Can James Harden Shake His Choker Reputation? + Should Wemby Be Suspended? | Hour 1

Summary

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Podcast Summary:

The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz
Episode Title: Can James Harden Shake His Choker Reputation? + Should Wemby Be Suspended? | Hour 1
Date: May 11, 2026
Hosts: Dan Le Batard, Stugotz
Location: Elser Hotel, Downtown Miami

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Overview of the Episode

This episode dives deep into two major NBA storylines:

• The ongoing reputation of James Harden as a playoff "choker" and whether a recent stellar game can redeem his legacy
• Victor Wembanyama’s (Wemby) controversial flagrant foul and whether it justifies a suspension
  Throughout, the crew brings their trademark blend of irreverence, humor, and sharp sports commentary, with plenty of banter about Philadelphia fans, media awards, and the quirks of player reputations.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Pulitzer Prize Talk & Media Self-Regard (00:15–03:45)

• Stugotz questions whether major media outlets (USA Today, NPR, Time, ABC, NBC, Disney) have won Pulitzers, learning that the awards are more varied than he thought and that non-written works, like audio journalism (including by NPR and Pablo Torre), are eligible.
• Tony provides detailed trivia on Disney-related Pulitzer wins.
• Dan jokes about media self-importance:

  "Are we about to hit Apex Mountain for inflated self-regard?" – Dan (03:15)

• Stugotz admits his prior takes are often misinformed:

  "It sounds like it’s getting diluted by the misinformation that I give as I talk." – Stugotz (03:46)

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2. Philadelphia 76ers, Fan Takeover, & Embiid’s Comments (03:53–08:19)

Philly's Home-Court Problem

• The crew discusses how Knicks fans overtook a Sixers home game, making it feel more like Madison Square Garden than Philadelphia.
• Joel Embiid had previously pleaded with fans not to sell their tickets but to little effect.
• Local news and player interviews highlight the embarrassment felt by Philly players over the crowd dynamics.
• Josh Hart’s jab at Philly:

  “I used to think Philly was a sports town. I don't know if it is anymore.” – Josh Hart (05:02)

Embiid’s “Success” Comments

• Joel Embiid claims the season was a “success” despite a second-round sweep and rampant injuries.
• The hosts express skepticism and frustration:

  “He’s never been out of the second round in his career...and this was a success. He’s due to make $58 million next season.” – Mike (07:07)
  “Once I have surgery, once I have appendectomy, emergency surgery, he said, nothing else in my body was right...That’s what Philadelphia’s core is built upon. Him trying to get through 38 games this season...” – Stugotz (09:05)

Dissecting Embiid’s Career Resume (08:19–10:36)

• Stugotz runs through Embiid’s years of playoff disappointments, highlighting the repetitive nature of Philadelphia’s failures.
• Mike pushes back, saying by any rational standard, “this is not a success.”
• Giannis’s earlier, widely debated “There’s no failure in sports” comment is referenced with eye-rolling.

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3. Knicks’ Resurgence & Tyrese Maxey on Home-Court Disadvantage (14:40–17:30)

Tyrese Maxey’s Honest Take

• Tyrese Maxey lays bare the frustration of being overrun by away fans:

  “It sucks, if I'm being honest. It just sucks, bro...It just felt louder here for them than it did in the Garden.” – Tyrese Maxey (14:57)

• The Knicks' recent run (winning seven straight playoff games; first NBA team to win three consecutive playoff games by 25+) is framed as the best period for Knicks fans since the late ‘90s.
• Hosts compare this Knicks squad’s likeability to past teams, praising Jalen Brunson’s leadership and the team’s explosive offense.

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4. James Harden’s Choker Reputation – Can He Ever Shake It? (17:49–32:56)

The Harden Paradox

• Discussion centers on whether Harden’s clutch Game 3 performance changes his reputation. Consensus: no, not really.
• Harden’s erratic playoff performances—alternating heroics and disappearing acts—are a defining feature.
• The standard for Harden is impossibly high:

  “If you're a Hall of Fame player...you should be, it should be expected, you're great every game.” – Mike (18:26)

The Empirical “Choker” Data

• Stugotz: “James Harden has the reputation...as the biggest choker...and you guys are telling me it cannot be shaken unless he does it in game seven.”
• Everyone agrees: only repeated clutch playoff heroics, especially elimination games, could challenge the narrative, but even then, the reputation might stick.

Comparisons to Other Athletes

• Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen, and (to some debate) Aaron Judge are mentioned as modern analogues—stars who shoulder “choker” narratives that seem nearly unerasable.
• Dan underscores the rarity of Harden’s kind of legacy—an all-time offensive player who’s persistently defined by disappointing playoff moments.
• Mike: “He needs to be great for the series...He can go out tonight and go 3 for 18 and everybody’s talking about, ‘Oh my God, Harden again.’”

Notable Exchange (Reputation Stickiness, 20:19–21:39)

• Stugotz: "I haven't seen it a whole lot, a player of this caliber not be able to get out from under the stigma."
• Dan: "You cannot say he just saved their season."
• Mike: "It needs to be more than one game. He has to be great for the series."

Discussion About Chris Paul and Precedent

• The crew notes Chris Paul also had a legacy of postseason heartbreak until late-career heroics.
• Stugotz’s main thesis: Harden (and some peers) can do everything right, but a single relapse will wipe out all gained “goodwill.”

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5. Wembanyama’s Flagrant Foul – Should Wemby Be Suspended? (33:45–42:56)

Breaking Down the Incident

• Wemby caught widespread attention for a spinning elbow deemed dangerous and potentially intentional.
• Crew debates intent versus optics, with Mike firmly stating:

  “It was intentional. It was dirty.” (34:05)

• Dan: “His face looks so intentional.” (34:57)
• Tony and Mike argue being “a nice guy” shouldn’t excuse a dangerous play; references to Miles Garrett and Zinedine Zidane are used as analogies for misunderstood moments of athletic violence.

