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- [00:00]
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- [00:31]
Dan Le Batard
Now's a good time to remember where tequila's story truly began. In 1795, Cuervo invented tequila. Cuervo, what are you doing here? Cuervo?
- [00:40]
Stugatz
Anytime someone says Cuervo, I show up.
- [00:42]
Dan Le Batard
Well, I do know that to be true. But even during ad reads like Cuervo, I think he could lay out especially for one of our great partners.
- [00:49]
Stugatz
Sweet, delicious Cuervo.
- [00:50]
Dan Le Batard
Since then, Cuervo has stayed true to its roots. The same family, the same land, the same passion.
- [00:55]
Stugatz
Cuervo.
- [00:56]
Dan Le Batard
So enjoy the tequila that started it all. Cuervo. Cuervo, the tequila that invented tequila. Proximo. Cuervo.com Please drink responsibly.
- [01:04]
Stugatz
Cuervo.
- [01:06]
Billy Gill
This is the Dan Levator show with the Stugats podcast.
- [01:16]
Stugatz
I walk in today.
- [01:18]
Billy Gill
What happened?
- [01:18]
Stugatz
I mean, I just. I walk in today and I didn't check the schedule. Yeah. And I'm like, oh, no, this crew is working today. This is the group that carries us into the future.
- [01:33]
Mike Ryan
It's a solid crew, man.
- [01:34]
Stugatz
No, no, I'll tell you why it's not a solid crew, okay? Because I know what I'm walking into, first of all, okay. Where Mike Ryan and Amin are on basketball. I know Mike Ryan is going to want to get on this bandwagon, and I know Amin's not going to let him. The basketball of the last two nights, Stugazi.
- [01:50]
Dan Le Batard
You are aware that it's a headphone, not an iPhone. What is happening here?
- [01:55]
Stugatz
Well, I'll tell you what's happening now. Thank you for asking. I was trying to figure out if I could do today's entire show, just close my eyes and listen to it so that I can hear our show instead of see it. Because I never cared for anyone to see it. So the reason that I was doing that is because I don't want to work with you guys today.
- [02:13]
Dan Le Batard
Oh, wait. Are we doing don't look now. Are we.
- [02:15]
Stugatz
I don't.
- [02:16]
Dan Le Batard
Are we doing don't look now?
- [02:17]
Stugatz
No, no, we're not doing. Don't look now. I don't want to do. Don't look now.
- [02:21]
Dan Le Batard
Ready? Strapp down the furniture.
- [02:23]
Stugatz
Right. Okay, great, great. Let's look. Let's. In a contract year with DraftKings. Yeah, let's. Let's go into the future and beat everyone else up because. Don't look now. We're wearing blindfolds and it's sponsored.
- [02:36]
Dan Le Batard
Yeah, look, it's limited in scope, but the execution's been stellar so far anyway, so it's not.
- [02:42]
Stugatz
So this is the reason that I dread today's crew. And I want to listen to our old show as people who all bet on each other because we make big bets at DraftKings. We cash them, we win them. That's how that works for our show. Amin and Mike Ryan, I'm hoping, are going to argue about basketball. But the last time that happened, it gets ugly. They're emotional, defensive.
- [03:02]
Dan Le Batard
Hope people argue.
- [03:03]
Stugatz
No. And walking into the mix is Stu Gotz, and he is doing the show that I'm afraid that people who are really old want to do. And it's a good show. He hates the traffic, and so he's coming in here today. And I want to do a. A good show that celebrates basketball, not fixes basketball the way Mike's trying to be doing for how long? And Stu got. Comes in complaining about the traffic.
- [03:30]
Mike Ryan
Is there somebody that likes traffic? Like, who enjoys traffic? No one enjoys traffic. I have to tell you, I have noticed that the construction where the turnpike down here meets 95, they have done some stellar construction work, but it causes problems elsewhere on my route to the. To the studios here. Dan, Today's drive, two hours plus. I can't handle it, man. I can't.
- [03:56]
Amin Elhassan
I don't mind traffic when I'm not driving. If I'm in the backseat, like if I'm in an Uber. And I don't have to be anywhere on time. In particular, I'll sit in traffic because I like messing on my phone. I like. People say, where are you? I'm like, I'm not there yet.
- [04:09]
Mike Ryan
And just someone else is driving because here you take an elevator.
- [04:12]
Amin Elhassan
I mean, well, that's not always a kiss.
- [04:16]
Stugatz
Billy, why are you wearing a neck brace?
- [04:19]
Mike Ryan
Traffic.
- [04:20]
Dan Le Batard
See, look at. Look at what you would have missed if your eyes were closed.
- [04:23]
Billy Gill
Got in a car accident yesterday. Oh, wow. Yeah. You okay? Hipaa. See what I'm saying? Can't go any further, I was told. I think those are the rules. I don't think I'm allowed to Disclose my own medical information?
- [04:35]
Dan Le Batard
Am I investigation?
- [04:38]
Billy Gill
Penny, I got hit by a Suburban.
- [04:39]
Amin Elhassan
Really?
- [04:39]
Billy Gill
Oh, yeah, really. Well, not me. My car got hit by a Suburban. If it was me, I'd be in more than that. I thought that this would be a little discreet, so I wasn't. You can see it. I wore my most zippable hoodie.
- [04:54]
Stugatz
Well, I am so happy, Billy, that you are here, because this was one of the reasons that I was like, oh, this crew today, because Mike and Amin are gonna get too serious about basketball. And I didn't think you were in today on a Wild Billy Wednesday.
