How Matthew Dillon Turned Rock Bottom Into Unbreakable Determination

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Determined Society with Shawn French

Episode: How Matthew Dillon Turned Rock Bottom Into Unbreakable Determination
Release Date: December 22, 2025
Host: Shawn French
Guest: Matthew Dillon (Founder, The MD Effect; Podcaster; Publicist; Animal Advocate)

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Episode Overview

This episode is an intimate, layered conversation between Shawn French and Matthew Dillon, exploring Dillon’s journey from rock bottom to a life built on resilience, authenticity, and determination. Together, they dive into the wisdom gained through adversity—addiction recovery, career pivots, cross-continental moves, and the transformative love of animals. The raw, humorous, and heartfelt discussion offers listeners actionable insights on pushing through darkness, embracing individuality, and finding purpose, no matter your starting point.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Myth of Balance and the Reality of Hustle

• Dillon rejects the concept of work–life balance, favoring relentless commitment.
  • "I will sleep when I'm dead. And I'm good with that... until these nubbly knees give way, I will stand up. I will rise again." — Matthew Dillon [03:02]
• True success comes from authenticity, pursuing projects and connections that align with your heart.
  • “I don't take on things that don't fit my heart. And I think that's where my success has come from.” — Dillon [03:14]

2. Facing the Darkest Moments and Building Determination

• Both Shawn and Dillon discuss periods of deep struggle and depression while building their platforms.
  • "Building this platform took me to the darkest days... feeling unworthy, feeling unseen, just invisible. All the different words you can think of for that." — Shawn [06:31]
• Their shared conclusion: sitting with discomfort, not shaming yourself, and taking even micro-actions forward is key.
  • “Take that moment, shed a tear if you must, and move forward.” — Dillon [04:38]
  • "It's okay to feel shame, but to turn it into a month-long shame fest on yourself is really not going to play well." — Shawn [30:47]

3. Starting Over: Leaving Australia, Starting from the Bottom

• Dillon recounts moving from Sydney to New York at 19, leaving behind major business success to start anew.
  • "I was making... over a million dollars. So I had done amazing work already. And I knew coming to America, I would go back to the bottom. Yep. I knew that... you are a clean slate." — Dillon [08:55]
• Culture shock, resilience, and embracing being ‘the odd man out’ became formative experiences.
  • “You can take me to a country town, and even as a gay man, I will rock with you... And I believe the statement that I'm going to say is, you got to fake your shit until you make your shit.” — Dillon [11:21]

4. Personal Development & Relationships: From Chaos to Clarity

• The power (and challenge) of cutting toxic people and influences is stressed.
  • "First major decision I did was eliminate humans and bad seeds in my life. And I think that's harder than one thinks, but easier to action." — Dillon [25:50]
• Dillon’s recovery from addiction involved mental self-discipline and self-reflection.
  • "When you're sitting in those deep moments, start really taking a mental note or write it down." — Dillon [26:36]
• Discernment, learned through hardship, becomes a superpower.
  • "That discernment isn't cocky. It is an ego. It's knowing for a fact if I say I can do this, I'll call this person... that's the thing." — Dillon [33:14]

5. The Transformative Power of Animal Connection

• Rescuing his dog (‘Mama’) from a trash can gave Dillon new purpose and mirrored his own feelings of being discarded.
  • “We found each other... It changed my whole trajectory. It gave me purpose, having a responsibility.” — Dillon [18:02]
• Years later, becoming caretaker and publicist for Limbani the chimpanzee provided another life-defining relationship.
  • Limbani’s story: Rescued, became a viral internet star, and recently transitioned to a chimp sanctuary for his well-being.
  • "Everything that went viral of his was an activity that he was obsessed with... For nine years, we showed him what love felt like. And that is, my friends, your answer." — Dillon [41:55]
  • [Emotional moment] “It's the biggest thing I've ever done and ever will do in my entire life. And I'm so grateful to you, Lambani. No matter what the world thought.” [45:31]

6. Universal Lessons on Greatness, Individuality, and Empathy

• Comparison and social envy are called out as self-defeating.
  • "Your dream is not my dream... Don't diminish what God gave you... Some people are like, I want to be a singer. You can't hold a note. Be a realist in your own life." — Dillon [27:44]
• Greatness is subjective; living a life true to yourself is the win.
  • “Everybody's potential is unique and different. But we're put on this world to do something and be grand. Why be boring and sit your ass at home and complain about what you don't have?” — Dillon [04:38]
• Compassion and not judging others’ paths is a key thread.
  • "I've never had any ounce of, like, not jealousy, not hatred, not. I'm better than you. So don't judge anybody's story if you don't really know anything. Nobody's a director of anybody else's life." — Dillon [49:54]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On resilience:
  “Push me down, but stay tuned, because I always get back up. Like, I really do have. I'm never going to stop.” — Dillon [20:30]
• On fake it till you make it:
  "You gotta fake your shit until you make your shit." — Dillon [12:30]
• On empathy in adversity:
  “You’re put on this earth to do something, chase your dream. Don’t diminish what God gave you...” — Dillon [31:20]
• On the chimpanzee experience:
  “This is just came out of me... It’s the biggest thing I’ve ever done and ever will do in my entire life.” — Dillon (tearful, re: Limbani) [45:31]
• On truly seeing others:
  “I hope that in my life, in my career, that I can do that for everybody... because I think that's the greatest gift. We can leave anybody being seen feeling important.” — Dillon [55:22]

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Important Timestamps

• On the myth of balance & starting over: [03:02]–[08:55]
• Australia to New York—Rock Bottom & Culture Shock: [08:55]–[12:30]
• Addiction, Recovery, and Personal Reinvention: [15:31]–[27:44]
• Finding purpose through rescuing a dog: [17:02]–[18:58]
• Limbani the chimpanzee: love, virality, ethics, and loss: [34:57]–[45:31]
• Living authentically & pursuing individual greatness: [49:08]–[52:22]
• Final reflections on self-acceptance, fashion, and presence: [54:43]–[57:17]

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Episode Tone

The conversation is raw, humorous, and heartfelt. Dillon and Shawn both lean into vulnerability, with light teasing and candid admissions creating a space that’s supportive and inspiring. Dillon’s voice is irreverent, direct, and passionate—a mix of motivational candor and irrepressible energy, while Shawn grounds the chat with genuine empathy and encouragement.

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Conclusion

Matthew Dillon’s story is a vivid portrait of determination: taking leaps of faith, embracing adversity, and continually reinventing oneself—while never losing compassion. Through addiction, professional reinvention, and deep connections with animals and people alike, Dillon embodies unbreakable determination, reminding listeners that your rock bottom can be the birthplace of your greatest self. The episode closes by underscoring the importance of presence, loving who you are, and valuing the paths (however grand or humble) that lead us forward.

