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- [00:02]
Dan Le Batard
You're listening to Giraffe Kings Network.
- [00:11]
Unknown Announcer
Exclusively on ESPN. UFC 313, Saturday. Reigning light heavyweight champion Alex Pereira defends his title against number one contender Magomed Alkalia, and an explosive lightweight bout between Justin Gaethje and Rafael Pizzi. UFC 313, Saturday at 10pm Eastern. Buy it on espnplus.com ppb.
- [00:43]
Dan Le Batard
I think I could say this without reservation or dilution. I mean, this is one of the toughest players in the history of the NBA. Someone who nobody wanted to trifle with. And not just a champion, but one of the best defenders in NBA history. We've talked to him a number of times over the years and just wasn't afraid to fight on the court. Coming from where he came from before, before professional basketball was just an uncommonly tough human being. He now goes by Meta Sandiford Artest. Okay, so it's not Ron Artest, it's not Metta World Peace, it's not the Pandas friend. It is Meta Sandiford Artest. Welcome, Ron. Meta Excuse me. It's nice to see you again. Can you tell us what it, what, what precipitated the name change?
- [01:30]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Well, I still go by Middleworld Peace, but when I got married in my second marriage, I took my wife's last name. So that's where Sandifort came from. And she really loved Artest, as you can see. Artest foundation, my dad's foundation. I have Artest Management Group. So I mean we still really love the Artest name and then but like I said, if it wasn't for changing to my wife's last name, which I thought was really cool, I would have still been World Peace. But I just still go by World Peace as much as I can.
- [02:01]
Dan Le Batard
Can you tell us here what has you excited? I've been fascinated to watch your growth over the years and late when you became a champion, you were very comfortable on the court saying thank you to my therapist because you were tackling mental health stuff before it was popular. You were doing vulnerability publicly before it was popular. So what what has you excited these days as you've you've blossomed here in adulthood post retirement.
- [02:25]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Man. Thanks a lot for recognizing that all sports teams have a lot of sports team have therapists now that started from 2010 when I think my psychologist on national television. I'm currently on the board of UCLA psychiatric ward and I'm also serving on the on the board of a couple other institutions. So I'm really excited about that. I'm also about to launch a Mental health curriculum with my healthcare company that I have is called EasyCareLink.com as a nursing company. And I'm the chair of the board. And we're also. We have a telehealth mental health app that we're launching, and we're going to have curriculum attached to that with Artist University, my foundation. So I'm super excited. The growth that I had since I retired. The first day of retirement was tough. Honestly, I was stressed. I didn't. I didn't think I had any skills, and I was insecure. But I quickly realized that I was an architect major and if I could apply architecture to building a business, that I think things will be okay. And I figured that it took me 11 years to make it to the NBA from the age of 8 to the age of 19. So I said, you know what? I'll just put in another 11 years of work, and at some point I'll be able to operate and administrator, you know, a firm in which I'm doing now. And we're here. We're right. We're nine. Nine years in, roughly. So we got 40 companies in a portfolio, 12 we control. And it was rough the first couple of years. It was, it was a lot of stress as a retired athlete.
- [03:47]
Dan Le Batard
Well, we can talk about that in a second. But I'm curious where the lights went off for you in terms of introspection. Right. Because nobody's ready to get to the league. Nobody is ready at a young age to get to the league. But when did lights start going off for you on. No, I kind of need to explore some things here in my patterns, in my upbringings, in the way that I, you know, handle issues. Where did lights come on for you?
