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- [00:00]
A
All those clients that are already loyal. When you do have something like Valentine's Day and there is limited space, we should always be offering those spaces to our loyal clients because they deserve it more than anyone else. And for those people doing families, even pets, I've seen so many studios do so well for Valentine's Day with pet photography. People just need a reason to come in and they want a reason to have artwork.
- [00:27]
B
Hey, difference makers. Welcome back to the Difference Maker Revolution podcast. And today we are getting very romantic with Ronan and Steve, because Valentine's Day is only around the corner. Steve, what are we talking about? It's own. It's still 2025. Valentine's Day is over and done.
- [00:51]
A
Well, from a marketing point of view, being prepared for Valentine's Day probably should have already happened, really, because Once we enter 2026, it is pretty much the first thing on the calendar and businesses.
- [01:10]
C
Steve and Jonathan, as you guys know, we have a packaging business and we're already producing Easter egg cartons.
- [01:19]
A
Right.
- [01:20]
B
I haven't shopped in at the time of recording this.
- [01:26]
A
I'm shocked they're not already in store yet.
- [01:29]
C
They are. We've been doing them for quite some time. We're actually at the back end of that now, so. And they'll be starting in January, producing cartons for all the chocolate for next Christmas.
- [01:42]
A
Oh, wow. Wow. So as you say, Steve, other industries. Other industries are well ahead of the game, aren't they? Well ahead of the game. So, you know, Valentine's Day is really around the corner because really, in January, February. Well, it's in February, but January, to get those alliances happening and to get yourself ready. It's almost. Almost too late for some, but there's still a few things that we can do to prepare ourselves then.
- [02:17]
C
Some people. Some people want to celebrate Valentine's with their artwork rather than. I think a lot of photographers that we talk to think that the Valentine's gift is the experience. Right. When a lot of couples or individuals may want it as a Valentine's gift for their loved one. Right?
- [02:40]
A
Yeah. It can go either way. It could be the gift, um, or it could be, you know, the experience, which starts on the phone. We all know that it all starts on the phone. So getting the artwork back in time means that the labs open when? January. Oh, first week of January, isn't it? They're back. Yeah. And so first week of January. So they're going to need a couple of weeks to get to. Well, I know Loxley can. Can get something back in a couple of Weeks. But also with the three XM boxes, it's the fastest turnaround time because you can have them stockpiled, but just.
- [03:27]
C
Yeah, or, you know, most people now using three XM volume boxes, we're doing the printing as well. So no, we quote 12 working days. So you need to allow that two weeks, you know, to get them there. So. And you need to market, so you need to get the marketing done to get those conversations from, you know, your existing clients that you can invite back in again. That's the key thing is, see that often people overlook. So let's start with the existing clients. No such thing as past clients. A difference maker revelation.
- [03:59]
A
No, no. All those clients that are already loyal. When you do have something like Valentine's Day and there is limited space, we always be offering those spaces to our loyal clients because they deserve it more than anyone else. And for those people doing families, even pets, I've seen so many studios do so well for Valentine's Day with pet photography. People just need a reason to, to come in and they want a reason to have artwork. And for a lot of people, even, even your pet clients, they will come in for Valentine's Day and celebrate, celebrate Valentine's Day with the most loyal love in their life.
- [04:54]
B
So how do we give them that reason? What should we be doing with our current clients to give them that reason to come back in for Valentine's Day or before, like before Valentine's Day, we.
- [05:06]
A
Need to have that list ready, Jono, and we need to be contacting them and sending them an offer. Now everybody has in their heads or, you know, at least a handful of people that really were and have been great clients and reaching out to them on the phone or sending a message via what you would normally send messages to clients with text emails and just getting out there and contacting them. Now I think a lot of people send an email blast to their entire database, which I don't particularly like. I much prefer that, you know, we take segments, manageable segments, so then that way we can follow those VIP clients up with a phone call and, and trickling them out into manageable, manageable amounts. So then that way we're maximizing our database all the time, but we should be flagging all year round. So if, if you haven't done it yet, making sure that you're adding tags for those people that you know and have said that they're always looking for something for Valentine's Day. And these people turn up all year round. And so we used to have a list of people that we knew would want to come in for Valentine's Day because we tagged our database. Which you can do on the engine, right?
