Local Hour: Shaq Was An Underachiever

Summary

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Podcast Summary

The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz

Episode: Local Hour: Shaq Was An Underachiever
Date: October 22, 2025
Hosts/Panel: Dan Le Batard, Stugotz, Chris Cody, Mike Ryan, Amin Elhassan, Tony

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Main Theme & Purpose

This Local Hour episode, recorded from the Elser Hotel in Downtown Miami, starts with the panel’s typically playful, irreverent banter and shifts into deep dives on sports nostalgia, the emotional side of fandom, and the complicated legacies of star athletes—including Shaquille O’Neal, Brad Marchand, Kevin Durant, and Aaron Rodgers. The recurring question of the episode: Can legends underachieve? South Florida sports, ownership, and fan psychology round out the discussion.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Notre Dame, Coaching Loyalty & Fan Entitlement

• (02:58) The crew mocks Notre Dame fans for being offended another school might want their coach.
• Dan Le Batard: "So wise people get really offended when the perception is even hinted at that their place is a stepping stone. This happened with Oregon and Mario Cristobal. It's why they hate Mario Cristobal." (03:36)
• Chris Cody’s Vatican/Pope jokes lampoon the mythos around Notre Dame and their deep pockets.

2. Basketball Season Returns

• (05:14-06:22) The group introduces basketball season with a humorous musical number:
  • Mike Ryan raps: “Basketball is back, Jack... Is it man to man or box in one?”
  • Laughs around the questionable use of 'box and one' in the song.
• Stugotz: “We gotta get that guy to stop breaking bottles over people's heads in the office. That seems really unsafe.” (06:22)

3. Brad Marchand’s Return to Boston – The Power of Emotional Sports Moments

• (07:42–15:00) Deep dive on the emotional tribute Boston gave returning hockey star Brad Marchand.
• Amin Elhassan: “I was moved by it. I really was. And for me, it's always F. Boston...They did a tremendous job for him. He is an ugly crier, and I felt it for him.” (07:42)
• Dan: “They nailed the tribute...the more emotional he got, the louder the crowd got, and it was just waterworks after that.” (08:13)
• The conversation explores why such moments matter, citing the contrast with how Kevin Durant was booed in OKC:
  • “Kevin Durant got booed when he returned back to okc. Durant will never get that moment.” – Amin (15:38)
• Mike Ryan: “That moment was bigger than sports. Right? It was a beloved player being hugged by the entire city of Boston. And that's so heartwarming to see.” (21:03)

4. Greatness, The Allure of the Chase, and Defining Underachievement: The Shaq Debate

• (09:22–13:58) Spirited debate: Can someone as dominant as Shaquille O’Neal (or Durant) be called an underachiever simply because their ceiling was so high?
  • Stugotz: “It's Durant, it's Aaron Rodgers, and it's Shaq. It's even Shaq. Couldn't he have won more given how dominant he was?” (12:28)
  • Chris Cody: “Shaq versus LeBron. Shaq, everyone’s like—the guy eats donuts and says, ‘I got injured on company time’…whereas LeBron, he's maximizing everything he can do.” (13:11)
  • Amin Elhassan: “If you don't believe that Shaq underachieved, I feel like you don't remember how incredible [he was].” (27:22)
  • Panel unpacks the difference between maximizing talent through sheer physical greatness (Shaq as a “three-peat” champion) versus lacking the driven, cold-blooded professionalism (à la LeBron) that would have produced even more.
  • Dan Le Batard: “LeBron's won four, Chris. His entire 30-year career, it seems.” (26:29)
  • Reluctance to label a three-time NBA champion an underachiever—but recognizing that expectations were nearly mythical for Shaq.

Notable Shaq Quotes

• Stugotz (about MVPs): “I don’t really need to say much more than Shaq won one MVP. Steve Nash won two. Who do you think’s the underachiever there?” (27:37)
• Chris Cody (on Shaq’s potential): “He wasn't just big, he had crazy footwork, he was smart as crap around the rim... People didn't appreciate it at the time.” (27:59)

5. Sports Ownership: Can You Be a Good Owner Without Winning? (Miami Dolphins Example)

• (40:25–48:12) Discussion on Steven Ross turning down a $10 billion offer for the Dolphins. Is improving infrastructure enough to make you a good owner?
  • Mike Ryan: “Nobody thinks Steven Ross has been a good NFL owner, but it doesn’t mean he hasn’t been great at capital improvement.” (43:16)
  • Dan Le Batard: “That stadium was trash before Steven Ross. My game day experience is so much better. Thank you, Steven Ross.” (43:04)
  • Chris Cody: “At the end of the day, the thing that you can’t really control is the results on the field... sometimes that’s all you can really ask for.” (44:40)
  • Stugotz and others argue: infrastructure matters, but 20 years without a playoff win is ultimately what fans care about.

6. Fan Respect, Quarterback Trust, and Team Dynamics: Tua & the Dolphins

• (37:13–40:25) Parallels between player underachievement and losing the respect of the locker room explore how quickly things go south for leaders like Tua in Miami after bad games.
  • Dan Le Batard: “Would it wreck your confidence if you were surrounded by people who were mad at you because you’ve publicly blamed them in a way that gets the coach to reprimand you?” (38:07)
  • Amin Elhassan: “If you have a player who you are mad at, you feel like you're not going to win, you stop giving max effort. That’s the first place you'd see a lack of respect.” (38:48)
  • Panel weighs how much a fractured locker room shows up on the field, especially in blowout losses.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote/Highlight | |-----------|------------------|-----------------| | 03:36 | Dan Le Batard | “So wise people get really offended when the perception is even hinted at that their place is a stepping stone... It's why they hate Mario Cristobal.” | | 07:42 | Amin Elhassan | “I was moved by it. And for me, it's always F. Boston...They did a tremendous job for him. He is an ugly crier, and I felt it for him.” | | 12:28 | Stugotz | “It's Durant, it's Aaron Rodgers, and it's Shaq. It's even Shaq. Couldn't he have won more given how dominant he was? I'm not—” | | 13:11 | Chris Cody | "Shaq versus LeBron. Shaq, everyone's like—the guy eats donuts and says, ‘I got injured on company time’... whereas LeBron, he's maximizing everything he can do." | | 21:03 | Mike Ryan | “That moment was bigger than sports. Right? It was a beloved player being hugged by the entire city of Boston. And that's so heartwarming to see.” | | 27:22 | Amin Elhassan | “If you don't believe that Shaq underachieved, I feel like you don't remember how incredible [he was].” | | 43:16 | Mike Ryan | “Nobody thinks Steven Ross has been a good NFL owner, but it doesn’t mean he hasn’t been great at capital improvement.” | | 43:04 | Dan Le Batard | “That stadium was trash before Steven Ross. My game day experience is so much better. Thank you, Steven Ross.” | | 38:48 | Dan Le Batard | “Would it wreck your confidence if you were surrounded by people who were mad at you because you’ve publicly blamed them...?” |

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Notre Dame/Coaching Discussion: 02:58–04:25
• Basketball Song/Season Return: 05:14–06:22
• Boston’s Tribute to Marchand: 07:42–15:00
• Shaq/Durant/Aaron Rodgers—Defining Underachievement: 12:28–14:34, continued 26:02–30:25
• Ownership & Miami Dolphins “Value” Debate: 40:25–48:12
• Tua/Losing the Locker Room: 37:13–40:25

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Section-by-Section Engagement & Analysis

Fun & Zany Energy

• The show’s tone is as irreverent as ever: running jokes (Cuervo, breaking bottles, “basketball is back, Jack!”), quick asides about garbled song lyrics, and playful self-criticism about being “post-coital” after singing on-air.

