← The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz
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- [00:01]
Dan LeBatard
Coming off a losing fantasy week, that means you're one week closer to losing your league. That's stressful, which can lead to nighttime teeth grinding. Dentek wants to prevent teeth grinding and has raised the fantasy stakes with a once in a lifetime punishment. Keep an eye out for the ultimate Fantasy Football Punishment reveal at the NFL Pro bowl or on dentech.com ultimate punishment. If you're still feeling fantasy stress, try a Dentech nighttime Dental guard to protect your teeth. Available at all major retailers.
- [00:38]
Chris Cody
All right, kicking things off with Smear off, the official vodka sponsor of the NFL and the number W vodka in the world. Chris Cody, you're here.
- [00:45]
Jim Leland
Sm.
- [00:45]
Chris Cody
Wow. You're on the money with sm.
- [00:47]
Jim Leland
Sm.
- [00:48]
Joe Madden
Chris, you know what goes great with sm?
- [00:51]
Chris Cody
Yes, but I'm really talking about game day fit. The style's got to match the vibe.
- [00:54]
Joe Madden
Fair enough.
- [00:55]
Chris Cody
All right, here's the deal. Game day is everything. And that's exactly why your fit has to match the occasion. Starting this December, Smirnoff is giving fans 21 and over the chance to score limited edition Smirnoff commission merchandise from some of today's top creators, including Kayla Jones, Gavin Matthew and Aleli May.
- [01:12]
Joe Madden
Smirnoff.
- [01:13]
Chris Cody
Here's the kicker. One lucky fan will take home the grand prize, a trip to the biggest game of the offseason. Plus, one fan will win Ali May's one of one Game Day jacket.
- [01:20]
Jeremy Stugats
Wow.
- [01:20]
Chris Cody
The merch will be dropped on select dates from December to January 21st. And it's all courtesy of what brand. That's right, Chris. Fans 21 and over can head to Smirnoff Socials to learn how to sign up. And don't forget to grab a bottle of Smirnoff vodka, number 21 at your local retail. Please drink responsibly. Smirnoff number 21, vodka distilled from grain 40 alcohol by volume. The Smirnoff Company New York, New York. Please do not share with anybody under legal drinking Hate Smear off. No purchase necessary. Must be legal. US resident, 21 or older. Sweepstake starts 12152025 at 12:00am Eastern and ends 1232026 at 11:59:59pm Eastern. See official rules at program website.
- [01:56]
Jeremy Stugats
Today's episode is brought to you by Venmo. Look, no matter how your favorite team does this season, there's still one way to feel like a winner, and that's with Venmo. That's because when you use venmo to transfer 50 or more to a DraftKings DFS account for the first time or the first time in three plus months, you'll get $25 in DraftKings bonus credits. Terms apply. Just go to draftkings.com venmoffer to activate your offer. Then choose Venmo to add Funds to your DraftKings account. Add $50 or more and boom, 25 bonus credits will appear in your DraftKings account if you're eligible. This offer is only good through February 15, 2026 or while supplies last, so don't fumble your chance before time runs out. Here's the deal. Venmo is a fast, easy way for you to add money onto DraftKings. And if you don't have a Venmo account yet, don't sweat it. You can download the app and sign up in minutes.
- [02:40]
Stan Van Gundy
So what are you waiting for?
- [02:41]
Jeremy Stugats
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- [03:24]
Dan LeBatard
Dan Levator show with the ST podcast.
- [03:31]
Stan Van Gundy
Christmas Eve. Chris Happy Merry Christmas Eve.
- [03:34]
Jeremy Stugats
Jeremy I'm so happy every holiday as I've gotten into marriage and kids it's just running around like a madman and I get to be planted this holiday Christmas Eve at the in laws, Christmas at my parents. I'm so excited to just be at one place per day.
- [03:50]
Stan Van Gundy
I'm excited for you. Christmas Eve is always really fun with my in laws. Obviously I celebrate Hanukkah, my wife is not Jewish and so in turn we get to celebrate Christmas with her family. It rocks. It's the best. I love everything. Yeah it's it's a nice life and Christmas Eve games with the with the family. Should have married a Jewish girl.
- [04:09]
Jeremy Stugats
Yeah tell Christy should have married a Jewish lady.
- [04:15]
Jim Leland
I heard it.
- [04:17]
Dan LeBatard
That was great.
- [04:19]
Stan Van Gundy
Anyway, so here's where we're at. We have a Christmas Eve episode for you guys. I really hope that, that you're excited for this. And I decided there's nothing better on Christmas Eve than listening to Stan Van Gundy talk to former baseball managers.
- [04:40]
Jeremy Stugats
Love it.
- [04:40]
Stan Van Gundy
Right? I mean, there's no one more passionate that I know. Not Tim Kirkshon, not either of us. Hey, listen to the pitch clock. But Stan Van Gundy. So we have an interview here from 2006 with Joe Tory. We also have interviews from 2013 with Joe Madden and Jim Leland. And I'll tell you, Chris, like, in this Joe Madden interview, it made me realize this dude was transcendent. This guy predicted everything that he says in this interview about, like what they do differently is everything that everyone does in baseball now. It's kind of insane.
- [05:17]
Jeremy Stugats
This interview was, I assume before Stugat started ripping him. Yeah.
- [05:24]
Stan Van Gundy
Later in the career he would repair. Yeah, he turned on him. Maybe he declined to come on and do another interview, but either way, this first hour of your show today is going to be three interviews. Stan Van Gundy with the show with Joe Torre, Joe Madden and Jim Leland. Some pretty simple names for baseball managers.
