The Big Suey: Known Buffoon James Dolan

Summary

Summary of "The Big Suey: Known Buffoon James Dolan" Episode of The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz

Release Date: June 4, 2025

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1. Introduction and Episode Overview

The episode titled "The Big Suey: Known Buffoon James Dolan" delves into the tumultuous dynamics within the New York Knicks organization, primarily focusing on the controversial firing of coach Tom Thibodeau and the pivotal role of owner James Dolan. Hosted by Dan Le Batard and Stugotz, the discussion is enriched with insights from guests Greg Cody, David Sampson, Chris Cody, Kaley Cuoco, Mike Ryan, and Billy Corben.

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2. The Controversy Around Greg Cody's Commentary

The episode opens with a heated exchange involving Greg Cody, who expresses frustration over being labeled a "senile old man." This epitomizes the tension between sports journalists and the subjects of their critique.

• Greg Cody on Being Called a "Senile Old Man":

  “...unless you're my age and hear somebody without credentials referring to me as that. Someone who's never met me, by the way, and probably has never read me or never heard me in his life to be referred to as a senile old man.”
  [02:17]

This moment sets the stage for a broader discussion on respect and professionalism in sports journalism.

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3. Analyzing the Firing of Tom Thibodeau

A significant portion of the episode scrutinizes the New York Knicks' decision to dismiss Tom Thibodeau after a five-year tenure marked by notable successes yet criticized for certain team dynamics.

• Dan LeBatard Questions the Firing:

  “...this was taken me too long to get here and forgive me for this... Thibodeau being fired... is not the results business or is it not?”
  [25:23]

• David Sampson's Perspective:

  “...the Knicks are doomed unless James Dolan stops making the decisions... Jim Dolan is willing to give Thibodeau 30 million on the way out the door.”
  [25:49]

Sampson criticizes owner James Dolan's influence, suggesting that Dolan's meddling and lack of championship pedigree are detrimental to the Knicks' future.

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4. James Dolan: The "Known Buffoon"

Central to the episode is the portrayal of James Dolan, the Knicks' owner, as a "buffoon" whose management style is questioned.

• Dan LeBatard's Accusation:

  “...known buffoon James Dolan. The man does not deserve any kind of sports respect... ”
  [34:09]

• David Sampson on Dolan's Management:

  “...ownership makes the call, not Leon Rose. ...there's not one coaching change that's ever happened where an owner was like, oh, I didn't know that you were thinking that.”
  [20:53]

The hosts and guests argue that Dolan's interference disrupts the team's stability and performance, attributing the Knicks' struggles to his leadership.

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5. Comparisons to Other Sports Figures and Management Styles

The discussion extends to compare Tom Thibodeau's situation with other coaches and owners in the sports world, highlighting differing management philosophies.

• Billy Corben on Coaching Changes:

  “...this happens quite often where you let go of a coach who did well and then another coach comes in, creates a different culture.”
  [30:14]

• Greg Cody on Potential Successors:

  “...Johnny Bryant... Jay Wright... a lot of options.”
  [31:00]

These comparisons emphasize the complexity of coaching tenures and the impact of ownership decisions on team culture and success.

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6. The Future of the Knicks and Potential Coaching Candidates

Speculation about the Knicks' next steps includes potential hires and the challenges of finding a coach who can build upon or diverge from Thibodeau's legacy.

• David Sampson's Insights:

  “...new coaching hires are not as many retreads... someone you've never heard of, who likely will be a way better coach...”
  [28:04]

• Chris Cody on the Need for Improvement:

  “...they have to be... getting Bam or Hero...”
  [37:15]

The conversation underscores the necessity for strategic changes beyond coaching, including player roster adjustments to achieve sustained success.

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7. Broader Sports Business and Ownership Critique

The episode broadens its scope to critique sports ownership practices, emphasizing the detrimental effects of owners who prioritize profit and control over team success.

• Dan LeBatard on Business vs. Sportsmanship:

  “...if sports were won, if sports were fair and business weren't dirty, known buffoon James Dolan... would not get to win...”
  [35:11]

• David Sampson on Dolan's Business Acumen:

  “...he's never won a ring of any kind... the Knicks will never win a title in my lifetime...”
  [19:15]

These points highlight the ongoing debate about the role of ownership in sports and its influence on team performance and integrity.

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8. Audience Engagement and Polls

Throughout the episode, the hosts encourage audience participation through polls, such as voting on whether James Dolan's hat is "dopey," reinforcing the interactive nature of the show.

• Dan LeBatard's Call to Action:

  “Put it on the poll at LeBatard show. Is it a dopey hat?”
  [34:35]

This engagement fosters a community atmosphere and invites listeners to actively partake in the discussions.

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9. Closing Remarks and Final Thoughts

The episode concludes with lighter banter and references to upcoming topics, maintaining the show's signature blend of humor and serious analysis.

• David Sampson on Documentary Review:

  “...It's called the Fall of Favre on Netflix. Untold...”
  [42:18]

While wrapping up, the hosts hint at future discussions, leaving the audience anticipating the next episode's content.

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Notable Quotes and Timestamps

• Greg Cody on Respect:

  “...unless you're my age and hear somebody without credentials referring to me as that.”
  [02:17]

• Dan LeBatard on James Dolan:

  “The man does not deserve any kind of sports respect.”
  [34:09]

• David Sampson on Knicks' Future:

  “...the Knicks are doomed unless James Dolan stops making the decisions.”
  [25:49]

• Chris Russo’s Critique of Dolan:

  “This makes the Knicks a laughingstock. You don't fire this guy.”
  [33:05]

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Conclusion

In this episode, The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz offers a critical examination of the New York Knicks' internal struggles, emphasizing the problematic influence of owner James Dolan and the contentious firing of coach Tom Thibodeau. Through passionate debates and expert opinions, the show underscores the intricate balance between management decisions and team success in professional sports.

Transcript

[Dan LeBatard]

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[David Sampson]

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[Dan LeBatard]

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[Kaley Cuoco]

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[David Sampson]

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[Dan LeBatard]

Go to your happy price Priceline welcome to the Big Sui presented by DraftKings. Why are you listening to this show.

[David Sampson]

The podcast that seems very similar to.

[Dan LeBatard]

The other Dan LeBatard podcast?

