Tony's Iceman Review + Zaslow's Cavs Prediction + Were The Maple Leafs Always The Problem, Not Mitch Marner? | Hour 1

Summary

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The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz

Tony's Iceman Review + Zaslow's Cavs Prediction + Were The Maple Leafs Always The Problem, Not Mitch Marner? | Hour 1

Date: May 15, 2026
Hosts: Dan Le Batard, Stugotz, John Zaslow, Tony, Dave
Remote Broadcast: Elser Hotel, Downtown Miami

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Episode Overview

This episode features the crew’s signature mix of sports talk, pop culture banter, and comedic riffing. The primary topics include Tony's early review of Drake's freshly-dropped "Iceman" album, discussion about the Cleveland Cavaliers’ big playoff moment without LeBron James, and heated analysis of NHL figures—chiefly the Toronto Maple Leafs and Mitch Marner. The hour is laced with asides on hats, the perils of moving homes, and the existential value of Internet service.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Classic Hat Debates & Personal Style (02:01–05:15)

• Dan, Zaslow, and the crew riff on hat fashion, notably berets vs. Kangol hats.
  • Quote [03:52]:
    Zaslow: “Two things everybody knows about me. I’m not a cuck, and I would never wear a beret.”
  • Tony details the Kangol hat’s significance in Black culture and jokes about classic old guy grill wear.
  • Zaslow fondly recalls his backwards Miami Heat Kangol from his youth, sparking playful roasting around fading hairlines and morning radio’s toll on aging.

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2. Modern Music Drops: Tony’s Review of Drake’s “Iceman” (06:32–10:25)

Drake's Promo & Album Surprise

• Zaslow questions the current music culture of "surprise" album drops, wondering where all the build-up and hype went.

  • Quote [06:32]:
    Zaslow: "What happened to the days that there was a...on sale date that the album is coming out, and you hype it up for three, four months...Now we just drop albums...without any promotion."

• Tony explains “Iceman” was, in fact, heavily promoted with Toronto’s icy stunts, but Drake doubled down by releasing two additional full albums alongside it:

  • "Iceman": classic rap
  • Second album: R&B/slower music
  • Third: Club/DJ mix, similar to "Honestly, Nevermind"
  • Quote [07:13]:
    Tony: "One is dubbed to be like an R and B slower music Drake. One is his rap, which is Iceman...Another which is kind of more like club mix DJ."

• Surprise at how streaming numbers favor Drake after public feuds with Kendrick Lamar.

  • Quote [08:14]:
    Tony: "Drake has like four other...number one songs since GNX dropped...Drake has been the number one streamed artist in hip hop still after that."

• Tony’s early “Iceman” review—classic "bangers", notable bars, some tracks familiar from earlier releases. Dave and Dan are ambivalent—Tony is “halfway through,” Dan expects to hear it via “the wife and Alexa.”

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3. Cavs Playoff Milestone & NBA Philosophy (10:28–22:13)

Rare Post-LeBron Achievement

• Zaslow highlights that if the Cavs beat the Pistons in Game 6, it’d mark their first advancement to an Eastern Conference Final without LeBron James since 1992.
  • Quote [10:28]:
    Zaslow: “Does it surprise you...that if the Cavaliers beat the Pistons tonight...it’ll be the first time without LeBron...since 1992?”

Cavaliers’ Aggressive Rebuild

• Discussion of Cleveland’s super-aggressive front office moves:
  • Outbidding for Donovan Mitchell and James Harden
  • Risk-taking with trades and coaching changes
  • Quote [11:57]:
    Dave: “Cleveland’s learned to be a super aggressive franchise...They have a nice rost and they’re not afraid to make big bold moves...”

Sports Fan Nihilism vs. Journey

• Dan questions whether being “just good enough,” without a championship window, is meaningful:
  • Quote [19:25]:
    Dan: “Unless it yields a title, what are you doing?...What is that going to matter?...Aren’t we delay[ing]?...The journey over destinations...”
• Zaslow counters that reaching the finals is validated in itself: any team in the championship round “has a shot.”
  • Quote [20:58]:
    Zaslow: “I think if you’re there, you have a shot...The only team that’s good enough to win the championship isn’t just the team that won...there are multiple teams good enough...”

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4. NBA Playoff Storylines: Spurs, Wembanyama, and Dynasties (23:26–30:45)

Rising Dynasties & Rooting Dynamics

• Anticipation about Victor Wembanyama’s impending dominance (“the long night is about to begin”).
  • Quote [24:35]:
    Dan: “Maybe you want to get one more title in before Wemby fully takes over...I think it’s setting up...the dominance is...about to start right now.”
• Discussion about sports fan psychology: initially embracing then souring on new dynasties (Oklahoma City’s example).
  • Quote [25:27]:
    Zaslow: “We did not foretell Oklahoma City being this team that everyone’s like...he’s tough to watch...the tide turned with them really quick. Is that gonna happen with San Antonio?”

Wembanyama’s Place in NBA Lore

• Long-term debate: Will Wemby enter the MJ/LeBron conversation?
  • Dan expresses worry about Wemby’s durability.
  • Quote [30:29]:
    Dan: “It might be a decade from now. Who’s better, MJ, LeBron, or Wemby?”

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5. NHL Talk: Leafs, Marner, and Vegas' Cinderella Run (31:05–36:23)

Mitch Marner & Maple Leafs Narrative

• Tony and Dave point out that Marner, long criticized, is now flourishing in the playoffs, shifting blame from underperforming stars to the Leafs organization itself.
  • Quote [31:42]:
    Dave: “Mitch Marner, this postseason is rewriting the narrative...This is increasingly looking like a Toronto Maple Leaf issue and not a Mitch Marner one...”
• Auston Matthews pegged as potentially “the overrated one.”

