Am I Doomed to Repeat My Family’s Tragic Past

Summary

The Dr. John Delony Show

Episode: Am I Doomed to Repeat My Family’s Tragic Past
Host: Dr. John Delony (Ramsey Network)
Date: October 6, 2025

---

Episode Overview

This episode of The Dr. John Delony Show focuses on breaking cycles of trauma, family legacies, and the quest for personal healing and change. Dr. Delony takes calls from listeners grappling with difficult family histories, shame, and mental health challenges. The central theme is one of hope: the past does not dictate one’s future, and intentional action, supported by vulnerability and community, can forge a new and healthier path.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Caller #1: Jane – Afraid of Repeating Family Trauma (00:54 – 19:50)

Jane's Story and Fears

• Jane, the youngest of six, recounts her childhood trauma: her father's severe abuse (physical, financial, emotional, sexual), family instability, and his public suicide after being expelled from the home for abuse.
• Witnessing her siblings' marriages falling apart, Jane fears she’s destined to repeat the family pattern, despite her loving marriage and young child.
• She experiences intense anxiety, self-blame, and overwhelming rage — traits she worries are inherited from her father.

Dr. Delony's Core Insights

• Validation of Jane’s Experience
  • “It feels scary when you feel like you're not in control of your own body.” (01:32)
  • “You have seen and experienced things that no child should ever see or experience.” (05:28)
• Reframing Her Father's Actions
  • Dr. Delony gently guides Jane to see her father's suicide as the act of a deeply unwell person, not as a deliberate curse on the family.
  • Quote: “If I say, dude was sick ... he did some evil, awful things when he was sick ... I want as early as possible to unhook him from this sense of destiny that you feel like you have, that you've been cast into.” (07:06)
• The Dilemma of Shared Survival and Healing
  • Jane and her siblings survived together, but each must heal on their own, which may feel like abandonment.
  • “Your healing journey sounds like it's going to be on your own, apart from them.” (07:35)
• On Outgrowing the Old Family Roles
  • Dr. Delony highlights the necessity of finding new supportive relationships, and the challenge of redefining role models.
  • “Y’all survived together ... That doesn't mean they're going to be the architects that help you build your new home on shore.” (10:10)
  • Quote: “You, in fact, might become the beacon of light for them.” (10:32)
• Changing the Family Tree
  • Healing does not mean erasure of harm, but proactively choosing a different legacy.
  • “The family tree changes with me.” (11:53)
• On Anger, Family Loyalty, and Trauma Responses
  • Dr. Delony challenges Jane’s idolization of her mother, recognizing the blend of reverence and suppressed anger common in trauma survivors.
  • “That's somebody hitting you with a two by four and then telling you you're not allowed to cry in public.” (12:19)
• Normalizing Her Emotions
  • Jane describes panic, rage, and shutdowns; Dr. Delony reassures her: “Your body is working perfectly ... it has run this script before.” (15:23)
• Practical Steps to Healing
  • Dr. Delony advises seeking a trauma-informed therapist, being upfront about history and goals, and stresses the importance of “outsourcing” positive perspective to safe people (husband, friends, therapist).
  • “If you'll plug into the skill set ... you will change your body's default setting, where it will go from rage and lashing out to grace to annoyance.” (18:22)
  • Quote: “Healing is on the other side of this.” (19:32)
• Encouragement and Realism
  • “Listen, the gates of hell are in front of you. This is not going to be easy, but ... it will be worth it.” (18:53)

Memorable Moment:
Jane is moved by Dr. Delony’s description of healing: “I can barely see what it's going to look like on the other side, but I'm excited.” (19:11)

---

2. Caller #2: Taylor – Telling Her Teen Daughter the Truth About Her Father (22:39 – 35:53)

Taylor's Story and Core Dilemma

• Taylor, a single mother, struggles with intense shame and uncertainty over how to tell her 15-year-old daughter that she doesn’t know who her biological father is due to trauma, addiction, and a chaotic past.

Dr. Delony's Core Insights

• Challenging Self-Judgment and Shame
  • Dr. Delony reframes her shame: “How dare you judge teenage you. That girl survived and she survived in unhealthy ways.” (25:41)
  • “You have scratched and clawed and now you have what sounds like an amazing 15 year old kid.” (29:20)
• On Generational Trauma and Openness
  • Dr. Delony emphasizes that secrecy and shame perpetuate trauma cycles.
  • Quote: “This is how trauma gets passed on. Because your daughter's going to know. There's a part of my mom that I don't know and it must be my fault.” (30:04)
• Honesty as the Path Forward
  • He advises Taylor to be candid with her daughter: “I don't know who your dad is. I was with multiple people during that time. Not proud of it...But I wouldn't have you and I wouldn't change that.” (31:36)
  • “There’s an opportunity that y' all walk away from this where your daughter's both curious ... and has a sense that my mom is a thousand times stronger than I knew her to be.” (32:51)
• Preparing for the Conversation
  • Suggests writing out her story, being honest about motives, and inviting open dialogue.
  • “Maybe you say, I'm going to read this out loud and then I want us to go for a walk ... and then we're going to circle back and we're going to talk about it.” (33:36)
• Hopeful Reframe
  • “She might look at you as the single safest person she's ever known.” (34:39)
• Concluding Counsel
  • “The shame ends with this call. Not beating up surviving me anymore.” (35:39)

---

3. Caller #3: Matt – Medical Student Struggling with Stress and Destructive Coping (38:02 – 51:32)

Matt's Story and Problem

• Second-year medical student, high chronic stress, self-defeating habits (pornography use, hair-pulling), and mounting self-loathing. Fears future breakdown, never expresses struggles to anyone—including his physician father.

