Hour 1: The Little Doubt Monster (feat. Elle Duncan)

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz

Episode: Hour 1: The Little Doubt Monster (feat. Elle Duncan)
Date: January 29, 2026
Setting: Elser Hotel, Downtown Miami
Main Guests: Elle Duncan

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Episode Overview

This episode explores the mental and emotional dynamics of high-stress live sports broadcasting, personal transitions in sports media careers, and the ethics of televising risky stunts. Featured guest Elle Duncan (recently transitioned from ESPN to Netflix and more) recounts her experience as the lead host at the Netflix live broadcast of "Skyscraper Live" (Alex Honnold’s skyscraper climb). The hosts and Elle dive into topics ranging from anxiety and professional reinvention to the unique moral calculus that surrounds “must-watch” death-defying televised events and the workplace tolls in high-level media. Interwoven are signature show tangents on pop culture, sports pain thresholds, and TV favorites.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Televising Danger: The Anxiety of Broadcast

• The team reacts to the rise of ultra-risky live events, such as Alex Honnold’s free solo skyscraper climb, and how these broadcasts push the boundaries of human fascination and queasiness.
• Tony admits that watching daredevils fills him with anxiety and doubts about the ethics of "must-watch" live danger:
  “Watching others do that makes me queasy. It seems flippant about life.” (00:23)
• Jeremy and Chris Cody joke about the learning curve/dangers in extreme sports:
  “Let’s try that for the first time.” (00:43)

Elle Duncan Recounts Receiving the “Death Card”

• Elle details the surreal moment five minutes before “Skyscraper Live” when producers handed her a card with prepared remarks in case Honnold fell to his death:
  Elle Duncan:
  “It was the first time that someone, five minutes before broadcast, handed me a card that was like, if this person falls off the building, here’s what you're gonna say, and then we’re gonna get off air.” (32:38)
• The show’s hosts and Elle discuss the EMOTIONAL toll and ethical complexity of narrating such events live, with the ever-present “little doubt monster" (her term) of what if?

2. Inside the Mind of a High-Pressure Host

Elle’s Career Change and Its Emotional Fallout

• Elle candidly shares why she left ESPN—the comfort of familiarity and a heavy workload—for Netflix’s new creative freedom (30 workdays a year vs. 250 at ESPN):
  Elle Duncan:
  “There was definitely that little doubt monster that was like, you know, you could work here forever and be fine… But Netflix was just giving me sort of all the things that I had been asking for in the universe, which was more time with my family, more time to sit and just be a creative…” (27:49)
• She describes the corporate/media culture at ESPN as “feeding the addiction” of workaholics:
  “If you are a workaholic, [ESPN] will feed your addiction, right? ...ESPN tried their best…but it netted out at about 250 days a year. And Netflix was 30.” (30:01)

Anxiety, Self-Criticism & Growth

• Despite confident on-air presence, Elle reveals high-functioning anxiety and moments of panic off camera:
  “I’m a high-functioning anxious person…It’s honestly what sent me to therapy…giving me panic attacks a couple years ago…” (31:42)
• After “Skyscraper Live,” Elle was self-critical upon review, admitting she was “at a ten” (adrenaline/anxiety) for the entire show:
  “When I went back and watched it, I was like, oh man. I started out ten, and then I just stayed at a ten…” (32:38)
• She discusses the delicate balance between “being hard on myself” and taking real feedback when trying new things, especially when social media criticism is involved:
  “You’re never as good as they say you are...never as bad as they say you are.” (38:04)

3. Sports Pain Threshold: How Much Are We Willing to Sacrifice for Glory? (07:00–10:55)

• Dan leads a deeper conversation about the cost of glory in sports—“the price of pain” for athletes. The crew considers the normalcy of injuries in football and contrasts emotional and physical pain. “Do you ever think at all about what you would trade in terms of pain in order to have those things that just about everybody wants?” (08:49)

• They compare Alex Honnold’s (reported $500,000) payday for the climb to other sports salaries—and acknowledge that these daredevils think about consequences differently than “the rest of us.”

• Chris Cody humorously admits:
  “I did spring football and I was like, this hurts. My coach sucks. I’m out.” (10:12)

4. Pop-Culture Tangents: TV’s Most Rewatchable Shows (14:42–19:00, 20:43–23:59)

• The crew debates the most "rewatchable" TV, bouncing among The Sopranos, Seinfeld, The Office, Always Sunny in Philadelphia, Modern Family, and others.
  • Tony:
    “…there's been in my lifetime a more rewatchable show than The Sopranos. It's just very easy to check in at any point.” (14:43–16:26)
  • Elle Duncan:
    “I think for me, the best rewatch was The Office…they live individually, but then…you watch…a long narrative, Michael falls in love, then falls out of love…” (18:23)
• Zaslo confesses watching The Sopranos as an adult made him realize "Tony Soprano was a real piece of..."
  “…watching it now again, I guess because I’m 20 years older and like, I’m a real grown up. He is a really, really bad person.” (18:01)
• Hilarious aside: Elle calls Chris Cody “Greg” by mistake, to everyone’s amusement. (26:26–26:37)

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• Elle Duncan on The “Death Card”:
  “It literally was like...‘We’ve experienced a fall and so we’re going to cut the livestream right now and we’ll update you as soon as we can on Alex’s condition.’” (35:21)

• Elle on never having done anything quite like Skyscraper Live:
  “It’s not like anything I’ve ever done...There were real implications of death, like true ones. It was the first time… someone, five minutes before broadcast, handed me a card…” (32:38)

• Dan on physical pain in sports:
  “…just very simply, you’re making a tackle and your hand gets caught between helmets…All their fingers are, like, sideways. They can’t hold change…That happens all the time in football.” (07:00–08:49)

• Elle on her career jump:
  “Netflix was just giving me sort of all the things that I had been asking for in the universe…” (27:49)

