Hour 2: The Bevacqua-Off 2.0 (feat. Jessica Smetana)

Summary

The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz

Episode: Hour 2: The Bevacqua-Off 2.0 (feat. Jessica Smetana)
Date: December 10, 2025

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Episode Overview

Broadcasting from the Elser Hotel in Downtown Miami, Dan Le Batard, Stugotz, and company deliver their signature blend of sports talk, pop culture banter, and irreverent humor. The main focus of this hour is the aftermath of the College Football Playoff selection process, the controversy involving Notre Dame's exclusion, and the ensuing debate between conference alliances, particularly centering on Notre Dame Athletic Director Pete Bevacqua's criticisms and strategies. Jessica Smetana joins the show, offering her perspective as a Notre Dame insider and cohost of The Echoes podcast.

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Main Topics & Segments

1. Jessica Smetana Reacts: The Notre Dame Playoff Letdown

• [02:03] Jessica Smetana finally joins following Notre Dame’s playoff snub, wryly noting she’s had "three nights to sleep on this."
  • "I've gone through all five stages of grief. Now I'm on to acceptance that you do this every time." – Jessica Smetana [02:04]
• Discussion of how Notre Dame fans are feeling and how the university’s perception in the national landscape is shifting after another controversial selection show.
  • "Yeah, like, Notre Dame fans already know everyone hates Notre Dame. ... Oh, you mean people are going to not like my football team now? That’s crazy. I’ve never felt that before." – Jessica Smetana [03:50]

Notable Quotes:

• "I've reprogrammed my brain to know that she's never going to give me anything. So when she does something like that, it's better than tears." – Mike Ryan [03:23]
• "After all these years of fandom... I was bawling my eyes out. It was incredible. Thank you for asking." – Jessica Smetana [03:05]

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2. The ACC vs. Notre Dame: Twitter Drama & the “Punching Down” Narrative

• Discussion on the ACC's embarrassing attempts to flex on social media and the real weight behind the so-called "controversy".
  • "ACC... have like, no followers on Twitter... less than me. And I don’t even, I have deleted Twitter from my phone for the last month." – Jessica Smetana [05:11]
  • Mike Ryan and Jessica agree: the issue with the college football playoff process goes much deeper than petty conference spats on social media.
• The “Pound of Flesh” Theory: Pete Bevacqua, as Notre Dame AD, gives fans a target by chastising the ACC but avoids conflict with more powerful entities (e.g., the SEC).
  • "Nobody minds punching at Jim Phillips. No one respects him." – Mike Ryan [04:48]

Notable Quotes:

• "I think Pete was smart in seizing on the ACC thing, which... that is something that he can win because nobody minds punching at Jim Phillips." – Mike Ryan [04:49]
• "It's sad that it's punching down on a conference commissioner from one school’s AD. I think that tells you everything you need to know about that." – Jessica Smetana [18:54]

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3. The Flaws of the College Football Playoff Committee System

• [07:02] Critique of the logic and process of selection, including the value (or lack thereof) of weekly rankings and the impact of public pressure and narratives in swaying the committee.
  • "The more they talk, the less you really have faith in what the actual process is." – Jessica Smetana [06:55]
  • "Bullying works. We've seen public pressure... influence those that have more influence." – Mike Ryan [09:08]
• The problem of independence for Notre Dame: "You're not going to have your conference... making the SEC games that are not big games feel like big games." – Jessica Smetana [09:08]

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4. The Notre Dame Playoff Dilemma: Financial And Competitive Realities

• Notre Dame’s business relationship with the ACC is dissected:
  • "ACC games on average sell out 23% of the time. When Notre Dame plays in them, they sell out 90% of the time." – Jessica Smetana [09:40]
  • However, "ACC actually gets money from Miami making the postseason"—Notre Dame keeps its own postseason revenue [10:14].
• The expansion to a 12-team playoff was supposed to fix these headaches, but familiar SEC advantages reemerged.
  • "Florida State was left out... That was really important two years ago and now it's not as important in this ranking." – Jessica Smetana [10:05]

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5. Notre Dame's Opt-Out of the Pop-Tart Bowl

• [21:38] The group reacts to Notre Dame's decision to skip the Pop-Tart Bowl. Conversation weighs player agency, bowl prestige, and media overreaction.
  • "It's not a moral failing to not play in the Pop-Tart Bowl. The game is still going on." – Jessica Smetana [22:13]
  • Mike Ryan questions how “player-driven” the opt-out truly was. Jessica defends the process and the right of players to decide:
    "If the players want to play in the game, you should probably let them play the game... it was a player-driven decision." – Jessica Smetana [23:12, 23:54]
  • Jessica downplays the significance: "I don't think it's quite as big of a deal as a lot of people are making it out to be because it is a bowl game." [25:17]

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6. Marcus Freeman’s Future and the Notre Dame Coaching Conversation

• Speculation about the odds of Marcus Freeman's return as head coach.
  • "If Marcus Freeman leaves, I know a head coach who's available... Brian Kelly, come on down." – Jessica Smetana [27:17]
• Discussion of Pete Bevacqua’s intentions to retain Freeman with a big contract.

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7. Pop Culture & NBA: Tyler Herro and Heat Roster Construction

• Shifting to NBA talk, the crew debates Tyler Herro’s fit on the Heat and the ongoing narrative of trading him as a "luxury" for the franchise.
  • "The Miami Heat go on these runs without Tyler Herro. ... He's a talented scorer, but for this system under this head coach... he stands in the way of real progress for this franchise." – Mike Ryan [35:35]
  • Amin challenges the "nobody thinks he's a keeper" defense: "That's all he's been the whole time since he signed that deal... the guy that you throw into a deal..." [37:46]

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8. LeBron, Rich Paul, and Miami Heat Conspiracies

• Jessica and Jeremy highlight Rich Paul’s and LeBron’s continued praise of Pat Riley and Erik Spoelstra, suggesting a pattern possibly pointing to future movement or mind games.
  • "Rich Paul, when talking about what's going on with the Lakers... singles out Pat Riley and the competitiveness that he'd always had." – Jessica Smetana [46:29]
• Fantasy Trades: The panel explores theoretical trades between Miami and the Lakers involving LeBron James, Tyler Herro, and others, contemplating legacy and competitive incentives as LeBron ages.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "I've gone through all five stages of grief. Now I'm on to acceptance that you do this every time." – Jessica Smetana [02:04]
• "Bullying works. We've seen public pressure... influence those that have more influence." – Mike Ryan [09:08]
• "It's sad that it's punching down on a conference commissioner from one school’s AD. I think that tells you everything you need to know about that." – Jessica Smetana [18:54]
• "It's not a moral failing to not play in the Pop-Tart Bowl. The game is still going on." – Jessica Smetana [22:13]
• "The Miami Heat go on these runs without Tyler Herro... for this system under this head coach, he's a luxury that they don't really need." – Mike Ryan [35:35]

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Fun and Side Content

• Tony’s Top 5 (Favorite NFL moments/trends) [40:57]
• Stephen A. Smith’s infamous “Goldberg as #1 wrestler” list ridiculed [39:47]
• Banter about Jessica and Gojo’s podcast facial expressions/photoshoots [20:50]
• Jokes around Miami elections and Christmas baking [28:31]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Jessica Smetana’s reaction to Playoff snub: [02:03–07:00]
• ACC vs Notre Dame Twitter drama: [05:11–06:01]
• Playoff committee process critique: [07:02–10:05]
• Notre Dame/ACC partnership economics: [09:33–10:14]
• Notre Dame opts out of Pop-Tart Bowl: [21:38–26:30]
• Future of Marcus Freeman as head coach: [27:14]
• NBA/Heat: Tyler Herro debate: [35:27–38:01]
• LeBron/Rich Paul Heat Conspiracies: [45:49–47:39]
• Fantasy trade talk (LeBron/Heat): [50:05–52:26]

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Tone & Style

The show’s tone is sharp, clever, and often self-deprecating, full of in-jokes and asides that regular listeners will appreciate. Jessica Smetana’s slightly sardonic, fan-weary energy is met by the show’s typical snark and irreverence. Analysis is served with mock-seriousness, but the emotional stakes—especially around Notre Dame’s continuing playoff drama—are real, even if delivered with a wink.

