The Diary Of A CEO with Steven Bartlett: Episode with Mike Baker (Ex-CIA Spy)

Release Date: November 28, 2024

In this riveting episode of The Diary Of A CEO, host Steven Bartlett engages in a profound conversation with Mike Baker, a former CIA officer turned corporate spy. Baker delves into his extensive experience in intelligence, offering listeners a unique perspective on geopolitical tensions, corporate espionage, and the intricate interplay between intelligence work and business strategy. This detailed summary captures the essence of their discourse, highlighting key discussions, insightful analyses, and thoughtful conclusions.

1. Mike Baker’s CIA Career and Skill Transfer

Timestamp: 00:00 - 02:45

Mike Baker opens up about his early days in the CIA, joining at the age of 22 in the early 1980s. He recounts his responsibilities within the Operations Directorate, emphasizing the agency’s role in gathering intelligence to inform strategic decisions. Baker explains how his CIA training—focused on targeted manipulation, psychological profiling, and deal-closing—parallels essential business skills.

Mike Baker [00:45]: "People are capable of it, more so than they realize. But there's a lot of similarities between what I used to do in the spy world and what you do in business."

2. From Intelligence to Corporate Espionage

Timestamp: 02:26 - 27:10

Transitioning from his CIA career, Baker discusses his venture into corporate espionage, branded as "strategic intelligence and investigations." He elaborates on how companies now seek intelligence to navigate international investments, assess risks, and outperform competitors. Baker underscores the ethical boundaries and legal considerations that differentiate corporate espionage from governmental operations.

Mike Baker [24:21]: "You have to know what is legally appropriate in each jurisdiction. And that changes."

3. Understanding Geopolitical Threats

Timestamp: 00:00 - 87:26

a. Current Conflicts and Power Dynamics

Baker provides a comprehensive analysis of ongoing geopolitical tensions, particularly focusing on China, Russia, and Iran. He asserts that China is already at war with the West through economic and ideological strategies, while Russia's aggressive posture in Ukraine exemplifies this covert conflict.

Mike Baker [05:24]: "If you don't think about that, if you don't understand that, then I think it's hard to close the deal with anybody."

b. The Ukraine War: Origins, Progress, and Predictions

Delving deep into the Ukraine conflict, Baker outlines Russia’s motivations rooted in Putin’s desire to restore Soviet-era influence and establish a buffer against NATO. He assesses the current state of the war, highlighting Ukraine's resilience bolstered by US and NATO support. Predicting a likely negotiated settlement by 2025, Baker remains skeptical about its satisfaction level for all parties involved.

Mike Baker [56:16]: "I think in this coming year, I think in part, I know I've talked a lot about what the Ukrainians are suffering from, but there are reasons why Putin is going to need to figure this out as well."

c. China and Taiwan: The 2049 Plan

Baker discusses China's long-term objectives concerning Taiwan, referencing the ominous 2049 timeline. He explores the potential scenarios of military confrontation versus gradual assimilation, stressing the strategic importance of Taiwan in China's vision for regional dominance.

Mike Baker [58:24]: "They want the reunification, the absorption of Taiwan, the taking over of Taiwan."

d. Nuclear Threats and Proliferation

A significant portion of the dialogue addresses nuclear weapon concerns. Baker highlights the precarious nature of nuclear proliferation, especially with Iran's ongoing efforts and North Korea's involvement. He warns against the normalization of nuclear arsenal displays, emphasizing the catastrophic potential of accidental or deliberate use.

Mike Baker [83:20]: "You're developing a playbook that says in the event that it should happen and we have a global conflict, we are going to shut down everything we can shut down in the US."

4. The Role of Disinformation and Social Media

Timestamp: 109:25 - 124:18

Baker critically examines the impact of social media platforms like TikTok in modern disinformation campaigns. He argues that algorithms fostering echo chambers exacerbate societal divisions, making populations more susceptible to manipulation by foreign adversaries. Drawing parallels to traditional propaganda, Baker emphasizes the accelerated and pervasive nature of digital misinformation.

Mike Baker [112:20]: "Social media is a real jumpstart. The concept is the same. I'm trying to influence opinion, I'm trying to get viewers, whatever it is, trying to change hearts and minds, but you can do it much faster."

He advises listeners to cultivate skepticism and verify information from multiple sources to mitigate the effects of such campaigns.

5. Personal Insights and Leadership Advice

Timestamp: 119:31 - 132:50

Towards the episode's conclusion, Baker shifts focus to personal development and leadership. Reflecting on his upbringing, he attributes much of his success to his parents' exemplary work ethic and loyalty. Baker imparts valuable advice on making decisive decisions under pressure, emphasizing simplicity and the importance of defining clear missions—principles he honed during his CIA tenure and applied to his business endeavors.

Mike Baker [125:14]: "My job as a parent is not to raise average kids. There's enough mediocrity out there. My job is to raise exceptional children... work a little bit harder than everyone else."

He also touches upon the significance of genuine empathy and listening skills in both personal and professional contexts, highlighting their role in effective leadership and relationship-building.

6. Closing Reflections

Timestamp: 133:27 - End

In the final moments, Steven Bartlett and Mike Baker exchange heartfelt sentiments. Baker shares personal stories about his family, underscoring the foundational values that drive his approach to life and business. The episode concludes with a mutual appreciation for the importance of character, resilience, and the relentless pursuit of excellence.

Mike Baker [132:50]: "If you can pass that sense of loyalty, of appreciation, of duty, of hard work, of honesty, if you can pass that along to your kids, you've done your job."

Notable Quotes

• Mike Baker [00:45]: "People are capable of it, more so than they realize. But there's a lot of similarities between what I used to do in the spy world and what you do in business."

• Mike Baker [05:24]: "If you don't think about that, if you don't understand that, then I think it's hard to close the deal with anybody."

• Mike Baker [24:21]: "You have to know what is legally appropriate in each jurisdiction. And that changes."

• Mike Baker [56:16]: "I think in this coming year, I think in part, I know I've talked a lot about what the Ukrainians are suffering from, but there are reasons why Putin is going to need to figure this out as well."

• Mike Baker [83:20]: "You're developing a playbook that says in the event that it should happen and we have a global conflict, we are going to shut down everything we can shut down in the US."

• Mike Baker [125:14]: "My job as a parent is not to raise average kids... work a little bit harder than everyone else."

Conclusion

This episode of The Diary Of A CEO offers an unparalleled glimpse into the mind of a former CIA operative navigating the complexities of modern geopolitics and corporate strategy. Mike Baker's insights bridge the worlds of intelligence and business, providing listeners with actionable lessons on decision-making, risk assessment, and the critical importance of understanding global threats. Whether you're a business leader, an aspiring entrepreneur, or simply curious about the intricacies of international relations, this conversation equips you with the knowledge to navigate an increasingly polarized and complex world.