• Tony summarizing the ESPN/Netflix work contrast:
  “…it netted out at about 250 days a year. And Netflix was 30. Yeah, like absurd.” (31:10)

• Elle on being her own harshest critic:
  “…as I’m moving into a stage where I’m going to be trying new things, I have to give myself real feedback...” (38:41)

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Timestamps — Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment Description | |-----------|--------------------------------------------------------------------| | 00:07 | Opening banter about danger in extreme sports | | 02:17 | The tension/anxiety of televised daredevil acts (“death card”) | | 05:48 | Dan interviews Darren Waller on football pain/career difficulties | | 07:00 | Discussion: the cost of physical and emotional pain for glory | | 14:42 | Debate: TV’s most rewatchable shows (Sopranos, Seinfeld, etc.) | | 27:49 | Elle Duncan on leaving ESPN for Netflix and “the little doubt monster” | | 30:01 | Workaholic culture at ESPN and the math of work-life balance | | 31:42 | Elle’s anxiety, panic attacks, and approach to feedback | | 32:38 | The surreal preparations for Skyscraper Live and live-event anxiety | | 35:21 | Elle reads the “death card”—what to say if disaster struck | | 41:31 | Behind-the-scenes: insuring live stunts (Lloyd’s of London!) | | 42:01 | Elle’s second most nerve-wracking moment as broadcaster |

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Flow & Tone

• Informal, self-deprecating, honest. There’s always a blend of sports gravitas, gallows humor, and vulnerable reflection with Dan, Stugotz, and Elle.
• The group often pivots quickly between life-or-death stakes, pop culture, and wrestling nostalgia—lacing genuine insight with comic relief.

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Conclusion

This episode offers a rare look into the emotional mechanics and ethical ambiguities behind live sports broadcasting—especially when literal lives hang in the balance. Elle Duncan’s candor about career risk, anxiety, and vulnerability, plus the crew’s own confessions about fear, ambition, and the things we do (or watch) for glory, make for a nuanced, empathetic, and often funny hour.

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“I have the spine for this, Dan. Which is the only reason that I'm willing to put myself in a position to keep trying things I’ve never done before and seeing if I’m any good.”
— Elle Duncan (39:15)

Transcript

[Dan LeBatard]

This is the Dan Levatar show with the Stugats podcast.

[Stugats]

Al Michaels is going to join us here later in the show. Elle Duncan as well. She hosted that Skyscraper Live event on Netflix. And I got to think that most humans have the same reaction that I do. Except for those daredevil types. I don't know what is the name of that sport where people I don't know how you get good at this dive off the side of the mountain with wings and a GoPro. The squirrel suit and then. Yeah, the squirrel suit. And then just fly along the side of a mountain. Watching others do that makes me queasy. It seems flippant about life.

[Chris Cody]

I also have no idea how you get good at that base jumping.

[Tony]

Yeah, let's try that for the first time.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah. You know, like in other sports. Like missed that shot. Let's keep working. I don't know how. I don't. Seems like a pretty high stakes game. Bucket punishment.

[Stugats]

It's not like Tom Brady getting better with reps at broadcasting.

[Elle Duncan]

Hey, kb, can you help me here.

[Stugats]

Put on this squirrel suit?

[Zas]

Like when does the chance. I think you're ready.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yeah.

[Chris Cody]

Feels like you gotta be pretty sure.

[Stugats]

I don't know that all of you have the same feeling, cuz I haven't talked to you about any of this. But I assume that most people who are not adrenaline junkies or daredevils when they see the guy from Free Solo, Alex Hanold, walk. And it's fairly safe for him because he's this good at it, he's not actually fearing death, even though his family fears death and there is the possibility of death. I also meant to ask Samson. I don't know how you get something like that insured. It seems impossible to put something like that on live television and have a zero percent chance that you're not going to be televising a live death in a way that we've never seen on television.

[Chris Cody]

Well, we'll ask Seth Rollins.

[Stugats]

But him climbing that skyscraper, when I see the wind blowing his shirt and I see no ropes and no protection devices, I'm filled with a queasiness that makes me not want to watch it. Like I'm not the daredevil nature of it. Like, I understand that it gets people to tune in, but it's exactly the reason I don't want to tune in. I don't want to feel like that when watching something.

[Zas]

I'm looking forward to talking to Elle because she relayed an anecdote where she says five minutes before they went live on Netflix the producer handed her a card of what she's to say if he falls and dies.

[Elle Duncan]

Ooh, I like that. I was gonna ask her about that five minutes before.

[Chris Cody]

What was Seth gonna say?

[Stugats]

We can't do an ad read if we're handed it five minutes before.

[Chris Cody]

That's wild. Look, I saw it on mute, so I don't.

[Stugats]

I would.

[Chris Cody]

I would love to know how that went, because I imagine a lot of personal stories. But is there, like, two and a half hours of also, like, he's still going?

[Tony]

No, no, it was. It was 90 minutes total. They're at. At points talking to him throughout it.

[Chris Cody]

Oh, really?

[Tony]

The scariest part. And then there are some people in the climbing game. I'm watching it. I meet everyone. I'm watching with. We are stressed. So, like, this. It looks scary as. But climber people on the Internet, I've seen videos of, like, compared to rock climbing. This is like climbing a ladder. Like, there are. There are people out there that. This was super easy and that for him, he wasn't stressed with this then.

[Chris Cody]

I mean, Seth knows about that.

[Stugats]

Elle couldn't talk to him at the top, which makes for an.

[Tony]

They lost interviews.

[Stugats]

Yeah. Well, but when you. How does it feel?

[Tony]

The scariest moments were when he would take a break and, like, go to the edge and just kind of, like, lean over and look.

[Zas]

Isn't the whole thing an edge?

[Tony]

No, but, like, because there were parts where you get to, like, he got to, like, lofts. There were, like, 10 different parts where you. You climb up something scary, and then you're on a loft and you have to climb up again. So there would be times where he could just kind of stop. Stop and rest. And those were the scariest parts. He would literally go right up to.

