The Documentary of Life with Matthew McConaughey

Summary

The Dan Buettner Podcast: "The Documentary of Life" with Matthew McConaughey

Episode Date: October 2, 2025
Host: Dan Buettner
Guest: Matthew McConaughey

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Overview

In this rich and revealing episode, Dan Buettner sits down with Oscar-winning actor and bestselling author Matthew McConaughey for a frank and inspiring conversation about happiness, longevity, family, faith, personal growth, and the art of living a purposeful life. McConaughey opens up about personal low points, sources of fulfillment, family legacy, and how his lifestyle aligns with many Blue Zones principles uncovered by Buettner in his global longevity research. The discussion delves deeply into vulnerability, resilience, and what it means to succeed—both in Hollywood and in the human journey.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Life as a Documentary: Embracing Agency

• Defining Your Role:
  • McConaughey views life as a documentary where each person is the protagonist, with "action" called at birth and "cut" at death. He challenges himself and listeners to embrace agency and not "half-ass it."

    “What are you doing in the documentary of life that everyone’s in? Where action was called the day we were born and cut will be called the day we die. Don’t half ass it.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [01:38]

2. The True Nature of Happiness

• Pursuit Over Arrival:

  • Happiness is less a static state than the pursuit of growth, accomplishment, and meaningful construction—whether in relationships, family, or career:

    “I’m happiest when I am on the come, on the approach, moving toward an accomplishment or adding logs to the fires I already have built in my life.… When I’m in construction is when I’m happiest.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [04:56]

• Happiness and Attitude:

  • Referring to Buettner's Blue Zones research, they discuss how viewing life as "long and easy" is correlated with greater happiness.

3. Fame, Success, and Its Costs

• Upsides & Downsides:

  • McConaughey acknowledges the privileges and opportunities that come with fame but doesn’t shy away from noting lost anonymity and heightened expectations.

    “You also have to work harder to carve time for yourself… harder if you get famous for one thing.… But the upside is just the chance to make those changes, no matter how hard they are. The access… is awesome. I would not trade it.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [08:36]

• Vulnerability of Visibility:

  • With fame, falls from grace are further, and success attracts both support and envy.

4. The Oscar Effect & Hard Work

• Impact on Longevity:

  • Interesting research: Academy Award winners live, on average, four years longer. McConaughey suggests it's more about the new opportunities and peak experiences that follow, rather than a causal effect.

  • The work behind his “Dallas Buyers Club” Oscar—meticulous preparation and extreme physical transformation (lost 47 pounds)—was grueling and meticulous.

    [14:37]

    “Get up in the morning and have three or four egg whites or…tapioca pudding… five ounces of fish and a couple of vegetables for lunch… and as much wine as I wanted to drink.”

5. Diet, Exercise, and Daily Routine

• Balanced Routine:

  • McConaughey cycles through being fully immersed in creative work (sometimes at the cost of physical health), to periods of athletic engagement, especially to remain active for his children.

  • He values sleep (aims for 9 hours), prefers matcha and kombucha over coffee in the morning, eats plant-forward balanced meals with seafood or chicken, enjoys beans, and limits red meat.

  • His first coffee is after lunch and he works out late afternoons; enjoys tequila in moderation at night.

    [17:52]

    “For the past year my daily routine would be—get nine, nine and a half hours of sleep… pretty spartan at breakfast… seafood or chicken with salad or tomatoes for lunch… work out at 5 or 6 o’clock.”

6. Work—Flow and Creative Process

• No "Off" Switch:

  • Creativity is a 24/7 commitment:

    “Some of my best ideas... have come after 10pm on Saturday night. As a creative, I’m always writing, jotting down notes, whether… inspiration… joke… article.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [25:03]

• Unstructured Time Fuels Flow:

  • Gaps hamper productivity; creative inspiration often strikes late and can send him into committed writing sessions lasting hours.
    [27:29]

7. Learning From Mistakes and Embracing Vulnerability

• Shame, Reflection, and Growth:

  • In writing "Greenlights," McConaughey faced embarrassing and guilt-filled moments from his past, leading to powerful life lessons.
  • Shares a poignant story about firing a friend who worked for him—demonstrating tough but necessary decisions in leadership, and the eventual gratitude and reconciliation. [34:21]

• The Pizza Story—Lies and Integrity:

  • Tells the story of lying to his father about stealing a pizza, the shame of not owning up, and the lasting impact of that moment.

    “…the look in my dad’s eye…as a father saying to himself, what do I gotta do… what am I doing wrong as a father that I’ve raised a son who can’t damn tell me he stole a goddamn pizza, man…that feeling felt like a coward. I felt like a fool. I felt weak, I felt vulnerable. I felt like an absolute failure.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [44:35]

8. Family as Foundation and Legacy

• Peaks: Family Collaborations:

  • Describes recently working with both his son and mother on the film “Lost Bus”—a peak professional and personal moment.

    “I remember the moment I got my arm around my son here and my arm around my mother here. They're both beaming and I’m like, well, look at this moment—as a son, as a father.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [70:53]

• Intergenerational Lessons:

  • Shared the story of asking his father for permission to drop law and pursue film—leading to the now-legendary “don’t half-ass it” advice, which has defined McConaughey’s approach to risk and passion.

    “Are you sure that’s what you want to do? Yes, sir. Well don’t half ass it.”
    —McConaughey’s father [51:39]

9. Faith, Purpose, and Blue Zones Wisdom

• Faith as a Guide:

  • McConaughey’s life is grounded in Christian faith, which he sees as a pursuit of living closer to the divine and to higher ideals.

    “If I’m seeking to be a better man… there’s no better thing to be doing.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [75:55]

  • He encourages listeners to seek out faith, not necessarily in religion, but in anything that gives life meaning and provides something/someone to live and die for.

    “Ask yourself who or what you would die for. Answer that question. There’s your spot to go, to double down on belief.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [77:42]

• On Leadership and Public Service:

  • While not ruling out future leadership or political roles, McConaughey values being present for his children during their formative years.

    “Is it my initial language—politics? No. More poet, philosopher, communicator that way. What does… I don’t want to lose that. But is that maybe what we need more of? … If I go into it, I’m going to look up and I’m going to be in it… I’ve built a currency that I appreciate.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [87:06]

10. Success, Longevity, and the Quality of Life

• Longevity: Quantity vs. Quality:

  • McConaughey emphasizes that it’s not the length, but the quality, of life that matters, echoing Blue Zones themes.

    “Would I like to live longer? Great. Do I want to live with the obsession of, again, chasing this number? … I want to look at quality over quantity.”
    —Matthew McConaughey [97:15]

• Defining Success at 100:

  “If you know God’s there and you get to the gates, what’s the first thing to say? For so many years I was like, I thought he’d say, ‘Thank you, buddy.’ And five years ago I woke up out of a dream and …he did not say, ‘Thank you, buddy.’ You know what he said? ‘No, you’re welcome.’"
  —Matthew McConaughey [100:21]

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Notable Quotes & Moments

(Timestamps in MM:SS)

• On Agency:
  “Don’t half ass it.” —McConaughey [01:38]
• On Happiness:
  “I’m happiest when I am on the come, on the approach, moving toward an accomplishment…” [04:56]
• On Fame:
  “It comes with losing an anonymous soul, which I think is necessary for everybody, especially any artist.” [08:36]
• On Diet and Routine:
  “Get nine, nine and a half hours of sleep… matcha, some kombucha… seafood… green juices… work out at 5 or 6 o’clock.” [17:52]
• On Family and Legacy:
  “I remember the moment I got my arm around my son here and my arm around my mother here. They're both beaming…” [70:53]
• On Faith:
  “Ask yourself who or what you would die for. Answer that question. There’s your spot to go, to double down on belief.” [77:42]
• On Longevity:
  “I want to look at quality over quantity.” [97:15]

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Memorable Segments & Timestamps

• 00:01–01:38: Playful “documentary of life” metaphor; establishing the episode’s inquiry.
• 04:02–06:49: Blue Zones happiness insights and McConaughey’s relationship with “in construction.”
• 14:37–15:24: Detailed breakdown of the diet for “Dallas Buyers Club.”
• 25:03–27:29: McConaughey describing his unstructured, late-night creative process.
• 34:21–35:06: Emotional story about firing a friend and later reconciliation.
• 44:15–45:46: The pizza story—formative childhood lesson.
• 51:39: "Don't half ass it"—father’s pivotal advice.
• 70:53–71:37: The family film project—multi-generational pride.
• 77:42–81:24: Discussion of faith, meaning, and hope as bulwarks against cynicism.
• 97:15: Perspective on longevity—quality of years over quantity.
• 100:21: Defining success at the end of a long life (“You’re welcome.”)

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Tone & Takeaways

The tone is intimate, wise, playful, and deeply reflective. McConaughey’s blend of Texan candor, philosophical bent, and willingness to delve into family and vulnerability, along with Dan Buettner’s expertise in lifelong wellbeing, make this episode a masterclass in living life with intention, courage, and heart.

Listeners will come away with practical lifestyle inspiration, a sense of perspective on success and legacy, and a renewed appreciation for “not half-assing it” at any stage of the human journey.

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Books Referenced:

• Greenlights (Matthew McConaughey)
• Poems and Prayers (Matthew McConaughey)

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Final Thought:
To live a long, meaningful life, McConaughey asserts, is less about never erring than about striving—choosing virtue, connection, and belief, and stepping boldly into the documentary of our own days.

Transcript

[Dan Buettner]

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[Matthew McConaughey]

Are you doing in the documentary of life that everyone's in? Where action was called the day we were born and cut will be called the day we die. Don't half ass it.

[Dan Buettner]

Oh.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I went away and I encountered what I thought I would encounter many things in my past that embarrassed the hell out of me, made me feel guilt.

[Dan Buettner]

Like what? You have a way of galvanizing people to go after the good and I think that's what our country needs. And I'm just wondering, have you given any more thought to entering politics? So most of us know Matthew McConaughey as the ROM com heartthrob, the academy award winning actor. He owns a soccer team. He owns a line of tequila. From the outside, he just seems to have it all. And guess what? He kind of does. And I was shocked in our conversation to discover his life is surprisingly blue zones. In other words, the same things that I found going out in the world and studying the world's longest lived people, the world's statistically happiest people. Matthew McConaughey has put them to work in his life. He has several great secrets for not only living longer, but living happier. This is going to surprise you. I've known Matthew McConaughey for seven years. I know things that other people don't know. You're going to learn about them right now. Matthew McConaughey. I just like saying the name.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Like saying the name.