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Takeaways

• The College Football Playoff selection remains deeply contentious, with both process and politics under fire.
• Notre Dame’s unique place as an independent and as a “brand” school continues to fuel resentment, both nationally and among their own fans.
• Jessica Smetana’s insight provides a clear-eyed, often dry, counterweight to knee-jerk fandom—eschewing tears for bemusement and skepticism.
• In both college football and the NBA, the panel is quick to spot the real levers of power: TV deals, conference maneuvering, and the influence of agents and superstars.
• The Notre Dame Pop-Tart Bowl opt-out is a microcosm of the ongoing evolution (or devolution) of bowl season importance for top college programs.

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Recommended listening for: Fans of college football, Notre Dame, Miami Heat enthusiasts, and anyone wanting an irreverent window into the intersection of sports, media narratives, and fandom—with a healthy sense of humor.

Transcript

[Dan Le Batard]

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[Mike Ryan]

Brought to you by State Farm.

[Jessica Smittena]

Listening to this podcast Smart move. Being financially savvy. Smart move. Another smart move having State Farm help.

[Mike Ryan]

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[Jessica Smittena]

Choose to bundle home and auto bundling. Just another way to save with a personal price plan like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state.

[Mike Ryan]

This episode is brought to you by NBA on Prime. The NBA on Prime is back with an exciting week of Emirates NBA cup action. The knockout rounds begin with quarterfinal doubleheaders on Tuesday and Wednesday night.

[Dan Le Batard]

Then it's a semifinal doubleheader on Saturday. And it all culminates with the championship.

[Mike Ryan]

Game next Tuesday night only on Prime. If you're not a Prime member, sign.

[Dan Le Batard]

Up for a 30 day free trial.

[Mike Ryan]

To get started today. Restrictions apply. See Amazon.com amazonprime for details. This is the Dan Levatar show with the Stugats podcast.

[Dan Le Batard]

The moment we have all been waiting for.

[Amin Elhassan]

Amin Tony's top 10.

[Dan Le Batard]

No, we'll get to that. That's coming. Don't you worry. We'll get to Tony. But we have all been waiting with bated breath. Today's Wednesday. It's the middle of the week. All right.

[Mike Ryan]

What took her so long?

[Dan Le Batard]

The show was Sunday.

[Jessica Smittena]

Chris, are you still the ep?

[Dan Le Batard]

And she's finally here.

[Mike Ryan]

There she is.

[Jessica Smittena]

Why didn't you guys just have me come in on Monday? I've gone through all five stages of grief. Now I'm on to acceptance that you do this every time. After the Northern Illinois game Last year, I wasn't in on Monday for some reason. This year we know the selection show. Sunday, you have me in three. I've had three nights to sleep on this.

[Mike Ryan]

Why didn't we book her for the first step of the grieving process? I'm here on step five why is Lucy here?

[Jessica Smittena]

I'm Mabel.

[Amin Elhassan]

Mabel Syrup.

[Mike Ryan]

Oh, from Only Murders. I get it.

[Jessica Smittena]

No.

[Dan Le Batard]

All right, Jess, look, none of us have spoken to you. I've gotten mess. I've gotten text messages from friends. I've gotten messages on Twitter. I. I'm at Zazzle. Show him a great follow, and people are asking me, where is Jess? I want Smatan as tears. So let's start out with this.

[Tony]

Okay?

[Dan Le Batard]

Sunday set us the scene. How did you experience Sunday afternoon?

[Jessica Smittena]

I could not believe that after all of these years of fandom that I put into this thing, Baby Lando was the driver's championship of the 2025 Formula One season. I mean, I was just. I was bawling my eyes out. It was incredible. Thank you for asking.

[Mike Ryan]

Oh, this is the good shit. I've reprogrammed my brain to know that she's never going to give me anything. So when she does something like that, it's better than tears. Honestly, Jess, I think your ad is actually knocking it out the park in.

[Dan Le Batard]

Terms of.

[Mike Ryan]

Doing a great job in making Golden Domers happy yesterday.

[Dan Le Batard]

Probably is.

[Mike Ryan]

He's making Notre Dame fans.

[Dan Le Batard]

They like the way he has represented himself in the school, I think.

[Jessica Smittena]

I think it plays. I think Notre Dame fans are going to just dig their heels in more now. I think they feel like espn, you. Thank you, Danny. Not gq. Danny B. That's who I am, Zaz. And I mean, I think they're just. Yeah, like, Notre Dame fans already know everyone hates Notre Dame. I don't think this, like, people are like, well, Notre Dame gave up the one hour of sympathy we're going to give them. It's like, oh, you mean people are going to not like my football team now? That's crazy. I've never felt that before.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah, I think of all the options at least, like, given his fan base a pound of flesh. Because they have several rights to be upset here, upset with the process, upset with Greg sankey and the SEC's influence over it. But I think Pete was smart in seizing on the ACC thing, which, trust me, I've listened to all the content out there, Jess, including your interview on Echoes with Pete Baqua.

[Dan Le Batard]

Was it good?

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah, I enjoyed it. Look, all this content is great. Tent Irish breakdown. For me, that was the best one because they were legit pissed off.

[Jessica Smittena]

Oh, yeah, that guy's angry.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah, he was angry. But I think in a distant third, and maybe you can correct me if I'm wrong, a distant third was the acc. Shouldn't have sent out those mean Tweets. And I think Pete has seized on, like, that one thing given his fan base a pound of flesh, and that is something that he can win because nobody minds punching at Jim Phillips. No one respects him.

[Jessica Smittena]

Yeah, I think that, to me, personally, this is where I think I diverge with people. Vacua. Like, I thought the tweets were honestly a little embarrassing given just how the ACC just. They have, like, no followers on Twitter. If you look at, like, their account, it has like 90. It has less followers than me. And I don't even. I have deleted Twitter from my phone for, like the last month versus the sec, which has like over a million, I'm pretty sure. So, like, they're kind of pathetic attempt.

[Dan Le Batard]

To like, the SEC has 93,000 followers on Twitter.

[Mike Ryan]

That's really bad.

[Jessica Smittena]

It's pretty bad. Again, it's fewer than me. And I. And I don't use Twitter very much anymore. So I kind of thought, like, the ACC thing, I understand why the money people are mad. That's kind of what he implied on our podcast.

[Dan Le Batard]

The SEC has, if you want, 798,000 followers.

[Jessica Smittena]

So, anyways, I think that the money people are mad. I think the people that are in the room with the ACC administrators when they negotiate and all of that, it seems like those are the people that are mad. And Pete Bivac was wearing it. I don't think that that's the central issue anyone has with any of this. I think that's just the big headline because obviously it ties into the Notre Dame conference independence conversation, which we're constantly having. I think the bigger issue is the weekly ratings show, rankings shows. I think that that's something that, you know, if Notre Dame had not been ranked ninth throughout most of the season, continued to win, and were left out in the final ranking, they are going to play in a bowl game. I don't think any of this goes down the way that it went down Sunday. So I think that that's where the frustration is. But I also think that's something that isn' unique to Notre Dame fans. I think Mike, you've been saying all season and Dan has been saying all season what a farce the Tuesday shows are and how you listen to the spokesperson for the committee talk. And the more they talk, the less you really have faith in what the.

