Sunday Special: The Enduring Power of Amusement Parks

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Daily – Sunday Special: The Enduring Power of Amusement Parks

Host: Gilbert Cruz
Guests: Brooks Barnes (Hollywood reporter, NYT), Mikado Murphy (movie editor & “roller coaster correspondent,” NYT)
Date: October 5, 2025

---

Main Theme/Purpose

This episode explores the deep cultural pull and ongoing evolution of amusement parks in America and beyond. Host Gilbert Cruz and guests Brooks Barnes and Mikado Murphy dive into personal memories, the business of theme parks (focusing on Disney and Universal), the art and thrill of roller coasters, the rising costs of family fun, and what makes these magical places matter generation after generation.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Opening Nostalgia: Growing Up Amused

• [00:36–04:35]
  • Gilbert intros the show with his personal connection to amusement parks, introducing guests Brooks Barnes (grew up on the road with a traveling carnival) and Mikado Murphy (self-taught “theme park architect” from childhood drawings).
  • Brooks reminisces about “free reign of the carnival” and having “friends with the Slim who ran the Ferris wheel and Chief who ran the merry go round.”
    • Memorable quote:

      “I had my little rounds. I would make friends with Slim who ran the Ferris wheel and Chief who ran the merry go round, and I'd ride the sea dragon over and over and over again…” (Brooks Barnes, 03:18)

  • Theme: The magical, chaotic atmosphere of carnivals and how it shapes lifelong attractions to amusement parks—even for those who grew up behind the scenes.

2. Theme Parks as Family Ritual

• [05:01–07:28]
  • Mikado shares his Oklahoma upbringing and summer tradition of traveling to Six Flags Over Texas.
  • Gilbert recalls his only vacation to Disney at age 10:

    “It was the biggest moment of my young life. And I've been obsessed with recapturing that excitement ever since.” (Gilbert Cruz, 05:30)

  • Mikado inventing imaginary parks (“Fun World, founded by H.G. Fun”) as a child highlights how theme parks foster creativity and anticipation.

3. The Science of the Visit: Planning, Obsession, and Perpetual Nostalgia

• [07:42–09:28]
  • Modern park visits are orchestrated down to spreadsheets and routes, compared to childhood plotting of park experiences.

    “My version of drawing your theme park was charting out a course throughout all of Disney World… everything needs to be as efficient as possible.” (Gilbert Cruz, 08:25) “Visiting a park now tends to involve spreadsheet nonsense.” (Brooks Barnes, 09:05)

4. The Theme Park Arms Race—Universal’s New Gamble

• [09:28–14:44]
  • Universal’s $7B Epic Universe expansion in Orlando represents a direct challenge to Disney dominance.
    • “Universal’s trying to be more Disney… Universal wants to flip that. You come to Universal and you do an added day at Disney.” (Brooks Barnes, 10:26)
  • New lands at Epic Universe: How to Train Your Dragon (Isle of Berk), Celestial Park, Nintendo World, Harry Potter, and Dark Universe (classic monsters).
  • The value and limits of “theming”: Mikado appreciates rides that successfully combine storytelling and thrill, citing “Hiccup’s Wing Gliders” (How to Train Your Dragon) and Universal’s innovative mist usage.

    “It’s hard to tell a story on a ride while you’re also moving down a track. And so I’m always impressed when a ride is able to do that.” (Mikado Murphy, 13:43)

  • Safety and the impact of real-world tragedy: The recent death on the Stardust Racers coaster prompts reflections on public perception and the “controlled danger” that makes thrill rides appealing.

    “You want it to feel slightly dangerous, but it also has to feel safe.” (Gilbert Cruz, 16:25)

5. IP-ification: The Rise of Intellectual Property in Parks

• [16:36–21:06]
  • Escalation of rides themed to movies/known characters—Disney’s Guardians of the Galaxy retheme cited as a business and cultural decision.

    “Kids had no idea what the Twilight Zone was… so Disney rethemed it around Marvel… the attraction has become twice as popular since then.” (Brooks Barnes, 18:12)

  • Parks now drive profits for media conglomerates more than movies or TV; $10B profit combined for Disney/Universal theme parks in 2024.
    • “Theme parks have become their most reliable growth business.” (Brooks Barnes, 18:40)
  • Nostalgia for “classic” parks/rides (Tiki Room, Mr. Toad) lingers among older visitors even as new generations connect via familiar IP.

6. Coaster Obsession: The Joy, Fear & Ingenuity of Thrill Rides

• [23:00–34:47]
  • Mikado has logged over 200 roller coasters (tracked on Coaster Count), including “coaster tourism” trips in Europe (7 parks, 4 countries, 100 rides in a week).
  • Current favorites:
    • Twisted Colossus (Magic Mountain): “It blew my mind the first time I wrote it. Even to this day, I’m super thrilled by that roller coaster.” (Mikado Murphy, 25:47)
    • The Ride to Happiness (Plopsaland, Belgium): “If you like a lot of combinations of thrills, this ride just packs them in.” (Mikado Murphy, 27:45)
  • The controlled chaos thrill:

    “It’s a controlled way to have a little bit of chaos in my life.” (Mikado Murphy, 30:40)

  • Brooks, less enamored by coasters, explains his anxiety dates back to seeing unsafe rides on traveling carnivals as a child.

Memorable Quote

“Humans were not made to do this. When I went to report on Epic Universe, the first ride the chairman of Universal Parks wanted to take me on was that big roller coaster… I was somewhat embarrassed to let out a scream next to the Universal chairman, as in my New York Times costume.” (Brooks Barnes, 31:20–32:11)

7. How Rides Are Changing: Interactivity and Video Game Logic

• [34:47–36:01]
  • Newer rides emphasize interactivity (e.g., Mario Kart at Universal, Harry Potter with augmented reality) to appeal to younger, game-savvy audiences.