- [05:09]
Billy Gill
Oh, I'm here. Loopy. But here.
- [05:11]
Stugatz
Well, this disappointed me. That. Can we get that?
- [05:14]
Mike Ryan
He's here.
- [05:14]
Stugatz
No, no. I thought we were doing Wild Willie Wednesday, and then I got in here, and Billy wasn't here, and I'm like, what are we doing? Not this crew. And here comes Stugatz two minutes before showtime, wandering around the studio, snorting about traffic.
- [05:29]
Billy Gill
Yeah, traffic wasn't great.
- [05:32]
Dan Le Batard
No.
- [05:32]
Billy Gill
But I decided to stop to get another car and then come in. That's why it was a little bit. Yeah.
- [05:36]
Amin Elhassan
I want to point out that Billy looks like George Sodano doing a Christmas game.
- [05:41]
Stugatz
It was strange. I just looked up, and he looked a bit like a doll. Like a. Like, I don't know, some sort of espionage dol.
- [05:48]
Dan Le Batard
See, this is why you can't have your eyes closed, because you're not even talking into the microphone. You can't see the microphone. This is. You know, I'm going to.
- [05:54]
Stugatz
I'm aging, Mike, Listen to me. I'm aging in front of people, and I'm trying to hide it. I miss our old audio show. This is a video show now, and I like doing video, but I miss our old audio show, and so can I do the show this? No.
- [06:09]
Dan Le Batard
No. It's a weird look. If I could have a camera fixated on any single person in the world yesterday, I'll tell you who I'd pick. And I wish I had this superpower that every day I could just get a 24. 7 feed on one person.
- [06:24]
Mike Ryan
Okay.
- [06:25]
Dan Le Batard
And it could be something that I decide at the end of the day, like, retroactively. Like, this person had the most interesting.
- [06:29]
Stugatz
Day fly on the wall.
- [06:31]
Dan Le Batard
I would love to be the captain aboard the USS Harry Truman when that second plane fell into the ocean. They lost another plane on the same warship.
- [06:45]
Billy Gill
Wow.
- [06:45]
Amin Elhassan
Well, the good news is they're not that expensive. Right. They're like, 12, 13 bucks.
- [06:49]
Dan Le Batard
I mean, I've gone my entire life, and I'm sure this has happened before, but I'd never heard about it and I sure as shit had never heard about it in consecutive weeks. I would love to see this person be delivered the news that they lost a second plane off the same aircraft carrier. Who would you pick? Jerry Jones? I mean that George Pickens acquisition seems like pretty interesting. I would love to know that Halliburton.
- [07:15]
Stugatz
Is 10 for 11 on shots to tie or take the lead in the last two minutes this year.
- [07:19]
Dan Le Batard
And they're like weird game winners. They're like four point plays or missed free throws on purpose. They're not even like good looking shots. And he's just a killer. I wish his dad was there for it.
- [07:31]
Stugatz
Amin. Please, please take me through the emotion of this Ernie Johnson salute to you, sir. I want to be able to do different basketball analysis than we've been doing, Amin, because I think even though it's small, sample sized theater and even though I'm sure, I'm sure most basketball fans know that not having Evan Mobley out there changes everything. Like it, it's, it doesn't allow. You're going to disagree with that.
- [07:59]
Amin Elhassan
I mean it does, but that's not why they lost the game. Like, yes, in general, not having Evan Mobley and by the way, Darius Garland, another All stars. Not having two all stars out there and DeAndre Hunter who has been their sixth man basically since the trade deadline. Massive before you start the game. And then that game happened and they were kicking Indiana's ass up and down the floor. And what happened at the end was you saw and Kenny Atkinson again shout out to coaches taking accountability. He says, my regret is that I didn't go deeper in my bench in the second half and in the fourth quarter in particular because we ran out of gas. Because I tightened the rotation and they just took advantage of that.
- [08:36]
Stugatz
The thing that I find so interesting about all that's happening out here, I mean, because okay, whatever, I mean, Mobley's out, but that was a great regular season team. And when Donovan Mitchell scores 48, most teams almost always win. Unless you're playing against Jokic in the bubble and he's got Jamal Murray. But Donovan Mitchell wins, plays that game. Donovan Mitchell did the thing the star has to do at home to save the series.
- [09:02]
Mike Ryan
Yes.
- [09:03]
Stugatz
Like the very thing he's like, cleveland, okay, we got a one. I know everybody says it's Allen and Mobley and Garland. No, it's not. It's me and are you guys coming? But Atkinson, are you going to use Mobley a better Way. And now that team is on the brink and on the brink after an amazing regular season that made us forget, hey, you know, the Cavs are always the cavs, except when LeBron's not there. Right? Like that. The Cavs. The Cavs, for a long time have been the Cavs, and now they're a winner.
- [09:29]
Amin Elhassan
Yes.
- [09:30]
Stugatz
And Indiana's got him buried with one of the most interesting players in the sport. They. All the. All the others say he's overrated. 10 for 11 on shots to tie or take the lead in the last two minutes this year. Like everyone's telling me, Brunson's clutch, and he is because he does it empirically. But that's clutch.
