Hour 1: Would You Die On That Hill? (feat. Jemele Hill)

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz – Hour 1: Would You Die On That Hill? (Featuring Jemele Hill)

Release Date: May 20, 2025

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From the vibrant Elser Hotel in Downtown Miami, Dan Le Batard and Stugotz engage in dynamic conversations revolving around sports, pop culture, and current events. In this episode, featuring guest Jemele Hill, the hosts delve into heated debates, fan behaviors, and introduce their interactive segment, "Would You Die On That Hill?"

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1. Introduction to Guest and Initial Banter (01:03 – 03:58)

Dan Le Batard opens the show with his signature enthusiasm, introducing the playful tension surrounding their upcoming guest, Dan Graziano.

• Stugotz (01:11): "I have been told that we have secured Dan Graziano. He will be joining us in about an hour so that Billy can accuse him to his face and Tony can accuse him to his face of lying about his workouts."

The hosts engage in light-hearted teasing about Graziano's fitness commitments, setting a humorous tone for the episode.

2. Jemele Hill on America's Support for New York Sports Teams (03:58 – 16:19)

Jemele Hill, a respected journalist and host of the podcast "Spolitics," provides an in-depth analysis of America's apparent favoritism towards New York sports teams, particularly the Knicks.

• Jemele Hill (05:17): "I think that people are similar to current healthba... Jane fine with that, but without supporting my base."

She explores the dichotomy between passionate fan bases and the media's role in shaping public support. Hill emphasizes the complexity of fan behaviors, especially highlighting incidents like trash-throwing at Brian Windhorst:

• Stugotz (07:33): "What do you want to know about the media, but don't know what people hate them enough."

Hill discusses how media personalities become easy targets for disgruntled fans, using Windhorst as a prime example.

3. Fan Behavior and Media Interactions (16:19 – 25:24)

The conversation shifts to broader themes of fan conduct, media influence, and the psychological impact on sports figures.

• Mike Ryan (07:50): "They put on your back. They should wear their hat, but they are also the symbol for ESPN."

The hosts debate the fairness of holding media figures accountable for team performances, with Jemele providing insights into the pressures faced by sports journalists.

4. Introducing "Would You Die On That Hill?" Game Segment (25:24 – 41:34)

The show transitions into an interactive segment where guests and hosts answer provocative questions, gauging their willingness to stand firmly on controversial opinions.

• Stugotz (32:46): "Is the median grandfather racist?"

• Jemele Hill (33:34): "I will die on the hill."

The game becomes a platform for spirited debates, touching on topics ranging from sports legends to cultural preferences like pineapple on pizza.

• Jamel Hill (35:15): "I would die on that hill. Pineapple on pizza is disgusting."

This segment highlights the hosts' and guest's strong stances on various issues, fostering engaging and sometimes humorous exchanges.

5. Deep Dive into Athlete Rivalries and Media Narratives (41:34 – 38:32)

Returning from the game segment, the conversation centers on athlete rivalries and how media narratives shape public perceptions.

• Jemele Hill (29:54): "When you bring in somebody's family, you're going to get a reaction."

She analyzes the dynamics between athletes like Angel Reese and Caitlin Clark, exploring the intersection of personal relationships and competitive sports.

6. Conclusion and Final Thoughts (38:32 – End)

As the episode wraps up, the hosts reflect on the discussions, emphasizing the importance of understanding the multifaceted nature of sports fandom and media representation.

• Stugotz (40:03): "I just can't see."

• Jemele Hill (41:20): "I just think that... I just think that every headline is just like, did you just jumble up a bunch of the strangest things that you could put together?"

The episode concludes with a blend of humor and thoughtful commentary, leaving listeners with plenty to ponder about the intricate relationships between sports, media, and fan culture.

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Notable Quotes:

• Stugotz (01:11): "I have been told that we have secured Dan Graziano. He will be joining us in about an hour so that Billy can accuse him to his face and Tony can accuse him to his face of lying about his workouts."

• Jemele Hill (05:17): "I don't know that to be the case, but I do know that generally speaking, American sports fans appreciate and like it when there is a new name that is in the mix to win a championship..."

• Jamel Hill (25:12): "I think that's what Ryan was trying to say. I'm not. I haven't talked to Ryan. I don't know."

• Jamel Hill (35:15): "I would die on that hill. Pineapple on pizza is disgusting."

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Conclusion:

This episode of The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz offers a compelling mix of sports analysis, cultural commentary, and interactive fun. With insightful perspectives from Jemele Hill and the hosts' trademark humor, listeners are treated to a rich exploration of what drives sports fandom and media narratives in today's landscape.

Transcript

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[Dan Le Batard]

This is the Dan Levatar show with the Stugats podcast.

[Stugotz]

I have been told, I have been told that we have secured Dan Graziano. He will be joining us in about an hour so that Billy can accuse him to his face and Tony can accuse him to his face of lying about his workouts.

[Dan Le Batard]

Falsehoods. No, I said I was more impressed by this than anything. I came in raving about Dan Graziano and his commitment to fitness. Tony's the one here calling him a liar.

[Jamel Hill]

I didn't say liar.

[Tony]

I said no, no, I said does he take liberties with the app sometimes here we sure does he maybe do it on a Christmas morning.

[Greg Cody]

He probably doesn't do a full peloton workout.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Come on.

