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- [00:00]
A
Obviously, we have to be skilled at our craft. And let's be clear here, we're not joking and saying that you can just be a crappy photographer. I mean, you can. And I've seen people that are not the greatest photographers have amazing businesses. Right. But we're speaking to difference makers and we know that you're taking care of your craft. That's a given. You are an amazing photographer. You provide an incredible, beautiful piece of art for your clients. Let's just take that out of the picture. It's a given.
- [00:29]
B
Hey, difference makers. Welcome back to this wild, wild party. Janine's dancing and everything. She's so excited for this podcast episode.
- [00:39]
A
It's a wild party.
- [00:41]
B
Wild party. So the last podcast we were talking about your marketing mix and on the podcast you guys mentioned that, you know, for referral marketing to work, you have to deliver an amazing experience. So in my mind, an amazing experience, if I was thinking like a photographer, I'd think, okay, I have to take, you know, 300 of the most incredible photos using my, you know, state of the art backdrops and my brilliant lighting and my perfect posing and my amazing props. And the client needs to love every single one of my amazing photos and my incredible art. And that's an amazing experience for my client. And they'll spend 20 grand and then they'll refer me, right?
- [01:32]
A
Oh, Jono, you're so cute.
- [01:35]
C
You had everything rocked at the 20 grand.
- [01:38]
B
Teddy?
- [01:41]
C
Depends. Oh, not quite. Not quite.
- [01:48]
B
So what is what makes an amazing experience?
- [01:51]
C
It's such a big topic, Jono.
- [01:54]
B
Oh, very big.
- [01:57]
C
I think knowing your intention for your clients to start with is really important. People can hear your intention and sometimes you meet people and you know that their intention and focus is your wallet. They need to make money and you can just sense the fact that it's about the money. And I think having the belief that you've got to give before you can receive and that the money will come if we give value and if we give the service and trust that the money will come, rather than be focused on the money, then it shifts your ability to give great service.
- [03:04]
B
What does that mean? What's giving great service or giving value look like?
- [03:09]
C
I think you need to ask Janine that.
- [03:12]
A
Well, it's interesting because I was even going to take. I know Steve took a step back, but with that, you kind of have to take a step back because you really have to understand what, who your ideal client is before you understand how to give them great service. Because it's going to be different. You Know, my clients are very different than a different photographer's clients. Giving an amazing service to someone coming in for a boudoir session is going to be totally different than someone coming in for a two year old session, you know, and so getting in the mind of your client and what's going to make them feel taken care of, what's going to make them feel seen and heard and that their story is being told and that you're making a difference in their life, you really need to go back and understand who your client is. And it has to be about them. It can't be about you. And I know that's what you were, you were joking about in the beginning and such a fun Jonathan way. You know, obviously we have to be skilled at our craft. And let's be clear here, we're not joking and saying that you can just be a crappy photographer. Um, I mean, you can. And I've seen people that are not the greatest photographers have amazing businesses. Right. But we're speaking to difference makers and we know that you're taking care of your craft. That's a given. You are an amazing photographer. You provide an incredible, beautiful piece of art for your clients. Let's just take that out of the picture. It's a given. You're listening to this podcast because you're trying to expand upon that and make a difference in the life of your clients. So just shake that off the table. So what is it that creates the incredible experience? It has nothing to do with that aspect of it. That's already a given. That's why I like you hear jokes about when people name their companies and it's like best in service. Well, yeah, that's a given. Like obviously I want good service from my providers. Like what? Tell me more. Like what? What more is there? You know, so yeah, so you got to get in the mindset of your client Jono first, along with your intent, like Steve said.
- [05:15]
C
Ooh, that's a huge, that's huge, Janine. Because I think that's a lot of what's missing and a lot of what's not taught to really begin to understand who your client is and what they value.
- [05:29]
B
What do clients value? I'm asking all the hard hitting questions tonight, haven't I?
- [05:35]
C
I think they value integrity and I think they value people that do what they say they will do and they value being seen and taken interest in, really taken an interest in. For them to be the most important person in the room when they come to see you, rather than us being the most Important people in the room and for somebody to think about and solve the problems that they haven't even considered yet. Because we know and should know what every step of this experience that you're about to give them, how that should feel like for them and how we want them to feel.
- [06:29]
B
Ooh, there's steps.
- [06:31]
A
There's always gaps. Jonathan, come on now. Where have you been?