- [09:48]
Amin Elhassan
Yes and no. Right. So, yes, you're right. They have a reputation. But I think they shook that reputation this year. I think last night, again, was a case of one team ran out of gas, a shorthanded team that was up ran out of gas, and both coaches cited the physicality and the ability to defend aggressively in a way that you can't during the regular season. And neither of them complained. Neither of them was like, they got to get a hold of this. It's like, hey, man, this is the playoffs. We got to get around it. Donovan Mitchell did all the things the superstar is supposed to do. The problem is Donovan Mitchell ran out of steam, ran out of gas. And there are two plays in particular where you can kind of see that. One is that offensive rebound. That was his. His basically blockout. And then the other one is, is when he's basically kind of falling apart right there at the end. You know, he. He can't even turn up the court without kind of bumping into somebody and collapsing. And so for me, I look at that game as Indiana, excuse me, Cleveland had the perfect game plan. They executed. They ran out of gas, Indiana took advantage. And then. And by the way, the thing I wanted to mention, Dan, is I didn't see Indiana take up 800 three pointers to get that done. They took the available shots. They were driving lanes again and again and again, and they took advantage of that. And that's the difference between what happened to Boston the other night and what happened in Indiana last night.
- [11:16]
Stugatz
Okay, but the reason I want to talk about how analysis changes, right? We just talked the other day about, like, all our lives we've done, man, role players on the road, always bad, always bad. You never get anything from them. And then Buddy Heald goes from zero in game six to, oh, he's carrying all of them. We'll Talk about Butler and Curry, but it's a role player on the road goes 9 for 11 from threes. So everyone's talking about how the game has changed and the threes dominate all and Karl Anthony Towns is a million miles away. And we're complaining the Celtics are champions, but we don't like to watch how they play because all they do is take step back threes. That's boring. Stop perfecting that. Is Joe Missoula a good coach? Like that's something that happened on our show yesterday. So if the game spreads out like that, now we hate Harden. He ruined the game. Mvp. Oh, but never great. Whatever. If we're doing all of the math on Indiana Cleveland, this is how Halliburton becomes a star. You slay this dragon this way because they're the underdogs. Ernie Johnson told us watch this series because the Pacers can beat anybody in the modern age. And the thing I wanted to ask all of you, we can usually do this with basketball pretty simply. It's really predictable. 1, 2, 3, 5, 1, 1, 3, 4, 5. Like at the end it's going to be the 1, the 2, the 3 and the 4, or the 1, 2, 3 and 5. And it will get there some way. But last year it was Dallas. They come through the middle and the Pacers could beat everyone because they have the elements in the modern game. And I'm wondering, I mean, if today, more than any day before, basketball can be less predictable than it was because the Pacers can make a ton of threes and change everything.
- [12:58]
Amin Elhassan
But that's my point. They didn't make a ton of threes. That's my exact point. They didn't come back because they made a ton of threes. They came back because they upped their defensive intensity and tried to get threes. But instead because Cleveland was rightfully defending the three point line so well, you got Siakam to the rim, you. You got Halliburton to the rim a couple of times, you got great offensive rebounding, you got Myles Turner right in the front of the rim. And then Halliburton hits a three at the end to win the game. But that wasn't a three point barrage that did them in. That was them playing methodical, good, smart basketball. Which is why, Dan, what I said yesterday, and it's not that Indiana's not a three point shooting team, this is not a philosophical thing, but what I said is they're not robots. And the problem with Boston is coach said I gotta shoot a three. No, you don't. Have to do that. If you got a one on one with Jalen Brunson on an island, you don't have to shoot him, I promise you.
- [13:49]
Stugatz
But this. So this part's so interesting to me, Stugance, because do you see what's happening here? Right. For the last two years, no one's really bothered or challenged Boston. And so Mike Ryan is whimpering around here. Somebody make Tatum earn it. Make him, make him win.
- [14:08]
Mike Ryan
The Knicks are doing it.
- [14:09]
Stugatz
Yeah.
- [14:10]
Dan Le Batard
We had general consensus even when we talked to Juju in the post game. Like he was. He. It's fair to question this team and want to see them do it. That's all I want to see. The same way I wanted to see Steph Curry do it in the final and be the best player. And he. And he was. And the same way that I just want the NBA to be good. And this second, this second round has been really fascinating. They've been really compelling games. And this, this will get the people in. I love Halliburton as a. Sorry. Like he literally went into a WWE ring and had a face off with Jalen Brunson. Like he likes being the bad guy. Hell, his dad likes being the bad guy. I know he was a star before, but if he has moments like that in these big upper echelon games and he makes a deeper run, it is so great to watch a superstar totally ascend right before your very eyes.
- [15:00]
Mike Ryan
Do he needs to have moments like that against Boston or against the Knicks? You would agree though, right? Reggie Miller had that moment. They made a 30 for 30 over it.
- [15:09]
Dan Le Batard
I think Halliburton had one of the. We were. Remember that show that we did a few months back? Like what are regular season moments that you remember? I remember Halliburton against Milwaukee and winning that game and probably when they had what was a win probability for Milwaukee? Over 99%. These are the moments. These are where people become legends. We've seen it in that uniform. To your point.
- [15:33]
Stugatz
Stugach just whispered in my ear and I missed these tickles from him because he just sort of belched out of the side of his mouth, whispered just to me muttered, really ran out of gas.
- [15:45]
Mike Ryan
How about you grab a rebound?
- [15:47]
Stugatz
Okay, so I mean this part I want you to help me analyze. Okay? Please. Since 1997 teams are 3 and 1640 when trailing by 7 plus in the final minute of the fourth quarter overtime. The Pacers this postseason have two of those wins. Okay, I'm sorry.
- [16:08]
Dan Le Batard
Amin had no idea about the WWE segment in which Halliburton and Jalen Brunson had a face to face showdown.
- [16:16]
Amin Elhassan
I thought he was like doing like allegories or whatever.
