Podcast Summary: The Deep Dish – "The Dish on Gossip"

Host: Melissa Kruger and Courtney Doctor
Date: September 4, 2025

Overview

In this episode of The Deep Dish, Melissa Kruger and Courtney Doctor dig into the uncomfortable but highly relevant topic of gossip. With their trademark warmth and candor, they explore what gossip really is, why it's so damaging, and how Christians can resist the temptation to engage in it. Drawing deeply from scripture and personal experience, the hosts discuss the spiritual, relational, and personal costs of gossip and offer practical ways to become women who build up rather than tear down.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Defining Gossip

(~02:45 – 05:10)

• Melissa broadens the traditional understanding of gossip, moving beyond simply "saying something bad about someone behind their back."
• Contemporary Definition: “Casual or unconstrained conversation or reports about other people, typically involving events not confirmed as being true.”
• Biblical Context: “Idle, harmful talk about others, often involving secrets or rumors… any talk not beneficial or truthful about another person.” – Melissa Krueger [04:23]
• Both hosts agree: Gossip can be even what seems like harmless, idle talk that doesn’t benefit or build up.

2. Scriptural Warnings and Weight of Words

(06:14 – 12:57)

• Proverbs 11:13 is highlighted: “A gossip betrays a confidence, but a trustworthy person keeps a secret.” – Courtney Docter [02:09]
• Ephesians 4:29: “Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.” – Courtney Docter [05:57]
• Proverbs 16:28: “A dishonest man spreads strife, and a whisperer separates close friends.” – Melissa Krueger [08:07]
• James: The tongue is powerful, a "rudder" or "bit," able to direct the whole course of life. Even teachers must be especially careful (Courtney referencing her Bible study on James) [10:08].
• Romans 1:29 lists gossip alongside major sins like murder and malice—emphasizing its seriousness [10:37].

Memorable Quote:
“God’s words are omnipotent, but our words are potent and that we need to, like, give pause for that.” – Courtney Docter [12:24]

3. Why Do We Gossip?

(13:36 – 17:08)

• Gossip often creates a false sense of intimacy: “In the moment, it creates a false sense of intimacy between you and the person you’re chatting…It’s such a lie.” – Melissa Krueger [13:36]
• Pride and a desire for power or to appear “in the know” often undergird gossip.
• "Crabs in a bucket": The urge to pull others down when one seems to rise (Courtney’s analogy) [15:03].
• Wanting relational power—“I want to prove relationally I’m closer to you” – Melissa Krueger [16:14]
• Gossip distances us from people and reveals much about the state of our hearts.

Memorable Quote:
“Our desire to gossip, our engagement with gossip is just so much.” – Courtney Docter [17:08]

4. Recognizing and Re-Directing Gossip

(17:21 – 22:19)

• Warning signs: “Don’t tell anyone, but…” and Christian masking as “Let’s pray for…” can be entry points [18:20].
• Strategies to Intervene:
  • The direct route: “Hey, this conversation is really not going in a direction that I want it to go.” – Melissa Krueger [19:46]
  • Redirect to positives: “Let me think of something positive to say about this person…” – Melissa Krueger [20:00]
  • Set boundaries: “If you’re not supposed to tell me, don’t.” – Courtney Docter [21:14]

Memorable Moment:
Courtney admits: “No surprise that I’m more confrontational than you…I've started to say things like, ‘I don’t want this to slip into gossip.’” [20:37]

5. Responding After Participating in Gossip

(22:19 – 26:18)

• Confession is often most appropriate before God and with the person you gossiped with.
• Only confess to the person you gossiped about if the information caused direct harm or was severely sensitive.
  • “If you shared information you shouldn’t have shared…then say, ‘I need to confess, I told Courtney about that medical diagnosis, and I’m really sorry.’” – Melissa Krueger [23:47]
• Not all confessions are helpful: “There are confessions that can harm.” – Courtney Docter [22:24]
• Nuance is important—seek God’s wisdom for each situation.

6. The Damage of Gossip

(27:10 – 32:00)

• Gossip harms relationships; damages trust; causes people to pull away or isolate.
• Leaders are often the subject of more gossip simply by being visible (Melissa’s personal experience as a pastor’s wife) [28:00].
• Gossip “objectifies” people and treats them as topics, not souls.
• “It does affect your confidence and trust in that person.” – Melissa Krueger [30:06]
• Both hosts stress that while all sin is damning, gossip is uniquely damaging to community.

7. Sin’s Deceptive Appeal and Real Misery

(32:00 – 34:39)

• Sin is often painted as what’s being kept from us, but it is truly corrosive. “Sometimes we need to take a really hard look at the ugliness and misery of sin. Not so we feel condemned by it, but so that we hate it and want to spit it out.” – Melissa Krueger [32:46]
• Gossip gives a fake bond; real relationships should be built on stronger foundations, like partnership in the gospel.

Notable Line:
“The strength of the friendship is only as strong as the thing that unites you.” – Courtney Docter [33:41]

8. Gossip in the Age of Social Media

(34:39 – 37:22)

• Is it still gossip if someone posted their own news? Yes—when shared with negative spin, judgment, or for idle talk.
• “I think the thing about gossip is it objectifies a person.” – Melissa Krueger [35:28]
• The hosts urge listeners to check heart motives and to avoid fuel for idle, harmful conversation even when information is public.
• Philippians 4:8 and Ephesians 4:29 are suggested as benchmarks for our words.

9. Casting a Vision for Life-Giving Conversation

(37:28 – 41:53)

• “Only have that [speech] be what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen—all those who listen. And that includes you as the speaker.” – Courtney Docter [38:17]
• Melissa and Courtney praise the women they work with at TGC for spiritually rich, edifying conversation. “It’s the women in my life who I know are in the word regularly.” – Melissa Krueger [39:01]
• Output matches input—what we fill our minds with shapes our words.

Touching Example:
Courtney shares her aunt’s words about her mother: “No matter how hard I’ve tried through the years… I cannot make her speak badly about others.” [41:24]
A life goal worth emulating.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “God’s words are omnipotent, but our words are potent and that we need to, like, give pause for that.” – Courtney Docter [12:24]
• “Sometimes we need to take a really hard look at the ugliness and misery of sin. Not so we feel condemned by it, but so that we hate it and want to spit it out.” – Melissa Krueger [32:46]
• “The strength of the friendship is only as strong as the thing that unites you.” – Courtney Docter [33:41]
• “No matter how hard I’ve tried… I cannot make her speak badly about others.” – Courtney Docter’s Aunt about her mother [41:24]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Defining Gossip & Scriptural Foundations: 02:00 – 13:00
• Why We Gossip & Its Damaging Effects: 13:00 – 17:30
• Recognizing and Stopping Gossip: 17:30 – 22:30
• Confession & Repair: 22:30 – 26:30
• Personal Stories of Gossip’s Damage: 27:00 – 32:00
• Sin’s Deceptive Appeal: 32:00 – 34:30
• Social Media & Gossip: 34:30 – 38:00
• Life-Giving Friendships and Examples: 38:00 – 41:53

Conclusion

Melissa and Courtney invite listeners to take a sober look at gossip, acknowledge its real consequences, and actively choose speech that is life-giving, trustworthy, and gospel-centered. They model both practical wisdom and gracious vulnerability, pointing toward sanctification as a loving, ongoing process. Their prayer is that, as Christian women, listeners would be known for discretion, encouragement, and the kind of trustworthiness that builds true, lasting friendships.

Call to Action:
Consider what bonds your own friendships—and be the friend “who cannot be made to speak ill of others.”
Reflect: What story will your words tell about your heart?