[Stugotz]

So I'm saying I like that, Chris. Keep working on that. Just the shouting of backtracking truckers. Yes. When we, when we get, we secure a guest in an hour and all of a sudden the commentary, man, I've been watching stug do that one for years.

[Dan Le Batard]

What do you of calling Dan Graziano a liar about working out?

[Tony]

Never called him that.

[Dan Le Batard]

Are you jealous of like him being committed to fitness? Like, what is it? What's your problem with him?

[Tony]

I don't have a problem with him whatsoever. And I know what you're doing. Not going to fall for it.

[Stugotz]

Well, you did accuse him of lying about working out every day on his peloton and Greg Cody, I think said it was flatly bullshit, so.

[Billy]

No, I said he was a braggart.

[Stugotz]

Well, but you accused someone of bullshit again, there's backtracking everywhere.

[Dan Le Batard]

He said Skip was full of shit when he said he's only missed two days since 1982 and that he invented weightlifting. 1980, whatever.

[Stugotz]

Well, Jamel Hill can answer some of these questions. She knows some of these people involved. She's got new episodes of her podcast every week on iHeart. Spolitics. Or is it Spolitics? It's Spolitics.

[Jamel Hill]

No, it's politics. You said it right.

[Mike Ryan]

It's on Eric Spoelstracker.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Is it politics?

[Stugotz]

It's clearly Eric Spoelstra talks politics with Jamel Hill.

[Jamel Hill]

Exactly. The political analysis you've been dying to.

[Mike Ryan]

Hear right now, subscribing right now.

[Stugotz]

It's huge. You should see. Filipino Jackson is huge in the Philippines. This podcast is so popular. The politics of the Philippines they talk about. You can also subscribe to her YouTube channel at. It's Jamel Hill. She's a contributing writer for the Atlantic. And I've got a number of things to talk about with her and to play a new game because I don't think she knows this, but at the end at espn, whenever it is I was having an argument with any kind of executive, I would say, oh, I'm willing to die on that Jemele Hill. So we're going to play with Jemele Hill. Would you die on that Hill? In a moment. But can you tell me what America is rooting for in basketball here? Because I am deathly afraid that for one of the first times in my life, maybe since 9 11, I'm feeling America root for New York sports teams.

[Jamel Hill]

I think you would be right about that. I mean, we know the networks are certainly rooting for the Knicks to make this. But I mean, but I feel like a little bit of both because I do think that there is an element of fans or a faction of fans, I should say, who want to see something different, you know, who appreciate the fact that OKC not being from a major market or Minnesota not being in a major market, that, you know, Midwest, Southwest teams or even Indiana, the fact that somebody very non traditional can make it. And I realize the Knicks also have not been in this position in a long time. They haven't won a championship since the early 70s. But it feels like people are sort of ready for that, something different. But yeah, unfortunately the majority of people are rooting for the Knicks. It's a little hard for me. While I do understand and appreciate what Knick fans have been through, this is a very triggering to see them in this position because I'm a Pistons fan. So obviously I had to go through that series. And so seeing them experience in success is both good and Bad because part of it is that, like, the Pistons gave them a very tough series. On the other end of it is sort of like, you know, when you're, when your enemy makes it further, you naturally are disgusted by it. So I'm torn between two things here when it comes to the New York Knicks.

[Mike Ryan]

Okay, hold on a second. The league media certainly wants New York, but you're telling me we're watching videos of Knicks fans throw trash at other fans outside. They're throwing trash at Brian Windhorst walking out the arena. And the majority of people are, you think are rooting for New York?

[Jamel Hill]

I think a lot of people are. And by the way, Brian Windhorst, as you all know, who is one of the nicest human beings on earth. And for that to happen to him is really baffling. And it's sort of, I mean, it's definitely classless by the, by some of those Knicks fans. But. But yeah, I mean, I do, I think there are, there is a contingent of people who like seeing teams who haven't won in a long time generally win things. Now, I would be curious outside of New York, and I don't even know. I mean, I think the media is beating this drum of like, well, the Knicks haven't won since the early 70s, Mecca basketball, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I don't know that if you are a Laker fan or if you're in other parts of the country, if you give a shit that the Knicks win a title. Like, I don't know that to be the case, but I do know that generally speaking, American sports fans appreciate and like it when there is a new name that is in the mix to win a championship, because it typically gives those fans something to hope for in their own right, in their own regard, with their own teams.

[Stugotz]

I want to attack a couple of the things that she just mentioned there. Windhorst. I think one of the great underestimations of my lifetime has been knowing that people hate the media, but not knowing how much people hate the media. Like, I knew, I knew it was bad, but what they think of the media, if you're mad and you put Brian Windhorse in your tool hall of Fame, the inaugural member Jamel is correct when she says Brian Windhorse is regarded by others in this industry as one of the sweetest, fairest person persons who exist. And to have him thrown trash at only because he's a symbol for ESPN and they're. The Knicks are 0 and 8 on ESPN and they don't like Stephen A. Smith very Much because his fandom feels ban. Wagony and insincere. And so Wind Horse just becomes an easy person to be bullied.

[Mike Ryan]

No, I mean, look, I. I was. I. I'm very immature in general, and I. I did not like seeing that video. It really bothered me. I mean, okay, you put the. The fake microphone. I don't care who you want. Like, okay, and everybody has a good laugh, but, like, they're throwing trash in him as he's walking. That's garbage. I don't like that.