- [04:13]
Meta Sandiford Artest
I would say when I, When I, when I was missing out on awards because you got to think about it, I was the youngest defensive player of the year. Right. At a. As a guard. Right. And when you think about how people were talking about me being on the COVID with Larry Bird, shout out to Larry Bird. Great guy. You know, when you think about what I was doing at 23 years old, you know, you were talking about jersey retirement at Indiana. It was only one direction to go. But when you miss out on an all star game because you're suspended, then miss out on another all star game because you're suspended, then you miss out on more all team NBA, all, you know, all team NBAs, and you miss out on even having an opportunity to get another defensive player of the year, arguably. I love Ben Wallace. This is not anything I've been Wallace. But you can make an argument that if I was there in 2005, before I got suspended, and if I didn't request the trade the next year, you can argue that I would have been in the running for defensive player of the year. Even when I got to Sacramento in a half a season, I made first team, all defense. So from that perspective, you know, just, you know, not taking advantage of the opportunity and taking things for granted. And that takes time to, you know, because you can soak in it. But I said, you know what? I'll just like, embrace it. I'll take it, hold myself accountable for it, my actions, and just go forward. So I think 2007 through 2009, I was. I started to try my best to make turn the corner.
- [05:41]
Dan Le Batard
We have talked to you about some of this stuff, right? Some of the famous stories where applied for work, work at Circuit City, I think it was. You've told us the story, I think, of running out at halftime of a Bulls game to go get liquor, right? Do I have that right? Or am I remembering some details wrong about having to go out at halftime? You were so young. Do I have this wrong? I don't want to get. I don't. I don't want to get it wrong.
- [06:06]
Meta Sandiford Artest
I actually appreciate you asking me if you have it wrong. I think like the halftime. No, but I was indulging quite often in alcohol. I'm not going to brand the company I was drinking, but I was indulging a lot. I did have a moment. I did have a really destructive and detrimental moment. I was young, but I even had young guys like Jamar Crawford on my team. So I wasn't. I wasn't the role model quite then. But yeah, I had some moments where I was taking my emotions out and sabotaging my own career.
- [06:42]
Stugotz
I'm curious because the stories that Dan brought up, and obviously it was a different time in NBA history. But at that time, the thing I kept thinking of was who's around you like, as far as not people working for the team, but who was around you that was supposed to be looking out for you? Because the Circuit City thing is a great example. And correct me if I'm wrong, you did it because you wanted the discount, the employee discount to buy CDs. But if you had someone around, you should have been like, no, man, just do like a signing and they would have given you all the CDs for free. You wouldn't even have to work more than an hour or so. Or you probably could even got paid on that. So they always think about what man was he by himself? Did you have people around you?
- [07:25]
Meta Sandiford Artest
So, like, right before I was going to college, my brother went to jail for 10 years for drug trafficking, right? So moved drugs under the Greyhound bus. So they gave him 10 years flat. So when he went away at 17 years old, you know, that was going to be my guy who I go into college and go into an MBA with. He's all. He has a logistics company now. He's really smart. He did 10 years and that was years. 18 years ago, he got out of prison. But so, you know, at that point in time, you know, I just, I only trust people I know. So, you know, I started to just be around different people that I know, you know, because, you know, you also navigate the street life, right? You also got to navigate who you're around. So, you know, for me, the Circuit City situation was I just need. Because time can get you in a lot of trouble, right when you have time. So I also just needed to. I needed to spend my time doing something positive because once I got to Chicago, I was. I went straight to the hood. You know, I would leave practicing, go straight to Robert Taylor okabrini Green or 79th and Halstead or something like that. Because I always needed to be around the streets because where I'm from, I only felt comfortable in the street. So it took me quite some time to understand that. But I also realized that I was. I wanted to be around the streets because I also enjoyed giving back. I never, I was never the type of guy to stunt in the streets like wear jewelry or do things like that. So I was always kind of well respected in the streets. But, you know, from that perspective, I didn't want to be around anybody. You know, I didn't want to be, you know, so I only wanted to be around people that didn't understand this new lifestyle. So it was a conflict. Not really a conflict of interest. It was really a conflict in like, what I'm dreaming for. I wasn't on the same page with myself.
- [09:12]
Dan Le Batard
Well, explain that part to us though, because that's an interesting kind of loneliness. You arrive at all of your dreams, ostensibly, but those people don't necessarily understand you. The business of it is foreign. And you feel lonely enough that you want to go back to something that feels like your neighborhood 100%.