- [16:18]
Stugatz
No, I mean. So this is the problem with you and Mike's relationship around basketball, and this is where you guys have no chemistry. Okay? Halliburton wants to be a star and Mike Ryan wishes for him to be a star. As Mike Ryan arrives at basketball and says to Halliburton, hey, tell me stories and bring your dad. And what are you here to say?
- [16:40]
Dan Le Batard
He didn't say that. He said they miss Evan Mobley.
- [16:43]
Mike Ryan
He said they ran out of gas.
- [16:44]
Stugatz
Yeah, I'm saying that when you guys argue about basketball, you passionately defend that the game's not dying, they haven't changed it too much. But then Joe Missoula's got this Boston team, right? And you're saying they're not robots. The only team that is. I know Orlando played okay against them, but the only team that actually challenged Boston. The, the. The. The last year in the playoffs was Indiana. In games, Indiana could have easily won and may have learned how to do so because holy shit, Halliburton's a star.
- [17:13]
Amin Elhassan
What's the question? I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be funny. I'm confused. What? You're saying what Mike said earlier and now you're saying.
- [17:19]
Stugatz
No, I'm saying that when you and Mike have argued, okay, in the past, Mike gets to basketball here and he hasn't been paying attention all season. He says, I'm boycotting basketball. I don't care. I don't care. I don't care.
- [17:31]
Dan Le Batard
I'm just choosing other things over it.
- [17:32]
Stugatz
But whatever.
- [17:34]
Mike Ryan
Look, you can always come back.
- [17:35]
Dan Le Batard
I've been critical of the game, but dude, I'm totally good admitting that I'm wrong. These games have been compelling. I want them to be compelling. Have I lamented too much, probably for the audience, that the game is boring to me?
- [17:46]
Stugatz
Yeah.
- [17:47]
Dan Le Batard
But I think it's a proper reaction. All I want to see is better games. I will always admit that I'm wrong when I'm wrong. Except when it comes to Paul Pierce and Brad Marchand.
- [17:55]
Stugatz
Okay?
- [17:56]
Dan Le Batard
Those people suck.
- [17:57]
Stugatz
Okay, no, wait. I mean, let me. So let me.
- [17:59]
Mike Ryan
Those are the only two, huh?
- [18:00]
Stugatz
Let me, Let me reframe the question for you, okay? Because I believe that Mike Ryan right now is identifying as. Cause We've been talking about bandwidth, fanwidth, how much you can care about a particular game. You've always cared basketball. You care about it unreasonably. Mike has ignored your entire season. He doesn't care, but he's like, ooh, something happened with Halliburton's dad, huh? Maybe I'll leave racing Talladega for a little while to see if I visit basketball again. And the last time you guys fought on air, you came in defending the purity of basketball and stuff. And he's over here telling you, no more wrestling. The future. You know how you fix basketball? We've been. He. Mike's been fixing basketball all season. You know, how do you fix it? More wrestling and you're not even paying attention.
- [18:43]
Dan Le Batard
Or better games. Better games, More compelling games, More moments like that, and I think we got it. Damn. I'm not gonna fight a meme today. It's just not gonna happen. Today is a celebration of sports. The sports last night kicked ass, and the NBA is finally coming to the party with good, compelling games that aren't blowouts. And they had, like. They had a great series with the Nuggets and Clippers. I kept my eye on that series. There's a lot going on.
- [19:08]
Stugatz
Kept an eye. He kept an eye.
- [19:09]
Dan Le Batard
Well, dude, to me, playoff hockey is the top level. And I don't want to make this a hockey versus basketball thing. But even sports neutrals will admit. I mean, look what happened in Game 7 between the jets and the Blues. The President's trophy winners saved their entire season to save themselves from embarrassment with 1.6 seconds left, and they ended up winning in overtime. That is just drama that the NBA very rarely replicates. When. The NBA playoffs when I was growing up were all about drama. And this year, I think they were delivering last night. They most certainly did.
- [19:42]
Amin Elhassan
Okay, let me start with a couple of things. Now I'm seeing a clearer place where Dan wanted to go, and I see it too now. So I apologize, Dan. I wasn't.
- [19:50]
Mike Ryan
You now see it.
- [19:51]
Amin Elhassan
I now see it because what I was trying to tell Mike was I'm not saying the intensity was at this level, but we had good games all season long, right? And a lot of the things that Mike was saying back then were like falsehoods. Everyone shoots too many threes. No, not everyone shoots too many threes. No. No. I don't care if my. If I. If my role players are shooting threes because I want to see my stars do star things. That's the way basketball has evolved. And I think we can all agree nobody wants to see the Tyrone Hill 16 foot jumper. That's what got eliminated out of basketball. We got.
- [20:25]
Dan Le Batard
I do kind of miss it, right?
- [20:27]
Amin Elhassan
So that's put it on the pole. I hear Stugat's already like shot with money.
- [20:31]
Stugatz
Put it on the pole. Juju had Levitar. Do you miss that? What is it a 12 footer? 18? No, but is it an 18 footer or 12 footer?
- [20:38]
Amin Elhassan
No, no, it's a 16 footer.
- [20:39]
Mike Ryan
16 footer?
- [20:40]
Amin Elhassan
Yeah. They call it free throw line extended.
- [20:42]
Dan Le Batard
I just miss him and his cheekbones come back. Tyrone Hill.
- [20:46]
Stugatz
Do you miss Tyrone Hill? Yeah.
- [20:47]
Dan Le Batard
You know who else I miss? George Hill's shoulders.
- [20:49]
Mike Ryan
Oh, great shoulders.
- [20:51]
Stugatz
My point though, or one of my points about this game because I think.