- [06:37]
C
And I think a lot of people believe that the experience starts when people turn up or when they're sitting in front of my camera. But there's a whole journey that's happening when they're reading your ad, when they're picking up the phone and speaking to you. And, you know, I'm a big believer in that. The magic happens the moment they put down that phone, after they've spoken to you and what's going on in their mind, after they've made their booking and after you've had a discovery call with them, and after they're being open to seeing the world slightly differently. And so really understanding where your clients are at at every stage of their experience, because their experience starts well before you pull your camera out.
- [07:34]
B
So that's when you said, when they hang out the phone. So they now know, you know, my process. And you know how they're going to be photographed, and you know what they're going to wear and you know what shots we're going to get. That's.
- [07:45]
A
What did he say process, Steve.
- [07:48]
B
That's what's happening, Right?
- [07:49]
C
That bad word. That banned word. Not a process.
- [07:55]
B
I'm sorry for being a sarcastic gift, but yeah. Okay, so let's talk those steps a bit more then. So you said the experience, and I think you're right. A lot of people do think that the experience starts when the person is behind the camera or. Sorry, in front of the camera, or, you know, they arrive at the studio. Yeah. Or walk in the door. But no, it's more than that. So let's talk about some of the steps.
- [08:23]
C
Well, the reading. A lot of people we talked about on the last podcast about Facebook ads, and Janine mentioned understanding your avatar and getting in the mind of your client if your ad doesn't speak to that person that you want to attract. It's an opportunity right from the very beginning to communicate who you're looking for, but also what you stand for and what you want for them and what you believe. And you can see it in the ads, those people that are clear on what they want and believe for that client and those people that aren't. And so you're already beginning the experience the moment they see the ad. Because you're setting up the expectation and you're beginning to communicate who you are and what you want for them. Just in the wording of your ad.
- [09:27]
A
I'll say, and then. Unless you wanted to talk on that, but I was gonna say, and then from there it's your follow up, you know, and so Steve said, people want to know that you're going to do what you say you're going to do. And so in your ad, when people respond to it, what does your text message sound like? What does your email sound like? What do your phone calls sound like? How many times are you calling them to follow up? What are you sending in your email sequence? All of these things, you know, they have to sound authentic. They have to speak to your ideal client. They can't sound like corporate, corporate generic garbage. It just can't. You know, like, thank you so much for replying to my ad. You know, it has to be. People need to open that email, they need to receive your text, they need to receive your phone call with enthusiasm and they're going to read it and it start, it's the second step of starting their, their experience with you. And it's like, oh, my gosh, this is, this is awesome. This person, they get me, I want my experience to be with them. I want my photographs taken by them. And it starts even before you get them on the phone. But then it definitely needs to carry into that phone call when you talk to them.
- [10:34]
B
That was really interesting. Oh, go ahead, go ahead.
- [10:36]
C
The other thing we need to mention that it needs to be consistent.
- [10:41]
B
All.
- [10:42]
C
Of what you mentioned, Janine. Quite often sometimes when we get to review things, each one sometimes sounds like it's from a different voice or from.
- [10:50]
A
A different person written from someone different written to a different. Yeah, it's like they piecemeal things together from different things they've seen.
- [10:57]
C
Yeah. And sometimes you wonder, well, you know, did they exactly that. Did they have a friend who, you know, wrote a great text and then they've taken that, but then their email comes from somebody else and then it's got to sound like everything is coming from the same place, from the same heart, from the same person. And sometimes there's a misalignment between the text and the emails and the messages that we're leaving. And so that consistency adds to the experience. And, you know, when it's all coming from the same place and the same vision with the same clarity, then I think that adds to the experience.
- [11:41]
A
And it's okay to pull for inspiration, right, Jono? So, you know, like my inspiration company has always been Disney because I like to provide magical experiences for my clients. And so Disney, I always found to be where I received my inspiration. What do they do along the journey? You know, and so a long time ago I booked a, you know, I live In, I live 45 minutes from Disney. I don't need to book a Disney vacation. I can just pop up, right? But I wanted to see why do people spend thousands and thousands of dollars to, to come here? Tens of thousands, tens of thousands people will spend their life savings to come to Orlando for a week to go to Disney. And I had to understand why. And obviously people do it multiple times, right? They don't just come once. Like we have difference maker friends who come every year to Disney and fly from overseas, right? So I mean, sometimes I don't even go and I'm only 45 minutes away, right? So what is it that makes it so compelling? And it starts from the moment you call? And so when I called to book a Disney experience and a Disney vacation and the phone call was magical, the person on the other phone was happy. They were excited to talk to me. They used my name multiple times. They asked names of my children, they used my children's names multiple times. They talked specifically about the interests of my kids. I mean, it was incredible. Like by the end of that phone call, I was besties with that person on Disney's like phone call line, right? And then guess what, Steve, I know this will shock you, but within a week I had a welcome packet in the mail with a custom made map, custom made map, printed my kids names on it with little stickers on all the places that I talked about with that lady on what would fit their age and their interest to make sure that we had that on our itinerary for the day, right? And the letter was written to them and it was like, you know, and it was so cute. It was like Master James because he's like a little boy, right? Like Master James and Miss Erin. And it was just, it was so cute and so clever and we were all wowed by it, you know, and so we didn't have to wait for our vacation. It started one with that phone call and then two with the welcome packet that came in the mail. And we were all blown away. And it was special and it was exciting and the kids started getting excited because they were able to touch the map and start dreaming about their Disney vacation, which, I mean, that's Amazing. And so, you know, it's. It doesn't start. It didn't start. Disney knew it didn't start. When I pull in my car into that park, right, they know it starts with that phone call and then the welcome letter that comes afterwards.
