The Daily: 'The Interview' – Simon Cowell Is Sorry, Softer and Grieving Liam Payne

Date: November 29, 2025
Host: Lulu Garcia-Navarro
Guest: Simon Cowell

Overview

In this thoughtful, intimate episode of The Daily’s "The Interview," Lulu Garcia-Navarro sits down with Simon Cowell at his home in the Cotswolds, delving beyond Cowell’s notorious “king of mean” persona. The wide-ranging conversation explores Cowell’s personal evolution—his regrets and apologies, his experience with grief following the sudden death of Liam Payne, his approach to artist development and the music industry, changes in his personal life, and his current outlook about fame and relevance.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Power of the Audience and the Art of Engagement

• Booing and Showmanship (02:05–04:48)
  • Simon Cowell recounts the experience of being booed by audiences and embraces it as part of the job:

    “It makes me laugh to be honest with you... We actually try and encourage it, which is, look, if you’re really unhappy with this, then tell us.” (02:47 – Simon Cowell)

  • Credits his father’s advice—“make people feel important”—and describes the importance of acknowledging everyone involved in a show, from security staff to the audience.

2. Early Struggles and Learning about Culture

• From School Dropout to Music Executive (05:07–10:45)
  • Simon candidly discusses his failed attempts at various jobs and his parents’ concerns, before landing as a runner and then moving into EMI.
  • He credits his “bottom-up” approach to his own financial insecurity and need to “keep the lights on”:

    “All I was thinking was I’ve just got to keep a job. I’ve got to keep the lights on. Exactly. Yeah.” (11:35 – Simon Cowell)

  • Noted for breaking Sunita in gay clubs and recognizing the value of subcultures and grassroots tastemaking.

3. Smart A&R: Hits, Flops, and Missed Opportunities

• Unorthodox Music Choices & IP (11:28–14:45)
  • Describes how he found commercial success with “gimmicky” acts (Power Rangers, wrestler themes) by leveraging the popularity of non-musical IP.
  • Recounts the formation of Westlife and the pragmatic importance of mixing talent, looks, and—most crucially—songs:

    “The song is probably the most important factor in all of this.” (14:31–16:01 – Simon Cowell)

• Regrets: The Ones That Got Away (16:13–17:53)
  • Missed opportunities with Spice Girls and Kylie Minogue described as hard lessons that stoked his determination.

4. Simon Cowell, Criticism and Apology Era

• On American Idol “Meanness” (17:53–20:58)
  • Simon reflects on his infamous bluntness and the outcry it sparked:

    “I wasn’t trying to be a dick on purpose... I was frustrated... What can I say? I’m sorry.” (18:34–20:16 – Simon Cowell)

  • Regrets moments that crossed the line into humiliation and admits the viral compilations of his harshest remarks are less than flattering.

5. Mentoring and Managing Fame

• Ryan Seacrest’s Ambition and Britney Spears on X Factor (20:58–25:33)
  • Speaks candidly about Seacrest’s “steely” hunger for fame and his surprising, sobering experience recruiting Britney Spears as a judge during her conservatorship.

    “It was like two different people, Lulu. And it was a shame.” (24:50–25:33 – Simon Cowell, on Britney Spears)

6. The Formation of One Direction and Mourning Liam Payne

• Boy Band Creation (25:33–27:48)
  • Recounts how One Direction came to be—combining individual contestants who hadn’t made it individually.
• Liam Payne’s Death & Dealing with Grief (27:50–33:28)
  • Simon describes with visible pain how he learned of Liam’s passing, likening the shock to losing his own father.
  • On his limits as an industry executive and the guilt/void that follows:

    “You always think about things like that. What if I’d said this? What if I’d said that? But... there’s only so much you can do with any artist.” (30:22–31:45 – Simon Cowell)

  • Explores the toxicity of fame and the complications of nurturing young stars.