[Dan Buettner]

The name is cool. The name's got a certain lyrical coolness. Matthew McConaughey.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I remember people called me Matt McConaughey. No, it doesn't work out to Hollywood. And I talked to a voice coach of mine. He says, oh, it's easy. You want to change it? He goes, just tell him it's McConaughey. Rhymes with what would Madonna say? I said that one time. It's done. Everyone said my last name.

[Dan Buettner]

Everybody says it, right?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

Well, full disclosure, you and I have been on several adventures together, and we're friends, and I know things about you that nobody else knows. So I'm going to reveal more about you in this podcast than anybody's heard. I'm going to reach down deep and pull out Matthew McConaughey, people who've never heard. So I hope you're ready for it.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Let's go for it.

[Dan Buettner]

All right. Extra points for vulnerability, too.

[Matthew McConaughey]

All right, all right.

[Dan Buettner]

I want to.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Comes up, man. I don't want to answer. I'll just go. None of your business, Stan. Or your business, Dan, is none of your business.

[Dan Buettner]

You and I actually met over happiness.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

Six or seven years ago. We were at a Google conference and the who's who of the world was in the audience. I remember the CEOs of Netflix and HBO and celebrities and Nobel Prize winning scientists and Sting. And I was delivering the talk on happiness to this rather intimidating group. And I asked two questions of the group title, identify the happiest people. And those two questions are, do you think life is short or long? And the second question is, do you think life is hard or easy? And it turns out that the people who think life is long and easy are about 40% more likely to be happy than those who aren't. Later on in the lobby, you came up to me. The first things out of your mouth was, I'm one of the happy ones. I'm one of the happy ones. Are you still one of the happy ones?

[Matthew McConaughey]

I think so. But my definition of happiness is not FA la la la la. Hey, what matters. Let's just go through life head above the clouds. I mean, I'm happiest when I am on the come on the approach, moving towards an accomplishment or adding logs to the fires that I already have built in my life. And seeing Them grow a la family or marriage or career. When I'm building, when I'm in construction is when I'm happiest. And I am still in construction in most parts of my life, with 24 hours in a day only. I have, in the last six years, started to seek other possible avenues of me and what I'm supposed to do in my life besides maybe acting in front of a camera. It led me to writing a book, Green Lights. It led me to writing this book, all with. Under the premise of saying, all right, McConaughey, what? So you make movies, you do someone else's script that someone else wrote, someone else directed, someone else lensed in their camera, and someone else edited. That's four filters from your raw expression. So what are you doing in the documentary of life that everyone's in? Where action was called the Day We Were Born and cut will be called the Day we Die. And so I was just trying to. Been trying to challenge myself to going, what are you doing as a person, as a man, as a husband, as a father, as a possible leader in life that's in construction. So I kind of created characters, not aberrations, but parts of myself, said, oh, let's. Let's be that. Be more of that. To write the written word and put it down in hopes that it could translate to somebody and they could see themselves in me through a written word without me being able to perform it, without me having to have it lit. Right. Just the literary word seemed like a massive challenge.

[Dan Buettner]

I didn't know you at the time, but I remember seeing you accepting your Academy Award, and you got up and you gave a speech, which has been viewed by millions of people, and you talked about your mom in that. And, you know, I looked at this guy who I just thought, I cannot imagine life getting better for any human being. Was that indeed a peak point in your life?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Sure. Look, I'm getting the trophy from my peers, deeming the work I did most excellent. All that work in something in a craft and a vocation that had become a career for me, Not a hobby, a career, something I was working on, something I understood, something I knew when I did it well and knew when I didn't do it well. Something that I, you know, I've, I believe, improved on and dedicated myself to becoming better at it. So that was definitely a peak. The choices that I was making at that time that led to that. The people that were around me, family, Camilla, the family that came with me on all those locations and supported my decisions. My life Was extremely full. And now I was getting outwardly a trophy from my peers in Hollywood.

[Dan Buettner]

How about the fame? Yeah, I think a lot of viewers, Right, think about all the fame that comes with an Academy Award, an Oscar. Is fame as great as it looks from our side of the tv?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Probably.

[Dan Buettner]

Really? Why? I mean, you do, you, you don't have a, I mean, I've been with you and it's very hard for you to have a private moment, especially when you walk out.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, no, it comes with its lack of privacy. It comes with no longer meeting strangers anymore. It comes with losing an anonymous soul, which I think is necessary for everybody, especially any artist. It comes with, you know, like I say, not meeting any strangers. People have a pre made biography on you before. Howdy. And they jump right into, sorry about your dog. And you're like, number one, hey, what's your name? Number two, how'd you know I had a dog? Number three, how'd you know she had cancer? It's like, whoa, you're kind of trespassing that, you know, and you can't be everyone for everyone. People go, oh, you change like a damn right I changed. Yeah, hopefully. So you, you know, you also have to make time for how you have to work harder to carve time for yourself and for what you care about irregardless of the rest of the world. And that becomes harder to do. You have expectations on you. So if you're famous for one thing, for instance, I have time. I was famous for rom coms. I had to leave the business for two years to get the ability to do something else. And for two years, people going, what are you doing? That's not, no, no, no, no, you can't do that. You can't do that. So it's harder if you get famous for one thing. It's harder to maybe move over and try something else. But I mean, yeah, what's the sweet part? I'm saying the upside is just the chance to make those changes, no matter how hard they are. The access to things, people, places, experiences that come with fame are awesome. Backstage passes, whatever in life are great. And I would not trade it. I also, though, am a realist. And you know me well enough to know that once something's inevitable, I'm like, that, checks being cashed, the last thing I'm gonna do is right, there's nothing I can do about it. I'm, there's no going back for me. So the last thing I'm gonna do is go, oh, man, I, I, you know, and haw. About my existence. So am I being optimistic and showing. Talking about the upside of it? You damn right I am. Because I am famous. Ain't no going back.

[Dan Buettner]

But you can fall further than the rest of us. You're.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, but you also, it also comes with inherent ladders to maybe rise higher than I would be able to without fame. And I mean, I'll take that opportunity to bet on that. And yes, I can fall further. You damn right. And with fame comes certain people and enemies that I've never done wrong that want just inherently with human nature. Want to see me fall.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah. I don't think I have as many as a lot of people, but I got them. And I don't know after, after years I've been doing this 30 something, 35 something years and I've got enough of a life that has nothing to do with my fame.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Going on that secures me and not only keeps my heels on the ground, but gives me the courage to fly. That fame is. It's not, it's not up. It's not the Paramount. It's not what I'm chasing or working my ass off to make sure I maintain. It's a bipolar. You know what I mean? Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

There's something about an Oscar that most people don't know. There was an article in the Annals of Internal Medicine in 2006 that studied the life expectancy of actors, of all actors, and then of those actors that got an Oscar, won an Academy Award. And it turns out that the actors who won the Academy Award live four years longer.

[Matthew McConaughey]

They got more work.

[Dan Buettner]

Does that make any sense to you? Besides.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Not really, but maybe. Geez a man, they live four years longer. Imagine if they'd have played tennis. They're not even 12 years longer. So I hear.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, you got extra bonus.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Hey, more work you do get coming off of an Oscar. I will say this one of the main, like coming off of an Oscar, you get more options, more choices, more. The top tier material does come in front of you to choose from. And if you choose wisely and you get lucky and you make you. You're on top and riding that wave of that momentum for longer, you have that opportunity to. Maybe that has something to do with it. So it's not a, it's definitely not a regressive thing. It's not like you win the Oscar, like, okay, I'm going to recede now. I'm going to retire. I did it. I never looked at it like that. I don't think, I don't know Any other actors that did either.

[Dan Buettner]

Do you feel better about yourself, maybe higher status?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Sure. I give his affirmation. Sure. Again, for my peers to have said, we deem that work the most excellent work by Mel Lead this year. Hell yeah. It's huge. And I, and I, and I look, I was, I'm aware. I felt like the work was honest and true. Now, does it have to be a lot of other things? Do you have to also be in a good movie? Yeah, there's plenty of great performances we've never seen because the movie sucked. There's great performances on the cutting room floor that we've never seen that could have won Oscars if they'd have been built up and put and edited right and put in the right movie. So to have a lot of foundation things going for me. Yeah. Was it the kind of role that I think it performed well in a movie that was good, that also had an extreme weight loss which kind of goes well. Wow. Yeah. I mean, you don't. I wasn't doing it for that. But that's a byproduct of man.

[Dan Buettner]

I mean, you worked your ass off on that. People, I think, think that you, you, somebody sends you a script you read, memorize the script and you say it and you get the Oscar. That, that was nearly a year of your life, wasn't it? Preparing and.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, well, the, and, and, and there was.

[Dan Buettner]

By the way, we're talking about the Dallas Buyers Club.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah. I mean, look, the weight loss was a five month thing. In a program diet I was on, that's 2.5 pounds a week, like clockwork. That was not hard.

[Dan Buettner]

How much did you lose altogether?

[Matthew McConaughey]

47.

[Dan Buettner]

47 pounds. And if you wouldn't mind, share the diet you were on. You told me, but yeah, I would.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Get up in the morning and have three or four egg whites or a little thing of tapioca pudding, which. Good secret. If you're going to get on this diet and you're having pudding, don't get a teaspoon. Get one of those little southern sugar spoons. Makes it last longer, smaller bite. Five ounces of fish and a couple of vegetables for lunch. Five ounce of fish and a couple of vegetables for dinner. And as much wine as I wanted to drink.

[Dan Buettner]

Not exactly a blue zone diet, but not horrible either.

[Matthew McConaughey]

2.5 pounds a week, like clockwork. And I thought that exercise had a lot to do with it. The first two weeks I was burning 2000 calories a day on a treadmill. Then I broke my foot. No exercise, same diet.

[Dan Buettner]

Doesn't make any sense.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Same amount of work, same amount of weight drop.

[Dan Buettner]

There was a study that came out last month that showed the effect of a diet is 10 times greater than exercise. So in other words, you cannot burn fat if you're overweight. You cannot overcome a bad diet. So.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And I think it's more true the older we get, too.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, metabolism slows down 2% per year, so by the time you get to our age, we're not burning as much.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Now, what I have learned, though, at the same time, say my favorite weight, my fight was 186, right? 186. Now I'll say if I have to diet to keep that. Right. I could diet to keep that. And said, don't exercise. Look at me in three months at 186, dieting to maintain 186. And look at me three months from now, working out, eating more, but working out to main.186. The working out and main and diet and eating more to maintain 186 looks better. Yeah, it's fuller, it's got more fat content. And you try, it's less gaunt. It's more energy.