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For More

Follow Matthew Dillon @MattDillon1983, check out The MD Effect (mdffect.com), and listen to The Fashionably Late Pod.

Transcript

[A]

You swam through the shit.

[B]

I was covered in it.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, sorry. There's a valuable lesson here for the people listening and watching. Want to try something but afraid I.

[B]

Will sleep when I'm dead. It's too hard. I'm not in the same position as you are. Well, why aren't you in that same position? Because you ain't busting your ass. Shed a tear if you must, and move forward. You got to fake your shit until you make your shit. That was learned through hard ass. Problematic life. And I think that's the best way to be what I am now.

[A]

I did have to fake it, right? I had to fake that everything was okay because I couldn't tell everybody I was stressed. I couldn't tell everybody I was scared. Dude, this show was started out of an extreme amount of pain.

[B]

And look at the joy you bring people now.

[A]

Talk to me about the chimp, dude.

[B]

Dude. Another game changer in life. It gets me emotional. It changed my life so much. Having gaze on talking about crying chimpanzees. Bitch. That's a rap.

[A]

This son of a bitch. Dude.

[B]

Welcome to the Determined Society. I'm Shawn French. Thanks for tuning in.

[A]

What up, everybody? I'm back here. I got my boy Matt dealing with me today, man. I'm so excited to have him on the show. Been on his show once before. The fashionably late pod, founder of MD Effect. My man. Welcome to the show.

[B]

What's up, brother?

[A]

My guy here. It's always good to see you, bro.

[B]

It's always a great energy you bring, and, you know, you uplift people in a way that's so genuine and authentic. Who wouldn't want to be in this?

[A]

Dude? I appreciate that, man. It's.

[B]

Pressure's on.

[A]

I know pressure's on. We got mama here if you can see.

[B]

But she's well behaved. Don't worry.

[A]

Yeah, she. She's cool, man. She's cool. She just wanted to be next to you.

[B]

I know. I know. What are you gonna do? I mean, what are you gonna do?

[A]

Oh, man, you're always looking fitted. You look nice. What are we wearing today?

[B]

Dude, this is something that's coming out in January for my own collection, so I'm collaborating with another company. You know, I would like to be. I'd like to call myself a jack of all trades, you know, a little bit about me. But I think today we'll get into, you know, taking those onion layers off because it's. It's rare that somebody can be a publicist on camera. Podcaster, Chimp Guy.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And I think that's what confuses people about me. They're like, you're like, in wildlife as well. I was like, no, that was my passion. But we'll get.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

We'll journey into that.

[A]

I'm interested in all the layers, so I'm gonna, you know, throughout the conversation, you know, open a layer and I'll dive in. Because there's so much to you. First of all, being a podcaster, being out on camera, traveling, doing fashion stuff, and then being a publicist, that's a lot of stuff, dude.

[B]

It is.

[A]

I mean, being a publicist is enough, because you have a bunch of people to keep straight.

[B]

Correct.

[A]

And now you're out there behind from behind the scenes now in the. In the camera, doing your thing. How are you scheduling? How's your calendar working? How are you staying. How are you staying locked in on everything that you have to do?

[B]

Okay, so that's a really good question, and that's something I remember. And you've had her on your podcast, too. Gertie said she goes, you know, if we're doing this, I need you to be fully involved in this. But she goes, I see how everything else is this, like, flourishing moment to actually. Which benefits everybody that's in my sphere, as in PR mode. So how my number one thing is, I do not believe in the term balance. I will sleep when I'm dead. And I'm good with that. I'm absolutely fine with that. You are living a life that is about curating memories, iconic moments, good, bad, and ugly. So I'm like, until these nubbly knees give way, I will stand up. I will rise again. But I also don't take on things that don't fit my heart. And I think that's where my success has come from. If you look at. If you look at the concept of burning out, to a degree, I think people push themselves for the money. That's what I learned. So I originally from Sydney, Australia, I moved to New York City. I was young, partying, wild, but would also always show up for work the very next day. So I had this innate thing in me that when it comes to my career, that's my number one ambition is. Is driven. But I really do believe that stepping into any project, stepping into yourself as a human being, that it doesn't take a lot to just stand up and show up and step into something. It's like there's a lot of weak conversation now that it's too hard. I'm not in the same position as you Are. Well, why aren't you in that same position?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because you ain't busting your ass.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I don't really hear excuses. I don't take excuses. You say you'll do something, you say you'll be somewhere, it's not that difficult. Show up, bring great energy and do what you love. Because if you don't do what you love and you're just there for money, you know, not everybody's built like you and I. I would say where you have that chutzpah to go and follow a passion even when it takes you to dark levels. But I do believe that everybody, and that's where the fashion comes in and why I decided to pivot a little bit and start the MD effect is because I do believe everybody, if they applied themselves in, you know, it doesn't have to be at the 100 gas pedal, but if they did apply themselves, that they would reach their full potential. Not everybody's full potential is yours, nor mine, nor my brother behind the lens over there. Not every, Everybody's potential is unique and different. But we're put on this world to do something and be grand. Why be boring and sit your ass at home and, and complain about what you don't have? Don't sit in and wallow in, in moments of toughness. Take that moment, shed a tear if you must, and move forward.

[A]

Dude, so many good things I want to get to out of that monologue right there. But the one you said, that really struck me and I thought you, you probably saw my physical reaction. It was. Not everybody has, has it in them to go hard no matter how low it takes them, like to the dark spots.

[B]

And you can't. And I don't judge people for that either.

[A]

I don't either.

[B]

I want to be clear.

[A]

No, no judgment. Because I mean, even building this, man, and I talk about this a lot, dude, building this platform took me to the darkest days. I mean, dark, bro, like, feeling unworthy, feeling unseen, just invisible. All the different words you can, you can think of for that. Right? But the ultimate thing is, is I, I, I was thinking like, you know what? This isn't my fault. This is because I don't have this, I don't have that. I don't have all these different things. Like, I don't have production, I don't have nice cameras, I don't have marketing, I don't have pr. I don't have all these things. But what I quickly realized when I took care of that one thing, that I needed to take Care of all those things came and I got out of those dark moments and all of a sudden we start having these massive, massive trajectory of growth. I mean, we were up 999% on all analytics in 2025.

[B]

That's insanity.

[A]

Explosive growth.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But it's because I was willing to sit there in those darkest moments and just kind of feel those and just go with my heart.

[B]

That's really nice.

[A]

It's like, I'm not going to come off of this. I know I'm going to come out of it. Can't get any worse. Like, this cannot get any worse. But you, you, you mentioned your heart, you know, and you mentioned you're from Australia and you moved to New York. That was said. And kind of just glanced over.

[B]

I know. It's like 15 years of my life that I just fast forwarded through the years. Yeah.