Vegas Golden Knights Surprising Everyone

• Vegas advances to the Western Conference Final despite a lackluster regular season — fewer wins than the Panthers, who missed the playoffs entirely.
  • Quote [33:05]:
    Zaslow: “Vegas won fewer games than the Panthers this year...Vegas was four games under .500 this season.”
• Dave sees Vegas as house money underdogs but praises their elite defensive forwards and a red-hot Marner.

Uniform Aesthetics & Identity Debates

• Dan questions which potential dynasty had the "worst uniforms," floating OKC Thunder and the Tom Brady-era Patriots as contenders for the gaudiest deep playoff runs.

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6. Comic Relief & Real-Life Chores: Moving House & TV as a Lifeline (37:50–41:32)

• Tony shares the logistical drama of moving: prioritizing Internet/TV installation above all else.
  • Quote [38:37]:
    Dave: “That’s what makes a house a home.”
  • Dan jokes, TV is his “enduring friend, always there through thick and thin...Thank you, TV.” [39:08]
• Rant about the infamous "service window" for installation—nobody’s really satisfied with "2-5pm” slots.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Kangols vs. Berets:
  03:52 – Zaslow:
  “Two things everybody knows about me. I’m not a cuck, and I would never wear a beret.”

• On Modern Album Drops:
  06:32 – Zaslow:
  “What happened to the days that there was a...on sale date that the album is coming out...Now we just drop albums...without any promotion.”

• On Cavs’ Aggressiveness:
  11:57 – Dave:
  “Cleveland’s learned to be a super aggressive franchise in the trade market...They outbid everybody for Donovan Mitchell.”

• On NBA Nihilism:
  19:25 – Dan:
  “Aren’t we delay[ing]?...The journey over destinations...my favorite seasons...I knew during the process this doesn’t end in a title.”

• On Wemby & Dynasties:
  24:35 – Dan:
  “Maybe you want to get one more title in before Wemby fully takes over...the dominance is...about to start right now.”

• On Marner’s Redemption:
  31:42 – Dave:
  “Mitch Marner, this postseason, is rewriting the narrative that surrounded him...increasingly looking like a Toronto Maple Leaf issue and not a Mitch Marner one...”

• On TV as a True Friend:
  39:08 – Dan:
  “TV is my best pal. He’s always there. I can be in any remote location...Thank you, TV.”

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Important Timestamps

| Time | Segment | |-----------|------------------------------------------------------------------| | 02:01 | Berets vs Kangol hats; Zaslow’s hat rules | | 06:32 | Drake’s “Iceman” album drop and new music culture | | 08:14 | Kendrick vs. Drake, streaming dominance post-beef | | 10:28 | Cavs’ playoff milestone—first ECF run post-LeBron since 1992 | | 11:57 | Cavaliers’ aggression, trade philosophy, front-office identity | | 19:25 | Dan’s sports nihilism: “Is it worth it if you can’t win a title?”| | 23:26 | Wembanyama & Spurs' potential dynasty; fan psychology | | 30:29 | Wemby in the MJ/LeBron pantheon discussion | | 31:42 | Mitch Marner, Maple Leafs, and Vegas playoff talk | | 36:23 | Uniforms: "worst dynasty uniforms" debate | | 37:50 | Tony on moving, installation woes, and TV/Internet priorities | | 39:08 | Dan’s “Thank you, TV” monologue |

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Tone and Style

Unfiltered, conversational, and laced with dry wit—classic Le Batard Show. Sports obsessions and pop-culture asides blend seamlessly. The team’s analogies, rants about fandom meaning and relatability (“TV’s my only constant friend”), and fearless nerdiness make this episode at once insightful and hilarious.

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In summary: This hour is a fast-moving pastiche of modern sports, music, and life, bouncing from deep-cut NBA analysis to the everyday anxieties of hat fashion and waiting for the Internet guy. The show’s characters shine as much as their sports takes, making it uniquely entertaining for fans and newcomers alike.

Transcript

[Dan LeBatard]

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[John Zaslow]

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[Dan LeBatard]

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[John Zaslow]

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[Dan LeBatard]

Saturday, May 16th at 9:00pm Eastern Standard Time, 6:00pm Pacific Time.

[John Zaslow]

This is the Dan Levator show with the Stugats podcast. DraftKings. Oh, my God.

[Tony]

The crown is yours.

[Dave]

Yeah.

[John Zaslow]

There you go. There we go. Where's Dave? Where did. Damn. This is what he does during the breaks. What? Wait, he's there. Okay.

[Dan LeBatard]

It's my new character. It's my new character. It's. It's the anonymous witness. I can't reveal who I am.

[Dave]

It'd be a terrible one.

[Dan LeBatard]

Could imperil me.

[John Zaslow]

Okay, you don't even know who's talking right now.

[Dan LeBatard]

You don't know who's talking right now. It could be anybody.

[John Zaslow]

For the audio audience is completely. It's pitch black in Dave's screen. Why is it completely dark?

[Dan LeBatard]

Well, I. I'm here to talk for Dave, although. So this is how I would disguise my voice so that you wouldn't be able to recognize the. Wait, wait, wait. It was me the whole time. Oh, wow.

[John Zaslow]

Wow. Give it up for Dave.

[Dan LeBatard]

Wow. Why is I see. Because it gets very hot in here. It gets 200 degrees in here. So I. So I turned the light off to chill things out for a few minutes while we're there. All right? But now, like, Dave went away, you don't know if Dave's here or not anymore. It could be a completely different.

[John Zaslow]

Wait, who's talking?

[Dan LeBatard]

Inhabiting this. Right. Exactly. Exactly.

[Dave]

Even if you disguise Dave's voice, you'd be able to tell it were him, like, right away. Anytime a modulated voice goes. What's the poop fella at that. That, like, it doesn't matter how you modulate it.

[John Zaslow]

We park our cars.