[Mike Ryan]

Actual process is 1000%. Like the logic that he gave for Alabama leaping Notre Dame in the penultimate episode, which was just getting over the line over a 5, 7 Auburn team because it was a rivalry game and because they. They went for it a couple of times. I think the real injustice here is that I do think Notre Dame kind of got caught. They were in the awkward situation because everything that I sampled, no one was like that comfortable arguing that Notre Dame should be in over Miami. A lot of the things that I heard was they should both be in. And they kind of got caught with their pants down a little bit because in the penultimate rankings, they were still ahead of Miami. They'd been led to believe for a month that Head to Head wasn't going to matter when. When really they should have spent that month campaigning against the likes of Ole Miss, Oklahoma, Alabama. Because I truly believe Notre Dame to be a better team than those. But this was positioned because of how unjust disregarding Head to Head was as Miami, Notre Dame. And by the time Saturday rolled around, you would. You had. Had Nick Saban, Kirk, Herb Street, Urban Meyer, everyone kind of coming out a line saying Miami should be in.

[Jessica Smittena]

If that's the case, I. Yeah, but that's where playing in a. Not playing in a conference kind of factors in, because no one's going to advocate for Notre Dame other than the athletics director and, you know, Marcus Freeman and things like that. Which I do want to say one caveat. I think that it's kind of lame that we've all accepted, like, public campaigning as part of the College Football Playoff selection committee. And, like, I just don't like, that shouldn't be a thing. I don't. You can't obviously avoid going on the Internet or watching ESPN if you're on the committee, but I do. I do think that that is part of the thing that's like, okay, this. Why are we.

[Mike Ryan]

Why does it work? It shouldn't work. That's why I was annoying everybody for a month. Because I knew, like, every time I was like, is this much? No. Yeah, that's why. For sure. No, that is 100% why. Oh, I swear to God. No, this. That shit matters. And it's a. It's honestly like a blight on the entire system that stuff like that matters. Bullying works. We've seen public pressure. Getting your message out there influences those that have more influence.

[Jessica Smittena]

Yeah, I think that that's where being independent factors in where you're not going to have your conference. Like, you know, Greg Sankey does a great job of. And with the help of espn, their partner, making the SEC games that are not big games feel like big games. Right? Like, they're able to prop up like, a Missouri Oklahoma game and be like, this was. This was the Big game this weekend. I think Notre Dame understands that that's like the cost of doing business if you want to stay independent.

[Amin Elhassan]

So.

[Dan Le Batard]

So, Jess, why does Bakwa think that he has a leg to stand on when it comes to being critical of the ACC in this spot?

[Jessica Smittena]

I think because he feels that Notre Dame is a good financial partner for acc. They have the five game scheduling agreement. And he said in his press conference yesterday, acc games on average sell out 23% of the time. When Notre Dame plays in them, they sell out 90% of the time. So it's his belief and Notre Dame's belief that they help the ACC make a lot of money, even though they're not full members.

[Dan Le Batard]

But wouldn't the ACC benefit more from Miami or any other team in their conference making the postseason than Notre Dame?

[Jessica Smittena]

Yeah, they'll actually get money from Miami making the postseason. Notre Dame got to keep all of the money that they made last year in their postseason run, which was $20 million, reportedly. It's a lot of money. So. Yes, absolutely. And I think that this is like, again, this is where I think less of the issue is with the ACC and more of the issues with the College Football Playoff committee. Because when they expanded to the 12 team playoff, the thought process was, okay, you know, we're finally going to get the 12 best teams, right? Like, we're finally going to get teams that can actually compete for a national championship. And I think it's very hard to argue that at the end of the season, Alabama is a team that can compete for a national championship. And it does fly in the face of something that was argued on Alabama's behalf in 2023 when Florida State was left out, which was, how are these teams playing at the end of the season? Well, Alabama's playing well. Florida, Florida State lost their quarterback. So that was really important two years ago and now it's not as important in this ranking. And it's once again helped an SEC team get in. So I think that's why there's frustration with the process and with ESPN and the fact that, like Mike said, like, you could have flipped Notre Dame and Miami last Tuesday after they both played their 12th game. And I think everyone would have been like, okay, well, Miami went 10 and 2. Didn't know if that would happen. Notre Dame went 10 and 2. Now we look at the 10 and twos and we look at the twos and Miami beat Notre Dame and that, you know, they should be ahead of Notre Dame. And I think that a lot of people would accept would have accepted that at that point, but instead Alabama moved up after beating Auburn and then ultimately got destroyed in their conference championship game. The most lopsided conference championship game this past weekend didn't even go below Miami, who I believe if by the committee's own logic, they should have. Miami should have had the higher seed in the playoff because they actually beat Florida State this year. And I think, you know, ultimately this is just a really, once again, an instance of a SEC team getting in that doesn't really have the best resume at the end of the season. Can we talk about how banks are still acting like it's 1994? Fees on fees on fees, overdraft fees, monthly fees, probably a breathing near the ATM fee coming soon. Which is why Chime feels like someone finally flipped the script Fee Free Smarter Banking that's actually built for you, the person trying to make it through life, not the billionaire who keeps a yacht in every time zone. Chime isn't just another banking app. They've got tools that genuinely help people. Like MyPay, where you can get access to up to $500 of your paycheck whenever you need it. Or getting paid up to two days early with direct deposit. Open your account in [e-mail] dan and now there's the new Chime Card, cash back and credit building with your own money together on one card. No annual fees, no interest, no strings and qualifying direct deposits get you 1.5% cash back on eligible purchases. Chime is not just smarter banking. It is the most rewarding way to bank join the millions who are already banking fee free today. It just takes a few minutes to sign up. Head to chime.com dan that's chime.com dan Chime is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services a secured Chime Visa credit card and MyPay line of credit provided by the Bancor Bank NA or Stride Bank NA. MyPay eligibility requirements apply and credit limit ranges $20 to $500. Optional services and products may have fees or charges. See chime.com feesinfo advertised annual percentage yield with Chime+status only. Otherwise 1.00% APY applies. No min balance required. Chime Card on time Payment history may have a positive impact on your credit score. Results may vary. See chime.com for details and applicable terms.

[Tony]

Hey guys, Tony here. The NBA on Prime is back with an exciting week of Emirates NBA cup action. The knockout rounds start with a quarterfinal, double headers on Tuesday and Wednesday night, then the quest for the cup heads to Vegas for a semi final doubleheader on Saturday. It all culminates with the championship game next Tuesday night. If you're not a Prime member, that's not a problem. Sign up for a 30 day free trial to get started today. Emirates NBA cup coverage continues this week only on prime. Restrictions apply. See Amazon.com Amazon prime for details.

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[Mike Ryan]

I swear. Dan lebartard. Jaz, you can't talk about double digit national titles when every single call of you winning the national title sounds like this. Oh, there's. There's Chubby jacket running down the sideline if the audio. Yeah, that's not true. Yeah, yeah. And there's a World War II veteran pitching into another white guy and he avoids another white guy.

[Tony]

Oh my God.

[Mike Ryan]

Notre Dame. The Fighting Irish have done it again for the eighth time, only paying white people. Stugarts. Chubby Checker.

Sorry, he's black. He's black. And I was really going with somebody named Chubby Checker. I picked him like, I'm sorry, man. I'm improv in here. It's a pretty cool riff.

Running down the side. He spells it differently. All right. His name is Chubby. Maybe you didn't hear me correctly. His name is Chubby Check. Is there's an S at the end.

[Dan Le Batard]

I feel like that should be the largest of five.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah, just chubby. Check it. It sounds like a college football name.

[Dan Le Batard]

This is the D. Levatar show with the ST Cats.

[Mike Ryan]

They rigged the game by moving Alabama up, I feel, because if Miami clears the Notre Dame hurdle, as you suggested in the penultimate episode, then everyone's viewing that SEC title performance with negative three rushing yards by Alabama as a direct comparison. Alabama, Notre Dame instead of the cluster conversation that we were having. But it's also why Pete Bac was very smart in changing the narrative around the acc, because the problem here is Greg Sankey's influence over the College Football Playoff committee. But Babak was not going after Greg Sankey.