[Dan LeBatard]

The edge where he wasn't edge.

[Chris Cody]

It was Seth Rollins.

[Tony]

Yeah.

[Stugats]

I'm looking forward to talking to Al Michaels as well. Later in the show, I got to talk to Darren Waller for South Beach Sessions. It came out today. And you guys make fun of me for the tissues and stuff, but one of the things that we're aspiring to do with. With South Beach Sessions, and this clip will not indicate it, the rest of it will, is to get to a vulnerable place with people who are happy and willing to do so because they care to share their story. Now, if you don't know Darren Waller's story, it has addiction in it. And also, he was really. He went dark during his divorce as a whole lot of people made fun of him because he made a music video trying to express himself about the hurt in that divorce. And to me, it's super interesting to see and hear someone built like that who plays like that. He's a mutant, right? Like, everybody wants a tight end like this, One of these guys who can run through the seam, and he can't be covered by smaller defensive backs because he's just too big and athletic. But he's. Here's Darren Waller talking about. And I'd like to see him back with the Dolphins for a number of different reasons, because he's good at football being chief among them. But here's Darren Waller talking about the Dolphins and what the prospects might be for him returning next year. He was the one in the middle. I should remind people of the exit meeting when. When Mike McD was fired by Steven Ross. And that exit meeting ended in both Darren Waller's exit from the season and Mike McDaniel's exit from the building. This season was a bit of a disaster. Not for you, but for the team. Right. Everybody gets fired. And I don't. I don't even know what your relationship right now is with football. If you're. If you want to play again, if you want to play for the Dolphins, like, if you've gotten to the place where. No, that was. Imagine. Imagine how many touchdowns I could have if I wasn't just coming off the couch because I didn't know that I needed to do this a little better.

[Darren Waller]

Yeah. Yeah, I'm. I'm definitely. Yeah, that's definitely a lot of what I've been thinking. Like, throughout the season, there was kind of, like, I could feel myself drifting back and forth between. Like, I feel like I could do this for however long. And then it's like, you know, the injuries and the frustrations are like, I can't keep doing this to myself and floating back and forth. So now is, like, the time that I have to sit with both parts, kind of have, like, a board of directors meeting with both parts of me and be like, okay, like, what. What are we doing here? Like, let's look at the pros and cons of each of these directions, and we can make a decision from there. But playing football again and starting to lay the foundation, going somewhere, investing in my training with professionals that can direct my performance and have me be able to take on that load is something that I'm considering. But, yeah, this is a time for me to kind of reflect on that.

[Stugats]

This time of season is exactly when not to ask football players if they want to keep playing, because none of them do, because their Bodies are just busted up. And so Jeremy was saying earlier that Drake may, in a human moment, is saying to Josh McDaniels, man, this is really hard. And McDaniels is saying, yeah, and all fulfilling things are hard. But I don't think any of us listening to this or even enjoying football sort of understand what price glory. Like, okay, I love the gladiator glory and the money. How much pain am I willing to endure daily when I get up? Because everything hurts and I don't want to actually go to work to go get what Sundays give me. You guys, I think about this a lot. Just in, like, just very simply, you're making a tackle and your hand gets caught between helmets. That is the most. Like, that happens all the time in football. All their fingers are, like, sideways. They can't hold change. They can't, like, turn a car on with keys. That's not automatic because of what happens to their fingers. Because a very small thing that they'd laugh you off the field if you came off the field for a dislocated finger. Like, that's not. They. They'd laugh you. You're not allowed to leave. You need to stay out there. Someone's going to take your job. Who will play with the fingers all busted up if you run off the field. Do you guys consider it all? I know we all think, man, that must be fun on Sundays or to play in the super bowl or to be at the height of that. The gladiator glory. Do you guys ever think at all about what you would trade in terms of pain in order to have those things that just about everybody wants? Because the longer they make these seasons. That college football season is crazy how long that is for college athletes. It's crazy that Indiana just won more games in a season than anyone since Yale in the 1890s, because nobody knew back then what the dangers of football were. And nobody knew back then what the commerce of football is, is that we all need more games. The whole point of it is not actually to measure and get a ch champion. The point of it is make sure the games are on television so that everybody gets their money right.

[Chris Cody]

What's the question again?

[Zas]

Yeah, like, are you asking how much physical pain I would endure for my team to win for glory?

[Chris Cody]

It's not just physical for the.

[Stugats]

No. For the. Yeah, it's not just physical pain for the gladiator glory. We all love the idea of playing in the super bowl is all. All of us would like to win the Super Bowl. Everybody listening to this would like to be the reason that the super bowl is won. And I'm asking you, how much pain are you willing to endure? Alex Hanold got paid $500,000 for what he did. It's not enough. It's. It's about $500,000. He was. I heard an interview with him where he's like saying, compared to what other people in sports are getting for this, it's ridiculous. But if he hadn't done it, somebody else would have. They wanted to get the most famous guy at this, and so they could get him really cheap for that. And I read him talking about how his wife feels about all it. She doesn't want him to do any of it free solo. The movie was a great movie because it wasn't just about him climbing a mountain. It was about her trying to climb the mountain of a relationship with a man who's crazy. And he goes out and he risks his life all the time. And she's worried about it all the time. And he doesn't worry about it as much because these people who do these things can't measure consequences the way the reason the way the rest of us do. And so we can't be them. It's not possible to be them. And so I'm literally asking you, Mike, how much pain would you be willing to endure for the things that you want the most? Physical pain? Mostly because I gotta think that's the worst pain there is in football. It's worse than the emotional pain.

[Chris Cody]

I don't know if I'm the right guy to ask. I did spring football and I was like, this hurts. My coach sucks. I'm out.

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[Dan LeBatard]

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[Chris Cody]

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[Dan LeBatard]

Stugats.