[Dan LeBatard]

Oh, am I right? Pittsburgh Steelers? Barry Olabeu. Who gives a crap? Hey, quickly, can I say this? Because as those backwards hat reminds me is the Steelers are playing the Saints in Paris. And that made me obviously think of a beret. And then I was thinking of. Is a beret the worst choice of hat you could make in the year of the Lord 2026? And I know that the easy answer is, well, you wouldn't want to. You'd rather wear a beret than an Abe Lincoln hat. But if you went to a hat store, they're not selling Abe Lincoln hats in 2026, but you probably could find a beret. And is that the bottom of the barrel when it comes to hats? Zaslow, as a hat wearer, how say you?

[John Zaslow]

Well, what about, like, those. Those kangal hats?

[Tony]

You know, Totally different thing. A beret is not a kangal. Kangal is not a beret. Black unk grandfathers of all kinds. Brian, Bruce, Aryans would not be caught dead wearing a beret.

[John Zaslow]

Okay?

[Dave]

So.

[John Zaslow]

But those guys. Did you say black on?

[Dave]

Yeah, yeah, that's what he said.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yes.

[John Zaslow]

They're. The black unks are still wearing Kangal.

[Dave]

Absolutely. Yeah.

[Tony]

Same with the leather sandals, too.

[Dan LeBatard]

With the.

[Tony]

With the. With the towel right over the shoulder on the grill.

[Dave]

Yeah.

[Dan LeBatard]

But wait. Sam Jackson wears his backwards, right? Or he or some of his characters.

[John Zaslow]

He only wore it in Jackie Brown. One movie.

[Dave]

He wears it all the time.

[Dan LeBatard]

But then you or Payne Stewart or Ben Hogan or somebody like you swing it around and, you know, I don't think I could pull that look off, But I think, Zaslo, you would look neat in that. I think, in fact, I would rather if you. If I had to choose a hat for you, if I were your friend trying to put you in a good spot here, I would say where the Kangal for the rest of life. If the only other choice was a beret, I think we would point and laugh at you much more in the beret.

[John Zaslow]

Well, I would never. I would never wear a beret. I mean, two things that everybody knows about me. I'm not a cuck, and I would never wear a beret. Everybody knows that.

[Dan LeBatard]

But a cuck in a beret. Now we're really talking.

[Dave]

Now. I know three things about you because you hate Bill Goldberg, too.

[John Zaslow]

Oh, every. Everybody knows that about me. Two things everybody knows about me. I'm never a cuck, and I hate Bill Goldberg. Everybody knows that. I used to have a Miami Heat kangal when I was a teenager.

[Dave]

Really?

[Tony]

Yeah. Front or back? Like, how would you wear it?

[John Zaslow]

The logo would be in the back. So I would wear the brim in the. Like, I'd wear it backwards. The brim would be in the back, and I'd wear, you know, the. The logo in the front. Yeah, I had a Miami Heat kangal. Whatever.

[Dan LeBatard]

That's his thing. He has to wear it backwards.

[John Zaslow]

Yeah, whatever, man. So. Oh, I had a great Dave. I had a great head of hair. You weren't like. Like, I wasn't Walking around with the dome, you know, big old head. When I was a teenager, I had a great headache.

[Tony]

What happened?

[John Zaslow]

Life. I mean, honestly, what happened? I did morning radio for seven years. Oh, yeah, that's what.

[Tony]

But the old man's got a good lettuce or. Nah.

[John Zaslow]

No, no, Tell us about the time

[Dan LeBatard]

you went bald, Zaslava.

[John Zaslow]

It wasn't. It didn't happen just one day. It was. It was over a course, you know, probably started happening in my early 30s. Yeah, probably early 30s.

[Dave]

Man, I knew you at 23. It happened before that.

[John Zaslow]

Really?

[Dave]

Yeah, brother.

[John Zaslow]

All right.

[Dave]

You're always the last to know.

[John Zaslow]

All right, there you go. But, man, Dave, you wouldn't believe it. Oh, my God. This. This put him and that had a hair. Find the ladies off of the stick, you know, I'm talking about devastating.

[Dan LeBatard]

I mean, listen, I know I'm doing all right in the hair department, but man, if I had the mane that I was sporting back in my mid twent, I would be a senator by now.

[John Zaslow]

Yeah, I hear you. All right, well, you know, nobody's perfect. So what is this I hear about Drake dropping a new album last night? And the reason I bring this up because, like, I don't care about Drake. It's not the kind of music I listen to. I don't understand how music is these days where all and seems to be like solely a hip hop thing, right? Or maybe, maybe Taylor Swift does this too, but the album will just drop out of nowhere. Oh, my God. Drake has a new album. What happened to the days that there was a. There was a on sale date that the album is coming out, and you hype it up for three, four months. You got a single that comes out on the radio this week, another single comes out next week, and then eventually you can buy the entire album. Now we just drop albums, we. Without any promotion. That's weird.

[Tony]

Well, no, Drake has had a long Runway of Iceman. He's had multiple, multiple, multiple promotions from Toronto Raptors freezing his seats to having, you know, 80 tons of ice blocked in. Toronto's like Main street over there. Putting the date of the Iceman drop inside the blocks of ice, so people had to go and dig in and wait till it melted.

[John Zaslow]

Is that what the album's called?

[Tony]

May 15th? Iceman is what it's called.

[Dan LeBatard]

Yeah.

[Tony]

May 15th is when we got it. And that was about a couple of weeks.

[John Zaslow]

I think it's little tease. Like that's what you get nowadays. Little teases, little hints.

[Dave]

You also get the surprise drop of nowhere. And Drake did both or two? Yeah, Drake did both big time because he promoted Iceman. And the surprise this time was there were two more full length albums. Yeah.

[Tony]

So one is. One is dubbed to be like an R and B slower music Drake. One is his rap, which is Iceman. And there's another one which is kind of more like club mix dj. Kind of like. Honestly, Nevermind was that he did with Black Coffee, which as it ages Nirvana very much. Huh.

[John Zaslow]

Never mind. That's Nirvana.

[Tony]

Honestly, never mind though.

[John Zaslow]

Oh, all right. So he dropped three albums.

[Dan LeBatard]

Lamar, can we go back Very.