[A]

And so, like, I want to dig into that because you have a, you have a pretty interesting story coming from, you know, Australia to New York to la and now you're here, Florida. Like, dude, that took balls. That took balls. And you didn't know how you were going to get it done. And this is why I think this is so important to the story. Because everything you've created, because it's given you the platform, it's given you the strength and resilience to, to build the clothing brand, to do all the different things that you're doing because you, you weren't afraid of what's it going to look like. You just knew that this is my passion. I want to get out to New York. I want to live there. So the audience and, and even myself back in the day would, would want something but, but always wanted to know the, the how or the why. Right. And, and the thing that I admire about you is you didn't, you might have thought about that, but you didn't act on that. You acted in, in such a way of just taking action. So I want you to walk the audience through your thought process because there's a valuable lesson here for the people listening and watching that are sitting there stuck.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Want to try something but afraid.

[B]

Okay. Let's say it's like, where do I, where do I begin? I would say, let me start with this sentence. Living in the moment. Really take pause in moments where you don't know what's happening. So even the littlest thing, the very first memory I have of getting to New York, I had a girlfriend there that was a contributor for the Today show. Her name was Katherine Eisman. Shout out to her. She's very, very well established. She said, you should come over here and give it a shot. And I was like, give it a shot. I was really doing well in Australia, and I was 19 years old. I had my own PR firm. I was making. I kept the tax return. I'd made over a million dollars. So I had done amazing work already. And I knew coming to America, I would go back to the bottom. Yep. I knew that some other people don't think that. They think, oh, I could ride what I have to get there. No, no, no. You. You are a clean slate. You've got to start from the beginning. I remember the craziest story was I knew Madison Avenue. Fifth Avenue was like luxury. I found a great rental on 125th between 5th and Madison. Now, this is Harlem. Back before Harlem had been gentrified, though. This is way back when. I arrived late at night, I packed my. My stuff in there. I woke up the next morning to go open a bank account. Now, me being somebody in Australia that really has never seen a culture like that, walked outside and I was like, what is all this now? I lived for it, but I was like, holy, I'm one. This is everybody else. And I remember the lady at the bank said to me, do you know where you are? And some other lady behind the thing screamed at her and said, you better watch your motherfucking voice to him. He's like, he's a brother, like I am, and I'm a sister to him. This is beautiful African American lady. So the bank teller was basically saying, you're white, we all black. What's happening? And I'm like, I'm just trying to open a bank account.

[A]

I just moved here.

[B]

I'm here and I need somewhere to take. It was shocking. So I won't say the banks, but I basically walked next door and joined the bank next door.

[A]

Yeah, of course you did.

[B]

So, that being said, that culture shock from Australia, because everyone thinks Australia is like, you know, it is multicultural. But I've never been in a community where it's a lot of one and me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And unfortunately, you know, I think the culture is so important in New York City, and I think that's what really toughens you up, that you are put in scenarios where you sink or swim. Are you gonna stand by who you are? Are you going to listen, learn, understand, take pause, and really get involved. I think my greatest skill set is that you can put me in a room. Even back then, you could put me in a room, and I'm one of myself. And everybody's different to me. So I'm the odd man out. You can take me to a country town, and even as a gay man, I will rock with you in that town. And they will end up loving me. You can put me in any scenario. And I believe the statement that I'm going to say is, you got to fake your shit until you make your shit. And that is so powerful to me because I was bullied in high school in Australia. I wasn't this confident person. And I became this because I was like, I feel greatness in me. Australia's pushing me down. They don't want me to unleash my beast. And America just opened up the doors and we're like, hey, we'll take you.

[A]

Hey. We like what you're doing here. Like, let's hey.

[B]

And this was before I was doing anything. I just had the balls to step in and open my big ass mouth and ask questions and be respectful and learn and listen. These are really important skills for anybody sitting at home asking, why is this not happening? Why can I be this person? Why can't. You can be whatever the hell you want to be, but if you don't know the skills, listen first. Don't. Don't have. There's a difference between fake it till you make it and false bravado. False bravado. You know, you can fool a few people, but that's when you turn into a narcissist, a manipulator, a artist. I was never that. I moved all the way to New York and I started from the ground up again. I worked in fashion for years as an intern. I started. So I went from making money using that money that I'd saved to survive and actually interned. So I've interned for Kelly Catrone, who back in that day was on the Hills with Lauren Conrad and Heidi. Major, major player. I moved into another power firm, industry pr, that looked after Harvey Weinstein's production. So before he was popping off Harvey, I was in with, you know, Georgina Chapman and, like, learning from the greats on the outside of the door. I wasn't even in the door. I was like, but I'm here. I came all the way from there and I'm here.

[A]

Yeah. You know, one of the things that you talked about is you can be anywhere and have these great conversations. You can be you. And it's through a lot of personal development. Obviously, you talk about a lot of people say, I don't like, fake it till you make it. Be it till you Are it. It's the same freaking thing, dude. You're just. You're just. You're just. You're just packaging it differently. Because there's multiple moments in my journey where I. I did have to fake it. Right. I had to fake that everything was okay because I couldn't tell everybody I was stressed. I couldn't tell everybody I was scared.

[B]

You're the captain.

[A]

Yeah. I'm like, dude, like. I mean, the closest people to me knew that I was just out of my depth. I was completely out of my depth. Didn't know.

[B]

In your destiny.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

Yeah, but. In your destiny.

[A]

Exactly. But the thing that I've always enjoyed about you was your level of self confidence and. And. Or is your level of self confidence in your ability to make relationship with all types of people, man. And that is a testament to you.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

You know, for the audience. You need to go look Matt Dillon up and you need to follow him. You need to go check out everything he's doing. His show is great. His purpose is great, but he's a great friend. And, you know, when I don't always read emails in its entirety, and I read your email in its entirety.

[B]

I appreciate that.

[A]

And. And I was just blown away. I mean, like, d. That move, like, it's not an easy thing. You know, people could say, okay, well, you just move from Australia to here, New York. Yeah, it's going to be tough. But, dude, there's so many layers to that.

[B]

Huge layer.

[A]

There's so many layers.

[B]

Mental, physical, emotional. I mean, pull a. Pull a year out. It's like, for me, I went through drug habits, alcoholism, cocaine addiction, and still showed up and worked. Now that's what they call the functioning problem. That's problematic.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I changed my direction and completely changed that and shut out my initial four or five years of people that I was hanging around. I cut them all out.

[A]

So you had to start over again one more time.

[B]

Yeah, one more time.

[A]

New network.

[B]

People that were there that were like, if you can beat this, you can be great. And the big defining factor for me was this big change where it was probably the second or third Christmas in New York, and I was super lonely, feeling really alone in a sense of, like, when you're surrounded by people, but you're like, this is not my people. And I remember I was like, the only thing that really resonated with me, made thought of happiness was seeing animals and dogs and what have you walking around. So I called the ASPC out and I said, do you guys do, like, picking up dogs like that. They were like, we need people. The day after Christmas is the biggest rate of return of animals. And I was like, all right, who do I meet? This woman on the side of the street. She's in. She's in like a sprint of van looking thing, no windows. I said, free sex van. What's going on? What the hell's happening?