- [05:45]
Dan LeBatard
Been wanting to talk to this guy for a long time. Very difficult job in sports. Manager of the New York Yankees. And he handled it with uncommon daily grace. Joe Tory with us on the ticket. Thank you for joining us. Joe, as you look around all of sports, is there a guy, a. Whose style you looked at? If I made you pick just one and you said, man, I love the way that guy handles himself?
- [06:12]
Joe Torre
Well, I guess it's someone who just, I mean, Gil Hodges to me, years ago, was a, was a nice role model because, you know, it wasn't about him. It was about his players and any of us coaches or managers who dilute themselves to think that they're the reason that these teams win. You know, I feel sorry for those guys because, you know, it's about the players and trying to make, make sense to the players, I think is important for us to do and, and sort of point them in the right direction. But, you know, there, there are a lot of. I admire a lot. I mean, I, I love the way Tom Coughlin does what he does in New York. You know, that wasn't easy for him starting out, and all of a sudden, two Super Bowls balls under his belt. And I think he's, he certainly has withstood the storm over there for, for a long time.
- [07:06]
Dan LeBatard
Are you like Stan Van Gundy? Who is with us here on Wednesdays, Joe, where if there's a guy who takes himself very seriously in a leadership position and feels like he's the reason for the winning, will that be met with your disdain?
- [07:22]
Joe Torre
Well, I know better than that. I've watched him coach, trust me. I mean, he. You know, both he and Jeff, to me, are. Did their job with. With great class and effectiveness and, you know, and sometimes it's time to move on. I felt that three times.
- [07:41]
Joe Madden
Trust me.
- [07:42]
Dan LeBatard
So the worst part of the job, New York Yankees manager, was.
- [07:50]
Joe Torre
Oh, I guess it was, you know, the best part was the worst part. You know, you win four World Series in the first five years, and then when you go to game seven and lose in the ninth inning, they say, oh, you failed. So, you know, expectation, I guess, and of course, the media, which I think Stan can vouch for that. You know, it's. You know, it's always looking for the dark side of it a lot of times. So it's. It's just the things you have to deal with, aside from being in the dugout or being on courtside, you know, is probably the toughest job, you know, at least you know what you're doing when you're. When you're sitting there on the bench.
- [08:33]
Dan LeBatard
How did you help your players deal with the pressure that comes with those expectations and the media challenges in New York?
- [08:42]
Joe Torre
Well, I'll tell you what I said to them. They only have to satisfy the guys in the lockers next to them. You know, the fans are important. There's no question. Media, you know, they are necessary. But, you know, the guy in the locker next to them are the only ones that know how hard it is to do what they do. And, you know, and I always judge players not on results, but on their effort and their preparation and their desire to play the game. So even though my boss, George Steinbrenner, was disappointed a time or two, it was hard for me to swallow knowing how hard these players worked. So, you know, to me, I always tried to make these players accountable to each other. And the only thing that satisfied me is a good effort and preparation and, you know, it sort of simplified things. I tried to keep the distractions out of the clubhouse.
- [09:39]
Dan LeBatard
Joe Torrey with us here on AM7.90 now FM 104.3 the Ticket. Joe, when you were hired as the Yankees manager, you were greeted with headlines from the tabloid such as Clueless Joe and Loser Joe. And I'm wondering, did you save any of those headlines?
- [09:55]
Jim Leland
Well, they.
- [09:56]
Joe Torre
They popping up sooner or later, you know. But you know what? I. I was. It didn't bother me a bit because I was so thrilled to get this opportunity. I know even my brother Frank said, are you nuts? You realize how many managers George Steinbrenner has hired and fired? And I just felt it was an opportunity to manage for an organization that was going to be out there trying to win, try to give you players. I was going to find out if I could manage or not. And, you know, again, I was blessed with some pretty special players. I mean, Jeter being. When you think about the core of this group that came down the pike for me, I had Jeter and Bernie Williams and Paul o', Neill, and of course, Tino came over the same year I did. And then you had Pettit and David Cohn and Mariano Rivera. That's a pretty good core group. And as I say, I was lucky. And these guys were very serious about what they did, and they never admired what they had, just accomplished it. It was a great scenario for me.
- [10:57]
Dan LeBatard
The owner of your team, George Steinbrenner, late owner, did he ever call you in the dugout?
- [11:03]
Joe Torre
No, no, I think I got George on the back nine. I mean, I really do. You know, he had Billy. I think, you know, he and Billy were very contentious with each other. And, you know, I think the one thing Billy never recognized is that George was the boss. I recognized George was the boss, and he was allowed to do what he did, but he never. In fact, I called him more than he called me. I don't know if it was disarming him in any way, but, you know, I used to call him.
- [11:32]
Jim Leland
We were struggling.
- [11:33]
Joe Torre
I said, george, what am I doing wrong? You know, and sort of caught him off guard a time or two. But he never, never. I mean, he made suggestions to me when we sitting in a room and stuff like that, but he never call me during a game.
- [11:47]
Dan LeBatard
What was the most odd or speechless you were ever left, Joe, by a celebrity or someone famous, important, or that you admired? Being impressed by you.
- [11:59]
Joe Torre
You mean someone else who was. Who was famous impressed by me?
- [12:03]
Jeremy Stugats
Yeah.
- [12:03]
Dan LeBatard
Or someone you really respected, where you were sort of left awed by it.
- [12:07]
Joe Torre
I'll tell you, there were a few of them. The one that struck. Struck me was. Was Henry Kissinger. I mean, he invited my wife, Allie and I to his apartment, had, you know, we had dinner. There's about 40 people there, and Barbara Walters was there and Mayor Bloomberg, and, you know, he split up all the couples, and I'm sitting at a table with the President of Czech Republic. Trust me, that'll get your attention in a heartbeat.