    “I don’t want to play a game while I’m on a ride. I want to ride the ride.” (Mikado Murphy, 35:43)

8. The Steep Cost of Fun: Accessibility and Alternatives

• [36:08–39:19]
  • Disney ticket and ancillary prices have soared (“bring the deed to your house”).
    • Viral story: $938 for a family of five at the Disney Princess breakfast.
    • Six Flags’ fast pass up to $260 per person (on top of admission).
  • Alternatives for affordable fun:
    • Knoebels, Pennsylvania: “Parking is free. It’s free to get into the park. And then you just buy tickets to ride the ride.” (Mikado Murphy, 37:55)
    • “Phoenix” wooden coaster highlighted as a must-ride.
    • Dollywood (Pigeon Forge, Tennessee): “Actually very family friendly and down home and country in the best possible way… best cinnamon bread.” (Brooks Barnes, 39:35–40:22)

9. What Makes a Great Amusement Park?

• [40:48–41:54]
  • Brooks: “There’s this common bond among strangers when the emotional buttons are pushed… it brings people closer together as strangers. You want to go somewhere where the normal rules of life are suspended.”
  • Mikado: “I go because of the rides mainly. If a park has two fantastic roller coasters, three pretty good ones, then it’s worth going to.”

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the enduring appeal:

  “When carnies have a vacation, they go to Disneyland.” (Brooks Barnes, 03:49)

• On business strategy:

  “Theme parks have become their most reliable growth business. A decade earlier, it was 2 billion. If you’re looking at growth, that’s where you want to put more money.” (Brooks Barnes, 18:40–18:56)

• On nostalgia and change:

  “It is sort of distressing as an older person when you see some of the classic stuff, you know, fading away.” (Brooks Barnes, 20:26)

• On the modern park experience:

  “I feel like now they have video games like Theme Park Simulator, Rollercoaster Tycoon, and that you were doing it before all of that just with pen and paper.” (Gilbert Cruz, 07:34)

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:36 – Introductions, childhood memories (carnivals, family trips)
• 05:01 – Formative amusement park stories; the meaning of the first Disney trip
• 09:28 – Universal’s Epic Universe; the new “theme park war” with Disney
• 13:13 – Theming rides, innovations in family coasters (How to Train Your Dragon)
• 15:12 – Park safety, the impact of tragedy on the fun
• 17:26 – The rise of intellectual property (IP) as a dominant force in theming
• 23:00 – Mikado’s roller coaster obsession & European park tour
• 25:08 – Favorite coasters: Twisted Colossus & The Ride to Happiness
• 30:40 – The psychology & appeal of roller coasters; controlled fear vs. real danger
• 34:07 – Shift to interactive, gamified rides; generational differences in amusement expectations
• 36:08 – Soaring expense of park visits; how some smaller parks remain affordable
• 39:25 – Dollywood and alternative parks; cinnamon bread and roller coaster gems
• 40:52 – Why we seek out amusement parks
• 43:59 – “Roller Quizter” game segment (fun quiz–skip for summary purposes)

---

Conclusion

The power of amusement parks lies in their ability to create worlds that blend nostalgia, thrill, and communal joy, even as their form shifts from quirky, analog attractions to big-budget themed worlds ruled by global IP. For some, it’s a longing for the controlled chaos of a roller coaster; for others, it’s simpler pleasures—cinnamon bread and shared wonder. The episode ends with appreciation for both the affordability and inventiveness of smaller, regional parks like Knoebels and Dollywood, and a reminder that whatever the price or form, these spaces hold a unique place in the American imagination.

---

Quick Reference:

• Theme parks are big business but still personal and nostalgic.
• The “IP-ification” of parks is nearly complete, changing how kids connect to rides and how companies justify massive investments.
• Modern thrill rides blend technical innovation with story—when done right, they’re immersive.
• Accessibility is a growing issue: High prices exclude many, but hidden gems remain.
• At heart, parks serve as a break from normal life—a place “where the normal rules of life are suspended.”

---

Summary by The Daily, October 5, 2025: The Enduring Power of Amusement Parks

Transcript

[Capital One Announcer]

This episode is supported by Capital One. Make the most out of your travel experience with Venture X. You can elevate your earned with unlimited double miles on every purchase, plus access over 1,000 airport lounges worldwide and enjoy easy to use benefits like a $300 annual capital one travel credit, all at a price that makes sense. Set out on your next adventure with a travel card that's elevated, not complicated. The Capital One Venture X card. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. Lounge access is subject to change. See capitalone.com for details.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Welcome, everyone, to the Sunday special. I'm Gilbert Cruz. I'm excited because today we're talking about one of my secret favorite things. It's not movies or books or tv, all of which, honestly, are some of my favorite things in the world. Instead, we are talking about amusement parks. All year round. Americans travel to Orlando and Los Angeles and Anaheim to go to some of the most famous theme parks around. And those who don't go there are likely going somewhere close to home, like the Six Flags that I used to go to in New Jersey. With me today to talk about amusement parks across America is Brooks Barnes, who writes about Hollywood for the Times. He's visited all 14 Disney theme parks around the world. And he also traveled with a carnival when he was younger, which is totally normal. No big deal. I have so many questions about it. Welcome, Brooks.

[Brooks Barnes]

Hello.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Across from me is Mikado Murphy. Officially, he is a movie editor here. Unofficially, he is the Times roller coaster correspondent. He has published more pieces about roller coasters than any other writer in Times history. I have not fact checked that, but it has to be true. Welcome, Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Hey, Gilbert.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Okay, Brooks, first things first. We have to get this out of the way. We need to talk about this. You grew up in a traveling carnival?

[Brooks Barnes]

Yes. Mikado's rolling his eyes. Not the old carnival stories. Not rolling that out again. Yes. I was not in a carnival. I wasn't an attraction myself. But my parents made a living by selling cotton candy and corn dogs. And we. I traveled with a carnival called the Mighty Thomas Carnival.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Okay.

[Brooks Barnes]

Through Canada, the Midwest, Texas, Louisiana, Arkansas, California. So I feel at home in these chaotic, manufactured environments.

[Gilbert Cruz]

How many years did you do that for?

[Brooks Barnes]

From the time I was born to the last season I worked for them was the summer after my freshman year in college.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Oh, my God. That's your entire child? I thought it was just a couple years. So they sold cotton candy, but they didn't operate rides or anything?

[Brooks Barnes]

No rides. Right.

[Gilbert Cruz]

But you sort of were around the people who operated rides.

[Brooks Barnes]

The Zipper the Himalaya. You know, I worked for them. I worked in the stands, starting at a maybe younger age than I should disclose.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Yeah. I don't get the impression there are a lot of, like, you know, the law's a little.

