722 - Oregon's Unwritten Law - Live

Summary

The Dollop Episode 722: Oregon's Unwritten Law (Live)

Podcast: The Dollop with Dave Anthony and Gareth Reynolds
Date: February 24, 2026
Theme: A comedic deep dive into the history of "Oregon’s Unwritten Law": an era when “honor killings”—particularly those involving men killing men (and sometimes women) for sexual transgressions—were not just morally excused but often legally tolerated in Oregon and across America. Through a series of wild, tragic, and absurd tales, Dave and Gareth lampoon the ways gender, reputation, and vigilante “justice” warped both the legal system and social norms.

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Overview

In this episode recorded live, Dave Anthony presents Gareth Reynolds with a bizarre and troubling chapter of Oregon history: the so-called "unwritten law." This informal but widely accepted code allowed men to kill people who, in their view, "dishonored" their homes or female relatives—most frequently over accusations of infidelity or sexual conduct. The episode follows infamous murder cases connected to this ideology, the slippery slope of its legal defense, a cult leader's sexual exploits, and the inevitable collapse of the policy as public opinion soured.

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Main Discussion Points & Insights

Introducing "The Unwritten Law"

• Dave opens with the 1859 case of Daniel Edgar Sickles, a NY congressman who murdered his wife’s lover, successfully pleading the first U.S. case of temporary insanity (“honor killing” defense).
• The unwritten law essentially entitled men to kill sexual "ruiners" of their female relatives with near impunity in both legal and social spheres.

Notable Quote:
Dave [04:39]: "This was the first use of temporary insanity as a defense, and the jury quickly found him not guilty. This is an honor killing, or as it would become known, the unwritten law, which means it’s okay to shoot cheaters."

The Belding Family Murders (Oregon, 1902)

• Alfred Belding murders his estranged wife Sylvia, her lover "Gip," and his mother-in-law, and attempts to kill his son and father-in-law; tries to use the unwritten law and insanity as defenses.
• Downfall: His own hypocrisy (he had a mistress), the killing spree beyond the “target” lovers, and nonchalance post-murder (ordering a drink) undermined sympathy.

Notable Moment:
Gareth [14:34]: "So funny that he was also cheating... he was like: Disgusting! You betrayed everything. This is my girlfriend. She’s awesome."

Key Takeaway:
The unwritten law had functional limits—familicide and child endangerment crossed the line, even for sympathetic juries.

The Cult of Edmund Creffield & Corvallis' Sexual Panic

• Edmund Creffield moves into the Hurt household, starts a free-love cult, and seduces both the wife and daughters.
• After the cult is kicked out, he’s tarred and feathered, then immediately marries a Hurt daughter, Maude.
• A husband of one of Creffield’s followers tries and fails to shoot him; George Mitchell, the brother of two of Creffield's lovers, tracks him and finally shoots him dead in Seattle (“I got my man”).

Notable Quotes:
Gareth [21:33]: "You've cucked me into another dimension."
Dave [30:13]: "So George Mitchell—the brother of Donna, Starr, and Esther—went to Seattle and shot Edmund. And George said, ‘I got my man.’"

Memorable Segment:
Family testifies in court about the graphic sexual details of Creffield’s exploits, resulting in open-court laughter and sobbing, culminating in Maude's suicide, Esther’s institutionalization and later suicide, and a chain-reaction of further tragedy.

The Mary Murray Case (Hubbard, 1905)

• 16-year-old Mary is seduced by Lincoln Whitney with a promise of marriage; he abandons her after she becomes pregnant.
• Her brother, Orlando, unsuccessfully attempts financial negotiation before shooting Lincoln three times.
• Orlando uses the unwritten law defense and is acquitted amidst sensationalistic press coverage, even as chaos erupts in the courtroom.

Notable Exchange:
Gareth [48:31]: "Feels very pedestrian… Hey, I killed a guy, I was pissed off… whoopsie. Banged my sister, can I go home?"
Dave [54:01]: "So the verdict ended up being innocent. And when it was read, an old woman yelled, 'Thank God for it.' And then the entire courtroom applauded and people rushed to congratulate Orlando.”

Gradual Collapse: Complexity, Contradiction, and Public Backlash

• A tragic, farcical chain of events involving infidelity, violence, corruption, and hypocrisy erode public faith in the unwritten law.
• Example: The Melvin and Kate Bradley case—after domestic violence, beatings, and a deadly bar brawl involving a cop who himself is sexually entangled with the family, the situation devolves into a sordid spectacle, further confusing the idea of “just” vengeance.

Notable Quotes:
Dave [74:36]: “Maybe life is a little too complicated for, like, the unwritten law.”
Gareth [74:44]: “Yeah, it might be. It really might just be time to allow sex to just—have people have sex. Don’t look at me.”

A Final Example: The Reynolds-Lulu-Hibbens Triangle

• Charles Reynolds, a Civil War veteran, discovers his much-younger wife, Lulu, is having an affair (as confirmed by their six-year-old).
• When direct confrontation and romantic "rescue" (day at the amusement park) fails, Charles murders her lover George. He’s found not guilty under the unwritten law.

Notable Exchange:
Dave [90:17]: "She wasn't hypnotized. Quote: We were just attracted to each other. The jury took 30 minutes to declare Charles innocent. But cases like this made people really rethink the unwritten law..."

The Beginning of the End

• After World War I, Oregon (and the nation) turn against "honor killing" as legal defense; convictions become more likely, and the unwritten law mostly dies out by the 1920s.
• Dave and Gareth end by lampooning the gendered double-standard that enabled generations of injustice—always at women’s and “home-wreckers’” expense.

Final Thoughts:
Gareth [93:02]: "It’s just a law to enable men in some way. Sometimes for murder. Right?"
Dave [93:12]: "Yeah… we were kind of running shit. Not very well."

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments with Timestamps

• [04:39] – Dave: "This is an honor killing, or as it would become known, the unwritten law, which means it’s okay to shoot cheaters."
• [14:34] – Gareth: "So funny that he was also cheating... he was like: Disgusting! You betrayed everything. This is my girlfriend. She’s awesome."
• [21:33] – Gareth: "You've cucked me into another dimension. By the way, I've been fucking you."
• [30:13] – Dave: "[Creffield case] George said 'I got my man.'"
• [54:01] – Dave: "So the verdict ended up being innocent. ...Old woman yelled, 'Thank God for it.' ...Courtroom applauded and people rushed to congratulate Orlando."
• [74:36] – Dave: "Maybe life is a little too complicated for, like, the unwritten law."
• [74:44] – Gareth: "Yeah, it might be. It really might just be time to allow sex to just—have people have sex. Don’t look at me."
• [90:17] – Dave: "She wasn't hypnotized... The jury took 30 minutes to declare Charles innocent. But cases like this made people really rethink the unwritten law..."
• [93:02] – Gareth: "It’s just a law to enable men in some way. Sometimes for murder. Right?"
• [93:12] – Dave: "Yeah… we were kind of running shit. Not very well."

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Episode Structure and Timestamps

• 00:59–02:14: Banter, audience/interruption, and intro to topic
• 02:20–07:59: History and context of honor killings/unwritten law (England to U.S.)
• 08:00–14:08: The Belding family tragedy (early example in Oregon)
• 20:11–35:50: The Edmund Creffield cult and its carnage
• 36:35–54:01: Mary Murray and Orlando's "honor murder" and court drama
• 54:01–74:15: The Bradley-Giddings murder—messy, almost satirical escalation
• 74:15–92:50: Later cases, public backlash, and the unwritten law's downfall
• 92:50–End: Closing thoughts on the gender bias and comedic wrap-up

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Tone and Style

• Bitingly satirical, irreverent, and openly critical of historical gender double standards
• Riffs and long improvised bits (esp. at [41:16], [82:53]) lampooning 19th–early 20th-century social mores, courtroom shenanigans, and the legal system's failures.
• Throughout, Gareth is baffled and incredulous, while Dave plays the “straight man” historian (with plenty of deadpan).

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Conclusion

This live episode showcases The Dollop's signature mix of meticulously-researched, absurd history and rapid-fire riffing. It exposes how the "unwritten law" allowed generations of violence and hypocrisy—especially against women—under the guise of "honor." Through increasingly outrageous stories, the hosts chart the rise and inevitable collapse of a cultural and legal farce, making it equally horrifying and hilarious for contemporary listeners. For fans of dark history, legal absurdity, or briskly confrontational comedy, this episode serves the goods.

Transcript

[A]

The Dollop will be on tour in March 2026. We are going to be in Buffalo on March 22. Then on the 23rd, we'll be in Syracuse. Then on March 24, we'll be in Boston at the Wilbur. Then on the 25th, we'll be in Bridgeport. And 26, the Gramercy Theater in New York. And then on the 27th, we'll be in Albany. And then on the 28th, we'll be in Pittsburgh. And then on the 29th, we'll be in Philadelphia. And then on the 30th, we'll be in Washington, D.C. at the Lincoln. The. Why would you name a theater after Lincoln? Anyway, that's our March 2026 tour. Go to dolloppodcast.com tour for tickets. You're listening to the Dollop.

[B]

Yeah. Well, Dave. Dave.

[A]

Those are good acoustics.

[B]

Dave.

[A]

What. What happened to the doll head? You took it off.

[B]

Yeah, I. It seems like people keep doing the Gary Chant. Maybe it's time for you to set people straight, because God knows I've tried.

[A]

His name is Garfy.

[B]

No, no, no, I do. I gotta be honest. I like the Counter Jose chant. That's nice. They're throwing the tear gas back at you. Cops.

[A]

February 20th.

[B]

They didn't even do the intro.

[A]

Oh, shit.

[B]

Christ.

[A]

I started it, right? And then they started chanting. That's what happened. You're listening to the Dollop. This is an American history podcast where each week I, Dave Anthony, read a story from American history to a bruh.

[B]

That's you, Gareth Reynolds, who has no idea what the topic is going to be about.

[A]

It's going to be about Oregon.

[B]

All right, I'll allow it.

[A]

February 27, 1859.

[B]

Sickles.

[A]

Daniel Edgar Sickles.

[B]

Sickles. Sounds like a disease where you die from buttons.

[A]

So Daniel Edgar Sickles was a congressman from New York, and he received an anonymous letter that said his much younger wife, Teresa, was having an affair with a man named Philip Barton Key. So Sickles confronted Teresa and she broke down and said, yeah, no, I. I was doing it with him. She was meeting Barton in a house, and they would go bang. Or, quote, what is usual for a wicked woman to do?