[Stugotz]

It is garbage. It's literally garbage.

[Mike Ryan]

I don't like it.

[Stugotz]

I don't know if you have any other thoughts on this, Jamel, but the point I wanted to make about New York being an underdog is you never see it. Maybe Isaiah Thomas, the player that size never gets to be the winner in that sport. That's not how that works. Jalen Brunson can't be the smallest player on the court and the biggest when it matters only Isaiah. Who else, other than Isaiah Iverson got a run at it. But you're just not allowed to be that size and win the championship in that sport.

[Jamel Hill]

But. But I think that adds to this idea about people rooting for the Knicks, that, you know, that America is pulling for the Knicks. It's like Jalen Brunson, I remember when, you know, he went to the Knicks, and there was a lot of questions about whether or not he deserved that kind of money. Like, why would a guy like this make this much money and be considered the star of this kind of franchise? And so, because he has that underdog story in his own right, combined with a major city that has not won a championship in a long time, I think it's fueling a lot of the fandom outside of New York that is there for the Knicks. And so, you know, I think he's. The trajectory of his career is just really fascinating because not only is he an underdog in terms of size, but I think he's very much an underdog in terms of how we think of who is supposed to be a star in the NBA. And he does not fit the criteria, the typical criteria that we are used to seeing, given what his trajectory in his career has been.

[Stugotz]

Zaz is right, though. You don't want these particular people to be louder. Halliburton has already bought tickets and is flying Pacers fans, plural, who had trash thrown on them to the. To the game in New York. New York has been unreasonable about its few victories in the last 25 years, by the way.

[Mike Ryan]

You know, that Pacer fan right there is a firefighter in New York City. That's what trash at him. Root for the Knicks.

[Billy]

They don't know he's a firefighter.

[Mike Ryan]

Okay. But still, he is.

[Dan Le Batard]

Should have been wearing his hat. Greg's right.

[Stugotz]

He should have rolled and dropped there. Even though there's no fire nearby, he stopped dropping.

[Dan Le Batard]

If you knew that the exchange was. You were going to get flown to an Eastern Conference finals game for them throwing trash at you, would you. Would you take the trash?

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah.

[Stugotz]

How much?

[Jamel Hill]

I mean, you got it. You got to take the trash.

[Stugotz]

Well, but how much trash is it? Is it trash with juice?

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah.

[Tony]

That bag look wet?

[Stugotz]

Is it juicy trash? Because it just trash. You guys are imagining a neatly wrapped bag being thrown at you, which is fine, but now make it dumpster juice.

[Greg Cody]

If it was one person throwing trash at me, maybe this was, like, hundreds of people walking at him and chasing him down.

[Mike Ryan]

Imagine coming home stinking of dumpster juice and your wife says, what's going on? It's worth it. Like, flown out to the game, baby.

[Dan Le Batard]

We're going to the ecf.

[Stugotz]

You smell like garbage, honey. It's okay, though. We're going to be surrounded by it at the Mecca.

[Greg Cody]

Jerks throwing stuff at Brian Wayne.

[Jamel Hill]

I don't.

[Mike Ryan]

I don't like it.

[Greg Cody]

I hate it.

[Mike Ryan]

It really bothers me. I don't like that.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Yeah, I'm going for the Pacers now. That's it. Yeah.

[Billy]

This is so.

[Tony]

This is so team in the last.

[Greg Cody]

I didn't actually see this version of it before. We're showing from behind people throwing stuff. I saw the side version where the guy was just in his face.

[Mike Ryan]

Ye. That's not a big deal.

[Comcast Advertiser]

That sucks.

[Mike Ryan]

Sucks.

[Comcast Advertiser]

It sucks.

[Mike Ryan]

Sucks.

[Comcast Advertiser]

It sucks.

[Mike Ryan]

Sucks.

[Comcast Advertiser]

It sucks.

[Tony]

It didn't hit him, though, Tony.

[Stugotz]

It would have been. It would have been worse with.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Worse.

[Stugotz]

It would have been worse with dumpster juice. We can agree on that one short.

[Greg Cody]

And he's, like, doing. He's like, speeding up his walk to get away from. He's got.

[Stugotz]

The backpack with the sports coat is also something. Right?

[Jamel Hill]

That's a sports writer swag right there.

[Greg Cody]

But nerd with all the little stickers.

[Mike Ryan]

They put on your back.

[Billy]

A nerd.

[Stugotz]

All right, ladies and gentlemen, here is the coolest guy any of us have ever seen.

[Billy]

I mean, I try. I don't wear a backpack.

[Stugotz]

Yeah, you.

[Greg Cody]

Because you write from home.

[Billy]

No, I mean, back in my day, the only people who wore backpacks were students carrying books. Why is everybody wearing a backpack now?

[Tony]

Because nerds have briefcases now.

[Billy]

Well, briefcases, that's a whole nother story. I did it back in my day on briefcase.

[Stugotz]

Why would you call Windhorse a nerd?

[Billy]

Well, only because he's wearing a suit with a backpack. It just doesn't go. Jamel knows. Doesn't go.