- [12:40]
Dan LeBatard
You were sitting at a table with it, but you felt small, right? You felt like you didn't belong there.
- [12:45]
Joe Torre
No, until. Until Henry Kissinger got up and started talking about my being in the room. Trust me, it was. It was a little uneasy for me, but I realized what a great baseball fan he was.
- [12:57]
Dan LeBatard
Was the president of the Czech Republic a big Yankees fan?
- [13:00]
Joe Torre
I don't know. We couldn't understand each other.
- [13:04]
Dan LeBatard
I've had players like that, by the way, that I couldn't understand.
- [13:07]
Joe Torre
Well, sometimes that works, too. You know that.
- [13:11]
Dan LeBatard
Joe Torrey with us on the ticket. Of all the perks that came with cameos, you were in. Analyze that. All the perks that came with your cameos. Joe Torrey's favorite cameo was.
- [13:25]
Joe Torre
Oh, no, it was. It was. No question. Analyze that. I mean, I've been a big De Niro fan, and, of course, Billy Crystal's been a friend of mine. And to have that cameo at Gallagher Steakhouse in New York. I took a train in from Baltimore. We had a game that night, and it was a lot of fun, and that had to be the best experience for me.
- [13:50]
Dan LeBatard
Joe, thank you. We appreciate all you did and all you do, and so does Henry Kissinger.
- [13:55]
Joe Madden
Thanks a lot, guys.
- [13:58]
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- [14:57]
Chris Cody
All right, so apparently everyone is launching their own AI agents now. You get an agent. No, you get an agent. They're automating tasks, running workflows, making decisions, and occasionally absolutely wrecking your day. You know what I'm talking about. An agent deletes the wrong files, changes something you've never approved or just goes completely off script, like it's trying to improvise its way out of a paper bag. And suddenly you're the one stuck trying to figure out what went wrong. Unless you're using Rubrik Agent Cloud. Because here's the thing. AI is moving fast. Like, really fast. Rubrik Agent Cloud is the only platform that lets you monitor, govern, and rewind AI Agent actions. One platform that lets you unleash more agents faster without fear that they're going to burn the place down. You get full visibility into what your agents are doing. You can enforce guardrails. You can actually quantify the risk. And if something breaks, you just rewind it. Like an undo button, but for AI and that rewind happens in minutes, not hours or days. And if your business relies on AI agents, you need the ability to monitor, govern, and rewind their actions. Right now, Le Batard show listeners get exclusive early access to Rubrik Agent cloud. Head to rubrik.com that's R U B R I K.com rubrik.com critics are calling.
- [16:05]
Stan Van Gundy
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- [16:29]
Dan LeBatard
Don LeBatard. Punctuate this segment with. What is your strike three call?
- [16:34]
Jeremy Stugats
Strike one would be strike.
- [16:36]
Dan LeBatard
And then you stand up and you give a good point to the right stugats.
- [16:39]
Jeremy Stugats
That's same for strike three. But strike three, you get down low, you got your hands behind the catcher. All right, the right arm goes up into the air.
- [16:45]
Dan LeBatard
Yeah.
- [16:46]
Jeremy Stugats
And then you finish it with the punch. The right arm flings way up into the air.
- [16:54]
Dan LeBatard
I wish I could see that era of audio's great. This is the Dan Levatar show with the Stugats. He is fun, he is interesting. He's super smart. He's also different, which I imagine Joe gets. You called a weirdo in the world of baseball because you are different. And I imagine that that doesn't exactly fit. Stan Van Gundy is here with us today, and he'll be talking to you, too. He loves baseball. But that gets you called a weirdo, right?
- [17:29]
Joe Madden
Well, if that's the case, I love it. Actually, you know, I don't want to be one of those normal, considered old school kind of baseball people. It's just the fact that we're willing to try new things and a lot of it has to do with just data. And although Penguins in the clubhouse, I understand it's a little bit different. The different theme trips are different. But when it comes down to the everyday operation, we're probably as old school as it gets when it comes to playing a game of baseball.
- [17:55]
Dan LeBatard
Well, how about unconventional thinking? Like what do you, what do you. What is something you believe that runs contrary or counterintuitive to what most old school baseball people believe?
- [18:06]
Jim Leland
Oh, my God.
- [18:07]
Joe Madden
Where do you begin? There's something really. The one thing that jumps out is that you can't make the first or third out at third base. As an example. And from my perspective, I want our guys to get the third base with less than two outs as often as possible. One of the other things, just like hitting leadoff hitters, power hitters in the leadoff spot, the number two hole for me is no longer traditional spot in the batting order. I really pay attention to reverse splits. In other words, a righty gets a lefty out better and a lefty gets a righty out better. And not be afraid to utilize that in game strategy. You just don't necessarily go by the way they've been drawn up way back in the day things. There's a lot more information if you really pay attention. There's a lot of anomaly moments in the game and just don't run away from them. You have to have the courage with your conviction. You have to have the support of the people above. So all those things actually to me are. I'm really surprised more people don't do it. And I'm seeing now that more people are actually trying to do different things. How about shifts?
- [19:02]
Jim Leland
There's another one.
- [19:03]
Dan LeBatard
Yeah, I was just going to ask you about that one. Actually, you shift more than anybody. I think everyone knows that. What will determine whether or not you shift on guys? Because you shift on some guys that other people don't.