Nuanced Sports Analysis

• While the initial energy is high, the panel delivers thoughtful sports analysis—on athlete psychology, the burden of expectations, and fan relationships with flawed legends. The Shaq debate is especially emblematic.

Emotional, Relatable Moments

• The Marchand tribute discussion includes several panelists admitting to being moved—even “brought to tears”—not just for sports achievements, but for the feeling of belonging and community they represent.

Ownership, Value, and Fan Experience

• The Dolphins discussion balances economic/business logic with fan passions. The group fleshes out how it’s possible (maybe!) to be a “bad” NFL owner (on-field) while increasing franchise value and enhancing the fan experience.

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Final Takeaways

• Legacies are subjective: Being a “winner” in sports or ownership is more complicated than championships.
• Emotion is central to fandom: Memorable moments often come from player/fan bonds—even with unlikely, antagonistic figures.
• Expectations shape narratives: Shaq, Durant, and Rodgers all “underachieved” only in relation to the superhuman expectations created around them.
• Sports communities are self-policing: Even the zany Dan Le Batard crew knows not to cross certain lines—whether with impersonations or hot takes, they challenge each other in real time.

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For Those Who Didn't Listen:
This episode mixes humor, nostalgia, and sharp debate to tackle the endlessly shifting sands of greatness, legacy, and what it really means to “achieve” in sports. If you like your sports talk unfiltered, funny, and yet sneakily incisive, this hour is a prime example of why the Local Hour is appointment listening.

Transcript

[Dan Le Batard]

Now's a good time to remember where Tequila's story truly began. In 1795, Cuervo invented tequila. Cuervo what are you doing here?

[Stugotz]

Cuervo? Anytime someone says Cuervo, I show up.

[Dan Le Batard]

Well, I do know that to be true. But even during ad reads like Cuervo, I think he could lay out especially for one of our great partners.

[Stugotz]

Sweet, delicious Cuervo.

[Dan Le Batard]

Since then, Cuervo has stayed true to its roots. The same family, the same land, the same passion.

[Stugotz]

Cuervo.

[Dan Le Batard]

So enjoy the tequila that started it all. Cuervo. Cuervo the tequila that invented tequila. Proximo Cuervo.com Please drink responsibly.

[Stugotz]

Cuervo.

[Chris Cody]

Introducing Oakley Meta Vanguard the new performance AI glasses designed for athletes with an action ready ultra wide camera, powerful open ear speakers and built in Meta AI that syncs with your Garmin devices for real time insights with while you train, take your performance to the next level with Oakley. Meta Vanguard Athletic intelligence is here. Learn more on Meta.com.

[Stugotz]

When did making.

[Dan Le Batard]

Plans get this complicated?

[Stugotz]

It's time to streamline with WhatsApp, the secure messaging app that brings the whole group together. Use polls to settle dinner plans, send event invites and pin messages so no one forgets mom 60th and never miss a meme or milestone. All protected with end to end encryption. It's time for WhatsApp message privately with everyone. Learn [e-mail] I can tell from looking at Greg Cody, who is a bit post coital, that he has just done some singing and soon there will be a no open that a new open that will have his song in it. And you can tell from looking at him, you can tell that he feels like he has accomplished something. He was just telling me Yesterday that he haw3 needs to perform in Las Vegas and do a documentary. He wants a documentary. He wants metal arc to make a documentary on he HA3.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah, it's. It's time. I mean we've been a band for 50, 60 years and at least I have been part of the band for that long and it needs a documentary. But that's the first time I've ever been described as looking like I'm poised post coital. So thank you for that.

[Stugotz]

Radiant as. Do you not see the happiness on him?

[Amin Elhassan]

Yeah, he's got a smile, you know, it's like an artist who is ready to, you know, show their art to the world.

[Mike Ryan]

That's exactly what it's like.

[Stugotz]

He is, but he's pleased with whatever work it is that he's done. Or it could just be that everything centers around him and that gives him equal pleasure.

[Amin Elhassan]

Is it like a debut for you two? Have you seen Final Cut?

[Mike Ryan]

I have not.

[Stugotz]

Oh, so you'll be watching it for the first time with us. Okay. I wonder what it'll be about. Mike Ryan was also muttering under his breath while you were performing the new Open, just grumbling about Notre Dame fans being funny. And I don't think he actually finds them funny.

[Dan Le Batard]

No, they're not. They're. They're mad that someone else would consider hiring their coach. It's a strange thing. Well, he wouldn't go. I'm not. Okay, That's. That's his decision. But how dare you say some other school may want to hire him?

[Stugotz]

I don't.

[Dan Le Batard]

What are we doing?

[Stugotz]

Not a good thing.

[Dan Le Batard]

I don't think.

[Amin Elhassan]

A compliment to your coach.

[Dan Le Batard]

He would never leave. I don't know. I kind of saw your coach leave for an SEC school a couple years ago, and I happen to know that he's. He's talked to other people.

[Stugotz]

You happen to know.

[Dan Le Batard]

I happen to know that Marcus Freeman and his agents have done some. He happens to know.

[Stugotz]

Great Scott.

[Dan Le Batard]

He happens to know. He happens to know. Gather, everyone.

[Stugotz]

Get the children. He happens to know.

[Dan Le Batard]

So wise people get really offended when the perception is even hinted at that their place is a stepping stone. This happened with Oregon and Mario Cristobal. It's why they hate Mario Cristobal.

[Stugotz]

This place considers itself less of a stepping stone than any place in college football.

[Dan Le Batard]

Even though they have $15 million to pay coaches, they typically don't do that.

[Amin Elhassan]

Ohio State used to be everyone's dream job. Ohio State would like a word.

[Stugotz]

Nope. I'm telling you. I understand what you're saying. There's greatness in plenty of places holier than thou. Only one.

[Chris Cody]

Do you think when they need money, do they call the Pope and say, hey, man, like, Marcus Freeman's about to leave. We. We need like another strong 15 million.

[Tony]

Open up the coffers there in the.

[Dan Le Batard]

Vatican, they got quite the endowment.

[Tony]

What do they got in there, by the way? What's going on down there? Something upon.

[Stugotz]

In the coffers.

[Tony]

In the coffers of the Vatican, Dan, you know what's going on there?

[Chris Cody]

Vampires.

[Stugotz]

I don't want to talk about what's going on in the.

[Tony]

We need to have that conversation. Not yet, but soon.

[Mike Ryan]

Basketball.

[Chris Cody]

Basketball.

[Mike Ryan]

Basketball. Basketball is back, Jack. Time for our favorite winter sport. The summertime is over, so let's head down to the court. Time for the tib ball give me fast breaks on the attack Will you shoot a three or take it to the wreck? Basketball is back Jacked It's a dream shake down in the post Or a killer cross you love the most.

[Stugotz]

When.

[Mike Ryan]

The offense tries to run and gun Is it man to man or box in one? It's big plays and talking smack that's how you know that Basketball and back Jack, let me hear you say basketball, Basketball, basketball Basketball is Mack Jack. 360 dunks and pick and roll and we're gonna watch it every day till they raise the Larry oh. Hard piles and hook shots A dagger three and hack a shacks if you say this game's the best I'll say Zagak Basketball is backjacks Basketball is backj. Basketball is back Basketball is back Jack.