7. Staying Relevant and the Shifting Music Landscape

• On Launching a New Boy Band & K-Pop (34:36–36:29)
  • Cowell admits the landscape has radically changed: “The change in 10 years is ginormous.” (36:54)
• AI and the Future of Music (35:51–36:29; 48:28–49:10)
  • Ambivalent about AI artists:

    "I'm not thrilled at the prospect, if I'm being honest with you. It's not really my thing." (35:56)

8. Personal Life: From Partying to Fatherhood

• On Regrets, Depression, and Healing (44:16–47:09)
  • Simon credits his son Eric and long-term partner Lauren with saving him from a post-bereavement spiral:

    "When my mum passed away... it was like feeling like an orphan... It was like my life changed when he was born. Everything started again, if that kind of makes sense." (45:24–46:24)

  • Shares how Eric’s innocent comment about being asleep in the day catalyzed a dramatic shift in Simon’s habits.

9. Softening Views and Stepping Back from the Fray

• On Social Media & Bullying Culture (52:13–52:44)
  • Cowell deliberately avoids the digital social world:

    "I don't have a phone and I don't read anything online or... newspapers." (52:13)

  • Reflects on how his own mellowing contrasts a world he sees as more vicious, but prefers his insulated, positive working environment.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the “King of Mean” Persona:

  “What can I say? I’m sorry... just being a dick.” (20:16 – Simon Cowell)

• On Grieving Liam Payne:

  “It was like, whoa... It’s very difficult to put into words... It was just awful. Awful.” (27:54–29:48 – Simon Cowell)

• On Fame’s Toll:

  “I don’t honestly know what is harder, which is trying to be famous or managing your fame. Both are equally difficult.” (33:50 – Simon Cowell)

• On Softening with Fatherhood:

  “Well, it saved me, if I’m being honest with you, Lulu... it was like my life changed when he was born. Everything started again.” (45:24–46:24)

• Favorite Current Artist:

  "Chapel Rhone. I heard her first song, Eric played it to me, and I went, that is one of the best, best songs I’ve heard in years.” (52:54)

• On Pressing the "Stop the Internet" Button:

  “I think people were happier then than now... That's just a personal thing." (49:58–50:44)

Important Timestamps (MM:SS)

• 02:47 — Simon on enjoying being booed, the artifice of the judge role
• 11:35 — “I’ve got to keep the lights on”; the drive behind his “unpretentious” music choices
• 14:31 — Looks vs. talent in band selection, and the story of Westlife
• 18:34–20:16 — Cowell apologizes for his American Idol “meanness”
• 24:50–25:33 — Britney Spears, her struggles, and Cowell’s concern
• 27:54–29:48 — Simon receives the news of Liam Payne’s death
• 33:50 — Reflection on the toxicity and difficulty of fame
• 36:54 — The massive industry changes caused by K-pop, social media, and TikTok
• 45:24–46:24 — Fatherhood saving Cowell from depression
• 52:13 — “I don’t have a phone... happier that way.”
• 54:05–54:47 — On the afterlife and faith

Fast Facts & Lighthearted Moments

• On the Jennifer Hudson “Spirit Tunnel” Viral Moment:
  • Lulu: “Comments seemed...surprised that you actually have legs, because a lot of people have only seen you behind a judge’s podium.” (38:19–38:26)
  • Simon: “But that is so funny you should ask that question, because it did occur to me...at least I can show that I still have that kind of work ethic...And I walk.” (38:26–38:59)
• On Reality TV:
  • Doesn’t watch “Housewives,” wouldn’t go on “Celebrity Traitors.”
• On Cryogenics:
  • “Forget it. No, I’m not interested. Maybe I actually do believe. I think now I do believe in God.” (54:05–54:47)

Conclusion

Simon Cowell reveals himself not only as a shrewd, occasionally ruthless industry player, but as a man who has been shaped by hardship, grief, therapy, and fatherhood. He’s reflective and at times apologetic about his past, open about his vulnerabilities, and wary of the toll—both personal and social—of relentless fame and modern digital culture. The episode’s second half, focusing on grief, family, and personal transformation, shows a softer Cowell with lessons hard-won, still curious and determined to adapt and find meaning, even as the world and his industry transform at breakneck speed.