- [20:56]
Amin Elhassan
Before you go, before you go because I have. Because it'll get away if I don't say you said what brought Mike back was Halliburton fighting in his dad.
- [21:03]
Stugatz
No.
- [21:04]
Amin Elhassan
Mike finally said let me see what's happening in these basketball games and saw some amazing basketball and said maybe I misjudged too quickly or maybe it is just the playoffs and he knows that these games are important versus game 37 in the middle of the season. But either way, not wrestling brought him back. Basketball brought him back.
- [21:21]
Stugatz
That's right. Well, Stugats, this part's upsets. Stugats, this part's so interesting. Amin and I took talked yesterday and I know Amin found it interesting as a basket even as a basketball savant with Iman Shumpert about like how LeBron and all the changes in basketball made it so that now Jayson Tatum can just fire up threes from a million miles away and they've sort of streamlined hedge fund efficiency. The numbers now say take the threes. Boston won a championship. We're wondering if their coach is any good And Indiana is here to say that right now on storyline oh, we know Indiana can beat them because they almost did last year when they weren't ready. And this is how you get ready now. And then you can ask yourself, hey Tatum, guys, have you actually been pushed in one of these like. And now we start questioning, hey Missoula, have you actually coached in one of these now of course Boston won a Game 7 against Miami here and Missoula went from fired to now he's running the sport.
- [22:21]
Dan Le Batard
Schruce wasn't, wasn't out of bounds, still under protest. But I think the close games the NBA has most certainly we talked about the diff in Cleveland. There have been more blowouts quantifiably in that sport and unfortunately that also meets in the playoffs. I punt on the regular season because a lot of teams have, you know, players are having their, their loads managed and all this BS and you finally get to the point that there are stakes and you hope for close games because those moments where the games are close, the intensity is amplified on the court. Everyone in the arena feels it. It is just different when the games.
- [22:57]
Mike Ryan
Are close and the games have meaning.
- [22:59]
Dan Le Batard
Right? And that actually brings out the wrestling moments because players feed off of that intensity, that tension that brings those wrestling moments. So they kind of go hand in hand. It's. It's a byproduct of good, intense playoff basketball. And I'm really glad to see that it's arrived.
- [23:15]
Mike Ryan
I think what Mike likes about these NBA playoffs, it feels like the hockey playoffs. He loves the hockey playoffs. We all love the hockey playoffs because anything can happen in the NBA. It's usually chalk that wins. But you were staring at conference finals that very well could be a 4 versus 7 seed, a 4 versus a 3 seed in the East.
- [23:33]
Stugatz
We're out of that.
- [23:34]
Mike Ryan
Never happens.
- [23:35]
Dan Le Batard
The NBA has been way more unpredictable lately. Like you rattled through it. Like we usually have these runs. You have what feels like an outlier championship from the Milwaukee Bucks. You have an 8 seed in the Miami Heat. Go to the NBA Finals. Like it is as unpredictable as it's ever been in our lives. I mean, see.
- [23:52]
Amin Elhassan
But yes and also no. Not, not, not no to the unpredictable, but no to. You like it because it's unpredictable. You like it because it's been good basketball. That's why. If Cleveland had pulled that out last night, if so, still a good game. If Halliburton hits that shot and then they give it a Mitchell Mitchell just tosses it from 90ft and it goes in and they win. It's still a great game, right? If Boston had held on against the Knicks one in overtime, that's still a great game. It's not because under. Fair enough.
- [24:18]
Dan Le Batard
Sounds good.
- [24:18]
Amin Elhassan
Fair enough.
- [24:19]
Dan Le Batard
That's. That's honestly like been my on ramp to. It is like Boston suffering. I'm like, all right, I remember this drug, this. That's chasing that dragon.
- [24:26]
Amin Elhassan
That's the taste.
- [24:27]
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- [25:35]
Okay, so I thought I was good with money. Turns out I was really good at ignoring it. Like, how am I spending this much on delivery or Uber or that one shoe store that I buy too many shoes from? Then I started using Monarch Money. And dude, it's a financial wake up call. Monarch's not just some budgeting app. It's basically your money command center. Puts everything, accounts, credit cards, investments into one place. So you're not guessing anymore. And listen, I found stuff I didn't even know I was paying for. Since I started using Monarch, I'm tracking my spending, actually saving and yeah, even having money check ins with my wife. And, and we're looking at each other and we're like, yeah, okay, we're all good. It makes the hard stuff way easier. And over a million households use Monarch. It was named the best budgeting app of 2025 by the Wall Street Journal. So it's not just me hyping up. It's legit. It's real. Real deal Holyfield. And get control of all of your finances with Monarch Money. Use code dan@monimalmoney.com in your browser for half off your first year. That's 50% off your first year@monimalmoney.com with code DAN.
- [26:34]
Folks, listen up. If you run anything online these days, a podcast, a merch store, whatever it is, you're basically forced to wear.
- [26:40]
12 hats.
- [26:41]
Marketing? Sure. Customer service? Why not? And now you're supposed to be your own IT department. Kinsta is managed WordPress hosting, which means you get blazing fast, site speeds, top tier security, and a dashboard that doesn't look like it was built in 2006. And if something goes sideways, real humans, not bots to help you 24. 7. No scripts, no sorry, I don't understand replies. Kinsta takes the stress out of tech stuff so you can actually focus on your business. Or in our case, more time watching games, arguing nonsense, and delivering the hottest take possible. No messing with settings, no panic troubleshooting, just smooth sailing. Tired of being your own website support team? Switch your hosting to Kinsta and get your first month free. And don't worry about the move. They'll handle the whole transition for you. No tech expertise required. Just visit kinsta.com dan to get started. That's K-I-N-S-T-A.com dan.