- [06:44]
C
Yeah. And Jonathan, I find that a lot of people need a new memory chip because somehow it's ingrained on the memory chip that they have in their brain that clients don't want to come back again. And we've seen that within even our. The members of Difference maker Revolution. We only had one a couple of weeks ago. Who it was she who was blocking the client coming back again. And when she opened her mind at Empower to invite those clients back again, guess what happened? Guess what happened?
- [07:19]
A
They were knocking on the door. It's amazing because clients love.
- [07:26]
C
I think.
- [07:29]
A
When clients are there we go. Well, what I love about what we do is that we build such excitement and such loyalty because what we give as difference makers makes such a difference to people. They do want to come back again and again. And when we open the door and allow that to happen, our clients are so much happier for it and they just want that next level or that next reason to come in. And Valentine's Day is perfect. So I promise I won't butt it in this time. Running. Off you go.
- [08:14]
C
I was just going to say that, you know when. When you see clients having a difference maker transformational experience, right. People grow and they're ready for their next one then. So it's different than the photographer's photographer who's creating a pose family portrait that the client only ever wants. Maybe one every six or seven years. It's a completely different scenario than that. And for some reason, so many photographers are wired to believe that if my client comes in and spends a few thousand with me or even more than that, that they won't want to come back again. And that's not the truth. That's not the reality. When you deliver a Difference maker transformational experience.
- [09:01]
A
And we've seen that all the time. Lots of our members are having their clients come back multiple times and it doesn't matter. It seems to be the more they spend, the more they're. The more they want to come back, which is the opposite of what most photographers believe. So it's great to see.
- [09:20]
B
If I pick up the phone, what do I do? Like, I want to call Steve, I need to press the type in your number and press ring, obviously.
- [09:33]
A
But like romance me trying to.
- [09:36]
B
Hey, Steve, I'm calling because.
- [09:48]
A
Well, I don't know whether that's going to work. You need to sound a little bit more excited than that, Jono. Get excited You've got to get excited and just let people know, hey, you know, we've got Valentine's. Valentine's Day is just around the corner. And I remember that you mentioned that you wanted to do something for Valentine's Day, and I wanted to make sure that you don't miss out. When did you want to come in? And so I think it's about that excitement. It's about, as difference makers, we're listening to our clients and they're sharing all of these things. All of you know these things anyway. And so you're playing off the information that you already have. And those session times are limited. As photographers, we can only offer so many. And to give somebody that gift is incredible for them to come in. So we need to believe that to begin with, know that it's limited. And then when we're calling our clients, refer back to our notes, refer to what. What we already know and remind them of the reasons why they wanted to come back and offer that limited, limited space to them and be excited about it.
- [11:09]
B
So for me, if someone rings me, I'm always kind of like, oh, God, what do they want?
- [11:18]
A
You're that generation, Jono.
- [11:22]
B
I'm like, quiet earring. I instantly get, like, alarm bells up, firewall up. Like, I'm like, oh, they must want something. What do they want? Oh, there must be bad news. That's like my instantaneous reaction when someone rings me because, like, I don't really do calls. Like, so, like, how do we prep our clients for that? Like, how do we know that it's okay to call them? Or how do we handle that?
- [11:51]
C
Can I ask you a question on that, Jono? So is this from a phone number you don't recognize, you don't know who's calling, or if it's your best friend who's ringing you? Whose name's in your phone? Is it different?
- [12:03]
B
No, it's both. Like, if I see a number. Well, it's more. You're more suspicious if. If you know a number you don't know is calling you. Right. Because there's so many scam callers nowadays that I think 99 of the time I answer a call that I don't know the number. It's. It's a robot trying to scam me. But even. Even when I have the number saved on my phone, I think there's a funny. It was funny. I think we had just dropped you to the airport, mom and I, and you were going over to Effortless in Glasgow, and I get a call from Steve I'm like, oh, God, what does Steve want? Why is he ringing me? Like, what's. It's like Saturday, like morning. We just dropped Ron at the airport. I was like, oh, I don't know. Answers. So I like, text him. I was like, everything. O. So even people like the default text who I know, I'm just like, oh, no, what do they want?
- [13:04]
A
He's that generation.
- [13:06]
B
Yeah. I think it's just my generation, maybe.
- [13:09]
A
But then in that case, I would text back. And in a lot of cases, they, you know, you. You can have a conversation via text because there are like, your generation who doesn't use the phone for talking. You use the phone for texting and Snapchatting, don't you?