[Brooks Barnes]

The lot's a little fuzzy. But when I was younger, they worked nonstop, and I had free reign of the carnival, So I had my little rounds. I would make friends with the Slim who ran the Ferris wheel and Chief who ran the merry go round, and I'd ride the sea dragon over and over and over again, and I kind of did my thing.

[Gilbert Cruz]

And yet, growing up in that environment did not, you know, tire you out from wanting to experience.

[Brooks Barnes]

It turns out that when carnies have a vacation, they go to Disneyland.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Is that true?

[Brooks Barnes]

That is true.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Also, can we say carnies? Is that, like, an acceptable term?

[Brooks Barnes]

I feel like I'm, you know.

[Gilbert Cruz]

You can?

[Brooks Barnes]

I can. Yes, of course.

[Gilbert Cruz]

So you went to Disneyland, and you were like, wow, this is a real.

[Brooks Barnes]

Yeah. Because at a carnival, you know, everything packs up. And amusement parks were always fascinating to me in how organized it all was. Right. And permanent. But also, it's just a chaotic environment, one that, as an adult now, I feel very comfortable in. You know, the smell of the popcorn, the music, the crying babies.

[Mikado Murphy]

Brooks, you totally lived my childhood dream. I couldn't.

[Brooks Barnes]

I left out all of the trauma.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I'm sure. I'm sure.

[Mikado Murphy]

But, yes, I couldn't imagine anything cooler than getting to work at a carnival all the time. But I grew up in a family that was very carnival like, but we did not travel in a carnival.

[Brooks Barnes]

Nice.

[Gilbert Cruz]

So what was your relationship with amusement parks when you were a kid? And was it like a family thing, or was it just your thing?

[Mikado Murphy]

With my family, I did come from a family of thrill seekers, and I grew up in Oklahoma, but we didn't have an amusement park in Oklahoma when I was growing up. Not a big one. And so my family would travel each summer to Fort Worth. We had some cousins down there, and we would go to Six Flags Over Texas during the summer. So that was kind of my big introduction to theme parks.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I grew up in New York, and we had Something Ryplay Land, which is a little theme park north of the Bronx, where I grew up, on the boardwalk, is where Zoltar, the little thing that makes Tom Hanks big and small in the movie Big, was located. And I went once to Disney when I was 10 years old. It was the only real vacation we ever took when I was a kid. And it was the biggest moment of my young life. And I've been obsessed with recapturing that excitement ever since. I don't think I'll ever get there.

[Brooks Barnes]

But Disney counts on that.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Believe me, Disney counts on that. Oh, yeah. Now that I have a child and my family's wallet is very aware of how much they count on it, it's just shocking how expensive it is, and yet it' still remains sort of like this rite of passage for American families. Did either of you. Was Disney a thing for you? The idea of Disney, at least when you were growing up?

[Mikado Murphy]

The idea of Disney was definitely a thing for me growing up. I always had fantasies and dreams of Disneyland just because there were all of these distinct worlds. Frontierland, Fantasyland. And when I was growing up, because I didn't get to go to all of these places, I actually created a theme park myself. I had this park that was called.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Like, in your mind.

[Mikado Murphy]

I created in my mind, and then I drew it all out. So the park was called Fun World, and great name.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Can't wait to go.

[Mikado Murphy]

The founder of the park was HG Fun.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Okay.

[Mikado Murphy]

And so this is all very. A lot of Disney theft here. But. But I do recall I created the park map, all of the rides, and then I drew out a number of the rides in the park, too.

[Gilbert Cruz]

This is amazing.

[Mikado Murphy]

Yeah, that was a part of my childhood because I didn't get to travel to parks as much.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I feel like now they have video games like Theme Park Simulator, Rollercoaster Tycoon, and that you were doing it before all of that just with pen and paper.

[Mikado Murphy]

I was doing analog Rollercoaster Tycoon.

[Gilbert Cruz]

My version of you drawing your theme park was in anticipation of our trip to Disney, which also coincided with the opening of Universal Studios Florida. It was in 1990. So I get to see some of those early rides that no longer exist.

[Brooks Barnes]

The Jaws ride.

[Gilbert Cruz]

The Jaws ride. Like the Alfred Hitchcock Experience. Murder she Wrote. There's just a bunch of stuff that would. That are so Murder She Wrote Experience.

[Mikado Murphy]

There was a Murder She Wrote ride.

[Gilbert Cruz]

There was a Murder She Wrote theatrical experience.

[Mikado Murphy]

It was one of the first things.

[Gilbert Cruz]

You saw on the main street as you were walking in through Universal Studios. You would sit down and they would talk to you about, like, Foley sound and, you know, the mechanics of sort.

[Brooks Barnes]

Of the click of her heels on.

[Gilbert Cruz]

That movie making and stuff like that. Anyway, before we went, I was obsessed with making sure that we got to every ride in the most efficient way possible. So my version of drawing a theme park was charting out a course throughout all of Disney World, go to Tomorrowland first, Go to Spaceland, do all that stuff that now people do on very intense websites. And it was an odd combination of excitement for a theme park and also like real spreadsheet nonsense that a 10 year old would do. And I feel like it has led to where I am today in my life, where everything needs to be as efficient as possible.

[Brooks Barnes]

Well, visiting a park now tends to involve spreadsheet nonsense.

[Mikado Murphy]

To be honest, Gilbert, that is exactly how I go to parks now. It is very much.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Yes.

[Mikado Murphy]

Yeah.

[Gilbert Cruz]

My brother in arms.

[Mikado Murphy]

Yes. What you were doing when you were a kid is the exact same thing that I do now. It really does require Herculean efforts sometimes just to make sure you make it on a ride at all.

[Gilbert Cruz]

So it feels like we're kind of at an important moment for a theme park business here in America, at least. Big thing happened this summer. Finally happened. After I feel like a year of commercials that I was seeing on tv, Universal Studios opened up its new park in Orlando, Epic Universe. So I'm wondering, first of all, what the heck is Epic Universe and why is it a big deal for Universal? Sure.

[Brooks Barnes]

So Epic Universe is. They spent at least $7 billion to build it.

[Gilbert Cruz]

$7 billion. Is that normal?