- [19:18]
Joe Madden
Well, with us we have a percentage that we go by. When it reaches a certain level, we feel as though it's safe to shift. I guess that's the best way to put it. And beyond all that, I mean, there's times when guys will hit the ball contrary to where you're playing, but that doesn't mean all of a sudden you blow up that thought process and move back because it happens one out of 100 times. And furthermore, I want certain hitters to try to do when Jose Batista wants hit a ground ball to the right side for base hit. I'll take it as an example. I think there's a lot of mental strategy involved. It's really hard to evaluate or determine exactly how much it is. But there is that element also where when you cause the other player to do something he doesn't necessarily want to do and I think that in some ways is a success.
- [20:01]
Dan LeBatard
I got to imagine Joe Madden, the Rays manager with us and this is a progressive organization. They're considered the new money ball. We've talked to you about the Jonah Carey book, the extra 2%. They are very smart organization. And I'm just wondering, Joe, if you have with you the conviction of your data and your knowledge. My guess is no matter how unconventional the move, you couldn't give a bleep whether it's being criticized or not. You are totally relaxed when making what others would assume are hugely gutsy moves.
- [20:34]
Joe Madden
Quite frankly, you're right. You know, it really doesn't matter what a talk radio person might think or somebody in a newspaper or anybody outside the organization. What matters is the people within the organization, the support of the ownership and front office matters. And then beyond that, that your players buy in. And when it comes to the player buy in, that has to be discussed in advance because when you're trying to do some things that are a little bit different, you just don't want to spring it on them at the last moment. A lot of the stuff that we do, I will talk to the players in advance of that moment and our coaches do a great job of the prep work too. But at the end of the day, for an organization to be deterred by outside voices or noise based on it goes against their internal philosophies. I think that's kind of on the organization making a mistake right there.
- [21:20]
Dan LeBatard
How do you feel about conflict with your players?
- [21:23]
Joe Madden
I try to avoid it in a sense by being proactive and staying ahead of it. I mean, you always want to stay ahead of your potential problems. I mean, there's quality control and there's quality assurance. Quality control, meaning that you can react to a negative moment and try to fix it. Quality assurance, you try to stay ahead of your problems. I think again, our coaches do a great job of stepping in front of our players and trying to avoid that. Now, I'm not saying we're perfect, we're going to make mistakes, we're going to have different things pop up at different moments, but you want to put out the fire as quickly as possible. You confront it head on. You don't let it fester. Don't ever let anything fester.
- [21:53]
Jim Leland
Man.
- [21:53]
Joe Madden
Once you start doing that, it really can get ugly. But the point is to try to stay ahead of your problems or your mistakes.
- [21:58]
Dan LeBatard
Can you give us a real world example?
- [22:01]
Joe Madden
Well, you know, just you look at certain players that we've had this year, and UNL Escobar came into our camp as an example with a lot of different thoughts from the general public and people that had him before. So for me, it was very important to get ahead of all of that, conversationally dealing with common friends that I have and that maybe UNL had. And beyond that, setting kind of a philosophy among the group in regards to how we're going to deal with and cohabitate with UNL on a daily basis. So you don't necessarily listen to what everybody else has said. You have to make up your own opinion, and you have to fit them into your culture. The way you see is the right way to do it. And the best way to do that is just communication. Communication and listening. And don't dictate. One of the things that. I think one of our strong points here is that we provide a lot of freedom for our players to work within. And when you do that, I think you get more respect and discipline in return. So all those things are factors, but everybody's got a little bit of a game plan here. And for example, a guy like, you know, you don't want to wait till spring training to try to put that game plan in action. You got to start way before that.
- [23:03]
Dan LeBatard
How often will Joe Madden apologize to a player?
- [23:07]
Joe Madden
I've done it twice, I think in the last or maybe three times in the last year and a half. Again, I won't be spec, but with one player, I really thought I overreacted and I said something I shouldn't have. And the next day I called them in and said, you know what? I stand by being upset about what I was upset about, but the way I handled it was inappropriate and wrong, and it's not. It's totally counter to what I believe in and what we do here. So I definitely made sure that the player knew that, but nobody else did. I mean, nobody else has to know about that. When you want to air your laundry out, whether it's publicly in a paper or you want to be confrontational in front of a group, that's not going to get it done. It's, you know, it's praised publicly and criticized privately. When you do that, you could get everybody on the same page.
- [23:52]
Dan LeBatard
You mentioned your. Your theme road trips earlier, and they're great. They become legendary. Actually. We've had your team dress up like nerds. Seattle. They have the grunge look going. What's been your favorite one, Joe, and why do you do them?
- [24:03]
Joe Madden
Favorite one's difficult. I mean, last year it was motivated by my granddaughter Tyler in Arizona. Then it turned into the Ken Rosenthal nerd Road tr and then we combined that with the Honey Jones with the bow ties. That one was pretty good because the guys really did get into that and it was kind of fun. It's always fun walking into the Boston hotel dressed up like a bunch of nerds and having people react the way they did. So that's among my favorites. The grunge trip, too, was pretty solid. To Seattle. Why do I do it? For several reasons. One of the reasons, I'm just poking fun in general at dress codes, which I totally don't believe in. I don't understand why you would think that I'm going to gain discipline from you by forcing you to wear a $2,000 suit. And how that translates to wins, I have no idea. So I've always felt that way. So part of it's poking fun. The other part is risk taking and team building. Again, to walk into crowded hotels in middle big cities dressed awkwardly for you, something that you're really not accustomed to. There's a little bit of risk involved in that in regards to how you feel about yourself. And then the team building, when you all walk in that way, it's okay. So there's a lot of different reasons, but primarily it was motivated by just poking fun a little bit at dress codes in general, which I totally disagree with.
- [25:14]
Dan LeBatard
Stan, I am swooning right now with man crushed delight. Stan, I don't know if this is happening to you over there, but I am. I mean, I haven't felt this way since I was a teenager. Stan, are you dressed in all white right now? Madden?