Dr. Delony's Core Insights

• Not Just a Med School Problem
  • Points out these issues pre-date medical school; stress is gasoline on an existing fire.
  • “This is not medical school. Medical school is the gas that's getting poured on an already existing fire.” (41:54)
• The Danger of Silence
  • “Secrets will kill you. Literally.” (42:40)
  • Dr. Delony compares Matt’s habits (self-harm, pornography) to unsafe release valves on a pressure system.
• Invitation to Vulnerability
  • Urges Matt to reach out—to his school’s counseling, and to his father (if safe).
  • “You’ve created an image that my dad is great ... but you actually don't know how he's doing at all.” (47:24)
  • Emphasizes that if Matt’s father can’t be vulnerable, the problem is with him, not Matt.
• Practical Commitments
  • Matt commits to both seeing a counselor and having an honest conversation with his father.
  • “I want you to actually, actually feel this one.” (50:52)
  • “This is you surrendering. What I'm doing is not working. And I want to be a physician ... I've got to learn some new skills.” (51:10)
• Hope and Humanity
  • Dr. Delony reassures Matt: “You're not broken ... I promise you can get there. It's gonna take some work, but you can get there.” (50:23, 51:32)
  • “Few physicians will be as compassionate as you are when somebody who's hurting walks in the front door.” (51:32)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Breaking Generational Trauma:
  • “The family tree changes with me.” – Jane (11:53)
  • “Healing is on the other side of this.” – Dr. Delony (19:32)
• On the Wounds of Childhood:
  • “That's somebody hitting you with a two by four and then telling you you're not allowed to cry in public.” – Dr. Delony (12:19)
• On Worthiness and Shame:
  • “I'm worth being well, I'm worth the hell it's going to cost for peace for me and for everybody who comes after me.” – Dr. Delony (19:56)
• On Parenting with Honesty:
  • “My mother always tells me the truth ... My mom has seen everything, so there's nothing I'm going to run into in the world that she hasn't been through herself.” – Dr. Delony (35:36)
• On Seeking Help:
  • “Secrets will kill you. Literally.” – Dr. Delony (42:40)
  • “This is you surrendering. What I'm doing is not working ... I've got to learn some new skills.” (51:10)

Highlight Timestamps

• 00:54–19:50: Jane’s story of abuse, survival, and fear of repeating the past; Dr. Delony’s guidance on healing and changing the family legacy.
• 22:39–35:53: Taylor’s struggle with shame and disclosure to her daughter; advice on truth-telling and intra-generational healing.
• 38:02–51:32: Matt’s confessions of stress, self-harm, and isolation in medical school; Dr. Delony’s urgent counsel on vulnerability and getting help.

---

Episode Takeaways

• Trauma and family history need not determine destiny; healing involves both courageous action and safe connection.
• Openness—especially with oneself, one’s children, and chosen safe people—is key to rewriting personal and family legacies.
• Practical support (therapy, honest conversations, community) is essential. Healing is painful, not instantaneous, but deeply possible.
• The show’s encouragement to listeners: “You are worth being well. You are worth the hell it’s going to cost for peace for you and for everyone who comes after you.” (19:56)

---

Summary prepared to serve as a comprehensive guide for those who have not listened to the episode, capturing the pain, hope, and practical wisdom shared.

Transcript

[Caller]

My father was abusive in every way. And then when I was 12 years old, he actually publicly killed himself in a place that we were at with our friends and family.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, man. To get to the root of a couple of things, I'm gonna have to make everybody uncomfortable. What in the world is going on? This is jon with the Doctor Doctor John DeLoney show, coming to you from Nashville, Tennessee, taking your calls on your mental and emotional health, your relationships, your kids, your spouse, whatever you got going on in your life. I'm so honored to sit with you and figure out what's the next right move, no matter what you're going through. Let's go out to Charleston, South Carolina, and talk to Jane. Hey, Jane. What's going on?

[Caller]

Hi. Nice to talk to you, John.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's nice to talk to you. What's up?

[Caller]

So I have a lot of backstory, but I'll start with the question. Long story short, I'm pretty scared of my DNA. I'm the youngest of six kids, and we were abused growing up, and my father suffered from mental illness. And as we grew up, I kind of thought it just made us stronger. But now I'm watching all of my siblings. Marriages fall apart, and at this point, I'm the last one married. And so I just want to know if there's a way to avoid pretty much giving into our DNA.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Wow, that's. It feels scary when you feel like you're not in control of your own body. What happens next, huh?

[Caller]

Yeah. And I just feel a big sense of impending doom. And my husband, I mean, he's just beautifully patient, and I've got a young son, and they are so pure. And I just know that if something were to happen to our marriage. Marriage. It would be a result of me.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's not true. But I also know that that feeling and belief is very real inside your chest. And so I want to honor that. Okay. Take me back as. As much as you feel safe doing so. Tell me about the abuse.

[Caller]

Okay. So growing up again, I was the youngest, so I feel like I was. I saw the least, probably. I can't remember most of my childhood as a trauma response. My father was abusive in every way. Physically, financially, emotionally, sexually. And, like, we were never stable. We almost got evicted so many times growing up, we had cars repossessed. And then when I was 12 years old, it came to light that he had sexually abused my sisters. He introduced my brothers to porn at a very young age, and my mom kicked him out of the house. And in return, he actually publicly killed Himself and in a place that we were at with our friends and family and stuff. So it was very. Just out of spite, if that makes sense. And he was bipolar, and me and my siblings, we just. It felt almost like we made it out of that trauma. Like, we grew to. It felt like we were almost like battle buddies. And I look up to them more than anything. I still do. And I'm just. These are the people that I ask for life advice for everything. And then I got married five years ago, and five of us were married at the time. And as of right now, it looks like by the end of this year, I will be the only one of us married. And when I speak to them about it, it's all either them struggling with traits that my dad had or struggling with just PTSD trauma and acting out from that side of things.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, man, this is tricky in this setting. Okay, so before I start. And there's a couple of reasons why. Because to get to the root of a couple of things, I'm gonna have to make everybody uncomfortable. Okay? And normally, I would never do that if I'm sitting with you in a. First time I've. The first time I've met you. Okay? So mostly what I'm gonna say is gonna be something that I want you to promise me you'll go meet with a professional. Okay? And this will take place over a series of weeks, if not months. Okay?

