I Married the Man I Had an Affair With

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Dr. John Delony Show

Episode Title: I Married the Man I Had an Affair With
Host: Dr. John Delony (Ramsey Network)
Date: February 25, 2026

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Episode Overview

This caller-driven episode of The Dr. John Delony Show dives into deep, practical conversations on personal challenges—centering on relationships, guilt, shame, family finance anxiety, and finding personal fulfillment after years of sacrifice. Dr. Delony offers compassionate, real-world guidance as multiple callers bravely share their stories, seeking help to heal from past mistakes and navigate emotional uncertainties.

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Major Segments & Themes

1. Making Peace with Past Mistakes and Moving Forward in Relationships

(Start–20:50)

• Caller: Ashley from Birmingham, Alabama
• Situation Recap: At 24, Ashley had an affair while married, then divorced her husband, and ultimately married the man she had the affair with. Four years later, as a Christian, she remains burdened by guilt, shame, and the hurt caused to others.
• Core Concern: "How do I make peace with a mistake I made in the past?" [01:25]

Key Discussion Points

• Emotional Safety & Communication:

  • Ashley describes her first husband as a "good guy" but not emotionally present. She admits to not being entirely honest or open about her feelings during their relationship.
  • Dr. Delony distinguishes physical safety from emotional safety, emphasizing the importance of radical honesty with oneself and one's partner.

• Handling Shame and Ownership:

  • Dr. Delony encourages Ashley to practice radical ownership—"Extreme ownership here. And it is, 'I chose to have an emotional affair. I chose for years not to tell him the truth about what I felt...'" 09:49
  • He explains: "Often, the things we do to try to fix the things we've done instead of just laying them out in the open... just get worse and worse." [07:14]

• Dealing with Advice and Secrecy:

  • Ashley was advised by both her father and ex-mother-in-law not to disclose the affair, hoping to "spare feelings"—a route Dr. Delony labels "madness" and unhealthy for all involved. [06:32]

• Forgiving the Past Self:

  • Dr. Delony suggests a practical exercise: write a letter to her 24-year-old self, both acknowledging guilt and extending compassion—a conscious act of releasing shame.
    • "Forgiveness is not letting her off the hook. You're living in the consequences of it. But it is simply saying, for 28-year-old you, I'm not carrying this around anymore." [11:28]

• Compassion and Empathy Emergence:

  • Ashley's journey equips her with greater empathy; Dr. Delony notes this experience will help her respond with compassion instead of judgment to others facing similar failures.
    • "When you hear somebody at your local church who the rumor has had an affair, your heart doesn’t immediately go to, 'I can't believe it'—it goes to, 'Oh God, I’m gonna take her to coffee.'" [12:40]

• Acceptance of Life’s Unsolvable Math:

  • Ashley struggles with having a child with her new husband—products of a mistake, yet sources of present joy.
    • Dr. Delony advises: "That’s a math problem that can’t be solved... it doesn’t... All it does is drain away any extra margin and energy for loving, well, the people in your life today." [15:34]

• Practical Coping Tool:

  • When haunted by shame, pull out a family photo with her current husband and child, to remind herself:
    • "I’m new now. I’ve rebuilt myself into somebody I respect with a thousand little actions every day." [16:23]

Notable Quotes

• "I hear somebody who became somebody she didn’t respect… it wasn’t like you cheated once. It was cheated on top of dishonesty, on top of telling everybody else but that one hurting guy... It seemed like a whole bunch of stuff all on top of itself." — Dr. John Delony [08:06]
• "At some point, you've got to let 24-year-old you go. All that pain you caused—radical. Oh, I own it all. … All of that is true and it all has a period at the end of it. What are you going to write next?" — Dr. John Delony [16:52]

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2. Obsessing Over Family Finances: Breaking the Loop

(20:50–41:42)

• Caller: Thomas, 21, from Johnson City, Tennessee
• Situation Recap: Despite being financially stable with his young wife (no debt, building savings), Thomas finds himself "obsessing"—constantly checking accounts, monitoring investments, and feeling anxious about financial security.

Key Discussion Points

• Roots of Financial Anxiety:

  • Thomas grew up in a large family (10 kids), moving from church to church and living on donations—instilling deep insecurity.
  • "You have a lived experience of seeing a father turn around and see 11 mouths plus his...and...thinking, I don’t know where we’re gonna sleep tonight." — Dr. John Delony [25:14]

• Information Overload & Comparison:

  • Working in finance exposes Thomas to constant headlines and financial advice, amplifying his anxiety.
  • Dr. Delony warns of the dangers of "doom scrolling" and feeding insecurities with relentless information.
    • "I would be extra crazy if I got any financial advice from TikTok." [32:40]

• Taking Control: Principles vs. Emotions:

  • Establish core financial principles (e.g., not touching a 401k, focusing on ratios, not on emotions).
  • Limit inputs: after making well-grounded decisions, stop chasing “better” plans or comparing outcomes.