- [25:30]
Joe Madden
Well, I did. I did. And I actually wore a tie on this trip just. Just because I normally wouldn't. I bought a white suit a couple years ago because we started this tradition of all white into Miami. It's just the Miami Vice MOT back in the day was solid show, and so we're just trying to pay tribute to that and the guys really get into it. We've had some great photographs with the all white. We've had the Urban cowboy trip to Colorado that we turned into the Midnight Cowboy trip from Colorado to New York City. There's all kinds of different, and the guys totally do dig it. At first, I was a little concerned, people jumping on board. The first one was the Ed Hardy road trip with T shirts and Don Zimmer. Don Zimmer in xl. It really didn't. Didn't help him a whole lot. I mean, but to see Zim in the XL bulging in his seat on your charter plate was definitely worth all of that. So all these little things that we do, again, I think it helps morale, and it's a lot of. It's just a lot of fun, man. I mean, listen, you got to have fun doing this. If you don't have fun doing this, do something else.
- [26:29]
Dan LeBatard
Who's the guy on your team that was most comfortable with that whole Ed Hardy scenario? Wasn't a costume. He just went home and grabbed something.
- [26:36]
Joe Madden
Oh, geez, that's a couple years ago. Actually. I might have been. I mean, I was into all that stuff, period. I mean, you know, of course, yeah, it's. It's all about, you know, you just. Whatever's. Whatever you. Here's. Here's. Here's the guide guidelines for our road trip. If you think you look hot, wear it. That's it.
- [26:55]
Joe Torre
That.
- [26:55]
Joe Madden
When I have my. My preseason meeting and we go over all the rules and regulations, which I don't have any. The one. The one question you have to answer to yourself prior to dressing for a road trip is if you think you look hot or not. I mean, the answer is, then wear it.
- [27:09]
Dan LeBatard
I mean, Longoria, to me, comes off as a net Hardy guy. It's gotta be Longoria.
- [27:13]
Joe Madden
Oh, yeah. Longo's totally into all that stuff. Absolutely. Longo's kind. He's definitely west coast, you know, Then you got the kids from the middle part of the country, some from down south, and they have different ideas of what looks hot or not. And it's always fun to see. And then, of course, we have our land contingency, which I love. I love checking out the way the guys yesterday, I think, you know, Escobar, his outfit. If we had a photograph, you would understand why he might have won. Best dress all white yesterday. It was a little bit different.
- [27:39]
Dan LeBatard
When was the last time you were hammered with a player, Joe?
- [27:42]
Joe Madden
Oh, geez. Poof. There was some legendary moments, you know, playoff games. Absolutely. After you win. After you win a playoff series. A couple years ago in the World Series, even the playoffs more recently. But, you know, back in the day, as a bench coach, I felt part of my duties was to go out with the guys at night to listen to them, and I did. And there was some guys that you had to stay up rather late with to listen to them all the way through. So it's been a while. But primarily, you know, post the post playoff wins or like we went to the World Series a couple years ago, those are some pretty severely heavy moments that you really want to get involved with your players. And we do and I do. And it was just a lot of fun, man.
- [28:20]
Dan LeBatard
Go ahead, Stan. You ever get any of those guys to go bike riding with you?
- [28:24]
Joe Madden
I did one year, and that was several years ago in Minnesota. Paul Byrd and Buddy Blackwell went with me in Minnesota. They have a great trail around Minneapolis. The city of Minneapolis has got a great bike trail around the entire city. It's fabulous. So I got Birdie in and Pepe Buddy Black to go with me at that time. But you know what? I'm kind of a loner with that. I like to get out there by myself. That's really a good moment just to think. I like to do a little exercise. I listen to my music down in the Tampa Bay area. We live in Tampa now, and there's a lot of dolphin in the water. There are some stingrays. Sometimes I get to check all that stuff out. It's a great way to start your day intellectually before you go to the ballpark.
- [29:02]
Dan LeBatard
Joe Madden with us on the ticket. Do you have any problems, Joe, sort of marking the line between being really friendly and human with your players and being their boss? Because it sounds, from the way that you talk like that might not be the easiest thing in the world.
- [29:18]
Joe Madden
Honestly, I don't really have that problem. I don't think I've been doing this for a while. Even before being a manager in the major leagues back in the day, I started rather young as a minor league manager and coach. So there's a lot of. You build up that ability, I think, over time. And you get. I need to understand what the line is first and then the players will definitely follow. So again, I've been instructional leagues, I've been in charge of minor league systems. I've been managing. I've been a lot of different things. So I think as you convert with the player and get to know the player better, that they. I know what the line is and I think that they figure it out also. And then furthermore, as a major league manager, the office itself represents something. So I think we all know how far we can go regarding the relationship and how casual it can be, but we do have a lot of fun.
- [30:08]
Dan LeBatard
What's the angriest you've ever been with a player?
- [30:12]
Joe Madden
Well, it's happened a couple years ago, I'll tell you. In 2008, we were playing in Kansas City and we were on a, you know, we were playing pretty well, and this was our year. We went to the World Series and we won a game in Kansas City, but played poorly and did some things that I really did not like. So I kind of blew up with the whole group and I did some screaming in the locker room in Kansas City. And also I really thought two things regarding that were perfect. The fact that the meeting would be on the road in a visiting clubhouse where we hardly ever go there. So you leave it behind. And the other thing is after a win, I mean, it's so easy to pile on after a loss. I'd much rather. I'd rather not do that. So foreign town, foreign clubhouse. After when I thought was the perfect time to get it done.
- [30:52]
Dan LeBatard
What's the key to a successful marriage?
- [30:56]
Joe Madden
Well, it was.