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm gonna say it this way. Okay. And I'm gonna oversimplify it, but what I hear in front of me is a woman who needs some peace because she's scared of herself. Right? And I want you to know that fear is very real. And it's right. You have seen and experienced things that no child should ever see or experience. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I also. And this is going to sound crazy, what I'm saying right now, okay, There will be time for anger and deep, deep rage. But I want to. I want to flip something around for you so that you can do the most important thing for you and your family right now, which is you begin to heal. And so I want you to think of Dad's suicide less about a last hurrah, screw you, middle finger to the family, and more of, how old is your little one?

[Caller]

He's two.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay? Imagine if he crawled out of his tiny little race car bed and he was sick and he didn't feel good, and he ran into your room and said, mommy, and then he barfed everywhere. Okay? We wouldn't get mad at him for that. It would be Awful. We'd have a big mess to clean up and everyone would be frustrated. But we're not going to get mad at somebody who's sick and just explodes everywhere. Okay? So if you reframe, I'm not letting your dad off the hook. I'm not minimizing how awful it is. But what I want you to do is, is take that fear and that anger and exhale it and begin to say, okay, I have to look in the mirror and I have to ask myself, what am I going to do next? And constantly looping back to dad means he still has his hooks in you.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so if I say, dude was sick, he wasn't. Well, he did some evil, awful things when he was sick. Now, when you. As you begin to heal and you begin to stand up tall. God almighty. Yes. The rage will be right, the anger will be right, and you'll be with a professional to process that stuff. But I want as early as possible to unhook him from this sense of destiny that you feel like you have, that you've been cast into. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Here's the second thing, and this is really scary. You and your siblings survive together, right. Your healing journey sounds like it's going to be on your own, apart from them.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And that's terrifying because you guys all banded together while y' all are floating out at sea, when the ship that was supposed to carry you from childhood to adulthood sank right in front of you. And they. They are. They're on a different trajectory than you are right now. And your healing, in many ways will feel like abandonment or your great marriage will feel like a slap in their face. Right?

[Caller]

Yeah. Yeah, I get that part already.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. And so. And by the way, I. I spoke wrong. Your healing will not be alone, but it may not be with them. And that means you have to go do something that is terrifying for your nervous system and that is go find new people to trust.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And talk to me about how scary that feels.

[Caller]

It is scary. I. It's really scary. And I. It's hard because they're all my role models. And so it's like, to me, I.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Don'T think they are, Jane. I don't think they are.

[Caller]

I just feel like they're the strongest people I've ever met. So if they can't get past this, then I don't have a lot of hope for me.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I would suggest that. That they. They're making choices on a day by day basis.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And that actually feels scarier because the next question is, you Mean, they're choosing this life.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And, and so the, the hard truth that I would give them if they called in is I'll never ever kick somebody out of the table. Sitting at a table with me when they're making, when they're constantly going back to the well with things like addiction, things like anger, things like rage, things like feeling like intimacy is, is terrifying because all those things are true. And I would not do this show, I wouldn't sit with hurting people if I did not believe in the power and the resilience of people in their communities to heal.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so what I think a reframe is they, y' all survived together and in many ways they kept you afloat. When you were a little girl, you didn't drown because they kept reaching out and holding you. Right. That doesn't mean they're going to be the architects that help you build your new home on shore.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And there's a strange way this might flip over time. You in fact, might become the beacon of light for them.

[Caller]

Wow.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And that's how people survive together. Sometimes somebody jumps on their grenade for everybody and then the rest of the survivors pick up that person and they carries them to the medic.

[Caller]

Yeah, I see that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so you're, you're choosing to go sit with a trauma therapist. And what we're trying to do is teach our body that family is the thing that will like connectivity, deep, powerful, trusting, safe relationships. That's oxygen. We all have to have that. And for your sweet little 12 year old body, that is a nightmare. Right. And so that's what quote, unquote, healing is. Healing does not mean what happened didn't happen. It doesn't mean we're just going to forgive and forget and you go skipping down the road. What it means is as for you and your house and that sweet little 2 year old that you see every morning, I'm going to live my life in a way and it's going to come with scars, it's going to come with late nights, it's going to come with pain. And I am going to the, the family tree changes with me.

[Caller]

Right. That's what I want. I want to change the family tree. And my mom, she always taught us growing up, she would say this, this is a terrible thing that happened to you guys. This is awful. But you do not get to take this with you out in the world and treat people like it's their fault. This does not become your spouse's problem.

When you grow up.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Like, yeah, but hold on, hold on, hold on, that is, that's somebody hitting you with a two by four and then telling you you're not allowed to cry in public. And your mom may be a sweet woman, but deep down there's also a part of you as a 12 year old girl saying, will some adult in this house please protect us?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so part of your healing journey is going to come with a ton of rage for her too.

[Caller]

That's hard because to me she's a superhero.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I know, I know, I know. But do you hear how this is how trauma works. It disconnects you from yourself, from your memories, from your identity and then it, which tells your body you are not enough. You are not lovable. You must attach yourself to other people immediately or you're going to drown. And when you're 12, that's true. When you're 25 or 35, it's no longer true. And those same attachments will sink you.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I'm not saying hate your mom. I, I, I had a mental health professional tell me like if you don't say F you to your family and I just walked out of the office, I was like, you're an idiot. Okay. But there, until you allow that 12 year old girl that's still trying to protect you, still looking around with her head on a swivel saying, oh my gosh, what kind of electric home do I live in? Until you free that little girl, your body would be failing you in the present if it wasn't still looking for threats everywhere.

[Caller]

Yeah. And I feel like I'm looking for threats everywhere.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And the demon for you is you think you're the threat.

[Caller]

I, I feel like I am. I do, I see, I think it's just so scary because I see traits of my dad and myself.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Tell me about it. Tell me about them.