[Brooks Barnes]

That's normal. That's conservative. That's good. That's the admitted amount. And it's a new park near across the Interstate Freeway from the older Universal Studios complex, which is two parks and a water park. Do we count water parks as theme parks? I do.

[Mikado Murphy]

We definitely count water parks as theme parks.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Okay.

[Brooks Barnes]

The reason Epic is such a big deal is that it's investment. It's Universal trying to be more Disney. The vast majority families go to Disney World and Universal is an added day or a day and a half. Universal wants to flip that. You come to Universal and you do an added day at Disney. And so it's a big deal for Universal in its evolution, but it's also a big deal in terms of igniting. It sounds cliche because it's true. Theme park war. Disney's pouring money into Disney World to remain competitive. And Universal, Epic is sort of reflective of their broader business at Universal. They're building a new park in the uk, they're building a kids park in Texas. They're expanding in California. And so Disney, even though it acts like it doesn't even notice Universal, why would we think about them? It keenly notices them.

[Gilbert Cruz]

And what are the sort of different parts of Epic Universe? Because it has several lands and each of them is sort of organized around a movie Or a piece of intellectual property. Ip. Yes. What are they?

[Brooks Barnes]

There's the Isle of Birk, which is how to train your dragon. There is the main part, which I think they call Celestial park, which is a big. A giant roller coaster and dancing fountains and that sort of thing. I'm sure Mikado has opinions about the roller coaster, which is currently closed because there is a mishap on it. And then the other areas are Nintendo themed, which is sort of a casino for five year olds.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I've been very curious about Super Nintendo World, or whatever it's called, but I also feel like it might be for people much, much younger than me.

[Brooks Barnes]

I'm exaggerating, but it was more than I could take. You know, there's like coins. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. You know, it's a lot. There's a world for Harry Potter, of course. Universal has Harry Potter in most of its parks. And what's the other one?

[Mikado Murphy]

The other one's Dark Universe.

[Brooks Barnes]

Dark Universe, yes. Which is classic monsters like Dracula and Frankenstein. And that actually has one of the best rides in the whole park, right?

[Mikado Murphy]

Yeah. Monsters Unleashed. That one is really, really fun. And you get to meet a lot of the Universal monsters on the ride.

[Brooks Barnes]

You rode all the rides and you liked the family coaster, which doesn't do any loops or, you know. And that surprised me. Because you're Mr. Adrenaline.

[Mikado Murphy]

I do love Adrenaline, but I also really love Theming. And that ride, Hiccups Wing Gliders, is a wonderfully themed ride. It's so great if you're. Well, whether or not you're into how to Train youn Dragon, it's just a really fun experience. And you get to see Toothless on the ride, and Toothless presses his little paw down to launch you into the coaster, and it's just super fun. There's a lot of mist.

[Brooks Barnes]

That's such a heart, Mikado.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Wow. That's adorable.

[Mikado Murphy]

I mean, it's hard to make a themed roller coaster. Usually what you're just trying to do is, like, get people up and down hills and lots of thrills and lots of bumps and lots of curves and all kinds of fun things. But it's hard to tell a story on a ride while you're also moving down a track. And so I'm always impressed when a ride is able to do that. And so that's why I like Hiccup's wing Gliders the most. I do really love Stardust Racers, the roller coaster that's in Celestial Park. And it is a wonderful, super thrilling experience. But there's just something about mist on a ride.

[Brooks Barnes]

They like mist in that park?

[Mikado Murphy]

Yes.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Mist.

[Mikado Murphy]

Like mist. Like wet water. Yes. Wet mist.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Yes. Not a fan, Is that.

[Mikado Murphy]

No, I'm a big fan. I'm a big fan. The more mist, the better. There's a ton of mist at Epic Universe. They use it everywhere.

[Brooks Barnes]

But it's hot down there.

[Mikado Murphy]

That's true, too. During the summer, you want more of that mist, trust me. But I also like a roller coaster track that moves next to the water and moves close to the ground and all of these things that you're able to see while you're on the ride and experience. So they did a really great job with hiccups, wing gliders. And that's one of the big reasons I like it more than the much more thrilling ride in the park.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Brooks, I want to back up to something you mentioned before, which is that Stardust racers this coaster, it's currently closed, and it's closed because of a tragic incident that recently happened on that ride. Can you talk a little bit about what happened? You know, we're here, we're talking about all the ways that theme parks can be fun and exciting, and I just wonder how a place like Epic, Universal, or any theme or amusement park sort of thinks through the effect that something like this has on the people that are planning to go there and the.

[Brooks Barnes]

People that work there.

[Gilbert Cruz]

People that work there? Yeah.

[Brooks Barnes]

A man died on that coaster. And there have been, you know, it's gotten pretty icky pretty quickly. Other people have come forward to say they, you know, felt unsafe on that attraction, and so they'll do an investigation. And it's sort of, you know, you want to feel safe. And that just being in the news infects the feeling. Everywhere it takes you out of this is a joyful, happy. I don't have to worry about the real world place. And suddenly you do, right?

[Gilbert Cruz]

Yeah. I mean, part of the appeal of rollercoasters, I think, to me and to some is a feeling of controlled danger. You want it to feel slightly dangerous, but it also has to feel safe.

[Brooks Barnes]

Right.

[Gilbert Cruz]

So let's turn to something else the both of you have talked about theming, which once you say it immediately makes sense in relation to amusement parks and theme parks in particular. But I would like to ask a little bit more. Disney has always been the Disney theme that's sort of built in from the ground up. But it feels like in other amusement parks that the focus on IP has gotten more intense in recent years. Brooks, do you feel like that matches just the general curve of how Hollywood in particular, has thought about what they have, what we can make money off, how we could squeeze every dime out of these things that we own. How important is the. For these big parts, the Ipification, it's.

[Brooks Barnes]

Increasingly the entire strategy. It used to be that Disneyland, Disney Parks had, you know, the rides that were quirky and weird and one offs. And that increasingly is not the case anymore. And that's because they've realized that younger audiences in particular care more about rides that they know. The classic example, or biggest example is probably the Tower of Terror at Disneyland was Twilight Zone themed. Disney had to pay rights to Twilight Zone, which it didn't own, and they didn't like doing that. And they realized that kids had no idea what the Twilight Zone was.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Tragedy.