[A]

You have be careful those vans, bro. You have to be careful.

[B]

No. No tags on another.

[A]

Okay?

[B]

No English either. Now I live in Miami. I'm still, like, a little shitty on the Spanish, but she was like, call me mama is what I understood. I was like, oh, mamacita. No problems. We went and picked dog after dog after dog, up five. Five more stops on the thing. We come to a place, we take a dog, and I hear a dog, like, a squealing sound in a trash can right at the end of the blood. And I'm running down there, and she's running behind me, and she's like. Pushes me back like this. And she opens it up and she puts it back down. Turns to me, and she's like, yours. No paperwork. I was like, mine. And I open it up. It's a little geriatric. She was no more than four months. Jaw hanging, a little skew whiff. Where you at? Come on. Ready? Come on camera. She came out of the trash. There you are, baby.

[A]

There she is.

[B]

Good girl.

[A]

Oh, man.

[B]

So we're now 17 years later.

[A]

17 years.

[B]

17 years later. She came out of a trash can. She was the size of just bigger than my hand. And she lives a life that. Good girl. Good girl. Let's sit you back down. No violence.

[A]

No violence. Don't choose violence today.

[B]

So we. We found each other. And if she could write a memoir. Bitch.

[A]

Dude, I'm gonna tell you something.

[B]

It changed my whole trajectory.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It gave me purpose, having a responsibility. And I just fell in love with the fact that somebody had discarded this being. And I felt discarded. And I was like, that's so. Like, wo be me. I'm discarded. She had enough money to come to New York City.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But I felt like I wasn't in my right place. So, Dogman, we found our thing. And I would bring this bitch everywhere.

[A]

She's here.

[B]

So she's here. She's hiding behind the thing, but she's doing well.

[A]

Cutie man.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's funny because I'm. I. I go deeper when you tell stories like that, right? Like, I'm. I'm hearing it, but I think one of your other gifts is being Able to see the truth or the potential in everyone. And I think it was created in those moments because, you know, you. It's about, you know, seeing a dog in a garbage can, but it's really finding the beauty in that and nursing that dog back to him.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And understanding that you haven't always been understood. You were bullied growing up, and I was bullied a little bit growing up, too. And so people like us, we. We tend to find the beautiful side of people and. And find those gifts, and that's a superpower.

[B]

I appreciate that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I mean, I did have that thought. If I ever found that person that did that, they'd be, like, in the trash can, dismembered. But that's okay. We do. I do have that little split. Split section.

[A]

Yeah, don't we all? Don't we all?

[B]

But I do. I do feel that trajectory started a lot of growth for me, and it started ideas, and at that point, I was surrounded and I was in the door. Not fully in the door, but I was getting paid. Now, you know, we. We fast forward to the part, I think, where all that shit, because I stuck in it and I swam through it all and. And I didn't let it put me six feet under. Did it break me? Yes, at some points it did. I think you can be broken and rebuild.

[A]

I think that's okay.

[B]

Because I don't want to sit here and say, in a sense, that determination, the whole EPI of your part, to me, I was thinking about it coming here and, you know, what does determination mean to me? If I was to think that through this whole cycle, it would be like, you know, push me down, but stay tuned, because I always get back up. Like, I really do have. I'm never going to stop. Yeah, I don't want to stop. I love the life that. All of it, the bad, the goods, the thing, every moment, I really appreciate, you know, and I'm like, sometimes, yeah, I'm exhausted sometimes we all. But I'm like, it's a blessing to, like, have lived so many dreams and so many ways. And I always say, like, now I'm here living in my. In Miami, in Florida. But New York raised me. It. It was 15, 16 years of hell high moments, finding family. Like every major friendship I have stems from there. And it's like, I go back there. I was just back there last week for some press, and I regularly go back. It really is a city that people are like, oh, if you can make it there, and then you're not in New York. Unless you've been there 10 years. I was like, catch me. I'm a half Aussie. I did 16.

[A]

I'm good.

[B]

I think, I think there's a certain dwaravi about New York where people are like, she's a tough city. They're angry. Nobody's nice in New York. I was like, I, I firmly disagree with that. They had a nice. Tell me.

[A]

Oh, come on.

[B]

What you got? What you got? Okay, that'd be nice to you.

[A]

Now, I'm, I'm from California. I just want to clarify. I, I grew up there. No, I was San Francisco Bay loves.

[B]

All right. San Fran. I complain.

[A]

Yeah. So east bay. So like 45 minutes east of San Francisco. Contra Costa County.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

My best interactions in this business have been from publicists and marketing executives and all from New York.

[B]

So it's interesting, bro. That's interesting.

[A]

Like the, the best of the best. They're so nice. They're responsive, they direct. They're direct.

[B]

Okay, so that's, that's people, right?

[A]

But they're kind. I've never, I've never been on the bad side of direct yet. Yet. I'm sure I will never, never. But, but that is so funny that you say that because I find the people in New York that I work with specifically in my business to be super approachable, like to a point where you would even think of texting a publicist that was. Had a full feature in Variety magazine, correct?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You know Sarah, right? Like I'm. Hey, what's up, girl? Like, what's up? Like, she's the one set up the, the one for us next week in, in your studio. But like that's the, that's the misconception, dude. That's a misconception.

[B]

Let it be known. I do say that that plays 50% in your. And who you are too, because.

[A]

Energy, right?

[B]

Energy.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, you said something interesting and I really, for the nature of the show, want to dive into it because you say you, you sat in it and you swam through the.

[B]

I was covered in it.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Sorry.

[A]

I mean that to me. Yeah. That to me though, it's just like anything if you're in the gym or you're trying to run a marathon, you're going to break yourself down. You're gonna, you're gonna be worse before you get better. And I think the problem with adversity is people see it as this never ending loop that they're never going to get out of it. I'm right here, right now and they. And they. And dude, they keep talking about the same thing over and over again. I'm struggling. I'm struggling. I'm screwed. I'm screwed. And guess what happens? They stay there.

[B]

You convince yourself.

[A]

They truly stay there.

[B]

You eat shit.

[A]

I mean, I would wake up every day, today's the day. I still do. I go, today's the day. Something massive pops.

[B]

Because I feel like you're at the. You're at a level here. But I was like, you've got so much more to go. And I'm like, I feel like I'm just starting. I'm 43 years old, damn proud of it. And I've got. So I'm just starting.

[A]

Yeah, dude. I think.

[B]

Just beginning.

[A]

I think there's so much more to me and so much more to the show that hasn't even been touched. Touched yet.

