shingles rash would affect simple, everyday tasks like bathing, getting dressed, or even walking around. I was wrong, though. Not everyone at risk will develop it. 99% of people over the age of 50 already had the virus that causes shingles, and it could reactivate at any time. I developed it, and the blistering rash lasted for weeks. Don't learn the hard way like I did. Talk to your doctor or pharmacist today. Sponsored by gsk.
- [43:58]
Joanna
Well, and apparently he did it from France. As we know, he's been staying for the G7 summit, first in Evian, before Macron, very cleverly enticed him to stay the entire duration of the summit, which he doesn't normally do. Normally, at some point, he pretends he's much too busy and has to hare back to Washington. But Macron enticed him, cajoled him to stay with a fancy state dinner at Versailles, which I'm sure will give Trump even more ideas for his own ballroom. But it was in the middle of the night that apparently he sent my friend John Huhn a memo saying, I've changed my mind about Jay Clayton. And also that you have to approve whoever succeeds Jay Clayton first before you can take Jay Clayton's vote to the Senate before he can have his confirmation hearing.
- [44:53]
Michael
Yes, and that makes more sense because he has had this enormous problem getting his approval on the U.S. attorneys. He's, he's wanted, you know, we've got those, the coterie of Trump women who were. Who were put in place in New Jersey and in Virginia and then who were. Who the courts threw out.
- [45:17]
Joanna
Right. So Lindsey Halligan in Virginia and Eileena Haba in New Jersey.
- [45:23]
Michael
Yes. And so they couldn't get either of those appointments approved by the Senate because there is this thing that you need the approval, a Senate tradition. You need the approval of the sitting senators in those states for the appointment of the prosecutor in those states. That didn't happen in Virginia and in New Jersey, because both of these people, Lindsey Halligan and Alina Habba, completely unqualified, just total Trump toadies. So the senators there in those states held back their approval. So now Trump is basically saying, and this is another dis to the Senate. So this particular tradition, this particular privilege or piece of power that senators have, he wants that done away with.
- [46:28]
Joanna
So John Thune, I can't even begin to imagine the conversations that the John Thuneites in the Senate, and I guess there are fewer of them than there were are having with each other about how is this man behaving like this? What is the logic here? We are going to lose our seats. And of course, Trump had actually said to Kristi Noem at one point before he appointed her Homeland Security secretary, that she should run against Thune. So again, this vituperative part of his nature, the retribution he seeks.
- [47:03]
Michael
They've been having these conversations now for the better part of 10 years. This is nothing new. Trump is a dick. They can't stand them. They have to, you know, they just have to, you know, sit there in somewhat passively or somewhat passively aggressively and wait for his particular ire at any given moment to pass. But. And they have, you know, I mean, I was going to say that they have learned to live with him, but I'm not sure that that is, that is true. I think he has basically undermined everything that they feel about their own, their own jobs, sense of self worth, identity. And, and, you know, and I think that they must look back now to, to 2020 or 2021 when that, that the January 6th, the post January 6th impeachment took place and think, why were we so such weaklings then? And the answer would be because they could not have in a lifetime predicted that Donald Trump would emerge from the ignominy of January 6th to become the president again.
- [48:33]
Joanna
It is an absolutely remarkable journey. So do you think that John Thune survives as leader of the Senate? Does he hang on?
- [48:40]
Michael
Well, he can only hang on if. If the, if the Republicans have control of the Senate and that's in the balance now.
- [48:48]
Joanna
Do you think he goes before the midterms?
- [48:51]
Michael
No, I don't. I think he does hang on. Yes.
- [48:54]
Joanna
We should put a bet on it. We should go to the betting market. Kalshe and what's the other one? Poly market, which of which Don Jr is happily an advisor to both of them. So, Michael, I think we have some limericks. We have some limericks and we have a poem, edits. The. Once was a pres. With senility whose organs had lost all utility. So much for his sex life. Perhaps in the next life. And his polling flopped. Just like his virility. Very good. And then Garfried, we've got one from our Limerick laureate. There once was a don on display who took being watched for cachet with AIDS brushed aside. He would govern by truth and rule in his own hollow way. We love your limericks. We love your poems. We love your artwork. I'm sorry, I'm sucking a cough. Sweet. Because I've really had a bad cough and a hoarse voice all week, but I'm definitely recuperating. Michael, we'll be back on Saturday with another episode of Inside Trump's Head.
- [50:01]
Michael
Fantastic. We will see you then. Are you back in the United States of America on Saturday?
- [50:08]
Joanna
No, I am staying in Europe for another week. I'm staying in Europe for another week. I'm going to the Cannes Lion Advertising Festival to whip up business for the Daily Beast.
- [50:19]
Michael
Fantastic. We'll have a good time, but we'll see you on Saturday.
- [50:24]
Joanna
Yep, I will see you on Saturday.
- [50:26]
Michael
Thank you, John, Ryan, Heather, Rachel and Neil, as always.
- [50:32]
Joanna
So the good news is we have so many Beast Tier members now, there are too many names to read out. And we really appreciate your support.