- [27:33]
Billy Gill
Don LeBatard. We didn't get to your guys against the spread. You're right.
- [27:36]
Mike Ryan
You're right, you're right, dude.
- [27:37]
Stugatz
I don't have it against the spread because I wasn't prepared for this segment.
- [27:41]
Sponsor Voice
You need an Ian in your life.
- [27:42]
Stugatz
You have actively played defense against me today in a way that has rarely been this undercutting. Stugats.
- [27:48]
Billy Gill
Defense wins championships, baby. That's show business. This is the Dan Levatar show with the stugats.
- [28:00]
Stugatz
This is what I want to talk about, though. So. So what is the next guy now? This is so interesting. It honestly is from a real. From a business perspective. Like, everyone's saying basketball's dying. The ratings are down, even though they got, you know, the monster streaming dollars. And it doesn't matter whether ratings are down. They've got the monster streaming dollars. So it's a thriving business. But what does the NFL do? How does the NFL stay in business no matter what, no matter how many Justin Tuckers, no matter how many Ravens. The Ravens made the statement on behalf of the NFL. Literally made a statement on behalf of Justin Tucker. Like that. That's what. That's what happened. That league keeps us addicted on Sundays. Why? Because 345. Holy shit, these games are good. How do you fix basketball? Holy shit, these games are good. The last two days, amazing basketball and great. And the only thing in the middle of it that was a turd is, oh, come on, Celtics. Really? You're going to look like that doing that. And that's how the Knicks are going to beat you. Like that. You guys are going to play that way.
- [29:04]
Amin Elhassan
That wasn't a turd, though. It was a great game. Now, the comeuppance plays a part in why everyone is so excited. And, you know, people like Mike are salivating. But the reality is it was still a very compelling game. Dan, I would argue again, going back to even said the ratings are down. The ratings are down for any number of reasons that have nothing to do with the quality of play. I said this months ago when we had this Conversation. The NBA doesn't have a style of play problem. It doesn't have a load management problem. It has a PR problem. We don't do a good job of controlling our destiny in terms of how our game is talked about in the same way that the NFL does. Right? We can't change the fact that 1 82nd of a season is not as valuable as 1 17th of a season. We can't. There's nothing we can do to change that. It's here to stay and it's been here. The reality is how people talk about our game, how we allow our game to be perceived, particularly with the casual market. Right? Because the diehards are here. I was telling this to my buddies last night. Oh man, it would be crazy if like Indiana and Minnesota got to the finals. And I'm saying no, no it's not. I mean yes, it'd be crazy from us basketball heads, we love it. But the reality is as the casuals, the casuals need dependability, reliability. Someone I can identify. The best example of this I can give is 2020. I'm watching the NBA finals. My kid sits down next to me. My kid is 10 years old, maybe at the time, maybe a little younger and says watches like, maybe like three or four possessions. It says where's Klay Thompson? Because in my child's mind at that point there is no such thing as an NBA finals where Klay Thompson isn't out there. That's what the casual fan is. They turn on the TV and if they see Shay Gilchitz Alexander versus Tyrese Halliburton they're like I don't know these people.
- [30:49]
Billy Gill
But like the PR problem for the NBA is largely self inflicted, right? Because it's not 1/72, it's like 30 to 41/72 of the season. That's the problem.
- [30:59]
Amin Elhassan
The fact that you're saying that tells me we have a PR problem. Cuz it's not that much, it's nowhere near that much. But we allow it to be said over and over again. And not just by jam, ok? Shows like ours, but people who pay for the right to broadcast the games. Turner and ESPN did not do a good job of being stewards of the game in the same way.
- [31:19]
Billy Gill
It's not their job, right?
- [31:20]
Amin Elhassan
Yes it is.
- [31:21]
Billy Gill
It's if you're broadcasting my job to go to watch the NBA like you give me a reason to watch it.
- [31:26]
Amin Elhassan
I'm not saying our job, I'm not saying it's the fans job. I'm saying Turner and espn Have a fiduciary duty to talk about the game in a way that is positive and uplifting and give people reasons to watch rather than giving people reasons not to watch.
- [31:43]
Dan Le Batard
I hear you, but I kind of like the negativity that I get from Turner. They kind of built their brand on keeping it real. And I don't want to get bogged down and be guilty of perpetuating what you're lamenting right there, Amin, and just talking about how bad the sport is. We're going to agree to disagree on the style of play and the load management. You don't think it's that big of an issue? I'm sure you have numbers to back it up. For me, perception is reality in that I punted on it like it is what it is when it came to me. It's venturing into baseball territory. And that's a couple different factors. My team is not good, but my team is not good because of a lot of the reasons that I've already outlined. I want to celebrate basketball because if they bring it like they've brought it over the last week, then there's no issue. They'll fix the sport. I imagine it will take time. Hell, baseball fix the sport. There are issues. We've talked about it. Maybe it starts on the defensive end, but I want more moments like last night. Give me more moments like last night, and I'll be one of the people helping that arrow point in the other direction when it comes to their ratings.
- [32:40]
Amin Elhassan
I'll be. So, to be clear, we need playoff intensity basketball during the regular season.
- [32:45]
Billy Gill
Every night. Yeah.
- [32:46]
Sponsor Voice
Got it from every.
- [32:47]
Dan Le Batard
I think we. No, I. Maybe.
- [32:49]
Billy Gill
Well, it worked for me.