[B]

You've scratched. That scratch has been impactful.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, it's.

[B]

It's been an impactful scratch, but I'm.

[A]

Like, way too shabbies or anything like that, but just.

[B]

Just.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

What is this podcast? What is this? I'm confused. The Determined Society sponsored by Johnson and.

[A]

Johnson, sponsored by Valtrax.

[B]

I was like, something like that.

[A]

It's not really. Just kidding, guys. No, dude, I just think that it's such an important point because in everybody's life, there's. There's individuals right now listening that don't understand what it means to fight through those moments. And. And I'm not here to judge. I'm. I'm here to educate and help. So when you. For you. When you were in. When you. When you were neck deep in shit, what are some of the things that you did every single day? Like little decisions, micro decisions, micro actions that started leading you out?

[B]

Okay, so first major decision I did was eliminate humans and bad seeds in my life. And I think that's harder than one thinks, but easier to action. So, you know, my darkest thing was, like, I was doing cocaine 24 hours a day almost.

[A]

That's crazy.

[B]

I would go into the bathroom, I would do it. I would. I would party on it, and then I'd wake up the next morning and need it to get out of bed.

[A]

I've never done it. I've never done it.

[B]

It's just good, but it ain't right. Sor.

[A]

I've never done that.

[B]

It is what it is, but we good. We good. So where I come from, that story is, though, when you're functioning on that level, imagine the personality I have just being this. I'm. I'm on a 100.

[A]

I can't even. I wouldn't be able to.

[B]

They were living for me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

At that point I was like, doors open, we're ready to go. Yeah. I think what really struck me was that it internalized with me. I started to go. I went to rehab once, I seconded that. Started to just self analyze. And I think when you're sitting in, in those deep moments, start really taking a mental note or write it down. And I was like, I'm doing cocaine in bed with my dog sitting next to me. That's not what this was. Like party. Like when you get to a level of life where you're so like, you've, you have everything in the back, but you're pushing it to the side and like, you start making up to counter, oh, I'm not going out tonight, blah, blah, and you're sitting in solo and wallow mode. It happened like my mind clicked and I was like, this is ridiculous. I will not do this anymore. I should be a bajillionaire by now, but I'd rather spend it on. And when I'm doing this, X, Y and Z happens and I never want to do this again and again and again.

[A]

It's a cycle that you have to.

[B]

It's vicious, but it does. It says so to answer the question, using that as my core, darkest example is to say, sit in that moment, give yourself the ability to, to breathe. I think people get to the point where we're trying to keep up to just survive right now. And if you can just sit there and be like, nothing's going to change till tomorrow anyway or the next day, sit there and just breathe, cry your heart out. But when you get through that little moment, and you will, you will, you know, I believe everybody is innately strong. I don't believe everybody is. And this might be controversial. I don't believe everybody's meant for greatness up on these levels, but I believe greatness is introspective. So when you be like, you know, you've got millions of downloads, you're the number one podcast. So we're looking at what dreams, goals, everything, live in reality is. Is. Is part of this. Because some people are like, I want to be a singer. I want to. You can't hold a note. So, like, sorry, that's not going to happen. Be a realist in your own life. So don't lie to yourself. Live in the reality of what you love. And when you start to kind of look at what people around you, eliminate things early that's called living in things. So when you're in your 30s and you hit your 40s, that's when you really should have things. At least in a better push. At least in a better push. Not everybody has the innate perception to, to really understand how important it is you are, who you surround yourself with. And that takes time. But that also takes time. And when you realize that and you eliminate certain things, it's like this exhale moment. The person that you were doing the bad with or the person that was, you know, emotionally abusing you. Like, there's so many layers to humankind and the reasons we go through teenager, young adult, and the reasons some win, some lose and what have you. For me, it was eliminating people really just getting down to the thing of being okay, talking to yourself up here. And if that, if that makes me certified to be crazy, then made. I know a lot of people that talk to themselves and they're very successful.

[A]

Daily, bro. Daily. And I think another point that I would add for me.

[B]

Yeah. Is.

[A]

Is when I make changes, when they don't stick, it's because I'm shaming the. Out of myself.

[B]

Correct.

[A]

And I'm, you know, like, you know, if I were sitting there at that point with you, you know, if I, if that were me, you know, next to my dog, you know, I was it, I was.

[B]

I. I'm most ashamed.

[A]

I. I bet, I bet. But it's okay to be ashamed in a moment, right? It's okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I think a lot of people struggle with that. It's okay to feel shame, but, but to turn it into a month long shame fest on yourself is really not going to play well. And so I found like, hey, you can feel shame.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But don't shame yourself. I mean, I feel it. I'm like, okay, well now I need to do. This is my problem. I'm going to do this today. I'm going to make it digestible. I'm going to make it, you know, to where I can do this again tomorrow. And then I keep going and I keep going and I would continue on that path and until something broke free.

[B]

It's, it's very indicative of like, I decided to, you know, do a coffee date with a friend in New York City. And I, and I pushed away a lot of people that could have been like lovers, friends, business associates, because I was like, best not to see them. So you take a nighttime thing and you go for a walk with a dog. You go here. I used to live near a big bridge, so, So I was on the Upper east side. We used to walk the bridge back and forth, and that took 45 minutes. And then I would be exhausted and I'd go to sleep. So it's like. It's things like that where you look at and it's taking those principles that you're speaking about and that I'm speaking about and saying, hell, it's okay to not be okay for sure. Secondary to that, your dream is not my dream, your dream is not their dream, and that's okay. But. But you're put on this earth to do something, chase your dream. Don't. Don't diminish what God gave you and the, the body and, and what have you. Like, really. And it took me a long time later in life, so, you know, I put my body and my mind and my everything through hell. And to be able to sit here and say, like, now I'm like, you know, I could be so further along, but I would not. I would not be the human that I am.

[A]

No, it built you ever. It built you.

[B]

I would not be able to be cutthroat in my decision making. And I think that's what differentiates me from everybody.

[A]

You have really good discernment when you're decision making. You're very. I've noticed when I've asked you questions and certain things, it's. The answer's there. It's there. Like, I trust that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like that's somebody I can.

[B]

I trust that in myself now because.

[A]

That'S why we're friends. Right. That's why I can trust. Because I see that in you.

[B]

And that was learned through hard ass, problematic life. And I think that's the best way to be what I am now.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That discernment isn't cocky. It is an ego. It's knowing for a fact if I say I can do this, I'll call this person. I'll get you. This I'm going to do so well, that's the thing.

[A]

Because, like, when you go through things like that, you build up the person that you want to become.

[B]

Correct.