- [09:29]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Like, even after practice in Chicago on a Friday, I would drive to New York just to touch 12th Street Mark, deep block where I was raised, just to touch it and drive back 36 hours later. Sometimes. Sometimes drive back 18 hours later, you know, and it's just the way you feel, you know, Havoc got that famous bar. No matter how much loot I get, I'm staying in the projects. That was really me, you know what I'm saying? But now I got a different perspective because I can communicate. I no longer have to use only my emotions to communicate. You know, I can use my words. So now that I can do that, you know, I can still be inspirational and I can do things. I can still have that type of those characteristics, but I can be more inspiring and build stuff where I couldn't communicate that at 19 years old.
- [10:20]
Dan Le Batard
I will leave this alone after this because I do want to accent. This man has been excellent for a long time. Tough for a long time, and has had a career that has a lot of difficult, difficult things accomplished in it. But the story that we've talked around sometimes, but I don't think we've actually gotten to the bottom of that. I don't know if it. What part of it is true either is how it is. You ended up before a Game seven on a corporate bus with salespeople, and you're.
- [10:48]
Meta Sandiford Artest
I'm really happy about you telling that story, actually. I never said it. You said it. I never brought it up because I don't like to tell things.
- [10:54]
Dan Le Batard
Okay. And if I've got it wrong, forgive me. And. And I. I must say, on the front end of this, I really admire this man's career and his growth. So I'm not just rummaging around in the salacious stories.
- [11:05]
Meta Sandiford Artest
It's a good. I'm glad. I'm glad you brought that up because I can't believe that's even brought up. I never said it, and it really is not even. You should not even know that. So I don't like to talk about things for clicks, but I'm really happy you mentioned that because, you know, you should not even have known that. And I'll just tell you the story. I was getting a haircut, but I had a great haircut. Game seven. I came down to get on the bus that typically nobody would be on. You know, I didn't really see anybody on these buses with the exception of the team. So when I came down with my suit in hand and some really thin shorts, really thin shorts with pockets. I wore them on Jimmy Kimmel just to show that they were shorts. The story said I came out of my underwears. Like, why would that. Why is that? And I had no shirt on. Who cares? I'm getting Dressed on the bus. I got off the bus in a suit or an outfit. I don't know what I had on. I had like a. Some. It might have been like a college shirt or something, you know, because I didn't want to be late for the bus, you know, and I'm going to a game and I was getting a haircut. My haircut was really nice for game seven, you know, and I played very well, you know. Yeah, you did. You know, and so that story for. For somebody to. To use that. And I don't even want to get into it because now I know why that story was put out there. Now it should. You should not have known this story. Now I got to talk about something that I'm not happy about, which I still didn't say. I just like to leave things alone because I'm tough. I can get through anything. I don't need much from anybody. So it's disappointing. And whoever said this, they should talk about it. Who mentioned that? Because I just went on the bus and went to the backseat, so I.
- [12:49]
Stugotz
Never heard this story before. So thank you, Dan, for bringing it to my attention.
- [12:52]
Meta Sandiford Artest
But just to explain, I would prefer. I'm never going to talk about it unless whoever brought it up, they can talk about it, but it's just an excuse. No, thank you, Dan, for bringing it.
- [13:01]
Stugotz
Up to explain it to the audience. An NBA team is on the road. There's typically, especially for a playoff game, there's an early bus and then there's a late bus, and then there's another bus. And sometimes what they'll do is they will have, like, people work for the team, especially if it's in the playoffs. Hey, we're making a trip out of it. Bring clients or whatever. So typically that bus that. That you're taking is empty.
- [13:29]
Meta Sandiford Artest
It's my bus.
- [13:30]
Stugotz
It's your bus. It is the bus for players and team for team. But then the team will be like, well, if we can bring the sponsor here, they would really think it was cool or whatever.
- [13:39]
Meta Sandiford Artest
So, yeah, it's our bus. I had no shirt on. Who cares?
- [13:41]
Stugotz
Yeah.
