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[00:00]
Narrator/Announcer
This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the uk.
[00:06]
Odoo/Schwab Ad Voice
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[00:42]
Narrator/Announcer
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[01:41]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
The in renue a set ceremonie d' in humaison pour une soldat in conneux de la Grande Guerre. As we lay to rest an unknown soldier of the Great War, though his name is lost to us, his life is not. He was someone's son, a friend, a comrade in arms.
[02:09]
Historian Jason Burke
I never seen so many dead men clumped together as what I saw bed and I thought to myself, oh, the world's dead. They're all dead.
[02:25]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
We're standing on the site of one of the bloodiest days in the history of warfare, burying one of the many young men who died here. 1st July 1916, the start of the Battle of the Somme. Here in the fields of northern France, more than 19,000 British soldiers and 6,000 German soldiers lost their lives in that one single day of the First World War. 40,000 British soldiers were injured or captured. It's still one of the costliest and most bitterly fought battles in British military history. And in the following four months of battle, more than a million soldiers from both sides would be wounded or killed. In Northern Ireland, where I come from, whole streets lost their sons in the first two days of the battle. And here in my home city, Belfast, among the Protestant community The memory of what happened at the Somme110 years ago is still, incredibly, after all these years, very much part of daily life.
[03:41]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
I used to live just over there. And even just walking to the shops, you have the Psalm remembered on walls around you. Behind this building, literally just on that street, there's another Psalm mural. Because in Belfast, more than the Second World War, the Psalm is remembered on walls across the city, not just at war memorials.
[04:04]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And it's not just murals and memorial gardens.
[04:08]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
In working class Loyalist communities right across Northern Ireland, marching bands are a massive part of life. People get together, play the flutes, the drums, and they'll march for many different reasons. But one of the big reasons that they do march is to commemorate the Somme. Why the Somme? What is it about that battle that's so important to you guys?
[04:32]
Unionist Community Member
Well, the battle of the song was most important to the Protestant Unionist community because of the sacrifice made on the first day of the Somme. There was over 2,000 lives lost that came from these streets. So we think it's important that we carry their name on and remember the sacrifice that they give the full week of things we have today.
[04:48]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
You know, when you look back and listen to some of the stories that I've certainly heard, there was young men ran away from home. A fell out of our band, his uncle, great uncle, ran away from home. They enlist to go and fight. I don't think there's too many people who do that today go and defend their country. And you can't forget that.
[05:03]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Yet just a few streets away in the mainly Catholic part of Belfast, people see that time very differently. Back in 1914, their sons went to fight in the First World War for Britain, too. But today there are no parades, no commemorations.
[05:19]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
This is the most famous nationalist part of Belfast.
[05:23]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And here for decades you had silence
[05:26]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
and in some cases, even shame. Yet all of those men went through the same thing at the same battle, but the reactions on each side of the city are completely different.
[05:40]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
You're listening to the documentary from the BBC World Service. I'm Jordan Dunbar, and in this episode, I want to find out more about the untold stories from one of history's most most infamous battles. With trench warfare now returned to Europe and Ukraine, I want to know how that battle, over a century ago in the war supposed to end all wars, shaped families and communities and the island of Ireland that I call home, how families are still discovering all these years later the truth of what happened to their grandfathers and great grandfathers. Families lives like mine.
[06:19]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
So we actually did a little Bit of research on your great grandfather.
[06:22]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Okay.
[06:22]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
You're saying he came back a changed man? Yeah, he actually did.
[06:26]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Any of this is all to hear this officially is, yeah. Wow.
[06:31]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And it's not just my family in Ireland. Others across the UK are also uncovering things they didn't know about their relatives who fought at the Somme. Wow, look at all these letters. Hundreds in there.
[06:48]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah. Probably even thousands.
[06:50]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Feel like a suburban. Indiana Jones is incredible. Can we take some of these downstairs?
[06:58]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Absolutely. Let's go through them.
[07:00]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
A few years ago, brothers Chris and David were clearing out their father's attic in a quiet suburban street in North London when they found a huge stash of letters and other memorabilia. The letters were from their grandfather's younger brother, Victor, who fought at the Battle of the Somme.
[07:17]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
A lot of them not even opened.
[07:20]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Is it over 110 years old?
[07:22]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah, absolutely. It was quite a find. So that was Victor.
[07:27]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Chris shows me a black and white picture of a dapper young man in his uniform with facial hair I can only dream of. And another picture of his best friend
[07:37]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Gerald, who took the photos.
[07:39]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Both great moustaches. Yeah, Very off the time.
[07:43]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah.
[07:44]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
When the First World War broke out in 1914, Chris and David's grandfather Frank had gone with his younger brother Victor to their nearby recruiting office in London to sign up to fight. But Frank was refused on medical grounds. Instead, he had to content himself with the hundreds of letters his brother sent home, sometimes daily describing life at the front.
[08:06]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Dear lassies and lads.
[08:07]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Dear lassies and lads. So my habitation at present and for the two following days is in a little house, or rather farmstead, which we call Red House. This place is the nearest fortified position we hold, about 600 yards behind the trenches.
[08:22]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Somebody in our bedroom is trying to
[08:24]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
kill us by singing Thora.
[08:28]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
Look at this.
[08:28]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Last Wednesday we went to the cinema.
[08:31]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Wow.
[08:32]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So this is 1915.
[08:34]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah.
[08:35]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
And all's well, the mates are all together?
[08:38]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah.
[08:39]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Chasing girls are going to the cinema when they're not fighting.
[08:42]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
They're trying to have some form of normality, Right?
[08:45]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah. And there's stories about getting local wine and then staying up all night drinking it. And then there's stories about where they befriend a cow who's been injured, but it means that they get a pint of milk. And then alongside that is pictures of a gas attack.
[09:02]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
The pictures were taken by Victor's friend Gerald. Soldiers weren't allowed to have cameras, so Gerald photographed in secret. It's an extraordinary record. One photograph shows Victor sitting on a box in the middle of a deserted road. Writing, maybe writing one of the letters we're looking at now.
[09:20]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Do you see his attitude to the war changing as it goes on?
[09:26]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
That's absolutely the thing. The letters start to get a little bit darker.
[09:30]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
In one of the letters, he describes seeing a village absolutely obliterated. There were dead horses, dead bodies, buildings destroyed. I think this is probably the most telling letter.
[09:44]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah. And he writes, one wonders that men can be such utter fools as to know no other way of settling their disputes except by causing such destruction to life. Property that can never be replaced.
[09:57]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
It's like a different person.
[09:58]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah.
[09:59]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
One other thing David and Chris found in their father's attic was Victor's will.
[10:04]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Dear Father, not having made a will before leaving home, I have done so in my paybook. £5 for my bank account to go
[10:14]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
to Frank on behalf of the tennis
[10:16]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
club, to be used as they see fit. The remainder of the money to mother, my post office savings and warlo and all personal effects to go to Frank. Victor Hember, 27th of the 6th, 1916.
[10:31]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Wow.
[10:31]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So you've got the will being written five days before battle of the Somme begins. They had a sense that this was going to be bigger than all the other.
[10:43]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
That will was the last thing Victor ever sent home to his family. He was killed on the first day of the battle. Chris and David say their grandfather Frank never recovered from the grief or the guilt of not being able to protect his younger brother or fight for his country.
[11:01]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
He was still trying to sign up even in 1917, even after his brother's death.
[11:07]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
It's just heartbreaking as well that he felt then that he needed to resign his post as a captain at a tennis club.
[11:16]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Does he say why he did that?
[11:18]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah. He doesn't feel he's. He's an appropriate person to be in charge of other people.
[11:23]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
He couldn't deal with it.
[11:24]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
He still couldn't deal with it. The fact that he wasn't there.
