Where ‘The Daily’ Gets Its Music

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Daily – "Where ‘The Daily’ Gets Its Music"

Date: October 25, 2025
Host: The New York Times (Michael Simon Johnson, guest-hosting; Natalie Kitroeff intro/outro)
Guests: Dan Powell (Creative Technical Manager & Composer), Marian Lozano (Composer)

---

Overview

In this bonus, behind-the-scenes episode for The Daily's subscribers, producer Michael Simon Johnson hosts a conversation with the show's two in-house composers, Dan Powell and Marian Lozano. The episode explores how the distinct music of The Daily is crafted, how musical decisions shape the show's tone, and what it means to compose for news podcasts. The discussion touches on creative processes, the show's internal music library, the blurry line between music and storytelling, as well as playful musical experimentation outside The Daily's typical "sound."

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Role and Philosophy of Music in The Daily

• The Daily is unusual in having its own in-house composers, forming an ever-growing internal library of tracks from which episode producers pull music as needed.
  • “The Daily is by far the largest library of any of our shows and it's probably the one we've spent the net total greatest amount of time writing music for.” – Dan Powell (02:43)
• Music selection is as vital to The Daily’s tone and identity as its journalistic content:
  • “Does this sound like a Daily episode to us? Does this story feel like a Daily episode?” – Michael Simon Johnson (02:57)

2. Defining 'The Daily' Sound

• The iconic theme (“primordial soup”) by Wonderly determines the show's musical DNA—propulsive, string-heavy, anchored in the present.
  • “There’s a certain amount of momentum and propulsiveness... It feels like breaking news. It feels like current events. It feels like the now that is happening.” – Dan Powell (03:35)
• Instrumentation is notably minimalist and string-based, with selective use of elements like marimba and piano.

3. Dissecting Popular Tracks

• “Looking for Answers” (by Marian Lozano) [04:19–05:36]
  • Originally written for an unaired episode; instantly became a staple.
  • Minimal instrumentation: plucky strings, marimba, piano.
  • The marimba is “cliché” for podcasts, but beloved internally.
    • “Sometimes I like to throw it in there as like a...see, you love it.” – Marian Lozano (04:37)
• “The Unmaking” (by Dan Powell) [05:54–07:24]
  • A frequent “ender” cue: sparse, reflective, designed for the episode’s contemplative closing minute.
  • Features pizzicato strings, electric bass, and a gentle drone.
    • “You’re sort of meant to just digest what's happened, what you've just heard, and maybe provoke some thoughts or ruminations about the episode.” – Dan Powell (06:09)
• “Middle Distance” (by Dan Powell) [07:24–08:33]
  • Defined by a warm, unobtrusive tongue drum, electric bass, and soft synths/woodwinds.
  • Crafted to be present, supportive, but never intrusive to dialogue.

4. Producer vs. Composer Perspectives

• There's an unscripted trust between composers and producers for how cues are used—often with little explicit instruction or explanation.
  • “We haven’t talked to each other about what those ideas are. We’re just trusting that we have a similar idea…” – Michael Simon Johnson (08:33)
  • “It’s cool when you don’t have the same idea.” – Marian Lozano (09:24)

5. Experimenting Beyond "The Daily" Sound

• The composers sometimes create tracks outside the customary style, adding diversity to the music library.
  • “45 Hydra” (by Dan Powell) [09:53–12:19]
    • Techno/psychedelic club track, used for an episode on WeWork founder Adam Neumann's excesses.
    • “There was a lot of experimentation of just, well, let me just make whatever. Maybe the Daily will use this at some point.” – Dan Powell (09:53)
    • Dance music and podcast cues fulfill similar functions—repetitive, minimal, with subtle variation to catch the listener's attention without disruption.
      • “Everything I learned about podcast music I learned from club music. And I'm only half kidding...” – Dan Powell (12:14)
  • “Bed Stuy 90s Hip Hop” (by Marian Lozano) [13:40–15:17]
    • Hip-hop track with classic “boom bap” sound, gritty guitar and bass loops, created for an unaired episode on 50 Years of Hip Hop.
    • Reflects both personal passion and genre experimentation:
      • “Hip hop and R and B are my favorite genres of music. So any excuse to write in that vein, I'm all over.” – Marian Lozano (14:20)