[Brooks Barnes]

Tragedy. And so Disney rethemed it around Marvel Guardians of the Galaxy, and the attraction has become twice as popular since then.

[Mikado Murphy]

But at Disney World, they did keep the Twilight Zone Tower of Terrorism.

[Brooks Barnes]

They can't use the Marvel superheroes in Florida because Universal has those rights, that's why.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Oh, my God.

[Brooks Barnes]

I know. But, yeah, I mean, increasingly, these big media companies, mostly Universal, NBCUniversal and Disney, have had enormous struggles in their core businesses of movies and television as we've all moved to streaming. Right. And theme parks have become their most reliable growth business. In 2024, Disney and Universal had a combined 10 billion in profit from their theme park divisions. A decade earlier, it was 2 billion. So if you're a shareholder looking at growth in various businesses, that's something where you want to put more money, and the companies are doing that, and that's a way to expand the value of movies. One of the reasons that Universal sold Wicked so hard, right? Wicked. Wicked, Wicked. Was to make the movie a success. But also, you know, they haven't announced anything. But you can bet there will be a Wicked land.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Yeah, it'll be an Emerald City corner of one of their parks.

[Brooks Barnes]

Correct.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Just to be clear, I am offended that Twilight Zone is no longer intellectual property that means anything to the kids. You know, for all the kids listening, you need to watch some New Year's Eve Twilight Zone marathons.

[Brooks Barnes]

I now go to the parks primarily for my job. Right. I'm usually reporting when I'm in them, but I'm definitely, as a fan, I'm definitely someone who wants to go to have the nostalgia button pushed. Whether it's a ride I rode as a kid, still being that same ride. You know, the Tiki Room at Disneyland is popular with no one except me.

[Gilbert Cruz]

It's popular. Hey, tiki, tiki, tiki, tiki, tiki room. You know, I got it in my.

[Brooks Barnes]

Head they would love, I think, to use that space for something else. But yeah, it is sort of distressing as a older person when you see some of the classic stuff, you know, fading away.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I feel like I still have nostalgia for theme parks that I went to when I was younger, amusement parks. But now the nostalgia is not for the experience. The nostalgia is for the movie that you watch. The nostalgia is for the Finding Nemo submarine, not the 20,000 leagues under the Sea submarine.

[Brooks Barnes]

Right. Although maybe in the past, I mean, there was 20,000 leagues under the Sea movie. So it could have been the same, but it's heightened is the point. Right?

[Gilbert Cruz]

All right, let's take a quick break and when we come back, we're going to talk roller coasters.

[Capital One Announcer]

Elevate your earn with the Venture X Card from Capital One and get unlimited double miles on every purchase with Venture X. Enjoy easy to use premium benefits like a $300 annual capital one travel credit at a price that makes sense. And no matter where your next adventure takes you, experience exceptional travel with access to over 1,000 airport lounges worldwide. The Capital One Venture X card what's in your wallet? Terms apply. Lounge access is subject to change. See capitalone.com for details.

[Joel]

Hey, hold up. This is your minute. It's your minute in this life, on this day. It's your day to play, to play, to make, to move, to move through, to explore. It's your morning to share, your weekend, to shape, to cook, to soak, to listen to, to wait. It's your body to rest, to nourish, to grow. It's your mind you know. It's your place, your country, your life, to love, to rise, to dream, to change. It's your world as much as anyone's. It's your world to understand the New York Times. Find out [e-mail] yourworld.

[Gilbert Cruz]

So, Mikado, we're gonna get into it now. Are you ready?

[Mikado Murphy]

Let's get into it.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I know you are the rollercoaster meister. How many roller coasters have you been on? Do you keep track in a book, a spreadsheet?

[Mikado Murphy]

Yeah, it's a website called Coaster Count.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Coaster Count.

[Mikado Murphy]

Yes.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Okay. We are doing free ads apparently.

[Mikado Murphy]

And you can go on there. And it has all the parks listed and all of the rides that have ever been in that park. I started using it long after I started riding things. That's why I can't remember if I rode certain things at certain parks. So I don't have a completely accurate count at the moment. I would say, generally Speaking, more than 200.

[Gilbert Cruz]

More than 200, yes. That would put you probably in, like, the top 5% of people who have ridden roller coasters, I would imagine.

[Mikado Murphy]

I would imagine so, yeah.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I feel like every year I hear about some trip or another that you took to go ride roller coasters. I think, correct me if I'm wrong, this year you went to Europe.

[Brooks Barnes]

Yeah.

[Mikado Murphy]

Yeah, you're right about that.

[Gilbert Cruz]

What are the stats on that?

[Mikado Murphy]

We spent a week in Europe. It was one week. Seven parks, four countries.

[Brooks Barnes]

Wow.

[Mikado Murphy]

100 rides.

[Gilbert Cruz]

That's a great movie poster tagline right there.

[Brooks Barnes]

I was gonna do a lot of fanny pack holding on that trip if I was alone. I don't want my hair messed up. I don't want to get wet. I don't want to feel sick. You know, I'm happy to sort of stand and watch.

[Mikado Murphy]

They weren't all roller coasters, so there are things that you could have ridden as well, Brooks. We also do, like, a good log flume and a river rapids ride and what enthusiasts call a dark ride, which is basically an indoor ride, like an indoor roller coaster or an indoor boat ride.

[Gilbert Cruz]

So you have to tell me, it would be journalistic malpractice not to ask you in this chair. What are some of your favorite roller coasters?

[Mikado Murphy]

Well, I'm happy to talk about it. So one of my absolute favorites, it's a ride at Magic Mountain that is now called Twisted Colossus. So they took the old wooden colossus ride and this company called Rocky Mountain construction, One of the big things that they do is go and take old wooden coasters and retrofit them with these customized steel tracks that they make. And so they did that with the old colossus and created this new ride, Twisted Colossus. And now it's this amazing racing coaster where.

[Gilbert Cruz]

So it's sort of two cars, you can see each other.

[Mikado Murphy]

Two cars, you can see each other. There's one element on it that's called a high five, where the track. Both tracks go sideways, right? And so you go through that part of the track sideways. So, yeah, that sounds so great. It blew my mind the first time I wrote it. And I just. Even to this day, I'm super thrilled by that roller coaster. And then another one that actually just became a very recent favorite is a ride that I just rode this year. It's at this park in Belgium called Plopsaland. And Plopsaland. Plopsaland Okay. Yes.