[Stugotz]

We gotta get that guy to stop breaking bottles over people's heads in the office. That seems really unsafe. I don't think when the offense is on the run, one of the options is boxing one.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah.

[Stugotz]

I don't. I don't think that that's what's happening.

[Amin Elhassan]

When's the last time you box and one was played?

[Dan Le Batard]

Wow.

[Mike Ryan]

I'll have to. I'll have to admonish my lyricist on.

[Stugotz]

A day when basketball reopens and Amin is in town flying in with urgency because basketball has reopened. We open with a hockey story and come on, hit the other open. The rarest. The rarest of things that you get in sports is we talk about drama and soap opera and beef and everyone hating each other. Just a super sweet moment. Just a super sweet moment that broke one of the top tough, dirty irritants that that sport has ever seen with one of the greatest stories and everyone in Florida and Boston could appreciate. Oh, they still love him, and he still loves them. And Marchand is trying to keep it together, and he's got no shot at keeping it together as he's watching the video montage. And he gets the career eulogy of his life flashing before his eyes. When they've got those banners and it says 2011, you see the one next one, 1972. Like, there's no back to back there that Marshand is going back to.

[Amin Elhassan]

I was. I was moved by it. I really was. And for me, it's always F. Boston. I hate everything about that city when it comes to sports. I hate that team right there. I hate that crowd.

[Chris Cody]

They.

[Amin Elhassan]

They did a tremendous job for him. He is an ugly crier, and I felt it for him, though. I felt good for him and I thought it was a tremendous moment. I loved it. I really did. I loved it.

[Chris Cody]

Would you think it was a tremendous moment if Mar. And played for, like, the Stars or some other team?

[Amin Elhassan]

I wouldn't give a shit.

[Dan Le Batard]

Well, I mean, for me, you know.

[Amin Elhassan]

I'm a Panther fan, right?

[Dan Le Batard]

They nailed the tribute. I was unaware he played in Boston. And so they. They really did a good job encapsulating catching me up on that. I did think it was really cool that the. The more emotional he got, the louder the crowd got, and it was just waterworks after that, especially if you had no idea he was a Boston Bruin.

[Amin Elhassan]

He also made it clear because they. They had talked to him throughout the day. He made it clear that he wouldn't change anything. He was. He's really happy with the way everything.

[Stugotz]

He said one thing that surprised me. He said that he had no intention whatsoever of re signing with the Panthers until he. Until he did. And he. He knew he was a rented mercenary and got caught up with the. God, this feels good. Like, this is one of the reasons, I mean, that it's still confusing for me to see Kevin Durant in Houston because I'm like, man, winning seems like it would be super fun. Why wouldn't you just stay with the winners? It seems like you could be swayed by that. Winning seems like a good way to spend your basketball life, I think.

[Chris Cody]

Well, for Kevin Durant, I think, you know, when you're that level of talented, and I'm no hockey expert, so I don't think Marsh, like, was that kind of talent.

[Amin Elhassan]

More of an emotional leader guy than, like, skill.

[Dan Le Batard]

He was. He was a tremendous hockey player. I know we all live in a swamp, and we just started following hockey a couple of years ago.

[Stugotz]

He's not Kevin Durant.

[Tony]

He's not the most gifted player we've ever seen with a basketball.

[Dan Le Batard]

No, but. No, but he was one of the top players.

[Mike Ryan]

He's close. He's close to Durant, in my opinion.

[Stugotz]

No, no, he's not close to Durant, in my opinion.

[Mike Ryan]

He is.

[Dan Le Batard]

I mean, he has a city that loves him more than any city loves Kevin Durant.

[Amin Elhassan]

Definitely not late to that.

[Stugotz]

In terms of unprecedented player. Marchand is not that, but he's got a story that's super, super interesting, super sweet at the end, and absolutely made the most of his talent. A lot of people would argue that Kevin Durant hasn't, even though it'd be hard to argue that because he's 110 best basketball players ever and maybe the purest scorer we've ever seen of any kind.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah, I don't know anyone who would argue he didn't make the most of his talent. Maybe, maybe his personality, maybe his choice.

[Stugotz]

I'm saying in terms of the winning that he ended up doing, yeah, sure.

[Chris Cody]

Marchand, two Stanley Cups is probably way above the over under for what we.

[Amin Elhassan]

Would have thought for like Marsh an overachiever for sure. Is Kevin Durant an over underachiever?

[Stugotz]

He's an achiever.

[Dan Le Batard]

Properly achieved.

[Amin Elhassan]

Properly achieved.

[Dan Le Batard]

Could have, could have won more. Decided to not.

[Chris Cody]

But, but to my point is that when you are a talent like Durant, there is a, there is an allure also to the chase, to how this happens. It's not just about the accumulation. I tell the story a lot. When Andrew Bynum, remember him, he was the center for the Lakers when, when they won with Kobe and Powell and all those guys. But when he was first coming up, there was a game when Mike Brown was actually the coach. He gets the ball at the top of the key, shoots a three with like 15 on the clock. Mike Brown goes crazy, pulls him out the game. After the game, all the reporters rush to Kobe's locker cuz they think, oh, Kobe's gonna rip this kid a new one. Like how dare you take that shot or whatever. And so Kobe, what'd you think of that shot by Andrew Bynum in the third quarter? And Kobe sat back and said, sometimes when you're great, you need to test the limits of your greatness. Like he wasn't mad at all because he understood. He's like, oh, this is the only way I know. Wait, what can I actually do? I've told this story as well. When I worked for the Suns, Steve Nash in a playoff game threw a behind the back left handed pass between someone's legs against the Spurs. And I was like, why would he do that? And like sometimes you just want to know, can I do this? Can I do this with the stakes this high? And so for Kevin Durant and I have to do this disclaimer because otherwise I'll get a DM from him. I haven't spoken to Kevin Durant.

[Stugotz]

I don't know anything.

[Chris Cody]

But it would seem to me when you're that talented, winning it just because, hey, we're on the best team is not enough of an intellectual pursuit. I have to find out what are the limits of my greatness. And I think that's what he's done in this journey since he's left Golden State.

[Tony]

Does this tie into your Aaron Rodgers theory of everything? Needs to be harder because I'm so good that I can't do it with guys that are just great. I have to do it with guys that are garbage to make sure that everybody knows it's me.

[Chris Cody]

It is the bizarro evil version of the Aaron Rodgers theory. Aaron Rodgers theory is, I need enough reasons to explain my failure. That won't be me. It wasn't my fault y' all gave me this and that at all. Like, hey, man, if I had, that's the Aaron Rodgers thing. Whereas Kevin Durant is like, I wonder if I could.

[Stugotz]

There are three guys I think of where they're all time immortals and one of them is not Mark Andrews. All time immortals that somehow achieved things that are damn near close to unprecedented, but still will get slathered with underachieved. It's Durant, it's Aaron Rodgers, and it's Shaq. It's even Shaq. Because you're like, couldn't he have won more? Couldn't he have won more given how dominant he was? I'm not.

[Amin Elhassan]

I agree. I agree.

[Chris Cody]

No.

[Stugotz]

What?

[Chris Cody]

No.

[Amin Elhassan]

And I love Shaq.

[Dan Le Batard]

What?

[Stugotz]

I don't even mean it as an indictment of him.