• Practical Tactics:

  • "Take one quick deep inhale and deep exhale and say out loud... 'Dude, thank you for taking care of me. I’m good.'" [34:47]
  • Use tools (calculators) for actual decisions, not for shaming yourself about missed opportunities.

• Filling Newfound Time Productively:

  • Use idle time previously spent obsessing positively—exercise, invest in relationships, or plan for actual career goals.

Notable Quotes

• "Your body has kept the score and it's often fighting wars that we don't even know we're fighting." — Dr. John Delony [31:49]
• "I look at my 401k balance once a year... because I'm never going to sell my 401k... looking doesn't do any good for it, will do nothing for me except give me false security." — Dr. John Delony [30:14]

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3. Rekindling Personal Passions Post-Parenthood (Dad Guilt)

(41:42–53:48)

• Caller: Bill from Philadelphia
• Situation Recap: After years devoted exclusively to work and family, Bill finds space for hobbies (e.g., snowboarding/trips with friends) but is plagued with "dad guilt" about leaving his family—even temporarily.

Key Discussion Points

• Understanding “Dad Guilt”:

  • Dr. Delony explains, with reference to Dr. Becky Kennedy, that what parents feel is rarely guilt (violating a value), but rather emotional discomfort at leaving family, or absorbing their sadness.
    • "Guilt is a feeling... when you violate one of your core values." [43:40]

• Modeling a Balanced Life:

  • It’s not a violation of being a good parent to have passions or friends outside the home.
    • "It’s important for kids to see their dad with friends... and fails at. That’s important also." [46:44]

• Practical Steps:

  • Assigns Bill homework: schedule at least one activity a week away from home, plus one larger trip per quarter.
  • Encourages presence—when with family, be present; when away, enjoy fully without ruminating on their feelings.

• Reframing Family Dynamics:

  • The greatest gift is not 24/7 access, but being a "whole" person; letting kids feel sadness at his absence (and joy at his return) is itself healthy.
  • Include kids in stories and experiences of hobbies when possible.

Notable Quotes

• "You're taking their sadness, by the way. That's good sadness. They love their dad. They like him around. But it could also be codependence... And that's not healthy." — Dr. John Delony [52:16]
• "Don't carry your kids' frustrations or annoyances or tears and shove them in your chest and call that guilt. That's not what that is. That's just kids loving their dad being kids." — Dr. John Delony [53:48]

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Memorable Moments

• Dr. Delony’s exercise for moving out of shame: "Write a letter to your younger self, forgive her, and decide to not carry that cinderblock anymore." [11:28]
• Observations on inherited family narratives: "The stories we’re told as children become the stories we tell ourselves as adults—except now we believe them, because they’re in our own voice." [29:41]
• Lightness injected into the finance segment: "If you have lived experience on a topic and your body gets really powerful and strong emotions around it, getting a coach, getting a friend, getting somebody to see something you don’t see is really important..." [38:16]
• Practical, humorous advice: “Exercise, sex with your wife—not with strangers...” [38:18]

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Closing Guidance

Each call wraps with actionable challenges—whether it’s caring for past versions of yourself, constructing intentional financial boundaries, or putting your growth and autonomy on the calendar. Dr. Delony’s refrain is consistent: radical ownership, humility, compassion, and building a foundation for life defined by integrity and connection—starting with micro-habits and self-care.

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For anyone navigating shame, anxiety, or transitions in parenthood, this episode is an honest, non-judgmental roadmap toward self-forgiveness, resilient relationships, and balanced, meaningful living.

Transcript

[Ashley]

I had an affair while I was married to my first husband. I had also asked my ex mother in law to meet me for dinner. I confessed to her and tried to get advice on how to tell him.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

She thought it would be better for her son's quote unquote feelings to have his wife up and leave him and divorce him and not know why. Hey, what's going on? This is John with the Dr. John DeLoney Show. Welcome back. If you're new to the show, I'm glad that you're here. If you are one of the OG17, you listen to every episode. You're with us since day one. I don't even think I was with us day one, but you've been with us. Thank you for coming back. Thank you for watching the show. Thank you for listening to the show. Thank you for sharing the show. We've started a movement here on owning what we feel, owning what we say and do next, owning our relationships and our mental and emotional health and loving those around as well. And I'm glad that you're here, glad that you're a part of it. Let's go out to Birmingham, Alabama and talk to Ashley. What's up, Ashley?

[Ashley]

Hey, Dr. John, how are you?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm great, how are you?

[Ashley]

I'm okay, could be a little better.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What's up?