- [32:50]
Dan Le Batard
We need more intensity. We do. We do. We need more intensity.
- [32:54]
Mike Ryan
I mean, the regular season, I'm with Mike, it feels meaningless.
- [32:58]
Dan Le Batard
We need more intensity.
- [32:59]
Stugatz
Yeah, but this is how Mike goes. Conservative as a. As a fan. No, because you're all about. You go. You've been sniffing around with NASCAR and complaining about basketball.
- [33:08]
Dan Le Batard
Yeah, well, I mean, fan width. I gravitate to the things that I find compelling. It's pretty simple.
- [33:13]
Stugatz
Like, I have Minnesota's 12 for 76 on three pointers in their last two games. Like that. We are about to talk about style of basketball. The games have to be what one.
- [33:23]
Dan Le Batard
Don Kang got me into that series. Like there. There are storylines there. Also, one of the things that is missed about their approach to the regular season is rivalries can be born in the regular season if you have certain intense games. I remember growing up and watching like, well, can you Imagine if these two teams match up in the playoffs that exists in hockey when the Panthers and the Senators are brawling at unprecedented rates and having 100 minutes of playoff. Of penalty minutes. You wonder aloud, like, man, can you imagine how intense this would be if they somehow met in the playoffs? Basketball doesn't really have those moments in the regular season. You don't have scuffles so much in the regular season. You don't have hatred and vitriol spilling over. And I do think that they need to up the intensity. Now. That is hard to impose.
- [34:05]
Billy Gill
Yeah.
- [34:06]
Amin Elhassan
Well, the problem with.
- [34:07]
Billy Gill
We need the perfect balance of Draymond, right? Like more Draymond being Draymond, but also less Draymond being Draymond, which is the hard thing. And really, no one's figured it out, particularly Draymond, the Goldilocks Draymond.
- [34:19]
Amin Elhassan
Is that what we need?
- [34:20]
Stugatz
That is such a good question. Hold on a second. So do we need more of more Draymond? Help me through that again.
- [34:27]
Billy Gill
More Draymond being Draymond, but also less Draymond being Draymond.
- [34:30]
Stugatz
That's a great poll question. Do we need more of Draymond being Draymond, but also less of Draymond being Draymond?
- [34:37]
Mike Ryan
Needs to pick his spot.
- [34:38]
Billy Gill
It's a tricky line.
- [34:38]
Stugatz
Okay, Billy, thank you for bailing out the show there. And this is why you are. This is why you are the wonder that you are, sir. And I have great, great remorse that what I worried about when I came in would be so I'm not dying.
- [34:50]
Billy Gill
Just so we're clear.
- [34:51]
Stugatz
We don't have to. I still don't understand what really happened to your neck? How much pain are you in?
- [34:55]
Billy Gill
I got in a car accident.
- [34:57]
Stugatz
I know, but what. How much pain are you in right now?
- [34:59]
Billy Gill
Well, Hippo, okay, they gave me medicine, so, you know, the medicine, so.
- [35:04]
Amin Elhassan
So.
- [35:04]
Stugatz
And when you're on. When you're on drugs and you've been hit by a car, it should. It should be Wild Willie Wednesday. It should be Wild Willie Wednesday. It should not be Amin and Mike. Talk about basketball.
- [35:15]
Sponsor Voice
No.
- [35:15]
Billy Gill
We're in the middle of the NBA playoffs. This isn't like, you know, great night. If we were in October, I would kind of tend to side with you here. But, like, this is it, baby.
- [35:26]
Stugatz
Look, that is not the spirit of Wild Willie Wednesday. Where. Where's my music? Where's. Where's my. Where is Wild Willie Wednesday? I've been promised that Billy, through all like Billy, is a rising Meadowlark executive star.
- [35:39]
Billy Gill
Am I?
- [35:40]
Amin Elhassan
Everyone's a rising star at this company. Have y'all noticed that?
- [35:43]
Billy Gill
That's the thing. Everyone's a rising everything, really. No one really's a rising star.
- [35:48]
Stugatz
Okay, so look at what this company has done to him. He comes into work today feeling like he's been hit by a car.
- [35:55]
Billy Gill
No, I. Why not feeling like that happened. But I was in a car. Technically, my car was hit by a car, but I was in the car. A truck, also suburban. And the thing didn't barely even have a scratch. I saw it. It was honestly the best commercial for a suburban I've ever seen in my entire life. To my detriment, obviously, because I don't know. I didn't know how much damage a 2013 Hyundai Sonata can take that they're eventually like, this is not worth repairing.
- [36:19]
Stugatz
How are you not right now?
- [36:20]
Billy Gill
I'm gonna have to pay for a new car. It's a whole thing.
- [36:22]
Stugatz
How are you not right now? Just.
- [36:24]
Dan Le Batard
Time to get a car.
- [36:25]
Billy Gill
I thank you.
- [36:28]
Stugatz
Wild Willie Wednesday.
- [36:34]
Dan Le Batard
That was you spitting into an aluminum cup as a loogie. It was. This is my first Wild Willie Wednesday.
- [36:39]
Stugatz
Oh, is it? Oh, Mike's coming. Oh, see, this is what you ruined. Wild Willy Wednesdays. That's what happened.
- [36:44]
Billy Gill
It's basically any other day, but we just call it that.
- [36:47]
Dan Le Batard
I'm beginning to think it becomes Wilder Willie Wednesday, specifically because I'm not usually here on Wednesdays.
- [36:52]
Stugatz
This is the whole whole thing.
- [36:54]
Dan Le Batard
Does he always wear this? No.