- [14:25]
B
Well, what Disney probably know is I reading this or watching this the other day, and it was a great reminder, and it was really interesting. You know, I think a lot of people, obviously I study a lot of marketing. My background's advertising, you know, Facebook advertising. And within that, there's a lot of psychology. And I was watching a marketer the other day, and he reminded me that, you know, most marketers think that people are buying products. You know, as people are buying photos or canvases or treasure boxes or albums. Most marketers think people are buying products. Good marketers think people are buying transformation. Right? Good marketers think they're buying some sort of transformation. Whether that's physical, you know, might be losing weight, it could be emotional, but what people are actually buying. And he said, what the 1%, the top 1% of marketers in the world know what people are actually buying? What people are actually buying is an identity shift. And he said, the best marketers in the world who know what their clients want so well that they know the identity shift that they want to achieve, they're the ones that can sell anything to anybody because they're able to give their clients an identity shift.
- [15:55]
C
And that's perfect for our industry.
- [15:58]
A
Yeah, it is perfect for our industry.
- [15:59]
C
Perfect for perfect.
- [16:00]
B
That's why I brought it up. It's a bit of a deep psychology, but it's relevant to every business that identifies, especially ours, especially photography. Photographers.
- [16:11]
C
Especially if you're a difference maker.
- [16:13]
B
Yes.
- [16:14]
A
Yes.
- [16:17]
B
Yeah. So that was an interesting part of this experience.
- [16:23]
C
You come out with some profound things. Can I just say that?
- [16:26]
B
Well, I mean, I didn't want to bring it up because it is advanced and a lot of people don't get it. But I think it's important to realize that it's not really about the product. It's about the identity shift that you're providing. And a lot of people do this accidentally. When you can do it intentionally, that's when the magic happens.
- [16:46]
C
It's the same thing with the luxury brands. When you think about it, you know, you're buying a Louis Vuitton bag and you're spending what, 5k, 8k, whatever it is, what is that that you're buying? You're buying what? Cow. And it's part of that identity shift is how that makes you feel that you own that, how that makes you feel. You know, when you're walking down the street with that bag, it's about, you know, the fact that you're. You own it. It's not about the fact that you're thinking about where that bag came from or, you know, the materials that it's made out of. It's about that. And I think all luxury brands are the same. It's about that shift in identity that they're giving you and that sense of emotion that that particular piece gives you. And I think photography is the same. It's not about the canvas or really the quality of our work is about how we make people feel and how we shift their beliefs in what's possible for them and who they are.
- [18:04]
B
Take that luxury brand analysis analogy and move it on to photography business. Give me an example of how our experience creates that identity shift.
- [18:12]
C
How the brand does or how we.
- [18:14]
B
Do, how photographers do.
- [18:17]
C
Well, we teach that we need to believe in our clients more than they believe in themselves.
- [18:24]
B
And.
- [18:25]
C
And we need to assume that most people have everything they need to be successful. And the problem is we always look for. We've been trained to look for, you know, what's wrong, even in ourselves. And it's only when somebody asks you about what you have to celebrate and what those gifts are and what. And what you see in your own child that you actually take the time to notice, because we become immune to all of this. And so I think photography is about helping people celebrate and set a new standard for who they're going to be from this day forward. You know, asking a groom, you know, what is it about this person that makes him want to spend the rest of his life with this person? There are so many brides or, you know, couples that have never had that understanding or conversation. You know, what is it that you value about this person? What do you see in them that nobody else sees? And I think that once people begin to think about looking through that lens and looking for what they love about somebody, they find lots. The problem is we're not asked to look through that lens very often. And the photography then, because we've asked them to look through that lens, the photography is taken through that lens. And that artwork that people are now displaying in their home becomes that window into seeing that part of themselves that we help them discover and we help them fight. And it brings it to life for them every day. And it can set a new standard for people to live by.