[Greg Cody]

I'm sorry, I'm not going to apologize for that.

[Dan LeBatard]

In fact, the only difference seems to be this imaging. I have been tempted in restaurants just walking past tables to grab somebody's fries that if they're just there. That hasn't happened to you guys. I've done it. And now here's the Marching man to Nowhere Fat Face and the Habitual Liar.

[Chris Cody]

This segment is presented by LinkedIn Jobs. Post your job for free at LinkedIn.com dls Terms and Conditions apply.

[Dan LeBatard]

I asked us to pace ourselves over these playoffs. I don't know if we have Greg. Cody does look a little bit relieved to not have had to do Heat at the same time as Panthers. He looks better at the end of this run than he looked at the end of the last run. But he just spent the entire break with pretty righteous indignation at both me and at the disrespect of Whitehat. Because he's still saying Greg is still saying that this is an act of cowardice and of great insult to be someone who doesn't have his journalistic pedigree and is very comfortable being disrespectful enough to call him a senile old man.

[Greg Cody]

Yeah, I mean, unless you're my age and hear somebody without credentials referring to me as that. Someone who's never met me, by the way, and probably has never read me or never heard me in his life to be referred to as a senile old man. It cuts on a very personal level.

[Dan LeBatard]

50 years a writer, 50 years covering sports, a half a century covering games.

[Kaley Cuoco]

But he's a senile old man.

[Greg Cody]

That's just disrespectful. In. In plain fact, now, the cowardice comes from those two doing a show yesterday, talking about me and about what I wrote and not having the decency to have me on, which I was under the impression they would have until White Hat didn't want to because he said, I would rather put knives in my eyes or whatever it was, which they pointed out.

[Kaley Cuoco]

You'd still be able to hear the podcast.

[Greg Cody]

Still be able to hear.

[Mike Ryan]

I hope he does.

[Greg Cody]

As he heard it, he would be screaming, which wouldn't be all that bad.

[Kaley Cuoco]

But he's a senile old man.

[Mike Ryan]

People should have to follow through on that. You'd rather put knives in your eyes and have Greg Cody on. Well, you didn't have Greg Cody on Knives out, baby.

[Greg Cody]

That's right. By the way, I have never. I have yet to write an entire column calling McDavid Mc overrated. Last year and again this year, I wrote about four paragraphs in a longer column.

[Dan LeBatard]

What is. What is the record you want to set straight? You were talking throughout the break. You wanted to set the record straight on two things.

[Greg Cody]

Okay? I think superstitious hockey fans like Mike and others, and they referred to this on the hockey podcast yesterday. They're like, why would he do it now? And rile everybody up. The bulletin board is dead. Okay? Nobody is placing my headline in the Edmonton locker room. The most pathetic athlete on earth is the one who can't really get fired up for the Stanley Cup Final, and he needs something outrageous that was said by a Miami columnist to get all excited about it.

[Kaley Cuoco]

The bulletin board has been replaced by the group text. Now that just gets sent around to their group like.

[Chris Cody]

But.

[Greg Cody]

But again, the point is, there was a big article out of Edmonton last year that McDavid apparently was aware that somebody in Miami had called him a golden dad.

[Dan LeBatard]

His dad.

[Greg Cody]

Okay, well, guess what? How'd that work out for him? He didn't get all riled up.

[Chris Cody]

He won the Con Smythe.

[Greg Cody]

Yeah.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yeah.

[Greg Cody]

Did he win the Stanley Cup?

[Chris Cody]

I understand your point, but, like, the guy can't do more than be the most outstanding player in the playoffs.

[Mike Ryan]

That's just the lead.

[Greg Cody]

Well, yes, he can, actually. Yes, he can.

[Kaley Cuoco]

Somebody should write the Mick underrated column.

[Mike Ryan]

That's also the league and the media trying to kind of COVID Their own asses on that one. Like, oh, look, he lost again. Here's a participation award, the Con Smythe.

[Greg Cody]

And I'll go a step further. If he wins a Stanley cup, the narrative might well be, now he's got to win another one and another one, and here's why. If he wins one, that's. If you're McJesus, you win one Stanley cup in your 10th year, that's not enough. All of a sudden you're Aaron Rodgers.

[Dan LeBatard]

But I don't.

[Mike Ryan]

Better win zero than one if you're him.

[Greg Cody]

Better. Well, no, I would never say that.

[Dan LeBatard]

Thank you. Is the put it on the poll at LeBatard show? Is the bulletin board dead? And I just don't think that we can say in this particular story, Greg, that you can say the bulletin board is dead. When you as a media personality were the epicenter of last year's finals because of what you said, so silly in saying it that it reached Connor McDavid's dad, who was at the Elbow Room and was telling others that he had no use for you. And this was the highest of indignant that was being expressed by a classy Canadian person to be enraged by how classless you were. It got to McDavid's father. You don't think it becomes personal, then you can't say the bulletin board is dead. When your words wounded his father so much that he's spilling drinks over at the Elbow Room and crying his heart out about, why is this quote, unquote, senile old man? Man.

[Kaley Cuoco]

But he's a senile old man going.

[Dan LeBatard]

After my great son who's clearly the king of all kings.

[Greg Cody]

Have you met Conor McDavid's dad? I'm just curious why? How you know he's classy when just Canadians?

[Dan LeBatard]

You don't know?

[Greg Cody]

Okay, I just wanted to make that.

[Dan LeBatard]

Well.

[Greg Cody]

But, yeah, and, and, and it's not a silly opinion. It might be an outrageous opinion that nobody else agrees with, but it's not a silly opinion. Look, I'm using an American standard here. I don't know how they think in Canada.

[Kaley Cuoco]

You did that in the column. I don't know how you guys do.

[Greg Cody]

It over there in the United Metric system.

[Kaley Cuoco]

Yeah, I was like last week when David did the Three Weeks, Three Days a Week podcast.

[Greg Cody]

You got to win something to be a goat. You have to win something to wear a crown. All I've ever said was, he's a great player who hasn't won the big prize yet. Win it, and then you can be.

[Mike Ryan]

McJesus imagine I old man, imagine had America lost World War I. But then they get best war participant award.