[Caller]

Well, I loved, I loved him.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Tell me the traits because you're already looping back to protect, which is what kids do when they've been abused. Okay. You can't defend him on this show. I want to talk to you.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller]

The trait specifically is rage. I tried to go to therapy and I went to two sessions and she wanted me to get actually diagnosed and I have not done that. But she said she believes I have a panic disorder that gives me rage episodes. And before I had my son, I kind of coped with it by working out or, and I know this isn't a good thing or taking like a THC gummy and it would just chill me out. But you know, when I Feel rage. I'm. I'm with a toddler all day and I just kind of shut down and I'm like, why do I, why do I feel this way? And it's like if, if the slightest little thing in a plan changes specifically on my husband's part, I just get so mad inside. And I, I see that it's not reasonable and I still feel that way.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Jane, your body is working perfectly. Perfectly. It has run this script before. And by the way, never beat yourself up for a THC gummy. They may have saved your life. It's not a good long term strategy, but you did what you needed to do to survive. But I want you to look for trauma informed counselor in your area.

[Caller]

Okay?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. And on the first session, I want you to tell them, I've got gaps in my memory. I come from in a very abusive household and my father died by suicide right in front of all of us in a public spectacle. And my mom said we weren't allowed to tell anybody or show anything because it was going to be unfair to other people. And then the next thing I want you to say is, I'm here because I want to learn to be comfortable and at peace in my own skin because this stops with me.

[Caller]

Exactly.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And if a therapist is like, well, let's go through, you're feel free to say, hey, this isn't a good fit for me.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Can I tell you this? I did not go through nearly the chaos that you've been through. I wouldn't even, I wouldn't even imagine to know what that was like. But I'll tell you, I've done a lot of trauma healing and I don't have a diagnosis. My therapist didn't start there.

[Caller]

I love that. I don't want to be put under a microscope in that way.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. And feel free to say that out loud. And if you're using insurance, they may say, we got to put something down here so that they can get paid. Which is fair. That's the, that's the world they're stuck in. And if you're able to pay with cash, then you can say, I'm going to pay with cash and I don't want a diagnostic written down. And they'll go, great.

[Caller]

Okay, okay, I will look into it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But that's going to be the place you start. There will be time when you're going to go back through some of this nonsense, but more importantly, you're going to get some real life tools for when I get angry. I'm going to exhale My anger is not wrong. My husband's still great, even though he keeps leaving those little stupid hairs in the sink when he shaves. And my babies, too. They're supposed to cry all night. They're supposed to have diarrhea on my dress as we're walking out the door. Like, there are two. And I'm going to feel that anger. And then you're going to learn some really important skills. And here's my promise to you. Okay? My promise is if you'll plug into the skill set the practice of learning new things over time, you will change your body's default setting, where it will go from rage and lashing out to grace to annoyance. Okay.

[Caller]

I hope. I hope I can get there.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Look at. Listen to me. I can say, look at me, but you can't because we're on the phone. Listen to me. I want you to change your language starting today. I will get there. I'm going to get there, and it's going to be like a roller coaster. It's going to be ups and downs. And if you're keeping a scorecard on yourself, you're always going to see the negative things. Why? Because your whole life, the people who are supposed to love you only looked at the negative things.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You are going to have to outsource some of that to your husband, to a counselor, to a couple of girlfriends in your local area that are just good friends that will have coffee with you. You're going to have to practice safe relationships. Listen, the gates of hell are in front of you. This is not going to be easy, but I'm telling you, on the other side of this, it will be worth it.

[Caller]

I believe you. And I. I can barely see what it's going to look like on the other side, but I'm excited.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Awesome. Here's the last thing I'll tell you. When I put my head down on my pillow last night, guess how long it took me to fall asleep? Less than a minute.

[Caller]

Really?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And that's what I'm telling you. I promise you, healing is on the other side of this.

[Caller]

Wow.

Yeah. It takes me like, an hour and a half.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I know. I know. Because closing your eyes isn't safe. The people who love you aren't safe. And that your body working exactly as it was raised to act.

[Caller]

Wow. Thank you.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Cool.

[Caller]

Cool.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You absolutely lifted my spirits today. I love, love, love talking to brave, powerful people who are standing at the threshold of what's going to be a really tough journey. Whether it's dealing with trauma, whether it's losing weight, whether it's dealing with whatever's in front of you and saying, I am worth being well, I'm worth the hell it's going to cost for peace for me and for everybody who comes after me. Jane, you call me anytime. It's been a high honor to get to talk to you. And I'm super, super grateful for your vulnerability. You're awesome. When we come back, a woman asks how to tell her daughter that she doesn't know who her father is. If you're looking around at the culture and you're having a hard time knowing who to look up to, I get it. There's so much noise coming from so many different directions, and it can be hard to know who, who to trust. It can be hard to know who to follow. But there are examples of people who can teach us. And these folks have been inspiring us with their wisdom and their faith for centuries. These aren't influencers. These are real people from history. And that's why I'm excited to tell you about one of Hallow's biggest prayer challenges. And it's back this month. It's called Saints in Seven Days. The saints we honor aren't just stained glass paintings on church windows. They were real living people devoted to God no matter the cost. During this challenge, you're going to learn how we can apply their faithfulness to our lives today. Saints in 7 Days also features Gwen Stefani teaching about Queen Esther, Michael Iskander from Amazon's hit series House of David, talking about King David, and so many more. The saints aren't just stories from the past. They're real life examples for living with purpose, humility, and genuine faith, especially during this time when it feels like the world has lost its mind. Join the Saints in Seven Days prayer challenge on Hallow today and you're going to get three months of Hallow for free at hallow.com DeLoney that's Hallow. H-A-L-L-O-W.com DeLoney all right, we are back. Take two seconds and hit the subscribe button. Hit that subscribe button. It makes such a difference whether you're listening to us on podcast, watching us on the YouTubes, wherever you happen to be, or if you're just watching this clip on Instagram or wherever, hit the like and subscribe button. It just lifts everything in the show, doesn't cost any money. And you're going to help out so many people around you. Let's go out to Taylor in Springfield, Massachusetts. Massachusetts. Taylor, Springfield, up north up there. Ish by Boston. All right, what's up, Taylor?

[Caller]

Well, my question is, how do I have the conversation with my teen daughter, she's 15, about the fact that I have no idea who her father is?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, boy. Tell me about it.

[Caller]

Long story short, I am a child of trauma. Both my parents were drug addicts majority of my beginning life until about age 30. As such, I, you know, found validation and comfort in intimacy with lots of people. And I wasn't necessarily caring so much about safety or anything like that. And, yeah, so I. So that's kind of how I was living my life. And I found out I was pregnant very traumatically as well. I was sick for a long time and couldn't figure out what I was sick from and went to my doctor and he sent me to get a CT scan and. And guess what they found on the fever. And it was very traumatic. The doctor comes rushing in like, hey, you don't have cancer, but you are well past your first trimester. And I started freaking out and everything, and then went to an actual doctor to get everything checked out. And it turns out she was already six months pregnant. I mean, I was six months pregnant. She was already six months along.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You got a CT scan before they give you a pregnancy test?

[Caller]

They. You know, my primary, I. I was continuing to have my periods. It just really wasn't even something that was even on my radar. And my doctor just never. I did. And so, you know, I went back to him first and thought he thought it was food poisoning, then he thought it was gas acid reflux.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I think they've given me pregnancy tests at the ER before. I thought they just gave you every person who walks a pregnancy test, but maybe just not in your world. All right, so do you have. Does your 15 year old know, quote, unquote, a dad? Is there a man in her life that she calls dad, or have you been raising her as a single mom?

[Caller]

I've been raising her as a single mom. She does have a male role model. I do have a son who now is 28. So she has had a positive male figure in her life, but not a dad. And they do not have any type of dad relationship at all.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, Tell me about your fear or what you're nervous about, or tell me why you're calling.

[Caller]

I'm calling because I just don't even know what to say. I mean, first of all, I have so much shame.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller]

So much shame.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Can I. Can I interrupt you right here?

[Caller]

Sure.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That ends today. And let me tell you why I'm hearing a girl, not a woman right now. I'm hearing a girl who survived. And if you could go back and talk to 12, 13, 14, 17, 19 year old you, you would grab that girl and hug her so tight and say I got you and there was nobody there for you. So I'm going to say this politely, but not very politely. How dare you judge teenage you. That girl survived and she survived in unhealthy ways.

[Caller]

Fair.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But that shame, man, you made it. If I've got, if I've got shame on anybody, it's mom and dad who by the way had their own demons. Right?

[Caller]

Right. I mean I've forgiven them, I've done.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No, no, but you haven't forgiven you.

[Caller]

That's really hard because I was an adult and, and I knew what I was doing and I just, you know, it was about survived self medicating basically, you know.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes. And what, what, what, what picture did you have in front of you? Drugs in terms of alcohol abuse. That's the roadmap you were handed for what to do when life feels really heavy and you feel disconnected from the people who are supposed to love you and give you connection the most. So yes, you're an adult. Yes. You got to be responsible for your actions. And by the way, you have been, you raised an amazing 15 year old girl, right? Yeah, you've been responsible. But I'm not going to beat up a 24 year old or a 22 year old for listening to her screaming body saying I need somebody to connect with and doing it in unhealthy ways because I didn't have unhealthy patterns. I didn't have any healthy patterns in front of me because listen, if I'm you, I'm going to sit down with my 15 year old daughter and say I've got to tell you about my life. And this is going to be hard to hear, but it brings me to this moment. And your daughter's 15, she knows a lot and she feels a lot. Right. I have a 15 year old. They're way smarter than I was at 15.

[Caller]

I just, I, I hear what you're saying, but it's hard to feel it because she's just so, she's just so young. Like she's not even like I feel when I was 15, you know, I was so much further ahead in life than she was.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You had to be, you had no adults.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You had to be. You didn't know where your food was going to come from. You didn't know what other Strange guy was going to come walking through your house. You grew up way too fast and that's not something to be ashamed of. I'm, I, I'm, I'm telling you right now, I, I don't lie on this show. I'll be the first to say I screwed up. I'll be the first to say I don't know. I am hearing an incredibly brave and strong woman who had a whole bunch of other options other than I'm going to raise this young girl as my own. And you have scratched and clawed and now you have what sounds like an amazing 15 year old kid. Is that fair?

[Caller]

That's fair. She's pretty amazing.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Are you worried about her being sexually active?

[Caller]

No, definitely not.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You're worried the opposite. You're like, you need to hold hands with somebody.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah. Kind of the opposite. You know, she's, she's 15 and she's into anime and yu Gi. Oh. And you know, that type of stuff. She definitely.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So she's crazy just in a different. I'm just kidding. I'm kidding.

[Caller]

Yeah, but, but has she asked you about her dad? Like, explain what the past is like, which is going to be hard because this is her grandma. I mean, she's been, you know, clean and sober like almost 15 years now.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Taylor, Taylor, Taylor, stop. Stop protecting her. There was nobody to protect you. When you're surviving, it's not your job to whitewash. Be proud of your mom and be proud of her sobriety and be proud of the grandmother that she is. But you can't have that pride come at the expense of you continually beating yourself up. Because in a strange way, this is how trauma gets passed on. Because your daughter's going to know. There's a part of my mom that I don't know and it must be my fault. And your daughter's going to try to solve it.

[Caller]

See, that's what I keep thinking. I keep thinking because she's, I want to say twice in her lifetime she's asked kind of a question. One time she asked, do I have a dad? And I. Basically anytime she's asked a question, I've just side side stepped it.

All right?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And here's what she gets from that. She gets that mom doesn't think I can handle it. Mom's keeping secrets from me, so there must be something wrong with me. And by the way, when she's seven, that's two. That's a lot to handle. 15. You better believe it. It's, it's, it's past time.

[Caller]

I'VE been kicking the can down the road.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's right.

[Caller]

Because I just don't have. I don't have any answers to give her.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes, you do. Yes, you do. You have the most important answer, which is. I don't know the truth. You have the truth. I don't know who he is. I made some choices that I'm not proud of in an effort to survive. And I have scratched and clawed to give you a life that I didn't have. And I think I'm doing a pretty good job. But here's the truth. I don't know who your dad is. I was with multiple people during that time. Not proud of it. If I could go back and change it, I would. But I wouldn't have you and I wouldn't change that. And I'll answer any question you got. But there's an opportunity that y' all walk away from this where your daughter's both curious about who her dad is. And by the way, she's going to go, she's going to get 23andMe. She's going to go down every avenue, try to figure out who he is, and she's going to have a sense that my mom is a thousand times stronger than I, I knew her to be. Which makes you way safer of a parent for her.

[Caller]

I just don't want her to look at me differently, you know?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I know. But honestly, that's you judging you, not her. And I would ask you, don't put your judgment of yourself onto your 15 year old little girl because right now she's judging herself, wondering what is so bad about me that mom won't even tell me who dad is. You get what I'm saying?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

This is how. It just repeats itself. And it repeats itself.

[Caller]

Oh, God, the conversation is going to be so hard.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. And here's how I would recommend. I'd recommend you even write it out. Write it down and tell your daughter you want to read her a story and be honest and say, I've tried to shield you and protect you from this story because I'm scared about how you're going to judge me. I don't want you to think evil and bad about grandma, about granddad, But I also think in an effort to protect you and shield you from all of this, I've also made you feel a little bit crazy because 15 year olds are real, real, real perceptive. They have to be. That's how they survive. And maybe you say, I'm going to read this out loud and then I want us to go for a walk. And while we're going for a walk, I want you to think of all the questions you have and then we're going to circle back and we're going to talk about it. By the way, this won't be a one and done thing. This will be an open. This will be you cracking open the door or blowing the door wide open. One of the two. And then letting her know, I will answer any question you ever come to me with. I won't. Not graphically. Right. I'm not going to go into graphic detail, but I'll answer any question you got. And here's how she's going to look at you. Sure, she may be. She's 15 for God's sakes. Right. There's a reason we don't let 15 year olds buy beer. Who knows how they're going to react? But ultimately, the meta lesson here, over time will be, my mom has seen everything, so there's nothing I'm going to run into in the world that she hasn't been through herself. My mother always tells me the truth. And so when you say I'm worried about how she's going to look at me, I want you to consider she might look at you as the single safest person she's ever known.

[Caller]

God, that sounds so hard to live up to.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I know, I know, God, I know. But the shame ends with this call. Not beating up surviving me anymore.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, I have to forgive myself, but it's really hard to do that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

None of this will be easy. All of this will happen in time. You have a choice as to whether you participate in what happens next or not. But I've dealt with a lot of 18 year olds who walked out of mom and dad's house and never went back because it wasn't a safe place to go. It wasn't a trustworthy place to go. And I don't want that to be your story too. Thank you so much for the call, sister. Go do the next right thing. And it's going to be tough. Go do it anyway. We come back, there's a man struggling with the stresses of medical school. Be right back. I love, love, love poncho shirts. I'm wearing one right now. And as the mornings are starting to get cooler, I get to pull out my favorite poncho shirts. The comfortable performance denims and their amazing soft flannels. Poncho's performance denim has that soft broken in feel like you've worn it a thousand times, but it still looks sharp. I wear them to dress up events, and I wear them on stages all across the country. It's got a touch of stretch, so it moves with you, not against you. And the poncho flannels, you can get them in original or western styles, and they are guaranteed to be the softest shirts you have ever owned. They're medium weight, yet somehow they're both durable and comfortable. I don't know how these wizards do it, but poncho shirts are amazing. These flannels keep me warm without overheating, and they're perfect for layering. Poncho shirts are built for real life. They wick away sweat, they dry fast, and they hold up to whatever your day throws at you. They come in slim or regular fit so you can look nice wherever you happen to find yourself this fall. Look sharp and stay warm in poncho denims and flannels. Head to ponchooutdoors.com deloney and get 10 bucks off your first order. When you sign up with your email, check out a few of my favorites, like the Laramie and the Matamoros and more. That's poncho outdoors.com DeLoney all right, let's go out to welcome to Miami and talk to Matt. What's up, Matt?

[Caller]

Hey, Dr. John. How you doing? It's so cool to talk to you.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm good, man. How are you?

[Caller]

I'm. I'm good. A little nervous, but I really appreciate you having me. Thank you.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Absolutely, man. What's up?

[Caller]

So I'm in my second year of medical school, and it's. It's probably not. It's not the most stressful time of my life ever, but it's getting up there.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's pretty close, man.

[Caller]

Yeah, it's. It's. It's really. It's brutal. I mean, I love it, but it's just very stressful. And I don't. It's more of a consistent stress and like, more consistent in my life than I've ever had before. Like, Like, I mean, over, like, a long period of time. Like, it's been going on for over a year now, and I'm finding myself just falling into, like, these horrible habits that I've had for a long time, but they're. They're really manifesting now because of such, like, because it's been so chronic. And I'm just wondering how I can break the cycle of. Of this. Of these habits and develop better coping strategies, I guess, for dealing with the stress.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's a great question, dude. Tell me about the stresses. You're feeling. Where are they coming from and what are they?

[Caller]

Well, of course, classes. I mean, you know, you got to do. Got hundreds of lectures for like, you know, one exam and it's just. I'm worried I'm not gonna get it done in time or do well or pass or.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Have you ever not got it done ever?

[Caller]

I mean, yeah, I've. I've failed before, but. But I've made it here, you know.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You're still in med school, so. Whose voice is that?

[Caller]

Yeah, I don't know. It's just. It's just me.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Is it daddy's voice?

[Caller]

No. I mean, I don't think so. I've been asked that question many times in my interviews and stuff because he's in the medical field as well. And you know, people think that I just went into this field because of him. And I mean, of course he was an influence, but really, I do really want to do this, but it's. Yeah, I'm not really sure who it is. I guess it's myself hating myself.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

I guess because of the habits, because of what I'm doing, You know, they're.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What are these habits that, that are worth hating yourself over?

[Caller]

Well, the one that bothers me the most is pornography use. It makes me feel disgusted with myself and.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller]

And I just can't get over that. Another major one is I rip my hair out when I'm like. Sometimes I don't even know that I'm doing it while I'm studying.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And, and what's the clinical name for that?

[Caller]

Trickle, trickle something mania. Trichomania. I forget.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm not even going to give it to you. I want you to go look it up.

[Caller]

Yeah, I'll do my research.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So you've got two coping behaviors that you don't like. One is considered some form of self harm. The other is a. Is a fake sense of connection or a fake sense of aliveness, if you will. And so my deeper question is, why does my friend Matt, a second year med student, why does he not like being in his own skin? Why are you. Why are you trying to escape from Matt?

[Caller]

I don't know. It's. I've. I've always been a procrastinator. I mean, I always just. I just see anything that stresses me. It's not just med school. I mean, any, any stress.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I know. That's actually what I'm getting at. I know, I know. This, this is not medical school. Is the gas that's getting poured on an already existing fire?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so I'm trying to get to the root of the fire. Who lit that fire?

[Caller]

I. I don't know. I'm not sure.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller]

It's. It's been. I guess it's been like that for. For a long time.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Have you sat down and talked to your dad about it?

[Caller]

About my. My stresses.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

About your pulling out your hair when you get stressed without even realizing it. With. About your pornography use, about your. Your feeling like you don't want to be in your own skin.

[Caller]

I didn't talk to really anybody about it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller]

And, yeah, that's probably part of the problem.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I would say that's the chief problem, because here's why. Secrets will kill you. Literally.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Think of. Think of all of these extrinsic behaviors, these actions that you're doing. Think of those as teeny, tiny release valves on a steam. On a steam engine. The pressure builds up so much, and if there's not a place for where it is regularly released, it will explode.

[Caller]

Yeah. Yeah. I should probably talk to somebody about it, I guess. Yeah. I don't even talk to my friends about it or anything.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I know. And can I tell you, I spent my whole career sitting with guys just like you, and it's rare that I am as concerned about somebody as I am of you. Because you're getting close to the edge, aren't you?

[Caller]

I mean, I'm. I'm hanging in there. There's been times.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's not what I asked. You're getting close, aren't you?

[Caller]

I mean, no. I don't know. I don't know. I'm okay right now, but I'm just worried that. I know it's gonna. This is only the second year, you know, it's gonna get more stressful than this. And, you know, I don't want it. Like, it's hard to see how it could be tougher than this. And I can't imagine that. And I just want to fix this now before things get worse.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So let me reframe your statement. Okay. I don't think you're broken.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I think you're not well, but I don't think you're broken.

[Caller]

I don't think so either, but.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. You have some strange cocktail of shame and silence and performance and duty wound so deeply inside your chest that it is desperately trying to get out.

[Caller]

Yeah. That's for sure.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I'm going to tell you right now, it will make its way out. And always the best way is sitting down and you controlling the release.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

There's a there in here, in Nashville. There's a big lake called Percy Priest. It's a man made lake. And at regular intervals they sound these huge alarms. And then they raise the dam and they release a whole bunch of water. They do it under control at regular intervals and they let everybody know it's coming. If they didn't do that, there would come a point when the dam breaks and it blows up. The dam blows up the lake and everybody downstream suffers the consequences.

[Caller]

Yeah, that's definitely true. Because you know, when I. If I start ripping my hair out or watching pornography again, then I start getting mad at myself and it makes me mad at everyone around me.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's right.

[Caller]

Anybody I'm around and I don't even know why I'm mad at them.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But then, then they withdraw and then you white knuckle it and then it comes back stronger and you do it again.

[Caller]

Yeah, right? Yeah. Especially when there's about to be an exam or something and you know, I have to be alone to study. And it's just. It's just like a never ending cycle.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's right. So here's an amazing situation you find yourself in at your medical school. I promise you, and I know this because I've sat with these folks, There are professionals who are trained for just this moment. And I promise you, there are other students sitting by you in class that you don't even know who are going through the exact same thing.

[Caller]

Sure. Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so. And with your insane tuition that you pay, you also pay for counseling and medical resources.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You also have a dad who's in the medical profession. What's your dad do? What's his specialty?

[Caller]

He's an obstetrician.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. Is he a safe, trustworthy guy?

[Caller]

Oh, yeah, yeah, he's great.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How does he handle his emotions? Is he open about him?

[Caller]

No.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller]

Never doesn't talk about them.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller]

So I don't know.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So you don't know. So what I want you to hear, what you just said, is you've created an image that my dad is great and that he handles all this stuff with grace and that he's just the perfect picture, but it's kind of like he's a living Instagram reel of one of those fitness influencers that just takes their shirt off and they got all these abs and like, follow my seven step plan for abs.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You actually don't know how he's doing at all.

[Caller]

I know, I guess I. I really don't.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so if he's a safe person, it'd be a pretty awesome thing. If you could say, dad, I want to take you out to breakfast, I'm not doing okay. But if you lead with, I'm in my second year and it's just getting really hard, he's going to give you the same speech that all physicians give, which is. Yep, That's a tough one, man. You just gotta. You gotta buckle down. They're gonna. That's what he's gonna tell you.

[Caller]

Right? That's literally what they all say.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Of course, if you say, dad, obviously I'm struggling second year medical school. I know. But I found that I hate myself and I'm pulling out clumps of hair. I'm struggling with pornography. I'm not okay. And you're the safest guy I know to talk to. If you do that level of vulnerability with him, there's two things that can happen. He can have a tear come out of his eye and reach across that table and grab your hand and say, brother, I've been there. Or he can say, well, you just. You're gonna have to suck it up. And if he does that, that means he's not ready, not you.

[Caller]

Yeah, I don't think he would do that the first one.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So give him the chance.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I've got a whole bunch of graduate school and tons and tons of experience, man. If. If for nothing else, I can help my wife and my kids and my close friends and family have a little bit better lives. That's way more important to me than strangers.

[Caller]

Okay. Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Do I. Do I have your promise you'll do that before this week is over?

[Caller]

Yes. Talk to him.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yep. Are you all in the same community?

[Caller]

I can. I was gonna see him this weekend, so. Yeah. Though.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. Give him a heads up and say, dad, I need to talk to you privately for a couple of hours this weekend. Can I take you to coffee or to breakfast?

[Caller]

Okay.

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And here's the second thing. Before today is over, I want you to have made an appointment with your counseling center at your university. Okay. Make me two promises. Will you make me two promises?

[Caller]

I can do that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'll tell the entire truth.

[Caller]

Yeah. Always to.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

To a therapist. And number two, I will continue to understand. I'm not broken. There's not something wrong with me. I'm just struggling right now.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller]

I can do that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I feel like you're going back to solve it, Matt. On me.

[Caller]

Say that again.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I feel like you're going back to. All right. I'm just going to solve it. I'm going to put it in my list. And I'm going to put it my day planner, and I'm just going to crush it and drag it and go. I don't want you to do that. I want you to actually, actually feel this one.

[Caller]

No, I. I definitely feel it. I just. Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

This is. This is you, Matt. This is you surrendering. What I'm doing is not working. And I want to be a physician. I'm not doing this just because my dad did. I want to do this. And I've got to learn some new skills. That's cool.

[Caller]

Yeah. That's another thing, too. I can't. I just. I. How can I be a physician if I'm feeling this way? You know, I can't help other people if I'm being. If I'm like this.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Well, number one, I promise myself I wouldn't have a job if physicians and attorneys and other folks didn't get all the way through without dealing with their own stuff. That's how I got started in this world, okay? And. And I don't want that life for you. The practice of medicine is crazy enough with all the regulations and boards and insurance. It's hard enough just to love and care for a patient. But that starts with you saying, I'm worth being loved myself. Okay? So hear me say, brother, I'm worried about you. And I want you to make that call today to your counseling center. Get on the books. Hopefully they'll get you in by next week. It's early enough in the semester that maybe they can get you in this week before the weekend's over. And then I want you to let your dad know. Hey, I want to talk for a couple hours in a private conversation that we've never had before. And it's probably going to be good for you because it's going to feel nervous and embarrassing and big. Write it all down and tell your dad I got to read this to you, because that's the best way I could. Just be completely honest with you and make sure you tell them. I don't need a Year two lecture on. Just suck it up. I'm not, okay? I'm starting to hate myself. And I got into this to help other people have better lives and feel good. And I. I decided I'm worth that, too. Can you help me, dad? And remember this. If he doesn't respond in a helpful or healing way, that's because he's got stuff. It's not because there's something wrong with you. You'll walk away knowing, okay, he's not. He's not Gonna be my person. I'm gonna double down on my school resources and I'm gonna go from there. I'm really honored that you called me, Matt. And I can't tell you, I can't count the number of young med students and law students and nursing students and theology students. Folks whose whole lives are dedicated to helping other people who are in the. Have been in the exact same boat you're in. You're not alone, my brother. You got. You got work to do. You got to learn some new strategies. Pornography's. It's a terrible mistress. Pulling your hair out is a. Is a. Is a. Is not a healthy coping strategy. But I promise you can get there. It's gonna take some work, but you can get there. In a couple years. I want you to send me your graduation announcement because I think you're going to do a great, great job. Few physicians will be as compassionate as you are when somebody who's hurting walks in the front door. We'll be right back. Everybody hears about supplements. Supplements at the grocery store, supplements on the Internet. We all hear about how important supplements are. And most of what you see on the shelves at your local store is garbage. Most of the stuff you swipe up to look at on Instagram, garbage. It's a lot of fancy labels with cool names and zero substance. I'm not playing that game. And I've never played that game. And neither is Thorne. I've been taking Thorn supplements for more than a decade. They're pure, they're clean. And I trust Thorn supplements enough to give them to my family. Yes, that includes my kids. Whether you're a serious athlete, a mom on the go, or a dad trying to show up for his family after a long, long day of work, you deserve the best, and that is Thorne. 35% of Thorne's employees work in quality control. They reject 15% of their raw materials because good enough is not good enough for Thorne. It's why professional athletes, olympic teams, and 60,000 plus doctors trust Thorne. And that's why I trust them to stop guessing and crossing your fingers about what's going into your body. Take what it needs and nothing it doesn't. Go to thorne.com the letter U. Deloney to get 25% off your entire order when you create an account that's T H O r n e thorne.com the letter U. DeLoney to get the supplements that your body was meant to have. All right, Kelly, Something great happened. What happened? So this caller asked to remain anonymous. So we are going to call her Sarah and she writes. I started listening to Dr. DeLoney's podcast in late 2022. I binged the podcast until I was completely caught up and still listen to every episode as soon as it drops. When I started listening, I started to understand how scary and dangerous scary and dangerous my relationship was. The part of the ups and downs of our relationships should not include cheating, abuse and loneliness. Oh man. I started to really see my 19 year marriage for what it was, not what it could be. I started taking the next right step. I almost did not make it out, but I did. I'm a year post divorce and living a life I never knew I could have. I know divorce is not something to typically celebrate, however in my case it might have saved my life. Thank you for understanding. Thank you for helping me understand that the next right step might be hard but worth it. Amen. Amen. Amen. I'm proud of you, Sarah, and for everybody out there. This was a difficult show. For everybody out there who's looking in the mirror saying, I can't keep doing life like I'm doing right now and the pain of change is going to be tremendous. Remember Sarah's words, you can't even imagine the peace on the other side and it is hard, hard. And it's worth every step. Love you guys. It's an honor to walk with you. See you soon.