[Chris Cody]

He called him a bunch of P's and B's. He did the thing again, called him a bunch of P's and B's. And then boom. Five unanswered. You win the division.

[Dan LeBatard]

This is the Dan Levatar show with the Stugats.

[Tony]

You got me thinking now they should have had just a regular person climb that building. That would have been interesting.

[Chris Cody]

That would have been compelling.

[Zas]

Yeah.

[Chris Cody]

Like, can you imagine?

[Zas]

Imagine if Roy Roy, what if it's like the Hunger Games and they have, like, people lined up and they draw, like a number and you got to make.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah, no, that's something.

[Tony]

There's 500k. There's a bag. 500k at the top of the building.

[Chris Cody]

That's where Seth Rollins could really come in handy with analysis because, you know.

[Zas]

He'S grabbed the briefcase, the money in the couple times, Dan.

[Stugats]

Yeah, I. I got that twice.

[Chris Cody]

You remember the one in Santa Clara?

[Zas]

Yep.

[Chris Cody]

It was Roman Reigns versus Brock Lesnar.

[Zas]

How about I physical battle. How about. I was there this past summer when he returned and he cashed in on.

[Chris Cody]

And he threw out the.

[Zas]

The crutches. He fooled everyone. I was there.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah, you were there.

[Zas]

I was there. I sat ringside.

[Dan LeBatard]

What a pop, huh?

[Zas]

Best night of wrestling I've ever been to.

[Tony]

Wow.

[Stugats]

How many nights of wrestling have you been to?

[Ad Read Announcer 2]

A lot.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah. A couple dozen, I'd say. But you weren't at the WrestleMania where Seth cashed in.

[Darren Waller]

Nah.

[Chris Cody]

He's got the two best cash ins, right?

[Zas]

He does, yeah.

[Chris Cody]

What's your top five cash ins?

[Zas]

Ooh. Wow. Well, those two for sure.

[Chris Cody]

Let's do this.

[Zas]

Yep, let's do it.

[Chris Cody]

Well, that's not how you do it. You don't say those two for sure and then make it a three. Yeah, I'll give you time. Okay.

[Stugats]

In the interim, I would like to talk to you about what you have been doing recently with your television viewing habits, because I don't know if there is a more rewatchable show. I love Breaking Bad. There are any number. I love the Wire. I love a lot of television, But I don't know that there's been in my lifetime a more rewatchable show than the Sopranos. It's just very easy to check in at any point. Like you could do. I've done it twice now, and I've been tempted to do it a third time because. Yeah, because it's just so easy to watch. And it's fascinating to see ground zero on television for the entire genre of suits and all these other shows where the people can be bad and you're still rooting for the bad people. Like, to my recollection, it started there as an art form. And I've told the story before. Right. David Chase tells the story. And spoiler alert to any of you have not seen the Sopranos. That it was very close to ending after season one, and he had to fight like hell thinking it was gonna. Because he's saying, no. Soprano. Tony Soprano needs to Kill someone on screen. He needs to be a murderer for me to tell the rest of this story. I want to test people and see if they'll root for a murderer for the rest of this story. And hbo, which pushes all the limits, did not want him to do that. And the show almost died after one season because of that. And so I can always watch. I'll always stop on an episode of the Sopranos if it's just. If I'm. I don't do much scrolling anymore, but if I'm scrolling, I will stop.

[Zas]

So two nights ago, I just finished my first ever rewatch of the Sopranos. All right. I've been watching it again over, like, the past month and a half, two months. And I got through the whole thing two nights ago, and I hadn't seen it. Like, you know, I'll stop every now and then. Like, you know, if it's a marathon, I'll watch an episode here and there, but I just watch it straight through again for the first time in probably 20 years. All right? And I'll tell you, I had a very different experience with that show this time around, obviously. Incredible show. That's not going to change. But two things stood out the most to me. Number one, the show is really funny. And I guess I didn't notice how funny it was the first time around because the first time around, I'm in my 20s watching and just. I don't know.

[Stugats]

And it's discovery. You're seeing something for the first time and you're not used to something like that being funny, so you wouldn't expect it.

[Elle Duncan]

You can't rewind it back then.

[Tony]

If we're talking, like, rewatchable. The goat of rewatching. You got to go lighter. You guys are going way.

[Chris Cody]

I don't trust.

[Tony]

Give me Seinfeld.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah.

[Tony]

Every day of the week.

[Zas]

Oh, I don't like re watching comedy.

[Tony]

I've never done the modern day is Modern Family the modern Seinfeld. I can put Modern Family any episode.

[Zas]

No, I want to watch the story. If I'm rewatching, I'm watching a story again.

[Chris Cody]

Oh, by the way, Seinfeld, that's the.

[Stugats]

Original rooting for bad people.

[Zas]

Well, so. So two things that I noticed again, watching Sopranos. Number one, the show's really funny. And number two, and this is more. So what stood out to me, I mean, I obviously knew it because he's a mob boss and that's what the show is about. It's about Tony and he's a mob boss and everything that Comes with it.

[Elle Duncan]

Thank you, Zeus.

[Zas]

But I, I. Tony Soprano was a real piece of.

[Tony]

And you reform. That was like the thing about that show.

[Zas]

Yeah. And the first time watching it's like, yeah, like I'm obviously rooting for him and I like this character and I, I don't want bad things to happen to him. And watching it now again, I guess because I'm 20 years older and like, I'm a real grown up.

[Stugats]

He.

[Zas]

He is a really, really bad person.

[Elle Duncan]

I think for me, the best rewatch was the Office. You can kind of put they, they live individually, but then as you watch them as an as a long narrative, Michael, you know, falls in love, then falls out of love, has a marriage that ends it, and then goes to find his love somewhere else in Colorado. Like that narrative and that story arc kind of goes with all these different permutations of the story and then comes back to like tell that one main story.