[A]

You have. You have this vision, and for people listening, watching, you have this vision of yourself that you want to be. You want to become. What would that person do? Would it keep his word or her. Her word to yourself? Would you keep your word to your friends? Would you do what you said you're going to do? Is basically what it all boils down to here in life. Like, do what you said you're going to do for others and yourself and your life. Will get pretty damn easy, because guess why. Those two things are very hard to do. It is very hard to do. Keep your word to yourself is the easiest thing to break. Because no one knows. No one knows, dude.

[B]

But we live in such a hustle society. We're on social media, we're looking at this, we're looking at that. I want to be you. You want to be me. Nobody is you, nobody is me. It doesn't really matter. And at 43, I realized I am who I am. I'm broken, I'm scratched, I'm bruised, and I'm pretty damn bloody good at what I do and. And who I am as a human being. Now, I like animals way more than I like humans. You're an exception. I got a few exceptions. But I tell you what. Lock me in with the chimp and the dog, put me on a refuge with a hundred of them, they won't hurt me. You watch. Jane Goodall is the G master of my life. And I look at people like that, and I'd be like, damn, I wonder if I got time to, like, get enough money. And then, you know, by 70, I'm going to open, like, a big ranch somewhere.

[A]

Talk to me about the champ, dude.

[B]

Dude. Another game changer in life. The pandemic happened in 2020. I was scrolling Instagram. I was in LA at this point. Bless California. It's just never been for me. It's. It's a tricky city to. To maneuver, but at a different age.

[A]

This is so hard there, dude. It's very difficult in la.

[B]

And I don't care about access anymore. I'm just. That's. Wasn't. That's not on my bingo card now. I think access comes through relationships and those that were there 20 years ago and now where we are now. And I'm like, oh, we. We got the. We got the dynamic down.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

So I'm scrolling through, and it was fashion. It was February of 2020 when the shit was, is this something? Is this a pandemic? Are we having anything? What's going on? I'm doing a photo shoot. I remember, with Common Electra. I'm here, I'm there, and I'm scrolling. And I saw this chimp, like, in a banana costume on a skateboard, skating. And I was like, is that real? And I looked and it said, zwf Miami. And I was like, I'd been to Miami probably twice in the whole. Nearly now, where in 20 years of living here in America, I'd been to Miami twice. I had no purpose to come here except to meet a chimp. So I go to Fashion Week, I take a flight from New York to Miami. I get in an Uber and this is out in Homestead. If you know anything about Miami. The Homestead is not it? No. Now we're driving, the guy's like, which way? Which way? I said, I don't even know where this place is. He takes a turn into a cornfield and I'm like, wow. It's like fast forward. I was with the guy for five years, but this instance here, I'm like, this is like Jurassic park, bro. This is sick. Come. The gates are there, the whole thing. Now it's a, a refuge for animals. They, you know, and these have become my family. So I go in, I'm a customer for the first thing. Within three days, I'd probably given like $5,500 to just spend 10 minutes with that chimp. Wow. Then I met, this is how I play the skill game. Then I met somebody that worked there who was a volunteer that brought me in the next day and brought the dog in. And I have these videos of all three of us interacting at the very first time. And the chimp takes my jaw like this and we're all kissing like this. And I remember looking at the chimp and I was like, do you want me to come back again? And it was like a yes. I went back to la, alright, maybe never again. The owner of the zoo, Mario to Browi. If you know anything about him, I gotta have him. Come on. Your pod, his life, his base. Well, he is the cocaine cowboy back in the day. Like he's a major player in this town. But he has served his time, done his dues and devoted his life to wildlife. He called me, he goes, the money's having his second birthday, do you want to come? They don't know me at this point. I fly all the way back again. Within six months of that second birthday, I've moved to Miami, dude. It just changed my life. And you asked about balance before. I would show up five days a week if I could there. But I'd be like, night times, mornings, whatever. Take him out running. So imagine from a 2 year old to 9 years old. So just so your audience is aware, Limbani is probably the most famous chimp in the entire world. He has 1.1 million followers on social media. He's gone viral. Gayle King spoken about him. He's been on, you know, the five on Fox. Every network has done a story on him. BBC, we're killing it. So I became his publicist, his best friend, his inbuilt, his inbuilt caretaker. And I remember. So this is interesting. And I want to. You know, I don't like to. Because you like to keep this shit Evergreen. But we are currently December 2025. Yesterday was one year since the day that we surrendered him and did the right thing by him. And he now lives at Save the Chimps. That is Jane Goodall approved. And he has a friend now that's a chimpanzee. He's working towards being on an island with chimpanzees. This is so one year ago. My whole life crumbled again. Wow. One more time. But I didn't do cocaine this time.

[A]

That's good.

[B]

I didn't do this. I didn't do that. So you ask about this chimp. It just changed my life. It was like, that was. I was Auntie. That was my family. And even. Even Gertie was like, you know, he could rip your face up. And I was like. Because he could. Maybe he could.

[A]

He could.

[B]

I mean, you. If you go to my Instagram, it's like, he's. We're like, you know, it's. It was the purest form of love. He would pick her up and, like.

[A]

No way.

[B]

Yeah. I was sent to B roll to interspice. While I'm talking about this, we'd get shot for some reason on the property. There was a shopping trolley from Marshalls. Nobody knows where that ever came from.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But he would put me in the thing, and he would push me in the shopping trolley. And then we take turns. Yeah.

[A]

Ask you a question. Because wildlife's interesting. Right. And I remember in college, I went to lsu, and one of the tailgate days, after baseball practice in the fall, we'd go right across the street, go to Mr. Popcorns.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

His name was Mr. Popcorn.

[B]

All right.

[A]

This dude was serious. He had beer for us, he had a bunch of food, and he had.

[B]

A monkey, I betcha.

[A]

No, he didn't have a monkey.

[B]

What'd he have?

[A]

No. So, like, a couple tailgates down one year. I think it was my last year at lsu.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

There was this, like, tiger cub. Like, this big name was Sable, and you could pay 20 bucks to take pictures with it. And I'm like, oh, I'm paying for that.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

So I went over there and I held this tiger, and I'm just like, dude, I'm literally holding something.

[B]

Yeah. That you're not supposed to, like, I'm.

[A]

Not supposed to be holding. And by the way, like, this thing could maim me. And. And like. And it was liberating. I will never forget that moment. Is one of my favorite moments in my life. Something special about that. So with the champ.

[B]

I know where you're headed with this.

[A]

Yeah. It's like you have this powerful, powerful wild animal. Literally you're submitting your safety to this animal.

[B]

And thus he's submitting to me, saying that I'm one of your caretakers. His origin story, his mother, when she birthed him, he broke the mother's ribs. So somewhere along the line he became not able to go back to the wildlife. So there's chimps that are out and about in these roadside scenarios, which DWF is not that are used like circus toys. And I disapprove highly of that. Now people have said to me and I've received millions of DMs because his videos were go into the billions of views.

[A]

That's crazy.

