Summary4 min read

Summary of "CEO Diaries: LinkedIn Founder Reid Hoffman: The Truth About Elon, Zuck, & Building Great Companies!"

Podcast Title: The Diary Of A CEO with Steven Bartlett
Episode Title: CEO Diaries: LinkedIn Founder Reid Hoffman: The Truth About Elon, Zuck, & Building Great Companies!
Host: Steven Bartlett (DOAC)
Guest: Reid Hoffman, Founder of LinkedIn
Release Date: May 21, 2025

Introduction

In this compelling episode of The Diary Of A CEO, host Steven Bartlett engages in an insightful conversation with Reid Hoffman, the visionary founder of LinkedIn. They delve into the diverse spectrum of entrepreneurial success, contrasting the leadership styles of iconic figures like Elon Musk and Steve Jobs. The discussion offers a nuanced exploration of what it takes to build and sustain great companies, highlighting the inherent trade-offs involved in different leadership approaches.

Diverse Definitions of Success

Reid Hoffman emphasizes that success isn't monolithic and can manifest in various forms depending on the entrepreneur's strengths and focus areas.

Quote:
Reid Hoffman (B): "No entrepreneur wins at every game. Generally speaking, as an entrepreneur, you should try to play the games that you have a massive competitive edge on." (01:19)

Hoffman illustrates this by comparing different entrepreneurs:

Anil Bhusri (Workday): Focused on cultural coherence and professional environment.
Elon Musk: Driven by grand, ambitious ideas with unwavering conviction, even if they seem improbable.

Leadership Styles: Elon Musk vs. Steve Jobs

The conversation contrasts Elon Musk's and Steve Jobs' approaches to leadership and company building.

Elon Musk

Visionary Ambition: Musk is characterized by his grand visions, such as terraforming Mars, which, while seemingly impossible, demonstrate his commitment to pushing technological boundaries.
Relentless Drive: His approach is all-encompassing, diving deeply into technological sophistication and working against the odds.
Impact on Teams: Musk's high-intensity style leads to mixed employee experiences—some view working for him as the best professional experience, while others consider it the worst due to burnout and being treated as disposable assets.
- Quote:
  Reid Hoffman: "He has the same level of 'I am 1000% right'... And I may be the unique person to make it happen." (04:21)
- On Employee Treatment:
  Reid Hoffman: "They [employees] are all, I never want to work for him again. Right... he's looking at them as disposable parts." (06:18)

Steve Jobs

People-Centric Hiring: Jobs excelled in hiring and building cohesive teams, ensuring that the foundation of his companies was solid and culturally aligned.
- Example from Transcript: Anil Bhusri at Workday conducts cultural interviews to maintain coherence among the first 500 hires, showcasing a thoughtful approach to team building.

Building Great Companies: The Balance of Strengths and Trade-offs

The discussion highlights the importance of entrepreneurs leveraging their strengths while acknowledging and managing the trade-offs that come with different leadership styles.

Reid Hoffman: Advocates for a collaborative and constructive approach to working with others, aiming to build lasting professional relationships without burning bridges.
- Quote:
  Reid Hoffman: "I try to work with people in a way that even when we're at a difficult moment... my goal is to work with people like Brian Chesky, Mark Pincus, et cetera. I want to be able to work with them for the rest of our lives." (06:34)
Host's Insight:
Steven Bartlett: Points out that extreme dedication to entrepreneurial ventures often involves significant trade-offs, such as personal well-being and sustainable work environments.

The Importance of Self-Awareness in Leadership

Both Hoffman and Bartlett touch upon the necessity of self-awareness for entrepreneurs to recognize the darkness or hidden costs associated with their relentless pursuit of success.

Host's Observation:
Steven Bartlett: "We almost never talk about the trade-off... the darkness." (08:15)
Reid Hoffman's Agreement:
Reid Hoffman: "That is 100% correct... you can be very." (09:00)

Contrasting Experiences: Elon Musk vs. Mark Zuckerberg

The conversation wraps up by contrasting the leadership and employee experiences under Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg.

Elon Musk: Known for his high-pressure environment that can lead to employee burnout and a feeling of disposability.
Mark Zuckerberg: Viewed as providing an exceptional working experience where employees are motivated and eager to collaborate in the long term.

Conclusion

This episode offers a deep dive into the multifaceted nature of entrepreneurial success and leadership. Reid Hoffman provides valuable perspectives on how different approaches can lead to varying outcomes both for the companies and their employees. The discussion underscores the importance of leveraging individual strengths, being mindful of the inherent trade-offs, and maintaining self-awareness to build enduring and impactful organizations.