[Dan LeBatard]

For me, it's Grubs and the evolution of JD's character and his friendship with Turk and his.

[Tony]

We go comedies as.

[Zas]

I don't get it. I would never rewatch a comic goat of rewatchable.

[Tony]

This goat conversation is presented by Frank's Red Hot. Make every dish the greatest. Eat the goat.

[Chris Cody]

That was a good sigh.

[Dan LeBatard]

I mean, that was a good sigh.

[Chris Cody]

He's been bad today.

[Zas]

Wow.

[Chris Cody]

He's been really bad.

[Tony]

And he's known it because he just leaves. That never happened.

[Zas]

That's twice today.

[Tony]

He just left.

[Chris Cody]

He wore that one. I'm gonna write a note down.

[Dan LeBatard]

Okay.

[Chris Cody]

Not one thing in particular. It was just overall, on the balance of the day, he was bad. Jeremy J E Hot.

[Tony]

That's a show I don't want to rewatch, Jeremy.

[Stugats]

I want. I want to talk about a couple of the things that you guys just brought up there. Put on the poll, please, at lebatard show Juju is the Sopranos really funny, but when you talk about character evolution, one of the things you will find interesting if you rewatch the Sopranos is how much James Gandolfini changed the character from the first season to the sixth. When I've read things about this Soprano, Gandolfini was very insecure and didn't think it was working and thought he was bad the first season as he was trying to find what the character had to be because they were reinventing television. But the thing that you guys are doing, while I understand, is a different conversation than the one that I'm having. All of the things you guys have mentioned are exactly what it is. That you check in on, and you're right when you call it light. If you just want a quick 20 minutes of something you don't want to invest in something large, something that takes an investment of days or series. Just give me 20, 30 minutes of something and let me just have my cotton candy and be done with it. And I understand the Sopranos is not neat and tidy like that.

[Chris Cody]

That's Heav. I like it's always sunny. There's a. There's an it's always sunny in Philadelphia rave coming to town in, like, two days.

[Dan LeBatard]

Oh, wow.

[Chris Cody]

I'm interested in that day. Man with a beat drop. You kidding me?

[Stugats]

Isn't there a big three championship celebration block party around here somewhere? We need to end up at some of these places, like the weird things.

[Chris Cody]

That you need a little bit more access. Come on, now. You're the big three. I need to be. You need to get the talk. We need to rub elbows with the people.

[Zas]

Wait, a buttermilk.

[Chris Cody]

Katie Meyer night. You know, I need to get guaranteed access to Mario.

[Elle Duncan]

Michael Beezy is gonna be there. Dan, I need to talk to MB.

[Stugats]

It's a block party.

[Chris Cody]

They're doing a block party in Coconut Grove. They're getting their rings.

[Elle Duncan]

Kudos.

[Zas]

You know, a ring ceremony.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yeah.

[Chris Cody]

This is hometown usa. Are you not aware, Tony, did you.

[Stugats]

Say kudos or barracudas?

[Zas]

No, no.

[Dan LeBatard]

Kudos.

[Elle Duncan]

That's what I call it.

[Dan LeBatard]

Kudos.

[Stugats]

I thought you were giving them kudos. No tipping your ship.

[Tony]

Courtyard.

[Elle Duncan]

It's a beautiful street that they blocked off, so now you can walk, get dogs.

[Chris Cody]

You got big picnic training. Mario Chalmers, Michael Beasley, Reggie Evans. You can ask him about, you know, getting hit by Chris Paul. There's a lot of questions that I would have, but I need guaranteed access again. It's Katie Meyer.

[Darren Waller]

Knight.

[Stugats]

Put it on the poll, please. Since we only have four categories. Give me the four categories it is that we're choosing. Most rewatchable thing. The Sopranos, the Office, Always Sunny. Give me a fourth.

[Tony]

Seinfeld.

[Stugats]

Seinfeld.

[Elle Duncan]

Seinfeld's a good one.

[Tony]

Seinfeld is just one of the most.

[Elle Duncan]

Greatest show of all time.

[Tony]

I think it would be the word association for most people. Rewatchable.

[Chris Cody]

Seinfeld, Ken Burns, baseball.

[Stugats]

Who was that character?

[Dan LeBatard]

I will watch that.

[Chris Cody]

That's unwatchable. It's Royce.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yep. That's mine.

[Zas]

Here's why I object to the Seinfeld rewatch. And by the way, Seinfeld, I think, is the greatest show of all time.

[Stugats]

All right.

[Zas]

I love Seinfeld Be careful where you're going. I've seen every episode a hundred times, but I've never sat and said, all right, season one, episode one and bang through all of them. That's binge like that. Nobody does that.

[Chris Cody]

No, you want specific episodes.

[Zas]

Right?

[Stugats]

Like you got. That's because you guys seem to be having a different conversation. Right. What Chris is doing is just what do I want to chew on that? That doesn't have to have any reference to before or after.

[Zas]

What I'm doing is not what I'm talking.

[Tony]

What I'm doing is what do I rewatch the most.

[Stugats]

No, but what. What Zaz is doing, you're going to beginning to end on six seasons of television.

[Zas]

I devoted a month and a half of my time.

[Tony]

I just did that with Shameless, if that's what you're asking.

[Stugats]

Yeah, that is what that is. That is what he's asking. It's a different conversation. You're just saying, what do I like to just check in on that's empty that I can watch for 20 minutes? No, ZAZ is saying, what am I willing to invest a month and a half in every time I'm stopping to watch television? I' back to see the chronology of this Seinfeld's. Not that none of these other things. You guys have sex.

[Chris Cody]

Is that I'm the only one.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yep.

[Stugats]

You're not the only one. I loved sex.

[Chris Cody]

It's the writing. That's what I tell everybody.

[Tony]

Six feet under.

[Stugats]

You're not the only one. I liked sex.

[Elle Duncan]

Did you like the new one?

[Stugats]

No, it's terrible. The new one.