[Jessica Smittena]

No. Notre Dame has scheduling agreements with a number of SEC teams over the next 12 years. I think doing business with the SEC is good for Notre Dame. So. Yes, Mike, to your point, he specifically in his press conference yesterday said that he was texting Greg Sankey over the weekend and he is a friend of his. So yeah, I think you. You're not going to. I think what the ACC did when they were tweeting about Miami and Notre Dame was they picked a battle that they thought they win because Notre Dame is not going to really fight back. They're not. You know, they lost the game to Miami. I mean, let's be frank. They lost. They lost in week one. And I think that the SEC doesn't feel like they can pick a battle against the sec. And when I think the SEC doesn't have a firm leg to stand on when their conference championship game is between 7 and 5 Duke and 10 and 2 Virginia. So I think that, like, they picked a battle they thought they could win. They ultimately won it, pissed off one of their partners. Whether or not they care about that remains to be seen. Whether or not anything really comes of it remains to be.

[Mike Ryan]

But Jess, it was overly sensitive. If you see the tweets in question, especially from a 90,000 followed account, like, they're just touting head to head. In fact, like, I heard a lot of podcasts saying they didn't take shots at Alabama. Yes, they did. They touted Miami's resume against Alabama too. I think, like from the play, it was also replay.

[Jessica Smittena]

Yeah, why not?

[Mike Ryan]

Like, it almost felt like Notre Dame was trying to like the position after the fact. And their anger was kind of directed, like, shame on you for shining light on the head to head matchup, which was kind of like, kind of bs. Like every, every Notre Dame. Even you. Like, like, even you Just like on some of your content, like you never argued that Notre Dame should be over Miami was kind of like, well, let's just see. Like I heard the Shane Gillis interview. Like, I'm kind of, I was kind of hoping they were going to screw Miami because I never felt comfortable making that argument. And I just think that this is more a Greg Sankey problem. He's. He's talking to Hunter Yurich, who's an AD of a school that's in his conference every day. And I think that you guys got boned by how this all played out. But I also think it's kind of soft to be punching down on Jim Phillips. What did you make of Bret, your mark's comments yesterday?

[Jessica Smittena]

I think that it is, it's sad that it's punching down on a conference commissioner from one schools ad. I think that that tells you everything you need to know about that. And yeah, Brett, your mark, I, he's obviously going to pick a popular side and try to make himself look good and all this. I, that I don't care what, what he says about people. Aqua, that's, that's his opinion. That's fine.

[Dan Le Batard]

Jessica, were you aware of the arrangement that not Dame has starting next year where they automatically get in if they're in the top 12?

[Mike Ryan]

I.

[Jessica Smittena]

It was gently reported on a few months back in the Athletic, I believe. And then I saw Ross Dellinger posted about it again. We asked people of Agua about it on our podcast the Echoes. I saw, I saw Tony making fun of our podcast on Instagram earlier. I do want to say it's I. My application to be a co host on the crossover with Keon dueling was denied. So this is the best I could do. Tony, guess why this podcast with Gojo.

[Tony]

Notre Dame fan Keon doesn't like that.

[Jessica Smittena]

Yeah, but I don't even remember your question. The memorandum of understanding about the automatic.

[Dan Le Batard]

Bid, you know, being top.

[Jessica Smittena]

Yeah, they still, they still have to get into the top 12, which means they're probably going to have 10 or 11 wins on the season.

[Mike Ryan]

And aren't you worried that there might be guardrails against that? Like they'll just like say, well, like if this season played out the same way, like, well, then we'll just put BYU there if we really don't want Notre Dame there. You can just like rig the game a little bit. And even Pete was like, well, it's an understanding, it's implied. But they can do whatever they want with the top 12.

[Jessica Smittena]

That's not exactly what he said. What he said was, it's a memorandum of understanding, not a memorandum of sort of understanding. So I think that, yeah, I think that that is not necessarily an outcome that they would anticipate and expect. But, yeah, I mean, who knows? This would still mean that Notre Dame has to be ranked in the top 12 this, and which is not a given in any year. So they still have to be at least, you know, somewhat worth a playoff spot to even be in the conversation for that.

[Amin Elhassan]

Jessica, how long did Gojo practice his serious face here on this picture?

[Jessica Smittena]

I mean, you know.

[Amin Elhassan]

You know, he does not have a serious face. That comes naturally. This is you guys.

[Jessica Smittena]

You guys love doing, like, facial analysis.

[Mike Ryan]

Yes.

[Jessica Smittena]

Of our podcast.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yes. Did you pose for this, or was this taken? Like, you know, these are just like, screenshots.

[Mike Ryan]

Jes. When you're so effective at not giving us a suffering, we're going to try to find it wherever we can. This is taking it to Michael Jr. S Charles Barkley. We need to start a dialogue phase.

[Jessica Smittena]

I don't know. He kind of looks like he's doing, like, a little bit of a model blue steel thing. I think he looks good.

[Amin Elhassan]

No, I didn't say he doesn't look good. I'm just saying he does not.

[Jessica Smittena]

I'm trying not to laugh at how silly this entire thing is.

[Dan Le Batard]

You do.

[Amin Elhassan]

You do look like you're on the verge of cracking right here.

[Jessica Smittena]

Yeah.

[Mike Ryan]

Anyways, so a lot of the national story outside of the acc, Notre Dame stuff is Notre Dame opting out of the Pop Tart Bowl. Jess, you have an ally with me here. I think that bowl game is ridiculous.

[Dan Le Batard]

I like Pop Tarts.

[Mike Ryan]

May I speak? May I speak? I showed up late. Let me get a shot up. All right? I didn't want to be in that Pop Tart bowl last year because I was shut out. I understand. And to go to a Pop Tart bowl, that just makes fun of the teams that are in it. Ridiculous.

[Jessica Smittena]

Mike, I knew you were ridiculous. I knew you were going to say this.

[Mike Ryan]

And as Jess, remember the narrative around the Pop Tart bowl last year, I had a month's worth of editorials and talking heads teeing off on Cam Ward because he had the gall, the temerity, to sit out a half.

[Dan Le Batard]

Sit out.

[Jessica Smittena]

Yeah, I know. Look, I think that I'm a huge fan of the bowl games. I love the bowl games. The bowl games are some of my favorite times in the sports calendar. I personally don't think that a Notre Dame opting out of the Pop Tart Bowl Spells the end of bowl games as we know them. I think that, that that's an overreaction. And B, I don't think it's a moral failing to not play in the Pop Tart Bowl. The game is still going on. I think the way that I've seen people react to this is like the Pop Tart bowl has been canceled. But I mean, you should be psyched now because Georgia Tech gets to play in the Pop Tartar.

[Amin Elhassan]

No, we were going to play in the Pop Dark bowl anyways. Byu, that, that came in.

[Jessica Smittena]

No.

No, that's not true.

[Mike Ryan]

That's ridiculous.

[Jessica Smittena]

Big 12. Yeah. But I mean, like, I don't think it's the biggest deal in the world. I think that like, if you're like, oh, Notre Dame, bunch of losers are going to take their bat and go home, like, okay, that's fine. I think that they just had to decide within like an hour of finding out they weren't in the playoff. And I think that the risk reward of playing in a bowl game is entirely up to your players and your team and the play. If I would say if the athletic director or Marcus Freeman made the choice for the players, I would be like, I don't know about that. Like, if the players want to play in the game, you should probably let them play in the game. But we asked people of agua on the show whose decision it was and it was a player driven decision. And I think the risk reward is just not really there. I wasn't crazy about for a bowl game.

[Mike Ryan]

I wasn't crazy about how quick they were. And even if it were true, like you think it's true, Even if it were true, that decision came down pretty quick. I'm sure they had a meeting. It might be. Let's just say it is. I don't want to call them liars.