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

Reid Hoffman on Entrepreneurial Focus:
"No entrepreneur wins at every game... play the games that you have a massive competitive edge on." (01:19)
On Elon Musk's Vision:
"I am 1000% right... I may be the unique person to make it happen." (04:21)
On Treating Employees:
"They are all... I never want to work for him again." (06:18)
Reid's Approach to Collaboration:
"My goal is to work with people... for the rest of our lives." (06:34)
On Trade-offs in Entrepreneurship:
"We almost never talk about the trade-off... the darkness." (08:15)

Timestamp Reference

For easy navigation, here are the key moments mentioned in the summary:

01:19 - Discussion on diverse definitions of success.
04:21 - Reid Hoffman talks about Elon Musk's unwavering confidence.
06:18 - Employee experiences under Elon Musk.
06:34 - Reid Hoffman's collaborative approach.
08:15 - The importance of acknowledging trade-offs.
09:00 - Further discussion on leadership styles.

This summary encapsulates the essence of the conversation between Steven Bartlett and Reid Hoffman, providing listeners and readers alike with a comprehensive understanding of the key themes and insights discussed in the episode.

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Transcript33 lines

[00:00]
A
There's a reason I love today's conversation. It is with the founder of a platform that we probably all use called LinkedIn. And the guy that made that platform is Reid Hoffman. The reality of running a small business is that switching off is never really an option. Even when you try the ideas, the excitement and all the responsibility is always there. And because you're always switched on, it's only fair that your hiring partner should be too. LinkedIn jobs who are the sponsor of this moments episode has been that hiring partner for me and for years. Because it's always working away in the background making my team can post our jobs for free, share them with our networks and reach top talent all in the same place. So let's get into today's conversation on all these great people you've worked with specifically during that PayPal period of your life. One of the things I was reflecting on is they're all independently successful people, but they're all very different people. And that in and of itself is evidence that there's not one version of success 100%. There's many different types of success. Presumably there's many different types of entrepreneur leader. Give me a flavor of the different types of entrepreneurs you've worked with and what you know, because I sat with Walter Isaacson and he talked to me about Steve Jobs, Elon Musk, et cetera. And it was like, Steve's really great at hiring people. Elon's not as good at the people team building part, but he's better at this part.
[01:20]
B
Yes. So no entrepreneur wins at every game. Generally speaking, as an entrepreneur, you should try the wimp to play the games that you have a massive competitive edge on. Same thing is true. So some people, for example, like take Anil Bushri at Workday, right? He is thoughtful, intentionally cultural building, very professional. So it's a HR product for work. His contrarian idea was going to the cloud and that people were going to do cloud software. Um, for the first, I think it was 500 people that workday hired, he would always do a cultural interview at the end because to make sure that the first 500 people all kind of shared cultural things. So once you get through all the competence and all the rest of the stuff, he would make sure that was a fit. And that's part of how you get cultural coherence. That's like one example, right? Another example, Elon, is the like, I have a big idea and I convince myself 100% that it's absolutely going to be the case. Like I am going to Settle Mars. We're going to terraform Mars in our lifetime, which is. No, it's impossible. No human being on the planet, including Elon, is going to do that within Elon's lifetime. Right. But I'm going to go all in. I'm going to work really hard. I'm going to be technologically sophisticated. I'm going to work against the odds. Right. In order to make that work. That's a, you know, Anil. Very professional, understands the workplace. Mark Elon, like, I think I was like, the second person he pitched SpaceX to. And his pitch, though, to my defense, was, I'm going to send a turtle to Mars. And I'm like, that's not a business. And you're competing with national governments and, like, Russian subsidized rocket programs and so forth. This is not a good. I was wrong, he was right. But it's not a good equity, you know, kind of play.
[03:25]
A
He pitched it to you as an investor?
[03:27]
B
Yes. Yeah.
[03:29]
A
At what point was SpaceX at when he pitched it?
[03:32]
B
That was before he started it.
[03:33]
A
So it was an idea.
[03:34]
B
Yes. And I'm going to send a turtle to Mars. And then it became, I'm going to send a gelatinous cube with plant seeds in it to Mars because they'll grow. I'll be the first person who will send life to Mars. And you're like, okay, Right.
[03:46]
A
What did you think, genuinely, when he said that to you?
[03:50]
B
I thought he'd gone off his rocker.
[03:53]
A