[Dan Le Batard]

Not. Not before. Not before LeBron.

[Chris Cody]

Sorry, Dan. Dan is speaking nothing but straight facts.

[Dan Le Batard]

He did a three beat.

[Chris Cody]

And people. People still say Shaq should be more dominant than that. You got to think about this. Shaq versus LeBron. Shaq versus LeBron. Here's the deal. LeBron spends seven figures on his body every year. And his diet is this. And he's got these trainers. No, he's maximizing everything he can do. Whereas Shaq, everyone's like, the guy eats donuts and says, I got injured on company times.

[Amin Elhassan]

He was lazy.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah. Like, well, I'm not going to say.

[Stugotz]

That he won a three peat the way you're describing.

[Amin Elhassan]

Yeah, like, that's.

[Stugotz]

Like that means. No, but he.

[Amin Elhassan]

That's how amazing he is.

[Stugotz]

No, but, Chris, when he came into the league, okay, first games in Orlando, when he was dribbling up and down the court with the ball, all of us looked and said, that's the most dominant thing we've ever seen. Should have won 10 championship or what? It should have won a championship, at least before he started winning MVPs in his early 30s.

[Chris Cody]

Guys, I love the enthusiasm in the room. Everyone's engaged. Everyone's in. Basketball is back. But if we're gonna do 90s nostalgia, how are we not talking? They brought it back and guess what?

[Stugotz]

There it is.

[Chris Cody]

Hit that music. You know what they Did Daniel, they hit the Buffalo?

[Stugotz]

No.

[Chris Cody]

Play the music. I need the bed. Oh, we can't.

[Stugotz]

Okay, never mind.

[Chris Cody]

Never mind. All right, we got flags.

[Stugotz]

Seven seconds or less.

[Chris Cody]

Never mind. Oh, I love that book. So, Dan, they pushed the button, and you know what happened? It was the Buffalo Wild wins button. They said, hey, this game is great. We need to go a little bit longer for a couple reasons. One, we want this to continue, but also there's another game with Steph Curry in it, and people can't watch it. You know what they'll have to do in order to watch it? They're gonna have to download Peacock and subscribe to that. And all of it came together. NBC could not have had a better night. And you know what the highlight was? The pinnacle, the zenith. That was second highest Pinnacle and Zenith. Insights into Excellence. No, that's not right.

[Stugotz]

That's not correct.

[Mike Ryan]

You didn't like it, Dan.

[Stugotz]

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. We'll get into Insights into Excellence. I saw what Amin did there. The ball went over to him and he's like, you're not going to turn this into a puck. I'm going to keep it a ball. And the story from last night, and that was a fun game between Houston and okc. Also a fun game. The late game was also fun, but the game of the night was. The game played around the emotion of Marshawn in Boston. At the top of hockey, seeing a player break like that because of his link to a community. It's almost Mike just said it, man. Kevin Durant got booed when he returned back to okc.

[Amin Elhassan]

Durant will never get that moment.

[Dan Le Batard]

And Rant was booing the OKC ring ceremony, which was great heel work out of him.

[Chris Cody]

And then Stephen Adams booed Durant on the intro.

[Dan Le Batard]

That was awesome.

[Chris Cody]

I like that one. I also love the dichotomy of. At center, from Pittsburgh, Stephen Adams, and the crowd went nuts. At forward, from Texas, Kevin Durant and boo. It was the exact opposite of cheers and boos. But then you say about the emotion of a guy and a link to a comedian, Brad Marchand. How about the emotion and the link to a legend of Amino Hassan? I sat there, I had tears in my eyes watching Michael Jordan tell me that he felt mortal for a second. Then he remembered who the hell he was. You're damn right I trained that free.

[Dan Le Batard]

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[Stugotz]

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[Tony]

Not just smoke free nicotine satisfaction, but real freedom.

[Stugotz]

Freedom to do what you love and choose your rewards. With Zinn Rewards, you can redeem points for premium tech outdoor gear and gift cards to your favorite retailers. Find your Zinn and keep finding rewards that fit your [e-mail] rewards warning. This product contains nicotine. Nicotine is an addictive chemical.

[Tony]

Thursday Night Football's on and it's only on Prime Video. This week, the Minnesota Vikings head west to face the Los Angeles chargers. Covers begin 7pm Eastern with football's best party, TNF tonight. Not a Prime member. Not a problem. Simply sign up for a 30 day free trial. It's the Vikings and the chargers Thursday at 7pm Eastern only on Prime Video. Restrictions apply. See Amazon.com Amazon prime for details.

[Dan Le Batard]

Don LeBatard Chris Cody does an impression. Just be careful.

[Amin Elhassan]

Dangerous game here.

[Dan Le Batard]

This is a dangerous game.

[Stugotz]

I don't want to play this game.

[Dan Le Batard]

No. He was saying, man, I could do.

[Stugotz]

Such a great no, I don't want to play this game.

[Dan Le Batard]

He's like, man, this is who we're.

[Stugotz]

Gonna this is who we're gonna trust. I mean you do it, let's let do it.

[Dan Le Batard]

I think st I think you could.

[Chris Cody]

Do it, Chris, because you did a great Charles Barkley. You're one for one there.

[Stugotz]

Did no one just hear the segment we just did with the mean we cannot be taking judgment. Is not the council from the local drunk on whether or not you should do the impersonation of a black man stumbling over his words like you don't see the bad.

[Mike Ryan]

There was Mose And Moody.

[Stugotz]

Moody Moses.

[Dan Le Batard]

It sounds worse. Be careful, man.

[Stugotz]

We gotta like. We cannot do this. It's too close to the line. This is where the line is. Something legitimately funny can't be funny because we're scared our Ginger's gonna do something racist by accident.

[Amin Elhassan]

Carry the hell on, Dan.

[Stugotz]

Rachel.

[Chris Cody]

Dan. The line is where we feel alive, though.

[Dan Le Batard]

This is the Dan Levatar show with the stucco. I think we've got all show to celebrate. Peacocktober. Let's just put a bow on this Brad Marchand thing, because the emotion at the start of that game was one thing. The game absolutely delivered. And it's one of the nuttier finishes you'll ever watch in sports. It's hard to make a regular season game echo. To have a regular season game be memorable, you need to have like, what the Senators and Panthers had.

[Amin Elhassan]

And it was ESPN a couple seasons.

[Dan Le Batard]

This was a national game.

[Amin Elhassan]

I don't know how that puck went in.

[Dan Le Batard]

You had the. The framing of Bradshaw.

[Amin Elhassan]

I don't know how Borhege gets credit for it.

[Dan Le Batard]

You have the framing of Brad Marchand's return to it. The panthers go up 2. 0. They concede it's even. They get a late goal to go up 3. 2. The Bruins pull their goalie, get a late equalizer. You're shitting bricks if you're a Panthers fan because you're about to go 05 on the road. Your season feels like it's in jeopardy already because you're blowing this lead to Boston. And then something that I don't think I've ever really seen before. Carter Verheage, Swaggy called game, hits a post. The puck bounces about 5ft in front of the net off a Bruins player back into the net, and the clock freezes at 3:05.

[Amin Elhassan]

That's what I'm talking about.

[Dan Le Batard]

But there was like 26 seconds left. So it drains stop at 3:05,305 back to 3:05. And then it disappeared.

[Chris Cody]

That's one thing.

[Dan Le Batard]

And we finished a game with zero clock. And the source was the officials on the ice. Just trust us.