- [13:42]
Meta Sandiford Artest
So I was getting dressed on the bus.
- [13:43]
Stugotz
And the whole idea is that the dress code kicks in when you step off that bus. So when you get to the arena, that's when the dress code kicks in. So you getting on the bus in any shape, form, or fashion didn't matter.
- [13:55]
Dan Le Batard
I feel like we're five minutes too deep.
- [13:56]
Meta Sandiford Artest
When I saw that, when I heard that story come out, it made no sense. I literally just laughed and I Said I'm never going to address it because I'm not in a position to win.
- [14:06]
Stugotz
Let's talk about something.
- [14:07]
Dan Le Batard
Speaking of position to win. You won game seven for Kobe when he was six for 19. You won game seven, became a champion for Kobe Bryant forever. You carried him in that game, actually.
- [14:18]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Yeah, that was. That was the next year should have been done in Houston, but I think, you know, that year was incredible. I. I told myself in January because, you know, you got to think about. I was averaging 22 or 25 in the playoffs against the Lakers.
- [14:33]
Unknown Analyst
We.
- [14:33]
Meta Sandiford Artest
We were the only team to take them to seven. Every. Everybody else was five. Right. So I was still. You don't get worse from May till September. I was really good still. But when you're playing with Kobe, we know who he is, and we know who Pau Gasol is, and we know who Derek Fisher is. Now you got. So you. It was hard to find a role. And then I was really stressed in the beginning. Then in January, I decided to be the best role player that I could be. And then when you look at that, when you look at the rest of that season, I actually was a really good role player, you know, and that was really tough. And then in game five, Phil Jackson just briefly came to me in the locker room and said, I need you to score. And I was like, you know, thank you. I can't wait to hear those words. And then in game six, I had 18. And game. Game seven, I had 20. But this is not nothing new, you know, I was always getting 20, you know, in the game.
- [15:23]
Stugotz
So one of the coolest things ever was you. You guys win game seven. And then instantly, you know, Dan brought up. You thank your therapist. But my memory is, you dropped a track champions. And so I was like, how did he record it? And then I found out you recorded it before the season even started. That's a ballsy move.
- [15:44]
Meta Sandiford Artest
I recorded that June 30th in 2009.
- [15:48]
Stugotz
So you hadn't even signed with the Lakers yet?
- [15:51]
Meta Sandiford Artest
No, because you got. Well, I thought I was going back to Houston. And, you know, we had a great team. When you look at that Houston Rocket team, you know, y'all broke his foot game three. And, you know, I love the Lakers, but Yao Ming broke his foot, Game three in the first quarter. So, you know, in my mind, I'm like, okay, we're winning the title this year. I need a title. I actually need a title. Cause I feel like I'm the best ever, even though I'm not. But I personally feel Like, I'm the best ever, right? But so I did that record just to give me a little motivation, and then, wow, we win it. Literally a year later, we win it, and the track just dropped.
- [16:31]
Dan Le Batard
I got it wrong. It was 6 for 24 that Kobe was in that game. 7. Not for 6, 6 for 19. And as I recall. And you spen. Spent the next week of your life basically wandering around the streets of Los Angeles, allowing people to touch you.
- [16:47]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Yeah, for seven days I was in New Jersey. I was in the same. Yeah, the same thing. I just. Because, you know, when you look at my career, I was playing early on, I was playing really well, Right. We was the best team in the league, you know, and. And then 50, 50 was me. 50, 50 was the fan. But, you know, I kind of put a halt to that. So in my mind, I'm like, I'm never. The basketball guys is never going to, you know, forgive me and give me a chance to win it. And then you win it, and it's like, wow, you just soak it all in. And I wish I probably didn't soak it in because I was really happy with that one title. I was just so happy I got one, honestly.
- [17:22]
Dan Le Batard
But take us. Take us through the streets, though.
- [17:24]
Meta Sandiford Artest
What.
- [17:24]
Dan Le Batard
Do you remember the details of that next week where you're not taking the Game seven jersey off for a week?