[Dan LeBatard]

David Sampson's nothing personal. I would have thought that podcast is now doubled the David, if you have not seen he is now starting at 7am because he is a maniac eastern going 7 to 9 and giving you sports business lane. He is doing it stronger than anybody. I think I can make that argument. I don't know that even Ravel would have much objection to the idea that David Sampson is owning the sports business lane right now. But his podcast is a lot more than that. And now it's twice the size. David, how has the first week of that experience gone? Because now you're talking to yourself two hours a day and that'll make a human being crazy. Ten hours a week. You will be an echo chamber inside of your own head. You will be insufferable to people who love you. You will talk too much all the time.

[Greg Cody]

What's different?

[Dan LeBatard]

It's twice the David, Nothing personal and he has gotten a great gig. Have any of you seen it? He's doing a great job. It is.

[David Sampson]

Thank you.

[Dan LeBatard]

But I don't feel like. Do you feel like you have the support of the company? I don't feel like you and Pablo feel in any way connected to the shows that that you guys are doing in our network.

[David Sampson]

I'd say Pablo and I connect more often than anybody else within the company as we're talking about topics and shows and what's happening. But no, I feel very much a part of Metal Arc. I feel very much that nothing personal is a part of your network. Your lineup. Really, really happy to be partners with DraftKings. They've been amazing as we've gone to two hours. Just totally supportive. And they have me doing a bunch of other things related to like Club World cup. And I just. I love being a part of your team. Preston. No, I'm enjoying it.

[Chris Cody]

It's a weird thing to toss out there. Dan. During his weekly hit.

[Dan LeBatard]

Greg Cody is still indignant before anything else. And it's taken me too long to get here and forgive me for this. So I think if you were to tell me what could be the most talk piece firing that could have happened in employment yesterday, where you would just get people talking about the importance of a coach and the value of a coach is fire one guy yesterday and you guys might have another. But if you do it to Thibodeau when he's made your team better than it's been in 25 years and anyone can Assemble the argument that doesn't deserve to be fired. It's better than you have ever been. It makes for just a classic New York sport sports radio argument of was this unfair or is it not unfair when the new standard in sports is you better get it done within five years. Man, they've sped up the curves on it was a long time ago with the Knicks and that Derek Fisher and Steve Kerr were deciding who were going to coach that team and they set a standard of $5 million a year of a coaching standard on the Knicks. Derek Fisher chose the Knicks. Steve Kerr went on to greatness. Thibodeau is the best thing that team has had at the top of its food chain since Pat Riley. This is their best coach, Jeff Van Gundy included. His success speaks for itself. But the criticism is fair on no bench and stubborn about minutes for the six guys and then they burn down at the end. And management is entrusted with fixing the future when they've given up the five first round picks for bridges. So the only kinds of changes you can make are at coaching positions because you're locked in with 93% of your salary on six guys.

[Billy Corben]

And Dan, you said the most important part. He got five years right? Like the the Knicks were, were getting better every season. But with getting better every season, the Tom Thibodeau weight grinds on you and grinds on you and grinds on you until your best player is like, hey, this is kind of a lot, right? You've got his dad also lurking in the background. You got Worldwide west, you've got Leon Rose, you've got all these different players. James Dolan at the top. At a certain point it's like the Mike Malone situation in Denver. You grind on people so much that it's like, you know what? It's better. Okay, thank you for, for taking us to the Eastern Conference finals. But, but we're going to try and move on to the next coach that can probably take us over the hump.

[Dan LeBatard]

David, his, his, his dad, his son. Like what are we doing?

[David Sampson]

I have a top five list if you're interested. Because I've been thinking about it a lot. Who, what announcement yesterday would have been more surprising or more newsworthy than Tibbs getting canned when he did. And I've got a top five firings that would be even more shocking had they been announced yesterday.

[Dan LeBatard]

All right, so you're undercutting my point. You have five. I'm idiot. I've said this was the most.

[Billy Corben]

You thought one.

[Dan LeBatard]

I'm a fool. I'm A prisoner of the moment. You've got 5 better than this. That could have happened yesterday. All right, let's see. Number five.

[David Sampson]

Number five, Rick Carlisle on the eve of the NBA Finals.

[Dan LeBatard]

Okay, fair enough. Good point. You got me. I'm cornered. Gotcha.

[David Sampson]

Number Wait till I'm just getting started.

[Dan LeBatard]

Just gonna get started. Okay, very good.

[David Sampson]

Number four, Mike Tomlin gets fired yesterday without Aaron Rodgers having signed. All of a sudden they can him.

[Dan LeBatard]

Maybe it's not a much bigger story, bigger sport, but not. Not New York, not the beloved team coming off the bet. Okay, but fair enough.

[Greg Cody]

He's Tomlin.

[David Sampson]

Number three, Andy Reid getting fired by the Chiefs.

[Dan LeBatard]

Very good.

[Greg Cody]

Oh yeah.

[Billy Corben]

All right, you know what, what are we doing?

[Dan LeBatard]

Like leap off? No, he's being.

[Chris Cody]

You want to switch to drafting Oilers and Cats? You know what, I'm a top two.

[Billy Corben]

More Mark Daganal next.

[Dan LeBatard]

No, no. You know what guys?

[Mike Ryan]

David's been waiting.

[Dan LeBatard]

Hold on. You know. Okay, well I've been waiting for an.

[Chris Cody]

Hour and a half to get to this draft.

[Billy Corben]

Five minutes.

[David Sampson]

Major asshole.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yes. David gets five minutes.

[Greg Cody]

Whoa.

[Dan LeBatard]

We are going Panthers, Oilers, draft. David gets 5min. Being an asshole here. Absolutely. Go ahead, Panthers.

[Chris Cody]

So Dan, this was impossible because I'm doing it based on current form. The Panthers have been so even in terms of stat distribution this season that it's really hard. So I'm going to go based on current form. These are the best 15 players in this series in order, in order top to bottom.

[Dan LeBatard]

Roy, how do you feel? Have you notarized this list?

[Chris Cody]

I did not get to see it. I would love your opinion on this.

[Dan LeBatard]

Oh, wait a minute. Oh now. After the fact.

[Chris Cody]

After the fact. No, no, I'm busy over here. There's been no.

[Billy Corben]

I haven't seen it yet though.

[Chris Cody]

I ran it by the Duke. I ran it by the Duke and he gave me some feedback. I trust Mike. He didn't like where Sam Bennett was placed.

[Greg Cody]

All right, Bob better be top five.