[Brooks Barnes]

It sort of competes with Schlitterbahn in Texas for the most awkwardly named theme park.

[Mikado Murphy]

Plopsaland is this really fun park in Belgium, and they did just put in this incredible roller coaster called the Ride to Happiness.

[Brooks Barnes]

In case it's not subtle.

[Mikado Murphy]

Yeah. Hey, it's kind of one of the great roller coaster ride names, I think, actually. But it is a spinning launch coaster. So the seats on the ride actually rotate, and then the ride also launches you into these hills and into loops and everything. But one of the cool things is right out of the gate, the train does an immediate inversion. They have a corkscrew or like a twist right at the beginning of the ride. And so while you're spinning, you also do this sort of upside down part, and then you go off into the launch. So there's a lot going on. If you like a lot of combinations of thrills, this ride just packs them in.

[Gilbert Cruz]

So, you know, when we talk about the limits of human ingenuity and we talk about going to space and we talk about all the things that we haven't done yet, it's just. I feel like it's all in roller coaster design here. Like, that's where all the great creativity is going.

[Brooks Barnes]

I love how deep you go, Mikado. You know, the manufacturers, you know, the advancements in track technology.

[Gilbert Cruz]

You look at, like, schematics before the rollercoaster's out. Is that. How are you tracking the construction of these things beforehand?

[Mikado Murphy]

Oh, definitely. I mean, when Epic Universe was being built, there are a lot of channels out there. There was a YouTube channel called Theme Park Stop that was tracking the building of Epic Universe. And they would go and look at permits to sort of say, it looks like this ride is probably gonna be this, and this is where it's gon. And I was following that stuff for a year, at least a year before that park opened. But, yes, I do track the manufacturers and watch a lot of the on ride videos, which are cool, but they don't really capture the full experience of what your body goes through on a ride. I mean, you can go and watch the ride to Happiness on ride video, but it is not gonna be anything like your body twisting and spinning and going upside down.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Yeah, I think there are lots of people, Mikado, who, you know, for physical reasons, whatever, can't get on roller coasters. There are people who are also afraid to get on roller coasters and who look at someone like you, maybe me, maybe Brooks, is this person and says, why would you do this? Why would you wait online for 45 minutes to feel scared or to feel these feelings. What is the appeal of rollercoasters for you?

[Mikado Murphy]

Well, one of the things I really like about it is that it's a controlled thrill. Like, I do like thrills, but I don't like all thrills. I'm not into, say, bungee jumping or skydiving, which feels a little bit scarier to me, because if I'm bungee jumping, it's just me. And so if something goes wrong, I'm the only person paying for it. But the parks do their absolute best to make sure that these rides are safe and secure, and I feel pretty confident of that most of the time that I'm riding a roller coaster, but it's still taking me to do something that I otherwise just wouldn't be able to do. Taking me up a giant hill and then dropping me down and upside down and into loops and everything. So that's the big appeal to me, this controlled way to have a little bit of chaos in my life.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I could ask you a question, or you could just respond to it, well.

[Mikado Murphy]

So, Brooks, why don't you like that?

[Brooks Barnes]

I used to like roller coasters, but I guess my fear or hesitation goes back to the carnival, to be honest. I could ride any ride I wanted, my parents said. But I could never ride the Zyklon, which was a rollercoaster on the carnival, because my parents considered that unsafe. And so there's probably, you know, some.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Did you see things? Is that. Did you see things as a traveling carnival?

[Brooks Barnes]

For sure, yeah.

[Gilbert Cruz]

That makes you.

[Brooks Barnes]

You know, this was the 80s and a traveling carnival and inspections weren't what they are today. I guess, you know, there's lingering trepidation around some of this. I also just think, you know, I do not think this is fun. I'm glad. I'm excited to be doing something I could never do otherwise. I only am thinking humans were not made to do this. Humans were not made to do this. When I went to report on Epic Universe, the first ride the chairman of Universal Parks wanted to take me on was that big roller coaster.

[Gilbert Cruz]

You did it.

[Brooks Barnes]

I did it. And I was somewhat embarrassed to let out a scream next to the Universal chairman, as in my New York Times costume. You know.

[Mikado Murphy]

Then it worked. What you're telling us is that the ride worked for you, and I'm here.

[Brooks Barnes]

To tell the tale.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Mikado, what is the feeling that you're looking for? Part of the reason that I go on roller coasters, it is that controlled chaos or that controlled fear. Very Often on a roller coaster or other rides that go very high, it is not a lie when I say I think I am going to die. But it is that chasing of an excitement that you just cannot get when you are living your normal life. That is what I am looking for.

[Mikado Murphy]

Yeah. I would say that feeling of turbulence on the airplane, that moment where your stomach drops, that's what I'm looking for. I just.

[Gilbert Cruz]

This is a turbulence guy over here.

[Brooks Barnes]

I'm holding onto the arms of my chair right now. This is making me very.

[Mikado Murphy]

I love turbulence on it.

[Gilbert Cruz]

You know what? So do I.

[Mikado Murphy]

There we go. Yeah, I just. I want that thrilling stomach dropping feeling. That's the big thing that I'm chasing. So I do like big drops more than I like inversions. Inversions are cool.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Loops.

[Mikado Murphy]

Loops. Yeah. It's cool to go upside down and I couldn't tell you how many times I've gone upside down. That's not as fun to me as that drop feeling.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Yeah, it's interesting. When I think back on the rides that I really loved when I was a kid, I still think I have the most nostalgia for those story based rides. They didn't have any big thrills. The type of big thrills that you're talking about. Mikado, the haunted mansion, Mr. Toad's Wild Ride, Peter Pan. These rides that would just seem so boring to kids today. To me they were. They remain just magical.