[Jamel Hill]

Remember, though, this, Greg, we didn't talk about back in my day that they used to give the media, like, at whatever event, the free swag was the roller laptop bag. So, like, I had the roller laptop bag. I didn't. I didn't graduate to the backpack until later on in my writing career because that was, frankly, that was a little easier to carry. But like him, you know, also wearing business casual clothing with the backpack and the 9,000, you know, little bands that they put on your backpack because those are security passes or whatever. So I have very. I have walked that walk that Brian Windhurst is walking. I've been in those particular shoes with the sport coat and the backpack. So I'm here to defend it.

[Mike Ryan]

I'm sorry, I gotta keep pushing. I think if you were to poll everyone, the Knicks would be third, maybe fourth. As far as the teams that America.

[Jamel Hill]

Wants to win, you think OKC and Minnesota are above?

[Mike Ryan]

I think they're one and two.

[Billy]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no. There's one national team in this Final Four. It's the New York Knicks. They're a national team. They're from the biggest city. They have transplants all over the country. They haven't won an NBA title in 50 years. America wants the Knicks to win.

[Mike Ryan]

Oh, I think.

[Dan Le Batard]

Paragraph.

[Mike Ryan]

They're so unlikeable. Let's put it on the fan base. The fan base.

[Greg Cody]

Who do you want to win the championship? Put all four teams up there.

[Billy]

People don't care about the fans. They don't care if Knicks fans are loud and boisterous.

[Stugotz]

Oh, that's not true. I rooted against both teams, Boston and New York, in the last series only because of their fans.

[Billy]

Well, Toronto fans, Maple Leafs fans, are some of the worst in North America. I mean, don't get me started with that. Ask Marchand about that.

[Mike Ryan]

What happens if we get you started on that?

[Greg Cody]

I mean, I feel like you did about.

[Stugotz]

Let's get him started. I don't think you have any more. I think you're started and finished.

[Mike Ryan]

I don't want to know what happens.

[Billy]

I thought Marshawn had a great quote when he said, those fans, meaning Toronto, heap all of the pressure on their own team. And I think it's absolutely true.

[Greg Cody]

The Chuck said that too that, like, we don't have to deal with that here. With, like, it's unfair. What they have to. It's been a little patronizing the way everyone's talking about the Leafs after that.

[Comcast Advertiser]

There are some Leafs fans that are suggesting the way that Florida is going about.

[Mike Ryan]

Totally agrees.

[Comcast Advertiser]

So sick on it is twisted.

[Greg Cody]

Like pitying them.

[Comcast Advertiser]

They're trying to also. They're trying to keep this court together in Toronto and make excuses for the man. It's. You got to. They're really close. You got to keep those guys.

[Billy]

Yeah. They'll blow it up. And their own coach says it's between the ears. The Panthers had them beat mentally. Their own coach said that.

[Dan Le Batard]

I would say if Panthers players are saying, you know what. What the Maple Leafs fans are doing, putting pressure on. We don't have to deal with that. That's more of an insult to Panthers fans.

[Greg Cody]

No, we know how to do it.

[Stugotz]

We do it the right way.

[Dan Le Batard]

I don't care enough.

[Stugotz]

I've got to be with Billy. I have not heard before. Our customers care too much.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yeah. And you don't have that passion.

[Stugotz]

And it's a disadvantage. It's a disadvantage at home in a game 7 it. That our fans cared too much.

[Comcast Advertiser]

I think they're all getting off of that press availability stage and laughing.

[Greg Cody]

I mean, they're throwing jerseys on the ice while play is going on. Throwing full beers onto the ice.

[Billy]

They're booing their team in the second period because they allowed 75 shots.

[Stugotz]

They deserve to be booed.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Not between the ears. While you can't get the puck out of your own zone for the first 50.

[Stugotz]

Paul Maurice. Do you know how rare it is for a coach to advance and be like, pitying the opponent because they're in their building. And he's sad because he feels like he's attended a funeral, which he has.

[Comcast Advertiser]

But he is a sensitive man.

[Dan Le Batard]

He also killed them. So that's.

[Stugotz]

There's that. He's the murderer of both Fun and the Maple Leaf.

[Dan Le Batard]

Is a murderer allowed to go to a funeral and be sad?

[Stugotz]

Go ahead and put that on the pole and put that one on the pole. Give her her intro music. It's taken too long to get here.

[Mike Ryan]

It's time for your friendly neighborhood race, lady.

[Stugotz]

RG3 against Ryan Clark. Ryan Clark goes after RG3 because RG3 has made the fox pivot and is saying at every point I keep it in the arena. Ryan Clark did cross the line saying he doesn't talk to black women because he's married. To white women. I do believe that is a line cross woman.

[Comcast Advertiser]

I know, to be fair, Dan is encapsulating here. There's more to it.

[Stugotz]

I believe that he's married and divorced. I may be having that.

[Jamel Hill]

That is correct, yes.

[Stugotz]

And so I do believe that there. I want your analysis as a legitimate.

[Jamel Hill]

Journalist on and a legitimate black woman.

[Stugotz]

That as well. Yes. The line. The line between something that's talked about in the mainstream and something that's talked about in private. Because RG3 versus Ryan Clark is being discussed by people. It's just not being discussed by people very well or very much on television.