6. Making 'Invisible' Music, Yet Essential

• The goal: Compose music that subtly shapes mood, keeping listeners engaged without overpowering conversation.
  • “I like to think of music in podcast as highlighter, especially in moments that are very explanary.” – Marian Lozano (16:01)
  • The music is “essential to the show,” even as it remains in the background.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• [03:35] Dan Powell: “The DNA of all Daily music comes from one place, which is the theme song written by Wonderly… I think it’s kind of the primordial soup from which all of our cues have spawned.”
• [05:17] Michael Simon Johnson: “Marimba has a kind of…cliché podcast music instrument...But the reason it’s cliché is because we love it.”
• [06:09] Dan Powell: “'The Unmaking' is a type of cue that we...label as an ender...meant to just digest what's happened, what you've just heard, and maybe provoke some thoughts or ruminations about the episode.”
• [12:14] Dan Powell: “I mean, I'm mainly just proud I could provide the soundtrack to Michael learning what hotboxing is for the first time.”
• [12:34] Dan Powell: “Podcast music has to be repetitive and minimal...but there also needs to be just the right amount of variation because if it's too repetitive, it...will feel very, very stale.”
• [16:01] Marian Lozano: “I like to think of music in podcast as highlighter...to highlight a section and...keep it interesting but not distracting at the same time.”

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:32 – Episode intro and purpose: Natalie Kitroeff
• 01:29 – Introductions: Michael Simon Johnson, Dan Powell, Marian Lozano
• 03:35 – Origins and signature sound of The Daily
• 04:19 – Listening to and dissecting “Looking for Answers”
• 05:54 – “The Unmaking”: the prototypical ender
• 07:24 – “Middle Distance”: gentle, meditative track
• 09:53 – Composing outside the typical Daily sound; “45 Hydra” and club/dance influences
• 13:40 – Experimentation: “Bed Stuy 90s Hip Hop”
• 16:01 – Reflections on the role and aspiration of podcast music
• 16:35–17:28 – Gratitude and camaraderie between producers and composers

---

Tone & Language

The conversation is candid, collegial, and infused with humor, gratitude, and professional curiosity. Both composers and producers speak with pride in their collaborative process, their willingness to experiment, and their commitment to a sound that is both distinctive and supportive of The Daily's journalism.

---

Summary Takeaway

This episode offers an engaging look into the meticulous—and underappreciated—craft of podcast music-making at The Daily. The in-house composers’ creative philosophies and playful experimentation ensure The Daily’s music is as thoughtfully crafted as its journalism, quietly but powerfully shaping the listener’s experience in ways most will never consciously notice. For fans and aspiring podcast creators alike, it’s a rare window into the subtle storytelling power of sound.

Transcript

[Natalie Kichoev]

Hey, hold up. This is your minute, your day to play, to make, to move, to move through, to explore. It's your body to rest, to nourish, to grow. It's your mind, you know, it's your place, your life to love, to dream, to change. It's your world to understand the New York Times. Find out [e-mail] yourworld hey, it's Natalie.

And welcome to another subscriber only episode of the Daily. We're gonna be doing these bonus episodes every two weeks to bring you stories that we wouldn't normally cover on the show. Stories that we think are fun or interesting or just something that you, our subscribers, would enjoy. Here at the Daily, we have something really special and a little unusual, which is our own in house composers. So today, a conversation with two of the people who make music you hear on the Daily, Dan Powell and Marian Lozano. For this episode, I'm turning the host mic over to someone else who's normally behind the scenes of the show. Daily producer Michael Simon Johnson, thanks so much for subscribing and as always, for listening. It's Saturday, October 25th.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Dan, Marion, thanks for sitting down to talk with me for a few minutes about music.

[Dan Powell]

Thanks for having us.

[Marian Lozano]

Yeah, happy to be here.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Listeners may not be familiar with any of us, actually. I'm Michael Simon Johnson. I'm a senior producer on the show. And what part of being a producer means is that when we work on episodes, we pick out the music to score certain sections from this growing library of tracks. And most of that music is written by a team of composers that we have, which includes the two of you. Dan, you are our creative technical manager and you're also the composer that's been here the longest.

[Dan Powell]

Correct.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Marian, you've also been here quite a while. And both of you are composers whose music we use a lot on the Daily Honored. We're super lucky to have you guys. I feel grateful for you every day. And so I know a lot of the other producers, but you are spending a good portion of your day, I don't actually know how much, but you're spending a good portion of your week, I guess, composing music that is added to this library that we pull from. Is that right?

[Marian Lozano]

Yes.

[Dan Powell]

It can vary week by week depending on the show, but the Daily is by far the largest library of any of our shows and it's probably the one we've spent the net total greatest amount of time writing music for.

[Marian Lozano]

You're welcome.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Yes, thank you. Well, I wanted to ask you guys about composing Music for the Daily. Specifically, when the editorial team, when the producers and the editors are sitting around thinking about what kinds of episodes we want to make, you know, we have a certain criteria. Does this sound like a Daily episode to us? Does this story feel like a daily episode? We have an idea about what that means, certain kinds of story arcs. Does it have clear takeaways, that kind of thing. But I imagine for you, thinking about what the Daily means is very different. So what does making a song for the Daily mean to you?