[Amin Elhassan]

I had to just wonder how much time was left while I'm watching the Panthers try and drain the clock. I have no idea what time was left.

[Mike Ryan]

It was such a great goal that it made time stand still. But as great as that game was, and it was like it almost had a playoff feel. As great as that game was and as great as the final game, final goal was, it was the emotion at the beginning. I. I was brought to Tears, which I rarely am by sports, because that moment was bigger than sports. Right. It was a beloved player being hugged by the entire city of Boston. And that's so heartwarming to see. I hate it. Nowadays you see a lot of fake ceremonies when a player who played there two or three years comes back and they give them the touching video.

[Amin Elhassan]

Everyone's got to get the thank you videos.

[Mike Ryan]

And they don't deserve it, most of them.

[Amin Elhassan]

Penn State fired James Franklin then tweeted out, thank you.

[Mike Ryan]

I mean, Brad Marchand. I don't think. I don't think Bruins fans have had a more popular player since Bobby Orr. I really.

[Amin Elhassan]

Patrice Bergeron.

[Mike Ryan]

But yeah, like, not, not. Not for my money.

[Stugotz]

I mean Borges.

[Chris Cody]

So I'm sorry, I need to clarify one thing really quick.

[Stugotz]

Sorry. Yeah. My bad.

[Dan Le Batard]

Echoes throughout eternity. Borges.

[Amin Elhassan]

Ron Borges is a writer there.

[Stugotz]

That's right. Thank you. Thank you for the help there. That's good help from you. Ron Borges is a writer in Boston.

[Dan Le Batard]

Started following the sport three years ago.

[Stugotz]

But Ray Bor. Ray Bork. If I put it on the poll at LeBatard Show, Greater Boston legend Brad Marchant or Ron Borges. Brad Marchant or Ray Borg.

[Mike Ryan]

Oh, I would pick Marshawn, probably.

[Amin Elhassan]

Marshawn didn't win, so probably.

[Stugotz]

No, but they were. The last time I remember Boston having a hockey moment like this is when Ray Bork won in Colorado and they brought him. They brought the parade back to Boston because Ray Bourke won in Colorado.

[Chris Cody]

And this.

[Stugotz]

This town obviously develops its allegiances very strongly and emotionally to players, but this guy getting the sweet one when he is nationally hated and six months ago was hated by Mike Ryan. Like to find. To find a sweet spot with two cities because your grit beats the respect out of people. And you're just, just. You're an annoying player. You're somebody other players do not like. You're not. I would say that you're not a light. Hell, not a likable player. Given that Paul Marie said himself, I had a certain idea about what this guy was before I spent time with him. It's. It's sort of like seeing Tai Domi get this. Like, it's not. This kind of player doesn't usually get this. It's not Tai Domi. I understand it's not Tai Domi, but I'm just saying it's a player who's viewed as annoying to other fan bases and other teams in a way that not a lot of other players are.

[Amin Elhassan]

Well, and to that extent, I don't think anyone. It was a national audience last night. I don't think anyone appreciated that moment last night outside of Boston fans and Panther fans. Like, that is not a likable player out there.

[Mike Ryan]

I thought what struck me is that it wasn't just Boston loving Marchand. It was obvious that it was reciprocal and is deep. Coming from Marshawn to Boston, he's a Bruin for life. If. If there was any doubt he could win two, three more Stanley Cups in sunrise, he's a Bruin for life. I feel like that's a beauty, beautiful thing to see.

[Amin Elhassan]

I felt like that went on like.

[Stugotz]

30 seconds extra, basically as like a.

[Amin Elhassan]

Statement to the organization of like, we don't agree. We didn't want him to be gone.

[Stugotz]

I feel like that there was a.

[Amin Elhassan]

Little extra there of like, yes, he.

[Stugotz]

Was an emotional player for them. Yes, they're going to miss him. But it's also they're mad at their.

[Amin Elhassan]

Organization because they never wanted him to.

[Stugotz]

Get let go last year.

[Amin Elhassan]

They wanted him to find a deal for him.

[Chris Cody]

I just want to be clear about one thing, Greg. You were driven to tears watching that.

[Mike Ryan]

Yes.

[Chris Cody]

And not emotional and not listening to Michael Jordan and Mike Tirico talk about.

[Stugotz]

We will get to that. I mean, I promise we will get.

[Chris Cody]

I would you want to clarify because maybe Greg was crying multiple times.

[Stugotz]

Well, Greg has already told us that is Mike Tirico fake laughing at Mike.

[Chris Cody]

That is not a fake laugh.

[Stugotz]

Hitting a free throw.

[Chris Cody]

Not a fake laugh.

[Stugotz]

It's really funny, Greg. Cody, as you've gotten later in life, you've been more likely to cry. Right. Sporting events might not make you do it, but you are now more of a crier than you used to be. Correct?

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah. I would say you started crying on.

[Stugotz]

Your podcast last week because I told you I drafted my daughter's soccer team.

[Mike Ryan]

That's true.

[Chris Cody]

That was.

[Mike Ryan]

I did talk about what a great father I think Christopher has turned out to be.

[Amin Elhassan]

Boy, how'd you get so soft?

[Mike Ryan]

And it made me tear up. Sorry. Not sorry.

[Stugotz]

When did this start happening to you where you. What would be the last sporting event that you found yourself crying? Because it. It really was a rare thing to see when the emotion jumps out of your television set in South Florida on hockey and this player, like, it's really disorienting to have the emotion sneak up on you. Oh, he's not gonna hold it together. Oh, he really loves fan base. Oh, this fan base really loves him. Oh, I love sports. This is why I love sports.

[Dan Le Batard]

Shaq is More disappointing than Conor McDavid.

[Amin Elhassan]

It's a wild take.

[Dan Le Batard]

He won three championships in a row. That's hard.

[Amin Elhassan]

Underachieved.

[Chris Cody]

You guys are just showing your age right now because you don't. Dan is. You guys want to make fun of Dan. Dan is spot on.

[Stugotz]

We're not complimental. We're not.

[Dan Le Batard]

Forget what you're doing.

[Amin Elhassan]

We're not saying that Shaq doesn't belong.

[Stugotz]

In this conversation, but to say that.

[Amin Elhassan]

There'S no player that underachieved.

[Stugotz]

That's why.

[Amin Elhassan]

Like he may be in a conversation, but It's a compliment.

[Dan Le Batard]

LeBron's won four Chris. His entire 30 year career, it seems.

[Chris Cody]

I'm telling you right now. When Shaq. Even at the height of Shaq winning, remember the. I got hurt on company time. I'm gonna rehab on company time. That happened, I think number two title. Number two. The expectations was this dude was going to be Bill Russell eight straight 10 out of 12. And the moment he didn't, he only had one MVP. People said, oh, you. That's all you got.

[Amin Elhassan]

That's not his fault though.

[Chris Cody]

You should have won.

[Amin Elhassan]

That's not his fault.

[Chris Cody]

What, what other one should he have won?

[Mike Ryan]

Nash.

[Chris Cody]

How dare you.

[Dan Le Batard]

I know you were this.

[Chris Cody]

Hold on. How dare you. I dare you dare not, sir. I'll be your ally on a lot of things where Cody.

[Stugotz]

Okay.

[Chris Cody]

This is not one of them.

[Mike Ryan]

Okay.

[Dan Le Batard]

All right.