[Brooks Barnes]

That's actually a good point of how they're changing actually, because we love those rides and they're still beloved. Right. But increasingly they're building. It's not just about ip, but it's how they're constructing rides which are to be more interactive. Like you're in a video game, you're supposed to play against other players. And that's all because younger guests don't get as excited, you know, watching sitting in a boat. It's a small world. You know, being amazed at the little robotic figures used to blow you away, blow kids away. Doesn't really do the same.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Yeah, there is a. I went to the, to Universal Studios in Hollywood and there's as there is in Orlando, there's a little Harry Potter corner and there is a ride there that is as much about the screens that are around you. Like you're moving around in this. You're hanging and then you're moving around to different parts of a giant screen and there's sort of fire effects and all this stuff and yeah, it's like the interactivity of it, the movie ness of it almost in both of the Nintendo parks, I believe there's like a Mario Kart ride that also involves like a gamification of the ride. You're not just riding the ride, you're also doing other things.

[Brooks Barnes]

Is it virtual reality or augmented? I forget Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Augmented reality. You have these visors that you put on and showing in the visors are things that you're shooting at while you're also on the ride.

[Brooks Barnes]

I don't want to do this either, by the way.

[Mikado Murphy]

I don't want to do that either. I don't want to play a game while I'm on a ride. I want to ride the ride. Give me a ride that's interesting enough for me to just experience it without having to also like shoot at things to have enjoyment with it. I don't like those rides too much.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Look at these three middle aged men here. We talked about the way things used to be. This is great, by the way.

[Brooks Barnes]

Can I just make a point that the way things used to be, it used to be affordable. Okay. The costs.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Tell me about it. Yes.

[Brooks Barnes]

Have gone. I mean it's like bring the deed to your house if you have a. There was that guy who went viral this summer for posting the receipt of his family of five to the Disney Princess breakfast. It was like $938 or something for five people. Oh my God. And you're like, how can that be? Well, each person costs roughly $150 plus tax and tip. And it's a lot. I was curious looking up. Disney gets a lot of the attention for the prices because it's the biggest. I think it has 140 million turnstile clicks a year worldwide and Universal has like 60. So it dwarfs everybody else. So it fairly gets more attention or scrutiny for costs. But Six Flags Magic Mountain, a fast pass there, costs for a Saturday, this Saturday costs between $140 and $260 per person. On top of admission. God. Right. Yeah, I can't afford that.

[Mikado Murphy]

Then you'll be waiting in line, I guess.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I guess so. Look, I think we have acknowledged and most families who ever consider going to Disney World in particular know that it is a bank breaker. You know, it is quite expensive. Do either of you have any recommendations for people who want to go to a great amusement park but don't want to have to, you know, sell a kidney in order to get there?

[Mikado Murphy]

Yes. I found this one park in Pennsylvania called Knoebels which is just.

[Brooks Barnes]

People love that park. Have you ever been there?

[Mikado Murphy]

It is an amazing park and it was just Wondrous. The whole time I was there. One of the great things about it is that it's kind of tucked away in the woods, but the parking is free. And then also it's free to get into the park. And then you just buy tickets to ride the ride. So now grandma can come. Now the whole family can come. People who don't ride anything. The purse holders. Right. Like everyone can come and just kind of enjoy the day. But then the rides are also really terrific. There's a wooden coaster there called Phoenix that is one of the absolute best that I've been on. And so it's nice to have a combination of fun rides, but also something that doesn't break the bank. It's, you know, a lot of the experience is totally free and just something you can go and do with your family. And that is the absolute opposite of Disney and Universal.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Can we give a shout out to the purse holders? I'm glad you brought this up.

[Brooks Barnes]

I was. Did you see me sort of gulp? I was like, oh my God. You just call me a pursehold holder.

[Gilbert Cruz]

This is the person in every group or every family who, when you all go to an amusement park, you know, there's the one person who doesn't want to go on the roller coaster or the rides. And to be real chill about it, they're like, I'll just hold everyone's bags, like it's totally fine.

[Brooks Barnes]

That's increasingly me.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Brooks, are there any smaller parks that you think are worthy of acclaim?

[Brooks Barnes]

Dollywood.

[Gilbert Cruz]

I was gonna ask about Dollywood.

[Brooks Barnes]

Pigeon Forge, Tennessee, needs a major shout out here. Have you ever been Mikado?

[Mikado Murphy]

Oh, yeah. I love that park.

[Brooks Barnes]

Yeah, they have.

[Mikado Murphy]

It's amazing.

[Brooks Barnes]

Before I went, and as a Dolly person, you could probably guess, I thought Dollywood would be sort of campy. You know, I was looking for anatomically correct Dolly Parton coffee mugs, maybe in the gift shop. It's actually very family friendly and down home and country in the best possible way, they are known for topiaries and flowers. They've got the Craftsman's Village where you can see someone being a blacksmith and doing those kinds of old fashioned crafts. And they make the best. They're known for cinnamon rolls. No one does a better cinnamon roll than Dollywood. Actually. They call it cinnamon bread, I believe.

[Mikado Murphy]

They also do have very good roller coasters there too. There's one called Lightning Rod, which is a wooden launch coaster that just goes out into the mountains and is just amazing. So in addition to just having it be some fun wholesome down home, Goodness. There are also some really good thrills there too.

[Brooks Barnes]

Fire chaser.

[Mikado Murphy]

That's a good fire chaser.

[Gilbert Cruz]

This is for both of you. What do you think makes a theme park an amusement park?

[Brooks Barnes]

Great.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Why do you go? Why do you think people go?

[Brooks Barnes]

You know, one of the things that really people go for but they don't maybe realize is there's this common bond among strangers when the emotional buttons are pushed through a parade or fireworks or the theming that brings people closer together as strangers. I think that you want to go somewhere where the normal rules of life are suspended. Right. You don't feel out of place as an adult or maybe feel less out of place as an adult wearing mouse ears or hugging Elsa or whatever. Right. You can eat junk food before noon.

[Mikado Murphy]

I go because of the rides mainly. If a park has two fantastic roller coasters, three pretty good ones, then it's worth going to.

[Gilbert Cruz]

We're going to take a break and when we come back, we'll finish up as we do every week, with a little game.

[Capital One Announcer]

Experience. Premium travel with the Capital One Venture X card. When you book through Capital One Travel, enjoy easy to use benefits like a $300 annual Capital One travel credit at a price that makes sense. Plus you'll earn double miles on every purchase. And when you need a moment to relax during your adventures, you can access over 1,000 airport lounges worldwide. The Capital One Venture X card. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. Lounge access is subject to change. See capitalone.com for details.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Hi, I'm Joel from the New York.