[Chris Cody]

Based on current form. You might be right. Number one, Connor McDavid.

[Greg Cody]

Yeah.

[Kaley Cuoco]

Obviously you would even acknowledge that.

[Greg Cody]

Yes, I think it's debatable.

[Chris Cody]

He's had more two point playoff games than zero.

[Dan LeBatard]

It's debatable. What's debatable?

[Greg Cody]

I think it's debatable because he's not an all round player in the way that Markoff is.

[Dan LeBatard]

Okay, so it is.

[Greg Cody]

Would I draft McDavid first? Yes, but I don't think it's a no brainer.

[Chris Cody]

Okay, well, he leads the playoffs in points and has more two point playoff games. Than zero point playoff games.

[Mike Ryan]

Anyone can get hot. Yeah.

[Dan LeBatard]

Greg, are you simply anytime anyone says anything positive about Connor McDavid going to be there with. Yeah, but. So that you can become Skip Bayless to LeBron.

[Greg Cody]

No, I respect Conor McDavid's game.

[Dan LeBatard]

But they just asked you to acknowledge he's the best player in the series. Correct. And you're like, do you mean complete player?

[Mike Ryan]

He said he'd take him number one.

[Greg Cody]

I'd give it a shaky. Yes.

[Chris Cody]

Really wasn't expecting pushback from number one.

[Dan LeBatard]

Shaky, Yes.

[Greg Cody]

I agree. I sanction drafting him first.

[Chris Cody]

Well, then you're going to be mad about number two because number two is not Sasha Barkov. Number two is Leon Draisaitl.

[Kaley Cuoco]

This is where we disagree.

[Chris Cody]

The former hard trophy winner. Look, Draisaitl is a very underrated defensive forward and I don't believe the gulf between. Even though Markov is a once in a lifetime defensive talent, especially with smooth skating and all that. But the gulf between their offensive games is pretty wide. Dry, subtle. Is a more complete, better, well rounded offensive player. And that's not to take a shot at Barkov's game. We're talking about a former MVP of the league in Leandro.

[Greg Cody]

That's fair.

[Dan LeBatard]

Okay. Notarized. Sanctioned. Wait a minute. Is sanctioned. Is Greg Cody sanctioned? Better than a confirming. Is there a level higher than confirming where we can get Greg Cody's sanctioned action? Because he's just giving no on that so far.

[Kaley Cuoco]

So Goodman is better so far.

[Chris Cody]

So good on the. On the top two.

[Mike Ryan]

Shaky.

[Billy Corben]

This isn't even the best confirming. I think Ethan's confirming is number one and then Mike's and then whatever's next.

[Chris Cody]

Number three, Sasha Barkov.

[Kaley Cuoco]

That's fair.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yeah, that's good.

[Chris Cody]

Number four, Sergei Babovka. Yep, yep.

[Kaley Cuoco]

You're going to get a lot of Panthers here, folks.

[Chris Cody]

All right, now this is based on current form.

[Dan LeBatard]

Roy, can you please get for me just Barkley, can you knock these through? I just want to hear Babka every time as a note as he goes through 1 through 15. Sergei Babka.

[Chris Cody]

Number 5. Sam Bennett.

[Dan LeBatard]

Sergei Babka.

[Chris Cody]

That's a shocker.

[Kaley Cuoco]

Ahead of Rhino. That is Chucky.

[Chris Cody]

He's a team leader in goals. I agree with that. In this postseason, Sam Bennett has been a force and he's making himself a lot of money. Hopefully not too much. Maybe take a little hometown discount. Sam Bennett is built for the player.

[Kaley Cuoco]

His hand does not shake.

[Chris Cody]

I watched the Departed last night. Yeah, Sam Bennett's great also. Do you know during the NHL combine, zero pull ups were accomplished by Sam Bennett. Zero. Don't need them.

[Dan LeBatard]

I took Odin over Durant because Durant couldn't do 185 on a bench press.

[Billy Corben]

I think it was 135 by the way, not 185. 185 is a lot.

[Chris Cody]

I Dan, I'm curious your feedback. This is where it got really hard for me. But I know he's battling an injury but. And he's not been the same player in that high slot offensively, but defensively Sam Reinhart has been a titan. So I'm going Sam Reinhart, number six, Sergey Bobobka. Then number seven. I'm going Evan Bouchard. We got an Evan, Sergey. Bob. The Bouchie bombs are just so important to what it is that they do. They have guys over there cleaning up now. Zach Hyman isn't there to clean it up. It'll be interesting. Hyman probably would have made this top 15.

[Dan LeBatard]

He's a series changer.

[Chris Cody]

He could help. Certainly.

[Mike Ryan]

There's a lot of movement. I'm noticing there is some back and forth there between seven and eleven.

[Chris Cody]

There is number eight, Anton Lundell.

[Dan LeBatard]

Sergey Babaka.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah. Baby Barky. Baby Barkey. Two way player. I mean, you want to look at Brad Marchand success and Lucy's success. You look at the centerman on that line. Anton Lundell has been super consistent.

[Dan LeBatard]

Folks.

[Kaley Cuoco]

We haven't said Chucky yet.

[Chris Cody]

Haven't said Chucky yet.

[Mike Ryan]

Number two, David.

[Chris Cody]

Number nine. This is going to be shocking because I'm still not going to say Chucky Lucerna.

[Dan LeBatard]

Aaron Boone, Sergey Babaka.

[Chris Cody]

Okay, he's been incredible. A little bit of a down series towards the tail end of that Hurricanes series. You could have said he's been Florida's best player entering that Carolina series. Then we're gonna go with Matthew Tkachuk.

[Dan LeBatard]

Sergey for Bob at 10.

[Chris Cody]

This is not projecting for their future career. He's very clearly hindered by this injury. He is not the same player but he's still top 10.

[Greg Cody]

Lot of cats in a row, but.

[Chris Cody]

He'S not the person that has probably fallen off the most based on current form. Because if I was doing this last year on current form, Gustav Forsling would have been a top five going. Gustav Forsling. Number 11, Sergei Babka. We're going Echolm 12, Sergei Babka. We're Going Swaggy.

[Dan LeBatard]

13, Sergey Babka.

[Chris Cody]

We're going Nugent Hopkins. 14, Sergey Babaka. And this may shock you. Brad Marchand. Congratulations.