[Mike Ryan]

I'm not alone. That kind of thing.

[Dan Le Batard]

A lot of haters didn't NASCAR like two in a row.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah, he did.

[Mike Ryan]

Great player for the little white guy.

[Amin Elhassan]

If you don't believe that Shaq underachieved. I feel like you don't remember how incredible.

[Dan Le Batard]

I'm open to that conversation. To put him on at the bronze medal stand of all time underachievers. When he did a three, I just put Aaron Rodgers.

[Stugotz]

I put Aaron Rodgers there.

[Dan Le Batard]

There's an argument for Aaron Patrick Mahomes, an underachiever. He could have win three in a row.

[Stugotz]

I, I don't really need to say much more than Shaq won one. Mvp. Steve Nash won two. Who do you think's the underachiever there? Like, Steve Nash won two MVPs. Shaq won one. In what world? In what world?

[Chris Cody]

This world, sir. Because.

[Stugotz]

No, but you, you understand what I'm saying?

[Chris Cody]

I'm your ally on this one. Like, like people now. It's going to sound ridiculous. I'm telling you. Even Shaq. Shaq talks about like, I have zero margin for error. Anything I do is not good enough. Because the Expectations are a guy that big, that skilled, that athletic. Right. That kind of footwork, which a lot of people did not at the time, I think appreciate. He wasn't just big, he had crazy footwork and he was smart as crap around the around. I don't know why I edited this.

[Stugotz]

Crap is not smart. Crap is not smart. Like, I don't know.

[Chris Cody]

Smart as hell.

[Stugotz]

Yeah, smart as crap.

[Mike Ryan]

I've never heard that phrase.

[Chris Cody]

Right. And again, the explosion. So most of the time you think of big guys that size, they're not. They don't have that kind of vertical, they don't have that kind of first step. So all of these things were combined that, oh, this guy's going to be ringing, ringing up the rings over and over again. And it started with that first finals loss. It's not that they lost, it's that they got swept by a succeed. And that's when it started with this guy's an underachiever.

[Stugotz]

Well, no, Amin can also tell you that what also started is next year. Oh, all of a sudden he's got post moves that he didn't have the following year because he went how many years without doing much of anything in the post other than dunking? Like he wasn learn he was getting smoked by Hakeem Olajuwon's skill set.

[Amin Elhassan]

And he didn't try defensively. Like, he wasn't close. The defensive player he became under Phil Jackson, he was not remotely close to that before.

[Chris Cody]

I mean, his early years when he was young and dumb and didn't know any better, he was pretty good defensively. And then as he starts to realize I, I have. You got really scared over there.

[Dan Le Batard]

I thought we thought we were going to go, yeah. And that defensive player, that's usually how it goes.

[Chris Cody]

We talked about this. We talked about this the other day, Mike. Right. Like, it's like it only takes one, right? That's the saying. Although the extended saying is a little different. Same thing with young and dumb is extended saying that we don't say on air. Then we just leave it to young and dumb. But he was decent defensively. Clearly when he got with Phil Jackson, he bought into being a better defender. It's not, I think it was again, choice. A lot of what the stuff that Dan is talking about is that there's an appearance of choice with check. He chose to be in shape. He chose to become a better defender. He chose to take the first couple of months of the season off to rehab a toe injury that he could have rehabbed during the off season. These are all Shaq choices. Whereas a lot of these other guys are like, oh, you weren't good enough. You choked. We didn't talk about that with Shaq. We just talk about. Man, you could have been so much better.

[Amin Elhassan]

Yep.

[Dan Le Batard]

Howdy listeners. It's Mike Ryan and Chris Cody. Hey, everyone. Hey, Chris. We love hanging out so much. You were at my birthday the other day.

[Mike Ryan]

You're old.

[Dan Le Batard]

You know what I saw in your hand?

[Chris Cody]

What?

[Dan Le Batard]

A can of Miller Light. Whether it's a can, whether it's a bottle, a draft pour of Miller Light, the draft bore. You see that beautiful iconic color right away.

[Amin Elhassan]

The ice coldness to it.

[Chris Cody]

Oh, so good.

[Dan Le Batard]

Yes, Chris, the ice coldness to it. Oh, whether you're hanging out with me on my birthday because I'm old or you're at a game, you know that Miller Lite just makes every special time a Miller time. That's how you make the special times by making a Miller time. Game day just hits different with Miller Lite in your hand. Hittin different from jaw dropping touchdowns to fantasy heartbreaks. It's a beer that has been there for every moment. 50 years of great taste, simple ingredients and that iconic golden color. That coldness, Chris, that.

[Stugotz]

That icy coldness.

[Dan Le Batard]

That icy coldness. The original light beer since 1975 and still hitting different five decades later. Miller Lite Great Taste. 96 calories. Go to millerlight.com dan to find delivery options options near you or you can pick up some Miller Lite pretty much anywhere they sell beer. It's Miller time. Celebrate responsibly. Miller Brewing Co. Milwaukee, Wisconsin. 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces. I see coldness. Quick break. Here to talk to you about the official ticketing partner of the Dan LeBatard show, folks, it's Mike Ryan. You know how much I love this product. I use it frequently. I'm often buying tickets on the secondary market and for me, Gametime has always been the best place to go for NFL tickets, concert tickets, comedy shows. It's just the best. Here's why. Zone deals favorites. Panoramic seat views. The lowest price guarantee where Gametime will credit you 110% of the difference. I love that thing. Gametime's ticket coverage. Your purchase is covered with the most flexible customer service policy in the ticketing industry. You get all those guarantees packed join what many in our show have already done. They download that Gametime app because Gametime guarantees you can trust you'll be getting 100% authentic tickets on time and at the Best price plus fees are always included. So what you see is what you pay. Take the guesswork out of buying NFL tickets with GameTime. Download the GameTime app, create an account and use code DAN for $20 off your first purchase terms. Apply again, create an account and redeem code DA for $20 off. Swipe, tap, ticket. Go download the GameTime app today.

[Tony]

Hey, it's Tony from the Dan Levitar show. And I gotta tell you something that makes me feel a lot safer with my wife and kid at home. It's simply safe. Most security systems only react after a break in and that's too late if you want to be honest. Real security stops crime before it even starts. I just watched a video that was absolutely terrifying. An arsonist trying to light a family home on fire. And you know what? SimpliSafe stopped it before anybody got hurt. Their AI powered camera spotted the threat, alerted the monitoring agent, and the intruder got confronted while still outside the house. That's what I call real security. Pre security, not post security. I trust Simplisafe with my home, my family and everything I care about. No hidden fees, no long term contracts. And they've been named one of the best home security systems by U.S. news for five years running. Right now, Levitar show listeners can get 50% off a SimpliSafe system [e-mail] DLB that's SimpliSafe.com DLB try it risk free with their 60 day money back guarantee and see why I trust them so much. There's no safe like SimpliSafe.

[Stugotz]

Don LeBatard and then Matt Stafford.

[Mike Ryan]

Oh, there's a brand new kid in town out of byu.

[Dan Le Batard]

Stugots they call them.

[Mike Ryan]

His quarterback is not named to us. Yeah, he is. Puka. Puka Nakua.

[Dan Le Batard]

This is the Dan Levatar show with the Stugats.