[Tony]

Talk about a five, two liar is that we're going to do Dave. Damage check on the day that Drake drops Iceman.

[Dan LeBatard]

We're talking about a five man cook on Kendrick. Go ahead, Dave. No, that's what I was going to ask. I thought that Drake at last check for me. I thought Drake had been shamed out of society by Kendrick Lamar and here he is. But then my wife, Drake has emerged victorious somehow. I don't. I do the math for me on that one. Who can?

[John Zaslow]

Is that true?

[Tony]

Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely. Without a doubt. Without a singular doubt.

[John Zaslow]

I thought Kendrick Lamar ended his career. Please.

[Tony]

Are you that. That's how I know you're not listening to Drake or listen to hip hop whatsoever. Because Drake has like four other. Yeah, four other number one songs since GNX dropped. Since the whole thing with Not Like Us, since all that stuff. Drake has been the number one streamed artist in hip hop still after that.

[Dan LeBatard]

I mean, people say Kendrick won the

[John Zaslow]

beef of their song versus songs, but

[Tony]

in terms of just popularity, Drake one

[John Zaslow]

like Drake's, it's not even close. Is that true? Mike Ryan?

[Dan LeBatard]

Drake. Drake. You're not a cuck to be rooting for Drake, who you got humiliated.

[Dave]

I think you are. So yes, Drake is more popular on streaming because white girls love Drake. But if you like artistry, if you like just the music. I don't look at Drake the same way. And I go to Drake concerts. I like Drake. Like Kendrick says I like. I like to dance to his music too. Like it's fine, but it's. I will never look at him the same way. That guy took a bad public l. As bad as you can get.

[John Zaslow]

I just, I can't get over. I can't imagine that I. I wake up one morning and all of a sudden Pearl Jam dropped a new album last night out of nowhere. That'd be crazy to me. And I understand you're saying that's not exactly what Drake did, although you thought he was coming out with just one album. He came out with three. But this happens all the time in music now, right? Especially in hip hop where it's just a surprise. Oh my God. So has anyone listened to the new Iceman?

[Tony]

I've been. I'm halfway through. I was listening on the on the Way in Bangers. A lot of good songs, a lot of good lyrics, Shebang. And obviously he had some stuff that he had already released prior to what did I miss? The one with Central Cee. So there's a couple out there that have already been listened to. But great bars in the song so far I haven't listened to the other two albums that were the surprise drops. But I'll get. I'll get around to it, Dave.

[John Zaslow]

You'll get around to it?

[Dan LeBatard]

No, no, probably not. I do think the old lady will put it on the Alexa and then we'll. I have to keep it down because the Alexa is right over there and she'll hear me talking about her and she'll start talking and chime into the conversation we don't want. But yeah, I do think. I bet you that the wife and. And Alexa will team up to play some Drake and I'll hear whether I want to or not. But do I have interest in it? I think is the spirit of your question.

[Dave]

No.

[Dan LeBatard]

No, I do not have any interest in it.

[John Zaslow]

Does it surprise you when last night was weird? There was no NBA last night. Does it surprise you when I say that if the Cavaliers beat the Pistons tonight in Game 6, that it'll be the first time without LeBron James that they advanced to an Eastern conference final since 1992? That's 34 years ago. They have not been in the Eastern conference final without LeBron James since 1992. When I say that, does that surprise you?

[Tony]

Is that the Jordan shot over Elo.

[John Zaslow]

No, that was the first round and that was maybe like 80, 88 maybe. Yeah, and that was the first round. Yeah, and that was a first round game. But 1992, Mark Price, Brad Dougherty, Eastern Conference finals. I think the Bulls. Bulls won. I think the Bulls won that series in six. It was actually the first year the Miami Heat made the playoffs. Bulls swept them in the first round. It's not a good series, but game three was fun. I mean it was only a five point Bulls victory anyway. The last time that the Cavs were in the Eastern Final without LeBron James, 1992. So I guess it's a roundabout way of saying this is kind of a big deal. This game tonight for the Cavaliers it is.

[Dave]

And look, Miami. A lot of Heat fans prided themselves on their ability to rebuild themselves so quickly, get back to an NBA final so quickly after losing LeBron. But since LeBron left Cleveland, Cleveland's learned to be a super aggressive franchise in the trade market.

[Dan LeBatard]

They.

[Dave]

They outbid everybody for Donovan Mitchell. This James Harden move was kind of

[John Zaslow]

inspired Jared Allen as well.

[Dave]

Jared Allen as well. Like, they have a nice rost and they're not afraid to make big bold moves with their head coach either. I think that they've actually stabilized as a franchise here lately, kind of taking other teams lunch money.

[Tony]

Not only that, it shows the win of getting a Donovan Mitchell. It makes the trade, like, vindicated James Harden, the same thing. Like all these things are pushing forward and it's like, all right, we won, right? Like, like even if we don't win the Eastern Conference, even if we don't make it to the NBA Finals, you've laid the groundwork for. The moves that we've been making as a front office are working.

[Dave]

Tony, you know that moment at a party or at a tailgate where everything just sort of clicks?

[Tony]

I know it. Well, it's usually when I show up, everybody goes crazy.

[Dave]

Yeah, you usually take all the credit for it, but it's because Tony usually walks in with Cuervo.

[Dan LeBatard]

Walking like this.

[Dave]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Cuervo is a thing that turns hanging out into this is the night.

[Tony]

It has that effect on people.

[Dan LeBatard]

It does.

[Dave]

You usually take the credit for it, but again, it's the Cuervo effect. It's like that moment in a big game where everyone in the crowd just starts standing up, hootin and hollerin', keep it Cuervo.

[Tony]

Keep it Cuervo, baby.

[Dave]

Chris Cody, when you come over to my house and we put on the games, I got basketball, I got baseball going on, but what do I lay out for you and the boys for entertainment and drinking Miller Lab? Uh huh. Those beautiful white cans or on draft or the bottle, if you prefer.

[John Zaslow]

Oh. When you open that with the can, though, and you.

[Dave]

One of the best sounds on the planet. You pair that with the right game, you take that first sip, we both look around. It's not a bit.

[Tony]

I have goosebumps thinking about the first sip.

[Dave]

We take that first sip, we open it up and we're looking around. There's just that five seconds of almost eerie silence where you're just soaking it all in and you're like, man, did we make the right call or what? That's why we reach for Miller Lite. It's clean, refreshing, easy to drink, brewed for taste with simple ingredients that golden color. Just 96 calories and 3.2 carbs. The original light beer since 1975 and it still hits different I love you, Miller Lite. Cheers to legendary moments with Miller Lite. Great taste. 96 calories. Go to millerlight.com dan to find delivery options near you, or you can pick up some Miller Lite pretty much anywhere they sell beer. It's Miller time. Celebrate responsibly. Miller Brewing Co. Milwaukee, Wisconsin 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces.

[John Zaslow]

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[Dan LeBatard]

You know, the exact opposite effect that was intended a decade or so ago when they started going to Mike Pereira and all those guys in the booth to sort of explain to the public what the officials thought was is the exact opposite result of what they wanted. They wanted it to make us feel at home watching on TV exactly what you're describing. See, it was validated by another voice, an official voice there. And instead they're like, yeah, I don't think I agree with that one. It just made us much crazier about what what the old men calling things with their eyeballs are doing when we can see in high def television everybody in the world except those guys the irony that everybody watching the game sees the truth. But we don't want to hurt the feelings of the official so we just have to roll with their call is such an insane spot that we've arrived in. I do love that. But back to the, the point you're talking about with they're validated that the Cavaliers are validated by James Harden. I don't think even the, the greatest Cavaliers fan thinks that this ends with them winning the title. So then what value does it have to do it? And I think that it is a canary and a coal mine of sorts for you Heat fans right now. You sure you want Giannis? Because unless it yields a title, what are you doing? And the same applies to, forgive me, I'm a provincial thinker. Same goes for the Pittsburgh Steelers. You, yeah, Aaron Rodgers, give us our best chance to at 10 wins. What is that going to matter? Who cares if it doesn't yield a title run. What are you doing? You're wasting time. I feel like in fact one more cross sports analogy, Brett Favre kind of took over that Vikings team when they almost went to the Super Bowl. The entire story, had they gone to the super bowl, would have been Brett. Would have been Brett Favre. It would have blocked out the Son of the entire Vikings thing. And the same goes for the Cavaliers. The whole thing is the redemption of James Harden or not. The Cavaliers are incidental to this.

[John Zaslow]

I think the reason that you do it if you're the Heat. And also why if the Cavaliers win tonight, the hardened trade, even if they don't win the championship, the hardened trade ends up working for them, ends up being a positive. You want to have a shot. That's what it boils down to.

[Dan LeBatard]

But you don't have a shot. That's my point. It's. It's the mirage of. Look how relevant we are. Look, we made it to the. To the Eastern Conference finals. We're one of four teams to make it this far. But you also know that there is a ceiling on that. It might be a high ceiling, but it's not winning the title and hoisting the.

[John Zaslow]

Yeah.

[Dan LeBatard]

At the end of.

[John Zaslow]

That's.

[Dan LeBatard]

Are you really just delaying? Aren't we delay. I'm all about the journey over destinations as I my favorite seasons in the last decade or 15 years as a sports fans, I knew during the process this doesn't end in a title. That's not where the Cavs are. Though I suspect that Cavs fans are thinking, man, it's about time this team is ripening. It's time for a title run. And that's just not realistically in the offing. Right.

[John Zaslow]

Yeah, I think. I think we disagree in that because I think if you get to the championship round, like, let's say Cleveland wins tonight and they beat the Knicks, which I don't think is going to happen, but they get to the championship rounds and they're playing San Antonio or they're playing Oklahoma City, they're going to be massive underdogs. They're not going to win that series. But that's where I think my. My opinion there disagrees with a lot of people, which is I think if you're there, you have a shot. Like, I think if you're there, you're good enough. Like, this brings us back to all the heat. We're not good enough with Jimmy Butler, you know, and I disagree with that because I think if you're in the finals, you're good enough. Like, the only team that's good enough to win the championship isn't just the team that won the championship. Like they won the series. They were the better team. Okay. But there are multiple teams that are good enough to win a championship. Only one of them is going to.

[Dave]

They were good enough in the bubble, but I thought the Denver series, told them that.

[John Zaslow]

I mean, they were there. They were there.

[Dave]

Yeah, they weren't close in that series.

[John Zaslow]

Yeah, I don't, I don't see it that way. I think if you're there, if you're in the finals, you have a chance to win. Like you're right there in football.

[Dan LeBatard]

That's true. Because as they say, you know, and why March Madness is compelling is because for a 40 minute stretch, anything might happen. In a football game, it's plausible that anything might happen, but in a seven game series it's not.

[John Zaslow]

Yeah, I think that the trade is going to be validated for Harden. I don't think that Detroit survives tonight. I think Cleveland winds up finishing them off. And I know you could say, hey, you know, Detroit, they, Detroit won a huge game seven last round. They came back from a 3:1 deficit. They could win this game and force a game seven back in Detroit. But I would, I would quickly point out, yeah, they came back from the 31 deficit against Orlando and they were down by 24 in the third quarter of game six. Getting waxed by the Magic. They had no business surviving that series and, and Orlando just couldn't score. So like as impressive it is that Detroit came back from three one, they were getting smoked in that game six.

[Tony]

And Detroit's options for winning this game or losing this game. Right. Is it all predicated on the Cavs? Right? Is it like, is if James Harden has a bad game, then the Cavs are going to lose. Can Detroit do anything to win?

[John Zaslow]

I think that, I think Cleveland can win even if Harden is not great tonight. Like Duncan Robinson is still questionable. He may not play tonight. They get nothing out of Jalen Durr in Detroit, which, my God, I don't know what they're going to do in the offseason, money wise with him. And we saw last game, Cunningham, yes, he had a lot of turnovers, but Cunningham can still have a 39 point game and it's not enough. And they still wind up losing. The Cavs not lost at home yet this postseason. I think Cleveland finishes them off tonight. And then you got spurs and Timberwolves tonight. Anthony Edwards, like, he was asked about going into this game and does the whole, we're not worried, everything's cool and all that. And you know what? When Anthony Edwards says it like, I believe it. Like, Anthony Edwards to me is one of those guys in the league who seems to be even keel no matter what, super confident no matter what. I don't know that Minnesota wins this game tonight, but I Think Minnesota has a chance of pushing it to a game seven? I don't know how any of us are actually rooting for Minnesota because you want Wembanyama versus Oklahoma City.

[Tony]

I don't know.

[Dan LeBatard]

Go ahead, Tony, please.

[Tony]

No, no.

[John Zaslow]

You gu. Chabot keep saying go ahead to each other.

[Dan LeBatard]

Well, now, please, the floor is yours.

[Dave]

Please, please, please.

[Dan LeBatard]

Go Lights out. A third party wants a weigh in on this one. Yeah, listen, I'm curious. Do. Are we sure if you're an NBA devotee, you sure you want the spurs to win this year? Because I feel like the long night is about to begin and maybe you want to get one more title in before Wemby fully takes over. And I. I think it's setting up and people, we were having the conversation on football America that you can listen as soon as this show is over today that the idea that, you know, Tim Duncan was great. He won five times.

[Dave]

Yeah.

[Dan LeBatard]

But he had Manu and he had Tony Parker. Well, those guys are those guys because they were in those big spots and won titles. The Aaron Fox is. Will be perceived as the equivalent of those that he'll be iconic if they do. It's not like Wemby's doing it on his own. I think that maybe is old news to. To a lot of people. But my point is, I think there's a decent chance that Wemby and the spurs reel off the next three or four here. Right. So don't you want to root against the Spurs? Because people hate dynasties. I don't hate dynasties. I think they're good for sports. But people who lament that same team keeps winning it. And this is getting boring. Well, guess what? It's about to start right now. So whoever it is, root for that team over Wemby because the dominance is. We're at the forefront of it. Right?

[John Zaslow]

Okay, so this is interesting, right? Because a year ago this time,

[Dan LeBatard]

we

[John Zaslow]

would be saying the same thing about Oklahoma City, where it's like, wow, this is a really likable team. It's cool if they win their first championship here. I like rooting for this team.

[Dave]

No, don't you remember that national ad campaign? What a pro wants? I was so sick of this team by the second round.

[Dan LeBatard]

That's right.

[Dave]

Hated them with a fiery passion.

[John Zaslow]

But we did not foretell Oklahoma City being this team that everyone's like, oh, shake. Yoda's Alexander. He's tough to watch. Lou Dort, dirty player. Chet Holmgren, flopper. Like, we. We didn't have any of those thoughts last year. Foul Merchant would shake Yodis Alexander, like the tide turned with them really quick. Is that going to happen with San Antonio? Because right now you look at the spurs team and they're fun and Wembanyama is. He's incredible to watch. But are we now going to sour on them after they win a championship?

[Dan LeBatard]

Well, it's interesting. It's sort of rooting for the bully in a sense. And the whole elbow to the throat incident kind of proves that point. It's a recurring thing for me is to pity the bully because when he. When the common factor in these big collisions that you see in big time sports, whether it's Shaq or the reason that I am so empathetic to those people is Mario Lemieux, that when you are. Or Jerome Bettis or Mark Bavaro, the. The Giants tight end or Rob Gronkowski. Eric Lindros is probably the most tragic figure in this regard. When you are always the one in the collision, it takes multiple people to slow you down. Your body is the one that's going to wear out even though you're the bigger guy. It's the weird paradox that goes on in sports. And so already you're starting to hear that with Wembanyana. I get it, that he threw the elbow, he looked the guy in the eye and then. And then threw the bow into him. And that's bad form. But on some level you got to protect yourself if you're taking a beating like that. And I do think people are already ever so slightly starting to demonize Wemby a little bit for defending himself.

[Dave]

I think it could draw comparisons to Zaz. You remember when LeBron James upset almost by himself, that Pistons team, and it felt like they were a year early,

[John Zaslow]

he scored like 24 consecutive points for the Cavs in Game 6. Yeah, yeah.

[Dave]

And LeBron was awesome. Everybody was like, this is incredible. He has arrived. And then quickly thereafter, you know, he's always in the conversation and you have this cult of personality that's beloved by seemingly half the fans and then hated by the other half of the fans. I think that's where we'll get with Wemby. Wemby has one dominant run. Everybody will be like, this is a crazy novelty. Amazing. And then he enters a conversation year after year after year, and then it will seem unfair.

[John Zaslow]

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[Dave]

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[John Zaslow]

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[Dave]

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[John Zaslow]

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[Dave]

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[John Zaslow]

Don LeBatard John Zaslow how you love that catchphrase. Bad news for opposing teams in the

[Tony]

Triple

[John Zaslow]

two guts these all smiles till the blood clot. This is the D Levatar show with the st.

[Dan LeBatard]

Here's a question for you that is, that is, you know, pretty hyperbolic. I asked a week ago what how many titles will be satiating to the spurs fan 15 years from now? Will 3 do it for the WEMBY era? Will 4 do it? Where does Wemby finish?

[John Zaslow]

Yeah, didn't we ask Michelle Beetle?

[Dan LeBatard]

We did ask her that. She said four, which I think is a kind of a fair answer, even though it's a pretty tall standard, even for 7 foot 4 Wemby and his pals. But then also, you know, Dan is among many people having the where does Jokic rank among centers and is he the greatest scorer of all time and all that kind of stuff Where I mean it's unfair to the kid obviously to some degree. But where does Wemby wind up in in our mind? Like is he a part of the enduring MJ v. LeBron conversation? Is it a three headed conversation ten years from now? I think there's a decent chance the way things are tracking that it will be. The thing that gets in the way of it is I I'm waiting for Wemby to break that body don't look right when he's running up and down the floor. It just doesn't seem like it can take guys taking runs at him. And the best thing he has going for him is that the era has changed in which he doesn't have to play through the low pivot anymore because if he did, I don't think he would have a shot. But I think as it stands now, it might be a decade from now. Who's better, MJ? LeBron or WEMBY?

[John Zaslow]

Decade from now?

[Tony]

It took LeBron 20 years to try and be even in the same stratosphere as Michael Jordan. And when he's gonna get there in

[Dan LeBatard]

10 if he wins three or four titles? That's how things go. Yeah, so Ron wasn't winning titles. That's why he wasn't in the conversation.

[John Zaslow]

So that's tonight. We got both those games tonight. Both Those series can end tonight. Last night, though, with no NBA, we had the hockey. The Vegas Golden Knights, they advanced the Western Conference final. They beat Anaheim and Montreal. Tony, I heard you even checked in to that Canadiens victory last night.

[Tony]

Oh, the Habs. As I turned it on with 2 minutes and 27 seconds left in the second period, I saw one goal from the Habs and I was like, all right, I'm good. It's 5, 3.

[Dave]

You picked the wrong stretch. There was like a 30 second stretch in which there were three goals in the first period.

[Tony]

I was watching the equalizer two, so I switched that on a commercial break to see what the.

[Dave]

There were two equalizers in that game. And then Montreal pulled away.

[John Zaslow]

What a performance. Performance by the Canadiens. They can now close it out in a game six at Bell center tomorrow. On the other series though, which the Knights blew out the Ducks, Mitch Marner. My goodness, Mike, did you see that? First goal of the game? Easily. Best goal of the playoffs.

[Dave]

Easily. I would agree. Mitch Marner, this postseason is rewriting the narrative that surrounded him. And this is increasingly looking like a Toronto Maple Leaf issue and not a Mitch Marner one or William Nylander one, which is perfect.

[John Zaslow]

So like, if Auston Matthews won out of Toronto, he's going to become like the best player in the league, I guess.

[Dave]

I'm also looking at Auston Matthews. I'm like, wait a second. You're the overrated one over there in Toronto. Because Marner. I always thought Marner's defensive prowess was so underestimated. He is a terrific two way player. He is showing it day in, day out. He's making his line mates look incredible. They really unlock something between Marner and Carlsen too. They play brilliantly together watching this team. And it was a very bizarre series win. Tortorella. We are living in the United States of Tortorella. He did not make the locker room available.

[John Zaslow]

Yeah, did you see that, Dave?

[Dan LeBatard]

I did. Bizarre stuff from Tortorella, but also par for the course because he's an enduring weirdo.

[Dave]

I mean, it's paying off. Certainly. Vegas says how many fewer wins did they have than the Florida Panthers this year?

[John Zaslow]

Vegas, like, I have a hard time accepting that Vegas is now in the Western Conference final. Look, the Panthers missed the playoffs. The Panthers had a very disappointing season. They only won 39 games this year.

[Dave]

The.

[John Zaslow]

The Vegas Knights won 38. Like Vegas won fewer games than the Panthers this year. Vegas was four games under.500 this season.

[Tony]

It's pretty impressive.

[Dave]

Yes. Chris. Yeah, Mike, I'm reluctantly doing this, but I think John Tortorella and the Vegas Golden Knights, Mitch Marner, they deserve a toast.

[John Zaslow]

They're worth a toast presented by Cuervo.

[Dan LeBatard]

Keep it fun. Keep it Cuervo. Here's to Mitch Marner. Look at you guys.

[Dave]

Now this sets up for a very interesting series between Colorado and Vegas. You have two recent Western Conference cup winners teams that are always in that

[John Zaslow]

conversation, 22 and 23.

[Dave]

You have Vegas playing their best hockey of the season. And where Vegas is certainly a way more interesting threat to Colorado than Anaheim would be is there's always going to be an elite defensive forward on the ice for Vegas.

[John Zaslow]

Here, here.

[Dave]

I cannot wait to watch McKinnon and McCart try to rush past that blue line and. And have Jack Eichel and Mitch Mourner waiting for.

[John Zaslow]

Why did you say here, here, here? When you say hosting someone and someone makes a good point, someone in the background needs to yell, hear, hear.

[Dave]

Now ultimately I think Colorado's depth is just insane and they'll. Their talent will win out and they, they had a relatively easy time with Minnesota and I do believe Minnesota to be a better team than Vegas. But Sals make fights and I think that this Vegas team playing this way with their defensive forwards and with Mitch Marner being totally unlocked. This guy was a joke. He tried a spinning goal against the Florida Panthers and it led directly to a goal for the Florida Panthers. He was a punchline and probably unfairly so this could be a really interesting.

[John Zaslow]

Well, yeah. And now he leaves and they finished what like next to last in the Eastern Conference.

[Tony]

Keep it fun.

[Dan LeBatard]

Vegas playing appropriately or not playing with house money here you think they are

[John Zaslow]

playing with house money? Dave, you think Vegas is playing with house money?

[Dan LeBatard]

I mean they have no business being there. Based on exactly what you just said, based on what they did in the regular season, I think the ave should smoke them. I think Mike is exactly right. I know the. It's simple math but they, they. The games were closer. Maybe a five game series and everything else. But the apps did ultimately handle the Wild who are way better than the Knights. And the question I have for drip drill pal Mike Ryan is what is the bigger eyesore the Avalanche against the Golden Knights. Two awful uniforms for two would be dynasties in the NHL or would it have been the head to toe orange against the AVs? I mean that would have been so vomitous. You have to watch it in black and white or maybe just listen on the radio. Right?

[Dave]

I think Vegas gets a bad rap. I understand the, the by the way, the the home sweaters look way nicer in person than they do on tv. I think they're ugly.