[Ashley]

So my question is how do I make peace with a mistake that I made in the past? And I'll try to keep a short backstory. So almost four years ago I was 24 and I had an affair while I was married to my first husband. We were married about a year and a half. The affair had started off emotional for a few months and led up to being physical one night. And a couple days after it had happened, I broke down to my dad about it, but not to my husband at the time. I wasn't honest with him about it at first, but he did have suspicion. And shortly after I ultimately ended the marriage and months go by and I was wanting to be honest about what had happened, but I wasn't sure about telling him since time had passed. And during that time I began confessing to some of the people around me, like my sister and a couple of friends. And I had also asked my ex mother in law to meet me for dinner and I confessed to her and tried to get advice on how to tell him. She and my dad both at the time were telling me that I shouldn't and I had told my dad that I was meeting her to tell her. And that same week my dad had Actually told my older brother, who then told my ex so he had found out about it from him. So fast forward to today. I'm 28 and remarried to the man that the affair happened with, and we now have a son. And I just still struggle with what I did or what we did and the damage that it's caused in multiple different directions. And I'm also Christian and very ashamed and embarrassed of it, and I just need some help with all of that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah, There's a lot to the story, huh?

[Ashley]

Yes, I was trying to.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No. Yeah. Let me. Let me. Let me start in a weird direction. Okay.

[Ashley]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Your first husband, is he a good guy?

[Ashley]

Yes, he was a good guy.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. See, like. And I say this, obviously, I mean physically, but was he a safe guy? Was he someone you could tell stuff to? Someone you could. You felt safe being around someone who could hear you?

[Ashley]

Not a hundred percent. I don't really feel like he was emotionally there. And we kind of just didn't talk about certain things.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But did you not talk about him because you wouldn't share? You wouldn't let yourself be seen and known? Or because he was a gaslighter, he was going to take what you said and rub your nose in it? Or maybe a bit of both. Sometimes when I hear people say this situation is not safe, it's because it literally is not safe physically. I'm going to get hit. If I say something. I'm going to get. My. My. My partner will withdraw from me. I'm going to get screamed at, like. Right. It's literally not safe. Sometimes, though, somebody says it's not safe, and that just is another word for it's uncomfortable or it feels scary to let myself be fully known, to tell the full truth. And so I don't. And I blame them for it.

[Ashley]

Okay. Yeah, I would say he would not physically hurt me. He did have some anger problems, but I think it's more of me not fully wanting to be uncomfortable or honest. Like, when I look back throughout, like, the years that we were dating. I started dating him when I was 18, and I had actually broken up with him a few times before we had gotten married, but we had always gotten back together shortly after. And I feel like I wasn't completely honest. And their reasonings sometimes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Sure. So why did your dad and his mom say he. You shouldn't tell him?

[Ashley]

I feel like. Because they were trying to somehow, I guess. I guess his mom was trying to maybe spare his feelings.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

She thought it would be better for. She thought it'd be better for her son's quote unquote feelings to have his wife up and leave him and divorce him and not know why. Yeah, that's insanity. I mean, you know that now, but like, that's madness. Why would your dad tell you? Don't tell him.

[Ashley]

I. I'm assuming because he thought it would be a big mess, which I already knew that it were going to

[Dr. John DeLoney]

be, but it already was a mess. I mean, your marriage was already over. It already blown up.

[Ashley]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Often the things we do to try to fix the things that we've done instead of just laying them out in the open. Let me put it this way. If you have a deep, deep cut and you don't ever take the time to rinse that thing out and have it exposed and have it cleaned, it will just get infected. And once it gets infected, when you throw a bunch of different bandages on top of it, trying to cover it up and trying to, it just gets worse and worse and worse and worse. Right. But that brings us here. I. I don't hear somebody who is still struggling with a decision, a choice. I hear somebody and tell me if I'm out, out to lunch on this one. Okay. I can be totally wrong. I hear somebody who became somebody she didn't respect, who did not just one thing that was out of alignment with who she wanted to be, or I'll put it this way, did one thing that hurt somebody really badly. But you did a bunch of stuff. And it wasn't like you cheated once. It was cheated on top of dishonesty, on top of telling everybody else but that one hurting guy that you loved and you committed yourself to, and it seemed like a whole bunch of stuff all on top of itself, as opposed to I just did this one thing. Does that ring true? I hear somebody who does not respect herself.

[Ashley]

Yes, that's true.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so fast forward now. What has come up recently that has made this voice louder? Are you finding yourself attracted to somebody else again? Are you missing this guy? Are the same patterns repeating in your new marriage? What's going on?

[Ashley]

No, it's. I feel like it's actually done the opposite. I will never do something like that again. And that's at least what I think in my head. I'm really not sure. I feel like the last few years since it has happened, it's kind of just been an up and down thing of where it still just kind of haunts me. But I'm not really sure recently of like one particular thing of maybe that has came up.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So I think the place to start is full and in many ways radical or to quote my friend Jocko, like extreme ownership here. And it is. I chose to have an emotional affair. I chose for years not to tell him the truth about what I felt, what I wanted, my concerns for our relationship. I then before I even gave him a chance to reconcile with me, before I divorced him, I left him. I then went and told a whole bunch of other people without like you see what I'm saying? All of those statements start with I. And I know there's context and I know you got advice and I know you were 24 and you were scared to death and I know all that stuff. But there's a part of you that knows something in your nervous system and there's a part of you that is trying to, has been trying to take the edge off of that for years with different stories, with blame, with shame, with all that stuff. And so there's something powerful about just shining a light on, a big bright light on all of it. This is what I did. And there should be guilt with that. You hurt somebody, you, you did something that was not in alignment with who you want to be. Is that right?