[Stugotz]

Before we get to some things about the coverage last night and the NBA returning, I did want to read to you guys a couple of quotes and just have a larger conversation as it relates to TUA and respect and what it feels like to be in a room with lost respect. Okay. When you're tua specifically, I want to tie this to something that I heard Dave Dombrowski say the other day about Bryce Harper. Okay? And you know people are gonna say that Bryce Harper is gonna get hurt by this. Dombrowski, the general manager, hall of Fame general manager of the Phillies says of Bryce Harper, he's still a quality player. He's still an all star caliber player. He didn't have an elite season like he's had in the past. I guess we only find out if he begin. If he becomes elite or continues to be good. Can he rise to the next level again? I don't really know the answer. He's the one that will dictate that more than anything else. I don't think he's the year that he had again, it wasn't a bad year. But when I think of Bryce Harper, you think elite, you think one of the top 10 players in baseball. And I don't think it fit into that category. End quote. Bryce Harper's got six years remaining on a 13 year, $330 million contract. Bryce Harper probably wouldn't disagree with that in private. Bryce or Bryce Harper probably wouldn't have much of an issue with it if Dave Dombrowski said it to his face. I'm guessing Bryce Harper feels disrespected that Dave Dombrowski said that honest truth out loud that then lies the blame for, hey, you can't be better than the Dodgers. We need Bryce Harper to be better than the Dodgers three best players. Or with Schwarber and Trey Turner, we're going to keep losing to the Dodgers three best players. So the disrespect, my point is can be ever so slight, ever so slight and wound you no matter how much money you make. If TUA lost the respect of the room, given that the games are all close in that league, given how bad the Cleveland Browns are, what would players quitting around him look like? Would it look like Sunday players quitting around him because they no longer respect what they're playing for? The season's already lost. They all know they're one in five. They know they're playing a bad team. They know they stink. And their quarterback just told everybody, I'm the reason that we could have won against the Chargers. Everyone else and leadership is wrong. My question to all of you would be, are you willing to make the leap to two was under it at least in part hurts the most because he's lost the entire respect of the room that he's in. And if they didn't quit on Sunday, quitting would have looked a lot like that. You wouldn't have been able to tell much of the difference.

[Mike Ryan]

Well, quitting would have looked like the quarterback throwing three interceptions. Two is the only one who I thought looked like he might have quit, which is preposterous because he's the one with the most most approved. The defense had a good game. Okay? Make no mistake about that.

[Stugotz]

That's A bad offense. It's a really bad. It's 17 points or fewer in 11 straight game. I understand you allowed 31. No, no, that's Gabriel.

[Amin Elhassan]

He had a pick six and he had another pick that was on the five yard line. I think Greg's kind of right about.

[Mike Ryan]

If you think the defense was responsible for 31 points. You didn't watch that game. The defense played very well. They. They barely gave up very well, that offense. They gave up barely 200 yards in total offense. The defense did not cost them that game. The offense was awful and Tua was awful. I didn't see anybody quitting. Maybe you did great.

[Tony]

The defense didn't have to do anything. They had the ball inside the Dolphins territory like 19 times in the game. Judkins was running wildcat quarterback.

[Chris Cody]

Right.

[Stugotz]

I'm not saying. I'm not actually saying they quit. I'm asking you guys what it would look like if a room lost respect for its leader. What that would feel like to the person who's trying to have the press conference after the game in which he played so poorly. Would it wreck your confidence if you were surrounded by a bunch of people who were mad at you? I'm asking in a very human way. Would it wreck your confidence if you were trying to do anything with a room full of people who you have a relationship with who are now mad at you because you've publicly blamed them in a way that gets the coach to reprimand you the next day because of how out of character and how unprofessional that is for a quarterback to do?

[Amin Elhassan]

I think the place you would see it first would be on the offensive and defensive lines. The reason that I say that is because that's probably the area of the field where you have to exert the most effort, the most energy. And if you have a player who you are mad at, this case, it's the leader of the team. You get down, whatever, it's 17, six, you feel like you're not going to win, you stop giving that max effort. I would say, like when you're getting gassed for 150 rushing yards a game or you're not blocking very well on the offensive line, I feel like that's the first place that you would see a lack of.

[Stugotz]

I'm not saying they quit. I'm saying how much worse than 31 to 6 to the Browns who don't score against them, would it have been if they had.

[Amin Elhassan]

No, that's rock bottom, bottom. Like, it doesn't get worse than that. That we saw last week.

[Mike Ryan]

I know. The problem is the Dolphins keep hitting new rock bottoms. I thought the opener at Indy was rock bottom.

[Amin Elhassan]

No, but the Browns are. The Browns like the Colts are not the Browns.

[Dan Le Batard]

Browns are a joke this season. Yeah, they're terrible.

[Stugotz]

Other than the Colts have been close. The Dolphin games are close. The Colts game wasn't. We now know the Colts to be good. The Browns are not good. The Browns are as bad as the Dolphins. And I'm. I'm legitimate.

[Dan Le Batard]

Wasn't close the a bad football team. One that Dolphins fans enter the season thinking they were surely better than part of the schedule. Yeah. This was the get right part. And when you all right. We dropped one in Indianapolis. Thank God we got Cleveland there. And Cleveland was looking at you too. Saying fool, you're worse than us.

[Stugotz]

We're looking at the Cleveland Atlanta back to back at the start of the season.

[Dan Le Batard]

Carolina too.

[Mike Ryan]

Yeah. And now Atlanta's got Bichon Robinson against the worst run defense in the league.

[Dan Le Batard]

I think the problem with Dolphin fans nationally is like you guys were thinking that of the other teams and the other team's fan bases knew you were the joke.

[Stugotz]

Stephen Ross. It's being reported the owner of the Dolphins has been offered. Barry Jackson reported this has been offered $10 billion for the dolphins.

[Dan Le Batard]

Really?

[Stugotz]

And turned it down. Turned it down because he wants his daughter to keep it. If you do not know the history of Dolphins ownership. Joe Robbie built a stadium with his own money. Got very little credit for it and ended up bankrupting his family. They had to sell the team in order to take. You know they couldn't take on the debt of that stadium. Huize planned on building Disney World down here. Wanted to buy all the team.

[Amin Elhassan]

Where's my water park?

[Stugotz]

Wanted to buy. Wanted. Wanted to put a water park around the stadium.

[Amin Elhassan]

Where's my water park?

[Tony]

As the same thing about Metro Zoo too. They were supposed to have water park there.

[Stugotz]

What happened there brought like his. He tried to get around the rules of buying multiple teams by having his brother in law Whit Watson try and buy the heat. Pretending hiding in the shadows. He just wanted to put it all together. Steven Ross's team is not worth $10 billion. The land in the stadium that he has that allow him that is built up What Robbie and Huizenga did make it so that the Broncos represent with Walmart the highest price that has gone for a. Is that still the right number Commanders go for seven.

[Chris Cody]

So the seven, I believe.

[Stugotz]

Okay.

[Dan Le Batard]

I thought without a stadium deal.

[Stugotz]

I thought it was Denver that was the most. It may be Washington that was the most. After that, regardless, this would be three or four billion dollars more than that because of the stadium. As a Miami Herald reporter, I'm only Herald emeritus. Your thoughts are what on the Barry Jackson report that apparently Zaslow believe?

[Mike Ryan]

Well, everybody knows the, the Miami Dolphins franchise alone is not worth 10 million. 10 billion or close to it. But when you factor in the stadium, when you factor in the racetrack, you're, you're, you're also buying for that money an F1 race.

[Amin Elhassan]

Imagine if it had a water park.