[Dan Buettner]

You and I hiked Buckskin Gulch. It was a 25 miles of ass deep in water. We biked over the mountains, North Vietnam. You're in good shape and 55 years old. You don't look 55. What is your routine? What. How do you. What do you eat and how do you keep in shape to.

[Matthew McConaughey]

So, look, I go through. I go through seasons. When I was writing Green Lights, I went ahead and told myself, be a writer. And if you don't, if you're. If you're hot and writing and you're. And you're in a groove, you ain't got to get up for nothing. You don't want to go exercise and. And I was consumed with writing where I was writing 17 hours a day. Remind you, I was kind of losing weight because I was forgetting to eat. I'd have to remind myself, you got to go to sleep and drink some water.

[Dan Buettner]

That's like writing like Jack Carol.

[Matthew McConaughey]

It was. That's how it was like. It was like that. I also had times when it was the editing process and then doing all the rest where I just kind of let myself go and I ended up putting on sweat. And that felt fine and good. I've been, you know, I try to stay within a few weeks of getting in shape for maybe whatever role now. What I do now is I'm trying to stay in shape to not get injured and to still be able to go out there and be athletic with my kids and to still be athletic enough to go play tennis and move around and be at a weight where I like the way my clothes fit and I feel good and I got a good amount of energy. I'll get up in the day. For the past, you know, year my daily routine would be get nine, nine and a half hours of sleep.

[Dan Buettner]

That's generous.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, get up. Thank you Camilla for that. As she says, I'd rather be around you. I'd rather get up before you and do the stuff that needs to be done when you get nine hours of sleep than be around you with seven and a half hours.

[Dan Buettner]

For those who don't know Camilla is Matthew's better Three quarter Yes.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Amen. So I'll get up. I'm pretty spartan at breakfast matcha a couple matcha teas and some, some, some kombucha. In the morning if I'm hungry I'll eat a little bit yogurt and berries or maybe some scrambled eggs and then but a lot of times I'll just skip it and kind of ride that little caffeine buzz in the morning until 12:30 or 1 I have a lunch. I usually do some sort of seafood I prefer or chicken usually seafood with a little bit of salad, a lot of tomatoes I'm into right now. I have a couple of green juices through the day one right after lunch I have my first cup of coffee after lunch.

[Dan Buettner]

Is that right?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah and, and that's on non conventional.

[Dan Buettner]

Most people get up and start their day with coffee.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I love to in the morning but I don't like how I feel in the afternoon. The coffee in the morning I love how I feel until 1pm but it steals the energy. I have a drop off.

[Dan Buettner]

Oh, interesting.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And it steals future energy from me. We' talked about this. I've tried that thing about no, wait an hour, wait till you're up for an hour and then have a cup of coffee. Whatever it is about the caffeine rust that getting coffee if I have it in the morning it grabs a debit from my energy in the afternoon. So I'll have my first cup and maybe two cups in the day at say 1:30 and then four and that's my favorite. If I'm powering through the afternoon I'll then in the afternoon do more work. I usually do my workout I prefer to do my workout 5 o', clock, 5, 6 o'. Clock I have much more, I'm a much more Energy and power.

[Dan Buettner]

I'm the same way.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Working out in the afternoon. Then if I can grab some tennis or whatever before dinner, come back, have dinner. For dinner, we'll have a lot less red meat than we used to, but, you know, fish or, or chicken of some form or some other white meat for, for dinner. And you know, I like my beans.

[Dan Buettner]

And he's just sucking up to me now.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I do, I actually do like my leg. I know I can get you started, though. And then, you know, I'll, I'll finish dinner, hang out, and then I'll pour my first drink of panelos tequila to probably about nine, you know, one, two of those and be hitting hay at about 11. Close my eyes about 1140.

[Dan Buettner]

By Joe. You're the only person I know who can drink a tequila at 9 or 10 o' clock at night and go to bed like a baby. I caught. Really, McConaughey.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Chamomile.

[Dan Buettner]

Chamomile.

[Matthew McConaughey]

What does it do to you? What's it do to you? You don't go to sleep.

[Dan Buettner]

No, I don't sleep very well. Most people don't sleep very well if they drink very close to bedtime. I'm a big fan of panel's tequila, by the way. I think it's very pure. If you're going to drink it's either red wine or pantalones tequila. But I usually, these days I drink a little bit with dinner, maybe a little bit after, and then call it off. But like people in the blue zones, most days are healthy days. A thousand out of 1100 meals are whole plant based and then they'll pig out during festivals. Same with me. About one day a month, I like to go deep where I'll stay up late.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

Usually a Friday night.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Once a month.

[Dan Buettner]

Once a month.

[Matthew McConaughey]

That's it.

[Dan Buettner]

Well, where I'll have more than, you know, one or two glasses of wine.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Okay.

[Dan Buettner]

And that is because, well, older people metabolize alcohol differently than younger people. So it doesn't provide the lift it used to provide. It interferes with sleep. The hangover is much longer. If I have three or four drinks on a Friday night, it's not until Sunday when by the time 60 Minutes is starting, that I'm getting over it. So it may just be that I hit it too hard in my younger life.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I don't know. I went pretty hard my younger life too. I mean, you know, I, I. Speaking of that, that, you know, a diet without meat, we've gone. We go a couple weeks at a time with that. And I used to be hard. It's not hard anymore. Maybe that's because there's so many new cool recipes. Yeah, without meat. But I find it. I used to.

[Dan Buettner]

I'm sure getting out of the Blue Zone cookbook all the time.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Oh, we've definitely eaten out of blues.

[Dan Buettner]

Think about what gives your life. Meeting your relationship, your values, your goals. Now imagine your mind constantly attacking those things with disturbing, unwanted thoughts that feel painfully real and persistent, even when there's no evidence to justify them. If this sounds familiar, you might be experiencing something more than everyday worry. Thoughts like these can be signs of ocd. And real OCD isn't about being tidy or liking things neat. It shows up as unwanted, intrusive thoughts that cause intense distress. OCD needs a type of specialized therapy called erp, or Exposure and Response Prevention, not regular talk therapy, which can make it worse. And that's where NOCD comes in. NOCD is the world's leading provider of OCD treatment with licensed therapists who truly understand OCD and specialize in treating it with ERP therapy. Therapy with no CD is covered by insurance for over 155 million Americans, and they provide support between sessions so you're never facing OCD on your own. If any of this sounds familiar, go to nocd.com and book a free 15 minute call to learn more about how they can help you. That's nocd.com and don't let OCD hold you back from the life you want. You know, as a National Geographic Explorer, I spend most of my life on the road. I like to say my main residence is a backpack, but actually I also have a real home. And because I'm not there most of the time, I usually host on Airbnb while I'm away. Next month, in fact, I'm taking a team of scientists to Sardinia, where we found a new blue zone. And while I'm away, my home will be on Airbnb because it makes sense. And the income I make off of that covers most of my expenses. So I'm a big fan of Airbnb and and how it solves a big corner of my little universe. You know, your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how [e-mail] host how many hours a week do you work?

[Matthew McConaughey]

That's a fun question, because some of my best ideas, the ones that have paid off, let's call it work, ones that have had the best ROI, have come after 10pm on Saturday night. I'm always as a creative, I'm always writing Jotting down notes, whether it's an idea, whether it's an inspiration, whether it's something I heard somebody say, whether it's a malaprop joke I told my kids, thought I said something I didn't say. And I write down what they thought I said and I go, oh, they actually, they actually mal propped and it's funnier or something I'll read, I'll pull an article or her paragraph from the news and I log these things at the end of each month. I'll get them all together and look and see where they fit in the silo of where my perspective is going. Do I have a theme in 100 of them? 100 times there they fall into a silo. Certain themes, I gather those, those have led to the books that I'm writing. Look, if I go like today, what have I done? I've worked from 9 and if we're calling this work, I'll work till 6:30 and had 30 minutes for lunch. I like to back to back to back to back it. I don't like a gap in the afternoon. Oh, you work till one and you're off till four. That three hours. I don't like it at all. And I don't work well in that three hours because I feel like it's got a curfew on it especially. I'm not going to be creative in that three hours because I know I've got a cap. And when I'm gonna be creative is when I'm like, you have no curfew. You can sit here until and spirit's moving you. Don't. I'm not gonna go to bed. Don't go, don't go to bed, don't get up, don't have to go to the next appointment, you know, So I don't like gaps in my day between work. I'd rather get up and get after it and go back to back. And I can stay in a flow and it's a yes flow I'm on. And then I can check if I've got a compartmentalize my thoughts for what the different meetings are for. I'll do that. But then at the same time, creatively, I may, you know, get on something. When I sit down at 11 at night and I go, and I wake up at 12 at night and I got an. I got an idea and I got a note, I'm going to lean over, I'm going to write that note and all of a sudden, if that spurs another thought, I'm going to follow it up. That may lead to two hours later. I've now moved out of bed because I don't want to make Wake up, Camilla. And I'm out on my laptop deconstructing that original idea that came in my head at midnight.

[Dan Buettner]

Wow.

[Matthew McConaughey]

If that takes me to four in the morning or I can get enough down, or six in the morning, they're like, okay, I'm formulating a thought here, and I think this is something worth following. And I've got a foundation here. I'll. I'll do that and then come back to it later and try to follow up and go, now, is this worth sharing in any way? Is this applicable to life in any way? That's usually my measuring point of things. All right, Is it applicable to practicality of more satisfactory living or more humor or more forgiveness or more courage? Or what about any of those values.

[Dan Buettner]

Or increasingly more poetry? You know, I remember when you told me about Green Lights. I think I remember you called me on New Year's Eve about six years ago and you said, I. I'm going to write this book. I don't know if you remember.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I do remember this. You weren't the first person I handed it to, and you gave me great notes.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, I was very honored to do that. And I'll be honest, when I. When I first read it, I thought this ran the risk of being a vanity book. And you went to work hard and you converted a memoir into a really impressive handbook. I thought you did a brilliant job of metabolizing your life experiences, many of which the rest of us will never have, but also a keen understanding of your very humble roots. You had a tough childhood, or it wasn't. You worked hard and you had more struggles than I think people know. And you somehow metabolize that into some very clear thinking. And one of my favorite quotes from Green Lights is about happiness and how happiness is more about responsibility, your family, and the alignment between who you are and what you do. And those are one of the lines. As a writer myself, I said, damn, I wish I would have written that line because it beautifully kind of sums up the philosophy of Blue Zones. But it's applicable whether you are an Academy Award winner or you're the janitor cleaning up the local high school. And where does that come from? First of all, did I sum it up correctly? And yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And so I'll say this like one of the things I noticed when I went to write Green Lights. I took my 35 years of journals away with myself on my own. And until that Point I was very afraid and still afraid to look back over my shoulder, which I've never been one to look to the past. I like to hear myself talk. I don't like to hear myself playback. I like to make movies I don't love watching. I did. It scares me a little bit.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah. I like listening to your own voice.