[11:29]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Victor's body was never recovered. I've come back home to Belfast. The Battle of the Somme has cast a long shadow over what happened here in Northern Ireland. And just like Chris and David's family and so many families across the UK and Europe, it had a lasting impact on my family too. I remember my father telling me that his grandfather, Josiah Dunbar, had been injured at the Somme and had seen terrible things. When he came home from the war, Josiah was a different person. He never worked again. And it sounded like it was a cold house to grow up in. My father only knew this from other people. There was a medal in a drawer, but silence about how it got there. Josiah never spoke about what he'd been through, but it affected all of us who came after.
[12:32]
Historian Jason Burke
I like to tell my visitors on the tours that the ghosts of the Somme continue to walk among us today. Jordan, whether we realize it or not.
[12:41]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Historian Jason Burke gives walking tours around Belfast about the Battle of the Somme and the First World War.
[12:47]
Historian Jason Burke
The very streets where I grew up, for example, and why I have an interest in the First World War at all. The street names, for example, were Somme Drive, Thiefval Avenue, Albert Drive, you know, and those are battle sites from the First World War. So I grew up literally with the war all around me as well.
[13:06]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Why was it so important?
[13:08]
Historian Jason Burke
It's often said that there wasn't a street across the province which didn't have the curtains and blinds pulled because a young man from that particular street had lost his life at the Battle of
[13:19]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
the Somme, including Jason's own great uncle, George Burke.
[13:23]
Historian Jason Burke
But it's symbolic of, you know, why the Somme so fascinating, because in actual fact, it's not what happens on the battlefield, it's everything that happens after. And right up to this day.
[13:33]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
In 1914, when the First World War broke out, the whole of the island of Ireland was part of Britain, not just Northern Ireland as it is now. The British government had just agreed to devolve some power to Dublin. They called it Home Rule. But the communities in the north, the Protestants who were close to Britain, known as Loyalists or Unionists, and the Catholics who were more supportive of Irish nationalism, couldn't agree.
[13:59]
Historian Jason Burke
Irish nationalism was somewhat comfortable with the idea of a sort of quasi independent Ireland within the confines of the United Kingdom. However, unionism had resisted this at every turn. They very much saw Home Rule as, I suppose, a political watering down of the situation.
[14:21]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Then in April 1916, some more militant Irish nationalists decided they did want more power for Dublin and they launched a rebellion. It was called the Easter Rising.
[14:34]
Historian Jason Burke
The great historian describes the Easter Rising as a flip moment, as a moment that changed everything in Irish history. And again, the war is the context for all of this.
[14:45]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
With the British army distracted by the war, rebels in Dublin proclaim independence.
[14:51]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
The British quickly respond.
[14:53]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
A five day battle ends with the rebel leaders being put to death by firing squad.
[14:59]
Historian Jason Burke
Britain wanted to be seen to be reacting swiftly in order to set an example to other potentially rebellious nations within the British Empire. And in reality, the Easter Rising didn't have much public support. Their over the top reaction, you might say, somehow managed to turn Irish society against them. Him in the space of just a few days.
[15:22]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
It's against this backdrop that two months later Irish soldiers will be among those who fight and die at the Battle of the Somme.
[15:40]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
These are the guys that I've come to see. So this band, Goodrich Star were based just a few streets away from where I used to be to live. That is like worried about his wrists. So this is it. This is the Gertrude Star memorial mural?
[15:57]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
Yeah, it is indeed. Yeah.
[15:59]
Unionist Community Member
As far as I can remember, there's
[16:00]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
always been a mural from the, from our band on this wall.
[16:03]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Kyle and Peter are two of the drummers from the Gertrude Star Flute Band. They're young, not a generation you'd normally think would be interested in a battle over a century old. Guys, where does the name come from?
[16:15]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
There was 12 young men from Griffith street who actually went to Sawmontide at the time and we just wanted to make sure that they were being remembered in the right way.
[16:21]
Unionist Community Member
The day of most importance for us is the first of July, the Battle of the Sawm Commemoration parade. And you'll have tens of thousands of people that come out and watch it.
[16:29]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
What about you guys? Is it in any way personal for you? Do you guys have that connection?
[16:34]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
Yeah, there would be a great great uncle of mine, Alan D'. Amster. He went off and was killed on the 1st of July. And there was a lot of other boys in the band. Has had a lot of of family members as well.
[16:44]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Like Peter's great great uncle. My great grandfather Josiah Dunbar was also from the Protestant community. But it wasn't only Unionists who signed up to fight. Thousands of Irish nationalists also fought for the British Army. But there are no parades to commemorate their part in the Somme. And it's many of their stories that are only now coming to light. You're listening to the documentary from from the BBC World Service with me, Jordan Dunbar.
[17:17]
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[18:56]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
So I'm on my way to visit a new museum in Belfast. It's called the Untold Museum and its mission is to tell the stories of the men and women across the island of Ireland who served in the British army and to help people all these years later trace loved ones.
[19:13]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Hi Sioux, how's it going?
[19:15]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
I've come to meet Siobhan, who's been researching her family's history.
[19:19]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
My grandfather was Michael Brennan. He was an Irish national volunteer. He served at the front line. The men from Belfast, from the Irish Nationalist volunteer background, they joined up in good faith, believing they were fighting for Ireland and freedom of small nations.
[19:34]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So Michael and those Catholic Nationalist soldiers believe they're going to get rewarded with Irish independence. So it's a sense of betrayal.
[19:43]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
It is indeed.
[19:45]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Many from the Nationalist community believed if they fought for the United Kingdom, Dublin would be granted more control away from London once the war was over. But instead it took another war, the war of Irish independence before Britain allows in the south what will eventually become an independent Irish state and Ireland is partitioned into north and south. I asked Siobhan what happened to her grandfather when he finally returned from the First World War trenches. Instead of coming home to the peace he must have dreamed of, she says, he was met with more violence as conflict erupts between Unionists and Nationalists.
[20:28]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
He served at the front line, his brother did not. But when they came back, their home was raided and shot. Was raided and his brother was actually shot in the back.
[20:39]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Hundreds of people on both sides were attacked or killed in sectarian violence fueled by battle hardened returning soldiers.
[20:46]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
His brother, he survived but died in the 1930s as a result of his wounds. So there was that.
[20:53]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
What was our reward when they first came home? Siobhan says the Nationalist Brigades did commemorate their part in the war, just like Unionists do. But as violence spiralled, that stopped.
[21:04]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
They marched through Belfast, had church services, but then some of their members were actually shot dead. And the last march they had was up to false route for burial of some of their compatriots comrades. And after that, they didn't commemorate again.
[21:20]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Instead, she says, many in the nationalist community felt shame that they'd served in the army, the army of a country that after all that had happened, many of them no longer felt part of
[21:31]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
it was hidden, it wasn't talked about at all. My grandfather returned his war medals. He didn't want them. He didn't want that reminder.
[21:39]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
These stories of young Irish nationalists like Siobhan's grandfather, who found fought for the British, were often kept quiet, even from their own families.
[21:47]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
Telling his story is like telling everybody else's veil. It gives people the confidence to come out and say, my grandfather was also in the army.
[21:56]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So more and more people from the nationalist community are discovering this and getting in contact.
[22:00]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
Yes, they are. Indeed.
[22:03]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Historian Jason Burke puts this greater willingness now to talk about the part that Nationalist soldiers played in the Great War down to the Northern Ireland peace process, a process that began 30 years ago.
[22:17]
Historian Jason Burke
And I think it's fair to say that the First World War has been beneficial in terms of cross community commemoration. There are aspects of the war where Unionists and Nationalists are known to have fought side by side and achieved a great victory. That's something which has been used in recent years in order to promote peace and reconciliation for Irish nationalists to be able to engage with their First World War path.
[22:46]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
110 years ago, all those Irishmen, Jason's great uncle George, my great grandfather Josiah, Siobhan's grandfather Michael, came here to northern France, to the banks of the River Somme, along with young Englishmen like Victor, Chris and David's great uncle. Scots, Welshmen, soldiers from Newfoundland, Canada, even a contingent from Bermuda faced the German army on that 1st day, the 1st of July 1916. Over 3 million soldiers from both sides would fight in the weeks of battle that followed. By the end of it, the British had advanced 11 kilometers.
[23:29]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Hi, Poppy.
[23:29]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
Hi, Jordan. Lovely to meet you.
[23:31]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Thank you so much for meeting us.
[23:33]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Poppy Mercier is a battlefield tour guide.
[23:36]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So when we talk about the Somme, I've driven past lots of different memorials. There's not been one place. Would it have been all around us?
[23:44]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
How far around us? We're looking at sort of 20, 25 kilometer front, and that's just for the British. So we're looking at miles and miles of fighting and this is just one very tiny sector of this.
[23:55]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Geezing out across this stretch of lush green field, interrupted only by passing tractors, it's hard to imagine the chaos and horror of back then. A quagmire of mud and bodies and barbed wire filled with the stench and deafening sound of war.