[Jamel Hill]

Well, you know, I definitely understand why RG3 reacted and responded that way. Anytime you start bringing in somebody's family, you're going to get a reaction. That being said, I do notice in general a lot of times or enough times, I won't say a lot. I don't want to put too much on it. Is that RG3 is very defensive about his marriage in a way, as if he's hearing whispers or he understands how it looks and he's brought his marriage into things before. Right. Like him being in an interracial relationship. It feels like a lot of times he is apologizing for this or trying to defend this. And I'm like, who you trying to defend it to, bro? Like, if that's who you chose to marry, be okay with it, stand on it, and that's the end of it. But in other things, he has done that. Right. And so, which always strikes me as a bit strange that you would feel like you need to defend what you have clearly chosen. And I'm like, I don't think there's a legion of black women that have a problem with that. Now. That being said, I think the reason I understood why Ryan Clark brought that into the mix, whether or not it crossed the line. Yeah. I mean, I think you can easily make that point that it did. But I do get why he did. Because this Angel Reese, Caitlin Carr thing, which I was like, man, why did this happen, like, just a couple days into the WNBA season? There is a lot of tropes. There's a lot of narratives. There's a lot of underlying racism that is going on underneath what we see or what should be just seen as purely a basketball rivalry. I would love if we could see it in that context. Like heartfelt flagrant. Understood why I was called. Yeah, there was a reaction. Let's move on. I would love for that to be the case. But ever since they met in the national championship. That has not been the case. It is. You know, I know we made the comparisons to Magic and Bird, but I think it's even a little bit more intrinsic or a little bit more deeper than that, because black women have been. Are constantly up against certain tropes when it comes to behavior, when it comes to looks, when it comes to all these things. And you're talking about a majority, a league where the majority of women are black, yet a third of women who are lgbtq. And the way that this league is often talked about, presented by people, is a reflection of how people feel about those two groups. And Angel Reese is caught in the firestorm of that, particularly as she has this, Whatever you want to call it, rivalry with Caitlin Clark. And there are narratives that are following Caitlin Clark as well. And when you speak to black women, I mean, there's a lot of black women who are huge fans of Angel Reese. And I think part of the reason that that fan fandom is as strong as it is, in addition to her being a basketball player who's accomplished a lot and what she's already accomplished in the league with the double doubles, in addition to her ability to play, is because there are a lot of black women who look at Angel Reese and can relate to some of the things that she has gone through. They can relate to the fact that. That this is a woman who is very unapologetic about who she is. And it kind of reminds me how a lot of black men. I'm not saying, obviously, socially, they're very different. So I don't want people to run away with some headlines saying, I'm calling Andrew Reese Muhammad Ali. But a lot of reasons that black athletes love Muhammad Ali is because of his unapologetic nature, because he wasn't afraid to talk his shit because of what he stood on. You see it with Deion Sanders, you see it with a lot, like, there's been a long line of black athletes because of their unapologetic behavior and attitude, that that really resonates with a lot of black people who want to feel that way in our space. We want to be in spaces and not have to apologize for who we are. And so a lot of black women appreciate that. So I think, and artfully and maybe clumsily, what Ryan was trying to explain is that. That if you talk to black women and understand why they ride for Anna Reese and why that right now she is the hero they both need and deserve, then maybe you can understand why what you said was so hurtful to a lot of black women in particular. I think that's what Ryan was trying to say. I'm not. I haven't talked to Ryan. I don't know. But yes, of course, naturally, RG3 was gonna respond when he brought in his wife. He's basically saying, like, you don't even know black women enough to understand why what you said would set them off. So that's where we are with this right now.

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[Jamel Hill]

Did you hear that? Yep.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

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[Jamel Hill]

You.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Okay?

[Tony]

So I thought I was good with money. Turns out I was really good at ignoring it. Like, how am I spending this much on delivery or Uber or that one shoe store that I buy too many shoes from? Then I started using Monarch Money. And dude, it's a financial wakeup call. Monarch's not just some budgeting app. It's basically your money command center. Puts everything, accounts, credit cards, investments into one place. So you're not guessing anymore. And listen, I found stuff I. I didn't even know I was paying for. Since I started using Monarch, I'm tracking my spending, actually saving, and yeah, even having money check ins with my wife. And we're looking at each other and we're like, yeah, okay, we're all good. It makes the hard stuff way easier. And over a million households use. Monarch is named the best budgeting app of 2025 by the Wall Street Journal. So it's not just me hyping up. It's legit. It's real, real deal. Holyfield and get control of all of your finances with Monarch Money. Use Code dan@monimal money.com in your browser for half off your first year. That's 50% off your first [e-mail] with code DAN.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Howdy listeners, it's Mike. This is one of the best times of the year. You're caught up in the emotion of the playoffs. Big time crucial games, going to games, hanging with your boys, hanging with your ladies, hanging with your family and having a good old fashioned time. Well, I can speak from experience. I've been doing all those things, but I've been doing so with a Miller Lite by my side. Because having good times is great. Making those good times a Miller time makes it an unbelievable time, a time of your life with Miller Lite, a brand and a beverage that has been around for 50 glorious years. That's hard to do. Remain popular and delivering on great flavor for 50 years. Brewed with simple ingredients, none of the fluff, just real flavor. Malted barley gives it that rich balanced toffee note taste and the iconic golden color that just hits right every time. Miller Lite great taste. 96 calories. Go to millerlight.com dan to find delivery options near you or you can pick up some Miller Lite pretty much anywhere they sell beer. It's Miller time. Celebrate responsibly. Miller Brewing Co. Milwaukee, Wisconsin 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces. Don LeBatard are the stakes that high that if Angel Reese loses to Caitlin Clark, you need to start over again as a race?