- [36:56]
Stugatz
This is what's happening.
- [36:57]
Billy Gill
It's just hit every Tuesday.
- [36:59]
Stugatz
No, it's. It's. He feels, actually, and metaphorically for the last four years, that metal arc has. Keeps hitting Billy Gill for four years, and now he's wearing a neck brace.
- [37:10]
Billy Gill
It feels. It is.
- [37:12]
Amin Elhassan
Can we give a little props to someone who. Who has took a lot of abuse for this but turns out to be pretty prescient? Greg Cody, he said, hey, man, coming in here is the traffic is what's gonna get him to quit, right? And here's Billy. Traffic got him in a neck brace. Traffic is bad. Dan. Dan, Your employees are dying because of the traffic.
- [37:35]
Billy Gill
Not yet, but on the way.
- [37:36]
Stugatz
Look, man, getting there stugat. I mean, poor Stugon. Like, that's.
- [37:40]
Dan Le Batard
Look, it's your turn. Your time to suffer it. I was driving up to Miami Gardens making dick for money. So, like, we're just in another part of the timeline right now.
- [37:50]
Amin Elhassan
How much money is.
- [37:51]
Dan Le Batard
You had your time. This is mine.
- [37:54]
Stugatz
Do you guys realize that the only. Like, Stu Gotz and I have made so many so Few verbal deals that have been, like, totally kept to completion by Stu Gotts. But honest to God, Stu Gotz, a long time ago, when he and I were at the beginning of this, had the conversation. I'm like, stuarts, eventually, this is gonna end up at the beach. Like, don't keep going that way. No more complaints about traffic. The rest of our. Okay. And we made a deal on the spot. And he never actually complained about the traffic. Except today he came in really mad about the traffic, but the traffic is worse than it's ever been. Like, it's just our. Our bejeweled dumpster of a city that keeps building stuff that's sinking into the ground near the airport and everywhere else. Stu Gotz has been getting stuck in so much traffic that Today it took two hours. It took me two hours and 52 minutes to get to F1 race. That was 20 minutes from my home. Now, I know that. I know that's F1.
- [38:49]
Billy Gill
I know that loss.
- [38:50]
Amin Elhassan
I'm still. I'm not. Traffic did that to you.
- [38:55]
Billy Gill
There's something.
- [38:56]
Stugatz
How are you not doing an ad for Suburban as the guy in a neck brace saying, I can vouch for this car?
- [39:01]
Billy Gill
Well, because at the moment, they're my adversary. They did this to me.
- [39:05]
Stugatz
But you can make the money back by just saying, look how good this Suburban is. It hit.
- [39:09]
Billy Gill
Someone's on.
- [39:10]
Stugatz
I was injured, and therefore, I endorse this truck. And you get the money with an advertisement for how sturdy the truck is because it could survive the crash.
- [39:18]
Mike Ryan
That money is going to buy him a new car.
- [39:20]
Billy Gill
I don't think you understand victimhood. Like, the Menendez brother's parents didn't come out and, like, you know what? Our sons. Really good guys.
- [39:27]
Dan Le Batard
You got to pick up on what he's doing by not giving you much. The man's wearing a neck brace. He is laying the foundation.
- [39:33]
Billy Gill
I don't know how people find my number and reach out to me after an accident, but they did.
- [39:37]
Dan Le Batard
Yeah.
- [39:37]
Billy Gill
And just started reaching out to me.
- [39:39]
Amin Elhassan
Chevy did what?
- [39:41]
Dan Le Batard
If I.
- [39:41]
Billy Gill
If I said, don't talk to Chevy.
- [39:43]
Dan Le Batard
If I may advise you, don't say another word.
- [39:46]
Billy Gill
I'm trying that.
- [39:48]
Dan Le Batard
It could affect your whole thing.
- [39:49]
Amin Elhassan
Shout out to Anna Jarvan way.
- [39:51]
Dan Le Batard
No.
- [39:51]
Stugatz
That was such a good line that flew across the sky. Anna Jar will take care of your every need. We know that. Proud sponsor of the Zaslow show. Zaslow rising star in the business.
- [40:02]
Dan Le Batard
I've had so much eye contact with Andajar as ip.
- [40:05]
Billy Gill
Yeah.
- [40:06]
Amin Elhassan
Oh, games, right.
- [40:08]
Dan Le Batard
Dude locked in every year.
- [40:11]
Stugatz
So hold on. Tell me if I've got this wrong because I. I'm. People are always making fun of me because I say Miami is some experience. In Miami. Isn't the experience somewhere else? This is a nationwide thing, right? Where everyone in the nation knows that if a local law firm is like spending giant money on sports advertising that that law firm in some places like Miami that are corrupt, sometimes the originators of this.
- [40:37]
Dan Le Batard
You need to be careful.
- [40:38]
Amin Elhassan
Yeah, you better watch out. You're going after lawyers.
- [40:42]
Dan Le Batard
Don't do that. And we are very thankful for their patronage during our pirate phase.
- [40:47]
Amin Elhassan
And there's only. There's only one lawyer that we can go after with impunity.
- [40:52]
Billy Gill
Who?
- [40:52]
Amin Elhassan
It's David Sampson.
- [40:55]
Dan Le Batard
What about Russy Harden and his hairpiece?
- [40:59]
Stugatz
David Sampson's gonna be here in moments. I am.
- [41:03]
Mike Ryan
Lucky us.
- [41:04]
Dan Le Batard
I'm a little worried about Wild Willie Wednesday.
- [41:08]
Stugatz
Oh, no. Wild Billy.