[Jessica Smittena]

I don't have any reason to believe that.

[Mike Ryan]

I don't want to call them liars. Even if that is so. Even if it was solely the player's decision. I thought it was kind of, kind of the bullshit. Zaz to put it all on the plate.

[Dan Le Batard]

That was the bullshit.

[Mike Ryan]

I think that was the bullshit. You come out and you go on that line with your players. We discussed it internally.

The coaches and the players all decided. I didn't like how they put it on the team captains whatsoever.

[Jessica Smittena]

I mean, I don't think that's putting it on the team captains. I think it's the opposite. I think it's like we, we trust our team captains and we give them Agency and making decisions about like putting their bodies on the line in a.

[Mike Ryan]

Spin game, spin zone.

[Jessica Smittena]

I. Mike, I mean, I think like this show in particular is one that I would say more often than not takes the side of player agency and player empowerment. Maybe that's wrong.

[Dan Le Batard]

So now though.

[Mike Ryan]

No, no, like I said, even if it were so, I would like to see a little bit more alignment in every interview. It was quick to put it on the team captain.

[Jessica Smittena]

That's. I think it's way, I think it's way worse if the athletic director is like, we want to stick it to ESPN because they screw that.

[Mike Ryan]

I'm not saying that. I'm not saying that. I'm just saying don't put it solely on the players.

[Jessica Smittena]

I think the worst case scenario is Notre Dame plays in the Pop Tart bowl and CJ Car tears his ACL and now we don't have find out if that'll happen. So I think as a fan you're like, I personally, I'm torn about it. Like, if it were up to me, I would probably want to play in the bowl game. And I like to watch the football games. Like I said, I'd like to watch them have another game. And now the season's over. So I think that that sucks. But I also don't think that it's quite as big of a deal as a lot of people are making it out to be because it is a, it is a bowl game. Like the other comparison I've seen to Florida State, who got, you know, totally screwed in 2023, is like, well, then they played in their bowl game. Even though half of opted out. That was the Orange bowl. That was not the Pop Tart Bowl. We don't have a New Year's six bowl option for teams that don't make the playoff anymore.

[Mike Ryan]

I agree.

[Jessica Smittena]

Pop Tart bowl is like the premier bowl if you don't make the playoff. That's why it was going to be Notre Dame and byu if you were.

[Dan Le Batard]

I don't think it was one of.

[Mike Ryan]

My favorite games ever.

[Jessica Smittena]

The players that grow up in this era do not remember a time when the Bulls had importance. I would also add that, oh, I'm excited.

[Dan Le Batard]

I'm psyched that you're doing this fun.

[Jessica Smittena]

Side thing for most of these players lives. And I think that if they don't want to play in it, then that's fine.

[Mike Ryan]

I'm psyched you're doing this because the Notre Dame brand is such that it calls to attention the, the whole bull system right now, which I think needs incredible reform. Again, I'm down with Notre Dame's decision there. I'd like to thank you for being a good sport. Check out the Echoes podcast with Michael Jr. And Jessica Smittena. They had people. I think Pete Pavakwa was really good and I liked your Marcus Freeman. Like you didn't lead with a Marcus Freeman question there, but it sounds like Pete knows that he has to drop a bag on Marcus Freeman as he alluded to in your interview, trying to make him one of the highest paid coaches in the sport. We have that comment from Pete Pavakwa. We've had some reporting saying, I think Pete Sampson said Marcus Freeman will be back in 2026. Yet if you look at some sports books, Marcus Freeman is the odds on favorite to take over the New York Giants head coach.

[Jessica Smittena]

Notre Dame was also a favorite to make the playoffs.

[Mike Ryan]

Minus 3,000.

[Jessica Smittena]

I don't know if I'm going to trust the sports book with decisions. Mike. I would say this. If Marcus Freeman leaves, I know a head coach who's available. He has experience coaching at a high level. He's the winningest head coach in Notre Dame history. That's right. Brian Kelly, come on down.

[Mike Ryan]

And his family.

[Dan Le Batard]

Jess, tell everyone again where they could catch your. Your recent talk with Pipa, which is serious faces.

[Jessica Smittena]

Yes, the. It's a very serious podcast. Look, I will say you. We were the only podcast the Notre Dame athletic director went on this week. We had podcast exclusivity. Well, proud of me and Mike for, for doing this show. I'm. What I mean, did he go on Dan Patrick?

[Dan Le Batard]

I mean, are we differentiating like that between radio and podcast?

[Amin Elhassan]

Okay, we're doing that. We're now.

[Dan Le Batard]

We're.

[Mike Ryan]

Everything's a podcast now, Jess.

[Jessica Smittena]

All right, whatever.

[Mike Ryan]

He's starting his own Bavaqua and company.

[Jessica Smittena]

I'm still, I'm still proud of us for getting the interview podcast.

[Amin Elhassan]

That was. That was a big.

[Mike Ryan]

I've sampled it all. Your interview with Babaqua was my favorite favorite. I will admit that. No, I'm telling you. And it was level headed. And if you're listening for some tiers, I think Jess gave you like more emotion in that moment than any other platform ever.

[Jessica Smittena]

Guys, it was Monday. Like, this is the thing. It's like you wait until Wednesday. It's like, all right, kind of moved on. I'm working on my Christmas baking situation now. I also want to say, hey, shout out to Miami. Electing a Democratic mayor. I heard last night, hell yeah.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah.

[Jessica Smittena]

Wow.

[Tony]

Good job.

[Jessica Smittena]

Billy Corbin.

[Tony]

Huh?

[Jessica Smittena]

Big day.

[Mike Ryan]

21,000 votes. That's how you win. One Cuban switched over. Shout out the Cubans.

[Jessica Smittena]

I know you all. I know you all voted for him.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah, well, we were not.

[Tony]

It's not city of Miami.

[Mike Ryan]

It's not even a real government.

[Dan Le Batard]

Jess, excellent job. We're sorry to the audience that was hoping to drink your tears. Nonetheless, excellent appearance.

[Jessica Smittena]

They I once again, they only have you guys to blame. Next time, switch it to Monday. You're gonna rock this outfit the rest of the day.

[Mike Ryan]

What are you thinking?

[Jessica Smittena]

I think I look better as a brunette than I expected.

[Mike Ryan]

Oh, I definitely think you would not have given us anything on Monday.

[Jessica Smittena]

Well, now you'll never know.

[Dan Le Batard]

See you, Jess. There's always canes.

[Mike Ryan]

I'm trying to get ready for the holidays and wrapping my head around what I'm going to cook and people keep asking me the same question. Roy, what are you gifting this year? What are you cooking? Cooking. And honestly, I don't have time for all that. I just keep it simple. I go with Omaha Steaks. People, listen up. Omaha Steaks delivers the world's best steak experience. You can send USDA certified tender steaks, juicy burgers and comfort meals that make you look thoughtful with minimum effort. Now that's my kind of gift. Right now, during the Sizzle all the way sale, you can get 50% off site [e-mail] plus an extra $35 off with promo code Daniel. Man, I've had Omaha Steaks plenty of times. I've cooked them, I've gifted them. People are always impressed. The steaks are aged perfectly tender and are full of flavor. It's holiday magic made easy. Orders placed by 6pm Eastern ship the same day. Save big on gourmet gifts and more holiday favorites with omaha steaks. Visit omaha steaks.com for 50% off site wide during the Sizzle all the way sale and for an extra $35 off, use promo code Dan at checking out turns. Apply see site for details. That's Omaha steaks.com code Dan.

[Tony]

Hey, guys. Tony here. The NBA on Prime is back with an exciting week of Emirates NBA cup action. The knockout rounds start with a quarterfinal double headers on Tuesday and Wednesday night. Then the quest for the cup heads to Vegas for a semi final doubleheader on Saturday. It all culminates with the championship game next Tuesday night. If you're not a Prime member, that's not a problem. Sign up for a 30 day free trial to get started today. Today, Emirates NBA cup coverage continues this week only. On prime. Restrictions apply. See Amazon.com Amazon prime for details.