[Stugotz]

Stugats.

[Jamel Hill]

I don't know that we have to necessarily start over, but it might have to be. It will be a black people's meeting, an important one that will be called the next day where we might have to put some things on the agenda and get it on the table.

[Dan Le Batard]

This is the Dan Levatar show with the stugats.

[Stugotz]

I thought that Juju Gotti was great on this subject in the post game show yesterday. I will ask you what's fair or not fair in the commentary that you've seen around this because when you invoke magic and bird and it's the only thing like this. I've seen, you know, that Magic went out of his way to be more palatable and cross the gulf of whatever he had to be at the time in order to be somebody who was marketed by and for the NBA the way that it was. The thing that I want wanted to ask you though, is I think it's being not talked about enough how much these two women have to play each other because there are so few teams in the league. And so the sparks keep rising on this. So what's fair and not fair here? I tried to tell you because Sparks and fever are rising. I and Liberty, well, no less. So I would say that I think that we are watching something that's easier to talk about than the games because the men who are talking about it, myself included, are more informed and interested in the soap opera over here than just, you know, the games. The regular season games.

[Jamel Hill]

Yeah, I mean, and that's. That's part of it. I mean, I've written about this for the Atlantic. Is that suddenly because Caitlin Clark has been able to attract a lot of new fans and, and because of the commentary around these two in particular, you have people who are chiming in who don't necessarily carry with them the institutional knowledge. And so when that is not the case, the drama becomes a lot sexier. To just talk about this as a right one, People love drama and sports in general. So I'm not trying to pretend as if this is some new phenomenon. Then like when it comes to the drama, as much as people say, hey, I just want to talk about the sports, or I just want to talk about the results or I just want to talk about people's ability, that's not usually what creates the conversation. What creates the conversation is some stuff that's happening that is larger than what is going on between the lines. And I guess what I have always not liked about this conversation was some of the things that RG3 said is that he immediately went to, you can tell she hates her. And it's like, what? How could you tell that? Like, no, they are competitive and they are rivals. And I get it. And if anything, I will be willing to concede this. I don't think. I don't pick up that Angel Reese has a personal hatred of Caitlin Clark. What I do pick up from Angel Reese because she said it, and I like to go with the face value of what the athlete actually says, is I think she resents the fact that she can't have her separate story away from the Caitlyn Clark drama. Like Caitlin Clark can have her separate story, like when Caitlin Clark is in any press conference or whatever, unless she's playing Angel Reese or it's something specifically that they have done together that is happening in the moment. She has not asked about Angel Reese at all. She's asked about thousands of other things about her ability as a basketball player. Angel Reese is always routinely asked about Caitlin Clark, and I think she resents that. Part of it is the fact that, like, hey, I can't even have my own identity. Yeah, yeah. I go, I can't even have my own identity outside of this storyline that has been following me since college. And if we recall, when Angel Reese announced she wasn't coming back to lsu, when she was in tears, no one had any sympathy for her. When she talked about these same men now that are chiming in about Angel Reese and talking about her behavior and all this, when she cried before the public and told you part of the reason she was leaving LSU was because of all the racial animosity that she faced. They had no sympathy for her. And so she is carrying this chip and she is carrying this resentment. But I don't think it's about Caitlin Clark. I think it's about the way that people have talked about her and about the lack of, frankly, grace that they have shown her through since that moment where she trash talked Caitlin Clark and flaunted that she won a championship. They have painted this woman out to be so villainous, and we forget how young she still is, that naturally she's wearing a lot of that on her sleeve. So I thought, RG3, he's entitled to his own opinion, but I thought his analysis missed the mark and it was unfair.

[Stugotz]

Personally, I want, before we get to our new game show, that I'm going to ask Zaslow to host. Would you die on this hill? I wanted to ask you about, again, the difference between how the mainstream covers something and the rest of the Internet talks about it. The New York Times now has a new profile on Belichick and Jordan Hudson. Belichick continues to make himself available all over the place in this story. Jordan has told at least one person that she and Bill Belichick are engaged to be married. What's fair and unfair here, Jamel?

[Jamel Hill]

I mean, Dan, they invited us into their relationship. It's like nobody was clamoring to know about Bill Belichick's love life. I certainly wasn't. Right? But when you start posting pictures of y' all doing yoga on the beach and, like, all this other stuff, you're Inviting people into your relationship. And just especially since that 60 Minutes interview. She's right there. We all saw it on camera. So listen, given especially all of of, you know, Pablo. Pablo Torre has been like the Woodward and Bernstein of this relationship with all the.

[Stugotz]

It's embarrassing. It's embarrassing. The click grabbing is embarrassing by him.

[Jamel Hill]

I'm not gonna let you dog my boy like that. But, you know, because of the details we've been able to learn about her influence and how that might be impacting his ability to do his job, his relationship is completely fair game because he made it that way. They made it fair game. And so it's clear that maybe he did not understand what this fallout would be, especially in the social media age. This is the same dude who couldn't tell Facebook from a real book just a few years ago. As he's talking about his level of non participation in social media now, how he's getting the other end of it is like, what happens when you do make a relationship public, Especially when it's this significant of an age difference? I mean, we can't pretend like we don't see these things, Dan. And it's like, as much as I don't want to talk about Bill Belichick's relationship, he opened the door. And so now that the floodgates are open, I mean, I don't really have a whole lot of, I guess, sympathy for him, if that's what you're looking for. I just don't. Because you invited people to this place.