[Matthew McConaughey]

On your answering machine as it's coming out. No, I don't like it on my answer sheet. I like it right now as it's coming out. Yeah, I don't want to hear. I don't want to hear playback even two seconds later. You know what I mean?

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I went away and I encountered what I thought I would encounter many things in my past that embarrassed the hell out of me, made me feel guilt. Like what shame times when I was egotistical prick and a know it all about certain things.

[Dan Buettner]

Well, can you say why? Because I think that's where the rubber hits the road.

[Matthew McConaughey]

There's times when I was very arrogant.

[Dan Buettner]

I remember one. What I remember you may or may not want to tell the. The circumstances around. You had a manager who was working for you and got a little bit too big for his britches. He's still a good friend of yours. Well, I thought that told a lot about you both. Sometimes you need to do what you need to do to. To get her done, so to speak. But yeah, yeah. So sometimes, yeah, you got to make hard decisions.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well that, that was a. That was one which kind of leads into ownership and really in renting, owner rent and how we go into relationships. And I always say this. Look like everybody when we hire, whether it's an assistant or find a new friend or whatever you. We go into it like I hope this will be a lifer. Very seldom is it. Very seldom are those lifers. How many people have the same assistant they hired 40 years ago? Not many if you're lucky.

[Dan Buettner]

If you guys have Sam, he's been with me 17 years.

[Matthew McConaughey]

See, you guys are doing it. You guys are doing it, you know, and you got to. We have some old friends. We have some. But most I believe for most people end up not working. And that's all right. Now that being said, this story was a good friend of mine from college who came to work for me and running my production company. He didn't run, he worked in it, in development. And there was a lunch we had and I was living at the chateau. We had the lunch and he wanted to talk about year end bonus and talk about what the next year is going to hold and I was like, you know, we were talking about it, and I was like, yeah, well, I mean, you know what you're asking for. I understand that, but we're not really. I don't think we. I'm not seeing that. It's just on the books. I'm not seeing that. We're not making that. We're still losing. I was like, but what do you. What does he want? He goes, I want this. I want what you got. I want this. And I went.

[Dan Buettner]

Wrong, buddy.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And it hit me right then, I was like, this ain't gonna work. And I had to let him go there on the spot. And I was like, this. Just. We're friends, but this.

[Dan Buettner]

He was no longer on Team McConaughey.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And to want. And I get it, because when you're in position, I'm in. It happens with a lot of people in my position. You know, no matter how much work people are doing on this side, it comes through the lens of, well, Matthew did it. Well, Matthew did. And a lot of times it's right. But a lot of times it's not like with my family. Now I've got stuff Camilla does helps me succeed tremendously. I've got a lot of people that help support me, but it comes through that lens. And it's easy for sometimes people to go, as your friend or manager or co worker to go, well, that. That's unfair. Not, dude, that's just the way. That's kind of just how it goes.

[Dan Buettner]

That's right.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Springsteen's talked about it. Everyone's talking. That's kind of just how it goes. And you got to go, they're over there to take that. They're the lead singer for a reason. They got supplies. Take. Just take that. Hey, support the band. And hopefully you got a lead singer that comes back and goes, thank you, thank you, thank you. Band was great tonight, man. I couldn't do this without you. But. But you're still publicly. You got to go. And he went, I want this. And I had to let him go. I fired him that day. It was hard because he was a good friend and we didn't talk for a while and we kept in, you know, contact around Christmas or here, there a little small obligatory little note here and there. But I went back to LA one time. He knew I was coming back to la. It was years later. And he goes, can I meet you, man? Like seven, eight years later. And we had lunch and he sat there over tears. He sat there and he told me and I had him in my eyes. He goes, thank you. Because you did me one of the biggest favors.

[Dan Buettner]

Is that right?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Anyone's ever done me. You let me go because I was. I was out of my. I was out of my zone. I was chasing things that weren't mine to chase for what I needed to do for the company. And it forced me, humbled me, to go focus on what I need to do. And he gave me a great story. And he's found this wife, Charlie, and they. They. She was a music supervisor. They moved. They went. They moved down back home, Alabama. Life is great. They zeroed in on. On him, on himself and his life and what he could do. And he. And. And he thanked me and we've had hugs over it. And I did not have any idea that would be the outcome of that. I just remember that day loving this guy as a friend, but going, oh, as a business relationship. This is not going to work if this is what you're.

[Dan Buettner]

I loved how you recognize that. You know, I'm from the Midwest, Minnesota, and, And it's a place of humble and apologetic people you can trust, but it's also a place where the tall tree gets chopped down. And the more of that story for me is there are taller trees and sometimes you just need to own it.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And there's trees that the spotlight will be on them. It's like they say in sport about the quarterback. They'll say the quarterback gets too much credit for the win and too much credit for the loss. And I mean, I mean, yeah, but. But we're not going to moralize. Right or wrong. That's just how it is. And if you're the Springsteen of the band or you're the movie star, has a production company, has a team around them, that person's gonna get the spotlight on them. They will get hailed for certain things that you maybe did 80% of the work to set up for them to do, and all they did was walk in and knocked it out. They're going to get that. You can't get jealous of that. That's a service to go. That's a. You're in that position. I'm not going to go. It's not my. It's going to sink the ship if I go to challenge you, because I want to be spotlight on me too. No. Or I want. Or I want the credit. I want the crime with the credit. It's a humble position of being a manager in businesses, you know, that help create things that have to go. Look, I'm. I'm content and like it as A support system on in the Shadows. This person is going to get the spotlight and I understand where the jealousy. I understand where the jealousy well what.

[Dan Buettner]

People don't realize you get the spotlight but you're also responsible for the downside.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well that's true.

[Dan Buettner]

If it doesn't work, you fail.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You take the hammer 60 other people and you take the. You take the hammer as well.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

In any kind of failure or perceived failure.

[Dan Buettner]

You know, people read in your bio and I think you know you're going to be on a magazine cover. I don't know if I can say what cover it's going to be but you look like you have a charm life. You won the academy award. You own part of a soccer team, you own tequila company, you live in a beautiful house, you have a beautiful wife, your children are all perfect or near perfect. You have great friends, you go to great events, you're enormously talented, you have fun but what people don't see and one of the reasons I think people should pick up poems and prayers here your new book. You have a chapter entitled fuckups, Daymares.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Wobbly, lost and looking looking.

[Dan Buettner]

And I'm actually going to ask you to read just one paragraph. I got it open for you.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Ooh ups. Daymares, wobbly, lost and looking we all been there. I continually miss the mark come up short sin I am not the man I aim to be. The father, the friend, the husband, the artist I aim to be. I don't like it but I wonder if we're not missing coming up short or sinning enough. Maybe we aren't trying hard enough. Are we not venturing close enough to the front lines of life's battles? I'm not sure but I don't believe that God wants us to stay warm and cozy in the even money exchange rate of doing just enough not to dare sin failure or coming up short to leave this life and arrive home with fewer sins but less victories might even be a sin itself. Yeah, I, I, I, I wonder you know so powerful. Well there's that what you know, if there's God and a final judge even if there's not are we what's what what's what's a better life to have taken eight, risk eight aims and hit seven of them or to take a hundred and hit eight?

[Dan Buettner]

I'll go with a hundred.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I think so. Yeah, I think so. And it goes to that Thomas Merton quote I think God, I don't know if I'm pleased you but I'm trying and I believe trying Pleases you try trying. And that's part of what this whole book is about. Saying amen. Come on, let's just not quit trying.

[Dan Buettner]

You also have that great line, just keep living. You go off and sign off. It's like, keep living. And living is about. It's not just existing. It's easy to exist. It's harder to try, risk failure. But that's what real living is. But what I loved about that passage and that chapter, this podcast is also about vulnerability. I've learned it the hard way. I. I've always thought that my wealth, my worth, my self worth, and my outward worth is a function of what I achieve. And I'm learning that's not necessarily the case. I do these Jeffersonian dinners. You've. We're at one last night, last night, and I asked a question about a year ago in Sardinia with a bunch of guys. The first night I asked a question about what their big idea for the world was. And there's a lot of sort of chest pounding and these alpha males went upping themselves. But the second night, we asked the question, what was the worst point of your life, the lowest point of your life, and what did you learn from it? And that's when these extremely powerful guys opened up and really connected and you weren't there. But I'm going to ask it to you right now, what was the lowest point of your life? Because your life just seems so charmed. But it wasn't always, was it?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, I'm not going to go and say, oh, and my dad died, or oh, and so and so, because I understand that's part of life. Those were hard times, but everyone goes through those. So I'm trying to think specifically of my lowest times. And there's times where I've let people down. The ones that wake me up still are. 1987, Navarre Beach, Florida, there for the summer, met the lady who ran the whole beach for all the beach boys, and they come work the cabana boys on the beach. And I was out there and she localed all hot local Florida kids. And I was from Texas, and I said, I want this job. She goes, no, no, no, you're not gonna. You're not from me. I was like, I'll be here next summer. She was like, you sure? I said, I'll be here, and went to school the next year and came out that summer and went off somewhere else. And I never called her. And I don't even know if I had her number, but I could have found her if I put on And I have this image of her going, oh, looking around and going, that son of a.

[Dan Buettner]

He promised show.

[Matthew McConaughey]

He told me he'd be here this year. That was one that was with not a stranger, but someone I just kind of knew. Another one was. And I have to tell the story in greenlights. The lion to my dad the night I stole that damn pizza. And the look on his face when he knew that I had stole it but just wanted me to admit it to him.

[Dan Buettner]

Can you kind of set the story up? Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I'd gone out with a friend, and my mom was out of town. This wasn't the second divorce or anything. She was actually just out of town. And, and, you know, I get. I get home, and me and my buddy had gone out. We'd gone to Pizza Hut, walked on this pizza, bam, stole it. That was the plan. We did it. I get home, my dad's on the phone in his underwear, side of bed, talking to my friend's dad. And he's like, all right, Ms. Sons. Yeah, I got him. No, he just walked in the door. Yep, I got it. Hangs up the phone. What'd you do tonight? I'm like, bud, we got a pizza, because did you pay for that pizza? Now, folks, when your parent says, did you pay for that pizza? And they just got a phone, that means they know. Know that they know you didn't.