- [13:34]
B
I'm just about in the Snapchat generation. So my younger sister, who's 10 years younger, finds it weird that I'm on Snapchat, but I mean, I'm just about in the Snapchat generation. Yeah. There was funny. Was it you or someone was saying recently, like, that they. I can't remember. Someone was telling me that, like, when they messaged their kids on WhatsApp that, you know, they'd be waiting like a day for a response and then they like, send them a snap. They have to join Snapchat because when they send them a message on Snapchat, like, they get an instantaneous response from their kids. I think I was at an event recently or something. They were telling me, yeah, that's funny.
- [14:15]
A
I believe in a memory.
- [14:17]
B
Yeah.
- [14:18]
C
I remember being in Tampa, Florida with Janine, actually. Yeah, No, I don't think you guys were there that time, but we had a conversation one evening about her daughter Aaron, who was 16 at the time. And Aaron was there. So, like, I was really curious about that generation. Right. So she's not even Gen X. She's Gen C, I think is. Is what they're called. But. And gone. Like, we were having this conversation and it got to a point where she turned and she said, if you want to have a phone call with me, you have to make an appointment. So they viewed a phone call as an appointment, like going to see a doctor or a dentist, the same thing as that. Which was really interesting, you know, that that's what they viewed her at. But as Steve said, you know, you know, one of the mantras at Difference Maker Revolution is you have to earn the conversation with the client and it's okay to interact on text or WhatsApp or whatever you need to interact with to earn that trust so that they will make an appointment with you if your ideal client is of that age.
- [15:28]
B
So that's why it's important to know who our clients are and that's why.
- [15:34]
A
It'S so important to make sure that you're keeping notes in the database. So when you go back to that client, you know what their preferred method of communication is, you know, what worked last time. They've probably already shared with you how they prefer to communicate. And just follow that preference of communication because it's about starting that conversation. Once you've earned that conversation, as Ronan said before, then you can make that appointment to pick up the phone and organize it. Or sometimes it can be done. You can make the time through texting if that's what they prefer.
- [16:24]
B
So for Valentine's Day, bringing it back because I know we kind of digress a little bit. So we should be prioritizing our existing clients and you know, initiating conversation over whatever, whether it's phone, text, email, messenger, Instagram, DMs, Snapchat, all of the above.
- [16:42]
A
I think our current clients should always be our preference, no matter what it is. We should be logging their birthdays and contacting them for their birthdays. We should be logging, you know, those major events in their lives and they share so much with us. When we are having those conversations about, You know, they're telling us about the fact that, you know, their children are, you know, going off and on a two year holiday, two, two year adventure or six month adventure and having your database up to date with the reminders, setting those reminders. So then that way you're contacting them before that because it's a major shift in their family. I turned 60 this year, you know, making sure, you know, you're on top of birthdays and particularly those milestone birthdays where it's, you know, 40s, 50, you know that, that every 10 years the, your database and your current clients need to be on top of your marketing list as a priority because that they're the easy, they're the easy wins because you've already built a rapport, you've already built a trust and they're the ones that are the easiest to book in again.
- [18:16]
B
Makes sense.
- [18:18]
C
And Jonathan, in our business, businesses, you know that we have a strategy of continuity. Do you just want to explain to people what continuity is?
- [18:30]
B
Yeah, I mean, continuity for a photography business, no one has ever truly cracked the code, but the closest thing we have to continuity in a photography business is getting people, our clients to use us more often. I mean true continuity is where it's like a Netflix subscription or, you know, a Disney plus subscription or a difference maker inner circle subscription, you know, where you pay monthly or weekly or whatever it is for that service. And the next best thing is reoccurring. So it's where. So that's recurring revenue reoccurring is where people place orders over and over again. So an example would be like a lab because photographers would order their wall art, their treasure boxes, and, you know, every time they have a client in, they'd place a reoccurring order for product. Right. And the best way that we can. Why this is so important is, well, one, it brings some stability and some consistency and you can actually forecast and project so you can manage your financials. But another thing is the hardest thing you can do in any business, in any industry is convert a new client. Like, it's really, really, really, really hard. Like, very hard and very expensive. Like, ads are getting more expensive. They're always going to be and get more expensive. And if you can get your existing clients who already know, like and trust you to use you more often, amazing. So finding those reasons, as Steve said, for them to come back over and over, and they will, is mission critical and should be the base and foundation of everything you do.