- [20:42]
B
Yeah, so, okay, he's gonna do The.
- [20:48]
A
Did he put you in silence? Shut up. That's unusual.
- [20:52]
B
So an amazing experience goes far beyond clicking the shutter.
- [20:56]
C
Yeah. It's gotta start off with your intention and your why. Why do you do what you do? And it can't be about you if you're photographing people. It's gotta be about what you want for these people that you are now helping and serving. If it's pet photography, it's about what you love about those dogs and how you see them, what they bring to a family, how they create a family, how they connect a family and bring. Make sure that every single person in that family feels vegetable.
- [21:45]
B
Right. Nice.
- [21:47]
C
Lots of silence there, Jono.
- [21:49]
A
I know. Jono, you're freaking me out.
- [21:54]
B
No, no, that's good, it's good, it's good, it's good. So, I mean, like some of the steps as well that happen, like, help to make that happen. So, like, you know, Janine, you were talking about Disney's examples, but like the physical mail that we send when the client books not making sure that you just book a client and then you don't communicate with them before they actually come in. Right. There's a step there between when you make the booking and the day of the session that you're. You're sending out your physical mail. You're making your calls, you know, you're sending your text and email sequences. You don't just ghost your client after you book them in. I think people miss that a lot too. All the small touches, touch points. Like you send a physical mail to your clients that book in, right?
- [22:40]
A
Me, yes. And it depends, and this is what I was saying, understanding your client, like, depending on the type of session that that type of physical mail changes. And so we have it, you know, depending on what type of session it is, depends on what goes in that little welcome packet.
- [22:56]
B
You send them a welcome packet.
- [22:58]
A
It is a welcome packet, Jonathan. And it's jam packed full of information. But if it's something related to a child, we include something in there for the mom and the child. So that way the child and that. I got that from Disney, you know, and it's not just about getting the mom excited. Um, I. Because when as a mom, there's a little tidbit for all of you trying to get in the minds of your clients. If they're a mom, if someone can make my child happy, they've made me happy. If they can speak to my. If I feel my child has been seen and paid attention to, they're speaking to my heart. Too, Right. So I want to make sure that I'm doing that for my clients, you know, and so like even something as simple as when our clients walk in the door, you know, my client, I have little clients too. So while we always greet the parents, I make a very conscious effort to get down. It's getting harder now as my knees get older. I squat down and I get on the level of that child and I talk to them directly, eye to eye, you know, and it, and it starts that connection between myself. And I've trained my team to do this too. We always squat down and talk to that child. Not just this big scary person looming above that talks to their parents like every other adult. Every other adult just talks to their parents and then looks down upon them, you know, so it's something just so small. We get down and we talk to them and you can see the parents shift too. So, you know, it's something for the little client and it's something for the big client. And so that's just, you know, a little bit of the nuance. Gotta understand your clients.
- [24:31]
B
So let's take just five things that people can take away from this podcast and actually do to create an amazing experience. So five things. So the first thing.
- [24:39]
A
Oh, you're not summarizing. I thought you were going to summarize.
- [24:41]
B
First thing. I don't know. For me it has to be the focus, the intent, the intention for your client and making your client the hero. Focusing on your client and focusing on understanding them so well that, you know, the identity shift they want to achieve and helping them through that throughout the entire experience. I think your client always, always, always the full focus on your client has to always be number one when creating an amazing experience.
- [25:07]
A
Agreed.
- [25:09]
C
Yep.
- [25:11]
B
So number two, I think genuine being.
- [25:13]
C
Genuinely interested in them.
- [25:14]
A
Yeah, I was saying being authentic, genuinely interested, definitely.
- [25:18]
B
And a part of that, just realizing that the experience isn't just when they walk in the door or when they're in front of the lens. It's from the very get go, you're having an impact.
- [25:28]
A
And taking that even a step further, it's not, it doesn't end when you take their credit card.
- [25:33]
B
Right.
- [25:34]
A
It continues past the sale. So just keep that in mind too.
- [25:41]
B
Because we want clients coming back over and over again like we talked about in the last one, right?
- [25:45]
A
Yes. Yeah, absolutely.
- [25:47]
B
So I think another thing, the big takeaway is this, you know, in between when someone makes a booking and just the actual when they come in further for the day of the session that, you know, you don't just ghost your clients that you, you're actually sending physical mail. You, you're calling them multiple times, you're calling partners, other decision makers, you're sending texts and emails with client stories, you're keeping in touch, you're keeping them top of mind, you're making them feel cared for. I would say the majority of photographers who aren't in the inner circle and aren't difference makers aren't doing anything in between this time period. And then they're wondering why clients ghost them and they'll show up.