[Mikado Murphy]

Times Games Team and I'm out here.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Talking to people about games. What's your favorite game?

[Brooks Barnes]

The Mini connections. The course.

[Mikado Murphy]

Vibe Strands.

[Gilbert Cruz]

What's your vibe when you're playing one of our games?

[Capital One Announcer]

It makes me feel like I'm procrastinating in a really productive way.

[Brooks Barnes]

It just scratches an itch in my brain. All of these games are so fun because it's like a little five to ten minute break. I love these games. Yeah, you can play all New York.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Times games at NY or in our games app. We're talking this week about theme parks, about roller coasters. And we've reached our final segment which as it is every week is a game. So it seems silly to me to spend all this time talking about roller coasters and not ride a roller coaster. Sadly, we cannot do that. I talked to the bosses here. They said it was, quote, a stupid idea for the three of us to record this episode on a roller coaster. So instead we have designed a game today that is a roller coaster. Let me explain. It's a quiz themed roller coaster. We're calling it the Roller Quizter. Each round of the game is named after a component or part of a roller coaster. I think it'll become clear what I'm talking about as we go. All right, are you guys ready?

[Mikado Murphy]

Yes.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Is your lap bar down? Have you removed all loose items from your purses?

[Brooks Barnes]

My glasses.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Have you taken your glasses off? Because they're going to fly off and hit someone down below. Are you ready? Okay. We're going to leave the station. First up, of course, is the lift hill. This is the part of the coaster where you get dragged slowly up to the top of an enormous hill and anticipation builds. In this round, I want each of you to name a kind of ride that you would find at a theme park other than a roller coaster. You're gonna go back and forth, and the first person to blank or repeat an answer loses. Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Log. Flume.

[Brooks Barnes]

Dark Ride.

[Mikado Murphy]

Tilt. A Whirl.

[Brooks Barnes]

Swing.

[Mikado Murphy]

Ferris Wheel.

[Brooks Barnes]

God damn it.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Mikado. You have a point. You have a point. Here comes the big drop. In this round, I'm going to give you the definition of a word, and you will give me the word. The answers all have a common theme. Another word for autumn. Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Fall.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Correct. To jump headfirst into water. Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Die.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Dive. Dive. To use a rubber suction device to unplug a drain or pipe. Brooks.

[Brooks Barnes]

Plum.

[Gilbert Cruz]

That is a fruit. The answer is plunge. Plunge. Plunge. It had a motion.

[Brooks Barnes]

It had a potion.

[Gilbert Cruz]

You were doing the motion. Nike's logo. Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Swoosh.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Swoosh. And finally, one of the most popular cereals in America, at least when I was a kid. Fruit. Blank. Mikado. Loops. Loops. And we are headed for some loops right now. I'm gonna play a famous musical loop, and you're gonna tell me any song that that loop has appeared in. Here's the first one. Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Can't touch this.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Can't touch this. This by MC Hammer. That is correct. Second loop. Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Harder, Bester. Faster. Stronger.

[Gilbert Cruz]

You were almost there. Harder.

[Capital One Announcer]

Better.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Faster. Stronger. Harder.

[Mikado Murphy]

Better. Faster. Stronger. Not Bester.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Come on, Bester.

[Mikado Murphy]

I'm a journalist.

[Gilbert Cruz]

My favorite word. Third loop. Mikado.

[Brooks Barnes]

Hi.

[Gilbert Cruz]

My name is correct. Now it is time to go through a corkscrew. I'm gonna give you a variety of wine and you tell me whether or not it is real. Alianico. Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Not.

[Gilbert Cruz]

It is real.

[Brooks Barnes]

Good. He finally got one wrong.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Next. Wine. Blau. Frankish. Brooks.

[Brooks Barnes]

Real.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Real. That is correct. Next one. Movedra. Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Not real.

[Gilbert Cruz]

It is real.

[Mikado Murphy]

Oh, my gosh.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Bop.

[Mikado Murphy]

I don't drink.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Bop. Neither do I. Bobich Brooks.

[Brooks Barnes]

Not real.

[Gilbert Cruz]

It is real. And final. Grillo Mikado. Real. Real. It was a corkscrew. They're all real wines. Ah. Okay, we have hit the splashdown round. Answer the following questions, the two of you. In physics, when a solid is heated above its melting point, it becomes what? Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Boiling.

[Gilbert Cruz]

The answer is liquid. The musician Prince won an Oscar 1984, for the score to his film Purple. What? Mikado.

[Mikado Murphy]

Rain.

[Gilbert Cruz]

A 2016 Oxford University Press survey found that this work, meaning slightly wet, damp, or humid, was among the most hated words in the English language. Mikado. Moist. Moist. The worst word in the world. All of those answers had to do with water. We've splashed down. We're back in the station. Good work, Brooks. Good work, Mikado. You both did great. However, we can only have one winner, and our winner today is Mikado Murphy. Mikado, you've won. And because you've won, you get a prize. It's an actual prize. I'm opening up a container here. I'm pulling it out. It is something we call the Gilby.

[Mikado Murphy]

Oh, my goodness.

[Gilbert Cruz]

It is a small golden trophy.

[Brooks Barnes]

That's really my face on it. I am jealous of that.

[Mikado Murphy]

This is fantastic. I want to thank the Academy. The Gilby Academy.

[Brooks Barnes]

The Gilby.

[Mikado Murphy]

Thank you, Brooks.

[Gilbert Cruz]

Thank you very much for being on this episode. This was so wonderful. Mikado, a delight.

[Mikado Murphy]

Happy to be here.

[Gilbert Cruz]

This episode was produced by Alex Baron, who is also our quizmaster. He had help from Tina Antolini, Luke Van der Plug, and Kate Lepresti. We had production assistance from Dalia Haddad. This episode was edited by Wendy Doerr and engineered by Rowan Nimisto. Original music by Dan Powell, Marion Lozano, Elisheba Itup and Diane Wong. Special thanks to Paula Schumann. Thanks for listening. We'll be back next week. See you then.

[Capital One Announcer]

This podcast is supported by Capital One. With the Venture X card. You can enjoy easy to use premium benefits like a $300 annual capital one travel credit when you book through Capital One Travel. Plus, you'll earn unlimited double miles on every purchase the Capital One Venture X Card. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See capitalone.com for details.