- [20:25]
A
It's also the most work, Jono. Not only is it expensive, but it's the most work. Getting, finding the new clients, getting a hold of them now is becoming even more difficult. And converting them, as you were talking there, you reminded me we had quite a number of our clients. We used to talk about continuity. They know that they want to come back in a year's time or in six months time. And a lot of them were on payment plans, but those payment plans were for their future session. And so they may have been on payment plans to pay off what they've purchased, but at the end of the payment plan, we would bring them, you know, let them know that, you know, their final payments coming up soon and thank them. But we also gave them the option to keep it going if they want it, because a lot of them have said that they want to come back and it allowed them to save the deposit for the next time they came in. And so I think sometimes we just need to be open to.
- [21:43]
C
To giving.
- [21:43]
A
Our clients the opportunity to be able to afford to come back and make it easy for them. And we had quite a lot of clients that said, yeah, I do want to come back. And I'm used to this amount coming out of my account every month now. I'm happy to keep it going now not everybody's going to say yes to that, but we had quite a few. And so I suppose does that kind of qualify for the continuity that you were talking about?
- [22:16]
C
Yeah, I think it does. And I think if you think about society today, you can put your toilet paper on subscription now. So you hear more and more and more about the modern household where they're managing their monthly budget based on subscriptions. So we have to align our offering with what's happening in the marketplace. Because when you align what you do with what the consumer, your potential client is used to, well then it makes, it makes it easier for them.
- [22:56]
A
People don't want to think about it. They know that, they know they want to come in, they don't want to make that decision again. And you're just making it easy for them.
- [23:04]
B
So I feel like if we were talking about marketing for Valentine's Day and given the emphasis and our training on Facebook ads that we do teach because they are very important still, you know, many, many marketers will tell you it's impossible to scale and grow a business in modern day without ads of some sort. And I'm going to be controversial because for me, I hate event based marketing. I hate, hate, hate events. Event based marketing, there's a lot of like natural scarcity built into it, like, because it's a set date, set time. But with that, with event based marketing comes a lot of stress, a lot of headaches. For me anyway, this is just my personality and a lot of, oh, I don't like this. So for me personally, if someone asked me like, as the Facebook ads, dude, can I run Facebook ads for Valentine's Day? Yes, you can. But unless you have good experience of running evergreen offers, then I would suggest you don't because the probability that you're gonna F it up and get it wrong is high.
- [24:34]
A
Right, but you'll be running that anyway. Your Valentine's Day promotion would run on top of your evergreen.
- [24:42]
B
Correct. But what I'm saying is if you like, I have seen members who don't have consistent evergreen campaigns going or haven't managed to, you know, get used to that cold traffic nuance, the follow up, as you said, the calls, the text emails, earning the conversation, they haven't managed to achieve that yet with an evergreen. And then they try and do it with event based thinking that that's the secret. And I'm just like, oh no, stay away. Just don't do that.
- [25:15]
C
Isn't evergreen a tree though?
- [25:17]
B
I knew you were going to ask us to talk, to explain what evergreen Is I just knew. Yes, evergreen is a tree, but evergreen, it's just a marketing term. It basically means that marketing that can run all year round, like you can run that promotion 52 weeks of the year, 24, 7, 365 days of the year. I see 3, 365 days of the year, it's evergreen. And it doesn't have to change. There might be minor tweaks they don't like need a reason. It's just your offer is so good that you'll get people filling out the form regardless. And mastering that is going to be like a big key to making sure you have consistent need flow too, being able to run that.
- [26:07]
C
So I think what you're saying is that when you've an evergreen and you're used to that, then you can do something specifically that's time bound by something like Valentine's. But if you start out for the first time running paid advertising and for some reason you don't get it right first time, which often people don't get it right first time, then you have to wait another year to do it again.
- [26:30]
B
Well, they'll crash, burn and blame Facebook ads. But yeah, pretty much when it wasn't Facebook ads at all.
- [26:38]
A
Always the optimist, Jon.
- [26:41]
B
Well, I mean that's like I've seen it too often, so I'm just trying to give people some realism.
- [26:48]
A
It does happen. It does happen.
- [26:50]
C
That's why we're saying start with your existing clients. Right. So start there and you'll be amazed what will happen. And then if you are used to running Facebook adverts as evergreens and everything else, like most of our difference banker members are because they've trained with you, Jonathan, then maybe it's something you can layer on top. So we're not saying replace the evergreen, but layer it on top and see what happens.
- [27:16]
B
Absolutely.