[24:18]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So where we're standing, that's where those men have to get past to get at each other. The Germans, this way, the British.
[24:25]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
So the Germans are defending this whole area. They do not want this area to fall into British hands, whereas the British are desperate to take this area because strategically it's a very important place. It was the breadbasket of France. It's also where there was lots of coal mining, industry. And one of the biggest things you need for a war is industry. You need coal.
[24:46]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Poppy takes me up to a hill to see what's known as the Loch Nagar crater. This is where, on the first day of the battle, the British army detonated a huge explosion. The aim was to confuse the enemy as British soldiers attacked. It followed a week of intense bombardment to try to weaken German defenses.
[25:08]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
It's absolutely massive.
[25:09]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
It's a.
[25:10]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
How did they do it? Looks like a moon critter.
[25:12]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
It does, doesn't it? So what you're seeing here is the result of a little large system of tunnels dug by men of the Royal Engineers, specialist tunnelers who in their previous life had been coal miners. And they, they ran these tunnels underneath the German front lines, underneath no Man's Land, to create this massive diversionary explosion.
[25:32]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Early on the morning of the 1st of July, the British detonated 19 of these huge buried bombs. The noise rose to a crescendo such
[25:45]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
as I'd never heard before, noise which made all bombardments that we'd heard in previous days seem like nothing at all.
[25:53]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And the effect of the bombardment created a sort of hysterical feeling. It was the loudest man made explosion until the atomic bomb. 30 years later. Two minutes afterwards, the whistle sounded, ordering British soldiers to climb out of their trenches and attack. The British were so confident their plan had worked, many soldiers were told to walk. But it hadn't worked. The Germans were waiting.
[26:23]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
Unfortunately, a lot of the shells were duds that were used, so they just didn't explode. But the one thing the British were not expecting was how well the Germans had dug in underground. So they had had two years to construct these beautifully ornate systems of tunnels which were essentially impregnable.
[26:41]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So when the men went over the top, that first wave, 7:30, if they get past the British barbwire, they've got to get past the German barbwire and there's shell holes and so on. What's facing them in the German trenches?
[26:54]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
Machine guns. That was the biggest problem they faced. And the Germans had a field of fire that completely covered the front line. It was the British of the 29th Division that went over first and their attack was not particularly successful. So the Newfoundlanders were sent in to try and reinforce that attack. About an hour later, the Newfoundland regiment was approximately 7, 800 men. And the next morning there was only 68 of them left.
[27:22]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
68.
[27:23]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
68. And where we're standing in Newfoundland park is really quite special to me because this is where my great uncle was on the morning of the first of July.
[27:33]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Here.
[27:34]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
Here, yes. Yeah. So he was in one of the trenches just behind us, and just as he was leaving the trench, he was shot in the chest.
[27:41]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So he didn't even make it that far?
[27:43]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
No, he got pulled back by one of his comrades into the trench and it was that that probably saved his life.
[27:49]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Standing here now, I feel like I can hear the noise of the battle, the carnage, the shouts, the machine gun fire, the cries of the wounded. A little way further along this line is where the Irish soldiers from the 36th Ulster Division, including my great grandfather, were based. We know that when they went over the top, the two sides were so close, they and the Germans were actually engaging in hand to hand combat. I remember seeing a mace in the museum in Belfast. It's something we usually associate with medieval battles, this heavy club with its big spiked metal head, but they used it here at the Somme, the Irish battalions in particular. And the Irish losses were immense. I remember the Belfast historian Jason Burke
[28:35]
Historian Jason Burke
telling me the Ulster division is about 16, 17,000 strong. They suffer 5,500 casualties, of which about half of those are fatalities in just two days, many of them in the first of July, but a second of July as well. So those are, those are hefty numbers from a geographical area as small as Ulster was, with a sparse population, a seismic and horrific loss.
[29:03]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And there'd be more losses, of course, in the months to come.
[29:06]
Historian Jason Burke
For Irish nationalists, really their moment arrives In September of 1916, the where they're tasked with liberating the villages of Guillemont and Ginchy. The Irish divisions were successful in liberating those villages, but again, it was at a terrible cost. You know, several thousand casualties, of which about a thousand were fatalities. You know, so the Belfast. Ulster and Irish losses at the Battle of the somme throughout the 141 days were horrendous.
[29:43]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Hearing those stories, seeing those battlefields in northern France and the memorials to those who died, it's got me thinking again about my own great grandfather Josiah, and what he might have gone through. And something I struggle to understand is why a young man from rural Ireland, a world away from international politics, would volunteer to go to war. To try and find out, I've come back to the Untold Museum in Belfast.
[30:09]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
Yes, very much still a building site.
[30:13]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Dr. Laura Patrick is a museum's director. She's offered to look into my great grandfather's story and I've come to hear what she's discovered.
[30:22]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So what I'd been told sort of through the family, is that he's from Oma, really rural Ulster. He had been gassed and then that a shell had hit a trench and he'd been buried and he came back
[30:34]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
a very different person.
[30:35]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
Yeah. So we actually did a little bit of research and so he served with the 9th Battalion, the Royal Enniskilling Fusiliers. His local regiment there had their depot in Omer and He served from September 1914 until March 1918.
[30:50]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Four years.
[30:51]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
Yes. He did a long service. Was injured in July of 1916 at the Somme, and because of that, he wore a silver star to indicate that he had had an injury.
[31:02]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
But he went back.
[31:03]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
He went back.
[31:04]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Why would he ever go back?
[31:06]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Was that common?
[31:07]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
Yes, because it was a career for a lot of them. It was their service and it was love of the regiment. He was discharged in March of 1918 because of shell shock. You're saying he came back a changed man? Yeah, he absolutely did.
[31:24]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
This is all to hear this officially is, yeah.
[31:28]
Narrator/Announcer
Wow.
[31:29]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
I still cannot believe that after you get gassed and seen people buried life,
[31:33]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
that you would go back for four years of that. Maybe that shell shock, or ptsd, as we'd call it now, helps explain the man he was when he came home. A very different person to the young man who left his small town in 1914. And we've already heard from historian Jason Burke how much the Ireland that Josiah and the other Irish soldiers came back to had also changed by 1920. The British government is looking for a way out, a political solution. That December, it brings in the Government of Ireland Act. The following year, Ireland is divided into north and South. And out of the ashes of the First World War in the Somme, the present day Republic of Ireland will be born in and two new nations created who must now try to learn to live together on one island, side by side. All these years later, the remains of around hundred British and Commonwealth Soldiers are still found on these old battlefields. Every year, each one is given a proper funeral, their death marked. Today there's a burial of a First World War soldier who couldn't be identified.
[32:52]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
Let us commend our fallen comrade to God's love and mercy.
[32:58]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
I'm joined by Victor's great nephews, Chris and David, who, like me, have come to pay their respects.
[33:04]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
They shall not grow old as we who are left grow old. Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemned. At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. We will remember them.
[33:38]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
The tears were tricky during that. I was so surprised at how much that touched me.
[33:43]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
Yes, I know. 110 years later, yeah, you start thinking about this unknown soldier's family. You know, he had probably a brother or loved ones, work colleagues, friends, all these people, even not knowing whether he was dead or alive.
[33:57]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
And.
[33:57]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
And that's exactly what happened with Victor.
[34:01]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
And did you think about Victor and kind of process that?
[34:04]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
Yeah, I did. I felt that they both paid the ultimate sacrifice. And I think it was important that we paid our respects and also all the other soldiers as well as Victor.
[34:21]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
The question I keep asking myself is, would I do what they did? Would I go to war? And I hope I'd be brave enough if the call came, if the cause was right. Because when I think of what these young men went through at the Somme, when I think of the sacrifices they made, what comes up for me is the sheer weight of responsibility on leaders. Because if you're gonna ask men and women to sacrifice themselves, if you're gonna ask them to give their today for
[34:53]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
our tomorrow, you're gonna. You can't take those sacrifices for granted.
[34:57]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
And so however we choose to remember the Psalm, can we do it in a way that means that we're not going to repeat the mistakes of the past?
[35:11]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
You've been listening to the documentary with me, Jordan Dunbar. It was written and produced by Louise Hidalgo. The editor was Rebecca Henchke. Sound design was by Neil Churchill. Technical support was from James Shearing.