[Ashley]

All right, okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so guilt is, is right here. I'll even say, hell, it's healthy to be ashamed of what you did. And there's something powerful about forgiving 24 year old you write her a letter and say we you blew it and I'm not carrying that cinder block around with me anymore because all it's doing is weighing down your new marriage, it's weighing down your relationship with your baby, it's weighing you down. When you look at that at yourself in the mirror here at 28 years old and if you're writing that letter, there's probably going to be some things in there. Unless you're just cold hearted. I don't hear that. There's probably going to be some things that you look back on that 24 year old with a little bit of compassion. You didn't know I messed up, I went left and I should have gone right. Like all, all those different, like it's just about taking full ownership and letting 24 year old you just forgive her. Forgiveness is not letting her off the hook. You're living in the consequences of it. But it is Simply saying for 28 year old you, I'm not carrying this around anymore. And my hope is this leads you to not a sense of walking around for the rest of your life with your head held low, but it just lets you walk a little More humbly and a little more compassionately because things happen, everybody messes up. And so when you hear somebody at your local church who the rumor has had an affair, your heart doesn't immediately go to, I can't believe it goes to, oh, God, I'm gonna take her to coffee. Right. Or when the rumor mill starts on somebody at work or somebody in politics, in the news, your immediate thought is one of compassion, one of humility, one of, dude, I have found myself in a place where I never thought I could be, and it makes you one of the most empathetic, caring people around. You get what I'm saying?

[Ashley]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so tell me a couple of great things about you at 28. What kind of wife are you right now?

[Ashley]

I'm an intentional wife.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What does that mean? Be specific.

[Ashley]

Of just doing little things for my husband. Like I make him coffee or I make his lunch every day. And we were pretty good about prioritizing time together.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. What kind of mom are you?

[Ashley]

And to be honest with each other,

[Dr. John DeLoney]

what kind of mom are you? You a good mom?

[Ashley]

I try to be.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No. Give me an example of how you are a great mom.

[Ashley]

I'm home with my son pretty much every day. Okay. So I make sure he's fed, spend time with him, teach him.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. Does he run to his mom with his arms open?

[Ashley]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. So if we're going to tell the whole truth and we're going to. We're going to have radical ownership here, we're also going to own the good stuff, right? And there's that weird. There's that weird paradox where if you had never done what you did at 24, if you had never blown up your ex husband's life and your life, this little baby wouldn't be here. That's a weird thing to try to do the math on, right?

[Ashley]

Yeah, that's something I've struggled with.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. Struggling. Let me put it this way. That's a math problem that can't be solved. And so trying to loop on that math problem over and over and over and over again, it doesn't. There's not an answer to it. All it does is drain away any extra margin and energy for loving, well, the people in your life today. And so here's the simple daily practice. This is really hard, but it's simple. Okay? It is. When the what if? Pops in your head, when the image of you driving home from your first, like, physical encounter with the guy who's your husband, now that you know that feeling, you know what I'm Talking about that shame like it's just heaviness.

[Ashley]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

When you go, when your body drags you back to that moment, all your body's trying to do is keep you safe. It doesn't ever want you to hurt like that again. And you don't ever want to hurt anybody else like that again. When it does that, you have a picture in your mind, a real picture. I would recommend have one on your phone or carry one in your back pocket, go old school to Walgreens and print one out. Put in your pocket, carry it with you and pull it out. And don't just look at it. Put yourself in that picture and it's one of you and your current husband and your baby. Y' all laughing feel the weather. Feel your son's hand on your finger, your new husband's hand around your shoulders. It will bring you from your body trying to protect you to remember what happened. Remember what happened to but I'm okay now. I'm new now. I've rebuilt myself into somebody I respect with a thousand little actions every day. I'm a, I'm a wife who loves her new husband well, and by the way, he's not your new husband. You've been with him twice as long as you're with your ex. I'm an incredible mom. When and if my son comes to me for wisdom, I'm never going to tell him. You should lie to, quote, unquote, spare somebody. Because that's just going to make when they find out even worse. Right? It's I am now in my driver's seat of my life. And when you get there, over time, when you constantly pull that picture out, you constantly decide, I'm not going to meditate on what I did, I'm going to meditate on what I'm doing and who I'm becoming. Your body will go, oh, you're driving again. Cool. And it will slowly change your default setting to constantly remind you of the worst thing you ever did to she is this person now. But at some point you got to let 24 year old you go, all that pain you caused radical. Oh, I own it all. I did this. Yes, I got bad advice. I chose to lie. Yes, he wasn't emotionally whatever, blah, blah, blah. I chose to go to somebody else's house and sleep with them. I had this picture of our life together, yet I have a family with somebody else now. All of that is true and it all has a period at the end of it. What are you going to write next? What I'm going to write is I'm going to become somebody of, of high character that my husband and my son can anchor into. I know what it's like to not be able to trust yourself. I'm going to always do the small little things so that I am a person that I respect and trust. I'm going to choose it. I'm going to choose it over and over and over again. Your move, sister. Thanks for the call. I took a lot of courage to call be a person of high, high integrity from this point forward. We come back, a man asks how to stop obsessing over his family's finances. Yikes. This sounds like me. Be right back. If you've got a dog or a cat or both or a whole bunch of dogs and a whole bunch of cats, I want you to pause this podcast and go to dutch.com deloney and check them out. Right now, Dutch is a telehealth veterinarian service that saves you a lot of time and a lot of money. I've got pets, you've got pets. And caring for pets is a challenge. And this is why I love Dutch. Dutch gives you 247 access to licensed veterinarians and anytime, anywhere. And here's the best part. A Dutch membership covers up to five pets with unlimited visits, unlimited follow ups and prescriptions shipped free to your front door. All of this is less than seven bucks a month with code [e-mail] DeLoney that's cheaper than walking into a veterinarian's office one time. The average Dutch member saves over 800 bucks a year. Whether it's medication, behavior issues, allergies or something else. Dutch vets are trained to treat over 150 common pet conditions. Go to Dutch.com DeLoney and use code DeLoney to get 50 bucks off a year of veterinarian care. That's their best offer of the year. That's a Dutch.com DeLoney use code DeLoney C site for details. It's Dutch.com DeLoney let's go to Johnson City, Tennessee, just a few hours from me and talk to Thomas. What's up, Thomas?