[B]

I have. My other DM is filled with I hope he kills you. You're a homo. I hope he rips your face. So I have that in one others folder. And then others that are like, you use him like a circus toy. That and then the lovers. So it's like this equal thing. Let me tell you this. Everything that went viral of his was an activity that he was obsessed with. He painted, he chalked, he rode a skateboard. We didn't say get on the skateboard and skate. We didn't say, hey, there's a paintbrush, do what you want. These are all mental enrichment activities. He's already in the scenario. He is. We didn't put him in that scenario. But for nine years we showed him what love felt like. And that is, my friends, your answer. If you ever want to come at me, you want to come at Mario. You want to come at any one of the core five to six people that works with him. That is a total bullshit that we ever did anything to him. The bigger he got the news things. Save Limbani, Peter, save Limbani. The ending of this journey ended with Peter basically having to retract the post that they put on their Instagram because they said we won another one. And so I had the place he went to say show the letter that shows that we brought him there because we made the decision. Mario made the decision. And the reality is there's good and bad in every scenario. Would I have preferred. Would Mario preferred. The reality is with humankind and human people, the wildlife is not really that anymore. It's so foresting and deforestation and tourists going in now into. Into South African jungles and Rwandan jungles, doing tours with big ass gorillas. I'm like, this is. That distinction has been lost. Maybe it was a part of the problem, maybe I wasn't. But what I did give the world for eight years, six, seven, you know, seven, eight years, was a portrait of love that has, funnily enough. You take all these wildlife people, most of them have stayed on my fashion journey, my PR journey. And they're rooting for me, and they're rooting for Limbani. And I was told life books. I've got so many books in me and so many moments. But that chimpanzee, like, gives me hair still. I mean, I haven't seen him at this date. I went back probably too soon. We dropped him in this very time last year. I went back for my birthday. The understanding was he was hugging me. He was this. It's a. No contact anymore. Can even like reach out and touch his fingers because he is a chimp. And I didn't want. And we all discussed collectively, I didn't want to push him back in his progress. And now we see him with, you know, another big ass chimp called Tuffy. And they're like pulling each other's asses. And like.

[A]

That'S hard, man.

[B]

I intend to see him in January. I would like to. I don't know whether my psyche can handle it. Yeah, I think for me and Mario and I speak about it, perhaps that's a chapter. So when he gets to one of the islands where he'll be living free and wild, maybe I can see it always. It gets me emotional. Maybe I could see him from afar. Man, it changed my life so much. Sorry. This is just came out of me.

[A]

It's amazing, man.

[B]

It's the biggest thing I've ever done and ever will do in my entire life. And I'm so grateful to you, Lambani. No matter what the world thought.

[A]

Oh, you know, Matt, and, and, and thank you for that. No, no apology needed, dude. Like, the, the bottom line is.

[B]

Been trying to hold that in for a second.

[A]

I, I've been, I know I've been feeling it brewing. It doesn't matter what the world thinks or the world thought because you know your intentions and you know what was going on. And then this is a little bit of a lesson for everybody that does listen to the show. Guys, if you're an audience of this podcast, please don't ever pop into Buddy's DMs or in their Comments and spew some hatred bullshit like, that's not what we're about here. This is not what America should be like. It's not what the world should be like. What we should do is potentially say, you know what? I bet you there's more to the story. I bet you there's more to the story than what I'm seeing because people are just going happy and calling you, unfortunately, I hope you ripped your face off. Calling you, you know, derogatory terms, that's just.

[B]

It's.

[A]

It's wild to me. But. But, dude, to have something in your life that has given you so much love and so much joy.

[B]

Purpose, my man. It's given me purpose and it's made me a better publicist, a better friend, a better human being. Totally. Because I have respect for what people's time and understanding because of the way we communicated. We're talking. I can listen to you. I can see you do that. His would be touch, and that's it.

[A]

But you're learning energy too, though, right? Because you know what I'm saying?

[B]

That's why you can pick up. You can pick up. I can see people's energy.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And understand, like, you're not good for me.

[A]

That was a gift. That's a gift.

[B]

He gave that to me.

[A]

He gave it to you. You know, so it's like, I just. I just find it fascinating, you know what I mean?

[B]

Because my regret is you weren't around in my life at that time. I know you and the kids would have.

[A]

That would have been so cool.

[B]

Ape. No pun intended.

[A]

That would have been so.

[B]

It would have been amazing.

[A]

It was so freaking cool.

[B]

We can go visit him at the other place. We just can't see. The other place is hundreds of chimps together that are every name a chimp that was in a movie. It's the way Limbani is now. Jim Crazy. The one that was with Robin Williams. Yeah. Wow. It makes me happy. It's just. I always wonder does. Does he cry? And I spoke to a girl that works there and they're like, every now and then he'll sit in a corner and think. And I'm like, oh, he thinking about us?

[A]

Yeah. Yeah, I bet you he is.

[B]

He crosses my mind every now and then and I'm like, keep going. I'm working.

[A]

Yeah, I'm working, man. That's impactful, dude. I just think that little thing. It's not a little thing, but I'm just going to call little things like that. It builds who we are and it's so funny because before we hop on, we talked about, like, so many different layers we can go through, but in. In so many different directions we can go with this episode here. But I truly feel the overarching theme is building yourself as a true human being of who you want to be. Like, that has been.

[B]

That's big and important.

[A]

Yeah. It's massive. And it doesn't matter how you do it. Well, hopefully it's constructive, I think.

[B]

Constructive, yes.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, that should be a. That should be a prerequisite. Right. Good Lord. Like, do it the right way.

[B]

We got a problem.

[A]

We got a problem here. But I just. I just think that there's so many different lessons, so I just really want to empower the audience to not prejudge any situation that they're about to get into or do, like, oh, this isn't going to help. This is stupid. You may pass on an opportunity. You may already pass on an opportunity that's going to really enrich your life.

[B]

Be. Be open if in. To close this with anything. Obviously, my. I've had some big moments, but my chimpanzee could be your walk down the street or meeting somebody at a coffee shop that you take. You take the chimp in the seven years out of it and say, like, that was a defining relationship that I had. If you're looking at life and you're looking at understanding how you can be the best version of yourself, which I think you were saying, this is the underlying thing for me, showing up, stepping into what your greatness is. And that's different for everybody.

[A]

Everybody.

[B]

And levels upon levels. So I'm not even saying, like, your ambition might be have a roof over your head and have a beautiful family. That's iconic.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

That's like, why is it not, dude?

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like, my mother taught me that, bless her. She said, not everybody has grandiose and those big dreams. And because I would used to be like this. What is wrong with that person now? I appreciate that life is made up of all of this. I've never had any ounce of, like, not jealousy, not hatred, not. I'm better than you. So don't judge anybody's story if you don't really know anything. Nobody's a director of anybody else's life. Nobody. There.