[Dan LeBatard]

You round out The Sergey, a shocker at the end.

[Chris Cody]

Gotta get the dirt line in.

[Dan LeBatard]

Stan Samson. What is fair on Thibodeau?

[Kaley Cuoco]

And for the record, that's five Oilers and 10 Panthers.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yeah, don't care. Just wanted to bother David for five minutes.

[Greg Cody]

David would only look more annoyed right now if he was theatrically looking at a Thibodeau.

[Dan LeBatard]

Your thoughts?

[Chris Cody]

He did that already.

[Dan LeBatard]

Sampson, you already did this for two hours on Nothing Personal. This is the talk topic of the day. You have. You have a couple of exceptions, but Thibodeau being fired. Your thoughts?

[David Sampson]

Well, number one, don't believe that it wasn't Jimmy Dolan who did it. Obviously Leon Rose, the president is saying in consultation with James Dolan. But that's just horse hockey. The owner makes this call, not Leon Rose. The fact is the Knicks are doomed unless James Dolan stops making the decisions. And I could argue he has not stopped with the trades they made, including Cat Randall. Everything is done with Dolan. He is super controlling, super meddling, like many other owners. The problem is he's never won a ring of any kind. And to get rid of Tibbs is fine. You look at Tibbs, he looks angry, grumpy and despondent on the sideline. You question their defensive schemes. You question the fact they couldn't deal with Indiana's full court press. You look at the makeup of the team and realize that Leon Rose isn't doing his job either, as they were outmatched by Indiana and certainly would have been my Oklahoma City. As far as I'm concerned. Move right along, find someone else. But if it's still Jimmy Dolan running it, the Knicks will never win a title in my lifetime. And that bothers me.

[Dan LeBatard]

How do you know all of this? How can you speak with such absolute authority? Can I? Let me.

[David Sampson]

Just because I used to run a team that had an owner just like it.

[Dan LeBatard]

All right, so let me. Let me ask.

[David Sampson]

I get it.

[Dan LeBatard]

Okay. So I want to ask the group here, though, when I say that David Sampson has an uncommon sports business lane. He is talking about things with an authority from the insides of a sport in a way that are super cold but also accurate. How can you say with such conviction all the things you're saying when that requires reporting? David, it requires. In order to know that James Dolan made that decision is to know the inner workings of the Knicks. And the Knicks have changed how they were doing management. The new management of the Knicks was being allowed by James Dolan to do what it is that they wanted to do.

[David Sampson]

I'm Sorry. Where did you get that information? That's from Pablo Torre.

[Dan LeBatard]

That's what's been reported. David, what do you mean from Pablo Torre?

[David Sampson]

You understand that I could get anything reported. All I have to do is get it out there. Hey, George Steinbrenner let Brian Cashman and Joe Tory run the Yankees. And that's why they got successful after my suspension. And that's when everything changed. Oh, wait a minute. We had jeter, passata, pettit, etc. And a few guys doing steroids. There is not one owner out of any of the top owners, top leagues who is not involved in a coaching change. It just doesn't work that way. And did I report it? No. What? I'm going to call up Jimmy. Hey, Dolan. That was you, not Leon? No, they're going to say it's Leon so the owner can have plausible deniability. But I'm here to tell you, there's not one coaching change that's ever happened where an owner was like, oh, I didn't know that you were thinking that.

[Chris Cody]

All right, y' all, the super bowl is in the rearview mirror. The draft has come and gone. So now what?

[Kaley Cuoco]

Now it's time to get the crew together. You keep the fandom energy going. It doesn't stop when the Super Bowl's gone. We gather.

[Chris Cody]

Exactly. And look, just because the pads are off doesn't mean game day stops around here. We do game days even in the off season. And what better way to do that than with a cold drink and your people around?

[Kaley Cuoco]

You've heard it all season long. Football is not a solo thing. This is not a me thing. This is not an I thing. This is a we thing.

[Chris Cody]

There is no I in fandom, baby. So grab your crew, grab some Smirnoff, and get into that off season groove. Summer workouts, training camp, rumors, fantasy football prep, it's all coming, folks.

[Kaley Cuoco]

And listen, if you're gonna sip something while plotting your team's comeback, Smirnoff's got you. It's the perfect vodka for crafting cocktails that are easy and tasty for anyone. 21 and up.

[Chris Cody]

Smirnoff isn't just a vodka. It's the number one vodka in the world and the official partner of the NFL. Grab a bottle of Smirnoff at your local retailer and head to smirnoff.com to find recipes of delicious cocktails perfect for game day. Please drink responsibly. Smirnoff, number 21 vodka, distilled from grain, 40% alcohol by volume. The Smirnoff Company New York, New York. Please do not share with anyone under legal drinking age.

[Billy Corben]

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[Kaley Cuoco]

If you're anything like me, when you were a kid, you were a big dreamer. Maybe you dreamed of being an astronaut, maybe the president of the United States. Maybe you wanted to be the shortstop for the Yankees. But now we're dreaming of something else like owning our own businesses. But let's be honest, launching it, it's total chaos. Websites, shipping, your cousin wanting to collab. It's a mess. That's where Shopify comes in. They power 10% of all E commerce in the United States from brands like Mattel to your aunt's candle shop. Can't design a site Shopify's got ready to go templates. Need help writing copy or touching up pics? AI tools want customers built in email and social tools. And if you get stuck 24. 7 support real award winning humans. Turn those dreams into and give them the best shot at success with Shopify. Sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com batard go to shopify.com shopify.com LeBatard you have some hot takes today, Joe. Chestnuts of fire.

[Dan LeBatard]

Oh, he's on fire.

[Kaley Cuoco]

He calls Connor McDavid overrated before the show.

[Dan LeBatard]

What the hell was that, Greg?

[Greg Cody]

Yeah, no, I love it. St. Roy, let me explain it to you. And not that you need, you know, more about hockey.

[Kaley Cuoco]

And this is coming from a guy that's watched Conor play six times, right?

[Greg Cody]

If that.

[Mike Ryan]

This is the Dan Levatar show with the St.

[Dan LeBatard]

Gods. How are you feeling, David, about the fairness or unfairness of firing Thibodeau after five years?