- [26:25]
C
I think as Janine was saying, that's got to be part of the experience.
- [26:29]
B
Yeah, absolutely.
- [26:31]
C
Because often it's two, three weeks where you could be creating an experience for them while they're waiting to come in for their actual experience for their photographic session. And so if you consciously make that part of their experience, which is what Janine was talking about, by creating a wacom pack, by, you know, sending those emails, by keeping in touch with them and making those phone calls, um, then if you make that part of the experience, then they're getting so much more value.
- [27:03]
B
Third thing for me was what Janine was saying about, you know, on the day of the session when they come in, you know, you're making your clients feel like royalty, all of them, the big ones and the little ones. Right. So I think delivering a five star experience, like your clients not having to lift a finger is key. That's the experience.
- [27:22]
A
But yeah. And having anticipated all of their needs.
- [27:27]
B
Yeah. So to give me an example of.
- [27:30]
A
Anticipating needs, you know, like for our clients, again, we deal with a lot of children, so we have a fully stocked changing table. You'd be surprised how many parents forget a diaper, you know, and that nothing can ruin a session more than a dirty diaper and mom not having another one. So, you know, like baby wipes, diapers of every size you could imagine, and all in a comfortable area for them to do that. In the bathroom area, we have the changing table. So, you know, we have that. And you'd be surprised. Parents are like, oh my gosh, you have all of this. I'm like, yes, we have all of this. Snacks. Oh my gosh, snacks are huge. You know, nothing will kill a design consultation faster than a growling stomach and people feeling they need to get out of there because they forgot to eat, their blood sugar has tanked, and they just want to get out of there so they can go get some food. You know, so anticipating the fact that people get hungry when they, you know, people are Very busy. They can. They can get to your studio and have forgotten to eat. Thought they might be able to make it all the way through, whatever the case may be. People forget to eat. And I find that people end up very hungry when they get here. Children especially. And parents actually always joke about it. I swear, I feed my children. I promise I feed my children. But the kids get. And maybe, Steve, it's because we're Italian. And so we see food and community and family. But we have snacks. We have children's snacks, we have adult snacks, we have protein snacks. So we have all those things here. Gummies. Kids love little gummies, and it makes them happy. Can you work for a bribe? If needed? But, yeah. So, like, that's an anticipated need. People are here for a while and they might not have brought a snack or a food or a water or a beverage. And so we have all that ready to go, and we offer it to everyone. And so no one ever has to leave for that.
- [29:17]
C
But in saying that to Janine, you know, taking the time before they come in to know what kind of snacks that they prefer or that they're okay with, because some people are very protective over, especially when you've got younger kids, they can be very protective over what their children can and can't eat. Um, and so they're making sure that you're aligning with their dietary. Yeah, there's nothing. Their dietary requirements. Not putting something in front of them and assuming that, you know, that's okay for that child because they may have an allergy. Yeah, the parents may sort of be anti sugar. There are those people that are anti sugar. And so, you know, just. Just having that conversation and providing something that aligns with, you know, going to make this the best experience ever for them because you've taken the time to understand them.
- [30:15]
B
I said five. We're running out of time, though, so let's just go with four. So one more.
- [30:19]
C
I think what I saw today with one of our members is your assumption. Assuming that people want this and assuming that what you're giving people is valuable makes a huge difference to your language and the way that you welcome people. Sometimes you can hear people, you know, when they share their phone calls. It's almost questioning whether they want to have this experience. And when they greet them, it's the same thing. And so I think really believing in what you do and how you can help people transform, like what you were saying, I think that adds to the experience. It's almost like, you know, that person, that. Which is the opposite of what we're talking about treats you like you can't afford to buy something because their assumption is that, you know, you're not going to spend. I think a lot of the times we, a lot of people can do this without even realizing. But being open to, you know, helping people, having what they really need out of this experience and being open to not being judgmental at all as to whether they can or can't afford it and giving them the best possible thing you possibly can, assuming they can.
- [31:42]
B
All right, so as we said at the start, as Steve said at the start, this is a huge topic to create an amazing experience. We tried to cover some of them today but to learn how to deliver an amazing difference maker experience, all the info, all you need to do is click the link below, join the inner circle where we will help you to create incredible experiences for your clients. So click the link, join. We'll see you on the inside. Bye for now.
- [32:08]
A
Bye everyone.
- [32:09]
C
Bye everyone.