Summary5 min read

The Documentary Podcast: "A Battle That Changed Ireland"

BBC World Service | Host: Jordan Dunbar | July 30, 2026

Overview

This deeply engaging episode explores the enduring legacy of the Battle of the Somme, fought in 1916, and how it profoundly shaped families, communities, and national identities across Ireland—both among Unionists and Nationalists. Host Jordan Dunbar returns to his native Belfast to uncover personal and collective memories, revisits family war legacies, explores shifting attitudes towards remembrance, and investigates how this singular battle left scars—visible and hidden—that persist more than a century later.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Somme and Its Lasting Significance in Ireland

Site of Mass Loss: The Battle of the Somme, beginning July 1, 1916, saw 19,000 British and 6,000 German soldiers killed on the first day alone.
In Northern Ireland, entire streets lost sons, embedding the Somme into Protestant Unionist communal memory.
Jordan Dunbar:

"Here in my home city, Belfast, among the Protestant community, the memory of what happened at the Somme 110 years ago is still, incredibly, after all these years, very much part of daily life." (02:24)

2. Contrasting Memories: Unionist and Nationalist Perspectives

Unionist Commemorations:
- Murals, memorials, and marching bands central to loyalist identity.
- Community Member:
  
  "The battle of the Somme was most important... because of the sacrifice made... we think it's important that we carry their name on and remember the sacrifice." (04:31)
Nationalist Silence and Shame:
- In Catholic Nationalist neighborhoods, commemorations are absent.
- Many Nationalists also fought for Britain, mistakenly hoping for political rewards.
- Siobhan:
  
  "It was hidden, it wasn't talked about at all. My grandfather returned his war medals. He didn't want them." (21:31)

3. Impact on Families: Personal Stories and Letter Discoveries

Dunbar's Family: Josiah Dunbar returned shell-shocked, never the same, affecting generations.
Chris & David's Family:
- Unearthed hundreds of letters from their great-uncle Victor, killed the first day of the Somme.
- Moving shift in Victor's correspondence from lightheartedness to despair:
  
  “One wonders that men can be such utter fools as to know no other way of settling their disputes except by causing such destruction to life.” (09:43)
Enduring Grief: Victor's brother Frank, unable to serve, was haunted for life by survivor's guilt.

"He still couldn't deal with it. The fact that he wasn't there." (11:24)

4. The Political Context: Ireland Before, During, and After

Pre-war Ireland was united under British rule, divided between pro-British Unionists and Nationalists seeking Home Rule.
Jason Burke (Historian):

“It’s not what happens on the battlefield, it's everything that happens after.” (13:23)
The 1916 Easter Rising (rebellion for Irish independence) and harsh British response shifted public sentiment, setting the stage for Ireland’s partition after WWI.

5. Changing Narratives and Modern Reconciliation

Nationalist stories long hidden, some viewed WWI service as a betrayal after partition; trauma compounded by violence against returning veterans.
Only after the Northern Ireland peace process did cross-community commemoration increase.

"The First World War has been beneficial in terms of cross community commemoration... used in recent years in order to promote peace and reconciliation." – Jason Burke (22:16)

6. The Reality of War: Trench Life and Losses

Battlefield tour with guide Poppy Mercier vividly illustrates desperate conditions, strategic failures, and why losses were so devastating:

"The British were so confident their plan had worked, many soldiers were told to walk. But it hadn't worked. The Germans were waiting." (25:52)
Specific atrocities and heroism recounted, e.g. only 68 of 780 Newfoundland Regiment survived the first wave (27:22).
Hand-to-hand fighting and use of weapons like medieval maces highlighted the horror.

"The Ulster division... suffer 5,500 casualties, of which about half... are fatalities in just two days." – Jason Burke (28:35)

7. Searching for Reasons: Why Did They Fight?

For many Irish soldiers, enlistment offered employment, adventure, or hopes of winning independence.
Host’s search for clarity on his great-grandfather’s motives emphasizes generational distance and enduring mystery.

“Maybe that shell shock, or PTSD as we’d call it now, helps explain the man he was when he came home.” – Jordan Dunbar (31:33)

8. Remembrance and Responsibility

Annual discoveries of remains still bring communities together for commemorations today.
Emotional funeral of an unknown soldier prompts reflection on sacrifice.

"Would I do what they did? Would I go to war?...if you’re gonna ask men and women to sacrifice themselves...you can’t take those sacrifices for granted." – Jordan Dunbar (34:20, 34:52)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On Memory’s Power:

"The ghosts of the Somme continue to walk among us today, Jordan, whether we realize it or not."
— Historian Jason Burke (12:32)
Changing Attitudes:

"Telling his story is like telling everybody else's veil. It gives people the confidence to come out and say, my grandfather was also in the army."
— Siobhan (21:47)
Hard Statistics:

"Ulster division... suffer 5,500 casualties, of which about half... are fatalities in just two days."
— Jason Burke (28:35)
On Leadership and Sacrifice:

"If you're gonna ask men and women to sacrifice... you can't take those sacrifices for granted."
— Jordan Dunbar (34:52)

Important Segment Timestamps

01:40 – Graveside ceremony for an unknown Somme soldier
04:31 – Unionist community perspective on commemoration
05:19 – Nationalist silence and absence of commemoration
09:43 – Victor’s somber letter on the futility of war
12:32 – “The ghosts of the Somme” and its enduring presence
13:59 – Historian explains pre-war Irish political divisions
15:22 – Easter Rising and its impact
19:19 – Siobhan recounts Nationalist volunteer story and betrayal
22:16 – Historian discusses post-peace-process remembrance
25:52 – The shock of the failed British attack on the first day of the Somme
28:35 – In-depth Ulster and Irish casualty numbers
31:07 – The personal toll of shell shock (PTSD)
33:04 – Graveside tribute quoting “They shall not grow old...”
34:20 – Dunbar’s final personal reflections on remembrance

Final Thoughts

This episode masterfully intertwines personal family histories, collective memory, and historical context, asking listeners to reflect not only on the horror and loss of the Somme but also the ongoing impact of how societies choose to remember—or forget—their shared pasts. Through emotive personal accounts, expert commentary, and visits to memorials and battlegrounds, it highlights the complexities of Irish identity, the costs of conflict, and the importance of honoring history’s lessons.

The tone is empathetic, questioning, and honest—inviting listeners to consider what remembrance means today, and how it can help heal old wounds and prevent new ones.

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Transcript177 lines

[00:00]
Narrator/Announcer
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[01:41]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
The in renue a set ceremonie d' in humaison pour une soldat in conneux de la Grande Guerre. As we lay to rest an unknown soldier of the Great War, though his name is lost to us, his life is not. He was someone's son, a friend, a comrade in arms.
[02:09]
Historian Jason Burke
I never seen so many dead men clumped together as what I saw bed and I thought to myself, oh, the world's dead. They're all dead.
[02:25]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
We're standing on the site of one of the bloodiest days in the history of warfare, burying one of the many young men who died here. 1st July 1916, the start of the Battle of the Somme. Here in the fields of northern France, more than 19,000 British soldiers and 6,000 German soldiers lost their lives in that one single day of the First World War. 40,000 British soldiers were injured or captured. It's still one of the costliest and most bitterly fought battles in British military history. And in the following four months of battle, more than a million soldiers from both sides would be wounded or killed. In Northern Ireland, where I come from, whole streets lost their sons in the first two days of the battle. And here in my home city, Belfast, among the Protestant community The memory of what happened at the Somme110 years ago is still, incredibly, after all these years, very much part of daily life.
[03:41]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
I used to live just over there. And even just walking to the shops, you have the Psalm remembered on walls around you. Behind this building, literally just on that street, there's another Psalm mural. Because in Belfast, more than the Second World War, the Psalm is remembered on walls across the city, not just at war memorials.
[04:04]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And it's not just murals and memorial gardens.
[04:08]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
In working class Loyalist communities right across Northern Ireland, marching bands are a massive part of life. People get together, play the flutes, the drums, and they'll march for many different reasons. But one of the big reasons that they do march is to commemorate the Somme. Why the Somme? What is it about that battle that's so important to you guys?
[04:32]
Unionist Community Member
Well, the battle of the song was most important to the Protestant Unionist community because of the sacrifice made on the first day of the Somme. There was over 2,000 lives lost that came from these streets. So we think it's important that we carry their name on and remember the sacrifice that they give the full week of things we have today.
[04:48]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
You know, when you look back and listen to some of the stories that I've certainly heard, there was young men ran away from home. A fell out of our band, his uncle, great uncle, ran away from home. They enlist to go and fight. I don't think there's too many people who do that today go and defend their country. And you can't forget that.
[05:03]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Yet just a few streets away in the mainly Catholic part of Belfast, people see that time very differently. Back in 1914, their sons went to fight in the First World War for Britain, too. But today there are no parades, no commemorations.
[05:19]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
This is the most famous nationalist part of Belfast.
[05:23]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And here for decades you had silence
[05:26]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
and in some cases, even shame. Yet all of those men went through the same thing at the same battle, but the reactions on each side of the city are completely different.
[05:40]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
You're listening to the documentary from the BBC World Service. I'm Jordan Dunbar, and in this episode, I want to find out more about the untold stories from one of history's most most infamous battles. With trench warfare now returned to Europe and Ukraine, I want to know how that battle, over a century ago in the war supposed to end all wars, shaped families and communities and the island of Ireland that I call home, how families are still discovering all these years later the truth of what happened to their grandfathers and great grandfathers. Families lives like mine.
[06:19]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
So we actually did a little Bit of research on your great grandfather.
[06:22]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Okay.
[06:22]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
You're saying he came back a changed man? Yeah, he actually did.
[06:26]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Any of this is all to hear this officially is, yeah. Wow.
[06:31]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And it's not just my family in Ireland. Others across the UK are also uncovering things they didn't know about their relatives who fought at the Somme. Wow, look at all these letters. Hundreds in there.
[06:48]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah. Probably even thousands.
[06:50]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Feel like a suburban. Indiana Jones is incredible. Can we take some of these downstairs?
[06:58]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Absolutely. Let's go through them.
[07:00]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
A few years ago, brothers Chris and David were clearing out their father's attic in a quiet suburban street in North London when they found a huge stash of letters and other memorabilia. The letters were from their grandfather's younger brother, Victor, who fought at the Battle of the Somme.
[07:17]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
A lot of them not even opened.
[07:20]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Is it over 110 years old?
[07:22]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah, absolutely. It was quite a find. So that was Victor.
[07:27]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Chris shows me a black and white picture of a dapper young man in his uniform with facial hair I can only dream of. And another picture of his best friend
[07:37]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Gerald, who took the photos.
[07:39]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Both great moustaches. Yeah, Very off the time.
[07:43]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah.
[07:44]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
When the First World War broke out in 1914, Chris and David's grandfather Frank had gone with his younger brother Victor to their nearby recruiting office in London to sign up to fight. But Frank was refused on medical grounds. Instead, he had to content himself with the hundreds of letters his brother sent home, sometimes daily describing life at the front.
[08:06]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Dear lassies and lads.
[08:07]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Dear lassies and lads. So my habitation at present and for the two following days is in a little house, or rather farmstead, which we call Red House. This place is the nearest fortified position we hold, about 600 yards behind the trenches.
[08:22]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Somebody in our bedroom is trying to
[08:24]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
kill us by singing Thora.
[08:28]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
Look at this.
[08:28]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Last Wednesday we went to the cinema.
[08:31]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Wow.
[08:32]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So this is 1915.
[08:34]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah.
[08:35]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
And all's well, the mates are all together?
[08:38]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah.
[08:39]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Chasing girls are going to the cinema when they're not fighting.
[08:42]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
They're trying to have some form of normality, Right?
[08:45]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah. And there's stories about getting local wine and then staying up all night drinking it. And then there's stories about where they befriend a cow who's been injured, but it means that they get a pint of milk. And then alongside that is pictures of a gas attack.
[09:02]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
The pictures were taken by Victor's friend Gerald. Soldiers weren't allowed to have cameras, so Gerald photographed in secret. It's an extraordinary record. One photograph shows Victor sitting on a box in the middle of a deserted road. Writing, maybe writing one of the letters we're looking at now.
[09:20]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Do you see his attitude to the war changing as it goes on?
[09:26]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
That's absolutely the thing. The letters start to get a little bit darker.
[09:30]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
In one of the letters, he describes seeing a village absolutely obliterated. There were dead horses, dead bodies, buildings destroyed. I think this is probably the most telling letter.
[09:44]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah. And he writes, one wonders that men can be such utter fools as to know no other way of settling their disputes except by causing such destruction to life. Property that can never be replaced.
[09:57]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
It's like a different person.
[09:58]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah.
[09:59]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
One other thing David and Chris found in their father's attic was Victor's will.
[10:04]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Dear Father, not having made a will before leaving home, I have done so in my paybook. £5 for my bank account to go
[10:14]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
to Frank on behalf of the tennis
[10:16]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
club, to be used as they see fit. The remainder of the money to mother, my post office savings and warlo and all personal effects to go to Frank. Victor Hember, 27th of the 6th, 1916.
[10:31]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Wow.
[10:31]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So you've got the will being written five days before battle of the Somme begins. They had a sense that this was going to be bigger than all the other.
[10:43]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
That will was the last thing Victor ever sent home to his family. He was killed on the first day of the battle. Chris and David say their grandfather Frank never recovered from the grief or the guilt of not being able to protect his younger brother or fight for his country.
[11:01]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
He was still trying to sign up even in 1917, even after his brother's death.
[11:07]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
It's just heartbreaking as well that he felt then that he needed to resign his post as a captain at a tennis club.
[11:16]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Does he say why he did that?
[11:18]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
Yeah. He doesn't feel he's. He's an appropriate person to be in charge of other people.
[11:23]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
He couldn't deal with it.
[11:24]
Chris or David (Brothers with Letters)
He still couldn't deal with it. The fact that he wasn't there.
[11:29]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Victor's body was never recovered. I've come back home to Belfast. The Battle of the Somme has cast a long shadow over what happened here in Northern Ireland. And just like Chris and David's family and so many families across the UK and Europe, it had a lasting impact on my family too. I remember my father telling me that his grandfather, Josiah Dunbar, had been injured at the Somme and had seen terrible things. When he came home from the war, Josiah was a different person. He never worked again. And it sounded like it was a cold house to grow up in. My father only knew this from other people. There was a medal in a drawer, but silence about how it got there. Josiah never spoke about what he'd been through, but it affected all of us who came after.
[12:32]
Historian Jason Burke
I like to tell my visitors on the tours that the ghosts of the Somme continue to walk among us today. Jordan, whether we realize it or not.
[12:41]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Historian Jason Burke gives walking tours around Belfast about the Battle of the Somme and the First World War.
[12:47]
Historian Jason Burke
The very streets where I grew up, for example, and why I have an interest in the First World War at all. The street names, for example, were Somme Drive, Thiefval Avenue, Albert Drive, you know, and those are battle sites from the First World War. So I grew up literally with the war all around me as well.
[13:06]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Why was it so important?
[13:08]
Historian Jason Burke
It's often said that there wasn't a street across the province which didn't have the curtains and blinds pulled because a young man from that particular street had lost his life at the Battle of
[13:19]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
the Somme, including Jason's own great uncle, George Burke.
[13:23]
Historian Jason Burke
But it's symbolic of, you know, why the Somme so fascinating, because in actual fact, it's not what happens on the battlefield, it's everything that happens after. And right up to this day.
[13:33]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
In 1914, when the First World War broke out, the whole of the island of Ireland was part of Britain, not just Northern Ireland as it is now. The British government had just agreed to devolve some power to Dublin. They called it Home Rule. But the communities in the north, the Protestants who were close to Britain, known as Loyalists or Unionists, and the Catholics who were more supportive of Irish nationalism, couldn't agree.
[13:59]
Historian Jason Burke
Irish nationalism was somewhat comfortable with the idea of a sort of quasi independent Ireland within the confines of the United Kingdom. However, unionism had resisted this at every turn. They very much saw Home Rule as, I suppose, a political watering down of the situation.
[14:21]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Then in April 1916, some more militant Irish nationalists decided they did want more power for Dublin and they launched a rebellion. It was called the Easter Rising.
[14:34]
Historian Jason Burke
The great historian describes the Easter Rising as a flip moment, as a moment that changed everything in Irish history. And again, the war is the context for all of this.
[14:45]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
With the British army distracted by the war, rebels in Dublin proclaim independence.
[14:51]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
The British quickly respond.
[14:53]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
A five day battle ends with the rebel leaders being put to death by firing squad.
[14:59]
Historian Jason Burke
Britain wanted to be seen to be reacting swiftly in order to set an example to other potentially rebellious nations within the British Empire. And in reality, the Easter Rising didn't have much public support. Their over the top reaction, you might say, somehow managed to turn Irish society against them. Him in the space of just a few days.
[15:22]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
It's against this backdrop that two months later Irish soldiers will be among those who fight and die at the Battle of the Somme.
[15:40]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
These are the guys that I've come to see. So this band, Goodrich Star were based just a few streets away from where I used to be to live. That is like worried about his wrists. So this is it. This is the Gertrude Star memorial mural?
[15:57]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
Yeah, it is indeed. Yeah.
[15:59]
Unionist Community Member
As far as I can remember, there's
[16:00]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
always been a mural from the, from our band on this wall.
[16:03]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Kyle and Peter are two of the drummers from the Gertrude Star Flute Band. They're young, not a generation you'd normally think would be interested in a battle over a century old. Guys, where does the name come from?
[16:15]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
There was 12 young men from Griffith street who actually went to Sawmontide at the time and we just wanted to make sure that they were being remembered in the right way.
[16:21]
Unionist Community Member
The day of most importance for us is the first of July, the Battle of the Sawm Commemoration parade. And you'll have tens of thousands of people that come out and watch it.
[16:29]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
What about you guys? Is it in any way personal for you? Do you guys have that connection?
[16:34]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
Yeah, there would be a great great uncle of mine, Alan D'. Amster. He went off and was killed on the 1st of July. And there was a lot of other boys in the band. Has had a lot of of family members as well.
[16:44]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Like Peter's great great uncle. My great grandfather Josiah Dunbar was also from the Protestant community. But it wasn't only Unionists who signed up to fight. Thousands of Irish nationalists also fought for the British Army. But there are no parades to commemorate their part in the Somme. And it's many of their stories that are only now coming to light. You're listening to the documentary from from the BBC World Service with me, Jordan Dunbar.
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[18:56]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
So I'm on my way to visit a new museum in Belfast. It's called the Untold Museum and its mission is to tell the stories of the men and women across the island of Ireland who served in the British army and to help people all these years later trace loved ones.
[19:13]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Hi Sioux, how's it going?
[19:15]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
I've come to meet Siobhan, who's been researching her family's history.
[19:19]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
My grandfather was Michael Brennan. He was an Irish national volunteer. He served at the front line. The men from Belfast, from the Irish Nationalist volunteer background, they joined up in good faith, believing they were fighting for Ireland and freedom of small nations.
[19:34]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So Michael and those Catholic Nationalist soldiers believe they're going to get rewarded with Irish independence. So it's a sense of betrayal.
[19:43]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
It is indeed.
[19:45]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Many from the Nationalist community believed if they fought for the United Kingdom, Dublin would be granted more control away from London once the war was over. But instead it took another war, the war of Irish independence before Britain allows in the south what will eventually become an independent Irish state and Ireland is partitioned into north and south. I asked Siobhan what happened to her grandfather when he finally returned from the First World War trenches. Instead of coming home to the peace he must have dreamed of, she says, he was met with more violence as conflict erupts between Unionists and Nationalists.
[20:28]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
He served at the front line, his brother did not. But when they came back, their home was raided and shot. Was raided and his brother was actually shot in the back.
[20:39]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Hundreds of people on both sides were attacked or killed in sectarian violence fueled by battle hardened returning soldiers.
[20:46]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
His brother, he survived but died in the 1930s as a result of his wounds. So there was that.
[20:53]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
What was our reward when they first came home? Siobhan says the Nationalist Brigades did commemorate their part in the war, just like Unionists do. But as violence spiralled, that stopped.
[21:04]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
They marched through Belfast, had church services, but then some of their members were actually shot dead. And the last march they had was up to false route for burial of some of their compatriots comrades. And after that, they didn't commemorate again.
[21:20]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Instead, she says, many in the nationalist community felt shame that they'd served in the army, the army of a country that after all that had happened, many of them no longer felt part of
[21:31]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
it was hidden, it wasn't talked about at all. My grandfather returned his war medals. He didn't want them. He didn't want that reminder.
[21:39]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
These stories of young Irish nationalists like Siobhan's grandfather, who found fought for the British, were often kept quiet, even from their own families.
[21:47]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
Telling his story is like telling everybody else's veil. It gives people the confidence to come out and say, my grandfather was also in the army.
[21:56]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So more and more people from the nationalist community are discovering this and getting in contact.
[22:00]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
Yes, they are. Indeed.
[22:03]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Historian Jason Burke puts this greater willingness now to talk about the part that Nationalist soldiers played in the Great War down to the Northern Ireland peace process, a process that began 30 years ago.
[22:17]
Historian Jason Burke
And I think it's fair to say that the First World War has been beneficial in terms of cross community commemoration. There are aspects of the war where Unionists and Nationalists are known to have fought side by side and achieved a great victory. That's something which has been used in recent years in order to promote peace and reconciliation for Irish nationalists to be able to engage with their First World War path.
[22:46]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
110 years ago, all those Irishmen, Jason's great uncle George, my great grandfather Josiah, Siobhan's grandfather Michael, came here to northern France, to the banks of the River Somme, along with young Englishmen like Victor, Chris and David's great uncle. Scots, Welshmen, soldiers from Newfoundland, Canada, even a contingent from Bermuda faced the German army on that 1st day, the 1st of July 1916. Over 3 million soldiers from both sides would fight in the weeks of battle that followed. By the end of it, the British had advanced 11 kilometers.
[23:29]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Hi, Poppy.
[23:29]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
Hi, Jordan. Lovely to meet you.
[23:31]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Thank you so much for meeting us.
[23:33]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Poppy Mercier is a battlefield tour guide.
[23:36]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So when we talk about the Somme, I've driven past lots of different memorials. There's not been one place. Would it have been all around us?
[23:44]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
How far around us? We're looking at sort of 20, 25 kilometer front, and that's just for the British. So we're looking at miles and miles of fighting and this is just one very tiny sector of this.
[23:55]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Geezing out across this stretch of lush green field, interrupted only by passing tractors, it's hard to imagine the chaos and horror of back then. A quagmire of mud and bodies and barbed wire filled with the stench and deafening sound of war.
[24:18]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So where we're standing, that's where those men have to get past to get at each other. The Germans, this way, the British.
[24:25]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
So the Germans are defending this whole area. They do not want this area to fall into British hands, whereas the British are desperate to take this area because strategically it's a very important place. It was the breadbasket of France. It's also where there was lots of coal mining, industry. And one of the biggest things you need for a war is industry. You need coal.