[Dan Buettner]

Okay?

[Matthew McConaughey]

But Mr. Weasel outed over here goes. Well, I mean, I, I think we paid for the, the, the, the pizza. I don't know why we wouldn't have paid for the. Saw him look up and take a breath. That was the first arrow to me about o. I started to feel myself just becoming the hypocrite, becoming a fool, becoming a wuss. And he goes, I'm gonna ask you again, bud, did you, did you, did you pay for that pizza? Well, I mean, I, I, I left. I went first. I left first and I went out to the car. Bud stayed in after me, and he, you know, I think he paid. Son, I'm gonna ask you one last time. Just level with me, Bud. Did you. Did you know you're gonna steal that pizza? What? I mean, he backhanded me. I hit the floor, hit the corner, about pissed my pants, knees buckled. Not from the strike.

[Dan Buettner]

Did he hit you?

[Matthew McConaughey]

A backhand? Okay, not, Not a vicious strike, no bruise, a red cheek, no problem. But I remember that feeling of cowardice. And the look in my dad's eye, just looking at me going, a father saying to himself, what do I gotta do?

[Dan Buettner]

Yes.

[Matthew McConaughey]

What am I doing wrong as a father that I've raised a son who can't damn tell me he stole a goddamn pizza, man. And he got tears in his eyes because of feeling like a failure as a father. And none of this over here has anything to do with a strike. That was a wake up and I needed it and deserved it. And I'm pissed in my pants leg. Legs googly come lactic acid of the lion. Little shit I was. Who didn't have the courage just go yeah I did. And then he went on. Tell me man. I've stolen plenty of pizzas in my day. Why don't you just tell me? But the fact that you couldn't tell me. Son, you lied to me. I gave you three chances to tell me the truth. That feeling felt like a coward. I felt like a fool. I felt weak, I felt vulnerable. I felt like an absolute failure.

[Dan Buettner]

Very biblical. It's like Peter and Jesus.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I. And I just remember the look on my dad's face of him feeling like he had failed as a father. And going through what have I done? What have I not done? And what do I need to do if my son can't even just tell me.

[Dan Buettner]

And it wakes you up 40 years.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Later, which still wakes me up. And then the third one. Scuba diving. 10 years ago, Tahiti. 20ft of water down low on the bottom. I've scuba dived many, many times. Camilla hasn't scuba dived that many, many times. We're at the bottom, we're very comfortable with each other. And when were you ready to do the mask switch? And I went to switch with her and. And we had to come to the top. She was fine. But being in the advanced diver, it was not my place to. To do that.

[Dan Buettner]

That dude. Switch masks with her.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Switch air. She didn't breathe that. She wasn't coming. She didn't breathe out. And that should have been a conversation above water.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Before doing the action below water. So I still wake up with that nightmare that was me not measuring the context of the situation and the technicality of the situation.

[Dan Buettner]

That was an honest mistake though. And you're. When you're 20ft down, it's not like a meta premeditated.

[Matthew McConaughey]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Look and mistake. But yeah, but also jump of the gun.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Me. You know, and I. And I. And I. And I have a line in here about I hope more crimes are from ignorance. And that's kind of what you're talking about. Honest mistakes. I wish more crimes were from ignorance rather than No, I know exactly what I was doing, and I chose to commit the crime because, you know, there's a lot of things people do. They screw up and they. Like, I didn't know. And those I believe we need to seek amnesty and allow rehabilitation for. But there's a lot of crimes that people commit with, like, no, I know exactly what I was doing. Those are the ones we got to watch out for.

[Dan Buettner]

The stolen pizza story is such a great story because it illustrates the point perfectly. I told you last night that I never hit my kids. I have three kids. And I told them very early on, if they admitted to something they did wrong, they would never be punished. And they learned very early on how to game that they would tell me. But here, your father and that experience gave you a lesson about lying that I'll bet, made you think twice for the rest of your life about lying. I mean, the power of that story. Well, first of all, it's very vulnerable, I think, people. It humanizes you. But secondly, it shows the power of letting a kid learn his own lesson as opposed to kind of smacking him into it or punishing him into learning the lesson.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Human chances. And if I would have told him in any of those three responses, yes, sir, I did, he'd have gone, God damn, buddy. Evidently you got to get better at getting away with it. That would have been, you know, and we'd laugh. He said, I'm still some tuna. Hey, buddy. Hey, what are you. What are you out of money or something? Is you. Because you cannot. Can you not pay for a pizza? What the hell, man? You don't mean running around stealing pizza. But I get it. He's doing it for the buzz or what, you know, but it would have been that conversation. We would have got. He would have got out of bed, we'd have gone in there, probably had a beer and had to talk about it. And they're like, you know, don't make a habit of that shit. You know, you got enough. We're not paying enough. Are we paying enough doing your chores to pay for damn pizza? You know, but it would have been that. And I didn't give that. I didn't get that chance.

[Dan Buettner]

You told me another story about your dad, which has inspired me to this day. And you were thinking about acting, and you called him.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yep.

[Dan Buettner]

And you asked him, you unpacked, what the situation was. And then he said something to you. I wonder if you could tell that.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, I can. So I was always expected to go be the. The family, the lawyer. And I was A good debater. And I would, you know, good orator.

[Dan Buettner]

Did become the Lincoln lawyer.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah. And Jake began time to kill. Play lawyers on. On Hunt tv and in this on the screen. But that's what I was going to go to school for when I went to University of Texas. That's where I was taking my liberal arts and philosophy to go to law school. And between my junior and sophomore year, between my sophomore and junior year, mind you, it had come to me. I was not sleeping well with the idea of becoming a lawyer. With going to law school and getting out. No. Maybe making my mark in this life. When I turned 30, I was like, no, I don't. I don't want to go get educated just for all my 20s. And I'd been writing a lot, sharing some short stories with a friend of mine who was in film school, nyu. He was like, man, this is pretty good writing. Plus, you know, have you tried being in front of the camera? Which I was. I was like, no, no, no, no, not that, but behind the camera maybe. Anyway, I got confident enough with the stories and the idea of becoming a storyteller that I decided I want to go to film school. But Dad's paying for school and I got to make that call to get permission. So I picked the time. And I remember, remember saying, I'll do it Tuesday night at 7:30 because Monday's the first work week there's a bit more stress. Tuesday, he'll be well into the week. 7:30, he. He's had dinner. He's on the couch with my mom having his first beer. This is.

[Dan Buettner]

Got it all dialed in.

[Matthew McConaughey]

7:36Pm Ring. Nope. Hey, Pop. Hey, what's up, monkey man? Can I talk to you a second? Sure. But said Dad, I. I don't want to go to law school anymore. I want to go to film school. That beat of sweat started down the back of my neck. Here it comes. I'm waiting to hear him go, you want a what? Boy, you know, that's a hobby on the Saturday maybe, but no, that's not a grid. Pause, pause, pause. What you gonna say, huh? Were you sure that's what you want to do? Yes, sir. Well, don't half ass it. Oh, jet fuel, man.

[Dan Buettner]

It was both permission and a warning.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And leverage and kicking the backside. Empowerment. Let's get it on. Don't half, half ass.

[Dan Buettner]

Love that.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And you know, and since I've shared that story and I want to add this because I don't think I've shared this as much part of what happened in that moment, besides him giving me the perfect jet fuel and affirmation to go do what I wanted to do was something happened, I believe on to him, to his ears. And what he heard from his son, I think is something that we all as parents hope one day we'll hear from our kids. Kids, we've, we've lined up guidelines for them. This ladder, here you go. If you do this, you'll can succeed in life and get a job and do these things and this is how we do it. And if we go on in those lines, we'll probably have some form of success. But when our child comes to us and they're not really asking permission, and they say, I'm going outside the lines, mom, I'm going outside the lines, dad, this is the way I'm going. We want to check and see if they'll stutter, if they'll blink or if they're two step bit. And the way I said I want to go to film school and not go to law school, I didn't really pose it as a question. And the way after he said, are you sure that's what you want to do? And I immediately said, yes sir. I didn't go. Well, I mean, yeah, pretty sure, yes sir. He heard it in my voice that I wasn't asking permission, that I had thought about this and I was coming in making a statement, dad, I'm asking for your permission, but this is what I want to do. And he heard that. And I think in that moment I didn't see him, but I think he had an internal pride of there we go. That's my boy.

[Dan Buettner]

That's interesting.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Bam. You broke out of it. You're, you're going your own way. And I think every parent in some version would love to hear that from their child where they're not asking permission, they're asking out of respect. He's paying my tuition. But they want, you're going your own way.

[Dan Buettner]

But you know, he didn't say, well son, let's think this through. No, he, I love that the, you know, brevity is the soul of humor. I think it's also the soul of wisdom.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

And rather than going on and on about this decision to just say don't half acid not only gives you that jet fuel, but it also takes all the upbringing he gave you and in one phrase says, you know what you need to do.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yep. Yes and yeah. And you know, a grace that came with that because he, he, he, he died of a heart attack soon after that. Like a Year after that he. I then go to film school for that year. Get the confidence to also go in front of the camera, walk in the right bar, right time, get rolling, days confused. And then I start my first role in days confused. Three lines turned into three weeks work.

[Dan Buettner]

But could you say those three lines?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, the three lines were. The one launch pad line that was written was Wooderson's leaning up against the wall outside the pool hall. High school girls walk by, he checks one of them out, his buddy goes, you got to cut that out. What, are you gonna go to jail? And Waterson says, no, man, that's what I love about those high school girls, man. I get older, they say the same age. Now that line, I was like, who the hell is that? You know, what if that guy is saying that not as an attitude, not as a clever thing to say to make people laugh, but what if that's his credo, his philosophy, his personal politics. Well, there I've got us now I've got a cycle encyclopedia on who that guy is. You know, what that guy's buying at 7:11, you know, what's in his fridge at home, you know, what kind of car he drives, you know, all kinds of things, you know, how he walks, how he talks, where he is and where he is not. And so that line informed me of who that guy was. And anyway, I go to work on that film. The three lines turn to three weeks work. On the fifth day of working on that film, I get the call from my mom Monday night, your dad died this morning, boom, knees crumble, I go home, we have the wake, all that stuff. Family says, get your butt back to work. You've been here four days now get back home. I go back to work. But my dad was alive for the first five days that I started something that was not a hobby, that was not a fad, that was not a season that became a 37 year career.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, he passed the baton that I.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Have not half asked.

[Dan Buettner]

What a gift.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Grace in that five days. Grace in that he overlapped that.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, you had a complex relationship with him. What was he like?