[Dan Powell]

Well, I think the DNA of all Daily music comes from one place, which is the theme song written by Wonderly, which is a great theme song. I think it's kind of the primordial suit from which all of our cues have spawned. And there are a few elements to that. There's a certain amount of momentum and propulsiveness. There's the instrumentation that's very heavy on strings. Electric bass, electric piano. It feels like breaking news. It feels like current events. It feels like the now that is happening.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Marian, to the point of what makes something sound Daily esque. I thought we could play a song that you wrote that is one of the most used tracks in the Daily. This one is called Looking for Answers.

[Marian Lozano]

I remember this one very well because I wrote it originally for an episode that never aired. So the music was released to the library, and I didn't think it would be used right away. And this one was used right away. This is classic in my mind, those plucky strings. Very classic Daily sound. I think I'm using. I think it is a marimba. Marimba is something you guys ask me not to use, and sometimes I like to throw it in there as like a. See, you love it.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Marimba has a kind of. It's seen internally as kind of like a cliche podcast music instrument. That's why. But the reason it's cliche is because we love it, so you don't have to convince us of that.

[Marian Lozano]

This song, I think, works well for the Daily because of the instrumentation within it. Also, it's super minimal, so it just works in a neutral sense because of how minimal it is. But instrumentation wise. Strings, marimba, piano.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

The news instruments Daily. Dan, we want to play another highly used song of yours that is called the Unmaking.

[Dan Powell]

Great. So the Unmaking is a type of cue that we would label as an ender, meaning that this is intended to be the last piece of music you hear before the here's what else you need to know today. Headlines part comes in. It's intentionally sparse and spread out. It also has a reflective character to it where you're sort of meant to just digest what's happened, what you've just heard, and maybe provoke some thoughts or ruminations about the episode. It also starts in this very, very sparse way and gradually brings in a few more things. So there's some pizzicata strings.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

That's that plucky string sound.

[Dan Powell]

Correct. There's live electric bass. Again, very, very sparse. There's this very light drone in the background. This is really just designed to be able to slot in in the last minute and a half of an episode in those final exchanges between the host and the reporter.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

This is another popular track that we use a lot from Dan. This is Middle Distance.

[Dan Powell]

So the main instrument you're hearing in Middle Distance is a tongue drum. It's called a tongue drum because the individual notes are cut out of the metal in the shape of a tongue, basically. And it provides this really nice, warm tonal sound. It's particularly well suited for podcast music because it has a rich sound, but there's not a lot going on frequency wise, in a way that would clash with vocals here. It's very soft and kind of muted. There's also an electric bass and some very gentle synth and woodwind drones that enter in. But this is another one of those reflective, meditative, let's ponder for a moment type of tracks.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

All of these are, you know, I hear the first five seconds and I'm like, oh, yeah, no, I know this one. This feels like a kind of like a friend that I see around all the time. And it's just interesting thinking about when producers are choosing these tracks, or at least when I am listening to these tracks to try to figure out which one makes the most sense. I listen to them for, you know, 10, 15, 30 seconds maybe, and I am hearing, as it's playing, what I think that song is supposed to be underneath. But it's just funny because you have a certain idea and I have a certain idea, and we haven't talked to each other about what those ideas are. We just. There's a certain amount of trust. You're just trusting that we have a similar idea in our heads as the producers of the show, that we use these songs in the way that you were imagining.

[Marian Lozano]

Yes, agreed. But also, it's cool when you don't have the same idea. It's just you envisioned it different than how we envisioned it. And that's fine because we're never telling you how we envisioned it either.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Well, actually, that sort of brings up an interesting idea we could talk about, which is, how often do you make stuff for the Daily that is explicitly outside the daily esque sound? How often are you sort of composing against type?

[Dan Powell]

When I first started working here, I was going through a sort of New York City club kid awakening and going out a lot and getting really into dance music and house and techno.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Amazing.

[Dan Powell]

And so sometimes I would be at the office late on a Friday afternoon or even evening and just make techno tracks and throw them in the daily library. So there was a lot of experimentation of just, well, let me just make whatever. Maybe the Daily will use this at some point. So this is one of those tracks I made. It's called 45 Hydra, and it's just sort of a pounding, pulsing, propulsive, psychedelic techno. It has a lot of atonal and kind of just purely textural layers that warp in and out. And I just sort of made this as a jam and then threw it in the daily Dropbox, not thinking that it would ever really get any use. But then there was an episode about the WeWork founder, Adam Neumann, who had a lot of very risque behavior as a CEO. And during one of the montages in which this was all recounted by the reporter, I heard this track pop in.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Do we want to listen to that?

[Reporter]

There was we bank. There was we sail. There was we sleep. There was talk of an airline.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

We fly.

[Reporter]

We fly. Presumably, there was talk of we Mars, even putting office space on the red planet.

[Marian Lozano]

That really is wild. It was wild.