[Thomas]

Hey, John, how's it going?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm good, brother. What are you up to, man?

[Thomas]

Oh man, I just got back from a work trip, so trying to settle back into the daily routine, I guess.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Very cool, very cool. What's up? How can I help?

[Thomas]

Yeah, man. So my question is, well, I mean, you know, it. How, how do I stop obsessing over my wife's and my finances?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What's the state of your Finances pretty good.

[Thomas]

I mean, I, I don't know how in depth I should go, but I mean, I'm 21. My wife is 22. We've done pretty well for ourselves. We're very, very thankful to God for that. I can't even point anything out that like, we're struggling with right now. We haven't bought a house yet, but, you know, we're working on that. We're saving up for a down payment kind of ending baby step three. So we're pretty much close to having that emergency fund built all the way

[Dr. John DeLoney]

up for, for people listening that don't know what that means. That means that Thomas and his wife don't owe anybody any money and they've almost saved up three to six months of expenses. So basically they are their own credit card now. They're their own merchant emergency bank now, which is amazing. Yeah, it's awesome.

[Thomas]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Which puts you ahead of most people in the United States, which is amazing.

[Thomas]

Right. And like, I see those statistics all the time, you know, I guess the algorithm on social media and everything is kind of tailored to what you engage with most. And mine just happens to be finances a lot of the time. So I see a lot of those statistics. And like, we are ahead of the game. You know, we're contributing to retirement as well.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What was your, what was money like growing up for you?

[Thomas]

I guess there's moments whenever you're like, lead with that next time. So I'll do that. My parents had 10 kids, so it was pretty tight.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Are pretty tight.

[Thomas]

Yeah, pretty tight.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Make a hundred million dollars a year.

[Thomas]

No, dude, no, not at all. Our kind of structure growing up was my family would kind of travel around the eastern United States doing like biblical dramas in churches. And we would live off of like a love offering basis.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So churches would basically pass the bucket, baby.

[Thomas]

Yeah, pass the bucket. And that's kind of what we live off of. So there wasn't any guaranteed, like, hey, this amount of money is coming in per month. And along with that, you know, kind of closer to the tail end of the ministry, my parents kind of started up their own business. But even as far as that goes, they're not doing the best financially, especially with retirement coming up. So they don't really have much put away for that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How are your other nine siblings doing financially?

[Thomas]

Good question. I think it's a mix of, I mean, good and all right. I don't think anyone's doing really bad. I think there may be a couple who are probably tighter just due to different life Changes recently. But I wouldn't say anyone's, like, down in the dumps, per se. I don't know.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What. What is your. Give me. You mentioned your social media algorithm feedback. Give me a big picture. Do you study finance? Are you all you. Are you all up to date on it all?

[Thomas]

No, I work for a large financial firm, so not as. Not as a financial advisor, though. I. I'm just kind of in that space as it stands. I. I do it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. So all you. You get the headlines.

[Thomas]

I do. I get the headlines. I see, you know, like, oh, well, you know, this stock is, you know, going up by this percentage or the S P is doing this. Well, you know, things like that. So it's. It. That's pretty cool.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Well, you get the. This stock is going up, of which in this country, there are approximately six to seven that are going up.

[Thomas]

Right, right, right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And the rest are floundering. The. So you get. You get those, but you also get the. It's all coming down. I can't believe this is happening. The. Oh, yeah. Fed is on all this crazy nonsense. Right?

[Thomas]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Everything.