- [17:30]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Well, okay. So I kept my boxes on. Actually, maybe a little less than a week. So I kept my boxes on. I went out that night, went to dinner, went to the club, got up with. I was recording champions part two with Dr. Dre at 3am that night. So I'm recording champions part two. It's in his system. I was really tired. Chris Brown comes into the. Into the studio, and he said, yo, let me get that jersey. And I'm like, wow. I was so honored that Chris Brown asked, so I gave that jersey to Chris Brown. So he got that jersey, and I kept everything else, you know, and I was in Dr. Dre's studio recording Champions Part 2, you know, with a stogie.
- [18:19]
Dan Le Batard
Anything else from the rest of the week that stands out? Because that had to feel like one of the happiest weeks in your life.
- [18:25]
Stugotz
In la, walking around in LA as a Laker Champion and Game seven. It was you.
- [18:29]
Dan Le Batard
It was you. You're bailing out.
- [18:31]
Stugotz
There's gotta be. Look, I don't what the rest of the summer was like, but I know those two weeks must have been crazy. Everywhere you went.
- [18:38]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Yeah, I. I performed with T Pain. T. T Pain did a remix, the Champions, which we never put out. I should have did an album. So I. I performed the remix the Champions with T. Pain. He killed the hook, and then I was just partying for the rest of the time. If I could do it over, honestly, I would have. I would have just went home with my family, Honestly, if I could do it over, I would have done that. Because, like, those moments, I'm so happy, I'm excited. But then you forget that your family is also excited, you know, and those moments, you should get out with your family. Then the next two weeks, you go party. So I would advise people spend the first moments with your family, then you go on your two week, you know, binge.
- [19:20]
Dan Le Batard
Rick Fox and Derek Fisher both told us stories about Kobe as a teammate purposely challenging them, purposely looking for confrontation. I don't imagine a whole lot of people are doing that. You or should do that with you. Did Kobe do any of that with you? Challenge you?
- [19:41]
Meta Sandiford Artest
You know, our first practice. I know I was excited about my first practice with Kobe because even I'm on record saying, like, I love to compete in practice and even when I practice against Reggie Miller, and I just couldn't wait to get into practice, even though Reggie was a little older. So I wasn't trying to do too much because he was a little older, but I was like, going hard. He's a legend, and out of respect, you want to go hard. So when I got with Kobe, I just couldn't wait for that first practice. And I remember the first drill. I can't remember exactly, but the first drill that we were on opposite sides and I was trying to go at his head, and he went right back at me. And, you know, I think I got his respect. I respected him more. And not even respect, I always respect him, but I just understood him more. Like, this guy is the real deal, you know, the way he can take the pressure and the physicality that I'm bringing to practice, you know, so the first week of training camp, that was the most exciting time for me because I got a chance to really compete. But then after that, me and Kobe were starters, so we stayed on the same team every drill, every game. We never competed after that.
- [20:42]
Stugotz
Meta I love you talking about intensity because you just reminded me of a quote that I don't think anyone has remembered in history, which was before you were an all star for the first time. You said, they can't let me in the all Star game because I'll go out there and get a flagrant foul. And you said that you weren't actually gonna do it, but you were saying, like, basically I would bring NBA game.
- [21:02]
Meta Sandiford Artest
I was coming to bring it.
- [21:04]
Stugotz
You were bringing it, right? Exactly. And then when you were an All Star, you did bring it. You played hard. And so as you watch the All Star Game now and see how guys are decidedly playing less than hard, what goes through your mind?