[Elle Duncan]

My wife was very upset about the new God awful.

[Chris Cody]

So disappointing.

[Stugats]

So. And they. They keep re upping it. Like they keep doing it and it's terrible. It's. It's so. It's such an offensive remake from Miranda.

[Elle Duncan]

I watch occasionally when my wife watches and I'll be in the kitchen and watch him like, this sucks. Right?

[Stugats]

I have a lot of questions for Elle Duncan. I have missed her. She has left SportsCenter because this is what she wanted to be doing something that was different. Had more free time around it. Not a lot of people understand the amount of work that's required in Bristol.

[Chris Cody]

Did I just get convinced by a sponsor to have an engaging conversation which I had conviction.

[Dan LeBatard]

Whoa.

[Elle Duncan]

By the way, really quick on the aside. Second seat in Sopranos where they had AI of Tony's mom. I didn't love that one.

[Stugats]

You haven't gotten great yet. At what is my inner monologue. You haven't Gotten great at the old guy watching?

[Chris Cody]

No, I'm workshopping. I need a voice modulator for it. It's too. I need a very girly voice for your inner monologue, so I'm gonna make that happen.

[Dan LeBatard]

Mine was good, though.

[Stugats]

Why very girl? He burned his bones. That was not good, him being an old guy.

[Chris Cody]

You ever watch wings?

[Elle Duncan]

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[Chris Cody]

For weeks, months even, during the regular season, I wondered aloud what Kevin Stendland did. And then about three weeks ago, it hit me.

[Dan LeBatard]

Stugats.

[Chris Cody]

He gives them one of these, and he gives them one of those.

[Dan LeBatard]

This is the Don Levatar show with the stugats.

[Elle Duncan]

Hey, what's up, Greg? There she is.

[Stugats]

Yeah, Greg is not here. That is Elle Duncan, I think, talking to Chris Cody and calling him Greg.

[Elle Duncan]

Oh, hey, what's up, Greg?

[Stugats]

And Chris Cody is still reeling from it. It's probably not fair. El Duncan has ascended, not unlike Alex Henold, to the heights of our world.

[Tony]

Her climb a little tougher, though.

[Stugats]

Yeah. And, yeah, more obstacles. More white, white men to get in the way.

[Elle Duncan]

You got a speed bump with Hanold, right? I've seen you do it a couple times.

[Chris Cody]

You kind of slow down a little.

[Elle Duncan]

Hanold. It's very British.

[Stugats]

Thank you, Elle, for supporting me. Unlike these clowns who have been around me for 20 years, who look like for any spot to Be Piranha. I appreciate your support.

[Dan LeBatard]

You're welcome.

[Stugats]

She's the former longtime ESPN anchor. She's now the lead host at Netflix. She's also going to be doing USA Network's inaugural season of the WNBA coverage for 2026 alongside our friend, the great Renee Montgomery. Thank you for being on with us. Before we get to what it is that you did with Alex Hanold and Skyscraper, can you take us through your last couple of months moving places and leaving espn? What was the difficulty of that and what wasn't the difficulty of that?

[Elle Duncan]

Well, the tough part was the people. Because, you know, I really do try to make family wherever I. So I. I've genuinely made family with a lot of people that I worked with. And I loved doing women's basketball with Dre and Cheney. Like, that was incredibly fulfilling. And I think, like, the tough part is leaving what's familiar and stability. You know, like, I have an entire family. I'm 42 years old. And there was definitely that little doubt monster that was like, you know, you could work here forever and be fine. You know, I wasn't unhappy. And I think sometimes, like, it's harder, it's very easy to leave something that you hate, that you're miserable, someone throws you a lifeline, you'll take it. It doesn't matter what it is. And that was really not the case. And sometimes that's more difficult. So I spent a lot of time, like, introspecting, asking questions, going to therapy, praying, like, doing all the things that people say, all the typical stuff. But I would say that the not hard part was that Netflix was just giving me sort of all the things that I had been asking for in the universe, which was more time with my family, more time to sit and just be a creative, you know, and like, try to think of things. And more time to pursue things that were sports and sports adjacent and the ability to just have, like, a little bit more autonomy over the spaces and projects that I took on. And so it was very easy when, you know, I got my contract offer and they were like 30 days of work. It was like, hell, yes. And that was, you know, that. That was. That was the easy part.

[Stugats]

So.

[Elle Duncan]

But it's been, you know, really interesting when you leave something like espn, you have a lot of existential, like, build up, I think a lot of anxiety. But I gotta be honest, Dan, like, it's been so surprisingly wonderful, the time with my family, but also the idea that, like, people were watching you that you didn't know were watching you. People want to work with you that you didn't think ever would. There's all these doors that are opening all of a sudden. And so, you know, so far, early returns are that, like, I made the right decision.

[Stugats]

Tell me about the anxiety monster and tell me about the. Whatever specifics you can about 30 days versus how many days. Because I was just mentioning before you came on, people really don't understand Bristol as a furnace for. They will work you to the ground.

[Elle Duncan]

You work a lot. And I get it. They have a really big sports portfolio. And I think that there is this sort of understanding amongst talent that the more value that you have, the more volume that you take on, right? So, like, you got to take on more things. You got to take on specific things. That's how you get paid then once you get that contract, you know, so if you want more money where you have to justify it by doing more and doing more and doing more. And you know, let me be very clear, Like, I was not a victim. Like, they never forced me to do any of it. I did it. I chose to work all the time. I chose to take on more and more projects. I do believe that in many ways I'm a recovering workaholic. And a place like espn, if you are a workaholic, will feed your addiction, right? Like, there's all that you need there. So I'm no victim. Like, I chose to do it. All of us do. We can say no. But I just think, like, I looked at it and the best that ESPN knew, that work life balance was like, really important to me too. They tried their best in terms of, like, what they could do and still justify giving me this big pay raise. And it netted out at about 250 days a year. And Netflix was 30. Yeah, it's like absurd, Dan.