[Mike Ryan]

Hey, folks, it's Mike Ryan. Happy holidays to you and to our tremendous partners of almost 20 years. Miller Lite. It's the 50th anniversary of Miller Lite. It makes the holidays special. It makes the football game special. It makes family gatherings and friendship time extra special. I make all those times Miller Time. And during the holidays, most of my favorite memories start the exact same way. I crack open a Miller Lite, take a look around at my friends and family, and think, yeah, this was the right call. Whether it's a late night hang after a holiday party or standing around a fire pit with a family, Miller Lite just fits. It's a taste you know you can depend on. And it's brewed for flavor with simple ingredients like malted barley, rich balanced toffee notes, and that iconic golden color. And at just 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces, it lets you enjoy the season without weighing you down. Miller Lite great taste. 96 calories. Go to millerlight.com dan to find delivery options near you. Or you can pick up some Miller Lite pretty much anywhere they sell beer. Tis Miller time. Celebrate responsibly. Miller Brewing Co. Milwaukee, Wisconsin 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces.

[Dan Le Batard]

Don LeBatard I don't like smutty either.

[Jessica Smittena]

Stugats women stay home in the kitchen where they belong.

[Dan Le Batard]

This is the Don Levatar show with the Stugats.

What'd you guys think?

[Mike Ryan]

I think that that was fun and I'm really deeply appreciative of our director cutting away from her about to put the U upside down.

Oh, I'm so happy this happened to them.

[Dan Le Batard]

Oh, man, this bifaqua.

[Mike Ryan]

I listened you guys traded Tyler Hero. I'm happy for that. Well, you stop short, but look, no one on South Florida radio has been telling the truth since 1983 like this guy. And I've been right about damn near everything about this franchise over the last three years. That guy needs to go.

[Dan Le Batard]

I saw Wind Horse came out and Windhorst claims that Tyler Herro has screwed up Kello Air and Jaime Hawk as is quote Mojo.

[Tony]

I saw that too. What a report by Wendy.

[Dan Le Batard]

Quote Ware and Hawkez had bigger roles before Hero came back and playing great. Since that has happened happen in addition to Lee catching up, them two have lost their mojo.

[Mike Ryan]

Jeremy's saying that's not a report back here. Well, the in addition is doing a lot of lifting there. But we caught up. Jeremy. You have to like, you're just like, okay, the last six games with Hero. Exactly. It looks different, but it's not here.

[Dan Le Batard]

Like, you got to just acknowledge that it hasn't looked good since Hero's been back.

[Mike Ryan]

It hasn't looked good since Heroes been back outside of the time that they scored 140 points and the starting lineup took a 20 to nothing lead yesterday. Like, the lineup has been good. The bench has really struggled, and that's a matter of several different players. I was saying to a mean during a break. I personally think that what they should be able to do is have bam out of bio and Tyler Hero playing more with the second unit because if the two of them are able to play with the second unit, then that means you'd be able to have what's happening.

[Tony]

Will you be able to have ultimately.

[Mike Ryan]

The ability to say, Khalil Ware play.

[Tony]

A little bit more with the starters, which is where he really was thriving earlier in the season and when Khale.

[Mike Ryan]

Ware was more engaged.

[Jessica Smittena]

Right, Right. He's able to be engaged with that starting unit. If you get him going early, that's.

[Mike Ryan]

When you know you'll be able to have more success with him. Emit Abio and Tyler Herro are guys.

[Jessica Smittena]

You can play with several different kinds of players. So if they're playing off of one another with that second unit, it might be able to help fix some of what's been going on. Wait, Lucy's here.

[Amin Elhassan]

I like Force Ghost Jeremy the best. I was like, oh, I'm gabbing the vision. Yeah. Like you look Killaware. His problems are his consistency. I don't think that's a Tallahiro thing. I think that's a killer Ware thing. Hawkez, look, man, that's one of those things. You know how they talk about Miami. You guys always think your guys are better than they actually are. Hakus is one of those. To me, he's just. I'm like, every time I watch him play, I'm like, I didn't like that.

[Mike Ryan]

He was a former reigning MVP of the day. Yeah.

[Dan Le Batard]

And he could be a two time. If he has another great game one night, no telling that he can't win it again.

[Mike Ryan]

Guys, this is most obvious thing in the world. It's been staring at you for three seasons. And I know he had an unbelievable bubble run where he kind of introduced himself to the NBA inside that bubble. But the Miami Heat go on these runs. The Miami Heat go on these runs without Tyler Herro. The Miami Heat seem to do Just fine without their All Star. I understand he's a. He's a talented scorer, but for this system under this head coach, he's. He's a luxury that they don't really need. And I think he stands in the way of real progress for this franchise. And lucky for the Miami Heat, I do think he has value.

[Amin Elhassan]

Mike, I mean, I'm a little confused here. Are you implying, like, there's some circles or corners of at least Miami Heat D where they're like, not Tyler Hero, he's a keeper.

[Mike Ryan]

I've never heard that in that corner, man.

[Amin Elhassan]

He's not allowed to talk about.

[Mike Ryan]

That's not quite what I'm doing. I. I'm just trying to discuss where it really works for this group.

[Jessica Smittena]

Right. Like with this group, having Tyler Hero is. In some ways there are redundancies there that exist within the way that this roster is constructed. But if you're going to take advantage of the roster that exists, you need to be able to figure out rotationally where to stagger which players. And ultimately, like, having Tyler run that second unit, it hides some of the issues that Jaime Hawkes has been having. Right. Like, he's been best in the open court when your defense is playing well and getting out in transition position. Well, the defense hasn't been able to stop anybody with the second unit. They're missing a lot of open shots. And when that happens, the thing that he's able to do in getting to the rim in the open court, it becomes a much bigger problem. And Tyler's able to fix some of those things offensively.

[Amin Elhassan]

Trista Crickley, ladies and gentlemen.

[Tony]

It also feels like his best situation is being a great asset as a trade piece. Right?

[Mike Ryan]

Because that's.

[Tony]

You look across the league and you're like, alright, who's somebody that can fill a very good void of contract, of playing style for a bad team? If you want to get, you know, cap space on the books or trade for a great player that somebody else will take and be like, yeah, I'll take him.

[Amin Elhassan]

That's all he's been the whole time since he signed that deal. It was just like, this is the guy that you throw into a deal, whether it was Tamian Lillard, whether it was Kevin Durant, now it's Giannis. That's why I'm a little confused. Mike is like, oh, I told you about Tyler Herrero. Nobody out here talking about he's a keeper like that.

[Mike Ryan]

You're right. But the narrative has shifted some as the data points start to mount up. Look, he's a nice scorer. I think that there are certainly teams in the NBA that his skill set is required and needed if they want to advance. I just don't think it's down here. I'll do the Colin Cowherd hand.

[Tony]

He's a great number three.

[Mike Ryan]

Tyler Hero. We're good, bro.

[Dan Le Batard]

Can I tell you what took place real quick while we were talking to Jessica there as Amin got very distracted. I mean, dare I say Amin was shook. All right, I was. Now, you guys know I'm going to Washington, D.C. this weekend. I'm going to Saturday night's main event. John Cena's last match this Saturday night is in the nation's capital.

[Amin Elhassan]

I'm catching stocks and bonds.

[Dan Le Batard]

Don't you worry. All right, Stop. Stop counting what's in my pocket. So I'm going on Saturday. And ESPN's doing all kinds of promotions. So on first take moments come. They had Gunther in studio with them. Gunther is facing John Cena in his last match this Saturday.

[Amin Elhassan]

Is that a marquee matchup? I thought like the last one would be like going out with some fireworks.