[Thomas]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so I want to back all the way out for a second. Okay.

[Bill]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I want to propose something to you that maybe you've never considered before.

[Thomas]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I want you to consider that your body's working perfectly. It's working exactly as your lived experience would set it up. And that is you have a very real. In your nervous system, not just in your head, wired into you from a young age that a meal may not be coming. You have a lived experience of seeing a father turn around and see 11 mouths plus his that he's responsible for and whether he tried to hide it or not. You know, that look of a dad who go. Who's thinking, I don't know where we're gonna sleep tonight. Okay. Yeah, you're. You would be. Clinically, I would tell you to go check yourself in to a hospital if you were like, no, dude, I don't think about money at all. It's all good and great. Every single cell in your body is saying, we're not safe. We're not safe. This could go away at any moment. Sometimes we get to have a nice meal, but most of the time, like, that's. That is your nervous system trying to solve for it. Okay. That's number one.

[Thomas]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Number two, you work in a world where you don't have insider knowledge, but you get blasted by head lines. What do I mean by that? I have several friends in the banking industry. When I ask them like, dude, what. What. What happens if we have a recession? To a person, they're like, sweet, dude. That means everything's on sale. And they know that because they understand how things work. I don't. So when I see huge headlines that say, recession coming, all this, ah, you should have bought crypto 10 years ago. You're behind the times. You should have. Whatever. Like, my body just sees the headlines and it does what it's supposed to do, which is dives out to protect me. Whether that means go to war, that. Whether that means worry and obsess and scroll more and read more and do more spreadsheets and figure out more little nooks and crannies and get more jobs. What? It's just doing what it's supposed to do, trying to keep me safe

[Thomas]

for sure.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so hear me say, I don't think you're crazy.

[Thomas]

All right, well, I appreciate that it feels like it sometimes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I know, I know, I know. And here's the third thing. What else are you anxious about in your life? Just throw them out there.

[Thomas]

I. I truly don't know nothing else.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You're just golden with your marriage. Y' all are all the same line together. Your job, you just feel, ah, not worried about AI or nothing. Like, what do you get anxious about?

[Thomas]

I mean, with AI comes layoffs. Like, there's been a lot of conversation about that with my company. So, I mean, that's something I think of honestly. Like, If I'm being 100% honest with you, I don't honestly get anxious much about that. I have full confidence that whatever happens, you know, that's just another step that I'll just have to take to kind of overcome it. And I know God's got our back, so I'm not really worried about that. Truly, the. Really, the only thing I can think of is finances.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

When you say obsessed, what does that mean in real life? Like, when you say I'm obsessing over our finances, what does that mean?

[Thomas]

Yeah, like, constantly checking the balances of, like, 401k, our savings, our money market accounts, seeing a headline on social media saying, like, hey, you know, this stock, you know, went up, this percentage. If you would have just invested in it, you know, six months ago, you could have had this much return. Well, then I'll take the balance that was in our account at that time, and do you know the Dave Ramsey investment calculator, and look up like, you know, from this time to this time, this percentage of return, what would I have? And it's like constantly, like, Parsing through those numbers and seeing like, man, I could have done better or like, man, I should really get invested in this sort of thing because it's projected to go this high. You know, crypto, you know, all that talk, whether it's going up or down, you know, things, things.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

When you're a kid, when you're a kid driving around in the rv, you just have kids everywhere.

[Thomas]

Yeah, it was, well, it was a 12 passenger van.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Even worse. How many times did you hear the words you should. Y' all need to. Y' all should have.

[Thomas]

Good bit.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. The words and the voices that we hear over time, the stories that were told when we're young become the stories we tell ourselves as adults. The problem is we tell those stories as adults in our own voice and so we believe it. I, I work my other job besides this show is I co host the Ramsey Show. Right.

[Thomas]

Love it. Listen to it all the time. Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I look at my 401k balance once a year and only because my wife and I get together once a year for our annual wed marriage retreat. And I just give a State of the union. Here's what it is this year and here's why. Not because I bury my head in the sand, not because I don't care, none of that, but because I'm never going to sell my 401k. I'm never going to get out of it. I'm never going to pay a 35% tax and borrow against it. It just is. And because it's there, I've made peace with. It's a roller coaster and looking doesn't do any good for it will do nothing for me except give me false security because I know it will go down at some point. Or, and, and so if it's high, I'm like, oh, I feel so good. That's false. It's going to go down and it'll go back up, then it'll go down, then hopefully it goes back. Right. Or it just leaves me looking for things I quote, unquote, should have done, which is a meta story for my wife. Probably could have done better than marrying. Yeah, I'm not enough. And whether your mind is way clearer than mine, which is like, yeah, dude, if AI takes my job, cool, I'll go get another one. That's fine. We'll figure that out. That's awesome. Your body has a lived experience. Or as Vander says, your body has kept the score and it's often fighting wars that we don't even know we're fighting. And so the, the challenge for you is twofold and I just know it in, in intuitively because I experience the same thing. Okay. I grew up in a house with a dad who's a good man, with a mom who's an incredible woman and very money insecure for most of my childhood. Okay. I would be crazy if I wasn't highly attuned to it as an adult. Also, I'd be crazy if I kept trying to play whack a mole with markets and with all the predictions and it's just madness. I would be extra crazy if I got any financial advice from tick tock. Right?