[David Sampson]

It is absolutely within the owner's rights to do anything. He wants fairness. Thibodeau has been a coach. He did five years. It seems like he could be the patino of coaches where stick and move, stick and move. Five years in Chicago, three in Minnesota, now five in New York. There are a bunch of managers and coaches whose voices get drowned out after a certain number of years because they come in hot, stay hot. Okay, leave.

[Dan LeBatard]

But more success than a Knicks franchise has had in 25 years, like, that's not up for dispute. Is it the results business or is it not?

[David Sampson]

Well, exactly. To me, it's the results business. And I don't think about the money, which I certainly could have. You guys haven't even mentioned the fact that Jim Dolan is willing to give Thibodeau 30 million on the way out the door. He just got extended. Which shows you how extensions that are given to coaches and managers are really meaningless to owners.

[Dan LeBatard]

Sam's will. What. What happened here, like, what is. What does this mean that somebody with more success than a Knicks coach had. Had. Gets bought out at the end? When most Knicks fans could say that's not the reason they lost, like, that's. You think that most Knicks fans today are happy that Thibodeau's out.

[David Sampson]

There are plenty of Knicks fans who look at the way that he got out, coached by Rick Carlisle in the conference finals. There's plenty of Knicks fans who look at the makeup of the team and say, listen, you cannot run your guys ragged and expect to lead the league in minutes with two guys who don't play defense, Brunson and Cat, and end up on top in a playoff round where defense matters and the coach is supposed to be defensive minded. I think there's plenty of Nick fans who look at that way, but frankly, I don't care the way they're looking at it. Jim Dolan looked at it and said, hey, I. I hear the noise. We came one home game short of the maximum in the Eastern Conference, and then we still could have had three more home games where he prints millions of dollars by loyal fans who don't care about mediocrity and losing. And at the end of the day they. They actually reward him for his behavior because they continue to pay and pay more and more money. It's the most profitable home game there is in all of base, in all basketball.

[Greg Cody]

David, do you think Thibodeau is now a hot hire in the NBA at age 67, or do you have doubts about that?

[David Sampson]

I think and this is going to be a little ageism and I don't want it to be given. Given who I'm talking to and me, Greg, I would like to believe that he would be able to have one more run with the team. But the way that coaches are being hired now, like managers, it's not as many retreads. You know, the Ron Washingtons are really drowned out by some up and coming bench coaches who like a Joey Espada who gets an opportunity finally, or a Brandon Hyde. Obviously he's been fired since, but I think that the Knicks will be very telling. Jim Dolan will want a name. He'll want a retread. If Leon Rose is good as his job, he'll find the next Oklahoma City Thunder coach. And I don't want to butcher his name because I do it every time. But some. Someone who you've never heard of, who likely will be a way better coach for a bunch of guys, but impatient normally don't want way better.

[Dan LeBatard]

Way better.

[David Sampson]

A way better coach than, than, than. Than a retread.

[Dan LeBatard]

Oh, they're going to go get somebody who's way better than Tom Thibodeau.

[David Sampson]

Oh, I think that just somebody different is what they want.

[Dan LeBatard]

But that's the same thing like that.

[David Sampson]

How much that changes get made.

[Dan LeBatard]

Okay, but David. Yes. Can you explain to me why you'd get such glee out of the fact that James Dolan is one of the worst owners and he has this power and he flings it around and he continues to make money and win even though he's a buffoon.

[David Sampson]

Well, you say I get Glee. Remember I started my life as a Knicks fan in 1974. Oh, I missed it by a year. And I've gone my whole life without seeing the Knicks win a title. So I don't know what glee you have in them losing in the conference.

[Dan LeBatard]

It seems like you, it seems like you like that. James, you're taking a certain delight and in telling us, hey guys, this is just the owner wielding his power all over the place, making a mess, being sloppy because he's going to remind everyone that he's in power and There are never going to be any consequences. Even though he's a buffoon because he's got the most expensive ticket in sports. And Thibodeau, honestly, great for business the last couple of years, like, spectacular for business. The Knicks people cared about him. Hey, fibs get out the door. Like, you can't say that's results based. You just can't.

[David Sampson]

I'm sorry, did you say he's a buffoon for having the most expensive tickets in the sport?

[Dan LeBatard]

No, James Dolan is a known buffoon.

[David Sampson]

Okay? So that's two different things. He's doing great business at the Garden, and he's got fans who are loyal and who pay money to see him now, notwithstanding the networks going bankrupt. But that's not actually his fault. So I would just argue this on behalf of Dolan, and it's hard to argue on behalf of someone who is, like, perceived the way he is. But he looks at that and says to the fans, I want you to have a title. He doesn't really mean that because he wants more home games than himself to have a title. But he says, we fail, therefore a change is coming. I'm not going to fire Leon Rose because it makes us look too disorganized. So we'll fire Tibbs. We'll bring in someone with the hope of we're going to get you where you want to be next year. It makes perfect sense to me.

[Billy Corben]

And from a basketball standpoint, it happens quite often where you let go of a coach who did well and then another coach comes in, creates a different culture. Look what Steve Kerr did, Mark Jackson. I brought this up on the alley oop a couple of weeks ago or last week. Is this a situation where we could see Tom Thibodeau get to the Eastern Conference finals, lose, and then get fired the way Mark Jackson did where he took him to the playoffs? He was right there at the edge. They have the same identical record, 51, 31. Mark Jackson's last year, and now Tom Thibodeau's last year, where you look at that and say, can another coach get us to the next echelon and get us to the NBA Finals? They work with Steve Kerr. They went on a dynastic run. Now you're looking for the next guy. Could it be Johnny Bryant, the guy they have on their own bench, who they blocked from having Phoenix? Take a look at him. Could he be the next name? Could Jay Wright come in and be the savior for New York? Like, there's a lot of options.

[Dan LeBatard]

All right, so this is Kat on the second team now that Tibbs ends with right. This is the second time this has happened to this particular pairing. What are you smiling about, Sampson?

[David Sampson]

Because that's a funny narrative that the media has. It is not that Kat is the downfall of Tibbs because he's been there, Minnesota and now New York when he got canned. It's just, just. That's just a coincidence.

[Dan LeBatard]

David, we're not going to be doing a lot better than fibs. We can agree on this. Like we can argue in the margins. And I'm not saying there can't be improvement and I'm not saying in the results business you can't go cutthroat about getting improvement. And we can say voice is tired in the locker room and can only change so much of the players, but you can change the players. Cat could be available like you, they.