[Mike Ryan]

I don't know that fool. It's good.

[Dan Le Batard]

You don't have to know him in.

[Mike Ryan]

His last act or presumed last act. Will John Cena finally put someone over?

[Dan Le Batard]

So I think it's a big deal. I like it. Gunther was in studio. Great. They flashed on the screen. Now, this is kind of old news because Stephen A. Smith debuted this a few months ago ago, like at the beginning of WWE and ESPN's partnership, which began over the summer. And Amin was shook when they flashed across the screen. Stephen A. Smith's top five wrestlers of all time.

[Amin Elhassan]

Now, guys, I am a wrestling outsider, maybe even an enemy of wrestling, according to some people. But I looked at his list and I said, that can't be right. This has to be a typo.

[Dan Le Batard]

It's an embarrassment of a list or something.

[Amin Elhassan]

I don't. Should we reveal the whole list or just go right to number one?

[Dan Le Batard]

No, you just say number one.

[Amin Elhassan]

Guess. I want to guess from you guys.

[Mike Ryan]

I. I have experience with Stephen A's top five list when it comes to wrestling.

[Dan Le Batard]

It's horrific.

[Mike Ryan]

Did they rehash it? Yeah, they. Is it the same?

[Dan Le Batard]

Yeah.

[Mike Ryan]

Is it? Did they. Did this person play for the Atlanta Falcons at one point? Yeah. Oh, it's Goldberg.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yeah, Number one.

[Mike Ryan]

Goldberg sucks.

[Dan Le Batard]

It's not number one. It's not Stephen A. Smith. Smith's all time favorite wrestlers. It's Stephen A. Smith's greatest wrestlers of all time.

[Mike Ryan]

On the Stephen A. Front, I heard one of his rants yesterday. I caught it on social media. The name Pete Bavaqua was made to come out of that mouth with disdain. I mean, Baqua it is.

[Dan Le Batard]

Has it overtaken Rachel Thiago?

[Mike Ryan]

Splitter? It's in the class.

[Amin Elhassan]

Slava Medvedenko.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah.

[Dan Le Batard]

Tony, I heard you got a top five for us today.

[Tony]

My official top five. Zaz.

And Tony's top five is presented by Smirnoff, the official vodka sponsor of the National Football League. Smirnoff. Please drink responsibly. The Smirnoff Company, New York, New York vodka, 40% alcohol by volume. No Olis today. We're gonna go straight to the top five. Number five. I love the annual Bills versus Bengals snow game. It always delivers. There's something about it. You, you see those two teams, except the last time when, you know, obviously something happened in the middle of the field that wasn't snowing that day. But every time they played in the snow, it's been a game that's delivered.

[Dan Le Batard]

I've never, I've never in my life. I mean, look, I've lived here in South Florida my entire life. I've never been to a cold weather football game game. Like I. I can't imagine sitting in the stands for three. Cuz it's not like you're moving around, staying warm. You're just standing in the snow for three and a half hours.

[Mike Ryan]

Something you're forgetting.

[Jessica Smittena]

You're hammered.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah. You need to drink a lot at the Bad Boy Mowers Pinstripe bowl to not feel it.

[Jessica Smittena]

Get the hand warmers going.

[Mike Ryan]

I'm telling you, it's fine. You like? Obviously I wouldn't want to do it every game, but like once every couple years. Fun.

[Tony]

Number four, rip to the Chiefs. It was a great run.

[Mike Ryan]

Official.

[Tony]

It's over. You lose to the Texans on Sunday Night Football at home. That's why Nick Wright came out on a gurney smoking a Whatever it was silver.

[Mike Ryan]

That was awkward with Nick.

[Dan Le Batard]

I put Nick in a body bag with that LeBron comment.

[Tony]

Wow, you got his ass when you said he was 4 for 17.

[Dan Le Batard]

And everyone knows I'm always on the record.

[Tony]

That is true. Number three. I think the Jags may have a legitimate real shot to win the afc.

[Mike Ryan]

Who else is it?

[Tony]

It's just you look around the league and it's like, who's here? Who's still around? The Broncos, maybe the. The Patriots, maybe like the Jags can get hot and something can happen.

[Mike Ryan]

I don't know.

[Tony]

They could Win the afc.

[Mike Ryan]

Isn't it okay?

[Dan Le Batard]

I mean, like, no, he gave us a medved.

[Mike Ryan]

I've been dying for a fake Stephen A Bavaqua, but he's done.

[Tony]

He's fine through. He's fine through right now.

[Dan Le Batard]

Like right now, Tony. The first round of the playoffs, Jacksonville would host Buffalo. You think it'll win that game?

[Tony]

Anything can happen. Bad Josh game. They get the ground game going with etn.

[Mike Ryan]

To Tony's point, though, outside of Buffalo, who do you trust more than them?

[Tony]

Maybe the Broncos defensively, but like, you don't super trust b Knicks.

[Dan Le Batard]

I would trust. I, I, I think New England will beat them.

[Tony]

New England, maybe. Yeah.

[Dan Le Batard]

All right, so so far, most of the field we believe, but I disagree.

[Mike Ryan]

I, I don't think like New England.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yes, they look good in this regular season. We haven't seen them do in the playoffs yet.

[Tony]

I think the Jacks can get hot. Number two, Someone please take a look at the Raiders kicking a field goal with no time left on the clock while backdoor covering seven and a half. Take a look at it.

[Mike Ryan]

At least you're not calling for murder.

[Tony]

I'm not calling for murder. Not yet, but somebody should take a look at that because careful.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah, I didn't like that.

[Tony]

Number one. Very quick. Bears frauds. It's over.

[Dan Le Batard]

That's.

[Tony]

They're not doing anything.

[Dan Le Batard]

I'm not with. Well, okay, those are two different things.

[Tony]

They're frauds.

[Mike Ryan]

They're not doing it through the playoffs.

[Tony]

Same thing.

[Mike Ryan]

You saw Jordan Love on McAfee Rocking the Toyota Thon quarters.

[Tony]

He knows.

[Dan Le Batard]

He knows what he's doing.

[Mike Ryan]

He knows what he's doing. Oh, my God. He knows. He knows what he's doing.

[Tony]

And guess what? He's starting to play.

[Mike Ryan]

Well.

Of course he is. It's Toyota thon.

[Dan Le Batard]

Good job, Tony.

[Tony]

Thank you, buddy.

[Dan Le Batard]

So we did a little bit of this with Dan earlier. Dan's up in New York City, of course, and yeah, little bit of this.

[Amin Elhassan]

Little bit of that.

[Mike Ryan]

He's back.

[Amin Elhassan]

Yeah.

[Dan Le Batard]

So. So Rich Paul and Max Kellerman have a new podcast. Right. It must be new because Kellerman's out of hiding.

[Amin Elhassan]

It's brand new. Yeah, I, whenever I hear pairings like that, I'm always thinking to myself, how many episodes are we getting in?

[Dan Le Batard]

Well, I just wonder how, how did that come about?

[Amin Elhassan]

I think Bill Simmons had something to do with it. I think he pitched this whole thing. He's got some connections behind the scenes.

[Dan Le Batard]

Like he says to Kellerman, hey, you know, I think would be willing to do a show with you.

[Amin Elhassan]

Yeah. Like, hey, Max, you're about to come out of, you know, whatever that contract hiatus that was. And, hey, you should do something with Rich. Rich. You know what? Max is. You've always respected Max. You guys should do something together. I'm just like, these guys are busy guys. They're not doing a podcast.

[Dan Le Batard]

Well, how long is it? How many times is it supposed to come out? Is it like a once a week kind of deal? I imagine, even if it's once a week.

[Mike Ryan]

Week. Yeah.

[Dan Le Batard]

So, like, are you.

[Mike Ryan]

I bet you it's one of those season situations. Well, they do, like, a bunch of them.