[Chris Cody]

It's your inner monologue. Just keep pushing, keep asking. She'll bash ESPN eventually and we'll get what we want. This is going really well. Some grief over there. Come on. I see it. Next question.

[Tony]

Come on, One more ESPN question. I think this is the one.

[Chris Cody]

Don't even say espn. Just hint at it. Let her say espn.

[Elle Duncan]

You can work through it. Cathartic.

[Chris Cody]

We can. Come on.

[Stugats]

The anxiety monster.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah, good one.

[Stugats]

I don't think of you as anxious.

[Elle Duncan]

Oh, yeah. Oh, I'm a high functioning anxious person. Really. I'm very anxious. I have a, A lot of anxiety. It's honestly what sent me to therapy because it was giving me panic attacks a couple of years ago. Very, very, very anxious. And I think all that Anxiety really showed up in Skyscraper, if I'm being honest. When I get anxious, I like, I talk fast, I talk through things and you know, I was, it was in a like a really like high cortisol like situation. And man, I was, I was feeling it, I was, I was amped, I was juiced.

[Stugats]

So take us through that experience with Skyscraper. Have you ever been. You're not that kind of anxious I would imagine. Cuz you're not televising Broad Live, you know, broadcasting live a possible death. That's why people are watching really. I mean it is that it's possible. And so take us through that. Compared to anything else you've ever done. Fun.

[Elle Duncan]

Yeah, it's not like anything I've ever done. I mean ever. Just because like, you know, when you do a pre game, like certainly I've had like sort of that, you know, you're doing something for the first time. You have all this like energy. You're like, and we're here, right? But you have commercial breaks. Like you have like time where you're not talking. And it really does sort of like lower some of that energy a little bit and get you in a sweet spot, right? Like you have time to like take a deep breath. I think in that situation. It was the first time that I was obviously covering something where there were real implications of death, like true ones. Ones. It was the first time that someone five minutes before broadcast handed me a card that was like, if this person falls off the building, here's what you're gonna say and then we're gonna get off air. And then I had honestly like built a rapport with Alex. I went out to his home, I like hung out with him and his wife. I played on the kitchen floor with his like little daughters. Like I had built an affection for him and it was like, you know, we all knew he was like in firm control of this. But you, anything can happen. We're in Taiwan. There could be an earthquake. Like there was just, just a lot of anxiety. And I think for me, like when I went back and watched it, I was like, oh man. I started out at a tin and then I just stayed at a tin like the entire, the entire time. So I think, you know, it was tough because like nothing like this has ever happened before. We really didn't know what the broadcast would look like. We didn't know, like there was no blueprint. So we were a little bit of like a science experiment, you know, and, and, and I think that we would all do things different, but I Think for me specifically, yeah, I would absolutely do it very differently if I, you know, had another crack at something like this. Although again, it's like, like when am I great that I took some notes down. Next time a guy climbs a skyscraper I'll know exactly how to compartment comport myself. But you know, I, I do hope that like, you know, my tone, which was, was definitely off, you know, I mentioned it a couple of times, like I was sort of broadcasting to the people that were there in the park with us, you know, that were loud and cheering and like into it and gasping and like there was so much energy. But when you go back and watch the broadcast right when you're the viewer, like there's none of that energy is coming through, only tension, you know, and only like drama and these beautiful scenes and this man dangling off a cliff. And like all of that was enough, you know. And so I went in with an objective to like teach the world about Alex Honnold. But like it just really wasn't necessary in that moment. And it's not something that you can know until you look back on it. And unfortunately, you know, like, it wasn't my best. I don't think I stuck the landing completely. But it was a really, really, really tough thing that I'd never done before and I was willing to, you know, take a chance and, and see, you know, how it would go. And, and so, you know, I'm proud of myself for that, for like doing something that had never been done before and just being a part of, you know, someone's history. Making climb like that was really cool.

[Chris Cody]

What did the card say?

[Elle Duncan]

It literally was like. What did it say? It was like we've experienced a fall and so we're going to cut the live stream right now. We'll update you as soon as we can on Alex's condition.

[Stugats]

That is an odd thing to give you for the first time. Five minutes before I knew we were gonna do it.

[Elle Duncan]

No, I knew we were gonna do it. It just like I, you know, it was sort of gonna be one of those things that they were gonna like pop in. We had a 10 second delay. We were gonna cut away to a wide shot. They were gonna pop this statement up in prompter. So I knew we were gonna do it. I just hadn't seen it right until like right before I was going on air. And it was like, just a reminder of like this is your card. If prompter doesn't get there, this is what you'll say. So it was just another sort of reminder and like, again, that has nothing to do with, like, you know, me being at a level that was just not sustainable for two straight hours. But. But, yeah, it was. It was a really high pressure situation in general. I also think that, like, it felt very celebratory. Like, again, the tension at home didn't feel that way there. It felt like Alex is, like, laughing and he's smiling and he's playing. The crowd is playing into him and they're waving on him. It just felt. Felt very different when I was there. And it was a reminder, like, you're not broadcasting for the, you know, 900 people that were in front of you, but rather for the 6 million people that were at home. So, you know, tough lesson to learn in front of the world, you know, but, like, it's okay. I've been dunked on before. But you're being very.

[Stugats]

You're being very critical and very hard on yourself. And as you do so. Zaslow is red faced with laughter from Tony something. Tony is.

[Zas]

I mean, Dan, how could. The update. Will update you as soon as we can again. How could the update on him fall and be anything other than death?

[Tony]

It's like he thought, well, because there were some ledges. There were times he was like, climbing and he was. And he could have fallen to an allege that wasn't all the way down.

[Elle Duncan]

Yes, that's exactly right, Chris. And he said that he was like, you know, at certain places in the building, I'm gonna. It would be certain death. But at some places he could fall on a ledge, a balcony. There were boxes. Like, there. There was a way that he could maybe live. But like, we all know, as you.