- [21:17]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Well, I had somebody tell me a long time ago, actually at the end of my career, they told me I was a practice player. So I'm like. And I was still playing well my last year. Keep in mind that in practice, I won most of the game. Luke Walton documented it, okay? It was, he put it in with marker and at the end of that season, I was number one in practice. And I had somebody tell me that, man, you only bring it in practice. And I said, well, for one, I'm the only defensive player of the year on this team, you know, and All Star champion. And I said, also, I always work hard in practice. Not because I'm trying to play and impress Luke Walton. I'm out. I'll take Luke Walton to work. Walton can't guard me. I'm not trying to impress Luke. Practice like what I would used to do when I, even in my prime, I look at the 13th man on the roster, the 15th man, and I got to work harder than him and destroy him in practice, you know, and the same thing everywhere I play. I don't know how to play no other way. I'm, I'm double teaming and she open runs. You kidding me? So, yeah, it's a different, is a different mindset. It's okay. That's how I personally feel me. And I'm never going to change how I feel about that. I know it's a different age, but that's just not me.
- [22:40]
Dan Le Batard
Meta's Lakers take on the Celtics in Boston Saturday night on ABC. Let's play for Meta. The sound of LeBron James saying, you guys don't want to be me. You guys don't want to be the face of the league.
- [22:51]
Unknown Analyst
It's unfortunate, but like, I don't know when you, why do you want to be the face of a league when all, all the, all the people that, you know that cover our game and talk about our game on a day to day basis on everybody, I mean, have that responsibility, that's, it's just weird. It's weird energy from the people that, you know, I don't know. But Channing, he said it, he said it perfectly. Couldn't say it no better. But and said he don't want it. I mean, obviously I didn't ask for it, but I knew there was a responsibility for me, not only to my family, my friends, my community, and whoever that was going to follow my journey throughout my career, not only in Ohio when I started there, but all over America and all over the world when I traveled all over the world. So I've always taken that seriously and understood from the beginning what being a professional was all about and being a role model is all about. So try to hold that with the utmost respect and honor and. But I feel ant. I understand, I completely understand. This is weird energy when it comes to that.
- [24:06]
Dan Le Batard
So what are your thoughts there, Meta?
- [24:08]
Meta Sandiford Artest
I think it's interesting, you know, when LeBron first came in as a 17 year old, he had 25 points against me. My first, his first game against me, you know, and he was missing some big shots. And I mean, you can't expect a 17 year old to come in and knock down big shots. But LeBron could always shoot, you know, I don't know. I mean, LeBron is the, he's the best shooter in the history of the game. He got 50,000 points and look at, look how he's ending his career. If you don't show his misses early. You'd think he was the greatest shooter ever, you know, and he's a family man. He, he might not be perfect. He's, you know, political. He's definitely a little political on that side and. But you know, who's not, you know, and I think in terms of his family, Ackerman, I think that's really impressive. We don't talk about that enough. So I think in the same breath sometimes you got to acknowledge that, you know, LeBron and Stephen Curry actually inspired me, you know, to just do things the right way. At the end of my career, I was watching these guys, like, you know, just getting inspired by high level athletes as a retired athlete, you know, and I don't think he's perfect, but yeah, I think he does. There, there's a, there's a lot, but that's what comes with it. And you know what? You should want it because if you're the face, that means you're going to be a billionaire. So who cares?
- [25:23]
Mike Ryan
Metal One thing that I don't think took off and you were kind of the face behind it. Whatever happened to the three pronged headband? I'm going to see if we can pull it up on screen here.
- [25:32]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Why did this not take off in the NBA? What happened here? Let's talk about it because that's a legend.
- [25:37]
Dan Le Batard
That's a legendary look on East Bay.
- [25:39]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Let's talk about it. Hey, man, I don't even know why, you know, a manager would bring this to me. Actually. No disrespect to the manager I had. He just doing their best. But this is something that, you know, this is the reason why I'm real, like, picky on companies I work with because, like, that should never have been on my head.
- [26:04]
Dan Le Batard
Thank you. His Lakers take on the Celtics in Boston Saturday night on abc. I didn't want to wrap you up. I want talk to you for another hour, but they're taking you away. They say you gotta go.
- [26:15]
Stugotz
So thank you.
- [26:17]
Dan Le Batard
Please. We hope to talk to you again. Always enjoy talking to you.
- [26:20]
Meta Sandiford Artest
Thank you for having me.
- [26:24]
Mike Ryan
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