- [30:58]
Dan LeBatard
I want to knock you off balance a little bit. You're too good at these other questions.
- [31:01]
Joe Madden
Well, I'll tell you. I mean, Jay and I, we've been married since. Since 2008. It's been bi coastal up to this year during the season.
- [31:08]
Dan LeBatard
So distance.
- [31:09]
Joe Madden
Distance is always good. But no, Jay's in Tampa right now. We're having a great time. For me, honestly, again, it's no different than what we do here. Listening. Listening is really important, man. And if you choose not to listen to the other person, then it can get a little bit ratty. I just think listening skills are among the most important things we can do as a human being.
- [31:30]
Dan LeBatard
Joe, it was a pleasure catching up with you. The audience found you exceptionally refreshing. Thank you for being on with us.
- [31:36]
Joe Madden
My pleasure.
- [31:37]
Dan LeBatard
Here's a question. You walked into a stash house and found it full of $20 million. How much would you steal? That's the question Matt Damon and Ben Affleck have to answer. Netflix's new movie, the Rip. They play a team of Miami cops alongside Teyana Taylor, Steven Young, Catalina Sandino Moreno, Kyle Chandler and Sasha Calle, all trying to decide, are they the good guys or the bad guys? This movie is an edge of your seat thrill ride the entire time, keeping you guessing until the very end. Don't miss the rip. Only on Netflix on January 16th.
- [32:12]
Commercial Announcer
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- [33:02]
Jim Leland
Done.
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Commercial Announcer
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- [34:28]
Dan LeBatard
Simplisafe. Don Lebatard, can I tell you something? I don't know, maybe like a.
- [34:34]
Stan Van Gundy
Month ago, and I decided to watch.
- [34:37]
Dan LeBatard
Pitch Clock and I told Jeremy Stugats, this is a good show you're doing. This is the Dan Levatar show with the Stugats. Jim.
- [34:57]
Jim Leland
Leno. Not a lot of.
- [34:58]
Dan LeBatard
People. People know Jim Leland is an emotional softie, and yet he scares the hell out of people. You just. Jim, you just scared the poor producer, Mike Ryan, who was impressed by your aura, your champion aura and your gruffiness, and he got scared. Can you explain to him he doesn't need to be scared of.
- [35:14]
Jim Leland
You? No, I don't. I don't really think that's me at all. But, you know, I guess that's the way some people perceive me, so that's okay. But no, I'm just looking forward to talking to you guys.
- [35:26]
Dan LeBatard
Today. You're cuddly and emotional. You're sensitive. You're a sensitive man. I've seen Jim Leland cry on a number of occasions because of how much he loves baseball and how much he loves his players. When was the last time Jim Leland got super.
- [35:38]
Jim Leland
Emotional? It's been a while, really. Probably at the All Star Game. I guess I thought that there was a whole lot of people besides me that were pretty emotional during the Mariano Rivera showcase at the All Star Game. I thought it was absolutely tremendous. And I thought there was a lot of players that, you know, honored him and came out to the warning track from the other bullpen and guys in our dugout. I. I wasn't the only one. I. I think I wasn't the only one in the dugout with a little emotion. I think there was a lot of people that night. So that was probably the last.
- [36:13]
Dan LeBatard
Time. You did good there, Jim. Jim, you did. You did good on that.
- [36:17]
Jim Leland
Moment. Well, we did okay. I mean, we, you know, we really. We really wanted to win that game. Obviously, there is a little more to it than there has been in the past, but the fact that it was, you know, in New York, which is a big scene, obviously, and then the Mariano situation, and, you know, we just wanted our guys to compete, and they did, and I was awful proud of them. Everybody from every team really competed. And, you know, one common denominator was the fact that somebody in that clubhouse was going to go to the World.
- [36:44]
Dan LeBatard
Series. Jim, you've been in organized baseball almost 50 years. How many hitters have you seen.
- [36:53]
Joe Madden
As good or better than Miguel.
- [36:55]
Jim Leland
Cabrera? Well, I don't think I've seen any better. I guess Bonds comes to mind. Cabrera is one of those guys that he kind of. He kind of hits like a little guy with big guy results. And, you know, he doesn't really over swing. He doesn't try to do too much. You know, he's very capable of taking a single right field with a man on second, two outs, pick up an rbi. He's just a terrific hitter, but like I said, it's almost effortless. You know, a lot of people see him see a big guy, they think he's just a muscle guy that overpowers the ball. It's really not true. He's really got kind of a simple swing. And like I say, he kind of hits like a small guy, but gets results of a big.
- [37:30]
Dan LeBatard
Guy. Jim Leland with us on the ticket. This is a difficult question. I want to reminisce with you a little bit about 1997, but did you have a favorite marlin? I know you loved all those guys and you appreciate the memories that you made with them. I know it's not Greg Zahn, but who was your favorite? Well, because he had a couple of great quotes. Stan, you're gonna love the couple of great quotes that he had for Greg Zahn. One time, Greg Zahn stole a base and wanted to know when he could steal a base in the future. And Jim Leland says, I'll give you the sign. I'll give you the sign in the dugout when I jump up and don't come down. That's. Who was your favorite Marlin.