[Stugats]

Are red faced with laughter because you and Tony were doing show over there in which, like, the report is going to be like, we'll update you when he. When we come back on and you guys are saying, well, he splatter. He's 100. He fell 100 stories.

[Zas]

Okay, there's alleged. So he would hit his head on the way down.

[Elle Duncan]

I hit his head from 20 stories and stuff.

[Tony]

There were like. Like.

[Elle Duncan]

No, buddy, I get it. But if you fall from 20 stories, it's not.

[Tony]

No, you're right. They kept saying on the thing, they're like, I know you might think, but 100. Falling 100ft the same thing as falling from.

[Stugats]

You're being very hard on yourself. L. Are you normally this hard on yourself stuff, or is. Was the feedback bad? Like, I don't like what you're doing here. I thought that what I heard of what you were doing was great, but you're gonna have a higher standard for yourself than I am.

[Elle Duncan]

Yeah, I mean, I'm. I'm. I really do. Do not go to social media to, like, elicit feedback, because I just think, like, either way, people are always wrong. Like, you're never as good as they say you are. You're never as bad as they say you are. Right. But I. So I wanted to right away just go watch it. So once we got done with all our posts up, I went back and watched it, and right away I. I was like, oh, I was on a 10. And then, you know, like, yeah, like, people are sliding onto pictures and being like, oh, my God, you were so annoying. You were like, so. It's not like I'm like, doom scrolling on Twitter and, you know, and I'm not a masochist, like, seeing all the negative things that people are saying. But I. I mean, I am critical of my work, especially as I'm moving into a stage, Dan, where I'm going to be trying new things. I. You know, I didn't need to go break down an episode of Sports Center. I did it every day for 10 years. Like, right. But with things like this, like. Like, if I really want to grow and I want to get better and I want to try different things and I have to give myself real feedback, and that was my real feedback. Like, you know, a full acknowledgment that sometimes I think people are just mean for the sake of being mean. And there's things that I've done that people dunk on, and I stand on it, and I'm like, I don't care. I thought that was funny, or I liked it, or I don't care. But this was one of those where I was like, I could see. I could see. Like, I. I get it. You know, they're not.

[Dan LeBatard]

They're not.

[Elle Duncan]

They're not wrong. So. Yeah, but it's all good. Like, I don't. I have the spine for this, Dan. Right. Like, which is the only reason that I'm willing to put myself in a position to keep trying things I've never done before and seeing if I'm any good.

[Stugats]

Oh, I know.

[Elle Duncan]

I know.

[Stugats]

I know. You have the spine for it. It's why I'm surprised that you're anxious, because none of that presents on television. You are one of the most. Like you present as one of the most confident people I have seen in sports television. We don't have as much time with you as I'd like. Al Michaels is going to be on with us, and we've got Pitch Clock coming on later. El Duncan with us here. I have some fill in the blank questions for you because I have a ton of questions. How much did it freak you out communicating with Alex during the climb?

[Elle Duncan]

I asked him ahead of time, are you sure you want to talk to me? He was like, yeah. And like, in fact, we were only going to talk to him once. He was like, you just don't want to talk to me once. You don't want to talk to me more than that. I was like, if you want to talk more than that, that go for it. But it was cool.

[Stugats]

What percentage of chance did he think there was of him actually dying?

[Elle Duncan]

I don't know about percentage. He told me it was a six, probably in terms of difficulty of climb and. But physically, six out of 10. But in terms of, like, you know, physical difficulty, it was up there. I don't know. He probably would have put it at a less than 1% chance just because he was very confident.

[Tony]

Tell me, explain. Every floor, he seemed like there were people at the. Like, was that planned? Because I feel like that was. I was getting. I'm on my couch with my friends and I'm like, hey, stop distracting him. They're waving. They're trying to get his attention. That to me, felt like maybe that was like a crack in the production and, like, they weren't expecting people to get gathered there on every floor. He had, like, fan, like, fans cheering for him. It seemed very distracting.

[Elle Duncan]

He was fully aware. And when he did practice climbs, that is a public building. There's, like, businesses there. So he. He, like, knew he would climb and people would wave at him that whole time. So he knew and he enjoyed it. Like he said afterwards, he was like, I was. I tried to give a guy a high five, but he was too busy being on his phone. It was not distracting. He didn't know if it would be. He's never free solo something with people. But it was a public building, so, like, we didn't stage people there. They were just there.

[Chris Cody]

How many milligrams, Chris?

[Tony]

Oh, dude, I was so nervous.

[Stugats]

Do you have any idea how this event is insured?

[Chris Cody]

None.

[Elle Duncan]

But I will say this. I have a couple of times Googled Lloyd's of London because I feel like they're probably one of the only. It was. It was tough the. The chairman of the building, you guys. After it finished, she came up to the green room and she burst into tears when she hugged Alex because, like, her job was on the line. Like a lot of people's jobs were on the line a ton. I don't know how they made this happen, but they did. They could have never done it in the states. It's not, it's. It's just not. You can't get it insured there. So maybe some Taiwanese insurance. I don't know.

[Stugats]

What is the second most scared you've been for a broadcast?

[Elle Duncan]

The second most scared. Oh, that's a good one. You know what, Scared's not the right word, but I would say equally sort of like, you know, had to take a couple deep breaths. Was before the national championship, Caitlin Clark versus South Carolina. Just because I knew that thing was gonna pull a frickin number. And you know, we had had a lot of like attention, the big three and whatnot. And I just really felt a lot of pressure to perform, so. But again, when you're in situations that you've been in a million times, even when you're anxious, you just lean on experience. When you don't have any experience in that situation, you know, you don't have anything to lean on.

[Stugats]

Always nice seeing you. Thank you for making time for us. Don't make it so long next time. See you later.

[Elle Duncan]

Okay, bye.