[Matthew McConaughey]

I don't know. Did I have a complex relationship with him? I was the third child. He Business got good in the 80s. We moved to Longview in 79, which is the fastest growing oil town in the United States. And he was traveling salesman and he all of a sudden had a staff under him. Whereas before with my older two brothers, he had the one Texaco station and he worked at Gensco as a salesman down the road from the house, and he got more successful, and all of a sudden, he's got 26 employees, so he's moving around more. He's not coaching my baseball team, so he wasn't around as much. I was raised more by my mom, probably, than my two older brothers. I don't know how complex the relationship was, though. He was always there. I mean, he. I was so jealous of the stories that I would hear the next day about the time that he had with his friends and my older two brothers. And I so wanted to be a part of one of those stories instead of just hearing about them. But in my house, 18 was your freedom age, because a lot of those stories took place after hours at so said bar or shindig, you know, or story out at some ranch somewhere. And I wasn't allowed to be a part of that until I was 18. That was age. You could make your own decision. So I did get a couple of years with him where we got to fratten our knives like that as more like big brother, little brother, instead of father son, still father son. But I got to be there and be a part of some of the stories. I got to take some road trips to go, for instance, collect from people that owed him money. And I would be the. You know, the one that he'd take in even long before I was 18, even younger than that. But he would take into the guy's office, you know, that in the high rise in Houston, the guy who owed him, you know, 120,000. $20,000. And I was the one that was there to shame. My presence was there to shame.

[Dan Buettner]

I was gonna go hungry.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, meet him. Yeah, hello, Mr. Song. Say, yeah, that's my boy here now. About that 120 grand you owe me. What are you thinking? And just say that. And the guy's got to say, yeah, I'm gonna pay you back. Looking at me over there going, you know. But I don't know how complex it was. I did get to have those couple of years where I felt more like it.

[Dan Buettner]

Well, he was loving and tough at the same time.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, the tough. I always took the tough as. As love. The tough always was love. He's never mean. I mean, it was never mean. Just corporal punishment to get it over with quick. Was my mom and dad's Post World War II means of.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Of. Of. Of communicating discipline. And I don't. I mean, sure as hell not gonna go. That was wrong. I don't practice it that way today with my kids.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, I've done fly today.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Had its. It had its assets. And our family did not hold grudges right after someone got in trouble. And we only got in trouble through. Only one time I got in trouble what I shouldn't have got in trouble with. And that was from my mom. And she was scared that I would gone. I'd gone down near the river and I was too young and it had been raining, so the river was rising and I didn't get in the water or go swimming, but I went down unaccompanied. And I went back. And I remember she found the nearest switch and whipped my butt with it. And it had thorns in it, so my butt.

[Dan Buettner]

She wasn't the best game either. Horrible.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You get on the back of your neck, back your ankles, always. She was aiming at your ass, but it may be back of your head or the back of your back of your heels. Anyway, I remember her going, I'm not sorry for why I whipped you, but I am sorry that, that that branch had thorns. It didn't mean for it to have thorns.

[Dan Buettner]

That is a little harsh, but any.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Every other time what I got in trouble for, I. There's no question about my guilt. I was wrong. I was guilty. I was. It was clear there was never. I got punished for something that I didn't do and that I know I shouldn't have done. So there's a lot of things that I did not do as a kid that I should not have done, and I didn't do them for fear of that punishment. So I can. I'm thankful for how they raised me. I never had a. I was never confused with or never injured. Never the next day. I was never confused. Their thing was like, I'm not grounding you because your time is valuable and I'm not gonna take your time away from you. So bend over, let's get this done. And once it's done, there's no grudges.

[Dan Buettner]

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[Matthew McConaughey]

Now we forget about it and let's drive it across town and go get a burger to shake.

[Dan Buettner]

You know, there may be some merit. I've written a lot about Singapore, which is both one of the happiest countries in the world and also has the highest healthy life expectancy. So there if you commit a violent crime, they cane you. They bend you over a gurney and give you several two fisted wax with something called rattan which splits the flesh on your backside. Then they put you in jail. But the jail sentence is very short relative to the United States. And while you're in jail, you get therapy. You get job training. And when you come out, you're not a hardened criminal. You've been taught a lesson. You never want to get that canine again. It's one of the most painful things in the world. And their recidivism rate is about a third of what it is in the United States. So I'm not sure, I'm not sure what punishment system works the best. So yeah, time will tell.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, time will tell.

[Dan Buettner]

I don't spank my kids. You don't spank yours. And I guess they're turning out pretty well.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I hope so. You know, sometimes my kids might be. Can I, can I please get a lick instead of having to go. Instead of having to go to my room or not having my laptop for that thing, you know. But yeah, I'm not going to judge that. And I don't think any of us should be quick to judge it. It was a different way, different time. And it had its usefulness, you may say, oh, it's inhumane. I mean I wouldn't look, I was. We were never even close to injured.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And we all. And it was clear. The rules were clear and we clearly broke them and had just said.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And as I took my chances and I got, I got caught.

[Dan Buettner]

Your self punishment was worse than the. The corporal. Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

It was actually like I said that night, the pain on my father's face. That was the pain.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Not the backhand. I didn't hit the floor because I was struck so hard. I hit the floor because I was a coward and I didn't have legs to stand on and I was embarrassed.

[Dan Buettner]

So a career that began. We could argue with your father saying don't half ass it.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

Has really peaked with a story that involves your mother. You told the last night I asked you what your peak experience has been.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And of the last year.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah. Would you tell that story?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Sure.

[Dan Buettner]

I just think it so beautifully sums up a successful journey.

[Matthew McConaughey]

So I got to do this film, Lost Bus, which is coming out very soon. I'm not sure when this airs, but it may be out now in theaters for a couple of weeks, L.A. new York, London, and then it'll be on Apple TV. Plus so it's based on this true story. 2018, the paradise fires. 185 people were killed. And in that one of the stories, the one we tell is about this man who comes home because his dad's died and he's take care of his widowed mother and try to reconcile his relationship with his son. While he's there, he takes a part Time job as a school bus driver. He takes the kid to school. One morning, there's a fire across the canyon. There's always fires over there, no big deal. By the time in the afternoon, he takes the kid to home to school. Bam, it's jumped the canyon. Mandatory evacuation. And this guy u turns the haul ass home to go pick up mom and son to get them out because neither one of them drive on that drive back to get his mom and son. Get to call through bus dispatch that says, I got 22 kids stranded on the east side of town. Is anyone over there with an empty bus that could pick him up? This guy, what do I do? Please, somebody else pick up this mic. Somebody else make the call. No one else picks it up. He picks it up, says, I'll do it. Goes against kids, doesn't know what happens with his mom and son because all communications are down. I pitched the story to my family as I always do when I'm gonna do a film. And. And my son Levi says, hey, how old's your son in the.

[Dan Buettner]

Of the character?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Character? I say, he's 14, 15. Your age. He's like, huh, Is it cash yet? I said, no. He goes, can I read for it? I was like, walk off. Forget it. He comes back up. Next day, goodbye. Can I roll? Can I, Can I, can I look at this? Can I read for it? 3, 4. The fourth time he came back, I was like, okay, he's hustling for it now. There's one. I said, all right. I talked to him a little bit about acting. I said, you know, here's the. Here's the. Here's the role. Read the script. Here's the. Here's the scene we'll do. We'll shoot it tomorrow afternoon. We talked for about an hour about what it is. He says, I'm ready. Put him on camera. I'm like, okay. Kid's holding the frame. He's got good instincts. That's a good take. Good audition. I sent it to the casting director and I said, look, I. You tell me. I know you hadn't cast the part. You're looking for the role, but here's my son. This might be good enough for a callback. What do you think she writes back, it's good enough to send straight to the director. I said, okay, well, if you do that, do me a favor, pull his last name. Because as much as I may be four against nepotism, I don't want the last name helping him get it. And I don't want him thinking that the last name ever helped him get it. If he gets it, send it to the director. Director sees it, says, that's the kid. Ask Rick said, well, that happens to be Matthew's son, Paul Greengrass, if you don't like even better. So he gets cast as my son. Meanwhile, he's working on the camera crew on the set. And every week the director and I would get together and talk about how was the last week, how's the show going? How's everything working? Everything seemed to be working, but he said, I got one problem. He goes, the scenes we shot, the lady I cast as your mother, are not working. Maybe I miscaster. Maybe it needs a rewrite. I'm not sure, but I'm looking for someone else. I need to recast it. You got anybody in mind? So I said, start thinking about, bring up a different actress. He goes, well, what about your mom? I go, I mean, possibly a good idea. My mom's a absolute ham and performer, but I don't know if she's right for this role. He goes, well, no, let's cast her. I said, hang on, hang on. I said, let me get her on camera in front of you. So I write my mom. I said, mom, give me a minute into an iPhone about why you love being a mom. And a day later I received this thing of her sitting in. In the cubby hole of a window, nicely lit, and it's an eight minute monologue about what she loves being a mom. And I show this to Paul Greengrass, director. He's like, perfect. This is exactly what I'm looking for for the mother. Cast her. You good with that, Matthew? I'm like, she did just fall down at my older brother's house and bust broke her tailbone. She's in a wheelchair. And she's like, that's even better for the role. Great. Boom. Mom's cast. We come out, we have scenes together, two scenes together in the movie where Levi, my son, plays my son and my mom plays my mother. And it went well. It went great. Couldn't have gone any better. They were happy to be there. They did good work. Now cut to declaration time. Means the movie's done. And we go to Toronto Film Festival a couple weeks ago for the premiere of the movie. And I'm on the carpet and there's a picture and I remember the moment I got my, my arm around my son here and armor on my mother here. They're both beaming and I'm like, well, look at this moment as a son, as a father.

[Dan Buettner]

Yes.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And they're both so happy to be there. Mom's 93, loving the red carpet, the attention, the flashing lights, just saying yes, yes, yes to the camera. Feeling wonderfully relevant. New charge in her, you know, maybe that puts four more years on her life. Like an Academy Award winner. Right. My son just getting into learning and having a reverence for the craft and seeing me do it from the outside for all those years and then coming in and getting a piece of it himself and doing it in a scene with me, that's something that's going to get cooler and cooler to me as time passes. It's already exceptionally cool. But talk about something to leave a legacy that lived me, my mom and my son. Beautiful.

[Dan Buettner]

It's such a perfect peak experience, too, because it blends. Not only a high moment in your professional career, but your mother lives with you. Well, I don't know if everybody knows.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Not living with me now. She moved out. She went back to her retirement home, which she likes because it's got one story. She knows where everything is.

