B (4:20)

Is this something you think that has existed in him forever? Like even in his younger years, before he had the power and the money, that these were his kinks, These are the things that he was into, really was gonna be are these things that came about later because he kept going to such extreme behavior that it's like, well, that's not that exciting anymore. So I gotta level up to this. And then that's not. So I gotta level up to this. And then you start getting into that really dangerous territory where you are harming other people for your own enjoyment. You think he was like this just all along? Like this is just kind of his thing and it just. Gimme your thoughts on that.

C (4:58)

Yeah. You know, we never know for everybody because the development of this stuff is always unique, but it's always a combination of biology, genetics, and social environment. Sometimes there's an abuse history, but certainly not always meaning a sexual abuse history. And sometimes it's exposure, particularly early in life to weird, violent or kinky porn that contributes. But there's also, you know, some thinking that some people are more pre wired out of the shoot for being a bit off sexually different than the rest of us. So my guess is that he was a bit off from the beginning and maybe more prone to extreme sexual behavior with extreme sexual drives. And then, yes, as he became more powerful, it progressed to where it's like an addiction. I need more and more and more and more to feel satisfied. But to me, it's. You know, there are people who are into foot fetishes and shoes. And I met one guy once who was into ears. I'm like, he had to. Had to have photos of women's ears. Another one that was into women's hair. He was actually riding the city bus around, and he would. I don't know how he pulled this off, but this was in all the local news here in Portland. He would masturbate in women's hair, sitting behind them on the bus. I mean, so people develop these weird, weird things. And I don't know how to explain some of this stuff. It's just. It's poorly understood. How do you research it? You get these stories and you try to go over their history, and sometimes you just can't find where did this develop from. But it does tend to develop, you know, as they become sexually motivated in their teens. That's when the weird fantasies start. But then I think a lot of people, they don't have the power to pull off what he pulled off. And yes, I agree with you, it did get more extreme over time.

B (7:07)

Siobhan, explain to me how someone gets off doing that into someone's hair on a city bus.

C (7:14)

I don't know. And there was another one. I'm giving you my stories today. We would have a very fun dinner party conversation. There was another one at my local Safeway about a mile from my house.

B (7:26)

The irony.

C (7:28)

Exactly. And they caught the guy. He was having little cups of semen, and he would walk around in the Safeway and throw it at women. And a lot of them, he did it from behind and they didn't know. And eventually he was caught on camera and someone saw him do it and he was arrested. And, you know, but I remember that one. It's like, where did that come from? I mean, it's just you find these. There are stories you probably don't want to hear. I've got more.

B (7:57)

But I'm morbidly curious about these people because it's so insane. I mean, what's scary to me about all of these things that people are doing. A lot of these folks, they were brought up pre Internet porn age.

C (8:14)

That's true.

B (8:15)

And now, I mean, there's something for everybody out there, it seems. What I'm scared about is that type of behavior becoming more rampant, more extreme, more weird stuff out in public. More extreme things that are hurtful to other people that they think is just normal. And I think that's a big question about the Diddy situation. Was he and doesn't make it right by any means. But was he aware of the harm he was causing other people with these sexual proclivities? I don't think there's any arguing that he knows it's not okay to kick somebody in the face or stomp on their head. There's no question knowing you can't, that that's wrong. But the sexual stuff, when you know, you have someone who seems to be kind of there under duress, and it's like, yeah, this is great Diddy. He seems to be taking that at face value without ever quite recognizing, oh, shit, like I'm really harming these people that I supposedly care about.

C (9:13)

I, I put that one down to his psychopathy, which I don't think there's any question that this guy's a psychopath at this point. He's sadistic, psychopathic, manipulative, all what we call the dark tetrad, you know, of qualities that are very bad mix. And psychopathic people see other people as objects. They don't love in the way that, you know, the rest of us feel kind of a romantic attachment or a loving attachment even to our children. Other people are objects to be used. And so even though they may intellectually see that, yeah, this person is not happy with what's going on, I can see that they really do not care. And that's what makes them so dangerous. There's just no empathic attunement there.

B (10:04)

But they can act like it. They can fake it pretty good, right?

C (10:08)

Very much. Very much, yes. And that's how, that's what makes them scary. The smart ones fake it very well.

B (10:15)

How do they know to do that? Is it just emulating other people that they've seen, showing love and showing care, and you just get really good at faking it till you make it, or, or. I mean, are they able to turn on those emotions for a slight period of time, but then flip them right off when they need to to not feel the accountability of their actions?

C (10:36)

I think it's an acting job. And a lot of people develop it. You know, people with this personality style develop, develop in childhood and they learn, you know, empathy develops. Age 3, 4, 5, 6 is when kids are supposed to develop it. And for whatever reason, combination of genetics, environment, these folks don't have it. But they see what gets them attention and praise. And when they can act loving toward other people, oh, you know, I get something beneficial back for doing that. And so it's a, it's again, a style that develops in childhood and they get really good at it.

B (11:14)

Let's talk about one thing that he is alleged to have done and that just came out in court is basically blowing up a car. Blowing up Kid Cootie's car. Kid Cootie was a. Or is a rapper who was dating Cassie Ventura for a short period of time while they were kind of having a downspout. Diddy recklessly sleeping with everybody that he wanted to. But if she did it, that's a big no, no. He found out about it, made a threat that he would blow up his car and then what do you know, a little while later his car blows up. Is, I mean, when we're trying to figure out what the hell's going on with the person, is that a prime example of a narcissistic injury or is this just a psychopath on a rampage?

C (12:03)

I think you've got the psychopathic lack of concern for somebody else's life and then, yeah, the narcissistic rage at how dare you? Because she's my object, you know, she's not a person, but she belongs to me. And how dare you?

B (12:17)

Yeah, and that's just. There's a lot of that with Diddy, it seems, where we've seen videos of Diddy where he gets into these rages and people looked at that and go, look how passionate he is, look how dedicated he is to what he's doing. There's a lot of folks in high places of power that have reactions like that and it could be narcissistic rage and sometimes it's. It's looked at or used as well. This is what makes them who they are without that sort of passion. And I'm saying that in air quotes for anybody listening to this, they wouldn't be where they are. Is that, I mean, not blowing up other people's cars, but I mean, is that more of a common thing with really high level individuals in their fields or in their crafts where they've reached such a level. But maybe they wouldn't have gotten there without the intimidation, without that rage, without basically people telling them no at some point because are fearing what is going to happen to them if they were to speak up.

C (13:22)

Now, it's appalling to me that we make awful people famous and how other famous people will validate, justify and go along with this kind of extreme behavior. And this would be another topic for a book on all the awful people that have become celebrities and then contrast that with the benevolent people, you know, that have used their wealth and fame for good. The one that pops into my head is Keanu Reeves, who's known as a humanitarian and always doing wonderful things. And I'm sure there are many other examples, but there's this dark side to the entertainment industry, and I think as a culture, we need to think about that and look at it. It's like, who do we make famous? And what does that say about us?

A (14:17)

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