[Mike Ryan]

You're, you're buying not only an F1 race, you're buying a major tennis tournament. So you're buying all of these things. And I've said for years, Steve, even Ross has been a bad owner of the Miami Dolphins. But he's been great at developing that whole thing. I mean, that's a masterclass in how to increase the value of what you own. On the same.

[Stugotz]

What's the job? What is the job? Because this part's always confusing to me, right. Roger Goodell has done a good job as commissioner of the league. Why everything goes up. Jerry Jones has done a good job as the owner of the Cowboys.

[Chris Cody]

Why?

[Stugotz]

Because it's the most valuable franchise. It's worth more than the $10 billion that we're talking about here.

[Chris Cody]

Here.

[Stugotz]

Steven Ross has done a good job because he's a good businessman. Like he's a bad owner. I, I separate the two things. One of them make you a good businessman. That doesn't make you a good owner. He's been a terrible owner.

[Dan Le Batard]

That stadium was trash before. Stephen Ross again.

[Stugotz]

I don't get my major upgrade again. Yes. That's nice.

[Dan Le Batard]

My game day experience is so much better. Thank you. Steven Ross.

[Amin Elhassan]

Yeah, it plays a m. It plays a major role. I think I did there.

[Mike Ryan]

And they have international soccer there. I mean, it's a multi use stadium. Nobody thinks Steven Ross has been a good NFL owner, but it doesn't mean he hasn't been great at capital improvement. And the fact that the Dolphins stink that they haven't won a playoff game in more than 20 years decreases the value of that franchise. Hardly anything decreases the value by $6. It doesn't matter whether you're buying a winning franchise or not. You're buying an NFL franchise. The most valuable thing in sports.

[Chris Cody]

Just looked it up on Forbes. Yes, it was. Is reduced by exactly $6.

[Stugotz]

It's amazing. You got that exactly right.

[Chris Cody]

He's done his research. Also, Dan, to clarify something, the most expensive NFL team sale was the Commanders for 6.05 billion. The Broncos went for 4.65 billion three years earlier.

[Tony]

To this point, like, none of those teams were winning franchises.

[Dan Le Batard]

The Broncos want a suit, but the Commander is like, you want to talk about an ownership, an ownership group that was hated by its fan base and all the things that you could say about Steven Ross, multiply that by 10. When it came to Daniel Snyder and look more than way more than 10.

[Amin Elhassan]

I think like 11.

[Dan Le Batard]

The stadium is still trash. They didn't have a stadium agreement in there, and they found a way to get the money that they did.

[Chris Cody]

To answer your question, Dan, what is it? What makes a good owner? Right. I think a big part of it is investment into the infrastructure and the.

[Amin Elhassan]

Fan experience, which is done in a big way.

[Chris Cody]

Because at the end of the day, the thing that you can't really control, and I know people don't want to hear this, you can't control the results on the field. And from everything we know about Steven Ross, it hasn't been for a lack of trying. This isn't him being petty. This isn't him being Jim Dolan petty. This isn't him being Robert Sarver chief. This is just, hey, man, it's tough to win in this sport without, like, having certain things, namely a great franchise quarterback.

[Stugotz]

Oh, but I don't believe that I could throw to the audience here if I. If I say to the audience, any sport, hey, don't do faces, don't do uniforms. Haven't won a playoff game in 20 years. Same owner. The entire. Is that a good owner? Is that a good owner? Like, there's no amount of concessions. You're going to convince any fan that that bottom line. Like, the bottom line isn't money, man. The bottom line is, do you do any winning at all? Any winning at all? Like, yeah, you can be worse. You can be Woody Johnson giving the press conference that he gave yesterday, which sounds, you know, you don't want him in front of microphones ever. Like, you'll notice that Stephen Rose Ross is not in front of microphones. You do not want to throw lighter fluid on. On this burning building.

[Chris Cody]

So I'll give you an example. Not with us anymore. But Larry Miller was the owner of the Utah Jazz, right? Was. They were instrumental for the Jazz being in Utah. Right? That team won a lot of games, Never won a championship. I don't think you find anyone in Utah who would say a bad word about Larry Miller as the owner for the Jazz.

[Amin Elhassan]

That's not the same thing. That team was always good winning. What, like the Bromer's not winning a Super bowl, it's doing any kind of winning.

[Stugotz]

There is literally no example that I can give the audience right now where I would say, Hey, 25 years, no winning, no winning. Same owner the entire time. Is that a good owner that anyone's given me a name? Hey, he built a racetrack.

[Mike Ryan]

You're ignoring the fact that you can be both. You can be a bad sports owner for the Miami Dolphins and great at building perhaps the greatest sports mechanics facility wise in the entire country. And one of the reasons they have the World cup next year, a shout out to the late Joe Robbie. It was Joe Robbie who was foresightful enough to build that stadium and that field with international soccer in mind before anybody cared about international soccer in this country.

[Dan Le Batard]

Fans can't disassociate on field success with how they think of the owner. But look at a town like Buffalo. The Pulas have kept the Sabres, have kept the Bills there, have built a new stadium that'll be unveiled next year. That's a small market. They have done things for that community that are greatly appreciated and yet they don't win a championship. So if you pull the fan base over there, it's a divided opinion.

[Tony]

Dan, are you. When you talk about the ownership and winning playoff games and whatever, like Jerry Jones is kind of that answer, right? Like, have they won three or four playoff games in a matter of 25 years, but yet the valuation of the Cowboys still goes up.

[Dan Le Batard]

They're still.

[Stugotz]

I'm just surprised at the measurement you guys are doing for Goodell, for Jerry Jones, for Steven Ross, that you guys are all counting in dollars. You're not using the stand again.

[Chris Cody]

I'm not just going dollars because again, Jerry Jones is an excellent example. Cowboys fans, number one. They have one of the best stadiums in the world. Their game day experience is elite. Right. There's a pride that they have there. And for all of the failure that Jerry Jones has done, they all believe we got a chance. This guy gives us a chance because he'll spend, because he'll do what it takes. And sometimes that's all you can really ask for. 4.

[Amin Elhassan]

He's also won three Super Bowls.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah, but that's a million years ago. Come on. Still having a hot tub.

[Stugotz]

It is. It is interesting to me every time that we talk about Steven Ross here, even at present, when they've got like an international embarrassment on their hands and we still talk about him as if he's maybe not the worst owner in the history of South Florida. And now Jerry Jones is the example when he doesn't even know the names of his players.

[Dan Le Batard]

Michael Parson. Now's a good time to remember where tequila's story truly began. In 1795, Cuervo invented tequila.

[Stugotz]

Cuervo.

[Dan Le Batard]

What are you doing here?

[Stugotz]

Cuervo? Anytime someone says Cuervo, I show up.

[Dan Le Batard]

Well, I do know that to be true. But even during ad reads like Cuervo, I think he could lay out, especially for one of our great partners.

[Stugotz]

Sweet, delicious Cuervo.

[Dan Le Batard]

Since then, Cuervo has stayed true to its roots. The same family, the same land, the same passion.

[Stugotz]

Cuervo.

[Dan Le Batard]

So enjoy the tequila that started it all. Cuervo.

[Stugotz]

Cuervo.

[Dan Le Batard]

The tequila that invented tequila. Proximo. Cuervo.

[Mike Ryan]

Com.

[Dan Le Batard]

Please drink responsibly.

[Stugotz]

Cuervo.