- [38:10]
Jim Leland
Jim? Well, this sounds kind of crazy, but I really like Kurt Abbott. I thought he was just a fun, loving guy, and he really probably never got as much out of his ability he should have because he just didn't have the confidence that he probably should have had. But he was such a great guy. In fact, I think he's a police officer down there now. But he had such a great personality, and I, you know, he didn't play every day, but he was one of those guys that I just kind of had a soft spot for. I really, really liked him a lot. And of course, there was a lot of guys on that team, you know, that I was actually pretty close to or as close as you can get. You know, manager, player relationship, you know, you have to divide that a little bit, obviously, but that was just a great bunch. And of course, you know, I'm sorry to say this now because not sorry to say it, but, you know, my good friend Darren Dalton, who I thought made a huge difference, has just gone under some very, very serious surgery for brain tumors. And I thought when Dutch came over there, that probably made a difference. I can remember when we were trying to get Dutch and Wayne Isinga called me and he said, well, if we get Darren Dalton, will we win the World Series? And I said, well, I'll answer that this way. I don't know if we get him, if we'll win the World Series, but if we don't get him, I know we won't win the World Series. And he really proved to be a huge difference down that stretch in your.
- [39:29]
Dan LeBatard
Career. Jim, who would you say when you say you try and manage players and also you develop affinities for them as well, who's the player that you would point to and say, that's the guy that I was closest to, that I was his boss, but he was also my.
- [39:44]
Jim Leland
Friend. Oh, boy, I'd have to think about that. You know, I like to think that I've had a lot of them, but, you know, I think the secret is to be able to separate the two. I think you can have a friendship and still, you know, be the boss. I mean, that's a very. It's a very touchy situation. I mean, when I say that, I mean, I didn't hang around with the players and things like that. I don't do that. But at the same time, I liked them. I saw what they were going through, and you see how tough it is to play this game and what those guys go through on a daily basis and the emotional ups and downs of it that I, you know, I just had a soft spot for all of them. Like I said, I'm proud to say after managing 30 some years, that I could count on one hand the guys I just didn't really care for. But. But I don't know, I just. I mean, I've always had a soft spot for Bob Walk, who pitched for me in Pittsburgh and just took the ball at any time. And, you know, there was just something about him. He was such a competitor and. But over the years, I've had so many guys that I put in that same class. I don't know that I really had one favorite. But, you know, like I said, I have a lot of respect for anybody that can do what these guys do. And, you know, if you have an extra special friendship with them, that's something Sean Casey comes to mind right away. I mean, he was one of the nicest guys that I've ever managed, so. But you know, all of them have made their mark on my life in some way or another, and fortunately, most of it.
- [41:05]
Dan LeBatard
Positive. Jim Leland with us on the ticket. Jim, understanding that you like your job, what do you hate most about your job? Or what is the hardest thing about your.
- [41:13]
Jim Leland
Job? I think the. Probably the most difficult part is just dealing with the media twice a day. And I don't mean that disrespectfully. I mean, there's, you know, a lot of times they have to fill the newspaper and there's some silly questions, and that's aggravating. And. And I also think that, you know, I know I'll get blasted for this, but I think that one time somebody told me they thought it'd be a good idea if somebody would have to cover a certain amount of games before they were allowed in the clubhouse, you know, to ask questions that I thought that was kind of a good idea. That will never work. But, you know, when you get the postseason play, you get so many people that you haven't seen all year. You know, it's not just the beat writers anymore. It's everybody that's in there and media, you know, asking silly questions like, you know, where'd you eat breakfast if you win? Or you eat breakfast? Or. No, I mean, a lot of silly stuff. So, you know, I think that I try to use the media to my advantage. I try to use them in the sense that I think my responsibility is to tell the media everything I can and everything that's true about our club because I try to use them to get the word of our team out to our fans. I think that's very important. So I have a great deal of respect for the media. And on the other side of that coin, a lot of times you get, quite truthfully, some media that don't really know much about baseball, so you get some silly questions that can be aggravating after a tough.
- [42:30]
Dan LeBatard
Loss. Oh, Stan, he's speaking your language. This nonsense of needing to meet the media twice a day. That's Jim Leland, and you are kindred to spirits. And I'm one of those guys now that's asking Jim Leland questions who knows something about. That's right, You're a media guy. Now I've got. And now I've got a couple of ridiculous questions for Jim Leland that don't have anything to do with baseball. I'd like, if you don't mind, Jim, because you've always been very kind about tolerating my nonsense. The number of cigarettes, if you had to give it A number. Number of cigarettes. Jim Leland has smoked in the dugout in the course of his.
- [43:02]
Jim Leland
Career. Oh, boy. I. Well, I don't smoke them in the dugout anymore. I have finally learned my lesson that I was wrong for doing that over the years. I used to cup it, try to hide it, but things were different in those days a little bit, too. So, you know, now I go underneath if I want to have a cigarette where I'm out of sight. But seriously, you know, I go down after everything and light a cigarette. But you don't really smoke if you have a couple puffs and you put it out. So it's not, you know, that's more habit than anything else. And. But to answer your question, I've smoked a lot of them. I'm not proud of that. But I also think that, you know, I guess there's a lot worse things than.
- [43:40]
Dan LeBatard
That. So how did you learn the lesson, though? I didn't realize there was a lesson to be learned.
- [43:44]
Jim Leland
There. Well, I think that, you know, like, when I was on the bench and some people would pick up on it, and of course, the cameras always want to pick you up on something like that. It probably wasn't the best example of young kids. And, you know, I certainly apologize for that, but I'm a smoker. I don't apologize for that. I enjoy smoking cigarettes, and I just don't. I think we're kind of penalized, to be honest with you. We really can't go anywhere anymore and smoke a cigarette. I've never have figured it out how they worry so much about somebody smoking a cigarette. But you go to a ball game, and I'll get in trouble with all the owners. Now they can drink 10 beers and get in their car and drive home, but you can't smoke a cigarette. That doesn't make a lot of.
- [44:20]
Dan LeBatard
Sense. That's not fair. You're absolutely right. You're like an outsider. You can't. Why you should be able to walk through an airport smoking a cigarette, not stuck in that leprosy cage that they put the smokers.