[Reporter]

So Adam Newman becomes fantastically rich. He also indulges his eccentricities. I mean, he was known to walk around the office barefoot, but now he's installed a private plunge pool in his office, a cold plunge, an infrared sauna in his office. He has a white Maybach. He's, like, blaring hip hop as this chauffeured white Maybach takes him all over Manhattan. He also convinced the company to buy a $60 million private plane, which he and other executives hotbox. I'm sorry, that's, you know, getting high in a confined space with the marijuana smoke filling the cabin.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Yeah, this is. This is amazing.

[Dan Powell]

I mean, I'm mainly just proud I could provide the soundtrack to Michael learning what hotboxing is for the first time.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Yeah.

[Dan Powell]

Jokes aside, I have this bit. I sometimes say that everything I learned about podcast music I learned from club music. And I'm only half kidding, because they are actually serving really similar functional roles.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Tell us more.

[Dan Powell]

So podcast music has to be repetitive and minimal in a way where you have things that are repeating so as not to distract the listener. Minimal. So as not to take away from the voice of the people talking. But there also needs to be just the right amount of variation because if it's too repetitive, it's just going to sound like a loop and get old and feel very, very stale and stagnant.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

And the listener will become aware of the music in a way that they.

[Dan Powell]

Shouldn'T, which we don't want. Dance music can actually be very similar in that you're often trying to make things that repeat and vary a little bit over time, but also not so much because things need to stay in a consistent groove. So who knows, maybe the two are cross disciplinary musical studies. Or maybe I'm just trying to justify my off hours music tastes into my.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Day job as having professional value. I think it does. I can hear it in the music that you write for us at not just the electronic music, but also I feel very conscious of those small variations that you're talking about.

[Dan Powell]

I feel so seen.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Marian, what kind of music have you written for the show? That is the kind of offbeat non daily sound.

[Marian Lozano]

Bed stuy 90s hip hop. I named this track off of the neighborhood Bed Stuy in Brooklyn because that's where Bay's from. And it was originally written for an episode, Rest in Peace that did not air on 50 Years of Hip Hop.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Yes, I was working on that episode. I was very excited about it. It did not air.

[Marian Lozano]

Yes. RIP Hip hop and R and B are my favorite genres of music. So any excuse to write in that vein, I'm all over. So yeah, I wrote this song that has that classic boom bap sound, the kick and the sn.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Very crisp percussion.

[Marian Lozano]

Yeah. And then there is a bass line and a guitar line that are playing on a loop. And that's intentional because 90s hip hop is very much a rapper laying bars over a loop.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

And these loops, I mean the guitar and the bass also sound like they are derived from some funk song that you found somewhere on an old vinyl. In the Same way that 90s hip hop producers would.

[Marian Lozano]

Well, I wanted it to sound a little gritty, like it was something ripped from a vinyl.

[Dan Powell]

Right.

[Marian Lozano]

So yeah, like samples.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Sort of a strange question for you guys. What do you hope that listeners take away from the music? Because on the one hand you're musicians. I imagine that when you envisioned being a musician it was to create music that you wanted people to listen to. But the nature of the music that you're writing is to be a little bit more invisible on some level and making music, as you said earlier, Dan, that is too noticeable sort of defeats the whole point of this. So I'm curious about how you think about the listeners engaging with your. With your music.

[Marian Lozano]

Yeah, I like to think of music and podcast as highlighter, especially in moments that are very explanary. I think sometimes a listener can tune out for a second and I think of our music as a way to highlight a section and we gotta keep it interesting but not distracting at the same time. So there are a lot of layers to it. But I think in general, when I think about the listener, I think about drawing them back in.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Well, like I said before, I feel the trust that you put in us as producers to use your music adequately and in a way that honors the intention of it. And if I haven't expressed this sufficiently enough, I feel very grateful that you guys do what you do, that you do it for this show. All of the producers and editors consider the music very, very essential to the show. Dan, Marian, thank you so much for stopping by.

[Dan Powell]

Thank you for having us. And something we're very grateful to do on our end as well.

[Marian Lozano]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Of course.

[Dan Powell]

We just want to make your life easier when it's 4am and you need to find, you know, something that you put in, like, oh, God, how am I going to end this?

[Michael Simon Johnson]

You know, that's so real. That's, like, not an exaggeration. So I really appreciate it.

[Marian Lozano]

I hope it's not 4am I hope it's more like 3am yeah.

[Michael Simon Johnson]

Sometimes it's midnight, and that's always nice. Thanks, guys.

[Dan Powell]

Thank you.

[Marian Lozano]

Yeah.

[Natalie Kichoev]

Today's episode was produced by Michael Simon Johnson and Rachelle Banja. It was edited by Lexi Diaw and Paige Cowett, contains music by Dan Powell and Marion Lozano and was engineered by Chris Wood. I'm Natalie Kichoev. See you next time.