[David Sampson]

Do need to get better. But you, you're looking for five more wins. I think that's the way that, that, that teams look at it who lose in the LCS or lose in the ECF or WCF is you try to figure out how do you make up the increment. Or if you win, you figure out how do you stay it on top. And you don't know how many opportunities you're going to have. You look at the construction of your team, the way the Knicks are put together. They are not able to win those extra five games. You start with a new coach, but you can't stop there. You got to change out those players in some way shape or form because otherwise you will not ever get those five games with this group.

[Billy Corben]

The other thing too is I think the Mikel Bridges trade was foisted on to Tom Thibodeau like there was, there was internal issues between him and Mikel Bridges throughout the entire season. And now you're looking back and saying, okay, the front office gave five first round picks to get this guy to figure to be their, their piece, their missing piece to beat the Celtics to go on to the finals. And that never gelled with Thibodeau.

[Dan LeBatard]

Let me get. David, let me get some sound here. Not just of JD and the straight Shots, James Dolan's great band. I don't know if I can play that music without getting in licensing trouble.

[Chris Cody]

You can't. When you talk it out, the answer's there.

[Dan LeBatard]

Okay, so in the absence of that, perhaps I can borrow just some Mad Dog talking about this firing in a way that I, if I had to guess, my guess is that Mad Dog is not going to Agree with David Sampson at all.

[Chris Russo]

This makes the Knicks a laughingstock. You don't fire this guy. How do you fire a head coach who took the team to the Eastern Conference final for the first time in a quarter of a century? The team needs a new voice. How the hell is Jim Dolan, though? Dolan doesn't know anything about basketball.

[Chris Cody]

What?

[Chris Russo]

Are you kidding me? Jim Dolan? I mean, come on, Jim. Let him go build spheres, you know, in Vegas, in Paris. That's what he's good at. Let him go figure out a way and, you know, rip us all off with.

[Greg Cody]

With.

[Chris Russo]

With optimum. How about we have Jim do that instead of sitting there worrying about who is going to head coach is going to be. This is a guy who's run the Knicks since, what, in the mid-90s and essentially has done absolutely nothing. Nothing. And then he sits there with this dopey hat on, you know, on the baseline, and he sits there and. Because they lose to Indiana because Towns and OG miss free throws with big leads in the fourth quarter of Game 1, and that's the reason why they lost the series. They lost the series because Nate Smith went crazy in the last minute of game one and OG And Anthony Towns missed free throws. If either one of them makes both free throws, the game is over. The next Podiat.

[Dan LeBatard]

Known buffoon.

[David Sampson]

That's who you want to side with in the legend of buffoonery.

[Kaley Cuoco]

It is a dopey hat.

[Chris Cody]

Yes. Stupid ass hat.

[Dan LeBatard]

It is a dopey hat. Put it on the poll at LeBatard show. Is it a dopey hat? Again, known buffoon. James Dolan. The man does not deserve any kind of sports respect. He shouldn't have firing power over anyone in sports.

[Chris Cody]

No.

[David Sampson]

The owner.

[Chris Cody]

No. Buffoons win. They can't. They can win in sports. You can get lucky.

[Dan LeBatard]

I'm just saying.

[Chris Cody]

Jeffrey Lauria.

[Dan LeBatard]

If sports were won, if sports were fair and business weren't dirty, known buffoon James Dolan of JD and the Straight Shots would not get to win by saying that Tom Thibodeau is not good at his job. When Tom Thibodeau is only miles and miles better at his job that James Dolan has ever been at anything other than the dirty politics of how you make money in New York. Even if your product actually sucks because you just have an arena in the center of town that will make profit forever. Because people want to love the Knicks so much that they don't care that their owner is a buffoon. They tolerate it.

[Greg Cody]

A known buffoon.

[David Sampson]

Yeah, but you're the greatest, Stan. You're the greatest economist I've ever come across. You just made the exact argument for why Dolan is not a buffoon. You made it word by word.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah, but the closest he's come to winning wasn't even with the Knicks.

[Billy Corben]

It was with the Rangers when they.

[Chris Cody]

Lost to the Kings in the Stanley Cup Final.

[Dan LeBatard]

He's never won anything and is again.

[Mike Ryan]

He made this fear, which was a win.

[Billy Corben]

A known buffooned billionaire is a win, too.

[David Sampson]

Can I give you my number one? That would have been way bigger news today than Nepo, baby.

[Chris Cody]

I mean, what. How did he win? What? What did James Dolan do to be one billionaire?

[Billy Corben]

He won the gene lottery. What are you talking about?

[Chris Cody]

You don't want to be James Dolan. He acquired his dad's team, okay?

[Billy Corben]

And.

[Chris Cody]

But you said he's a billionaire. As if, like, he achieved something. He just climbed out of the womb.

[Billy Corben]

Achieved or not, that's still a win.

[Chris Cody]

Okay. All right.

[Billy Corben]

Thank you.

[Chris Cody]

Cool.

[Kaley Cuoco]

It's not easy being a billionaire.

[Mike Ryan]

There's a room full of people that think that billionaires are losers. And Pete, whatever the hell his name is, is a big winner.

[Kaley Cuoco]

White hat.

[Dan LeBatard]

Put it on the pole.

[Billy Corben]

Nice hat, asshole.

[Greg Cody]

Ass hat.

[Dan LeBatard]

Y' all had to get in with the ass. You just heard the word ass, and everybody's like, I've got my signature for that ass hat. The Suns are aggressively looking to trade Kevin Durant.

[Chris Cody]

I'm ready to get my heart broken one more time.

[Dan LeBatard]

Really?

[Chris Cody]

Yeah. I'm like Tom Cruise, Mission Impossible. I need you to trust me. You won last.

[Dan LeBatard]

You want to ran for the Heat?

[Chris Cody]

Yes. I want to see one of the game's greatest scorers in the history of the game play in a Miami Heat uniform. As I've been edged by this franchise for 17 years on acquiring this guy.

[Dan LeBatard]

Feels like my information is, I'm going to say, two months old or three months old, but the best kind. The only way you get Durant is. It's got to be. It's got to be picks. It's got to be picks.