[A]

There's a place. There's a place and a thing for everybody. And it's funny because, you know, there's a lot of people that wouldn't want to do what I do, and there's a lot of spouses that wouldn't want their spouse doing what I do.

[B]

Having gays on, talking about crying chimpanzees having. That's a rip.

[A]

This son of a Dude, listen, I love the gay.

[B]

I'm giving you.

[A]

This is a great clip.

[B]

I'm giving you guys.

[A]

It's a great clip.

[B]

I know you do. We good?

[A]

I lost my train of thought with this son of a.

[B]

Welcome to the German society. I'm Sean Fresh. Thanks for tuning in.

[A]

Matt Dylan, everybody. My wife will get, you know, things thrown at her from her friends. Like, how do you do this? His Instagram's massive. There's got to be people popping into his DMs. Does he travel? It's like. And she goes, I got to worry about him.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, he doesn't have a bad bone in his body. Everybody has a different path. But my point is with this, when we talk about, and this is a question that I hate, when you're at like a get together and another man comes up to you and goes, what do you do? I hate that question. I hate because, because you know what it is? It's a dick measuring competition. It's all it is. It's all it is. I want people to come up to me like, hey, what are the, what are you teaching your kids right now? Like, what are you and your kids reading? Like, what are you guys going through right now?

[B]

Have a great day. How are you? I think start with some empathetic situation.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. What's your name?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's just funny because, you know, there's a lot of people. My, my, my long drawn out point is a lot of people look down on others for not doing things that are as big. And this is air quoted for people that are listening as big.

[B]

Right.

[A]

It's like, but I can look at, my wife was an amazing salesperson. Now she's a badass teacher. Well, that's her passion right now. Go be the best you can be because the kids need a really great teacher. Those are heroes.

[B]

I got a lot of respect for her for that. I have a primary degree education.

[A]

I know, I did read that.

[B]

Don't worry about that. I mean, God, can you imagine me as a primary school teacher?

[A]

Oh my God, that's hysterical.

[B]

Shut up.

[A]

I don't think you'd be that way.

[B]

I think I'd have an amazing time, but I'd pick the favor and be like, what's wrong with you guys? Like some ambition.

[A]

You'd be the kindergarten teacher that every book was about a chimp.

[B]

That'd be amazing. Come on. That's. That's live chimps, good people. Podcasting, television.

[A]

And Mama, let's bring her up for the. Yeah, bring her up for the finale, man. Oh, mama, you. You.

[B]

What do you got to say? Say, thanks, Daddy, for changing my life.

[A]

Give him his flowers on air, Mama.

[B]

I'll give her her flowers.

[A]

No, but, man, I just think that, you know, there's so many great people, so many great things that they're doing. You know, I. It's so funny. Like, I. I go in little small things, dude, in the morning every garbage day. Like, I'll go outside, and if I run into, like, what's up, boys? Like, what's going on, man? And like. But then other people just diss the. Out of them, like, oh, here's another bag. And they put on the ground. I was like, yeah, like, they are not your servant. They're act. They're actually doing really well for themselves.

[B]

Let me tell you, anyone in that service like that is making good money.

[A]

They're making great money.

[B]

I want to be a window cleaner up high on the. On the rooftops, because I could make more monies in a couple hours.

[A]

Look at that, dude.

[B]

Yeah, they make danger money.

[A]

Yeah, I know.

[B]

Danger money.

[A]

Keep it. Keep it. Keep that, man. I'm not. I'm not all about that.

[B]

I mean, clearly, I'm on a theme. Champs thing. I want to clean windows at the top of the thing.

[A]

That's just crazy to me. That's just great. I'm gonna stay on the ground.

[B]

And he's like, let's walk a red carpet. Yes.

[A]

What else you got going on, man?

[B]

You know, to wrap it up, let's. Let's just say PR business is great. Fashion business is great. The MD Effect changed my life. And. And to sum that up really fast, the MD Effect is a. It's a curated approach to making others capable of wearing, looking, and understanding fashion. So it's like small, medium, large, extra, extra, wherever you lie on that black, white, Chinese, whatever, whoever you are. Fashion is an integral part of life, but it's so much more than that. It's. It's about feeling good and really loving who you are. And I think I started this because I didn't love who I was. I love. And now I love who I am, dude. I truly can look at that and be like, I love the man I've become because it took a long time to find him.

[A]

I feel that, dude. I feel that. I always love how.

[B]

Little lady.

[A]

Yeah, little lady. It's always great, you know, Just what you said there was. You know, I started this because I wasn't happy with who I was or I didn't love myself. And it's like a lot of great things. Most great things are originated out of some source of pain.

[B]

Bonkers, right?

[A]

Like, I. I mean, dude, this show was started out of an extreme amount of pain.

[B]

And look at the joy you bring people now and the education and the perspectives that come. And I must say, you have a greater potential and reach because you feel like you're somebody's best mate. And that, my friend, is your power gift. Yeah. And I'm. I've learned so much sitting here with you, I didn't think I'd ball on. I was not planning on doing half the things or discussing half the shit that I did. But you really make somebody feel seen, and I appreciate that. And I hope that in my life, in my career, that I, you know, can do that for everybody, not just the people that are in front of me, that I can do that for everybody, because I think that's the greatest gift. We can leave anybody being seen feeling important and just that. What else is there?

[A]

Ah, I hear you, man. Oh, I appreciate that, dude. I really do.

[B]

It's the truth.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

One thing I don't do.

[A]

No, I don't.

[B]

I'd be like, this is a waste of my goddamn time.

[A]

Like, you ain't it, bro. You ain't it.

[B]

You are it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And a bag of chips for sure, bro.

[A]

Let's take it higher, man. Let's get it.

[B]

We are. Don't worry. Stay tuned.

[A]

Stay tuned.

[B]

MDffect.com the MDffect.com. listen, I got a lot going on. Follow me at Matt Dillon, 1983 on social. I want to do books. I want to do the whole thing. I want to come into this 2026 period and really look at life and take some time for me now, too. So really kind of not the balance word, but really pick and choose what serves me mentally. So it really keeps the. The engines churning. And that's really it. There's no big. There's no big formula in life, I think. Pick things that make you happy.

[A]

My big thing for you, man, Chase presence.

[B]

He's gonna make me cry again.

[A]

This presence, man. Change. Not presents, not like gold.

[B]

No presence.

[A]

Presence.

[B]

Cnc, whatever. You spell that. Always being revealed.

[A]

Well, he's been found out. No, but, man, thank you so much, dude. You're a friend, man. I love you, buddy. And for the audience, share the show with somebody. You know, love and trust go follow him at @Matt Dylan 1983. Go check him out MD effect.com and go listen to his show the Fashionably Late Pod. I was on it. It's a good one. And always guys, I appreciate everything you guys do with sharing the show, telling your friends about it. Keep sharing this thing out guys, and until next time, stay deter.