- [27:17]
A
And for, you know, when you said, you know, it adds so much stress, like from the other side, running a studio, knowing that we had Valentine's Day coming up, knowing that we had that in our pocket where we could be marketing for that, for me was a relief rather than stress because I knew that people would respond to that and I knew that we had lots of families that had come in and that every family, the core of that family, was a couple. And in most cases they were looking for something different. They were looking for a way to celebrate themselves as a couple. And we just needed to give them that opportunity. So we had the clients already. But for a lot of people, they need a reason they need that extra thing that the market's giving them, be it Christmas sales, retail goes through the roof, Valentine's Day. Certain industries within Valentine's Day, people just spend because it's Valentine's Day. So it's that extra reason for people to want to be spending or wanting to be selling, celebrating who they are as a couple within a family. It's not just for new love. It's for all those people that we've already served as well. And so it was pretty exciting. We knew that we already had a lot of clients that would come back, and the market has given us that reason for them to come back. Easy bookings. And we knew that a lot of, you know, a lot of other businesses were looking for ways to. Sell. And when you align with those businesses and a lot of those businesses were businesses that our clients owned, sometimes they need a reason to reach out. Sometimes they need that extra thing that's going to get people across the line to make that decision to spend with them or to buy that extra thing. And those alliances used to, you know, prop us up after Valentine's Day because they would be spending, you know, we had alliances with jewelers who needed a reason for those people who were, you know, coming in, sucking up their staff's time and for them to not walk away and be looking online for, you know, that alternative. If they had a sweetener, which usually was us, that extra thing to give to them, then they were making more sales, their team was converting more. And we then were busy after Valentine's Day because they tended to get that, that, that extra gift certificate after Valentine's Day. So it not only helped us on the lead up to Valentine's Day, but also afterward because of those alliances that we had. So it relieved a lot of stress because we didn't have to rely on advertising externally.
- [31:06]
C
Jona, what we haven't talked about, right. Is marketing for AI recommendation. Because if you're like me, I'm probably going to ask ChatGPT, Valentine's Day is coming up. What can I do differently for Susan? So, Jonathan, tell everybody about marketing for AI recommendation and the reason why they need to join the difference maker revolution. Inner circle.
- [31:35]
B
Yeah, I mean, like over the past few weeks, Ronan and Janine have been doing these, this five weeks of, you know, I don't know, something, something about marketing AI for recommendation. You know, it's an only joke and it's been really, really exciting for. I've never seen the community so engaged like that. It's absolutely buzzing because what we've been doing over the past few weeks is not only showing our Inner circle members how to set themselves up to be, you know, top of that list, to be recommended by AI, but as part of that, you know, experience of. Of, you know, making, having that outcome, you know, photographers in the group, difference makers in the group have been, you know, reigniting their why, fully understanding the clients that they serve, getting a deep dive into, you know, their. Their why, their what, their how. Understanding how they can improve their website, you know, copy and just, I think it's. It's opened their eyes to unreignited the passion and the fuel for why they do what they do, as well as giving clarity, you know, because with clarity comes confidence. And having clarity about why you do something, how you do it, and, you know, what you do and who you serve is makes life easier. Right? So over the past four weeks and we continue on that journey, we have been preparing our members not only to be ready to be recommended by ChatGPT and get bookings through AI, but also to give their business that spark, that push they need again. So did I summarize that? Okay, is that like.
- [33:36]
C
Yeah. So what do I need to do? I want to know more about this marketing for AI recommendation.
- [33:42]
B
So to make sure that you future proof your photography business, just click the link below and inquire about Inner Circle, because that is where you need to be. So we will have a conversation and we will help you decide that Inner Circle is the perfect opportunity for your business.
- [34:01]
A
And that course is recorded, right, Jono? They haven't missed out. They can still join and access that course where they step through week by week on all the things that they need to do to prepare for this AI revolution.
- [34:15]
B
Absolutely. Because luckily you weren't on the calls to not press the record button.
- [34:25]
A
I've been taken off that job.
- [34:26]
B
You set me up perfectly. Because, yeah, we have done that in the past. I've done that too. So. But yeah, all joking aside, yes, it's recorded.
- [34:33]
C
We've all done it.
- [34:34]
B
We've all done it.
- [34:36]
C
Did someone press it on this podcast?
- [34:39]
B
Oh, sugar. Only joking.
- [34:44]
C
All right, we'll see you all soon. That's it from us this week on the Difference Maker Revolution podcast. We'll see you soon. Bye for now.
- [34:54]
B
Happy New Year.
- [34:55]
A
Bye, everyone.