- [44:30]
Jim Leland
In. Well, like I said, I, you know, I try to be respectful to all people, and I'm a smoker. I'm not proud of it, but, you know, it is what it is. And, you know, like I say, years ago, that was, you know, that was a way of life. Everybody smoked. Not everybody, but a lot of people smoked. And now it's become such a hot topic and a. No, no. But I think we got other things this country that we should be Worrying about a little bit more than Jim Leland have with a.
- [44:55]
Dan LeBatard
Cigarette. Yes, that's true. Jim Leland champion 1997 Marlins champion Jim Leland, is there anything you miss about Miami or not so.
- [45:04]
Jim Leland
Much? Well, I really enjoyed it there. Of course, we had, you know, we had a great time, and I actually enjoyed it both years. I took a personal hit, but obviously on my record. But that's okay. I really enjoyed that second year because a lot of those kids became great players. We just weren't good enough to win a game. We got beat up so bad. But, you know, to go down there with Wayne Huizenga and win the World Series and, and it was such a. It was kind of an odd place, to be honest with you, because we played a lot of games where actually half the crowd was to the other team. You know, Philadelphia Yankees, Baltimore, Atlanta, and it was Chicago Cubs. It was kind of a strange place, really, because a lot of nights, like I said, half the crowd was to the other team. But, you know, we accomplished our goal and I thought, you know, I thought we had one of the greatest World Series of all time. And I still say to this day that we really got cheated because had that World Series that we played between the Marlins and Cleveland been between the Yankees and the Dodgers, it might have gone down as the greatest World Series of all.
- [45:58]
Dan LeBatard
Time. Do you have any that you remember your. Your favorite Greg Zahn line? Because I love the way that you used to ride poor Greg Zahn into the. Into the ground in a loving and hostile fashion. Do you have a favorite from memory or too many to.
- [46:12]
Jim Leland
Count? Well, I can remember. Yeah, I do. I can remember Greg Zahn, who I love. I absolutely love him. And I was just really trying to teach him a lesson. I think I. I think I helped him a little bit because one year they were talking about interleague play and all this other stuff, and Greg Zahn came out and was kind of blessing the owners about it. And then I said, you know, I called him and I told him, I said, you know, you're a backup catcher here. You're a switch hit and catcher that's got a chance to stay in the big leagues for a long time. But it's not a good idea, you know, for you if you're the number one catcher in a star, maybe you should make some comments like that. But when you're a backup catcher at this time and you got a chance to play for a long time, you need to just keep your mouth shut and just be thrilled to death that you're in the big leagues. And he went on to really have a nice career. And I'm actually kind of proud of that because I think in some way I think it helped him. So it wasn't that I was picking on him or anything like that. I was just trying to teach him a good lesson, you know, I mean, superstars can get away. Let's face it. Whether it's right or wrong, superstars get away with comments that the 25th player can't get away with. That's just as simple as it is. Might not be right, but that's the way it.
- [47:17]
Dan LeBatard
Is. Well, you also told him that he wasn't allowed to steal another base until you grew a second.
- [47:21]
Jim Leland
Ass. No, I told him, I said, if I jump up in here and.
- [47:25]
Dan LeBatard
Never come down, you go, that's the greatest line ever, Jim. That's a great line. Jim Leland, Champion Marlin and just the last question. Tolerate one more silly question. How often after a loss will Jim Leland wander over and blow off steam by playing the slots over there in the Detroit Casino? Just blow off some.
- [47:45]
Jim Leland
Steam? Well, it's not really blown off steam. It's a lot of times it's. I don't go so much anymore because I moved out of the city. So I, you know, I kind of sit around and sometimes watch the late things in my office and then I just go home. But a lot of times it's a really, it's really a peaceful relaxation for me to go over and just go somewhere up in the corner over there and sit and, you know, it's kind of a no brainer. People say it's easy, you know, you're not using any brain power. Well, I don't really want to use brain power at that time. I just like to relax and, and have a cup of coffee or coke and sit there and, you know, mind my own business and you're kind of just relieved of everything. And I really enjoy it. But I don't, I don't get over there quite as much as I used to. But I can't tell a lie. I've really enjoyed it. And it's been kind of a buddy for me, to be honest with you. I know it's probably not the best buddy to have. I guess at times there's some times when I leave, if they rob me, all they get to experience. I ain't got nothing. But that's.
- [48:39]
Dan LeBatard
Okay. You can smoke at the casino. Yes, you can. There you're not an.
- [48:42]
Jim Leland
Outsider. But in Ohio you can't. But in some of them you.
- [48:45]
Dan LeBatard
Can. Jim, always good catching up with you. Congratulations on all your success. We really do miss you down.
- [48:51]
Jim Leland
Here. Well, I appreciate you guys having me on. Thank you very, very.
- [48:54]
Commercial Announcer
Much. Quick break to talk to you about the official ticketing partner of the Dan LeBatard Show. Game time. The NFL regular season is already winding down and this is when the games get really good and tickets are in high demand. Some of them really difficult to find. So why don't you take the guesswork out of buying NFL tickets with the game time map? I use it all the time because it gives me the advantage. That's right, sports fans take the power back. It's the hack for grabbing amazing tickets in just a couple of taps. Super easy, super reliable, and with a game time guarantee, you're getting 100% authentic tickets. Tickets on time and at the best price. Plus fees are included. What you see is what you pay. Do yourself a favor. Open up the gametime app right now. You'll see tons of seats available, lower bowl, midfield, upper deck, and NFL tickets starting at around 100 bucks. Pick what you want. Tap.
- [49:45]
Jim Leland
Tap.
- [49:45]
Commercial Announcer
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