[B]

Oh, yeah. Oh, girl. What is usual for a wicked woman to do?

[A]

Say it again.

[B]

I can't remember it fully.

[A]

Sickles grabbed a gun and went out on the street to find Key. And when he saw him, he shouted, quote, key, you scoundrel. You have dishonored my bed. You must die.

[B]

I mean, yeah, so far it's pretty good. The Other. Well, neither guy has a leg to stand on. But this guy definitely doesn't have a leg to stand. He's right in the bed. That's worse. In the bed's worse.

[A]

I assume he was walking around thinking of what to say, because that's pretty good.

[B]

It is pretty good, but the bed is. The bed to me is worse than the banging. Yeah, cheat on me all you want, but you sleep with another guy in that bed. Oh, boy. And I mean, just take a nap. No, the dollops. Brought to you by Helix Helix.

[A]

So he shot. He shot Key twice.

[B]

Oh, shit.

[A]

So he died of what? I don't know. Nobody knows. Sickles was arrested and tried for first degree murder,

[B]

but your honor, I was just being a naughty boy. No.

[A]

How could I do it? This was the first use of temporary insanity as a defense, and the jury quickly found him not guilty. This is an honor killing, or as it would become known, the unwritten law, which means it's okay to shoot cheaters.

[B]

Wha. Wait, what?

[A]

So sympathies for men killing cheaters went back a while in the 16th and 17th centuries. In 1761, England, judges said, well, if you see it happening, go ahead and just kill the guy. Yep, that's fine.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

And in the 1800s, there were more killings and more sympathy. This is kind of all building. And you could kill someone who, quote, ruined your sister or another relative.

[B]

Now that's strange.

[A]

In an 1890 editorial in the Portland morning Oregonian. Just say Oregon. Why do you. You gotta throw morning in there? No one gives a shit.

[B]

What time was there an evening? I don't know if I answer that. Answer that question and I'll hear it.

[A]

No.

[B]

Overruled.

[A]

Supported the idea quote. There are certain gross offenses against persons, against. Against the family relations, against women, against virginity and against domestic chastity, against reputation and the finer sense of moral shame. Too impalpable to be measured by the course standards of formal law, too profound and far reaching in individual cases to be punished adequately by any penalties prescribed by the law for all cases alike.

[B]

All right. So fucking under certain circumstances could get you killed because the court would not

[A]

do out of wedlock.

[B]

So will you.

[A]

Someone's sister or will you.

[B]

Read that, Liz, quickly. Again.

[A]

There are certain gross offenses against persons, against the family relations, against women, against family relations.

[B]

So that means someone in your family or that means.

[A]

Yeah, like your sister or your.

[B]

Okay, so if your sister has sex,

[A]

you could kill that sister or daugh.

[B]

Daughter, you know, sister daughters, if they ever have sex, you could kill the guy.

[A]

If you do it before they're married.

[B]

Okay, gotcha. Okay.

[A]

Ever. You can't just go shoot some guy's.

[B]

Oh yeah. Imagine in the 60s.

[A]

Why? Did you read the newspaper? Yeah. It said I can show you now.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Against women, against virginity, against domestic chastity, against virginity. Meaning what if they took the virginity?

[B]

Well, isn't that the exact same thing that I was just talking about?

[A]

No, you were just saying sex in general.

[B]

But you could. If you took someone's virginity, you could kill the guy who did it.

[A]

If they're not married.

[B]

If they're not married. Right. That's the key. So you marry her, then you could take the virginity.

[A]

Yeah. Because then it's. Then you're not ruining them. Then they're in.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

We're going back to this.

[B]

We exclusively. We have decided that we don't want

[A]

anyone who's been around the block against reputation. So you're hurting the woman's reputation, which is what the ruining part is. A finer sense of moral shame. Too impalpable to be measured by the core standards of formal law.

[B]

Okay, yeah.

[A]

So you get it. So the courts can't handle this. You gotta take care of it on your own.

[B]

Right.

[A]

You gotta kill a bro.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So starting in 1896, there was a huge rise in unwritten law killings known in other countries as honor killings. And this included Oregon in July.

[B]

What are you. I don't know if I've ever heard a more lonely clap. And I'm not kidding. As one guy was like, absolutely right. You want to fuck my sister, you marry her? No, we're not. No. Okay. We're not all. Okay. Wasn't sure. Looked like that guy was going to clap too, because I felt like. But I guess he was just itching his arm.

[A]

So in July 1902, Alfred Belding and his wife Sylvia were married for seven years. So that's nice.

[B]

No, it isn't. Something's about to happen.

[A]

They had a son, Eddie.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

Lots of fighting though, in the marriage. Sylvia's family had been pushing for her to get a divorce for five years. So it's already. That's crazy because it's the 1890s. She was finally ready and she moved back into her parents house. If I have a picture of a house from 1896, really bad shit happened in the house. There's never just a snapshot of a house and like everybody was happy.

[B]

Well. Cause you didn't have a lot of film. It was a pain in the ass to take a picture. If you're gonna take a picture. That's what you were gonna do. Like if you were gonna, you were gonna be like, yeah, that, that's worth a shot.

[A]

If I, Yeah, if I have a camera.

[B]

If you go to a house, like, why the fuck is I doing My buddy's begging that lady in the barn.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Or. Or the haunted forest.

[A]

So recently, Sylvia had been seen in public with another man. George Gip Woodward.

[B]

What's his name?

[A]

Gip. George Gip Woodward.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

It didn't matter that Alfred was banging a much, much younger woman for years. That's not the problem. This was unacceptable.

[B]

Well, what that younger woman did was disgusting. Yes. But what he did was great.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And then what his wife did was horrible. And then what the guy who banged his wife did was awesome.

[A]

No, Bad.

[B]

Right. Naughty. Got it.

[A]

So Jip had to die.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Sylvia too. Also fuck her parents for taking her in.

[B]

Well, don't fuck them. But yeah.

[A]

On July 11, he got really shit faced and got two guns. A Colt and a Smith and Wesson. Neither fully loaded. He just had some bullets in each, nine shells between him.

[B]

Interesting.

[A]

And he went to Sylvia's parents house and his son Eddie was playing on the porch. So he hung out with him and talked for him a little bit. Hi, how you doing? And gave him a kiss good night, as you do before you're to commit mass murder. And told him to go to bed. At that moment, Gyp stepped into the doorway. Hello. And Alfred shot him in the head.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

And then he went inside and he shot and killed Sylvia. And then he killed his mother in law. One shot. And his father in law now had his pistol. And he ran at Alfred shooting the entire time. And he was really bad at shooting. He didn't hit him. And Alfred was good at shooting. And he shot and nicked him in the neck, then grazed his arm. And then, then the older man grabbed Alfred, who shot him. This one hit him in the torso because he was holding him.

[B]

That's nice.

[A]

But the man had a pocket watch and the bullet hit it.

[B]

I can't believe how often that actually happened.

[A]

It really did.

[B]

We keep hearing that all the time. Like it's like the dumbest shit in the world.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

People like, thank God for the old watch. Yeah. Like what?

[A]

It happens all the time.

[B]

Just shoot in the head from now on. That's the move.

[A]

But the father in law, he goes down. He's down for the count. Oh no, he's still alive. So Alfred turned to Eddie and shot at him. He missed quote, pop fired Three times at me. Once at my right foot and then at my left. But the third time, it did not come near me. I was across the street.

[B]

Wait, what? What do you.

[A]

So Eddie's still on the porch. It sounds like he's shooting Eddie to scare at him. To scare him.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So sounds like not trying to kill him. So Alfred then dropped his guns and went across the street to the Lake Charles Saloon. And he called the cops and he told them what he'd done. And he ordered a drink.

[B]

I mean, while you're there. Completely get that. Might be your last drink for a minute.

[A]

But he also figures he's gonna get off, right?

[B]

Okay. So he's celebrating. He's like. He's like, I just killed three people. Who wants a shooter?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

No shot. Sorry. A drink. Oh, God. Oh, man. I just killed three people across the road.

[A]

What do you have?

[B]

Pretzels?

[A]

It's also possible he just didn't care. His lawyer argued temporary insanity. The unwritten law. But shooting everyone else kind of made it a hard argument. Like if he had just shot Sylvia and the gyp guy, they'd be like, okay, but he also shot the mother

[B]

in law and the father.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And the father died or lived.

[A]

It says it there.

[B]

Go back a couple more. Serious.

[A]

Seriously wooded.

[B]

Okay. Yeah, yeah, okay. Yeah, I get that.

[A]

So it didn't help that when he found out his father in law was still alive, he lost his shit.

[B]

He was furious.

[A]

Yeah. Still, he was gonna use the unwritten law for a defense. And he had a trial. And at the trial, a cop testified he'd seen him smoking opium a few times.

[B]

Nice.

[A]

Eddie's testimony hurt him. Shooting at the kid made no sense. Nor with the unwritten law. And nor did calmly having a drink afterwards. And so he is found guilty. So there's limits to the unwritten law, right?

[B]

Just kill the woman, right? Yeah.

[A]

Or the dude. You can kill the dude.

[B]

Kill the dude and the woman.

[A]

Mostly you kill the dude, right?

[B]

Oh, not enough for me, to be honest. I would be. I want both.

[A]

But the law is so common. You might as well give it a shot, right? So.

[B]

Sure did.

[A]

While waiting for his appeal, Alfred got his mistress to help him.

[B]

So funny that he was also cheating.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That he was like disgusting. You betrayed everything. This is my girlfriend. She's awesome. She's really cool. My girlfriend helped me plot this whole thing. I love you, babe. You're everything to me.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

You mean so much to me. That. It's crazy. Oh, my gosh. Don't you go cheating you know what I do? I get tempts insan my little pudding pie. I'll have to kill your dad. Oh,

[A]

Okay. Don't do that. Okay.

[B]

These are weird.

[A]

Just being weird. So a friend gives Alfred's mistress some cayenne pepper and two blackjacks.

[B]

Yeah, show's over. Thanks, everybody. Two blackjacks. Cigarettes.

[A]

Those things you hit people with.

[B]

Oh, you hit people with blackjacks?

[A]

Yeah. Knock them out.

[B]

What is it?

[A]

It's a. You knock em out. Hit him over the head.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Blackjack.

[B]

Like a shirt?

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Like a flogger.

[A]

It's not a flogger. A flogger's.

[B]

Ah, fuck.

[A]

It's like hard. It'll.

[B]

It's like hard. It's a. Flogging pillows. I'm not.

[A]

I never said flogging.

[B]

I'm just trying to relate to you, Doug.

[A]

Like, think what a cop would do with something in his hand.

[B]

He'd take his time and he would assess and he would. He would think. What's my process here? And how do I keep it cool when other tempers seem to be flaring? What can I do to not exacerbate, but serve and make sure that people feel safe while also maintaining a level of decorum and law so that nobody leaves here injured? And while I definitely don't want to get hurt in this situation, my work is to make sure that other people are safe before me. So the last thing I'll be doing is shooting and asking questions. I'll be sitting here waiting. And if I take that gun out, it means someone has a gun pointed at me. And nothing short of that will get me to lose my emotional sanity. So anyway, they were flogging.

[A]

I noted everyone who didn't clap. And I think you're all fascist, So.

[B]

You're such a cop hater, dude. Name one thing they're doing that's weird right now.

[A]

My Neighbor's a cop, L.A. cop. The friend told her to blow the pepper. So go to the jail. Blow the pepper in the guard's face.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And then grab the keys.

[B]

Jail used to be really fun. You're like, there's a 50% chance I get out of here. It's just crazy. It's like the Epstein guards are always on duty.

[A]

That was murder.

[B]

Excuse me.

[A]

Suicide.

[B]

Mr. Security Guard?

[A]

Yep. Honey?

[B]

Ma'.

[A]

Am?

[B]

Hi. One of my pillows isn't as fluffy as I'd like it. Okay. You reckon I could use one of your keys to make it a little more goose feathery?

[A]

Sure.

[B]

There we go. I left.

[A]

So blow the pepper in the guard's face, grab the keys, blow the pepper in the grab. Then they can't see, I think. Yeah, grab the keys, open the cell, let Alfred and his cellmate out, and then give them the blackjacks. And then they beat their way to freedom.

[B]

Like, the pepper in the face. It's very Three Stooges. I can't see. Just long enough for y' all to leave.

[A]

Okay, so the cops found out about this awesome plan, also, the paper did. So the Oregonian printed the plans before she arrived at the jail. So she fled to San Francisco, and Alford was hung on March 27, 1903.

[B]

That's the face you make when you get hanged, when your girl's supposed to come in with pepper.

[A]

Alford left a note saying he was not sorry. Quote, why should I not prefer to see Sylvia in the grave than know that she was living in shame? I mean, dudes. Just dudes. She.

[B]

She was living. I was helping her. She needed my help, so I killed her.

[A]

So they charged $5 to each person who wanted to see the hanging, and the proceeds went to young Eddie. So that's nice.

[B]

Jesus Christ.

[A]

So there was a.

[B]

That is weird. That is weird. $5 is steep, by the way.

[A]

It is steep.

[B]

It's a lot of money.

[A]

But how much do you want to see a killing, though?

[B]

It's pretty great. Not that much. Nope, not that much.

[A]

It's for charity. Don't even think about us watching the killing. You're just doing it for charity.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

As a bonus, you get to see a man die. As heard in episode 217 Edmund.

[B]

Go ahead, you tell him. I'll. Yeah, go ahead.

[A]

Edmund Cremfield arrived in Corvallis in 1903. So this guy arriving would lead to the greatest wife and daughter fucking in Oregon history.

[B]

In what way? Before I celebrate,

[A]

this gentleman knows how to seduce a lady.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

As you can tell.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. And he knows how to seduce soot.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

He looks like he just went down on dirt.

[A]

So Edmund started a cult.

[B]

Well, who wouldn't follow this guy anywhere he told you to go?

[A]

Yeah, it was. It was begun in the home of OV Hurt. So his wife and daughters were having sex with Edmund after he moved in.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And rumors swirled that a lot of naughty stuff. Stuff is going on with all of his young female followers, which is mostly what the cult is.

[B]

Yeah. We've established. Yes.

[A]

And so OVI kicked. Kicked the cult out. He's like, enough of this.

[B]

Okay, I get it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

He was just like, you could stay here. And he's like, I side started cult. I'm banging your wife and kids. Yeah, I'm. Well, you leave.

[A]

I'm being cucked in ways that no one thought was possible.

[B]

This is crazy. You've cucked me into another dimension. By the way. I've been fucking you.

[A]

What?

[B]

What do you mean? Yeah, I've been fucking you. One time I fucked you into her. I'd spend all. What? My God, man. You can stay.

[A]

Just tell me you care about me. A lot of the young ladies refused to return to their homes, though, after they were kicked out of Ov's house, Edmond said that, quote, marriage was not necessary.

[B]

So. I'm listening.

[A]

Local bros did not like that.

[B]

They did not like that.

[A]

No, that was not the time.

[B]

How dare you? You can fuck an entire family if you want, but you watch what you say.

[A]

So the local men are done and they. They grab Edmund and they tar and feather him.

[B]

I've never wanted to fuck a bird so much. Look at him.

[A]

He responded by marrying Ov's daughter the next day.

[B]

Jesus Christ.

[A]

Mad hurt.

[B]

Sounds like what a country kid falls off of like a wagon. Maud hurt. Mod and heart. Mounted tart at heart. When. When you are tarred and feathered. What is the. The recovery is a minute, right?

[A]

No, it's terrible. Yeah, it's terrible. Yeah. It's a while. Yeah.

[B]

So the next day he was like.

[A]

He's not. There's no way they get the tar off, right?

[B]

So he shows up.

[A]

So he's probably still covered a little bit of tar.

[B]

He's covered in tar. And he's like, I would like to marry you. And she's like, for sure.

[A]

But love sees past tar, feather and feather feathers. Yeah.

[B]

Do you, Maude, take this chicken to be. Well, honey, you don't have to talk like that. I think I might have just taken a chicken in my. Okay. Well, he is a sassy little boy, isn't he?

[A]

The next night, vigilantes went out looking for Edmund, but he was nowhere to be found. Months later in Portland, Donna Starr had sex with Edmund in a purification ritual, which is what I call it.

[B]

Yeah. So now maybe we should explain how we. Okay.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

A purification ritual sounds way weirder than it is. It's just a way for us with a penis to absolve you of all the sins. And when we say that, a lot of people think it's strange.

[A]

Yeah. But it wipes the slate clean, so to speak.

[B]

Exactly, Dave.

[A]

It's a do. It's a restart.

[B]

Yes, yes. It's exactly. It's like, you know, sometimes on an electronic thing where you got to put a paper clip in it to do the full restart.

[A]

Same thing.

[B]

It's a paper clipping. Golly. I could tell by the reaction of these people that they think it's right.

[A]

Her husband filed a criminal complaint. Oh, she's married.

[B]

Oh. So wait. Okay, you're right. Right, Donna? Yeah, you're right.

[A]

So Donna signed an affidavit stating she and Edmund had, quote, improper relations of the most revolting kind.

[B]

Wait a. Wait a minute, wait a minute.

[A]

Pictures.

[B]

What do we. I mean, that's not just straight up coitus.

[A]

I think it is, probably, but she should be careful. She's just naughtying it up.

[B]

Right, okay.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. She made it or she did other stuff.

[B]

Yeah, I think other stuff maybe happened. It was awful.

[A]

So now papers reported Donna was just one of 10 to 15 young ladies having sex with Edmund. So this is like next level, unwritten law shit. Like, this is like off the chart. Wives and daughters who were having sex with them were now put in the state asylum. Which looks great.

[B]

Completely. Yeah. You know, it's good when they get a banzai that big.

[A]

It's not creepy. It's, yay, I'm going to the asylum.

[B]

How come it has lightning around it always?

[A]

Do the trees have leaves? No, no, no.

[B]

Nothing here. Leaves.

[A]

Everything's dead.

[B]

All right, so he just. He banged him loony

[A]

while their brothers and husbands and fathers put them in there.

[B]

Oh, yeah. So I was enjoying myself.

[A]

If they were younger than that, they were sent to the Oregon Boys and Girls Aid Society for Troubled Youth. Well, that included Donna Starr's 15 year old sister. Yeah, Edmund was gone, by the way.

[B]

He's really.

[A]

He vanished.

[B]

He just bangs it down and rolls.

[A]

Yeah. And then a kid was looking for worms.

[B]

What?

[A]

A kid was looking for worms.

[B]

I don't think he should get them for bait.

[A]

He's not just.

[B]

Oh, yeah, right. Not like pinworms or something. He wanted nightcrawlers.

[A]

I wish you hadn't said that. That's the worst thing that's been said in this podcast.

[B]

That's not. Buddy, you are so out of your lane right now. That is so not true.

[A]

So killing and worms for bait found Edmund under Ov's porch in July. He was filthy bearded and starving.

[B]

Help. I need pussy. I need some pussy. I'm dying under here. I haven't eaten ass in three months. I'm dying under here. Anything will do. I formed a woman out of mud down here. But I couldn't get hard, so I made a mud husband so that it felt wrong. And now I beg my mud woman, Help. Help me. Help.

[A]

Literally nobody wants to help you.

[B]

Anything will do. I'm broken. Find me a woman with a stable relationship. I need to upturn a comfortable life. Oh. Even just talking about it. And now my cranks are turning. Hey, I notice a ring on your finger.

[A]

I'm a nine year old boy.

[B]

Oh, sorry. My eyes haven't adjusted to the light so much yet. I guess I saw a little ring on your finger. Do you have any brothers or sister? Oh, geez. Well, boy, you're a weirdo. And that's coming from me. Oh, by the way, I got a mud wife.

[A]

By the way, I need worms, so hold still.

[B]

Oh, yeah. Oh, take some out of Kathleen. Most of her's worms. You'd like her. She's full of worms too. Too.

[A]

So he'd been living under there since not thriving. And the ladies were coming down and giving him food and water.

[B]

Hello. I mean, it's shocking.

[A]

How are you?

[B]

It's shocking what this amazing.

[A]

I mean, love is.

[B]

He's got it all. A porch that's not his. And that's pretty much it. He needs a shave. He's filthy. It's awful. So he was arrested, you know, too. At some point. He was like, look, I just don't think this is gonna work out. You're kind of clingy. What? I don't know. It's kind of a turnoff while you're here.

[A]

So he's arrested and he's found guilty of adultery and sent to the state prison. He was given two years and he came back right after he got out to the same. He talked a bunch of his ladies to leaving with him and starting up in Waldport, Oregon.

[B]

Same guy who clapped twice.

[A]

Now a guy whose wife and daughter were banging Edmund, tried to kill him, but the gun misfired.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yeah. And so Edmund was freaked out by that and he fled to Seattle. Sure. So George Mitchell. So George Mitchell, the brother of Donna, Starr and Esther, went to Seattle and shot Edmund. And George said, quote, I got my man.

[B]

Shot him dead.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

So the entire town.

[B]

I bet you women were still like, I'm not gonna break up with him. I still love him. He's great.

[A]

Everybody pitches in for George's defense.

[B]

Okay?

[A]

This is truly the ultimate unwritten law. Killing. And the Post Intelligencer said the Village, the vigilante killing, was not great. And the Seattle Times was fully on board saying if Edmund Was quote, the debased brute clothed in a cloak of religion. He is said to be. George Mitchell deserves immediate freedom.

[B]

I get it.

[A]

Yeah. The Republican paper was very anti lynching usually, but still called for Edmund.

[B]

It's always funny to hear stuff like that.

[A]

Yeah, well, they.

[B]

I know.

[A]

They called him a human monster.

[B]

A human monster.

[A]

Okay, so Mitchell pleaded temporary insanity and all. Then the whole trial was just about sex. So everybody in town.

[B]

So every juror was like, can I

[A]

be on the jury?

[B]

Permission to approach the bench. Permission to go under the bench for a minute.

[A]

Can you repeat when they're deliberating?

[B]

We're going to need to hear her testimony one more time. Could she do it with a French accent? That's always been a thing I loved. Is that possible?

[A]

OB testified his daughter and wife had sex with Edmund, who was his son in law because he married Maude right

[B]

quickly when he was tarred and feathered.

[A]

A man said Edmund was fucking to make a second. Jesus Christ.

[B]

Oh, well, excuse me. Why is everyone getting on his ass? He's like Noah's ark. He's building something just different way. Still using wood.

[A]

I was one because I wasn't with you with the ark. But then you brought it.

[B]

Hang in there with me, buddy boy. 50% of the time I can do something.

[A]

Georgia Boy collapsed on the defense table sobbing when his dad testified about all the sex.

[B]

Wait, wait, wait. His dad's up. It was so crazy, the amount of fucking that they were doing.

[A]

Dad, that's my sister and mom.

[B]

When she told me what he did to her, she said she'd never felt a ride like that before in her life. Did you know there's other positions besides man on top? There are. There's over four others. And he did them all to her. He did her looking into the pillow with one arm under her chin, looking bored. Her on top, her on top facing the other way. And a little something they called the 49er. That's where he would go into her behind and dig for gold. And searching he would go.

[A]

Did he ever find gold nuggets?

[B]

For sure. He had a special helmet he wore. And that was just what he did to my wife. I can't keep going, but I think it's probably a bad idea. I think I should probably be stopped by your collapse, son. Cutting me off would be a grand idea now.

[A]

I'm listening, dad.

[B]

All right. He went through my family tree like a lumberjack.

[A]

So the jury declared George not guilty. A few days later, his younger sister Esther shot and killed him.

[B]

Oh, Jesus Christ. Because she loved him so much. Yeah, she loved Evan so much.

[A]

She loved Edmond so much. But remember, she's married. Her sister is the one who's married to Edmund.

[B]

Yeah, well, I mean, but not like that.

[A]

Really. This guy was charismatic, dude.

[B]

I mean, he really had something going on. Yeah, he was fucking. He was there. That's enough of a sentence to be honest. He was fucking.

[A]

And Maude had bought the gun to kill her brother George, the police chief. Quote, I wish these Oregon people would kill each other on their own side of the river.

[B]

That still holds, by the way. We're all saying that in the other states, just so you know.

[A]

Yep, every state around you is.

[B]

Do what? Do it. Enough already. Do it. Ah.

[A]

Maude then poisoned herself in prison.

[B]

Jesus. How did she do that? I self peppered like perfume.

[A]

She got someone to sneak something in.

[B]

I heard she did that.

[A]

Edmund, Esther poisoned herself a couple years later in. Oh, sorry. Esther did a couple years in an asylum and then killed herself after she got out. Five years later when she remarried, she was like, well, you're not as good as Edmund.

[B]

I can do everything he did and then more.

[A]

I can't come without seeing crazy eyes.

[B]

Well, the female orgasm's a myth. And nobody's gonna prove that to you more than I. That's why come I spurt before I don't even get in. You understand?

[A]

Welcome to another speech by Jordan Peterson.

[B]

It's an honor. There's no point to even getting inside of her. I finish on the walk to the boudoir.

[A]

In 1905, six year old Mary Murray traveled from Portland to.

[B]

How old?

[A]

16.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Traveled from Portland to Hubbard to work in hop fields for a week.

[B]

Been there.

[A]

Little job, little summer job.

[B]

Sure. What's a hop field?

[A]

Sure.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Hop these hops to make beer. Beer? Yeah, it kind of does. It kind of look like wheat. Is that what it looks like?

[B]

It's like a little kind of weedy.

[A]

Cousins.

[B]

It looks like an acorn. Looks like a baby acorn. Grows on a vine.

[A]

Grows on a vine.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I am way off. I'm sorry I let you guys down. 22 year old Lincoln Whitney lived in Hubbard and he seduced young Mary in just in. In under a week. He seduced young Mary and prom by promising to marry her.

[B]

That's all it took to seduce a woman. I'll marry you. Oh, well, part one of my evil plan has started. I lied about marrying her. And then you just have sex.

[A]

Yeah. And then you have sex. But once he was done, he ghosted her a few weeks. No, I mean he haunted.

[B]

He. He passed away. Yeah. The original ghosting.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

He died in a grain elevator. Oh, quit ghosting me.

[A]

A few weeks later, Mary realized she was pregnant. So her dad went up to Hubbard to talk to Lincoln and his father about marriage.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Gotta do the right thing.

[B]

Sure. Well, contraception wise.

[A]

What do we put it in there?

[B]

Got it.

[A]

I think it's probably just pull out at that point.

[B]

No, they had to have something.

[A]

They have condoms.

[B]

They had to have like a moleskin or something.

[A]

I think it's a hole. An entire mole you put.

[B]

You're missing it. Sorry. It's blind. Wrong hole.

[A]

This is what you do on a farm.

[B]

Jesus Christ. What are you doing? I think it's making a nest. Jesus Christ. Get off of it. A whole mole. Now these are called moleskin condoms. That looks like an entire mole. Sure does. You ain't gonna feel shit. You gonna last forever with a full on mole on there. I got a whole line of vermint rubbers.

[A]

I've been using a gopher for a while.

[B]

Oh yeah, man. Give her the old squirrel curl. This thing's gonna bury your nuts deeper than you even imagine. But it's stowing things away for the winter months. By the time you're done with this thing, it won't even remember where some of them are. Wait, what? I don't. I don't know. Buy it, boy.

[A]

Woo. By the way, show's gonna be a little dirty tonight.

[B]

Even the mic keeps trying to move away from me.

[A]

I get it.

[B]

The mic is constantly like, I'm not super into what he's going with.

[A]

So from the Oregonian quote, the father talked it over with the elder Whitney and then called the young man himself Whitney laughed in my father's face.

[B]

Jesus.

[A]

And said he would not marry my sister. Ms. Whitney then came out, called my sister a vile name and insulted my father.

[B]

Jesus Christ.

[A]

It's a good family.

[B]

So it's the genetics. The whole family's genetics? Yeah.

[A]

The whole family's just like, yeah, they're not great. So Mary's brother Orlando, hers, the whole

[B]

story, I love it. Was there an Orlando back then?

[A]

Most, I would say 30% of kids were named Orlando at least.

[B]

I'm okay with it back then. Naming your kid Orlando now is fucking bonkers. To name him after Orlando Bloom, it's an insane thing to do.

[A]

What about Orlando and Dawn?

[B]

What are you even talking about? To name your kid Orlando now is remarkably strange. If you've ever been to Orlando, you're like, oh, man, imagine if we could have a kid this cool. This is little Orlando.

[A]

You know my son's name.

[B]

And here's Dubuque.

[A]

You know my son's name is Finnegan. Orlando Anthony, right?

[B]

Yeah, yeah, but that's different. Hey, the dog. I'll be right back.

[A]

He's named after the city. Cause it's one of the greatest cities in America. Hey, if you ever seen meth as a city. Yeah, Orlando.

[B]

Yeah. No, someone went to Orlando and was like, it'd be cooler if a dolphin could do bath salts. Is there any way to emerge? Drug abuse and aquatic nightmares.

[A]

The dollop is brought to you by Mint Mobile. Look, we both know that there are groups out there who just really love doing things the hard way. You have that guy who still wants to pay for the subscription they forgot they had or doesn't want to update their phone because it still works.

[B]

Got the guy. What about the. The guy who's doing the square tires?

[A]

Square tire guy? That guy's just crazy.

[B]

So I used to guy who's only drinking pond water.

[A]

I think we got enough of them. I gotta be honest. I think.

[B]

Well, I'm just saying, I think to your point, there's a lot of people holding on to the double monocle guy.

[A]

Yeah, I think probably not the blacksmith. So there's the people who refuse to update their phone because it still works. That was me. I was that guy. And especially when it came to overpaying for wireless. And then now what am I on? Gareth, what's my phone company?

[B]

I believe you're doing Mint Mobile, my friend.

[A]

Doing Mint Mobile. It's a lot cheaper. It is just as good a service. There's no reason not to switch. Basically, it's same coverage, same speed, without the huge price tag. You pay less for the same thing. Premium wireless you expect. It's unlimited talk, text and data, but way less than the other guys charge. And for just a little bit of time, you can get 50% off 3, 6 or 12 month plans of unlimited premium wireless. Go 12 phone. Take your own number. That's it.

[B]

I took your number. Did I tell you? That's weird.

[A]

Yeah, I didn't know that that was part of the thing.

[B]

Doing a whole thing.

[A]

Have you been getting texts from my

[B]

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[A]

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[B]

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[B]

Oh, buddy boy.

[A]

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[B]

By the way, grow your brand, get paid. Every time I've claimed a domain, I do say it like I've just taken over a palace in the 1400s. So I'll be like, this domain is mine.

[A]

Yeah, I don't know if that's a thing that actually works. I, I would say once you get

[B]

one, what through Squarespace, they make it easy. But then when you get it, you could do stuff like that. I don't think, I don't think what I'm saying is unhelpful.

[A]

I think it is. Squarespace gives you everything you need to offer services and get paid right in the same place. From consultants to events and experiences, showcase shopping.

[B]

You're smiling a little bit because you know what I said is kind of helpful.

[A]

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[B]

And then like if someone claims mine, I go, you've taken my get.

[A]

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[B]

Don't forget SEO tools. Don't make me do it. Don't make me do it.

[A]

We have all of our websites with Squarespace.

[B]

Every website. I just started a website for my movie. Guess what? I did it through Dave Squarespace.

[A]

There you go. All you're going to use, we have you go to dalpodcast.com right now and go to our tour page. You can see our tour of the east coast in March.

[B]

Go to the merch site. It's no longer available, but it was. We were able to shut it down easily. Squarespace makes that easy for you.

[A]

Yeah. If you have a guy that's not putting out merch, then you got to take down the merch page.

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[A]

It's a user issue.

[B]

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[B]

domain, as domain is mine.

[A]

Okay. Mary's brother Orlando heard the whole story and goes to see Lincoln, who still refuses to marry her. He's like, no, I'm not marrying her. So then Orlando offers him money. He's good. Like, what a weird.

[B]

This is so ridiculous.

[A]

Jesus. Here's some cash.

[B]

Here's here. Marry her. And he's like, fuck, you had sex with her. It's over. You are married. Basically.

[A]

He's still like, no. So Orlando pulled a gun. And even then, Lincoln's like, I'm not going to do it.

[B]

By the way, if your name's Lincoln and someone has a gun, you listen back down now.

[A]

So Orlando shot him three times. What I tell you, Lincoln is now a dead Lincoln.

[B]

He's dead.

[A]

One of the many dead Lincoln. But that was the sort that's Orlando's version, is that he gave money, you know, and kept trying to talk him into it. It's probably just arguing and yelling at each other and then murder, right? So Orlando goes after that, he goes to the sheriff, and he turns out, turns over.

[B]

He goes, I was insane for a minute. Now I'm better. Can I go home?

[A]

I killed Alfred E. Newman.

[B]

I killed that guy. Can I go home now? I killed a guy who had a race car tie. Can I go home now? I met a guy who had a bone for a tie. Can I go home now? I killed him. He's dead. I was so crazy back there. Now I'm better.

[A]

So papers start reporting on this crazy affair and the unwritten law. It's tantalizing reading. Everyone's like, sure.

[B]

Wow. A hot, swinging sack of meat like that. Mmm.

[A]

So he pleads not guilty by reason of temporary insanity. The unwritten law and Lincoln.

[B]

So it feels like at some point you would write some version of the law down, but for a long time, they're just like, it's the unwritten law. And then the legal system is like, ah, yes, the unwritten law, which we recognize in the legal system, which feels a little bit like a law, but it isn't.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So we hear your unwritten law. And yeah, it works pretty good here in this world of law because it's.

[A]

Because you're put. You're putting the victims on trial. Right. That's what it is for the most part. And then you're asking for jury. Jury nullification, essentially. Like.

[B]

But it feels very pedestrian to just be like, hey, I killed a guy. I was pissed off. Whoopsie. Banged my sister. Can I go home?

[A]

Yes, you can go home now. Yeah.

[B]

Okay, bye.

[A]

So Lincoln had been bragging about screwing Mary. So after he. He was all over town just telling everybody.

[B]

Boy, you should see what I pulled the other day. You know how all culture's completely backwards? Well, I manipulated a poor girl into believing something that was fake. And now because our system's so backwards and messed up, she's totally ruined. And I'm at a tavern boasting about it.

[A]

So the. The mom testifies Orlando's mom and says, insanity runs in the family.

[B]

Oh, yeah, we've all been having it pretty bad. Well, there's going to be a lot more killings from this crew.

[A]

So all this press makes Mary very popular with the fellas who are reading about it.

[B]

Also awful. So this is like, going to be like girl watching.

[A]

Well, marriage proposals are just flowing in. These people, guys are.

[B]

She's like, oh, marry you? I heard you have sex. I buy that. Yeah, I hear you have sex. I'll marry.

[A]

What else? Why else would they be. But what the.

[B]

Wasn't that the whole thing? You got married and then you fudged?

[A]

Well, no. Now they want to marry her and then had sex with her.

[B]

Isn't that the order that every.

[A]

They know that she could do it.

[B]

What do you mean? So weird. It's the weird. It's. It's so. It's like the suicide bomber. You go to heaven and you get like 118 virgins.

[A]

That's true, though.

[B]

I know. That is, by the way, what an awkward heaven that is. How's everyone doing? I've got butterflies, too. Eat more grapes. Drink a little more. Let's loosen up before we get into the vile acts that are going to be. What a cool little zone we have up here. It's just Austin Powers heaven. Yeah, baby.

[A]

Yeah. That's a nightmare. It sounds like.

[B]

That's crazy.

[A]

It's what sounds crazy?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

No. Who would want that?

[B]

I don't know.

[A]

No, I can't think of a sound. You're gonna go up to heaven, be stratified by 17, two virgins?

[B]

Yeah. No, no, including me.

[A]

What about, like, you're gonna go to heaven? There's gonna be 72 women are really good at sex. Oh, that's different.

[B]

Also weird.

[A]

Also, that's just like. I'm tired. Stop it.

[B]

72.

[A]

I mean, where's the room where there's a TV?

[B]

Yeah, that's the. That's that you just pitched Mormonism, basically. It all is fucking crazy. It's that this idea, it's like, oh, fuck, it's just insane. Just be like so many women. It's like, you would eventually. I mean, you've seen it with the, like any Mormon documentary where the guy's like, jesus Christ, what did I do? Fun loophole. You can't ever pull out or use contraception. I have 800 kids, nine wives, and no time.

[A]

Is that. Is that true? They can never.

[B]

Well, they're. I. I mean, they're meant to just fucking procreate.

[A]

Like, fucking hold my hand when we talk about this.

[B]

Okay, so let me walk you through a little religion that I like to call.

[A]

Perfect. So Mary is a 16 year old.

[B]

Forgot that part.

[A]

Oh, lady who had sex once. And now the entire state of Oregon is talking about how she.

[B]

Oh, I'd really like to marry you.

[A]

And the trial is about the sex.

[B]

What the court. What the court should do is just collect those letters and go find each guy. Well, for what? Your letter was super weird.

[A]

Oh, so she spent the trial in a, quote, hysterical breakdown or at home in bed while the court discussed her

[B]

in what kind of bed? Goddamn.

[A]

He.

[B]

Well, no, I just would think I sleep in bed. Oh, okay. I could tweak my letter.

[A]

The trial was very heated, a lot of tension. Orlando's lawyer said if the prosecutor died, quote, that a considerable interval would lapse between the date of his death.

[B]

Wait, what?

[A]

And the hour when people would be saying good things about him.

[B]

Wait, about the prosecuting attorney? Yeah, he was like, by the way, if you die, then there's gonna be a break from when people are saying good things.

[A]

Yeah, he's saying. It's a big one.

[B]

Should we keep going? By the way, here's a human skull.

[A]

Oh, hi. Why? I'll allow it. Orlando's lawyer punched a relative of Lincoln's, which set off a huge courtroom brawl in which the sheriff was decked. Anyway, the verdict was innocent.

[B]

Wait, what happened?

[A]

There was a huge. Attorneys are punching attorney punched a relative of. And he was still the fucker.

[B]

And then, your honor, I played temporary insanity. My wife banged a guy right before I hit him. It's the unwritten law.

[A]

So the verdict ended up being innocent. And when it was read, an old woman yelled, quote, thank God for it. And then the entire courtroom applauded and people rushed to congratulate Orlando. And the celebration of the verdict made some papers start to turn against the unwritten law.

[B]

They're like, it was just chaos.

[A]

Maybe this is not great, right? So in 1907, Melvin Bradley argued with his wife Kate.

[B]

Jesus Christ.

[A]

And the Morning Oregonian said it led to, quote, a beating administered to Ms. Bradley by her husband in a fit of drunken jealousy.

[B]

In the morning.

[A]

Well, it's just.

[B]

Yeah, he's mourning. Hammered.

[A]

No, the Morning Oregonian said that.

[B]

Oh, right. Sorry, I keep. You're right, they shouldn't call it that. It's not helping anything.

[A]

So then after morning, after, Melville goes to a local bar and Kate goes to her brother Joe, and she's like, this fucker just did this. So Joe goes to the bar to kick the shit out of his brother in law, Melville.

[B]

Good.

[A]

And he brings a Portland cop with him that he knows, that the family knows John Giddings. And the cop hangs outside. So Joe goes inside and he finds Melville and he says, quote, come outside, I want to see you. And Melville very happy to take the invitation. He said, quote, you do, do you? Well, I can't wait. Well, I can't see you any too damn quick.

[B]

Then he, like, he did one of these. He was like, well, I can't see you too damn quick. Damn it. That wasn't clean.

[A]

It could have been worded differently. You know what I mean?

[B]

I can't see you quickly.

[A]

Try. Try a different one.

[B]

Well, I can't. Yeah, yeah. From the. Okay.

[A]

Come outside. I want to see you.

[B]

Say it again.

[A]

Come outside. I want to see you.

[B]

Well, I. Quickly go outside to see. Man, see a guy with a. Yeah. God. What?

[A]

I don't even know what that means. What are we doing? Want me to do it again? All right.

[B]

Ha. Fudgy brownie. Yeah.

[A]

Melville, come outside. I want to see you.

[B]

Well, quickly see me while I see you with your eyes inside of myself.

[A]

Are we gonna get outside?

[B]

We will get outside. Now, I know what I'm trying to say. It's just. You could feel the energy of what I'm trying to go with.

[A]

Melville, come outside.

[B]

Well, let me turn my back. Back to what? Jesus fucking Christ. Give me a minute to get my shit together.

[A]

Melville Come outside. I want to see you.

[B]

Well, see me. All I see is me when I be the quickest seer who had a different. Hold on. Let me. Give me a second to stick this. When I had the eye one time. Why don't I take my eyeballs out, put them in your skull and see myself for the first start going in from the beginning.

[A]

Do you want me to write it down?

[B]

No, you don't need to write it down.

[A]

You want to write it down.

[B]

No, but you're turning into a big thing and it's getting stooped. Please, that one was on you. Don't interrupt when I do it. Come on. By the way, good to see you. You lost £10. You look great.

[A]

Melville, come outside. I want to see you.

[B]

See me. The letter C. That's after B and before D. Well, well, well. Looks like someone just made Alphabet soup out of this whole arrangement.

[A]

Are we going with that?

[B]

What was the second one?

[A]

Can we. Let's just go outside now, because it's.

[B]

Okay. Yeah, we'll go outside.

[A]

But I would say that this is gonna be printed in the paper after what happens outside.

[B]

Well, I'll tell you, it's been good to see you. Even though I'd like to go outside and see you again to see myself.

[A]

All right.

[B]

I'll see myself out.

[A]

Yep. Well, we're going outside together.

[B]

Wait. What?

[A]

It's a whole thing.

[B]

I did not understand that part. Why?

[A]

Yeah, bad stuff's gonna happen.

[B]

Wait.

[A]

I'm gonna do to you what you did to my sister.

[B]

I had sex with your sister.

[A]

No. And, well.

[B]

Well, I think I see you in a way I haven't seen you before.

[A]

My God, your eyes.

[B]

Stop it. Do not Even.

[A]

So, as soon as they stepped outside, Joe punched Melville in the face. So Melville pulled a gun and shot twice, missing both times.

[B]

Who was good with guns back then? It felt like it was all gun culture and nobody could fucking. When you watch a movie and you see, like, the guy running up the fire escape, and the guy, like, Mrs. 18 times always felt very. But in this time, that was just like, what you did. Yeah, I shoot to miss.

[A]

So then Joe starts to run, but he slips and falls in the mud.

[B]

No, no.

[A]

And then he just lays there, maybe scared stiff.

[B]

Yeah, we did the mud thing.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I just become the mud.

[A]

He's like Rambo in the first round.

[B]

Yo. Yeah. I wasn't even anywhere near any of this stuff.

[A]

Ladies, that's. That's a movie we love.

[B]

We're sorry.

[A]

So then he sees the cop giddings and the cop probably could have been pulling his gun at that point because he has a gun out, right?

[B]

He was brought with the other guy, so he's.

[A]

Well, he's. He's shooting at the other guy. So the cop could have been pulling his gun, Right? But he sees the cop. Either way, he shoots at the cop. Now, four shots, and they all hit Giddings. Oh, getting the cop. Giddings shoots five times and misses with every. Every shot. Wouldn't that be great if that's how cops were? Now, then Melville runs off and Joe goes over to Giddings, who said, quote, I'm afraid I'm done for. Why send for a doctor at once. Here's my gun. There's only one shot left. Take it and get him if you can.

[B]

Do you have any more ammo?

[A]

No, I said. I said there's one shot left. I don't have any.

[B]

Well, it just seems like the site might be off a little. You missed a lot back there. I might need more. What kind of gun is it?

[A]

Can you take it? My arm is getting.

[B]

I don't want to get my fingerprints all over it. It feels like I'm a cop.

[A]

You can what I need you to get.

[B]

How do you not have more bullets?

[A]

They're inside of me.

[B]

Take a couple out.

[A]

I don't think they work like that.

[B]

How does it work?

[A]

Well, there's a shell.

[B]

I'm going to be up front. I'm not comfortable with how you're forcing that gun on me. You are pushing, and I'm trying to create a boundary. So, no, I'm not going to take the gun. I am sorry, my friend. Thank you for coming down here, by the way. I got a good feeling you're going to be all right. It's just five bullets in like, 1900, probably 1905.

[A]

You're all muddy.

[B]

Thank you, man.

[A]

So Giddings got up, took two steps and collapsed. Joe ran home, grabbed his hat and disappeared.

[B]

Well, what a weird thing to have to get. As usual.

[A]

So everyone's very shocked by the crazy unwritten law shooting that has happened. But the next day, the Oregonian reported evidence of previous bad blood between Melville and getting the cop. Okay, quote, Getting. Getting. Was friendly with Kate Bradley.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And Giddings was friendly, too, and in sympathy with the members of Ms. Bradley's family who were on bad terms with Bradley. Okay, so the cop and the guy who hid his wife. Yeah, yeah, he was. The cop was friendly with that guy's wife.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And also the whole family.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So that. That's kind of an unwritten law problem.

[B]

The whole fucking unwritten.

[A]

How about this?

[B]

Write a fucking law down. Is that so crazy? It's been a long time.

[A]

At the end of Giddings funeral, you

[B]

see, because he was friendly with the family, too, which makes the unwritten law

[A]

a little more unwritten.

[B]

It's pretty crazy. What unwritten law? Time. What time to look into the unwritten law. But I don't know if it goes all the way there or maybe it's more unwritten than it used to be and it already wasn't written down. You see?

[A]

No.

[B]

Well, again, this is outside of any sort of legal argument. But not written down. Okay, that's interesting.

[A]

No. What?

[B]

Well, I'm just saying he's friends with her and the fam. Friendly with her.

[A]

What is that?

[B]

I did it. And then the family. Friends with, friends with the family, probably.

[A]

What does that mean? Are you saying he's fucking the family?

[B]

All I'm saying is, is the law is not written down, but. Okay. Little invisible ink on it, maybe. Think about it.

[A]

I am.

[B]

What am I saying to you?

[A]

I'd have no idea.

[B]

Well, okay. Think about it a little bit.

[A]

I'm not.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

So at the end of Giddings funeral the next day, Kate, her sister and another woman entered wearing heavy veils. Now, they shouldn't even be at the funeral because there's no reason for them to be there, because they're not supposed to. Whatever. So the sister.

[B]

Because nobody knows what.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So the sister, Kate's sister, is sobbing, quote, my God, are we too late?

[B]

What? What? He died a while ago. It's been like four or five days.

[A]

What? Kate asked where the burial would be, and then they headed out to go to get to the cemetery first before the procession.

[B]

I love that move, by the way. I've always tried to do that. Get there first. It's a nice move. Stake it out.

[A]

It is.

[B]

Yeah. Absolutely.

[A]

So they got there, they waited by the open grave. The procession arrives. And as the widow stood quietly sobbing at the head of the grave, Kate and the other two women were sobbing and wailing way more loudly.

[B]

It was a song. Oh, my God, he's gone. He's gone. Oh, no.

[A]

The funeral director later told the Oregonian that Kate's sister had come to see the body twice and once had, quote, cried over the body until requested to leave.

[B]

Wow. Getting cut off from weeping. Ma', am, you've had enough. Leave.

[A]

The next day, she threw herself on the casket and sobbed until she was kicked out and permanently banned from the funeral home.

[B]

Holy shit. That's. That's what I want. That's what I want. Enough.

[A]

Jesus, lady.

[B]

You don't come back here anymore.

[A]

Now, that's obviously the weird thing for the sister of the wife of the cop who the killer of the cop to do. But it turned out Kate's sister Aggie lived next door to the Giddings and hated Mrs. Giddings. Quote, Giddings spent much of her time in her company, much of his time in her company. Then the Oregonian reported that, quote, Ms. Aggie Vanders demanded of the policeman's widow that she surrendered certain papers said to be in Giddings pocketbook. She also asked for his watch and his gun. And Mrs. Giddings said no. So now she's just asking.

[B]

That's very invasive.

[A]

That's weird.

[B]

Yeah. Can I have his hair? How about some of his undies?

[A]

So the Oregonian is absolutely fucking love this. All the Portland, they're just loving the story. It's fucking amazing. Like there's nothing happening in the at all.

[B]

Ever.

[A]

But this had more murkiness than the usual unwritten law situation. It's obvious that the cop who was killed was having an affair with the murderer's wife's sister.

[B]

Jesus Christ. Sounds like Ricky Lake. Okay, though.

[A]

Though the shooting part is straightforward, right?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Guy beat his guy beats his wife. Brother comes to beat him up and brought a cop who the family knew. And the guy killed the cop, by the way.

[B]

I love how that sounds straightforward.

[A]

So reporters are now going crazy and they're digging into getting his home was the grave. Yeah. His home was described as, quote, a deplorable little shack. Cold, forbidding.

[B]

I still live here, Leaky.

[A]

I'm still here and unpaid for.

[B]

It's. What? What do you want? What do.

[A]

We didn't buy it the fuck out.

[B]

What? You're just a reporter. Leave.

[A]

They were focusing on the home as a way to show Giddings wasn't taking care of his wife and three kids. Quote, Giddings got $100 a month from the city, but his family did not get so much from Giddings. There's no evidence that they ever got anything. The widow is miserably clothed and his three little children actually look cold.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

That's my favorite thing. You reporter. You're like. You boys feel cold?

[B]

We don't know.

[A]

You certainly do look cold.

[B]

I mean, it's okay.

[A]

Why? They're shaking. Oh, my goodness.

[B]

See those nipples through their shirts. These boys are freezing.

[A]

Nipples are hard, nipples are hard, teeth are chattering.

[B]

The turkey's done six times over in these kids.

[A]

Turkey's done six times over. And what the fuck am I writing?

[B]

Keep going. You're writing.

[A]

Doesn't make any sense.

[B]

Yeah, that's right. I looked at these boys and realized they were frigid.

[A]

The boys are frigid. Is that.

[B]

I hadn't seen three blue kids like this since I went to Boston and watched grown men toss marshmallows into each other's mouths. Blue Man Group, they called them. I don't repeat that back.

[A]

Blue.

[B]

No, all of it. From the top.

[A]

I haven't seen anybody this blue since

[B]

I went to three boys this blue

[A]

that show three guys eating bags of marshmallows.

[B]

Yeah, well.

[A]

And they were blue like a toilet bowl.

[B]

I wish I'd never ghosted this guy

[A]

any. Who? Someone should. Someone not me. Should give these boys a jacket. So the papers are now pushing a narrative that would lead. So they try to make the cop the bad guy. So they're pushing a narrative that would make it okay to shoot a cop.

[B]

Sure. Stop.

[A]

Which. Which never happened again in America. So cops started taking a collection to take care of the family. It's Christmas time. So the community pulls together, gets the family into and pays for a very nice house with a cow and chickens.

[B]

This house has everything. No doors, no beds. It's not furnished. But if you go out back, you'll see a cow and a chicken. Unbelievable, huh?

[A]

One chicken.

[B]

All right, settle down, Doug.

[A]

Sorry.

[B]

Doug fought real hard for the one chicken. We wanted to get you two, but he's worried they'll be goitis. Fornication with the cow. Yeah.

[A]

I don't know how anything works.

[B]

Okay, that was the chicken.

[A]

Three months later, Joe, the brother who went to the bar for fisticuffs to protect his sister and then got the cop killed and then ran. Was arrested for forging checks.

[B]

Okay? So he's a good guy.

[A]

So this upset people. They're like, how this guy's. No, this guy's bad.

[B]

Right?

[A]

And so they're. They're very confused. He's supposed to be good.

[B]

Great for papers, though.

[A]

Yeah. Everyone's like. The papers are great. But now they're like, is this guy a swindler? A year later, another twist. Kate is arrested for prostitution at 3rd Neverett.

[B]

3rd. Never.

[A]

Everett 3rd. Okay, not 3rd Neverett.

[B]

Stop it.

[A]

Very rough neighborhood.

[B]

Step. Okay?

[A]

The waterfront. Full of sailors and boarding houses and brothels and Shanghai saloons. The whole. It's a bad place. So now People are upset at her. So they're like, well, this whole thing is.

[B]

It's all falling apart.

[A]

There's no good.

[B]

No heroes.

[A]

Yeah, there's no heroes. So this, obviously, this is not where an innocent wife. Sister would find herself. On top of all this, reporters are putting together the. That the man Melville believed was screwing his wife was Giddings. So he was screwing Kate and her sister. So now the situation is that a guy beats up his wife for screwing another guy, goes to a bar, the wife's brother comes and brings the cop she's screwing. Fight happens, guy shoots the cop who's banging his wife. So it's all very. It's a very different from the original story.

[B]

Everyone's just like, if it wasn't for the beating of her at the beginning, we could have close to a hero. But he. He really screwed it. I don't think you're allowed to request that at a show.

[A]

It honestly doesn't matter because it's all fucked up. So sorry, Dave.

[B]

I hate to be Carol from the audience.

[A]

Yeah, go ahead.

[B]

Can we do it one more time, please?

[A]

Which. Which part?

[B]

The whole show, please. What was the. Just go back to the picture where the werewolf was banging the woman in the Sleepy Hollow. Go back to the Sleepy Hollow. Yeah. Now, Dave, can we just admit that this story was a lot simpler then? How about this? Here's my only. Here's my only note. You're having your fun, but is it possible to just do that story of those two from 3, 2, 1. That story. Once again, Carol, on behalf of the audience.

[A]

So we have our first storyboard for Game of Thrones. So everyone involved in the story is bananas. That's how everybody thinks. Everybody in Portland is just like, I can't keep. I can't. Even people who just love unlit roster is like, I can't, I can't, I can't. You guys are. This is terrible.

[B]

Right?

[A]

So the supposed good guys, a swindler, the damsel in distress, a prostitute, and now bigamist. The bystander cop is a serial cheater, terrible family man, and possibly there to murder. The sister is having an affair with the cop. So the Oregonian now reports that Melville. Melville also beat his kids, too. So the paper clearly held onto that information and waited until Melville was arrested and he was being sent back to Portland from Idaho to face trial. But Portland's just like, these people are exhausting freaks. Exasperated, they're exhausting freaks. There's no good guys. So everyone just stopped caring. And then the cops realized they actually had not arrested Melville. It was some other guy. But Kate had gotten married again. So now they're like, well, let's arrest her for bigamy. Because Melville was never. Because she never divorced him. Because he was gone.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And she got remarried. So they arrested her for bigamy and Melville was never found.

[B]

Well, there's. Okay, all right. There's a good lesson. Nevermind.

[A]

So the whole. The whole thing made people start to think that, like, maybe write down the law

[B]

might be time to get a pen on paper with the law.

[A]

Maybe life is a little too complicated for, like, the unwritten law.

[B]

Yeah, it might be. It really might just be time to allow sex to just have people have sex. Don't look at me.

[A]

And also, Oregon now starts to see a lot fewer honor killings. They're definitely going on around the country. In Oregon, it doesn't end completely, but it's dwindling. It's still happening in rural areas.

[B]

It still is. So

[A]

Charles Reynolds and his wife Lulu were living in Portland. They just moved from Colorado. They ran a bathhouse. So Charles Reynolds is a U.S. army vet and he's in his 50s. Lulu is in her mid 20s. She wanted to be a songwriter, and she had met a music teacher in Colorado named George Hibbens. So when she moves to Portland, they start writing letters to each other, and the letters start to become more and more familiar.

[B]

Throwing out that, like, throwing out the first flirty letter feeling like it's unrequited for, like, you know.

[A]

Oh, yeah, because it's going to be.

[B]

It's like, even with text, if it was like a day later, you'd be like, I fucking creeped her out. I was just trying to be like, what's up? Like a letter. Be like, three weeks later. Be like, what the fuck was I saying? Why was I saying that? But as I explained in my undergarment, I shouldn't even complain about my undergarments. She didn't want to know about them. That she's like, my undergarments are also sometimes a little different. Oh, oh, here we go. Well, well, well.

[A]

Now. Are you talking about long underwear?

[B]

No. Get. Get out of here. I'm in the middle of something.

[A]

Yeah, well, it's the. Just based on the year. Like, what are your undergarments like at that time? Panties are you wearing.

[B]

Women wore thongs back then.

[A]

Are you wearing panties? You're wearing panties?

[B]

I wear a panty. Yeah, Okay. I love a panty.

[A]

I was just checking.

[B]

Go ahead, shame me. Get canceled.

[A]

I'm not shaming you.

[B]

No, no, no. Go ahead.

[A]

No.

[B]

Do it. You fucking kiss. Shamer.

[A]

I just think for the time.

[B]

All right. So all the listeners out there who are wearing panties, men or women. Dave doesn't support you. I do. I got your back. I like a panty. Thank you. I'm starting a six podcast called the Panty Pod. Is that funny?

[A]

No.

[B]

Is it not? No. Why are you smiling? Kind of giggling a little bit.

[A]

I'm not. I'm just. I'm just. When you talk about panties, I uncomfortably touch my mustache. Who doesn't do that?

[B]

That's quite a Pavlovian response. Jeez. Are you clearing a surface?

[A]

So they're writing letters, becoming more and more familiar. Charles at one point finds a letter that she'd written that says, quote, my heart belongs to you. That's not good. So George moves to San Diego and tells Lulu she should come join him down there. He's married, by the way.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

After they both get a divorce.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

Then one day, George just shows up to Portland unannounced.

[B]

Hey. Hey.

[A]

So there's two. There's two. There's two creeps in the story. That's my. That's how I'm seeing it. Offbeat, Oregon quote. He told her that she had given herself to him and he had come to take what was rightfully his.

[B]

Oh, man.

[A]

It's just being rude.

[B]

Like when I was on Tinder, that was my initiating message. I would be like, I'm glad we matched. The next part is me coming to take what is rightfully mine. Hello,

[A]

I'm here to brand you.

[B]

I also love old country for a moment. Now it's my time to take you.

[A]

Lulu wasn't sure what to do, so she put him up in a room in the bath house that they own. And when Charles was out, she would go and they would do naughty things. So George buys her an expensive engagement ring and puts it on her finger.

[B]

I don't believe that's how proposals. I believe you're supposed to ask.

[A]

Well, he did.

[B]

Oh, he did. He didn't just go like, gotcha, I

[A]

got it on your mind.

[B]

There was actually nothing to reach for,

[A]

so she just wears it around.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

She's married, so that's weird.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So Charles starts to notice a change in her because he picks up on the things.

[B]

I noticed you're wearing another ring. That seems strange to me.

[A]

And he asked his kids, he's got an 18 year old and a 6 year old. He asked them if they've seen anything. And his 6 year old son Goes, yeah, she's visiting some dude when you're at work, and I saw them kissing.

[B]

Okay, time to talk about the family communication. So if your mom. If she's kissing other men, that's something I want to know.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

It's kind of not my business, but it's my business. So that's it? She's just. You've seen her kissing? A little. Okay, well, in future, you let me know if you see anything, okay? Because I got to talk to her now about that kissing. Because that's not okay.

[A]

Why not?

[B]

Because I'm. She's. She's our. She's ours. I mean, I don't mean to put it like that, but that she's a good kisser. Yeah, when she kisses him, she's a good kisser.

[A]

No.

[B]

I mean. Nope. Have a good day, boy.

[A]

So right after that, Lulu asks for a divorce, and Charles decides he's gonna win back his lady, and he takes her to a day at an amusement park.

[B]

How fun is this, huh?

[A]

Whoa.

[B]

Look at all these rides. Aren't I fun? Aren't we having the best time? More cotton candy? How about some taffy? Hey, let's go win a little stuffed animal. Let's go to the Ferris wheel again. How great was that? Oh, I love you. I love you. I love us. I love us. Nothing can ever come between us. I love you so much. Let's go play some more games. Hey, how about I'll hit the hammer into the thing. I'll show you how strong I am, big shot of man. And even if I don't hit it on the highest level, it's just that we're having fun while we're finding out stuff like that. Oh, my God. Listen to us. It's like we just are on our first date again. I'm also having the best time with you. Sometimes when I'm on the rides, I feel a little bit. Little nauseous. But I know that you're there for me. And that's what's awesome about all of this, is how we're on the same page. I could stay here all day.

[A]

I haven't.

[B]

I tell you the. The best part. It's the bond between us. There's a ride I want to give you later when we get home, by the way. And you don't need one of the carnival tickets for it, but if you want to hand me one, I suppose I'll take it. How about a caramel apple? Caramel apple? Let's have two each. Let's share one. Let's Share one. Let's share one. Let's share a fucking terrible apple. How about the popping corn? Oh, that'll be the best. We'll share the pop bag of popping corn. Don't talk for the rest of the day.

[A]

I haven't said anything in four hours.

[B]

No, I know, and I want to hear your voice, but it's just I also have the voices inside of myself, and those are torturing me. How about this? We'll go over to the game where you throw the ping pong ball and you try to get it into the bowl, and if I hit it, we're together forever, Soulmate. Is that too far that ping pong

[A]

balls haven't been invented yet?

[B]

Ah, You put me in Hell,

[A]

Yeah. This is why we're not together. We. And anymore, I'll tell you either.

[B]

Either way, I'm cool with whatever. I don't need it, but I would love it. But, like, hey, you want to do whatever you want to do? Maybe we should have our hands burned together.

[A]

That's the worst thing anyone's ever said. So when they're at the amusement park for their. Oh, aren't we in love? In day, he just starts interrogating her.

[B]

Quote.

[A]

Then he noticed the ring, and he.

[B]

How the fuck?

[A]

What?

[B]

That's so. Man.

[A]

What? She's wearing an engagement ring.

[B]

I know. And forever.

[A]

He's like, oh, what the fuck?

[B]

Hey, I suppose I haven't looked at you in a while.

[A]

Well, George has only been there for

[B]

a week still, day one, I'd be

[A]

like, yeah, I would notice if my wife had an engagement ring.

[B]

My wife had another ring.

[A]

Hey, who's the fella?

[B]

Oh, I'm also. I've taken a fiance.

[A]

Then he noticed the ring. He asked where I got it, and I told him that maybe he would know someday. So she's pretty awesome.

[B]

Okay. Oh, cool.

[A]

A couple of days later, George notices a picture of George on her. So they're still. She wants a divorce. They're still living together, and she now has put. She's wearing an engagement ring, and she now has put a picture of George on her bureau.

[B]

Awful.

[A]

And he knows George from Colorado. Hey. He somehow figured out through his son that George is at the boarding house and he runs there 15 blocks.

[B]

Probably walked a little.

[A]

Yeah. And she and George at that point, are preparing to take a walk in the park, and Charles bursts in and yelled, quote, I'm on to you.

[B]

He had 15 blocks to nail it. Hold on, let me. Let me. Let me go back from the beginning. I got a Better one. Hold on.

[A]

Okay, go ahead.

[B]

All right. Here we go. Oh. Well, well, well. Seems like this boarding house isn't the only thing you've been inside lately. A little wordy. Yeah. Charles Will.

[A]

No, no. You're Charles.

[B]

I know. I'm looking into a mirror.

[A]

Oh, you're. You're talking to a mirror now.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Are you practicing?

[B]

Yes. Okay, now I'll even come back.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Your name again?

[A]

George.

[B]

That's right. Whoa. Oh. Hey. Oh, hi, George.

[A]

Hi.

[B]

Haven't seen you in a while. But that's not something that my wife could say on account of you have seen her in a while.

[A]

She's right here. I'm holding my hand. We're going to the park. I'm engaged to her.

[B]

Yeah, well, she. Hold on. Hey, George.

[A]

Hey.

[B]

What about a throuple? Could be cool.

[A]

Have you heard?

[B]

We could do stuff. Or we don't have to.

[A]

Have you heard of a cuck?

[B]

I'm okay with that role. I've been looking at chairs.

[A]

So anyway, he shot George three times.

[B]

That's better.

[A]

George stumbled into a drugstore. A bullet had cut his intestines, and he died that night.

[B]

Do you have Gatorade?

[A]

No, sorry. Pepto. Do you have Pepto? So Charles was arrested, and he said to the cops, quote, I was with General Custer for a long time as

[B]

a scout, by the way, that from now on should be when you get arrested, what you say?

[A]

Yeah, use the Custer card.

[B]

I was Custer as a scout, you fool.

[A]

The guy who got killed because he sucked. And do you think that now, when my home was in danger from a despoiler, I would show the white feather? I will stand by my home.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Everyone's just like, all right, so, okay, you're still arrested. Like, I don't know what's going on.

[B]

What do you mean, white feather?

[A]

I think that's surrender.

[B]

It's a lot harder to see than a flag.

[A]

Hello.

[B]

We got a sick bird over there, sir. Keep fighting. We got a weird dove over there, sir.

[A]

That's a parakeet feather. Let's get, like, a bigger one.

[B]

Let's go. Let's get him.

[A]

Lulu said George was innocent and helping her with her music. And that's it. And Charles had just lost his mind. Before George died, he confirmed her version. So they asked Lulu to identify the body. And when she saw it, she just completely lost it and was sobbing and.

[B]

All right, you cut off. You don't have to go home, but you can't grieve here. That's enough, man.

[A]

You really like that music teacher.

[B]

Get out of here. Enough grieving. Jesus Christ. What's with all these women freaking out over these dead guys? They like.

[A]

She threw herself on Georgia's corpse and started, quote, kissing his cold lips passionately.

[B]

Ma', am, he's dead. Ma', am. He died. That's how I like it. Ma'. Am. Ma', Am, I didn't know. All right, keep going.

[A]

And at that. At that point, she realized she had blown her cover story because she's making out with a corpse. And she confessed that she had been having an affair with George. And the media goes fucking nuts. So her love letters are printed in the papers, and Charles says he's innocent due to the unwritten law. Unwritten law.

[B]

What the fuck? The invisible man was at the trial.

[A]

That's her.

[B]

So they say. I'm actually just a beekeeper.

[A]

Yeah. So she covered up for the trial, I guess.

[B]

Sure did. It's a cover up.

[A]

He also said Lulu had to be had. So Charles says Lulu must have been hypnotized by George for sure. Quote, under that influence, she was helpless. I will never believe anything else. He still loves her and he wants her back.

[B]

She's. Dude, take the. Read the room.

[A]

Honestly, Leila said she could never live with him again. And she. She wasn't hypnotized.

[B]

Still hypnotized. She was hypnotized. The desane. She wasn't hypnotized.

[A]

I'm not hypnotized.

[B]

Yeah, you are. You're under his spell.

[A]

You looked at a watch, didn't you, crazy ass.

[B]

You'll live with me again.

[A]

Custer made you nuts.

[B]

Well, come on now. We raced the white feather together.

[A]

She wasn't hypnotized. Quote, we were just attracted to each other. The jury took 30 minutes to declare Charles innocent. But cases like this made people really rethink the unwritten law. They're like, okay, this is really fucked up. In 1909, the owner of a stable shot one of his teamsters five times and then claimed the man.

[B]

Yo, it's unwritten law.

[A]

He can kill a Teamster.

[B]

Whatever. He took my sandwich.

[A]

On written law, he said that the guy was having an affair with his wife.

[B]

Unwritten law.

[A]

But she had filed for a divorce. And it turns out.

[B]

Cause you can't do that. Unwritten law.

[A]

It turns out they've been separated once, and the wife was using the teamster as a. As a witness.

[B]

But unwritten law.

[A]

And then they're also documented as being violent and drunk and shooting.

[B]

I could do that, though.

[A]

Shot his house so papers wrote about the trials. If the unwritten law is at stake. Like, they're like, this is the one. If this one doesn't happen, it's over. And the defense attorney told the jury, quote, I do not think you men will declare your verdict. Oh, by the way, the jury.

[B]

All men.

[A]

The juries are men.

[B]

Yeah, all men. You know, the unwritten law seems pretty good to us on account of we could maybe kill guys sometimes. Unwritten law.

[A]

So they. They write as if the unwritten law is at stake. And the defense attorney told the jury, quote, I do not think you men will declare by your verdict that the seducer of women and smasher of homes can ply his wicked vocation unrebuked right here in Portland. And they voted five for acquittal and seven for murder on the first vote. So that shows that the unwritten law is, like, falling apart. And then they voted 11 times and finally settled on manslaughter. And when he heard the verdict, he was like, what the fuck?

[B]

I did not slaughter a man. It's offensive.

[A]

He got three years. But now the unwritten law couldn't easily be used to just kill people. So that meant less dudes killing. And it remained a common defense until World War I, when it just kind of ended and newspapers turned against it. And by the 1920s, unwritten law, honor killings in Oregon were rare, if at all.

[B]

That's it.

[A]

Well, I think the point is, is that men are cool,

[B]

right? It is. It's just a law to enable men in some way. Sometimes for murder. Right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. That's cool.

[A]

Yeah. Dudes are. You know, we kind of. We were kind of running shit. Not very well.

[B]

Yeah, we were.

[A]

We were. Now it's over.

[B]

Yeah, we.

[A]

You know, by the way, now a

[B]

lot of people who aren't history buffs, men used to be in charge and shit.

[A]

We used to run stuff. Yeah.

[B]

Then things changed, and now things are good again.

[A]

Pretty stand up, Buddy. You weren't ruling. It was other dudes. Anyway, Trump's president, and at least all

[B]

the laws are written down for that guy. Yeah, it's gonna be fine.

[A]

Yeah,

[B]

It's good. It's fun, and it's fine. Got sources you want to talk about or you want to talk about? Yeah, I don't know.

[A]

Offbeat Oregon Friedman.

[B]

That's actually called Beat Off Oregon. It's different, and I write for it.

[A]

Friedman, Lawrence Emmanuel Haverman, William E. The Rise and Fall of the Unwritten Law. Sex, Patriarchy, and Vigilante justice in the American Courts. The Oregonian legal history miscellany. And that's it.

[B]

Well, we gotta go. Unwritten law. Have a good night, everybody. Thank you very much for coming out. Appreciate. Hey, what's up, doll heads? This is Gareth Reynolds from the Doll up, the podcast. You're listening to. Hey, I've got some very exciting information. If you like movies and you're in the San Jose area, I made a movie. It's called Give it up and it will be at the Cinequest Film Festival. You can go to GiveItUpFilm.com for tickets and information. It'll be March 15th is the main screening, so go to GiveItUpFilm.Com also if you like stand up comedy February 4th I'll be in Spokane, February 5th, Bend, Oregon. Then I'll be in Portland February 6th and February 7th, three shows that night. Then I'll be at flappers in Burbank February 21 Bakersfield, February 27 for two shows. I will be in Albuquerque, New Mexico, April 19 Tulsa, Oklahoma, April 21 Bricktown comedy in Oklahoma City April 22 Dallas, Texas, April 23 Tyler, Texas April 24 Finally Houston, April 25 Two shows, Austin at the Great Cap City April 26 and then San Antonio April 28 and Tucson April 29. Garethreynolds.com for tickets and information. But also if you want to go see my movie and you're the San Jose area. GiveItUpFilm.com.