[Thomas]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You should have. You need to buy passive income, buy duplexes and sell. I would be insane.

[Thomas]

Right?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right. So the path I'll give you is, is twofold. Path number one is or three, commit to yourself to stop going to war with your body. If you start obsessing over something. If you start, if your heart, that warm feeling you get when your stomach drops, if your heart starts racing, if you start saying I should have, I should have, I should have. Instead of immediately trying to run out and solve that problem, if you'll just take one quick deep inhale and deep exhale and say out loud or whisper it depending on if you're by yourself or the others. Dude, thank you for taking care of me. Thank you trying for trying to keep me safe. I'm good. That's you just calling your body back into your frontal lobe, into your mind. It's realigning him saying, I got it, I got it. You're trying to save us. You've been there before. I'm good though. I'm just not going to go to war with my body anymore. I'm too, I'm too tired, man. It's a losing proposition. The second thing is, is committing to a set of principles. And what I mean by that is I'm not ever going to sell my 401k. That's a principle of mine. I will go up or down on that ship. We'll either go to the moon or we'll go to the bottom of the ocean. That money, when I invested in my 401k, it's spent, right? And so when I have that principle lined out, the action steps that validate that principle in my life means I'm not going to, I'm not going to bother looking at it. Doesn't do any good. Not going to do anything. If you're one of those day traders of which a vast majority of them lose everything you need to Watch every second of every. Everything of all. Like, right, you need to.

[Thomas]

Yeah, thankfully I don't do that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. And so, and so it's really asking yourself this one question. What can I control here? Or as people used to ask in the alleyways between, you know, between bars when I was in college. What are you gonna do about it? Oh, nothing. I'm just going to put a bunch of fake numbers into a calculator and project out a decision that I didn't even make and to try to see just what kind of a loser I am. I'm not, I'm not even going to, I'm not even going to put in the calculator. I'm going to use the investment calculator for real money that I have that I am putting in there so that I can project out a future that me and my wife want to create together. That's what those calculators are for. They're not shame meters. Right.

[Thomas]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so come up with a set of principles I have. Growing up with not a lot and having a couple of number one best selling books in a show that's pretty popular. My, my, my life has changed to some degree when it comes to worrying. The daily stresses of worrying about how me and my wife are going to pay our bills. Okay, that's changed. The angst hasn't. And so this is directly from Dave, who grew up with not a lot of stuff, who's worth hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars now. And that is, I just simply look at ratios, I look at the numbers, and I make decisions based on the number, not on my feelings or the emotions attached to it. And for me, that means I don't make big decisions without my wife because she's stable, more stable than I am. She doesn't have that same angst that I have.

[Thomas]

Yeah, same here.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And here's the third thing. You ready?

[Bill]

Yep.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Stay on the known path. All I mean by that is this. Just keep doing the same workout, man. Just keep eating the same healthy diet. Just keep showing up for your wife in a thousand little ways over time, asking her every day, how can I love you? Getting together a couple times a year to make sure your values and your actions are aligned together so y' all are best supporting each other so that y' all can get where you want to go. And anytime somebody throws another path in front of you and another path in front of you and another path, a new cutting edge way, just keep scrolling or put your phone away. But you know, you get what I'm Saying, limit your inputs on what you should be doing.

[Thomas]

Yeah, I think that's. That's probably something I struggle with a lot.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah.

[Thomas]

Get off. Yeah, there's a lot of information coming in.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Turn it off. If you've already made your principles known, turn it off. If your principles are wavering, if you have new ideas, be honest about those, sit with your wife and a friend or two and put those principles on the table and say, I had this principle. I think about changing it. What do y' all think? If you have. If you have lived experience on a topic and your body gets really powerful and strong emotions around it, getting a coach, getting a friend, getting somebody to see something you don't see is really important because your feelings are. You can't help those. You're just gonna feel stuff. But you have to be responsible for your next emotional. Right. Action. Right. The next emotions, the next actions you take. That's just emotional maturity. And sometimes we need people with us