[Chris Cody]

We got some of those. I mean, let's make it happen. Come on. We've seen this team not enough.

[Greg Cody]

God, we've seen 4.0.

[Chris Cody]

Give me Kevin Durant.

[Greg Cody]

I want.

[Chris Cody]

I want to have a franchise that had LeBron James, Shaquille O' Neal, and Kevin Durant play for it. That'll be cool.

[Dan LeBatard]

David, your thoughts?

[David Sampson]

He is old. He's not the Kevin Durant that he was. He's not the centerpiece of a championship team anymore. You signed can't be the third piece with Bam and Tyler and form a a threesome that in any way would get Miami a title. It's dangerous to overpay for a name that used to be. You want to pay what he's worth, I think. And what he's worth is not the package that the Suns want because remember you're dealing with an owner there, Ishpia, who doesn't want to wear egg on his face, who created this team in Phoenix that has failed and now he wants to get out of it. But without looking bad.

[Chris Cody]

This is a team that very clearly needs a player better than Tyler Hero and Bam Adebayo. And I think today at his age, Kevin Durant strolls in with that head coach and is that.

[David Sampson]

Yeah. I don't know that you will get Durant without giving up one of those two, however.

[Dan LeBatard]

No, but that's. No, I'm telling you that that's not what the Suns wanted two months ago. I'm not. I know you got to make contracts match up but what they wanted two months ago was picks they did not want players they look, I think you've seen enough in Pablo Torre finds out and elsewhere to know that Ishpia, when you talk about meddlesome management and whatever Isaiah Thomas is doing in the shadows, there's there it's a giant, epic fail for one of these owners who spilled money all over the place and now like I can't tell you how epic a fail that Beal contract is and they went for it, didn't come close and now it ends with Durant slinking out a side door. This is not what you want for an all time great scorer. This has been a disaster and they've got as of two months ago the information I had is that they were going to rebuild it with picks. It's not about getting Bam or Hero and the Heat didn't want to go down that path because that's what it was going to take. And there are other teams that will have enough to Kevin Durant's in economy whether he's old or not. We can agree, yes that Kevin Durant.

[Chris Cody]

This we can agree that he's old, but we can also agree that he's still good.

[Dan LeBatard]

I think a lot of people would say terrible at defense and how good is he really if that Suns team can't even get into the playoffs? Because he can get. Yes, of course he'll be able to score 28 a game on 48% shooting for the rest of his life on jump shots. But what else?

[Chris Cody]

Dude, the best player right now is atrocious on defense. Your all star is atrocious on defense and would get picked on more than Kevin Durant would. Because Kevin Durant is a seven footer. Even at this age, I'd rather have Kevin Durant's long ass out there than Tyler Hero.

[Mike Ryan]

It's also just a name, right? Like he just need to sign a name at this point in time after swinging and missing so many. Like they just need a win. Whether or not it's going to lead to wins on we need to say.

[Kaley Cuoco]

We'Re going after someone and then we get that.

[Chris Cody]

Yeah, exactly. Chris Cody. And while Bill's right on the money, we need a player that is better. We need better players.

[Mike Ryan]

Well no, then you also have him forever as part of your franchise's history moving forward. And then when the heater and another downswing. Oh, guess what we're gonna do. We're gonna retire Kevin Durant's jersey and we're gonna sell the nostalgia stuff. And one of the all time greats was wearing a Heat jersey. Like that's what they need him for at this point in time because the fan base is kind of out on what they're doing.

[Greg Cody]

I mean does Kevin Durant at his age make you a championship contender in the first year or two? If the answer is no, then why would you go for him?

[Chris Cody]

I like the ingredients better if he's a part of it.

[Mike Ryan]

Well, they're not a championship contender in the first year or two now.

[Dan LeBatard]

All right, hold on.

[Greg Cody]

They're not, but they have to be.

[Dan LeBatard]

David Sampson before we get to the review. This part is new information and you're gonna have to look up for me this because I wasn't prepared to say this and I was meaning to check up back on this but now that this is gonna heat up a little bit, I can tell you that. And you guys are gonna have to explain what this means to me cuz I don't know who the five guys are but the Heat would believe to be in play for whoever the five guys are that have had they would have to reach out. However it is that these things happen where antetokounmpos people or Joel Embiid's people. I haven't even asked who the five people are but you guys could probably tell me who would be the Anthony Davis would be among them.

[Chris Cody]

We're ranking disgruntled superstars. I got Zion Williamson fifth stars that.

[Dan LeBatard]

Would one out who block is a.

[Chris Cody]

Little Hot on that one. I don't know if you've seen the news.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yes, that one. I didn't think it would have been Zion, but whatever it is that the. What would the five. Trey Young. What would the five calls have to be? Because Embiid would be one of them. Would they not?

[Chris Cody]

Man, I think we're ready.

[Greg Cody]

Giannis has to be number one.

[Chris Cody]

Are we ready to call that Joel Embiid thing?

[Dan LeBatard]

Are we?

[Billy Corben]

It's is cooked. I think the call is cooked.

[Dan LeBatard]

Wow. All right, we got less than a minute left here. Samson, what are you reviewing for us this week?

[David Sampson]

Less than a minute. We needed to talk about Brett Favre. There's an untold that you can watch on the Fall of Brett Favre. My God. It doesn't happen often. I hope somebody out there watched it. It's only 63 minutes. And it goes into pretty big detail that as good as you can be on the court, if you are a complete buffoon off the field and you commit crimes, take advantage of people and do things that basically ruin your reputation permanently, then you're just Brett Favre. And he's spending the rest of his life trying to make good for not having stolen money from people who are on welfare, trying to prove that he didn't do any of it. But he's going to have a hard time proving it. And it's. It's quite a story. It's called the Fall of Favre on. On Netflix. Untold.

[Dan LeBatard]

It stunk.

[David Sampson]

63 minutes. It wasn't a great documentary. I'm talking about the story, Dan. I'm asking people to learn the story.

[Dan LeBatard]

It's been told.

[Mike Ryan]

No, it's untold.

[Dan LeBatard]

No, it wasn't untold.

[Billy Corben]

New series.

[Dan LeBatard]

Been told. Number one done been told.

[Chris Cody]

And, Dan, not that you need help with five guys in your life, but I got Greek freak Katie, Joel Embiid, Trey Young and Zion Williamson.