Really? Well, yeah, of course you would. Yeah, my friend said that to me. I think I'd make a couple of calls just to check in. Do you know what I mean? Like, is Elon doing okay? He just told me about this turtle.
[04:03]
B
Yes. It's like, that's not a business.
[04:06]
A
Has your opinion of him changed over time in terms of his potential and ability as an entrepreneur?
[04:14]
B
No, no. I've always thought of him as one of the world's great entrepreneurs.
[04:18]
A
Always.
[04:19]
B
Yeah. All the way back to PayPal days.
[04:21]
A
Really?
[04:22]
B
Yeah, yeah. No, look, he has done repetitively amazing things. Now he pitches everything with the same level of certainty. Right. Like, you know, I have this idea for online banking. I have this idea for boring tunnels under cities. I have this idea for creating a pneumatic tube for hyperloop tubes. All of them. He has the same level of I am 1000% right. That this is, like, guaranteed to be part of the future. Right. And I, you know, and I may be the unique person to make it happen. Right. So you have to have some discernment but he's his, you know, on base.
[04:58]
A
Batting is pretty good for such major.
[05:01]
B
Ideas, but it's not, it's not 100%.
[05:04]
A
Yeah. People kind of excuse that though. Of course, if you get, if you.
[05:08]
B
Get one that's big, that's fine. Right? Yeah.
[05:12]
A
On the hiring side, has he been, is he up there with the best or is he not a direct hire of people like Steve Jobs was.
[05:21]
B
He hires well, matter of fact, you can't be a great entrepreneur and not ultimately hire well. I think some people are better hires. Some people also have, like, are the kind of people that people would work for forever. Elon tends to burn people out a lot. Like, there's lots of burnt out people in his wake. And when you go and talk to those people, what you hear is some people say that was the best work experience ever and I never want to work for him again. And other people say that was the worst work experience ever and I never want to work for him again. So the they're all, I never want to work for him again. Right. So as kind of a dynamic because he basically looks at them as disposable parts and go as hard as you can, and then afterwards you're out. Don't care.
[06:18]
A
Because he goes so hard.
[06:20]
B
Yeah, he goes hard. But he also thinks your only relevance to me is your relevance. Your only relevance to me is, can you help me with my mission? And after you're done, after you can no longer help me with my mission, you're not relevant to me anymore.
[06:33]
A
What do you think of that approach?
[06:34]
B
Not stop. My approach, right. LinkedIn mirrors my approach. Like literally, I am referenceable by every entrepreneur that I've ever worked with. Right. As a board member and as an investor. Right. Who, you know, even ones that I've like, fired as CEO and so forth. Those people will say he was really good to work with on these things. They may also have some critical things. There's no problem with that. Right. But like, like, literally, like when I'm pitching an entrepreneur, I like call anyone that I've worked with because you. I try to work with people in a way that even when we're at a, at a, at a difficult moment because I disagree with them intensely about how well they're doing or what they're doing or something else that I'm doing it in a collaborative, constructive way. And so my goal is to work with people like anyone I want to work with, Brian Chesky, Mark Pincus, et cetera. I want to be able to work with them for the rest of our lives.
[07:41]
A
What's interesting is I think these strategies fundamentally come down to what you think matters in life the most. Because you could optimize, even you could optimize more for building more companies or something at the expense of something else. And it's a trade off of something else. Like you could go harder. Yes, but there's a trade off happening here. And we often, because Elon's done these crazy things like the cars and the neural links and there's tunnels and now the AI and the X and the spaceships and stuff, we go, oh my God, that's so amazing. And I do that as well. As an entrepreneur, one person can do that much. But we almost never talk about the trade off.
[08:16]
B
Yes, yep, you're 100% right.
[08:18]
A
And we. And it's so this goes back to the point about self awareness. It's like you, it's so tempting for the, like the brain to go, oh my God, I want that. That's what I want. Because you're not seeing the trade off, you're not seeing the darkness.
[08:31]
B
That is 100% correct. And look, I respect it. I understand the burn people out, like, treat them as disposable assets that when they burn out, you just jettison them. And you can be very. Elon's not the only entrepreneur who is very successful doing that. Right. But for example, on the other side, like, if you go to Mark Zuckerberg and you talk to the people who work for him, they're like, that was great. That was the best working experience in my life. Of course I work with him again.
[09:00]
A
Interesting. I hope you found today's conversation helpful and insightful. If you're Ready to join 2 1/2 million other small businesses already using LinkedIn for hiring, head over to LinkedIn.comddoac. now that's LinkedIn.comdoac to find your next exceptional hire.