[Dan Buettner]

But she lived with you for several years.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Quite a few years.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah. She has, yes. So you had this very tight extended family. And the fact that all of you end up in the same movie, the same set, and they did it on their own, you didn't plug them in. It was the natural. I would say hard work. There's some talent going in the McConaughey gene pool, but there's four parts hard work and one part talent, I would say. But so many people with your level of success, it completely corrupts them. They turn to liquor, they turn to drugs, they turn to sex. And you've turned to family and faith. And I don't know if those two go hand in hand, but for knowing you now very well, for seven years, I would say those are the two pillars that define your life.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I have and have had my indulgences to, I don't know, maybe better cope with fame or stress or whatever, blah, blah, blah. But I know there are amendments. I know there's stops, not stays. My family and my faith, I don't want. Those aren't stops, not renting. Those are stays. Those are non negotiables and things that are about immortality. Fame's mortal, my job's mortal. It doesn't mean I respect it any less. Because when I got married and when I had kids, my, you know, acting moved to the three hole. Most important things where it was one. I think I got better at it when I moved to the three hole. Didn't. Didn't have lose any more reverence for it. Have just as much respect for it. Worth ethic, work ethic became probably better, but it wasn't the one. All be all seeking for my identity. I get a family, I'm like, ah, this is immortality. Become a father, you become a mother, you become immortal, if you're lucky.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

And that's playing the immortal game, the immortal finish line. If I can get three kids out the house and become their independent, conscientious, confident individuals, healthy as much as possible, what greater export is there? If mom, you know, I mean, she's rolling right along. I mean, I can pray for her. Like she says about my oldest brother, you know, she says, I pray for you, Matthew, and I pray for Pat. I don't pray for Rube because I don't think it matters.

[Dan Buettner]

He's going where he's going, you know.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Now her, you know, just talked to her today. She's like, you know, what are you doing? She's, oh, I'm getting ready for Pilates. I just had my lunch. Sitting on the back porch reading the news. A bunch of stuff I don't really care about. Now I'm about to go in and do my plotties. I don't really. It's not that much going in my life, but I tell you what, it's just pretty structured now. I just got. There's not much for me to stress about. And if there was, I wouldn't. She's going along fine. She's not missing out. She's been living on the same amount of money per year for 40 years. I'll give her American Airlines miles, you know, to go fly somewhere. And, you know, when she had her companion, cj, they love to travel, and we give them some money, but if I gave that. If I gave my mom $10,000 right now, she'd go like, it'd be sitting there on the damn counter a year from now, going like, I don't want anything different than what I have, you know, so. So Mom's going. She's. She's on her track. She's not afraid to die. Not looking forward to it, but not afraid of it. And if hopefully her body can stay up with her head because above the neck, she's sharp as attack.

[Dan Buettner]

What surprised me about you, getting to know you is how important faith is to you. Your 50th birthday, you brought your.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Your pastor. Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

Fun guy, by the way. Yeah, he was. But have you always been this religious?

[Matthew McConaughey]

I believe if I'm seeking to be a better man, if I'm seeking to be more in the imitation of God's likeness and what the. In my transcend itself or better self, whatever we want to call that, that there's no better thing to be doing that. That's what. Higher. Yeah, but what. What Higher seeking.

[Dan Buettner]

In your naked bongo drum days, you going to church those days.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I was just as faithful.

[Dan Buettner]

You were. And just as showing up and.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, yeah. And, and, and, and let's not, you know, let's not relegate naked bongos into the debit section. I still do that. I've done that. I just did that in the last two weeks. I just got more room now. I don't wake up the neighbors. So, no, I was. You know, it's not like I've become all puritanical. It's what I'm saying. Let's sell Sunday morning like a Saturday night. I'm still. I still have fun. I still party. I still have a good time. I do my. Doesn't mean I need to be a tie, become a tyrant. It doesn't mean I'm going to become a nihilist. I'm not going to sit there. I want. I know.

[Dan Buettner]

It's actually a beauty thing. And, you know, people listen to this podcast, they're interested in longevity and happiness, and it turns out that people who go to church actually live about four years longer than people who don't. You hold everything else constant, churchgoers. And you have such a big life with so many demands on your time, but yet you find time on Sunday morning. And I'm just wondering what you'd say to people who don't have faith in their life yet. How do you find it?

[Matthew McConaughey]

First, ask yourself who or what you would die for. Answer that question. There's your spot to go, to double down on belief. Now, I'm not going to sit here and try and convert you or talk anyone into going, but you better believe in God. No, I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna say that. You can find that on your own way. I will say that heaven or not, one of the surest ways to stay and remain in the rut of pain and disillusion and unhappiness and dissatisfaction is to not pursue, is to not believe that there's a way out, to not have hope, that there's a path out, to not do what you can to make the next right move, to go forward, to go on, to seek higher ground. So heaven or not, believing in a divinity or pursuit in your own life of your Own more divine self is the best bet I can see out there. The best prescription out there for I see about evolving and getting out of a rut and getting out of pain. Even if there is no heaven, it helps here, live this mortal life. Now. I'm hoping there is a heaven. I don't know. I'm doing my best to live like there is. And is that in vain sometimes? Yeah, it is in vain. But I sit there and go, I'll give you a little forgiveness on that, Makani. At least you're trying to stay in the asset section. You know what I mean? Maybe you're not mellow. Those are times where I'm like, not as pure and as faithful as I wish I was. So I do it for vanity's sake. And I'm hoping if God's there, he's forgiven me. Going, well, at least you try. Yeah, party process. I go through doubts. Part of the reason I wrote this book, going through doubt, coming cynical about shit. Looking down my nose at people, objectifying women, men, thinking, man. Found myself doing that. What happens then? Start looking in the mirrors, doing the same damn thing to me. Now I'm going, oh, this scares me. And after getting scared, it starts to piss me off. I'm like, we talked about this a long time ago, McConaughey. Cynicism, that's the. That's. That's. That's a living disease that we can choose, and that's a good way to be a walking dead man. Bullshit. So if I'm looking around at reality, I'm watching the news, and you're looking around and the world's telling you there's no reason to believe or nothing to believe in. I said, well, let's elevate. Let's think about ideals, dreams, poems and prayers. Get out of the logic and academia of the math, because the math ain't adding up. And let's. Instead of looking to try to make a dream out of reality, let's look at dreams and say, hey, keep a beginner's mind and believe that we can make that dream a reality. So I've kind of flipped the script on myself, and it's partially largely my own spiritual therapy to have written this and to be talking about it and to take it on the road. And I'm hearing along the way and before I wrote it, that a lot of people are looking for belief that if the doubt wins, we are all going to lose. So heaven or not, find something to believe in. If you don't know what that is, I would go back to that first answer. Ask yourself who or what you die for. And I think everyone's got something answer to that. Don't look at that. Start living for that. And you'll find that belief and you might find faith. I'm not going to. I don't know if you. If you will. For me, I believe in God. Not only for people who don't believe in God, not only for people who do believe in God.

[Dan Buettner]

It's. It's not only a good way to live your life, to become a better person, but also eternity is a long time and at least you've done what you could. If there is indeed a heaven, you're. You're. And there is the God that we think it is.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You're.

[Dan Buettner]

You're probably in.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I don't know. But even if that. If it's done, if it's black, the day our heart quits beating and our. We flatline to believe and to live as if. And to pursue that divinity that's sacred within us, to pursue that, to pay attention to that makes this life better.

[Dan Buettner]

I love it. You have a great. Can I have that book back? Yeah, there's. You have one. You have a great passage in here that I think sums up this book perfectly. It's right here. If you'd read. Thanks. Yeah.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Ah, yeah. So let's sing more than we might make sense Believe in more than the world can conclude get more impressed with the wow instead of the how Let inspiration interrupt our appointment Dream our way to reality Serve some soul food to our hungry heads Put proof on the shelf for a season and rhyme our way to reason Ah, Forget logic, certainty Owning or making a startup company of it. Let's go beyond what we can merely imagine and believe in the poetry of life. Musical bridges from the mundane Poems are Saturday in the middle of the week they illuminate belief Inviting new ways to seek Poems are songs of romance with ourselves Others space, place and time Hymns of holy language Huge angelic ditties of the divine Poems are also prayers that.

[Dan Buettner]

Rhyme Poems and prayers. Matthew McConaughey. This is another huge New York Times bestseller. We need it right now. There's not much to believe in in the world right now. It's very. And it's hard to know what's right and what's wrong. And we did.

[Matthew McConaughey]

It's. Yeah. That scale and the goal post even move when once we have the ball in the air it seems like. And I don't know how much does every generation go the path to America and Dream is an illusion, I don't know, but seems ambiguous to what that is. More ambiguous now than usual. When we, you know, we see success without profit, we see sometimes more of whatever it is being the measure of what a person should be and what they pursue. But it doesn't have value to them. It doesn't give them profit and they end up lonely and they got shit relationships and they can't look in the mirror and without flinching. Is that really success? Well, maybe it is without the profit. What's the what? Just a bit of a constitution, man. Little expectation for the rules of engagement. Come on, man. I don't want to go in going nine out of the 10 things I think about you, I don't trust you. What kind of life is that, a way to live? What kind of lens is that to see? I'm not saying don't be wise. I'm not saying there shouldn't be consequences, but come on, man. I mean, if we could invest in ourselves more, I think that's where we can invest in others more. That's where it's amazing. And I see it happen all the time. Again, be wise. But. But when you do put trust in someone and you see the best in someone, it gives them an invitation to give you that back and find that in themselves. All of a sudden they go, you just invited me to do that. I've been looking for someone to do that, show that part of myself. And you get a like response and just try that out, but also try it out in the mirror. You love. I love what you talk about. You're re. Engineering. You and blue zones and cafes and, you know, tightening roads to 25 miles an hour in downtown retail. So people park out and walk for the engineering. Putting the vegetables at the beginning of the lunch. Engineering, health. And, you know, I'm talking about behavior. And you've always been like, ah, boy, that's a. That's. That's a big rock up a hill. And I get it. But I. I believe if. If enough of us double down on our belief for one more, whether it's salvaging our marriage or our character or our investment in our children or what have you, or a friend, or even our job, if enough of us can go one more step in that investment, that's a great way to move forward.

[Dan Buettner]

But a lot of it's leadership. And we've had leaders in this country who've said, ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country. And there are leaders who Lead with kindness and leaders who pull people together. And a few years ago, two of our friends, Matt o' Hare and John Mackey, we spent three days with you, exploring, trying to talk you into running for president. Why? You're a great communicator. You inspire people. You're well known. But also you have a good heart and you have a way of galvanizing people to go after the good. And I think that's what our country needs. And I'm just wondering, have you given any more thought to entering politics?