Suspension Debate

• The group is divided on whether Wemby should sit another game.
• Consensus emerges: Wemby’s reputation and superstar status will likely protect him from further punishment—a “reputation privilege” that would not apply to players like Draymond Green or Dillon Brooks.
• Notable quote:

  “You never have a star player ejected from a playoff game, a face of the league ejected from a playoff game, for a clearly dirty play...His reputation is making this a discussion and a very sincere chance that he gets to escape it.” – Dan (40:46–42:53)

• Tony: "There is 0.0% chance that he misses a second." (42:19)
• Stugotz: "But it’s dirty enough to warrant that. Like, I wouldn’t have a huge objection if...Wemby’s also going to end up missing the next game because this was so flagrant."

Coach & Media Defenses

• Spurs coach Mitch Johnson claims Wemby has to defend himself given the physicality he faces (38:05).
• The hosts mock his logic:

  “This sound was embarrassing also.” – Tony (39:04)

• Reference to Nick Wright echoing the group’s outrage:

  “His coach justifying the dirtiest, most dangerous play of the playoffs...” (39:50)

The “Nice Guy” Problem

• Dan and Tony warn that even “good guys” can do bad things, and the NBA is unlikely to punish Wemby severely, in part because of marketing and narrative forces.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)

• On Philly fans selling out:
  “I used to think Philly was a sports town. I don't know if it is anymore.” – Josh Hart (05:02)

• On Embiid’s season:
  “His knee kept him out for 50 games this season. What are you talking about? ...and this was a success. He’s due to make $58 million next season.” – Mike (07:07)

• On Harden’s playoff reputation:
  “James Harden has the reputation throughout all of sports...as the biggest choker there is.” – Stugotz (18:51)

• On reputational stickiness:
  "He can do it for the remainder of the games in this series, knock off the Pistons, and still in the next round, you still won't take it off for James Harden." – Stugotz (28:03)

• On Wemby’s elbow:
  “It was intentional. It was dirty.” – Mike (34:05)
  “His face looks so intentional.” – Dan (34:57)
  “There is 0.0% chance that he misses a second.” – Tony (42:19)

• Wemby’s suspension debate:
  “His reputation is making this a discussion and a very sincere chance that he gets to escape it because everyone agrees he seems like a good guy. That's how they get you.” – Dan (42:53)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Segment | Timestamps | |-----------------------------------------------|---------------------| | Pulitzer/Maintstream Media Segment | 00:15 – 03:45 | | Sixers/Knicks, Philly Fans, Embiid’s Comments | 03:53 – 10:36 | | Knicks Resurgence & Maxey Interview | 14:40 – 17:30 | | Harden’s Choker Reputation | 17:49 – 32:56 | | Wemby Flagrant & Suspension Debate | 33:45 – 42:53 |

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Tone & Style

The episode is filled with candid, off-the-cuff banter, biting humor, and a fearless willingness to poke fun at both sports stars and themselves. The hosts are skeptical of empty PR lines, quick to challenge superficial narratives, and unafraid to compare serious sports debates with pro wrestling antics.

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Summary

This episode is a quintessential Dan Le Batard Show installment: a blend of NBA playoff analysis, media introspection, and cultural commentary. The hosts lay bare the futility and irrationality of sports reputation—whether it’s an all-time great like Harden dogged by "choker" labels, or a new super-duper-star like Wembanyama escaping full discipline on the strength of his image. The panel refuses to let narratives go unchallenged, dissecting every angle for entertainment and insight.

For listeners who missed it, you’ll get the heated drama of the playoffs, the pulse of sports culture, and plenty of laughs—all in one densely-packed hour.

Transcript

[Dan Le Batard]

This is the Dan lebatar Show with the Stugats podcast. This episode of the Dan Lebatard show is presented by DraftKings. DraftKings. The Crown is yours.

[Stugats]

Tony, what did you find for me before we get to Wemby and what happened with him yesterday and before we get to the Sixers and the Knicks? Because I do want to talk about both sides of that. Joel Embiid has still not ever gotten out of the second round and had some post game comments that were super unusual. I would say that we'll get to in a second. But am I correct in what it is that I said about USA Today never winning a Pulitzer, the BBC and NPR never winning a Pulitzer? Time Magazine, ABC News, NBC News never winning a Pulitzer?

[Tony]

Um, no, just because there's 23 different categories of Pulitzer Prizes and actually NPR won one for the same category that Pablo won one, which is audio journalism, audio reporting. They won in 2021. So I'm going to go through all 23 categories and see if there is overlap there.

[Stugats]

Okay, but how about Disney? Has Disney won one? Because I was surprised to hear that ABC News in the entirety of its history, had never won a Pulitzer. Now, I will admit that I did not know that you could win the Pulitz for something that was not written. That's. I thought the Pulitzer was just something that was a written award. Didn't you guys think that as well? Were you not of the impression that that was only something that could be had by writing something? Because that's. That is what I thought and I was floored. And I don't know if any of you were floored by this, but the placement. Okay, I'm just going to. Before I get to Sixers, Knicks and Wemby, here's the first paragra and the third paragraph of what was reported about this. The New York Times won three Pulitzer Prize awards on Monday, including for an investigation into how President Trump is profiting from his deal making in news photography documenting starvation and destruction in Gaza, and also for analyzing the rise of authoritarianism. So you've got Gaza, Trump, corruption and authoritarianism in the first paragraph. The third paragraph is Reuters in the Washington Post winning for exhaustive coverage of the Trump administration's overhaul of federal agencies and how they were reshaping the country. That's the first and the third paragraph. So authoritarianism, starvation and destruction, reshaping of the country, corruption. And then the second paragraph, an NBA player not planting trees. That's nuts. It's just totally nuts.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yeah. So far the only punishment from Any of those categories that you mentioned was the Clippers getting the fifth pick.