[Stugotz]

Can you give me, please, some hacky game show music for this new game? Would you die on this hill? And they will not be as hard as this, but I will just start the bidding before I give it over to game show host Zaslow. Is the median grandfather racist? Would you die on this hill? The average median grandfather. Any race, any culture.

[Jamel Hill]

Okay.

[Dan Le Batard]

In fairness, they're from a different time. Jamel.

[Stugotz]

Yes, right. Is the median grandfather racist?

[Jamel Hill]

It wasn't racism then when they did it. Is the median grandfather racist. Okay. I'm trying to think of all the. The men I met, which is not a lot of. What would be grandfather age?

[Greg Cody]

Greg, Cody age, Gringa.

[Billy]

Consult me, Jamel.

[Jamel Hill]

I will. No, I think it. I gotta be honest. I think it depends on what race we're talking about.

[Stugotz]

Okay? This is a distinction she's making that ruins the game. Will you die on the hill or will you not die on the hill? All of this nuance. There's a correct answer.

[Jamel Hill]

You're right. You're right. You're right, Dan. You're right. Forget about nuance. I'll die on the hill. That the median grandfather is racist.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Oh, wow.

[Jamel Hill]

I will die on the hill.

[Stugotz]

All right, I'll hand over the proceedings to Zaslow. He's a better game show host than I am.

[Jamel Hill]

Him.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Is he?

[Mike Ryan]

All right, wait for my game show music. Mike Ryan.

[Jamel Hill]

What'S happening?

[Mike Ryan]

Oh, that is not the game show we're playing today. Welcome, everybody, to another episode of everyone's favorite game show. Jamal, would you die on this hill? Everybody, I'm Jack. Jonathan Zaslow, your host. Everybody knows I am a game show host. Dan Lebatard, would you like to explain the rules of. Would you die on this?

[Stugotz]

I think I just did. We could just.

[Mike Ryan]

Don't worry about it. I will explain it. I am the game show host. I will present questions, and Jamel will tell us if she would die on this hill.

[Stugotz]

Ramp.

[Mike Ryan]

Here we go, Jamel. First question. Michael Jordan is better than LeBron. Would you die on this?

[Jamel Hill]

I will. I'll be stabbed on that hill. Yes, I will die on that hill. That Michael Jordan is better than LeBron.

[Mike Ryan]

All right, that got violent. That's not the type of game show.

[Stugotz]

It's unnecessary, okay?

[Jamel Hill]

I don't have to say the manner of death in which I'm going to go.

[Dan Le Batard]

No, no, no.

[Jamel Hill]

All right.

[Dan Le Batard]

Bonus points if you do, though. Yeah.

[Mike Ryan]

Really have a good time here. It is a family show. Next up for Jamel. Pineapple doesn't belong on pizza. Would you die on this hill?

[Jamel Hill]

By firing squad, I would die on that hill.

[Mike Ryan]

All right. Still a little too violent for this game show host taste.

[Stugotz]

Really?

[Jamel Hill]

Yeah. Pineapple on pizza is disgusting. I hate. I don't even know who started that.

[Billy]

It's terrible.

[Tony]

A terrible take.

[Mike Ryan]

Next up on everyone's favorite game show.

[Stugotz]

Hold on. I'm sorry. I've got to get. Hold on, I got to get.

[Mike Ryan]

Tony knows pizza.

[Stugotz]

Argue with her. Go ahead.

[Tony]

Jamal's wrong here. I. I love Jamal, but she's wrong. It's okay. Pepperoni and pineapple together.

[Jamel Hill]

How would you ever put a sweet fruit on a pizza?

[Tony]

Because you got the spicy pineapple, and.

[Jamel Hill]

Then you supposed to be savory.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Sweet with the savory.

[Tony]

Sweet with the savory.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Have you ever smoked drugs? You ever smoked drugs?

[Tony]

Thank you.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Sometimes you want the sweet and the salty.

[Jamel Hill]

I missed that part of my life. I did not. I never smoke some drugs.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Perhaps smoke some drugs or eat some drugs. Then you realize, oh, I get this now.

[Tony]

Pineapple.

[Comcast Advertiser]

This was possibly invented by someone who smoked or ate drugs.

[Stugotz]

Just be clear on this. She's a respected journalist. She has peed drunk on a car tire. She has not smoked drugs.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Well, if you smoke drugs, then you'd know that there is a purpose for it.

[Jamel Hill]

Oh, okay. I got it. I mean, wait, hold up. Let me think. I was like, I have smoked weed before. Like, I mean long, long, long. Doing it wrong though. Okay, so. Yes, but I, I didn't get sweet and savory when I smoked weed. Sorry, I. I didn't, I didn't get munchies.

[Comcast Advertiser]

That's okay.

[Tony]

The palate's not there. That's fine.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Get some French.

[Jamel Hill]

No, no. I mean I'm a terrible. I'm a. I'm the worst weed smoker ever created.

[Mike Ryan]

Moving on. On today's episode of would you die on this hill? Jamel, The NBA draft lottery is not rigged.