[Dan Le Batard]

That's season one.

[Mike Ryan]

And then do, like, another season.

[Dan Le Batard]

Like, are you surprised? Like, are you surprised that LeBron is still doing these episodes of the Mind the Game? I think he's doing it with Steve Nash, right?

[Amin Elhassan]

Yeah, he is. I am surprised a little bit, because also there's a video component to that in terms of talking about plays and stuff, but he seems to be committed to it, so.

[Dan Le Batard]

So we.

[Mike Ryan]

Jeremy's connecting dots with all of this.

[Jessica Smittena]

I'm telling you guys, this rich Paul and LeBron narrative all around Pat Riley and Eric Spallstra, it's not happening for no reason.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yeah. Jeremy's been, like, obsessed for a few weeks now with how LeBron. And now it's Rich Paul, any opportunity they have to give the Miami Heat and Eric Spoelstra praise.

[Tony]

Yeah, that's right.

[Dan Le Batard]

You're, like, marking it down.

[Mike Ryan]

I mean, it's happening constantly.

[Dan Le Batard]

Everywhere you look.

[Tony]

Was there a cat?

[Mike Ryan]

Everywhere you look?

[Tony]

Every time they're talking about one team.

[Mike Ryan]

Or another, they're ultimately also just squeezing in. Hey, you know, right before LeBron comes back and he's playing. Was that Lil jon? Right before LeBron comes back and he's talking to the media, he's saying, oh.

[Jessica Smittena]

I can play anywhere. I'm gonna fit into what's happening with the Los Angeles Lakers. Why? You know, coach Eric Spolster always said, positionless basketball. I can play for any franchise in the NBA. Now, Rich Paul, when talking about what's going on with the Lakers and them maybe not being a championship contender, what does he do? He singles out Pat Riley in the competitiveness that he'd always had.

[Dan Le Batard]

That's just the way they do things.

[Jessica Smittena]

This is how they've always done things. Why does it surprise you? It just has me asking.

[Dan Le Batard]

Has you asking?

[Amin Elhassan]

Hit the button.

[Dan Le Batard]

Has you asking. Okay, so, Rich Paul, a couple things stood out to me, and we talked a little bit about it earlier. Well, the. The first one, which we played earlier, you know, it was. Rich Paul was not critical, but just straight up saying the Lakers, who are second in the west right now and are playing tonight in the NBA cup against the spurs, that they are not a championship contender. All right, I thought that was interesting. And you wonder, you know, what's the MO There? Because Rich Paul and, you know, who's, you know, mouthpiece for LeBron most of the time anyway. Like, they don't say things, not on purpose.

[Mike Ryan]

Who says this show doesn't have a female voice happy to fill the role.

[Dan Le Batard]

So another thing that stood out to me, Amin was here is Rich Paul again with Max Kellerman. And Rich Paul is seemingly telling you the way that LeBron right now with the Lakers, the way LeBron should be used to.

[Mike Ryan]

There's a couple things to be made, changes to be made in the short and the long. In the short, I'm putting. I'm putting LeBron as the screener because no offense to Aiden or Jackson Hayes.

[Amin Elhassan]

They'Re just not the decision maker coming out of the pick and road.

[Dan Le Batard]

It makes it hard if you have.

[Mike Ryan]

Luca and LeBron in those rooms because it's. It's O. LeBron is overqualified for that role. But now all you need is in that case. We've seen it. The guy in the dunker spot and then the guy in the short corner. If they make shots, then you very tough to beat.

[Dan Le Batard]

So I always take a pretty simplistic view on this kind of stuff. I mean, for one, JJ Redick has done a really nice job, by all accounts, with this Laker team, like, overachieving right now. 17 and 6. You're telling me Rich Paul is saying something here that J.J. redick, like, hasn't thought about?

[Mike Ryan]

About?

[Amin Elhassan]

No, I think he's saying something that he probably wants to be more on the forefront and wants to apply pressure to JJ Redick in that regard. I like the. The idea is, like, look, it's not that JJ doesn't know it or even that JJ Thinks it's a bad idea, but I. I remember when Steve Kerr, you know, when they first did the death lineup with Iguodala in the lineup and Draymond at the 5 and Harrison Barnes at the 4, and the plus minus was off the charts, but Steve Kerr would never do it until they got in the playoff games and all that. And they're like, why don't you do it all the time? Why isn't that your starting lineup? He's like, because that's not a card. I Want to play in the middle of December, right? Like, that's a card you play Game six or whatever.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yeah, there's a reason.

[Amin Elhassan]

And so similarly, I would think the last thing you want is for the league to get tape on LeBron as a screener and how the Lakers do things. But that's something you hold in your back pocket for another time. For a time where there's less preparation and more stakes at hand.

[Dan Le Batard]

Or is it also sowing the seeds a little bit for why LeBron eventually will not be pleased with his, you know, new role in LA?

[Tony]

But, I mean, you look at their team, they're second in the west in a really tough West. LeBron hasn't played Luka, and more so AR have carried that team to a 17. 6 record. And it's like LeBron, you got to get in where you fit in. And if it's playing the dunker spot, if it's. If it's playing pick and roll, if it's playing that, like, he's very equipped, like he said, overqualified to be in that position. So why not use it?

[Mike Ryan]

Let me ask everybody a question then. What's more important to LeBron at this stage in his career? Being a role player on a Lakers team that apparently has a shot at winning a title or being the main attraction for one last postseason run? That.

[Jessica Smittena]

I wonder where he might want to.

[Tony]

Do that for a team that has.

[Jessica Smittena]

No shot in the eastern conference. If LeBron James is here in exchange for. Not a lot.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yeah, but it's. I mean, for a team with no shot, like, that means there's only upside. But like, like there's some downside now with this Laker team. They're second in the Western Conference. They get to the postseason, LeBron doesn't play well. It's like Jeremy just did the trade machine. It's Hero.

[Amin Elhassan]

Who was it?

[Mike Ryan]

It was Hero.

[Jessica Smittena]

I didn't trade anybody.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah, but come on.

[Dan Le Batard]

It was Gabe Vincent and LeBron for hero.

[Jessica Smittena]

And rosier salary wise works for LeBron and Gabe Vincent. If you're adding a couple of picks, there's inspiring stuff. And if the Lakers wanted to add another school.

No. If they're just trying to add another score off the bench. Are you saying does it fix anything for Miami?

[Tony]

Correct. Does that fix anything for Miami?

[Jessica Smittena]

Yes, certainly. Another decision maker with that bench lineup.

[Mike Ryan]

And it gives the Lakers another white guy who can score.

[Jessica Smittena]

That's true.

[Amin Elhassan]

Jake Laravia is getting real, real lonely out there. He's like, oh, you know, Austin and Luka, they're cool together. I'm by myself here. Maxi Cleber never plays. And also, he's from another country.

[Mike Ryan]

You really think, like. Cause he's. He's chasing the Michael Jordan thing, right? He's chasing ghosts. Like, regardless of his impact on that, like, you could always Frame it like, LeBron was in his 40s when they won that title. Like, if he wins another one, don't you think that would go further than him just, like, being the man on a Miami Heat team that may get bounced in, like, the second round?

[Amin Elhassan]

No, he's got to win one where it's like, oh, it's clearly it was you. But I told you guys already where that's going to happen, and it's not Miami, and I don't even think it's Cleveland either. There's only one place where LeBron can land new York, win a championship, and have it count for a million championships. It's New York. There's no other location.

[Jessica Smittena]

All right, that's fine. So then Giannis can come here instead of New York?

[Amin Elhassan]

Sure. You want to trade Tyler here? On what? Terry Rose?

[Mike Ryan]

Come on. That seems like a good one. You're throwing in Jovic.

Throwing anybody.

[Dan Le Batard]

Sometimes you acquire big stars. It's got to hurt a little bit.