[Stugats]

So now put this up on Pablo and you tell me whether we're in this realm. Pablo Torre just won a Pulitzer for his ballmer story. Are we about to hit Apex Mountain for inflated self regard?

[Dan Le Batard]

That's funny coming from the Simmons Reddit.

[Stugats]

Put it on the poll at Lebatard show. Pablo winning Pulitzer. Are we about to hit Apex Mountain for inflated self regard?

[Tony]

So Disney has won a couple of Pulitzer Prizes because it was it owned the Los Angeles times from 2000 to 2016 where they've won a couple there. ABC News has won a couple between staff and journalists, and ESPN has won a couple as well.

[Mike]

You were way off.

[Stugats]

Yeah, I was. Okay, so I wasn't right.

[Tony]

I'll check the other 22 categories.

[Dan Le Batard]

Actually. Not that impressive.

[Stugats]

Yeah, it sounds like it. It sounds like it's getting diluted by the, the misinformation that I give as I talk.

[Joel Embiid]

You said it.

[Stugats]

So the Sixers and the Knicks yesterday. This one's interesting for a few reasons. Before we get to the Wemby stuff, which is also the Sixers go from ending Boston season on the road, ending maybe Boston's architecture on the road, to never getting to celebrate that with their home fans, and then coming home and getting slaughtered. And not only getting slaughtered because they can't trust Joel Embiid. This one was interesting to me, Zaz, because, oh, Paul George can look like that for a couple of games if he takes 25 of them off, and Joel Embiid can look like that for a couple of games to knock off Boston, but over the course of a series, they'll get worn down so that in a Philadelphia arena that New York fans take over. You can have Josh Hart of the Knicks say this after they sweep the Sixers.

[Mitch Johnson]

Nah, man. Because everybody was begging for that, for

[Stugats]

Philly to not sell their tickets and all that stuff.

[Dan Le Batard]

So, man, yeah, it's.

[Stugats]

I used to think Philly was a sports town.

[Mitch Johnson]

I don't know if it is anymore.

[Mike]

It's awesome. So, I mean, it's. That's such an awesome thing to say by Josh Hart. And you got Joel Embiid at the end of game seven, last round, begging and pleading with their fan base not to sell the tickets because Joel Embiid said, if you need the money, I got you. Now, I don't know what that exactly means, Dan. Like, did he give some fans money? I, I. And then they still turned around Solar tickets. I don't know. We may need to look into that. But then for Josh Hart to say that I thought Philly was a sports town, that's something.

[Stugats]

Well, look at how New York took over Philadelphia during this local news clip as well.

[Dan Le Batard]

Action News reporter Cheyenne Corinne live inside Xfinity Mobile arena tonight. Cheyenne, this game was brutal. Walter, you would think that I'm in New York right now instead of Philadelphia.

[Stugats]

This is absolutely not the way that

[Dan Le Batard]

fans were hoping to end the Sixers season.

[Stugats]

So after that, you have Joel Embiid. Or maybe it was during that. Here's Joel Embiid in the locker room saying something that is just a little bit mystifying from someone who played 38 games this season.

[Joel Embiid]

You know, I said it, and I'm going to say it again. I know we lost, you know, and I know that's not divine mentality to have, but. But, you know, for me, this was a success. I came into this year not knowing where I was going to be, you know, how long I was going to play, if I was even going to play, based on how the knee was the last, you know, the last few years. And, you know, I came in, you know, hoping for the best. And I feel like we're in a position where we figured out the knee.

[Jeremy]

Ah, the kid.

[Stugats]

The kid coughed, though, so, yeah, the colicky baby is the healthiest part of that.

[Tony]

Sound, to be fair in context, he's talking about his knee.

[Mike]

Who cares?

[Tony]

But he says he feels healthy about the knee.

[Mike]

Talk about his knee. His knee kept him out for 50 games this season. What are you talking about? Talking about the knee? How could you say that if you're Joel Embiid? They just. Not only did they get swept, he's never been out of the second round his career. They lost 144 to 114. And this was a success. He's due to make $58 million next season.

[Dan Le Batard]

I think it was a success. You just contextualize how difficult their season was. They were down 31 to the Boston Celtics. They went on the road, and Embiid had one of the classic closeout game performances in Philadelphia sports history. He did that on the road. Now, I understand a sweep to the degree that they had one against the New York Knicks is how you kind of burn up all that goodwill. But we cannot overlook what they did in that first round. We can, Mike.

[Mike]

They gave $200 million before last season to Embiid. They gave $200 million to Paul George, and this season ended with them getting curb stomped in three or four games in a sweep in the Second round. Another second round that Embiid goes home in. It's not a success. There's no way you could shape it as a success.

[Stugats]

There is one way I could shape it as a success, and it's just to pair it against everything, year by year that he has done in the league. Are you ready? 2015, play. 2016, did not play. 2017, missed playoffs. 2018, second round exit. 2019, second round exit. 2020, first round exit. 2021 through 23. Second round exit. 2024, first round exit. 2025, missed playoffs. 2026, second round exit. It's the best he's done. It's it when he, when he plays through all of his injuries and there was a comical headline, was the closest game the Sixers played, the one without him in that series is the closest one they played. The headline before that game was something that would be written by comedy writers, which is just Joel Embiid out with multiple injuries. Like they just say multiple injuries. And he was saying, and this part's fair. Once I have surgery, once I have appendectomy, emergency surgery, he said, nothing else in my body was right. I came back too soon and nothing was balanced. And every year he is playing with an assortment of broken body parts. And that's what Philadelphia's core is built upon. Him trying to get through 38 games this season, last year, or the year before Bell's palsy, the year before that, he's playing with a mask because they've shattered his eye. He's saying, this is what must be so frustrating for Joel Embiid, is that he's saying, after that game, nobody cares more about being out there winning than I do. And his reputation is exactly the opposite of that. Cuz he can't get out there because his body keeps betraying.

[Mike]

Everything you're saying is completely reasonable. But that doesn't make any of this a success. It's not a success. And a main reason that it's not a success is because unfortunately he's never healthy, but because he was able to play in the final game of the year, a year that he missed more than half the games in, missed four of 11 playoff games. These are good reasons for missing games, but it's not a success.

[Jeremy]

Does this go back to the Giannis

[Dan Le Batard]

quote a couple years ago, where it's just like every, every year you job, you get a promotion. I'm doing my Giannis right now.

[Stugats]

Don't do that.

[Dan Le Batard]

I mean, just saying, do you. It's still a success, right? You still had a good. A good year work. No, not the old one.

[Mike]

It's not the same thing.

[Tony]

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[Stugats]

Don Levatard the hoy is Captain Slappy. Stugats is this Chum Bucket.

[Dan Le Batard]

This is the Dan Levatar show with the Stugats.

[Stugats]

Let's play this maxi sound. So you guys tell me if this sounds like success. Tyrese, can you describe what it was like playing again against the Knicks here, where their fans come down here and kind of take over your home arena? Do you. Do you use it as fuel?

[Dan Le Batard]

It sucks.

[Tyrese]

It sucks, if I'm being honest. It just sucks, bro. It just sucks, man. Yeah, it just sucks. That's really all I can say about it, man. Like, I just. It's hard. It's definitely difficult. You know what I'm saying? And it's only one way to put a stop to it. And it's. It's. We have to go out there and win these games. Like, we just Being completely honest, we were better when we played them in, in the Garden this entire season. Like, I know we lost game two and one, but, like, game two was better. Regular season was better. Here we was. You know, I was telling them it just felt. It felt louder here for them than it did in the Garden. And it's like, well, we gotta put a stop to it as a team, like, winning these games. That's what's gonna make, you know, our fans, like, louder than theirs or whatever. I don't know how to keep them out. I don't know the logistics of it, but, you know, it does suck. I can't even lie. It definitely does suck.

[Stugats]

This is the best that the New York Knicks have felt since Larry Johnson hit a four pointer against the Indiana Pacers to get them to the Finals. What year was that? Was that 2001?

[Mike]

Was that 99?

[Stugats]

99. So that's this century. This is the best that the Knicks have felt right now, this minute, where they have won seven straight playoff games. They're the first NBA team ever to win three straight basketball games in the playoffs by more than 25 points.

[Mike]

I'm pretty sure, like, this generation of Knicks fans is going to look at this version of the Knicks the way that, you know, that fan base in the 90s looked at that version of the Knicks. Like this.

[Stugats]

This is. This is a more lovable team, though. That one had Latrell Sprewell on it and Larry Johnson. And they liked that team. They embraced that team. But they didn't have anyone on that team as beloved as Jalen Brunson leading that team. And the first quarter that the Knicks played to close out the Hawks is the best quarter of basketball that I saw from a team this season not named the Oklahoma City Thunder, where they were up with four minutes left in the second quarter to 22 is after. And it was on both sides. It wasn't just offensively. Yesterday they hit 18 threes in the first half. When their record for threes in a game is 19 or the record for threes in a game was 19. They hit 18 in the first half. They had 81 at the half. That used to be more than the Knicks. That the era you're talking about Knicks basketball. There are any number of playoff games that didn't have an 81 next to a victorious Knicks team when they were finished with the basketball game.

[Dan Le Batard]

They're rooting hard for the Cavs. Yeah.

[Stugats]

Yes.

[Dan Le Batard]

Because styles make fights now.

[Mike]

They.

[Dan Le Batard]

Cleveland did make an acquisition that they. They hope mitigates new York's advantages over them. But Cade Cunningham, like that could be a really interesting Eastern Conference finals for a team that was on life support against Orlando. Knicks.

[Stugats]

The Knicks look good against Sixes and Sevens. And Detroit will be a different problem. They will not have any problems with Cleveland. They wouldn't have had any problems with Toronto. They match up extraordinarily well. Even with Harden. I don't need to watch that. But since you brought up Harden, does he buy himself anything with that last game or does Harden have to do it in game seven?

[Mike]

No, but do it again.

[Dan Le Batard]

So he's doing it.

[Stugats]

So he's got to do it. So Harden all Harden does. So I just want to be clear on this. When Harden disappears for nine minutes at the end of game two, that's Harden being Harden. But when Harden wins game three with everything he does at the end, he buys himself nothing. Correct. Nothing at all.

[Mike]

Yeah. If you're a Hall of Fame player, which he is going to the hall of Fame. Okay. If you're a Hall of Fame player, you should be. It should be expected. You're great. Every game. Every game.

[Tony]

He also has these disappearing acts and reappearing acts throughout playoff series his entire career.

[Dan Le Batard]

Right.

[Tony]

Like a couple years ago, had a 40 point game in a game six and then has a dud for a game seven.

[Stugats]

No.

[Dan Le Batard]

But that famous game six didn't buy him anything. He's certainly not going to get anything bought with a game three.

[Stugats]

I believe that James Harden has the reputation throughout all of sports, not just American sports, all of sports, as the biggest choker there is that right now present. Now this changes every few years, but Harden's held the title for a while. A reputation for a guy that you know is great. Hall of Famer, top 20 scorer of all time, multiple time MVP. He's got a reputation as a choker that you guys are telling me cannot be shaken unless he does it in game seven. And I don't agree with you. I think he's got to do it multiple times in a game seven.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yes. No, you do agree with us. When Zaz said that we were all nodding along. You agree exactly with us.

[Mike]

When you nod your head like this,

[Dan Le Batard]

that's agree on cherry. Pick a game three. Where were you? Game one and two.

[Stugats]

He was terrible. But I'm saying game. If he does it, if he does it to eliminate the Pistons in a game seven or it's the second round, not even a game six. I'm telling you, I'm telling you, the reputation is so embedded, it's a really unusual thing, guys. Usually a player of this caliber doesn't come with the reputation of this guy's more likely to not be trusted in an important moment late in a series. James Harden having that distinction, I don't think, I mean, McDavid sort of headed there even though he was playing incredibly hurt during the playoffs.

[Mike]

But you don't think it's unfair, the hardened reputation, right?

[Stugats]

It's not that I think it's unfair, it's just that I haven't seen it a whole lot a of this caliber not be able to get under. Out from under the stigma.

[Dan Le Batard]

That's why it's a thing where.

[Stugats]

Where. But it's a thing. But it's a thing where you're not willing to change your mind unless it becomes a game seven because he just did it. Like, you cannot say he just saved their season.

[Dan Le Batard]

But the thing is he can't do it in game seven. He did it in games like, however impressed you are with this game three, that game six that Tony mentioned was so much better, so much more impressive and no one cares.

[Stugats]

He just made that trade for him a winner by saving their season late. And after the game when they're asking Donovan Mitchell about, hey, you didn't do anything late, he's like, we've got James Harden now. We've got a guy who takes the ball from me late in the games. And that is what we're going to trust late in games.

[Dan Le Batard]

But that's why we all agree he has to do it more because there are so many more opportunities for him to burn up goodwill. Like, it's not some contrivance, it's data back.

[Stugats]

I know, but the last. But the last game that you have as Data would serve as disproof if you, if you were willing because he just.

[Dan Le Batard]

Well, then how can you eliminate game

[Stugats]

two and one because he just saved their season? How could game one and two be big, but the one that saves their season is not a big moment.

[Dan Le Batard]

I it's. It is a big moment in the complexion of that series for now, but he has to keep doing it. His reputation is overwhelming for a reason.

[Mike]

And again, it's a series like it needs to be more than one game. He has to be great for the series.

[Tony]

He can go out tonight and go 3 for 18 and everybody's talking about, oh my God, Harden again save the get the season quote, unquote, but now ruin the season again.

[Mike]

Like it's not the caliber player that it's like, all right, he could win. You you know, one or two games in a series. No, he. He needs to be great the whole series.

[Dan Le Batard]

He's a Mount Rushmore shooting guard potentially. He. He is graded against all time greats and what they do in the postseason and he has a reputation that's unlike any of the other Mount Rushmore two guards. He's. You can make it a solid argument that he's a top three offensive player in the history of the game.

[Mike]

I mean, look, spin it in a for a local perspective and I'll use Dwyane Wade because Dwyane Wade seems to be this comp for James Harden. But I'm gonna do it anyway. Like if. If the Heat. We're playing in a playoff game. Dwyane Wade was expected to be amazing every single playoff game. And if he wasn't amazing in that game, that's a massive disappointment. Harden should be expected to be great every single playoff game.

[Dan Le Batard]

Chris Cody, when you come over to my house and we put on the games, I got basketball, I got baseball going on, but what do I lay out for you and the boys for entertainment and drinking?

[Stugats]

Miller Line.

[Tyrese]

Uh huh.

[Dan Le Batard]

Those beautiful white cans or on draft or the bottle if you prefer.

[Mike]

Oh.

[Jeremy]

When you open that with the can

[Dan Le Batard]

though, and you one of the best sounds on the planet. You pair that with the ripe game. You take that first sip, we both look around. It's not a bit. I have goosebumps thinking about the first sip. We take that first sip, we open it up and we're looking around. There's just that five seconds of almost eerie silence where you're just soaking it all in and you're like, man, did we make the right call or what? That's why we reach for Miller Lite. It's clean, refreshing, easy to drink, brewed for taste with simple ingredients.

[Tony]

Wow.

[Dan Le Batard]

That golden color. Just 96 calories and 3.2 carbs. The original light beer since 1975. And it still hits different. I love you, Miller Lite. Cheers to legendary moments with Miller Lite. Great taste. 96 calories. Go to millerlight.com dan to find delivery options near you. Or you can pick up some Miller Lite pretty much anywhere they sell beer. It's Miller time. Celebrate responsibly. Miller Brewing Co. Milwaukee, Wisconsin. 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces. Hey, Roy, buddy. Yo. You know that energy shift when the game gets good and everybody all together in unison knows to stand up on their feet? Oh, absolutely.

[Tyrese]

Mike.

[Stugats]

Yeah.

[Dan Le Batard]

You've been at many big time sporting events. You Know that moment quite well. That's what it's like when you take your first sip of Cuervo. Oh, delicious. It's the signal that says, we're not checking the time anymore, pal. It's when small talk turns into stories. Cuervo, man. It's that high five. A random stranger effect. That's right. The game is popping. You're hugging people you never met before. That's the kind of energy that Cuervo brings. It's so smooth, so delicious. That's the Cuervo effect. Keep it Cuervo.

[Stugats]

Don LeBatard.

[Dan Le Batard]

I don't think I ever got that

[Stugats]

many roses in my whole life.

[Dan Le Batard]

Stugats. Certainly not from your lovely grandfather. God, may his soul rest in peace. This is the Don Levatar show with the stugats.

[Stugats]

I'm just surprised. Anytime a guy saves a season and it doesn't does nothing to improve his reputation. That's all I'm saying. And I'm saying it's because of empirical data that makes it so that he is a player who can shrink comparative to his greatness. But it's also because the reputation is now so imprinted and embedded that he's basically in Lamar Jackson territory.

[Dan Le Batard]

It's a two man island right now.

[Mike]

He's like the only other one because

[Dan Le Batard]

he's bad in those big games. Josh Allen can be accused of having that reputation, but Josh Allen, outside of this Denver game where he made puzzling decisions, still had a decent box score, but he's been incredible in some of these games. Lamar, like Horton, what is happening here? You're one of the all time greats. Why are you so much worse in this moment?

[Stugats]

You guys have for me a couple of other names that you can throw into the mix that I'm talking about. This mix of, yes, all active of Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson and James Harden, where it's not just that he has to do it at the end of games, it's not just that he has to do it at the end of playoff games. He has to do it at the end of the playoff games, like at the end of the playoffs. Is. Is the standard is in a place where everything you do before the last games of the season doesn't matter at all. We're not erasing what your reputation is. We're not even going to give you this much room to move your reputation.

[Dan Le Batard]

I don't know if he's there. I think the standard for him is why are you back compared to where you are during the regular season? Like it's not just, like, do it in these late moments.

[Mike]

And it's not just missing shots. It's turning the ball over.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yeah. I think the standard is why this is puzzling. Why are you worse?

[Stugats]

Agreed. All I would say to you is that Detroit defense is really good. And the end of playoff games is the hardest time in all of basketball to score. And he won that game like that. That Detroit team playing to finish the Cavs, James Harden would not let them. That's what happened at the end of the game.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yes. But if they get eliminated in six, no one will ever remember that game. No one.

[Mike]

I feel like Austin Matthews is that guy in hockey. He's probably. I think McDavid. It's not fair. I wouldn't put him there.

[Dan Le Batard]

It was Mitch Marner. I mean, it was. McDavid ended up winning a postseason MVP in. In a season when it was Stanley.

[Mike]

Right, Right.

[Dan Le Batard]

This is for. I'm trying to think in playoffs, the only superstars that have this thing about their chokers and the reason why they're chokers, it's because they're bad, and they're really bad in these big games. It's Lamar and James Harden right now.

[Mike]

Yeah. Like, there's no one currently in baseball. Right. Since there's no more Kershaw.

[Stugats]

But what. What you guys are doing, though, that is, to me interesting is I'm telling you right now that he can do it for the remainder of the games in this series, knock off the Pistons, and still in the next round, you still won't take it off for James Harden. Like he can do it.

[Mike]

That would go a long way if

[Dan Le Batard]

he didn't say flowers. It is a second round, but I would give him flowers.

[Stugats]

I'm not saying the flowers would rot quickly in the next round if he doesn't keep doing it, is what I'm saying. It's a super unusual situation for a player of his caliber to find himself in that. I'm telling you, the next three games, he can do exactly what he just did, finish the Detroit Pistons. And you guys will still be waiting for him to choke in the next round against the Knicks.

[Tony]

What's the same conversation with Joel Embiid? Right. That's another guy who we look at and we're like, you're so good.

[Mike]

You had.

[Tony]

You had a 3310 season. You wanted an MVP. You can't play. And when sometimes the big games do come up, you come up short. He has come up with big games in the past, like he did with the. With the Celtics in that Series, but then he comes to the Knicks series, and where were. Was he. Was he playing? Was he there?

[Dan Le Batard]

I don't know, and I don't know exactly what it does to the conversation. But at this age in his career, he was brought there to take pressure off of Donovan Mitchell. Donovan Mitchell is the face of that franchise now. It seems to be a loaded team. A lot of guys for that playoff team is stepping up right now. James Harden is not asked to be the guy that puts the entire team on his shoulders. Now, he was that in game three. That was amazing by him. But it's also why he gets to live in a space where we're not really talking about games one and two all that much.

[Mike]

If the Cavs win the series, which they won't, but James Harden is great, and they advance the next round, and like you said, what if he's terrible the next round and they lose? You say that. Our negative reaction to him. You say that as if that would be unfair. I think it's completely fair. Even if he carries them in this second round to a victory, and then he's terrible in the conference finals.

[Stugats]

Yeah, we're gonna crush him. I'm not saying it's unfair. I'm saying it doesn't have a lot of precedent for a player of this caliber where the thing that you attach to him is not merely the not winning of a championship, but also is gonna disappear for nine minutes at the end of the game where you're not even sure whether he's on the court or at concessions because of what happened in game two, for example, where you're expecting what happens in game two, and you're surprised what happens at the end of game three.

[Mike]

We're probably getting close to that with Aaron Judge.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yeah. Yeah, that's a good one in baseball. That's a great one. He's got to win the big one. You can cherry pick some individual moments, like, oh, look, he came through in that moment, just like he did in last postseason.

[Mike]

Right. If he carries them in the alcs, then he stinks in the World Series. He's going to get hit.

[Stugats]

Hammer. Well, but that one was unfair because he was great last postseason, wasn't he?

[Mike]

He was not good at the start, and then he was good in the World Series.

[Tyrese]

Right.

[Stugats]

I mean, so you're. So the. The earlier games are the pressurized ones, but the World Series games are the ones where the pressure's not on him.

[Mike]

No, no, I. I think. I think in that part, it's unfair.

[Tony]

Didn't he have A major goof in the World Series where he, he short played a ball that went over his head.

[Dan Le Batard]

I, I think it's a, it's a good name because statistically not as good in the postseason. Same with Lamar and same to James. All Dan is doing is marveling at how rare it is. And we're all agreeing. Yes, it's super rare, but it's not a contrivance. It's not some media made fabrication that you can just point to stats and say, well, look, he's the same guy. He's very clearly not.

[Stugats]

I'm not saying it's a fabrication. I'm just saying that usually when you save a season against the Detroit Pistons, their brand of basketball, defensively, playoff basketball, by making all the tough shots at the end where Donovan Mitchell's the one that gets pushed off to the side because you've got a situation where the Pistons are saying, okay, James, go ahead and beat us. Because it's not like, it's not like these teams don't also have the scouting report right. They're going to dare James Harden to be the one that beat him, beats them. But he did the last game and I don't think he gets much for it. I think it gets immediately erased. It's not. You mentioned the 40 port game in game six. I still hold the game seven against the warriors against him when he's the MVP of the league with the Rockets.

[Dan Le Batard]

And that's why a large part of his reputation is what it is, because he was supposed to be the man there and Chris Paul took a little of the heat away from him. I do think that even if he's great this series, even if he is the reason why they beat Detroit, it'll probably be unfair that he doesn't get anything for it because then he's going to be in the conference finals against the New York Knicks. The pressure is going to be ratcheted up and he is going to be the guy that they brought in specifically to Overcome the Knicks.

[Tony]

CP3 is a guy that gets kind of like put. I know he retired this year, so maybe we can like angle him in there, but he's another guy that was elite point guard. The guy was supposed to be the face of the team and make all the right plays and would always come short in big moments.

[Mike]

I mean, yeah, he saved their season in Game 3, but we could also make the case that he wouldn't have had to save their season if he wasn't so terrible in games one and two. Like, if he like if he was. If he was good in games one and two, game three is not going to be on the line.

[Stugats]

They're the lesser team though. They. I mean, the Pistons have been better all season. Even after the Cavs traded for Harden. My. Let's see here. Tony's making faces.

[Tony]

You know, are they the better team of the Pistons? A better team?

[Stugats]

You don't think? I mean the piss all regular season they were. Maybe that doesn't mean anything anymore given what I saw from the Celtics this year and how the playoffs can change a basketball team. But it doesn't appear like for all the talk we had about, hey, the Pacers made it as a 5 and the Mavs made it as a 5, it appears that this year it's going to be ones and twos and ones and threes and it's not going to end up being Cleveland and it's not going to end up being. The threes distort everything. It's just going to be at the end. I suppose Minnesota could beat San Antonio, but it's looking like it's going to be ones and twos and ones and threes.

[Dan Le Batard]

I mean, we gotta see what the NBA hands down, that game was awesome when it comes to Wemby because you could look at like it looks pretty bad on a replay. Look bad as it happened that. Do you think he's gonna get suspended?

[Tony]

No, no, no.

[Dan Le Batard]

He just had chance.

[Stugats]

Tony, did you just do play on? You just did play on.

[Dan Le Batard]

That was pretty crazy.

[Tony]

It was egregious.

[Dan Le Batard]

When you slow it down, it looks as intentional as it felt like live.

[Mike]

It was intentional. It was dirty. Look, I'll ask you this. If this was. This was this took place in February and today I'm asking you is when many getting suspended? The answer is what?

[Tony]

No.

[Mike]

Really?

[Stugats]

He's not getting suspended.

[Dan Le Batard]

I think he gets suspended for that. I think he gets suspended for that. If it's a regular season of these 100%, we'll see. He's bought a lot of goodwill. You know the part of this is did Wemby really mean to do that? He seems so nice.

[Mike]

Sure look like it.

[Dan Le Batard]

He's benefiting from it even being a discussion. Terrible. Dude, that look. That was really bad.

[Tony]

Terrible.

[Dan Le Batard]

He should be suspended.

[Tony]

That should have been at the UFC 328 on Saturday night. That a spinning back elbow.

[Dan Le Batard]

Super dangerous now also he's so tall. Yes, that I'm not. But I can't make that excuse. Mas Reed is seven feet tall. I'm not gonna make that Excuse for him. Did he not mean it? His face looks so intentional.

[Mike]

Absolutely mental.

[Stugats]

I will say this. He absolutely meant to swing the elbow. But I'm with Mike on that.

[Dan Le Batard]

This.

[Stugats]

He's also of a height that when he swings his elbows, he's hitting a dude, most people at the top of the head, over the head. Usually when he's swinging his elbows, he's not hitting someone directly in the.

[Dan Le Batard]

Kind of gives a peripheral, like, oh, he's there.

[Jeremy]

Okay, good.

[Stugats]

Yeah. You want to try that word again?

[Jeremy]

Peripheral.

[Stugats]

Peripheral. I think you threw an eye in there.

[Dan Le Batard]

His face scared me a little bit. Like there was like some rage there.

[Stugats]

Who?

[Dan Le Batard]

Dylan Harper's?

[Stugats]

No.

[Dan Le Batard]

Wemby. Let's play it one more time. When he cocks that. That elbow back like that is. He means to do that.

[Mike]

He absolutely meant to do it.

[Dan Le Batard]

And he takes a look at, like the target.

[Stugats]

Again, I'm. No, I'm agreeing with you that he meant to hit him with an elbow. What I'm saying is he didn't mean to hit him where he hit him. Him with the elbow. He did not. I don't believe that he meant to hit him in the face, in the chin. He also seemed to be confused about what a flagrant two was.

[Dan Le Batard]

What a show. That was what a show.

[Tony]

You know everything about everything. You asked the gober about water filters, but you don't know if flagrant two kicks you out of the game. You've been in the NBA for three years. What are we doing?

[Mike]

He's never gotten a flagrant 2.

[Dan Le Batard]

He doesn't know what it means.

[Tony]

He's never been in a game where somebody's gotten a flagrant two before.

[Mike]

Well, but if it didn't.

[Dan Le Batard]

Exactly. Right, right.

[Stugats]

You think he's lying? Yes, so. But it's very clearly. But he didn't say it. They caught him. Hold on, hold on.

[Tony]

It was a performance, Dan.

[Stugats]

Come on, Tony. They didn't. They did also interview him, but you're objecting to his confusion. And he was caught in a private moment on the bench, turning to a teammate and saying, what happened? What's up? What's the flagrant to?

[Tony]

Guy in the neck and they're kicking you out of the game.

[Dan Le Batard]

This is. You're being fooled by the person's reputation. This is the Miles Garrett thing all over again. Miles Garrett got such a benefit of the doubt and to this day still does. And he was rage filled for one really ugly second that he is somehow quelled a little bit because everyone just wants to believe this is such a Nice guy. That was evil from Wemby. Thank you, Mike. This is why he's gonna become like the great super villain.

[Mike]

You think he might be evil?

[Dan Le Batard]

This is. I think he is, dude. I tell you, I'm enjoying this run.

[Mike]

Right.

[Dan Le Batard]

I kind of want to vanquish OKC at the moment. This is his only moment to be a baby face. This is like Survivor Series Deadly game where the Rock has a crowd right behind me. Fooled. Yeah. He has a crowd right behind him. We got a mega face right here. This is going to be incredible. And then he. He turns to the help of the McMahons to screw over.

[Mike]

I was shook.

[Dan Le Batard]

Mankind.

[Mike]

I did not see that coming. To Tony. You're telling me that this is the same thing that Wembanyama. I know you've been on his case.

[Tony]

Evil.

[Mike]

You. You think Wambuyama could be evil?

[Tony]

Yes, that's what I've been trying to tell you. He does. He says all these things to make sure that. Oh, wow, he's. He's so conscious about whatever. You're not conscious about a crazy elbow you're throwing neck.

[Mike]

This changes everything. If true.

[Stugats]

Let's listen to the spurs coach Mitch Johnson defending Wembing in general.

[Mitch Johnson]

I do think it's. It's getting to a point that it's. If the people that are in charge of controlling the game and protecting the physicality of the game don't do that, then at some point he's going to have to protect himself. We've been asking him to do that now for a while. So that call him Glenn Nasri was okay and sound like the call was warranted, but in terms of the game plan of every single team we face since that kid's. That young man's been in the league and the physicality that people try to impose on him and the lack of protection is really disappointing. At some level, it's starting to get actually disgusting. Just in terms of terms of when he tries to fight through things and be professional and mature and deal with some of that stuff. I'm glad he took matters in those old ends. Yeah. Not in terms of hitting Nazri, but I wouldn't be very clear about that. I'm glad Nazrid was okay and I didn't want him to elbow him, but he's going to have to protect himself if they're not. And I think it's disgusting.

[Mike]

Why does he got that Doc Rivers disease does. I get it.

[Tony]

You got to come out and help your. Your best guy, your face of the franchise. This is Embarrassing. This sound was embarrassing also.

[Dan Le Batard]

What. What are you arguing? Was it a mistake or what? Wasn't it because he's arguing that. That there's so much roughhouse going on with Wemby the whole season. He's 8ft tall. Doesn't mean you could just jump all over him. No, I know what he's saying there, but he gives the game away by saying exactly what you just said. He. He makes it seem even more intentional because this is a player. They play me physical. That's the only way that they tell me. We've been coaching him to defend himself. So this is what he does now. He took it into his own hands. He literally says that. Well, that's the intention behind it. And it was a direct elbow to a chin. That should be a suspension for at least a game.

[Mike]

I don't think he gets suspended.

[Stugats]

He did miss half of a game. He did miss or three quarters.

[Dan Le Batard]

Second quarter.

[Mike]

Two and a half quarters.

[Mitch Johnson]

Yeah.

[Stugats]

So here is Nick Wright agreeing with you. I'm not sure what I find more outrageous. He says Wemby, who once upon a time said he studied the rules of the All Star Game skills Challenge pretending he didn't know a flagrant two gets you ejected. Or his. His coach justifying the dirtiest, most dangerous play of the playoffs. This is the most dangerous, dirtiest play since when in the playoffs? Because you don't you see guys swinging elbows all the time in the NBA. You never see this. This is just something that does. Never mind the playoffs. You never have a star player ejected from a playoff game. A face of the league ejected from a playoff game. For a clearly dirty playoff. You can argue whether it's intentional or not. I don't actually think you should be arguing whether his reaction on the bench was sincere or not. I think he was confused about the idea that he might get ejected. I don't think he expected to get ejected.

[Tony]

I think the last time I think of a big elbow was when Ron Art has dented James Harden's forehead.

[Mike]

But that was the end of the regular.

[Tony]

Hit him with the. Oh, was that. I thought that was first round me.

[Mike]

The suspension was seven games. It was one regular season game and then six playoff games.

[Tony]

Gotcha. So just missed it.

[Jeremy]

Yeah.

[Dan Le Batard]

On the superstar scale of intention, this is the second worst act in sports in French athletics history.

[Tony]

He didn't think it was getting a red card there, Dan.

[Mike]

I was trying to think of Boris

[Stugats]

Dia headbutting just randomly.

[Dan Le Batard]

A chill just went down my spine when he said Boris DL. I feel like I saw a gun ghost.

[Stugats]

My favorite part about the Zinedine Zidane situation is that soccer players, even when fighting, don't use their hands. Like the idea that he went to the headbutt to be dirty.

[Dan Le Batard]

Not talked about enough.

[Stugats]

Well, the Wemby thing will be talked about plenty if the NBA does the shocking thing and knocks him out for another game.

[Mike]

The commissioner's on nothing.

[Tony]

They're too big into the Wemby thing. He's in Wemby's pocket. He had to do something, which is why he got taken out for the game for a flagrant, too. There is 0.0% chance that he misses a second.

[Dan Le Batard]

Can you imagine, like the letter, the note that Wemby's sending Adam Silver this morning. Tony. Oh, a plate of cheese.

[Tony]

Oh, Bordeaux wine.

[Dan Le Batard]

Get out of here. Calligraphy.

[Stugats]

Put it on the poll. Is there a 0.0% chance that Wemby is suspended for one more second?

[Tony]

Second.

[Dan Le Batard]

Iota.

[Mike]

One.

[Tony]

One iota of a second for one more.

[Stugats]

You guys would be shocked by that, correct? You guys shot.

[Dan Le Batard]

Suspended. Yes.

[Stugats]

But it's dirty enough to. I think it's dirty enough to warrant that. Like, I wouldn't have a huge objection if you guys. If all of a sudden the news was Wemby's also going to end up missing the next game because this was so flagrant. And you can. You simply cannot have something this dirty being in any way condoned.

[Mike]

All right, so here's the question. If it was Draymond Green or Dylan

[Dan Le Batard]

Brooks, easily prison, the reputation. And that's exactly what's happening here. Just on the other side. His reputation is making this a discussion and a very sincere chance that he gets to escape it because everyone agrees he seems like a good guy. That's how they get you.