[Jamel Hill]

I will die on the hill. It is not wow. At all. At all. How many people would have to be in on the conspiracy for it to work? This is impossible.

[Billy]

People.

[Stugotz]

Yes. They'd all be in prison too. That.

[Jamel Hill]

Thank you. I was like, no, people, it's not.

[Mike Ryan]

Does this game show host look like he would do well in prison?

[Jamel Hill]

No.

[Mike Ryan]

Everybody knows that.

[Stugotz]

Vending machine for sex.

[Mike Ryan]

Holding pockets. Let's move it along. Next up, Jamel. Major league baseball. Did Pete Rose dirty.

[Jamel Hill]

No, man, they didn't do him dirty.

[Greg Cody]

She's not dying on that hill.

[Jamel Hill]

I'm not dying on that hill.

[Stugotz]

It hurts living on the hill. Yes. We also have to have ask her the question though. In sing song chant. It doesn't work really. If we don't say would you die on this hill?

[Greg Cody]

This or that hill?

[Mike Ryan]

It's this.

[Stugotz]

Anything else? Do you have any others there?

[Mike Ryan]

Of course. There is still time left. In today's episode of Would you die? Jamel? Florida does not deserve a hockey team like the Panthers. Be careful here.

[Stugotz]

No die on this hill.

[Jamel Hill]

I would not die on that hill. Florida absolutely deserves. Yeah, we do. Thank you.

[Comcast Advertiser]

I mean six straight conference finals when you include the Tampa Bay Lightning.

[Greg Cody]

Nice.

[Comcast Advertiser]

What are we doing?

[Stugotz]

Yes.

[Jamel Hill]

Every sports fans deserve good things to happen to them. For the most part.

[Tony]

Not all.

[Jamel Hill]

I mean some sports fans maybe not.

[Stugotz]

But most garbage throwing Knicks fans.

[Jamel Hill]

Except garbage throwing Knick fans. But the majority of sports fans.

[Mike Ryan]

It is now time for the next question on would you die on this hill? Jamel, only monsters order a steak medium well. Would you die? Please wait for us to finish asking the question. Give me now answer.

[Jamel Hill]

Okay. No, I am not dying on that hill. I so this is. I want you to hear my rationale. I do order steaks medium well. Only because. Oh, no, I know they won't really do it medium well. I know they'll do it medium. Like, closer to medium rare. It just won't be like, if I order a medium rare, the thing is gonna still be alive. So I order a medium well to get the medium rare that I actually want.

[Billy]

That's fair.

[Stugotz]

I think medium would work in that medium.

[Jamel Hill]

Yeah.

[Tony]

There's a reason why it's medium.

[Stugotz]

Medium.

[Mike Ryan]

It is now time for the bonus round of would you die on this hill? Everybody knows in the bonus round, we open it up for questions from the audience.

[Stugotz]

Really?

[Mike Ryan]

Yes.

[Stugotz]

I've got one for her. I've got one for.

[Dan Le Batard]

Go ahead.

[Stugotz]

Thank you. I didn't know. Everyone knew that. I will say in your voice, this, this. I'm used to being cynical and skeptical about celebrity behavior, but Diddy has exceeded my every wretched expectation.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Where'd you learn this?

[Stugotz]

Would you die on? That's why he's the game show host. Post. Would you.

[Mike Ryan]

What happens when you let a rogue member of the audience.

[Greg Cody]

Never good when there's question.

[Jamel Hill]

I was like, what the hell am I dying on with Diddy? Exactly.

[Greg Cody]

Never good when there's an apology midway through the question.

[Jamel Hill]

Well, I understand. I think I understand where you were going with it. But in terms of filter and the headlines every day, they are. I'm just like, I. I can't read any more of this. It is, it's way beyond. I mean, I don't want to say that nothing should surprise us in today's age of celebrity or media, but I just think that every headline is just like, did you just jumble up a bunch of the strangest things that you could put together? And then, yes, sure, no, I will die on the hill. That I don't want to read anymore about Diddy.

[Mike Ryan]

Yes, that'll do it for today's edition. I don't even know if that was the question.

[Jamel Hill]

I just can't see.

[Mike Ryan]

Would you die on this hill? I've been your host, Jonathan Zazzo.

[Stugotz]

Thank you, Jermel. Good talking to you. Always nice seeing.

[Comcast Advertiser]

Howdy listeners. It's Mike. This is one of the best times of the year. You're caught up in the emotion of the playoffs, big time crucial games, going to games, hanging with your boys, hanging with your ladies, hanging with your family and having, having a good old fashioned time. Well, I can speak from experience. I've been doing all those things, but I've been doing so with a Miller Lite by my side. Because having good times is great. Making those good times a Miller time makes it an unbelievable time. A time of your life. With Miller Lite, a brand and a beverage that has been around for 50 glorious years. That's hard to do. Remain popular and delivering on great flavor for 50 years. Brewed with simple ingredients, none of the fluff, just real flavor. Malted barley gives it that rich, balanced coffee note taste and the iconic golden color that just hits right every time. Miller Lite Great Taste 96 calories Go to millerlight.com dan to find delivery options near you, or you can pick up some Miller Lite pretty much anywhere they sell beer. It's Miller time. Celebrate responsibly. Miller Brewing Co. Milwaukee, Wisconsin 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces.