3/3/25: Trump Zelenskyy Oval Office meltdown, DOD blocks our show

Summary

Podcast Summary: The David Pakman Show – March 3, 2025

Title: Trump Zelenskyy Oval Office Meltdown, DOD Blocks Our Show
Host: David Pakman
Release Date: March 3, 2025

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Introduction

In the March 3rd episode of The David Pakman Show, host David Pakman delves into a series of pressing political and economic issues shaping the United States and the broader global landscape. The episode primarily focuses on a controversial Oval Office meeting involving former President Donald Trump, Senator J.D. Vance, and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy. Additionally, Pakman addresses concerns about economic forecasts, media censorship by the Department of Defense, and broader reflections on the state of democracy.

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Oval Office Meeting: Trump, Vance, and Zelenskyy

Overview:
David Pakman opens the discussion by critically analyzing a highly contentious Oval Office meeting between Donald Trump, J.D. Vance, and Vladimir Zelenskyy. Described as an "abortive press conference," the encounter has sparked divergent interpretations both domestically and internationally.

Key Points:

• Divergent Reactions:
  While some MAGA supporters lauded Trump and Vance for their assertive behavior towards Zelenskyy, viewing it as a display of strength and alpha leadership, the global community largely condemned the interaction. World leaders rallied behind Zelenskyy, perceiving the U.S. display as embarrassing and indicative of the U.S. aligning with authoritarian figures like Putin.

  David Pakman [00:07]: "This absolutely humiliating event drove Europe to the defense of Ukraine, pushed world leaders to say... 'We are seeing this for what it is.'"

• Meeting Dynamics:
  The meeting lasted approximately 50 minutes, becoming increasingly tense towards the end. Pakman suggests that the fallout was not a premeditated ambush but rather a culmination of underlying tensions within the Trump administration, particularly its nefarious sympathies towards Putin and skepticism towards Ukraine.

  J.D. Vance [03:11]: "We are staying in our country, staying strong. From the very beginning of the war, we've been alone, and we are thankful."

• Public Perception and Media Portrayal:
  While MAGA enclaves celebrated the perceived show of dominance over Zelenskyy, the majority of Americans and international observers saw the event as a misstep, further isolating the U.S. from its Western allies.

  David Pakman [05:31]: "Putin sitting at the Kremlin, just loving this, Loving this."

Notable Quotes:

• Pakman [02:00]: "If that's your view, you are not going to be on the side of democracy when it comes to global affairs."
• Vance [05:49]: "You should be groveling, Mr. President, groveling on the floor."

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Global Reactions and Tulsi Gabbard's Interview

Overview:
The fallout from the Oval Office meeting reverberated globally, with leaders from NATO allies like Canada, the UK, and France reaffirming support for Ukraine. Concurrently, Republican Congresswoman Tulsi Gabbard's recent interview raised eyebrows as she adopted rhetoric reminiscent of Kremlin propaganda.

Key Points:

• European Solidarity:
  In response to the U.S. mishandling of the meeting with Zelenskyy, European nations doubled down on their support for Ukraine, countering any perception of U.S. wavering commitment.

  Pakman [07:16]: "This was an embarrassing video for what supposedly is a free press."

• Tulsi Gabbard's Shift:
  Gabbard, now serving as the Director of National Intelligence, conducted an interview where she criticized Zelenskyy’s handling of the war, aligning her stance unsettlingly close to Russian narratives.

  Vance [40:58]: "After close to an hour of conversation when President Zelensky directly challenged President Trump and Vice President Vance... there was a huge rift."

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Economic Forecast: Atlanta Fed Predicts GDP Decline

Overview:
Pakman shifts focus to economic concerns, highlighting the Atlanta Federal Reserve’s GDP Now model forecasting a 1.5% decline in the U.S. GDP for the first quarter of 2025, coinciding with Trump’s presidency.

Key Points:

• Economic Indicators:
  The model, previously predicting a 2.3% growth, has adjusted downward amid collapsing consumer spending, declining consumer confidence, and plummeting exports.

  Pakman [25:03]: "TRUMP walks in the door and the first GDP number is now expected to be a decline."

• Trump’s Economic Policies:
  Pakman critiques Trump’s lack of a coherent economic strategy, attributing the negative forecast to policies such as tax cuts for the wealthy, antagonistic foreign relations, and mismanagement of governmental programs.

  Vance [05:53]: "You've done a lot of talking... if you didn't have our military equipment, this war would have been over in two weeks."

• Public Reaction:
  Despite the grim outlook, some audiences interpret the economic struggles as a result of Trump’s policies, with skepticism about MAGA's denial and blame-shifting tendencies.

  Pakman [28:09]: "Social Security is a pay as you go system. That's what Ellen is kind of getting at here."

Notable Quotes:

• Pakman [28:09]: "A Ponzi scheme would be... the next person comes in and invests... it's never really any underlying investments like it eventually collapses."
• Vance [31:08]: "This is really going to get me assassinated."

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Department of Defense Blocks The David Pakman Show

Overview:
A concerning development highlighted by Pakman is the Department of Defense (DoD) blocking access to The David Pakman Show website on its computers, while conservative websites remain accessible.

Key Points:

• Viewer Feedback:
  An active-duty service member reported the blocking, attaching a screenshot as evidence. Pakman points out the inconsistency, noting that right-wing sites like American Conservative and Hot Air remain accessible despite similar content regulations.

  Viewer Email Quote: "My website, the David Pakman show is apparently too dangerous for the brave men and women defending our country."

• Implications:
  This selective blocking suggests possible bias within the DoD, possibly influenced by remnants of the Trump administration, raising alarms about censorship of progressive and independent media.

  Pakman [43:26]: "It was an embarrassing moment for the United States."

• Call to Action:
  Pakman urges listeners, especially those in the military, to report similar instances and support independent progressive media to counteract potential governmental overreach and media suppression.

  Pakman [43:26]: "We must support the independent shows that it is now clear the Trump administration is going to target however they can."

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Reflections on Democracy: Plato’s Concerns

Overview:
Towards the episode’s conclusion, Pakman engages in a philosophical discourse inspired by Plato’s skepticism of democracy, questioning whether the current state of American politics aligns with Plato’s warnings about the system’s vulnerabilities.

Key Points:

• Plato’s Predictions:
  Drawing parallels between Plato’s fears of democracy succumbing to the ignorance of the electorate and present-day U.S. politics, Pakman contemplates whether democratic systems are undermined by voters influenced by propaganda and misinformation.

  Pakman [43:26]: "Plato warned that democracy, left to its own devices, eventually will elect the worst among us."

• MAGA’s Impact:
  He critiques the MAGA movement for promoting policies detrimental to collective welfare, such as undermining Social Security and favoring autocratic leaders, thereby illustrating democratic decay as predicted by Plato.

  Pakman [44:00]: "Democracy assumes an informed electorate... but what happens when a significant chunk of voters are so propagandized..."

• Call for Informed Electorate:
  Emphasizing the necessity for an informed and rational electorate to preserve democratic integrity, Pakman advocates for active engagement and support for independent media to counteract misinformation.

  Pakman [45:32]: "We need to keep a very close eye on it. So it doesn't have to be this show that you support..."

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Conclusion and Future Outlook

Wrap-Up:
David Pakman concludes the episode by reiterating the critical nature of the issues discussed, especially the intersection of media censorship, economic instability, and democratic integrity. He underscores the importance of audience support for independent media outlets as a bulwark against authoritarian tendencies and misinformation.

Final Thoughts:

• State of the Union Preview:
  Pakman teases coverage of the upcoming State of the Union address, inviting listeners to join his bonus show featuring live analysis and interviews.

  Pakman [60:09]: "See you on the bonus show... I will be live for the State of the Union address tomorrow evening."

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• David Pakman [00:07]: "If you’re hearing this clearly, you survived the weekend and what a weekend it was."
• J.D. Vance [03:11]: "We are staying in our country, staying strong."
• David Pakman [05:31]: "Putin sitting at the Kremlin, just loving this, Loving this."
• J.D. Vance [05:49]: "You should be groveling, Mr. President, groveling on the floor."
• David Pakman [28:09]: "Social Security is a pay as you go system. That's what Ellen is kind of getting at here."
• J.D. Vance [31:08]: "This is really going to get me assassinated."
• David Pakman [43:26]: "We must support the independent shows that it is now clear the Trump administration is going to target however they can."
• David Pakman [45:32]: "We need to keep a very close eye on it. So it doesn't have to be this show that you support."

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Final Notes

Throughout the episode, David Pakman maintains a critical and analytical perspective, urging listeners to remain vigilant against political maneuvers that undermine democratic principles and to support independent media as a safeguard for truth and accountability. The episode underscores the fragility of democratic institutions in the face of populist movements and highlights the need for informed citizenry to sustain the democratic fabric.

Transcript

[David Pakman]

Welcome to the show. If you're hearing this clearly, you survived the weekend and what a weekend it was. We're going to talk about the Oval Office meeting with Trump, J.D. vance and Zelensky. We are going to talk about the new GDP decline prediction from the Atlanta Fed and so much more, including this completely whacked out to Kelsey interview where she seems almost like a Kremlin spokeswoman. It's really outrageous stuff. I have a very exciting announcement. I have here with me the first hardcover copy. And it is, it's stiff as a board. I can't even bend this thing. The first hardcover copy of my book, the Echo Machine. We're just three weeks plus a day away. It's all happening. If you would like a signed copy, David pakman.com/booksmith I'll be up at Brookline Booksmith in a couple of weeks signing books. 550 so far to be signed. Going to be quite, quite a day. Bringing a bunch of big Trump style sharpies. But the first hardcover book is in my hand. There's a picture of me in it which is really crazy. But this is really exciting. Also want to say thanks. Thanks to so many of you. Last week we went from being ranked around 120th on the top news podcasts to 60th. Okay. From 120th to 60th, we are making a big push on the audio podcast. We passed Tim Pool, we passed Benny Johnson. So help us keep it going no matter where you listen, no matter where you watch. You can subscribe to the podcast for free on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. It really helps us. And updates on ratings coming up. Very, very. We've got the strongest marks these days. It's hard to believe. All right, listen, global shame. This is the only way that I can genuinely and honestly and frankly describe to you the completely abortive press conference in the Oval Office with Donald Trump, J.D. vance and the Ukrainian president Vladimir Zelensky. Now we are seeing in the reaction to this event gone wrong, completely different worldviews because there are those who saw what I am about to play for you. Donald Trump and J.D. vance berating and yelling at Zelensky as a sign of strength. This is how Alphas behave. That was so great for Trump and JP Mandel to put Zelensky in his place. He should be more thankful. He should be praying at the altar of Trump. This is not the global interpretation and in fact world leaders rallying behind Zelensky after embarrassing and childish treatment of him by Trump and J.D. so let's pick this up. This was a 50 minute event overall. Let's pick this up where it starts to get very dicey.

[J.D. Vance]

Cease fire. All of them told me that he will never go. We signed him with gas contract. Gas contract, yes. But after that he broken the ceasefire. He killed our people and he didn't exchange prisoners. We signed the exchange of prisoners, but he didn't do it. What kind of diplomacy, J.D. you are speaking about what, what, what, what do you mean? I'm talking about the kind of diplomacy that's going to end the destruction of your country. Yes, but if. Mr. President, Mr. President, with respect, I think it's disrespectful for you to come into the Oval Office and try to litigate this in front of the American media. Right now you guys are going around and forcing conscripts to the front lines because you have manpower problems. You should be thanking the President for pride to bring it into the this. Have you ever been to Ukraine that you say what problems we have? I have been to come once. I have actually, I've actually watched and seen the stories and I know What I've watched TV.

[David Pakman]

Mr. President happens is you bring people.

[J.D. Vance]

You bring them on a propaganda tour. Mr. President, are. Do you disagree that you've had problems bringing people into your military and do you think that it's respectful to come to the Oval Office of the United States of America. America and attack the administration that is trying to prevent the destruction of your country? A lot of questions. Let's start from the beginning. Sure. First of all, during the war everybody has problems, even you. But you have nice ocean and don't feel now, but you will feel it in the future. God bless. You don't know that. God bless. God bless. You are not. Don't tell us what we're going to feel. We're trying to solve a problem. Don't tell us what we're going to feel. I'm not telling you because you're in no position to dictate that. Remember this, you're in no position to dictate what we're going to feel. We're going to feel very good, feel influen. We're going to feel very good and very strong, feel influenced. You're right now not in a very good position. You've allowed yourself to be in a very bad position and it happens to be right about from the very beginning of the war. You're not in a good position. You don't have the cards right now with us. You start having right now. You don't miss a friend. You're gambling with the lives of millions of people. You're gambling with World War Three. You're gambling with World War Three.

[David Pakman]

Putin sitting at the Kremlin, just loving this, Loving this.

[J.D. Vance]

And what you're doing is very disrespectful to the country. This country. I respect you far more than a lot of people said they should have. You said thank you once.

[David Pakman]

No, you should be groveling, Mr. President, groveling on the floor.

[J.D. Vance]

In this entire meeting, you said thank you. You went to Pennsylvania and campaigned for the opposition in October. Offer some words of appreciation for the United States of America and the president who's trying to save your country. Please. You think that if you will speak very loudly about the war. He's not speaking loudly. He's not speaking loudly. Your country is in big trouble. Wait a minute.

[David Pakman]

No, no.

[J.D. Vance]

You've done a lot of talking. Your country is in big trouble. I know. You're not winning. You're not winning this. You have a damn good chance of coming out okay. Because of us, Mr. President, we are staying in our country, staying strong. From the very beginning of the war, we've been alone, and we are thankful. I said, thanks. You haven't been in this cabinet. We gave you, through this stupid president, $350 billion. We gave you military equipment, and you met a brave. But they had to use our military. If you didn't have our military equipment, you invited. If you didn't have our military equipment, this war would have been over in two weeks. In three days. I heard it from Putin in three days. This is something maybe less in two weeks. Of course, yes. It's going to be a very hard thing to do. Business like this. Just say thank you. I said a lot of excitement. Except the American. Except that there are disagreements, and let's go litigate those disagreements rather than trying to fight it out in the.

[David Pakman]

So anyway, you know, if there is anything that we can say with certainty here, it's that this absolutely humiliating event drove Europe to the defense of Ukraine, pushed world leaders to say, hey, you know what? We're actually seeing this for what it is in our countries, no matter what's happening in that Oval Office. And something very strange seems to be where all of a sudden they're on the side of the authoritarian, brutal dictator, Putin. We stand with you. And this included Canada. This included the UK this includes France. This includes our Western democratic allies. Now, there were questions as to whether this was a planned ambush. You know, this event was 50 minutes and it went haywire. During minute 45. So my instinct is, no, it wasn't a planned ambush, but this was the boiling over of a Trump administration that's extraordinarily enamored with Putin and just very skeptical of Ukraine, the defender, the aggrieved. In this particular situation, we have to also acknowledge that there are people, you look online in the typical enclaves of MAGA ism and you see them absolutely thrilled that someone finally put Zelensky in his place. This guy shows up, he doesn't say thank you, he doesn't even wear a suit. And we'll get to the suit part a little bit later. And Trump and JD finally had the testicular fortitude to put this guy in his place. If that's your view, you are not going to be on the side of democracy when it comes to global affairs. You're going to be on the side of authoritarianism and autocracy, dictatorship and invasions, and taking things by force. That's not the side that the majority of Americans are on, fortunately. So planned ambush. If you're determined to do this, I don't think you wait until minute 45 out of a 50 minute event, especially since it's sort of related to the dynamics with, with Zelensky. But was there a boiling over that was there based on emotions prior to this meeting? Yes, it does seem that way. So now the question is, it appears as though the US Is going to pull back in terms of support of Ukraine. At least based on how this went, it seems like our allies are mostly going to push forward and expand their support of Ukraine. What happens now with Putin, who is loving that this took place? That's the critical question when it comes to the future of Ukraine. Marjorie Taylor Greene's boyfriend dressed up as a reporter and attacked Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky because he wasn't wearing a suit. And saying more generally, why don't you wear a suit? Do you own a suit? This was a particularly embarrassing video for what supposedly is a free press. This guy really doing a great job of pretending to be a reporter, but we know he's nothing other than a tool of Trumpism. Here is the moment during the Oval Office fiasco during which Brian Glenn, the boyfriend of radical and repugnant reactionary Republican Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene, said, do you even own a second?

[J.D. Vance]

My second question for President Zelensky. Do you ever. Why don't you wear a suit? Why don't you wear a suit? You're the highest level in this country's office and you refuse to wear A suit. Just want to see if you do own a suit. Yeah. You have problems. A lot of Americans have problems with you. Not. I don't have. I will wear cotton. Awesome. After this war will finish. Okay. Yes. Maybe. Maybe something like yours. Yes. Maybe some. Something better. I don't know. We will see. Maybe something cheaper than. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you.

[David Pakman]

There was some Lost in Translation moment here where it appeared as though Zelensky is calling what Brian Glenn is wearing a costume. Like C O S T U M E. Apparently this, this was a, this was a translation issue because there's a Ukrainian word which sounds almost exactly like costume. It's spelled with a K and it means a suit. So that, that little detail may have been a kind of lost in translation moment, but this is part of the. We're really big and tough and we tell it like it is. Why don't you wear a suit? Now, I wonder, would Brian Glenn, had he been around earlier in the 20th century, would he have asked the same question of Winston Churchill? When Winston Churchill went to the White House and as we put up the picture here for you as well, did not wear a suit because he was also at war, would the same question have been asked, would Churchill have been called disrespectful by Brian Glenn? Well, the difference is that when it came to World War II, the United States was decidedly against dictatorial autocratic authoritarianism, whereas the Trump White House, when it comes to Russia and Ukraine, seems to subtly, and lately not so subtly, be on the side of the authoritarian dictatorial autocracy which is led by Vladimir Putin. So Glenn, of course, is a pathetic lapdog for Trumpism. He goes out there and he'll do whatever needs to be done to please his handlers. And by handlers, I don't mean, I don't mean at whatever network he's at now. I don't even know where he is. Is he independent? Is he still at right side broadcasting? I mean, the, the, the cultural and social milieu of Trumpism and which he's now invited to Mar a Lago with Marjorie Taylor Greene and the whole thing. And so he's willing to go out there and ask the very stupid questions. What an embarrassing event for the United States. The world is looking. You should see the emails I've gotten from people all over the world saying, david, we are so sorry to see the United States under Trump taking the side of the anti democratic forces globally. And of course, if you've been following Trump, you know, he's not impressed with our Western liberal allies. He's impressed with dictators and autocrats and authoritarianism. Authoritarians. And Brian Glenn doing his part to show. I'm with you guys. I'm with you guys. What an embarrassing moment for the country. One of our sponsors today is Peak who make delicious Pu Er tea. These are absolutely delicious. I've become a huge fan. Peaks Poor Tea is Natural. One of our sponsors today is Peak who make delicious Pu Er tea. These are absolutely delicious. I've become a huge fan. Peaks Pu Er Tea is naturally fermented, delivering probiotics that can support gut health and digestion. It's sourced from from 250-year-old tea trees, which means it says nutrient dense as tea can get. 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Go to wildgrain.com/pacman the link is in the Podcast Notes the David Pakman show continues to be funded primarily by our audience through the membership program. I can't thank enough all of the folks who signed up@join pacman.com in February. We are now into March and I invite you to get instant access to all of the member benefits. This includes the bonus show, the commercial free audio and video streams, the members only soundboard, and all of the other stuff that you can read about@join pacman.com Also, thank you so much to everybody who has preordered my forthcoming book. We are trying to now push to 7,000 preorders by March 25th. I've got the first hardcover copy here in my hands and you can preorder it signed at David pakman.com/booksmith or not signed or the audiobook version or the Kindle version at Barnes and Noble, Amazon or any local bookstore of your choice. Well, it is happening. The GDP now model is predicting a GDP decline in Donald Trump's first quarter in office. The Atlanta Fed's GDP now model is predicting that gross domestic product in the United States will go down, not up 1.5% for the first quarter of 2025. That's right. TRUMP walks in the door and the first GDP number is now expected to be a decline. Now I want to be fair and objective here. This forecast is not an official Fed prediction. It's based on early economic data. It could change. But here's what we do know. This very same model was predicting 2.3% growth just weeks ago. Donald Trump then took office. Consumer spending has collapsed, consumer confidence has declined, and exports are falling off of a cliff. Eggs are at the highest price they've ever been in the history of the United States. And now we are looking at negative growth. Now I'm scared and I'm sorry and I'm sad to say this, but this might just be the beginning. When you look at what we know, consumer spending shrank in January. That's when people are often spending holiday bonuses they received or gift money. But this year down 0.2%. And after adjusting for inflation, consumer spending down 0.5%. That is a brutal indicator of economic confidence. Secondly, exports. As I mentioned, exports are dragging down the GDP projections from a slightly negative contribution of -0.4% to a disastrous -3.7%. The effect of exports on GDP. The labor market is starting to soften. Unemployment claims have now hit their highest level since October. The bond market is flashing recession warnings with a inverted yield curve, historically one of the most reliable indicators that something not so good is coming. And while all of this is happening, what is Donald Trump doing? Is he putting together a coherent economic strategy now? Of course not. He's screaming about retribution. He's scolding and yelling at President Zelensky. He's threatening journalists. He's working on these mass deportations that will further destabilize the economy. And he is playing a hell of a lot of golf. And just understand, MAGA will not take responsibility for this. If we go into a recession, if unemployment spikes, if businesses start closing, do you know who they're going to blame? It's not going to be Trump. It's not going to be their own disastrous economic policies. It'll be Biden's fault. It'll be the fault of immigrants. It'll be the fault of corporations that went woke or of DEI crt. Maybe they will rehabilitate. Trump inherited an economy with significantly cooled inflation, steady job growth. Right. You don't, you don't have to believe everything was perfect on January 20th. As I have told you, we look at the indicators. It's not mind blowing, but the Biden numbers were pretty good. Wages rising in excess of inflation. And we're starting to see the cracks, jittery markets, businesses that say, man, the tariffs will determine what I should be doing. Complete and total uncertainty, I guess will wait also. And now just dropping this hammer of the expectation of negative 1.5% GDP growth. Remember we were told that Trump's policies would be so pro growth that it doesn't matter if they cost money. It doesn't matter if the tax cuts for the rich and corporations that are now being pushed are going to be revenue negative because they will stimulate the economy so much that that GDP will go up and revenue is going to then increase. That's not the prediction of the Atlanta Fed. Now let me address one other aspect to this and I think this is, sadly, I may have to do this a number of times. I continue to get emails from people saying, David, you seem delighted at the economic misery that may be forthcoming. I am not rooting for this. Much the opposite, call me self centered and greedy. I don't want to be logging into my mutual fund account, my retirement account, my daughter's 529 and seeing a bloodbath. So this is not political. We are reporting the facts as we get them. I gave you the economic indicators on January 20. We gave it a month, just like I said we would. I gave you the economic indicators a month later. It was, I think March 20th, maybe was a weekend. Or in any case, around March 22nd or 23rd, I reported to you. Here's what the economic indicators did in their first month. Some of these are completely flat. Some of these are starting to look not so good. I am not rooting for this. I am rooting for the opposite. I would like the country to do well under Trump, because what's most important to me is not Trump's legacy, but what is the state of suffering or thriving of the average American. And it gives me no pleasure to report to you that this GDP expectation has now done a complete and total 180. I hope it's wrong. Like I said, this is just a prediction which could be wrong or it may change. And that's what I'm hoping for. But right now, it is not looking so good. Elon Musk suffered a total collapse on the Joe Rogan podcast. The topic of the Nazi salute came up. The topic of Social Security came up. The topic of Elon being assassinated came up. And this is about as bad as you could imagine it being. Let's start with Joe Rogan saying, how could it be that you buy Twitter for billions and then people call you a Nazi? And Elon explains he is definitely not.

[J.D. Vance]

A Nazi when you're going through all this USAID stuff. Yeah. Like, here's what's weird. First of all, what is it like to buy a company for $44 billion and then people call you a Nazi on that same thing that you bought? I did not see it coming.

[David Pakman]

Isn't that funny?

[J.D. Vance]

Like, it's classic.

[David Pakman]

So funny. Rogan's just in stitches.

[J.D. Vance]

People will go anything down. Yeah. Oh, he's never going to stop. Wait, wait. What? What is it like? Like all this. People used to the left was in love with you. Yeah. And now the same idiots are calling you a Nazi. It's the most bizarre thing I've ever seen in my life.

[David Pakman]

You know, one of the things they. They love talking about is people used to think one thing about you and now they've changed what they think. And that's crazy, but sometimes the opinions of people change based on what the person does. Elon used to be this sort of doofusy, awkward, kind of antisocial tech guy who dramatically accelerated electric vehicles by his actions at Tesla and so on. And so forth. And so we saw him as a kind of benign guy who was doing some good things. Now all of a sudden he's wrapped up in political extremism. He's getting involved in all sorts of. You know, he said something about how his son died because of the woke mind virus, all this crazy stuff. And so yes, it is a different Elon Musk. So people's opinion of him have changed. That's not crazy.

[J.D. Vance]

I mean, there's so many examples of people saying my heart goes out to you with a little enthusiasm that probably wouldn't be recommended with hindsight. Yes, but I was obviously meant in the most positive spirit possible. Yes, obviously, obviously. But it's so strange where people want to think that you are openly public, publicly doing secret Nazi cile hand motion.

[David Pakman]

It's openly, publicly, secretly, openly, publicly, secretly.

[J.D. Vance]

And now I can never point at things diagonally. I can only point at things there and there. And then I. So you have to divide that. Yeah, cuz that's where the spaceship is over there. It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. When cnn, when I was in all my trouble. Absurd. Every time CNN used a photo of me, it was one of the photos from the UFC weigh ins where I go like this, welcome to the weigh ins. So every photo is me. Every photo is me with. It's absurd. It's so crazy. It's deliberate propaganda. So they, they know it was not, it was obviously not meant in a negative way that it was that I literally said my heart goes out to you. And it was very positive. The entire speech was all right, so it's all cool.

[David Pakman]

But then more substantively, Ellen drops this bomb about how Social Security is a Ponzi scheme. Listen to what he had to say.

[J.D. Vance]

Well, I mean, the government's one big permanent scheme, if you ask me. Yeah, well, you can talk. Social Security is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time.

[David Pakman]

Right.

[J.D. Vance]

Explain that. Oh, so well, people pay into Social Security and, and the money goes out of Social Security immediately, but the obligation for Social Security is your entire retirement career.

[David Pakman]

Oh boy.

[J.D. Vance]

So you're, you're paying with your, the people you're paying. Like, like if you look at the future obligations of Social Security, it falls far exceeds the tax revenue. Far. Have you ever looked at the debt?

[David Pakman]

Elon is so incoherently explaining this that I'm just going to take over. So. So he says Social Security is a Ponzi scheme because the money that's paid in by the people still working immediately comes out. Now a Ponzi scheme would be. There's really no money invested. Okay, so the way a Ponzi scheme works would be investor number one invests a million dollars and you think that it's invested in a mutual fund, for example, and it's not. Right. Just like the people running this fund are just taking the money. The next person comes in and invests $2 million. And then when the first investor wants to pull their money out, their supposed earnings come out of that $2 million that the second investor put in. But there's never really any underlying investments like it eventually collapses when there aren't enough new investors to pay the returns. That's a Ponzi scheme. It's, it's, it's a very defined type of scam. Social Security is a pay as you go system. So that's what Ellen is kind of getting at here. Current workers pay into it and that funds benefits for current retirees. It's not, it's not a Ponzi scheme. It's not designed to generate profits. It's just a system based on the full faith and credit of the U.S. government. The U.S. government has the authority to tax, it has the authority to borrow. It's not a secret that it's pay as you go. Social Security is designed to be self sustaining over time. Now the issue we are coming up against is that as more people retire, if you have more retirees relative to workers, you can have an insolvent or partially insolvent Social Security trust fund. Right now, if nothing is done right, this is, this is if you do nothing, the trust fund would be depleted in the mid-2030s. That's if you make no changes, but it would still be able to meet 75 to 80% of scheduled benefits. So it would be depleted in terms of accumulated money, but everybody would still be able to get 80% of their promised benefits. It's not a collapse, it's just a shortfall. Now with some small adjustments. We've talked about a slight raise to the cap. There's a bunch of different ways to do it. You solve the problem. That's not a Ponzi scheme. It's the system as designed, with a growing imbalance of workers to retirees, which needs to be addressed. Not the Ponzi scheme that Elon makes it out to be. Now, at another moment during this interview, they spoke to Grok. Grok is the Twitter AI chat bot sort of version of Chat GPT. Very funny stuff.

[J.D. Vance]

Lever. No, she's just a pain in my ass. Yes, a fucking conspiracy theorist.

[David Pakman]

Yes.

[J.D. Vance]

Yes.

[David Pakman]

Isn't that funny? It's just, it's a really, really funny stuff. And finally, Elon Musk says some of the stuff he's up to, some of the stuff he's talking about, it could get him assassinated.

[J.D. Vance]

And what other methods. I mean, this is really going to get me assassinated. I'm not lengthening my lifespan by explaining this stuff, to say the least. I mean, I was supposed to go back to dc. How am I going to survive? This focus is going to kill me for sure. So, in fact, I do think it's like I actually have to be careful that I don't push too hard on the corruption stuff because it's going to get me killed.

[David Pakman]

Right. If he really. This is why he won't be able to root out corruption. Because he's ready to do it. He's ready to do it, but they'll.

[J.D. Vance]

Kill him, you know. Yeah. You know. All right.

[David Pakman]

Anyway, the, the fact that this guy is arguably the most powerful person in American government right now, if it doesn't terrify you, you must not be paying attention. Guys in my audience, I know you're tired of the chafing with traditional underwear. Our sponsor, Sheath makes the most comfortable boxer briefs I've ever worn. And if you're sick of the boxers that are too loose or the briefs that are too tight, Sheath is for you. Sheath Underwear is designed with two special pouches in the front. Keeps everything separate in its own compartment with extra confidence that you will feel throughout the day. Keeping things separate and comfortable. No more sticking and chafing. I was skeptical about the dual pouch, I admit it, but it is game changing. Everything stays where it is supposed to be extra useful when working out at the gym. And even if you don't want to use the pouches, you don't have to. It is still the most comfortable pair of underwear I have ever owned. It will blow your mind how soft and stretchy these are. Made with moisture wicking technology to keep you dry. If you were ready to take underwear comfort to a new place, a place you didn't even know it could go, head over to sheath underwear.com/pacman and get 20% off with the code PACMAN. That's sh e a t h underwear.com/pacman. Use code PACMAN for 20% off. The link is in the podcast notes. I am not exactly a wizard at building and fixing stuff around the house. I leave it to the pros. I recently moved and the blinds in my new home office looked like they were from 2005 the room needed a little updating so I went to three Day Blinds, the leading manufacturer of high quality custom window treatments in the US you don't need to leave home to shop for blinds. Three Day Blinds has local, professionally trained design consultants with an average of more than 10 years of experience. They'll come to your home, they'll give you guidance, they'll tell you here's what would work in this space. The quote is free with no obligation and their expert team will then design, measure and install everything. So you just sit back and relax. You don't have to do anything. I love the new window treatments that three Day Blinds got me for my office. It looks great. Schedule your free no charge, no obligation consultation. You'll also get their buy one get one 50% off deal on custom blinds, shades, shutters and drapery when you go to three three day blinds.com/pacman that's buy one get one 50% off when you go to the number three DIY blinds.com/pacman the link is in the podcast Notes Can Donald Trump Read? This is the question that people have been asking since Donald Trump was handed a letter from King Charles by British Prime Minister Keir Starmer and handed it back, asking Starmer to read it out loud. Now, if this sounds familiar, it's because everything old is new. Again, you might remember back from Donald Trump's first term, my Giga viral video. Oh, does Donald Trump know how to read? And in that video we looked at widespread evidence that Donald Trump, while not literally illiterate, may be functionally illiterate, struggling to read, and partially may simply be too vain to wear the reading glasses that he appears to need. Another reason why he tries to avoid reading off of papers in public. Now there is a new video that is once again raising concerns about this. In this video you will see Trump sort of act like he's reading this letter from King Charles, but he doesn't address anything in the letter. He hands it back and asks Starmer, tell us what is in this letter. Once again raising the specter that this guy has very limited reading ability.

[J.D. Vance]

It is my pleasure to bring from His Majesty the King a letter. He sends his best wishes and his regards, of course. But he also asked me to bear this letter, bring it to you. You. So can I present a letter from the King to you? Thank you very much. Am I supposed to read it right now? Yeah, please do. I will do. I've got to tell him what your reaction is.

[David Pakman]

I need to know.

[J.D. Vance]

He is. He is A great gentleman. A great, great gentleman. Oh, that's. Wow. Well, that is really nice. I must make sure his signature is on that, otherwise it's not quite as meaningful. It is. And that's quite a signature, isn't it? How beautiful. That is a beautiful man. A wonderful man. And we appreciate. I've known him, gotten to know him very well, actually, first term. And now second term. Perhaps you'd like to say what that very important paragraph.

[David Pakman]

Yes, Please tell us what it says.

[J.D. Vance]

This is a letter from His Majesty the King. It's an invitation for a second state visit. This is really special. This has never happened before. This is unprecedented.

[David Pakman]

And I think that just symbolizes the strength of the relationship between us.

[J.D. Vance]

So this is a very special letter. I think the last state visit was a tremendous success. His Majesty the King wants to make this even.

[David Pakman]

All right, so you get it. And this just won't go away because it's always weird when Trump is handed stuff to read. Now, you may recall this Pete Davidson story. Pete Davidson from Saturday Night Live has gone on record saying the guy can't read.

[J.D. Vance]

I have one story I'm allowed to tell, and it's hilarious. You have stories you're not allowed to tell. What happened with the Trump story?

[David Pakman]

Okay, so he's like.

[J.D. Vance]

He doesn't really know how to read. For real. Yeah. And he loves to improv. Yeah. So during, like, the table read, he, like, before. Like, we were gonna read each. Before he had to read each line. And he's the host, so he's at everything. Yeah. He would go, I'm not going to say this. I think I'm going to say it the way I want to say. Is that okay? Is that okay, Lauren? Is it everything? Literally? And everybody's like, what? And then this is my favorite part is there was a sketch that we wrote where he's at Disneyland with his daughter, and the line is, all right, let's get out of here, turkey legs. Like, let's, like, go get turkey legs. And he doesn't know how to read, so he went, all right, let's get out of here, turkey legs. He called his daughter turkey legs. Maybe that was his improv. Oh, no, it wasn't. And then he looked at. Like, he doesn't get it. Like, he thinks if everybody's laughing with him, but we're all laughing at him. And it was like.

[David Pakman]

So anyway, I don't know what's going on with Trump's reading. It's not a new story. It just won't go away. And every Opportunity. It seems like he's struggling now. I'm going to be totally frank with you. He may just need reading glasses and he doesn't like the way he looks with them. So he's looking at blurry words on the page that it could be that simple. But with Trump, you just never know. And once again, can the guy read? I don't know. Tulsi Gabbard, the new Director of National Intelligence gag went full Kremlin spokeswoman during a Fox News interview yesterday. How truly humiliating for the United States. Sounding very much like Dmitry Peskov, Putin propagandist, Tulsi accuses Zelensky of escalating. He should have not escalated and just let Putin take what he wants, help himself to whatever what happened in the White House.

[J.D. Vance]

After close to an hour of conversation when President Zelensky directly challenged President Trump and Vice President Vance in front of the media and the American people, he really showed his lack of interest in any real good faith negotiations.

[David Pakman]

This is the pro Putin reaction to what happened in the Oval Office. Zelensky was rude. Zelensky caused an escalation. Rather he's part of the problem and meanwhile very calm, very demure. Vladimir Putin just says let's get together and chat. Putin's being the adult and Zelensky is being like this escalating little kid throwing tantrums.

[J.D. Vance]

And tell you there were a lot of conversations that were happening through, through different emissaries, both for Zelenskyy and for President Trump leading up to his visit there to the Oval Office and President Zelensky's immediate escalation there was frankly quite a surprise. This has created a huge rift in the relationship. President Zelensky, as you pointed out in the clips that you played, doesn't believe that he did anything wrong and that there was no issue with what he brought up in the Oval Office with President Trump. There's going to have to be a rebuilding of any kind of interest in good faith negotiations.

[David Pakman]

The idea that Putin and Trump will be doing the good faith negotiations with no problem. But Zelensky is going to have to be a good boy and he's going to have to help rebuild before any good. It is just a laughable perspective. Now there was another moment during this interview where there was a very simple opportunity to criticize Putin for his aggression and for his invasion. And Tulsi just pivots to instead attacking President Zelensky also.

[J.D. Vance]

That is a predator, right?

[David Pakman]

In more alignment. They should be with the US when it comes to those freedoms and things. You talk about, certainly those are not things that you would say that Russia or Putin celebrates or bestows on his own people.

[J.D. Vance]

That's correct. I would not make that claim. And it's clear that that's not the case, nor does President Trump. But that's not really what we're talking about here. We're talking about many of these European countries and Zelensky himself, who claim to be standing and fighting for the cause of freedom and democracy. When we actually look at what's happening in reality in these countries as well.

[David Pakman]

As with Zelensky's government in Ukraine is the exact opposite.

[J.D. Vance]

You have the canceling of elections in Ukraine. You have political parties being silenced or even criminalized or thrown in prison. You have the freedom of religion, churches being shut down. You have political opposition being silenced. You have total government control of the media.

[David Pakman]

We could now just about everything she points to there is happening in Russia far more heavy handedly and thanks to Putin. Now some of what she says is taking place in Ukraine, for example, Elections are suspended in Ukraine during times of war. I don't like that. I think that it would be good to have elections anyway. We did it in the United States during the Iraq war. Okay, I don't like it. But Zelensky didn't come up with that. That is part of Ukrainian law, this subjugation of media control. That's what's happening in Russia. And there seems to be just an unwillingness to hold both countries to the same standard, even when it is clear that one country, Russia, is the aggressor here. Now, finally, in this interview, moments after being shown polling that shows most of the American people don't really like Trump's cozying up to Putin, Tulsi goes, oh, no, no, no. Americans are celebrating what Trump is doing. Dimitri Peskov saying what the US Is doing is changing the game. And it largely coincides with our vision. What do you make of Russia celebrating and saying what the US Is doing? Lines up with their vision.

[J.D. Vance]

They're going to say what their position is. What we should pay attention to here in the United States of America is the American people. So many people across the country celebrating the strong leadership that President Trump and Vice President Vance demonstrated in the Oval Office, something we have have not seen over the last four years of the Biden administration. We finally have a president who's going to stand up strongly and fiercely and unwaveringly for the cause of peace and freedom for the American people.

[David Pakman]

How heroic. How heroic. Despite the fact that the American people don't like Trump's cozying up to Putin, taking giving him the benefit of the doubt and attacking President Zelensky despite that. It was so strong what JD and Donald did in that Oval Office and she absolutely loves it. My how far Tulsi Gabbard has fallen. And you know, like her or hater Hillary Clinton was right about Tulsi and a lot of people didn't want to hear it years ago. But at the end of the day, she was completely correct. If you're still using a free email service, your emails are often being scanned and tracked, even after you delete them. Companies use the data to know everything about you and show you ads, even your most personal communications. That's why I recommend you check out Start Mail. Unlike free email services, our sponsor Start Mail never scans or tracks your emails. It also blocks tracking pixels which companies and hackers use to capture your IP address. 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It happens to me every single time because I don't know anything about wine. Which is why I love our sponsor, Naked Wines. Naked Wines is a subscription service that just connects you directly to the world's finest independent winemakers so you can get award winning wine delivered straight to your door. With my code Pacman, you can get six bottles for just 3,999. My girlfriend likes white wine. I know I'm more of a red wine guy even if I'm generally clueless. So we usually get the split box from Naked Wines which has both. Naked Wines believes that great wine is an experience and they're all about helping you connect with your friends family community over a shared bottle of wine. You get background information on each bottle. So when I have friends over, I can actually tell everybody where the wine came from and sort of sound like I know a little bit of something. And you can pause or cancel at any time. Head to naked wines.com/pacman and put in my code pacman for both the code and the password for six bottles of wine for just 3999 with shipping included. That's naked wines.com/pacman code PACMAN for six bottles of wine for 39 99. The link is in the podcast notes. My friends, much like Plato, I am finding myself questioning democracy. Did you see video of the Oval Office, Donald Trump and J.D. vance berating and yelling at Ukrainian President Zelensky? And maybe you said to yourself, you know, maybe Plato was on to something. Maybe letting ignorant clowns decide how we run our country is a bad idea. Now, before the MAGA people start flipping out, I'm not actually calling for the suspension of democracy the way they did multiple times. I am pro democracy, but this is sort of a thought experiment, and I do find myself feeling like Plato did. Now, I'm not saying let's put in some dictator or philosopher king. I am saying Plato's biggest fear about democracy is playing out in real time right now in the United States. What Plato said was that unchecked democracy will eventually fail under its own stupidity, or the stupidity of the average voter. If you let everyone vote as we do in democracies, at least supposedly, if you're uninformed, if you're detached from reality, you're still allowed to vote. And when that's the case, eventually the loudest and the most shameless liars will win. The ignorant will end up in charge. And what are we seeing today? We're seeing a con man reality TV show host with dozens of felony charges as President of the United States. We're seeing the guy who bragged about I'm going to be a dictator on day one is the president. We're seeing the guy who gives unqualified friends and family jobs be the president. The guy who yells at the Ukrainian president while kowtowing to the Russian dictator is the president. And this is really not about left and right. This is simply about whether facts, logic, and basic reality can survive when millions of people prefer entertaining nonsense over the truth. And MAGA is the sort of final boss of entertaining nonsense. It's really Plato's nightmare. Now, democracy assumes an informed electorate. It assumes that people will act in their own Best interests. But what happens when a significant chunk of voters are so propagandized to, so ignorant and so detached from reality that they can't even recognize a scam or what's truly in their best interests? What happens when they actively vote for their own destruction? MAGA voters cheer when Trump says he wants to gut Social Security because of fraud. Fraud. They applaud when Trump brags about giving tax cuts to billionaires while they're struggling to afford groceries because it's going to be pro growth and great for everybody. They chant his name when he calls for shutting down the government programs that they depend on. They pray at the altar of Trump when he proposes tariffs that they are going to end up paying for. So maybe Plato had a point. Because Plato warned that democracy, left to its own devices, eventually will elect the worst among us, and that if enough voters reject expertise and reject reason and choose leaders based on who yells the loudest, democracy is going to eat itself. And here we are. So what do we do? What we don't do is we don't sit back and kind of wait for a magic genie to fix it all. We need to stop treating ignorant, propagandized voters like an unfortunate side effect of democracy and say, this is an existential crisis. This is not the way democracy was supposed to work. Because if Plato was correct, and democracy is doomed to collapse under the weight of its own stupidity, the only real way forward is to fight like hell for an informed democracy. If we still believe that for all of its failings, democracy is the best system we've come up with, I tend to still believe that it is. And so I want to be clear that I'm not actually calling for the suspension of democracy. What I am pointing out is that when the population, when the electorate gets as painfully ignorant and uninformed and it's so easy to bamboozle, as we are seeing here in the United States, we end up with really unqualified, dangerous people in power. And once you open that door, once the genie is out of the bottle to stick with that, it's extraordinarily difficult to get it back in. And that's what we are seeing. I mean, as we started the show today and I said, you know, most of the world sees the Oval Office fiasco with Trump, JD And Zelensky as embarrassing for the United States. Most of the world has said, oh, wow, the US Is really going full dictator and saying the dictator who invaded is the guy we should defer to and the democratically elected president who's defending his country needs to be berated and yelled at in the Oval Office. Most of the world said we should come to the defense of Zelensky here, here in the United States. A lot of magas saw that and said good for Trump and J.D. for being tough. Now I didn't mention this earlier and it does does bear mentioning. I don't know how many of you notice Secretary of State Marco Rubio sitting next to JD during that. You can't always know what people are thinking from how they look. But by all accounts, Marco Rubio looked disgusted with what was going on. He seemed disgusted with the way that Trump and JP Mandel were treating Vladimir Zelensky. And so my suspicion is, and I'm going to talk to some Republicans kind of off the record this week, my suspicion is that a large share of the Republican Party right now did not like that and were not impressed and are not impressed with the way in which Tulsi and Trump and JD and others are more and more kind of favoring Putin. We will see. It is starting. The Trump Department of Defense has blocked the David Pakman show on all of their computers. But other right wing commentary websites are are allowed. This is yet another reason to believe that just as I was recently warned by some lawyers, expect this administration to come after independent progressive media. Now I got an email from a viewer and this viewer is an active duty service member. And by the way, thank you for your service. This viewer wrote to me and explained what is going on and said quote, hey there David Pakman, Sir, I am an active duty service member and very proud subscriber to your program and I tried accessing your website from work today. I was very surprised to see that your website is blocked on our Department of Defense network. Take a look at the attached screenshot. Interestingly, conservative websites like American Conservative and Hot Air are are not blocked even though they should also fall under streaming media philosophy and political advocacy. Thankfully, we can still access your YouTube channel. Thanks for everything you do. That's right, my website, the David Pakman show is apparently too dangerous for the brave men and women defending our country. Here he is trying to access it, but as you can see, blocked. You know what isn't blocked? Right wing sites like the American conservative right wing sites like Hot Air. So let's step back here for a second and talk about what's going on. The Defense Department claims that this is about restricting access to streaming media philosophy and political advocacy. Okay, so does right wing propaganda not count as political advocacy? Now I'll be upfront. I don't know if this was a deliberate choice by the Trump era holdovers or people at DoD. Is it an algorithmic decision? Is it a bored IT guy playing favorites? I don't know. But what I do know is that the conservative content pipeline is alive and well in our military. Military because we've been hearing for years about how right wing content, whether it's Fox News blaring in the Met halls or extremist YouTube channels filling recommendation feeds, it is dominating, dominating military culture. And before some MAGA keyboard warrior says, well just watch David on YouTube if that's what you want. Yeah, luckily YouTube is still accessible. But that's not the point. The point is that if this were happening in reverse, if Breitbart were blocked but you could access David pakman dotcom from DoD computers, Republicans would be melting down on Fox News right now about woke censorship and left wing propaganda. So what do we need to do? First of all, this needs to get attention. I want to hear from other members of the military. Have you seen similar issues? What other websites are blocked? What other websites aren't blocked? I would love to get more information. Secondly, we must support the independent shows that it is now clear the Trump administration is going to target however they can. It costs nothing to subscribe to our YouTube channel. It costs nothing to subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts and Spotify and to leave a review. Now of course shows like ours do have memberships. Doesn't have to be this one. Support whatever show you want to. Financially it's an option to support us. But at the end of the day this is about information access. And if a sitting president can push disinformation and an ex president can demand military tribunals for his enemies and a former general can suggest coups, then maybe we do need to be more worried about this than just what my website being blocked signals. And realize that there is a building. Whoa. There is a sort of building consensus here for this sort of bias and lack of objectivity and we need to keep a very close eye on it. So it doesn't have to be this show that you support. But understand that independent progressive media right now really needs your support. If it's helping us get to 3 million YouTube subscribers, great. If it's helping some smaller show get to 100000 YouTube subscribers or get their first hundred reviews on Apple podcasts. The bigger the ecosystem is, the better positioned we will all be to come to our shared defense. Sort of like Naito. If and when the you know what starts to hit the fan, which quite frankly seems to already be happening.

[J.D. Vance]

Now.

[David Pakman]

On today's bonus show, we are going to talk about a high school graduate who doesn't know how to read or write and she's suing, saying she is the victim. Secondly, Skype is going away. Microsoft says Skype will close down. And finally, the Fyre Festival seems to be back. Fyre Festival 2. It's not clear it really exists. It's a wacky situation. Get instant access to the bonus show by signing up@join pacman.com Remember, you can preorder my book out in just three weeks. The Echo Machine, anywhere you want. On the back, beautiful blurbs from Brian Tyler Cohen, from Barbara McQuaid, from our friend Ben Meiselas from the Midas Touch Network. There is a picture. It is not strictly speaking a picture book, but if there it's mostly words. But if people you know only do picture books, there is one picture in the book and a couple charts. If you want a signed copy, you go to David pakman.com/booksmith or go to David pakman.com /echo or you can get the Kindle version, you can get the audiobook, the whole thing. I will see you on the bonus show. We've got a whole week of shows and I will be live for the State of the Union address tomorrow evening. I hope you will join me starting at 8pm Eastern, 5pm Pacific, YouTube, Twitch, Facebook Live for the State of the Union interviews, all sorts of stuff. See you then.