[Dan LeBatard]

All right, well, what are you talking about? That's a horrible color of gold that they wear.

[Dave]

I think it looks nicer in person, but I think the road whites are fine. I'm with you, though. This is. This is a much better uniform matchup, though, than we would have gotten with the Anaheim Ducks. Any. Anything close to red. When Anaheim's going up against someone, that color clash is not easy on the eyes.

[Dan LeBatard]

Actually, come to think of it, is. Are the Aves. Because if they win this cup, they're not dynastic or they're. They're kind of in that conversation. What is the worst uniform for a dynasty we've ever seen? I'm gonna float two for you right now. The OKC Thunder. That's part of the reasons. As though that's why we reject them. We don't like them because their uniforms are ugly. They just. They. They're like, what. What's your color scheme? What colors do you want to use? All of them. We're gonna take every color under the sun and put them into our uniform. That sucks. And then the other one is the Tom Brady Patriots. Pat Patriot. We should have been the uniform. Instead, we got Flying Elvis for the entirety of that run. That miserable run. Keep it fun.

[John Zaslow]

Keep it Cuervo. No hockey tonight. So we gave you a little bit of hockey there. The hockey will finish off this round possibly tomorrow. Now, there's a new episode of Mystery Crate that comes out today. All right, you're gonna love it. I got old ass stories. Chris tries to come over the top, and he. You have your. What is it? New ass story. You have a new ass story. So check that out today. New episode of Mystery Crate Every Friday. Tony, though. Tony talks about moving into his new home and the moving situation. All right, so tune into Mystery Crate and you can hear about that. Don't ever ask me to help you move. I will never do that. But how is everything coming along with the move?

[Tony]

We're on our way. We're about halfway done with all the stuff. I'm gonna get a U Haul truck tomorrow. I'm gonna back it up in front of the house of my in laws, drop all my stuff in there and take it to the new house. But today, I'm going over there later today to get the Internet installed with the Internet service provider guy.

[John Zaslow]

You know what? Let me stop you there real quick. When you move into a new home, Internet service, the TV service Has to be, like, the first thing that gets done. Like, I remember any times that I've moved, I have the TV slash Internet guy installing everything in the home before the furniture's even arrived. Like, it's the very first. And I feel weird about that because I feel like my wife is thinking, all right, this is not even remotely as important as everything else that needs to go on. But I'm thinking to myself, like, no, no, no. This is the most important.

[Dave]

That's what makes a house a home.

[John Zaslow]

Right?

[Dave]

I was watching the bubble playoffs from the floor.

[Dan LeBatard]

Floor?

[John Zaslow]

Yeah. TV slash Internet installation in your new home is paramount. All right, go ahead, Tony.

[Tony]

So I got the couch, so I won't have to sit on the floor, but I'll sit on the couch and watch the guy do whatever he's got to do. But for this particular Internet service provider, which I've had at my previous rental house, I called him up and I said, hey, do you guys have fiber in the area? They said, yep. I said, all right, perfect. I'm like, all right, we got the fiber. You know about that fiber, Dave?

[Dan LeBatard]

I do know about that. Gotta have it. Continue.

[Tony]

I.

[Dan LeBatard]

Can I weigh in on what Zaslow just said there? Because I think he really hit on something important. People talk about, you know, maintaining friendships, but they come and go. Family is deeply important. People say it's the most important thing. I'd like to amend that. My one friend, my enduring friend, who's been there through thick and thin, through all the decades of Nerd Dome and otherwise, is television. TV is my best pal. He's always there. I can be in any remote location, driving across America. If I see that motel sign past midnight and it says, has HBO or has cable, I pull over, and I'm right as rain. Thank you, tv.

[Tony]

So they hit me up with, hey, all right, so Friday's good. We'll give you a window of 2 to 5 for the guy to be there. And I'm like, 2 to 5? What are we doing? He's like, yeah, it also could take two hours if he's there. Could take two hours of him to work. I'm like, okay. So I'm sitting at the house that doesn't have Internet, doesn't have TV for five hours.

[John Zaslow]

So the window is really two to seven.

[Tony]

Two to seven. Because he's going to be working on it. So now I'm sitting here, and something like, all right, what are we doing with these windows of time? Why can't we make it like. Like, all right, here it is. You got 1:30. It's going to take him 30 minutes. It's going to take him an hour. But you got 1:30. He's going to be there at 1:30. Not this time thing. Like the windows at times, dude, if

[Dan LeBatard]

they give you a specific time. If they give you a specific time,

[John Zaslow]

they're just going to be late constantly.

[Tony]

Yeah, but then I can call and bitch about it because if they're like, all right, we'll be there from 2 to 4, but the guy shows up at 3:59. I can't, honestly, man.

[John Zaslow]

A three hour window is like a small window. I've had ones where it's like noon to six. Yeah, it's like, what the hell is that? Three hours is like a small window. I feel like these days, normally they're coming on a specific day and you'll get a call in the morning with the time frame calls.

[Tony]

They've called me 20 times, by the way. Do you want to change it? No, I don't want to change it. I want to keep it.

[Dan LeBatard]

Is the. The TV serviceman or Giannis the bigger pain in the ass? I can't tell who has a tougher time keeping time.

[John Zaslow]

Well, no, Giannis is the bigger pain in the ass because ultimately the TV service guy is going to fulfill your every wish and need. Ah, right.

[Dan LeBatard]

Take him, Miami Heat. Get the TV service guy. He's the missing.

[Tony]

I'll let you know his stats when he walks up. If he's a big guy, you know,

[John Zaslow]

maybe like, is that not a tremendous feeling when the guy, like when he says, okay, we could do this, like when he's figured out the lay of the land, all right, we could solve this.

[Tony]

And he tells it's going to be shorter than the timetable, too.

[John Zaslow]

It's a beautiful feeling when you can get done what you need to get done. I'm telling you, when you move into a new home, by far the most important thing is the TV and the Internet guy don't come out.