[24:46]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Poppy takes me up to a hill to see what's known as the Loch Nagar crater. This is where, on the first day of the battle, the British army detonated a huge explosion. The aim was to confuse the enemy as British soldiers attacked. It followed a week of intense bombardment to try to weaken German defenses.
[25:08]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
It's absolutely massive.
[25:09]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
It's a.
[25:10]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
How did they do it? Looks like a moon critter.
[25:12]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
It does, doesn't it? So what you're seeing here is the result of a little large system of tunnels dug by men of the Royal Engineers, specialist tunnelers who in their previous life had been coal miners. And they, they ran these tunnels underneath the German front lines, underneath no Man's Land, to create this massive diversionary explosion.
[25:32]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Early on the morning of the 1st of July, the British detonated 19 of these huge buried bombs. The noise rose to a crescendo such
[25:45]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
as I'd never heard before, noise which made all bombardments that we'd heard in previous days seem like nothing at all.
[25:53]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And the effect of the bombardment created a sort of hysterical feeling. It was the loudest man made explosion until the atomic bomb. 30 years later. Two minutes afterwards, the whistle sounded, ordering British soldiers to climb out of their trenches and attack. The British were so confident their plan had worked, many soldiers were told to walk. But it hadn't worked. The Germans were waiting.
[26:23]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
Unfortunately, a lot of the shells were duds that were used, so they just didn't explode. But the one thing the British were not expecting was how well the Germans had dug in underground. So they had had two years to construct these beautifully ornate systems of tunnels which were essentially impregnable.
[26:41]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So when the men went over the top, that first wave, 7:30, if they get past the British barbwire, they've got to get past the German barbwire and there's shell holes and so on. What's facing them in the German trenches?
[26:54]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
Machine guns. That was the biggest problem they faced. And the Germans had a field of fire that completely covered the front line. It was the British of the 29th Division that went over first and their attack was not particularly successful. So the Newfoundlanders were sent in to try and reinforce that attack. About an hour later, the Newfoundland regiment was approximately 7, 800 men. And the next morning there was only 68 of them left.
[27:22]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
68.
[27:23]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
68. And where we're standing in Newfoundland park is really quite special to me because this is where my great uncle was on the morning of the first of July.
[27:33]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Here.
[27:34]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
Here, yes. Yeah. So he was in one of the trenches just behind us, and just as he was leaving the trench, he was shot in the chest.
[27:41]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So he didn't even make it that far?
[27:43]
Poppy Mercier (Battlefield Tour Guide)
No, he got pulled back by one of his comrades into the trench and it was that that probably saved his life.
[27:49]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Standing here now, I feel like I can hear the noise of the battle, the carnage, the shouts, the machine gun fire, the cries of the wounded. A little way further along this line is where the Irish soldiers from the 36th Ulster Division, including my great grandfather, were based. We know that when they went over the top, the two sides were so close, they and the Germans were actually engaging in hand to hand combat. I remember seeing a mace in the museum in Belfast. It's something we usually associate with medieval battles, this heavy club with its big spiked metal head, but they used it here at the Somme, the Irish battalions in particular. And the Irish losses were immense. I remember the Belfast historian Jason Burke
[28:35]
Historian Jason Burke
telling me the Ulster division is about 16, 17,000 strong. They suffer 5,500 casualties, of which about half of those are fatalities in just two days, many of them in the first of July, but a second of July as well. So those are, those are hefty numbers from a geographical area as small as Ulster was, with a sparse population, a seismic and horrific loss.
[29:03]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
And there'd be more losses, of course, in the months to come.
[29:06]
Historian Jason Burke
For Irish nationalists, really their moment arrives In September of 1916, the where they're tasked with liberating the villages of Guillemont and Ginchy. The Irish divisions were successful in liberating those villages, but again, it was at a terrible cost. You know, several thousand casualties, of which about a thousand were fatalities. You know, so the Belfast. Ulster and Irish losses at the Battle of the somme throughout the 141 days were horrendous.
[29:43]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Hearing those stories, seeing those battlefields in northern France and the memorials to those who died, it's got me thinking again about my own great grandfather Josiah, and what he might have gone through. And something I struggle to understand is why a young man from rural Ireland, a world away from international politics, would volunteer to go to war. To try and find out, I've come back to the Untold Museum in Belfast.
[30:09]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
Yes, very much still a building site.
[30:13]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Dr. Laura Patrick is a museum's director. She's offered to look into my great grandfather's story and I've come to hear what she's discovered.
[30:22]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
So what I'd been told sort of through the family, is that he's from Oma, really rural Ulster. He had been gassed and then that a shell had hit a trench and he'd been buried and he came back
[30:34]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
a very different person.
[30:35]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
Yeah. So we actually did a little bit of research and so he served with the 9th Battalion, the Royal Enniskilling Fusiliers. His local regiment there had their depot in Omer and He served from September 1914 until March 1918.
[30:50]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Four years.
[30:51]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
Yes. He did a long service. Was injured in July of 1916 at the Somme, and because of that, he wore a silver star to indicate that he had had an injury.
[31:02]
Siobhan (Family Historian)
But he went back.
[31:03]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
He went back.
[31:04]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
Why would he ever go back?
[31:06]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
Was that common?
[31:07]
Dr. Laura Patrick (Museum Director)
Yes, because it was a career for a lot of them. It was their service and it was love of the regiment. He was discharged in March of 1918 because of shell shock. You're saying he came back a changed man? Yeah, he absolutely did.
[31:24]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
This is all to hear this officially is, yeah.
[31:28]
Narrator/Announcer
Wow.
[31:29]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
I still cannot believe that after you get gassed and seen people buried life,
[31:33]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
that you would go back for four years of that. Maybe that shell shock, or ptsd, as we'd call it now, helps explain the man he was when he came home. A very different person to the young man who left his small town in 1914. And we've already heard from historian Jason Burke how much the Ireland that Josiah and the other Irish soldiers came back to had also changed by 1920. The British government is looking for a way out, a political solution. That December, it brings in the Government of Ireland Act. The following year, Ireland is divided into north and South. And out of the ashes of the First World War in the Somme, the present day Republic of Ireland will be born in and two new nations created who must now try to learn to live together on one island, side by side. All these years later, the remains of around hundred British and Commonwealth Soldiers are still found on these old battlefields. Every year, each one is given a proper funeral, their death marked. Today there's a burial of a First World War soldier who couldn't be identified.
[32:52]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
Let us commend our fallen comrade to God's love and mercy.
[32:58]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
I'm joined by Victor's great nephews, Chris and David, who, like me, have come to pay their respects.
[33:04]
Chaplain/Religious Speaker
They shall not grow old as we who are left grow old. Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemned. At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. We will remember them.
[33:38]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
The tears were tricky during that. I was so surprised at how much that touched me.
[33:43]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
Yes, I know. 110 years later, yeah, you start thinking about this unknown soldier's family. You know, he had probably a brother or loved ones, work colleagues, friends, all these people, even not knowing whether he was dead or alive.
[33:57]
Kyle or Peter (Drummers from Gertrude Star Flute Band)
And.
[33:57]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
And that's exactly what happened with Victor.
[34:01]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
And did you think about Victor and kind of process that?
[34:04]
David or Chris (Brother, Reflecting on Victor)
Yeah, I did. I felt that they both paid the ultimate sacrifice. And I think it was important that we paid our respects and also all the other soldiers as well as Victor.
[34:21]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
The question I keep asking myself is, would I do what they did? Would I go to war? And I hope I'd be brave enough if the call came, if the cause was right. Because when I think of what these young men went through at the Somme, when I think of the sacrifices they made, what comes up for me is the sheer weight of responsibility on leaders. Because if you're gonna ask men and women to sacrifice themselves, if you're gonna ask them to give their today for
[34:53]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
our tomorrow, you're gonna. You can't take those sacrifices for granted.
[34:57]
Jordan Dunbar (Narration/Interviewer)
And so however we choose to remember the Psalm, can we do it in a way that means that we're not going to repeat the mistakes of the past?
[35:11]
Jordan Dunbar (Documentary Host)
You've been listening to the documentary with me, Jordan Dunbar. It was written and produced by Louise Hidalgo. The editor was Rebecca Henchke. Sound design was by Neil Churchill. Technical support was from James Shearing.

A battle that changed Ireland

A battle that changed Ireland

The Documentary Podcast: "A Battle That Changed Ireland"

Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Somme and Its Lasting Significance in Ireland

2. Contrasting Memories: Unionist and Nationalist Perspectives

3. Impact on Families: Personal Stories and Letter Discoveries

4. The Political Context: Ireland Before, During, and After

5. Changing Narratives and Modern Reconciliation

6. The Reality of War: Trench Life and Losses

7. Searching for Reasons: Why Did They Fight?

8. Remembrance and Responsibility

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Important Segment Timestamps

Final Thoughts

The Documentary Podcast: "A Battle That Changed Ireland"

Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Somme and Its Lasting Significance in Ireland

2. Contrasting Memories: Unionist and Nationalist Perspectives

3. Impact on Families: Personal Stories and Letter Discoveries

4. The Political Context: Ireland Before, During, and After

5. Changing Narratives and Modern Reconciliation

6. The Reality of War: Trench Life and Losses

7. Searching for Reasons: Why Did They Fight?

8. Remembrance and Responsibility

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Important Segment Timestamps

Final Thoughts