[Matthew McConaughey]

It's continued to be on my menu of thoughts of the categories and places for me in the future, as I said then and I still say it now. And you measure is that the most useful place in category for me? To what extent would some argue. Don't. Don't change who you are. That's what you are is what we're saying. Turn it up. And that's what that needs. I don't know. Is it my initial language politics no more poet, philosopher, communicator that way. What does. I don't want to lose that. But is that maybe what we need more of getting people to believe in themselves? And also, look, I do think no matter who the leader is that us, that we, if we get the right leaders in the position, those leaders need to put it on us to go. I can change work on policies and changes, but I can't do it without you. Yeah, I got. And I think that more people are looking for that to be asked for that ownership to be relied on. And I don't think our leaders have asked us to be relied on as much as they could or in a way that we feel collectively. Yes, because you're showing me the steam as the leader and you're walking the walk. I think people would want to get behind that. I don't know if that's for me right now. My default place to go is I've got three kids in the house and I'm doing. I'm apart and I'm in place in I am present doing the one thing that I always knew I wanted to do and always wanted to be a father.

[Dan Buettner]

And you're doing a great job.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Doing the best I can. Let me see when I have three children out of the house, hopefully it goes as planned. Hope they're individual and want to move on by the by, when it's time and. And let me, let me measure if that's the place for me when it comes. Dan, I, I do believe and I could be wrong. I do believe I've been conscientious enough and aware and have been investigating and watching and looking and those circles enough that if I go into it, I'm going to look up and I'm going to be in it. Yeah, it will have pulled me in. I, I'm open. I'm just don't not going to try and put a square screw in a round hole for the sake of, well, let me just see if I can pull it off. No, I, I, I, I've built a currency that I appreciate and you know, arguments, there's arguments for and there's arguments against. I will continue to seek out. Hey, what forms of leadership am I or could I be most useful at?

[Dan Buettner]

Well, the job of a president, I think is to inspire a nation more so than anything and imbue it with the type of values that bring people together and make us better people as individual. And I, this, I read this book, poem and prayers. And I know you as a human and as an individual and you possess those fundamental American values of responsibility, of family, of knowing your sense of purpose, of kindness, of generosity. And you're a great communicator and you're a great motivator and it's what I think our country needs. And I'm not saying left or right, but I'm just saying together. I'm just saying we need to be pulled together. And both the good old boys here in Texas like you and the people who gave you an Academy Award in Hollywood like you and demographically and psychographically and spiritually, I think you are more qualified for that job than anybody that's come along in the last century. That's Dan Buettner speaking.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Thank you, Dan Buettner. Thank you for, for seeing me that way. I take that as a, as a, as a major compliment because that's a position that I have incredible reverence for and understand and have a reverence for the responsibility and conscientiousness of that position. And you know, at the least it's a, it's a wonderful thing for all of us to consider what if for ourselves. Because it's amazing how objective you get in a 360 degree view about your own opinions and your own values. And you have, you're forced to ask, so are those scalable? Are those, are those, should those be affiliations? Would those be great executions for the masses? And you, you test them and you see what they come up against and you really start to form what you really believe in and what you don't. Now that's one of the things that I've found out about being around a lot of politicians. They're not necessarily doing what they believe.

[Dan Buettner]

They'Re doing what gets them elected.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Okay. And there is an inherent sense of betrayal that comes with the job. I. I'm not willing to betray myself. Can be done without that.

[Dan Buettner]

Good point. You know, Well, I remember. You know, it may sound like a too quixotic and too out of bounds to think about it for you, but I remember a few years ago, you weren't even running for governor of Texas, but you were the most popular candidate and never announced it. I don't think you even were thinking about it, but somehow I was thinking about it. Somebody got the idea that you'd run for governor and you were the most popular potential candidate. So who knows? You know, stranger things have happened.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Stranger things.

[Dan Buettner]

I want to do something fun real quick.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

We do this. You know, Blue Zones is after all, about longevity.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yes.

[Dan Buettner]

And we've, we've identified some of the characters you've played over time. And I'm going to ask you about their life expectancy, how long they live.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

So, you know, the question is, is the character dead at 40 or gonna live to 100? All right, we'll start with the Cooper Interstellar.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, he made it back.

[Dan Buettner]

Yep.

[Matthew McConaughey]

But he probably went on another. He's out there. Who knows? I think he's, he's. He's over 400 years old by now, isn't he? He's, he's been on another leather place in time. Time. Time runs a little slower where he was.

[Dan Buettner]

So he might. He made it to 100 hundreds. There we go. And we have also purpose driven, strong family bond, endurance. All right, from Dazed and Confused, David WOODERSON that did 40 or made it to 100.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Oh, much closer to 100. Oh, really? Zero stress. Zero stress.

[Dan Buettner]

But a fast car, babe.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Fast car. He had his frequency and had kept minimal options in his life and had probably three. Three redheaded daughters and, and still does the local, local midnight community radio station DJs. It has his playlist, has his ritual through the day, smokes a little joint when he does it and lashes cruising by and he'll want anything he doesn't have.

[Dan Buettner]

Was he a good dad?

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, he's a killer.

[Dan Buettner]

I love it. I love it. From Lincoln lawyer Mick Howler, dead at 40. Made it to 100.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Oh, Mickey was on the edge, man. He might have when he said there in the last, last frame of that movie, hey, nah, I'll stick it to him next Time he probably seeked out enough. Enough danger. He might have got clipped, but he had a fun time doing. He won the last case.

[Dan Buettner]

High stress. Didn't sleep very well, I guess.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

All right, how about. This is my favorite from True Detective.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I love Rustin Cole.

[Dan Buettner]

Russ Cole, dead at 40. Or do you make it 100?

[Matthew McConaughey]

He made it. He found some grace and forgiveness there at the very end. And it just pulled a little bit of a plug out of his heart and head that let a little air out. And that man just needs a little room.

[Dan Buettner]

He was tightly wound to breathe.

[Matthew McConaughey]

He was never going to be one that gives up, but just a little bit to go. I can stroll through life just at certain times now. I don't have to be on at the ready to be the absolute best detective at all times.

[Dan Buettner]

I love, by the way, how you drop right back into these characters. It's like you become rustic. You go from Matthew McConaughey to Russ, and all of a sudden you're rushed for 30 seconds.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Well, I remember him, I guess.

[Dan Buettner]

Well, you're feeling them.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

All right. Magic Mike from Dallas.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Ah, Dallas, man. He don't care. He was ready. He may. He made good money at the last. The last strip shows he had the ran. It was running well in Tampa.

[Dan Buettner]

You.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Know, I mean, come 40. He made it past 40. Come on. He made 50.

[Dan Buettner]

All right.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Come on, man.

[Dan Buettner]

Got the half century.

[Matthew McConaughey]

He was a great capitalist.

[Dan Buettner]

Lovable guy. Skinny.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Dallas. Wow. He was in thong shape, bro.

[Dan Buettner]

That ain't a good looking thong, though, I have to say.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Rattlesnake thong.

[Dan Buettner]

It gave me the willies. I'm sorry. All right, we are Marshall coach Jack.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Jack Lingle. Well, Jack Lingle, is he. He was around for quite some time.

[Dan Buettner]

Body men of service.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, he was.

[Dan Buettner]

He did give emotional intelligence.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, absolutely. And he did a lot to give later in his life, too. Yeah, he's making it. Come on, Hunter.

[Dan Buettner]

There we go. Any of your other characters who you think go the distance?

[Matthew McConaughey]

See, I can't probably think of one that wouldn't go the distance. Let's just keep living. I believe in all of them.

[Dan Buettner]

How about you? I mean, in. In your book, you said you'd rather live 90 good years than 60 crappy. I mean.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, yeah. Look, I just. That's a bit of a comment on would I like to live longer? Great. Do I want to live with the obsession of, again, chasing this number more? I've got to get the higher number. Got to get more money. I got to live the More years for that to be the measure. Success. I see people doing it at the Force for the sake of. And they're missing out on. What's the word? They're, they're missing out on quality of life. Chasing a number. And I'm going to. Is that really what the. Is the winner, the one who lives the longest? I want to look at quality over quantity. And that's what I mean when I'm talking about difference between success and profit. You know, a lot of people succeed, they may not profit more. Quantity does not necessarily mean more quality. Now we can parlay quantity and quality. That means we have success and profit and we probably live a lot long, live longer, but we also have a great life. So I'm not willing to sacrifice quality for the quantity.

[Dan Buettner]

But you know, by the way. Yeah. I would say the Silicon Valley version of longevity is the, is the quantity. They want to make it to 120 or 150. In blue zones, people are living into their 90s or hundreds, but the journey is wonderful. Yeah, they're, they, they grow their own vegetables, they live close to the earth.

[Matthew McConaughey]

They play checkers down at the bar with a glass of wine with the.

[Dan Buettner]

Buddies, sit down to dinner with their family. They walk up to the church on Sunday. They know their sense of purpose.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Some of them smoke cigarettes and none of them wear a watch.

[Dan Buettner]

That's right. And they enjoy their glass of wine. Maybe if they got some pantalones, they give them another couple years.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah. Or win an Academy Award. Or what's the other one? What's the other four year plus Academy Award gives you four more years. And going to church 64 more years, man. So if you're going to church and you win a few Academy Awards, that's 16 years.

[Dan Buettner]

One of those is easier than the other. Lesson to those of you listening, final question.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

It's your hundredth birthday.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

You got your three kids sitting around you, Camilla looking great as always. Those hundred candles burning. What's the definition of success? You've accomplished so much at 55, you're, you're just passing.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah, look here, I made me. I've thought about this and, and I was always going through the. Okay, so if you know God's there and you get to the part of the gates, what's the first thing to say? What's God say? Right. And for so many years I was like, I thought he'd say, thank you, buddy. And five years ago I woke up out of a dream and I had died. And I met Gal at the Curly Gates. And he did not say, thank you, buddy. You know what he said? No, you're welcome. You know, long, easy, hard, short.

[Dan Buettner]

There it is.

[Matthew McConaughey]

You're welcome.

[Dan Buettner]

Perfect way to end it. Matthew, that was phenomenal.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Enjoyed that always. Dan, I.

[Dan Buettner]

You know, I was at your 50th. I hope I'm at your hundredth.

[Matthew McConaughey]

I do, too. I do, too.

[Dan Buettner]

You'll be saying, you're welcome.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Come on. Or someone will hopefully.