[Ashley]

for sure.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Here's a fourth thing. Last one really quick. You ready? Yep. If you put your phone away, you're going to have a bunch of idle, boring, itchy time. Choose to backfill that time with things that will get you where you want to be and help you become the man you want to become. Exercise sex with your wife, not with strangers. Go to a comedy club, go watch movies. Go get another degree. Go start planning for life after AI takes your job, whatever it is, you're going to have time and itchiness. Like, go use that productively. And don't just scroll. Literally doom scroll, in your case, your life away. Don't go seek more opinions and more information. And more information. More. Dude, I made my call. I've made my choices. I'm not. I'm. I'm gonna invest 15% of my income. I'm not gonna owe anybody any money. Those are core values. Those are principles I have put forth. That's the sidewalk I walk on. So I'm not even gonna look at things that challenge those. I'm gonna get on about my life, and then you're going to find yourself pretty bored pretty fast. And so I got to do some things that are going to backfill all that. It's all well and good, but all I have to say is, you're not crazy, man. Your body has been through financial insecurity. Your body has seen and experienced hungry mouths. You're not crazy, man. Your body's just doing right. It's an honor. Gets to talk to you, brother. Hang on the line. I'M gonna send you a copy of Building a Non Anxious Life. I want you and your wife to use that as a road map to build your young marriage with. All kinds of things will come out when y' all read the book and do the exercises at the end of each chapter, but I think it will provide great stability for you as you build your own branch on your family tree. Thanks for calling, brother. We come back, A man asks how to bring back his hobbies without feeling guilty in his marriage. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Sometimes it feels like everyone else's love lives are these perfect little Hallmark movies. Here's the truth. Whether you're married, dating or single, everybody is still figuring out how to do relationships. I've been married for 23 and a half years. Both my wife and I have PhDs and we're still trying to figure out how to keep our marriage rolling down the track. Both of us have benefited greatly from our times with a great therapist. No matter if you just met someone or if you've been married forever like me, therapy can help you find your way. It can help you find what you want, what feels heavy, and how you can take some of the pressure off yourself and your relationships. Whether for individuals or couples, therapy is an opportunity to identify what's getting in the way, help remove any blockers, and create a plan for moving forward. I recommend BetterHelp. If you're just starting therapy, BetterHelp is an online therapy platform that matches you with a licensed therapist based on your goals and preferences. You can message your therapist and schedule sessions through the platform. And if the first therapist isn't the right fit, you can switch anytime at no additional cost. When it comes to love and relationships, everyone is still finding their way. Find yours. Visit betterhelp.com DeLoney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H E L p.com DeLoney all right, let's go out to Philadelphia, talk to B double L. What's up, Bill?

[Bill]

Hey, Dr. John. How are you?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm good, brother. What you up to, man?

[Bill]

Hey, just living the dream. Trying to not let it become a nightmare.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Excellent. That's a. That's a good thing. That's a good thing.

[Bill]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What's up?

[Bill]

Yeah. Hey, my question how can I pick up on some hobbies that I left go of? 16 years of child raising? My children are getting older and I just finding some time on my hands and feeling a little dad guilt that I don't know how to navigate. So I just thought I'D give you a call and see what you had to say.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, you used a magic word. Tell me about dad guilt.

[Bill]

Yeah, so I have a lot of. I've been married 20 years and have a phenomenal marriage and three awesome, awesome kids. 16, 13, and 10. And raising those children to this point has been somewhat of a challenge. Our youngest was in a NICU for 14 days, and, yeah, just created some financial challenges and around that. So I've. I've kind of put my head down, maybe, so to speak, and just plowed through some of those challenges, let go of a lot of my hobbies and things that I enjoyed in lieu of family and raising children and my marriage. So now here I am. I want to go out with the guys, want to go snowboarding and do some of these things that I enjoy, but I feel guilty for letting my family at home. And I don't know how to navigate that. Yeah, navigate that guilt. And just feel bad that, you know, I'm leaving them behind or that I, you know, I've invested 16 years of my life as I should have, but now. Yeah. Where do I go from here?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So a friend of mine, her name is Dr. Becky Kennedy. She's a clinical psychologist in New York. She's a pretty wise voice when it comes to parenting. She gave me a definition of mom guilt, dad guilt that I had never heard before, that I thought was phenomenal, and I'll pass it along. Okay, sure. She said, most of the time, moms and dads are not feeling guilt. Guilt is a feeling, and I would even go as far to say it's a good feeling of your body's response when you violate one of your core values. Okay, so do you think dads are bad if husbands are bad, if they also have hobbies?

[Ashley]

No.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Bill]

Answer is no.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. Do you think guys who work really hard for their families, guys who are stable and secure and who love their wives well and who love their kids well, are bad men when they go snowboarding with their buddies or when they do wood cutting or when they play golf, within reason,

[Bill]

no, they're not.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so doing. Going snowboarding, hanging out with your buddies once a week, twice a week, is not a violation of your core values. So I would challenge you and wonder, is this not guilt?

[Thomas]

Or

[Dr. John DeLoney]

when you leave your kids, you've done such a good job with your kids, you're so connected with your wife, they miss you, they're sad to see their dad go, and you take their sadness and their frustration from them, and you shove it down in Your chest. And you call it guilt.

[Bill]

Ah. Ouch.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And here's. Here's the next step. Here's the next step where I would really challenge you hard is this idea that 247 access for your spouse and for your kids somehow is quote unquote, the right thing. Because your kids get unfettered access to their dad. Your wife gets every single meal at the table with her husband. All those are good things, I guess, but they also have a lived experience of a man who is slowly letting the light inside his chest go out. And that's not good. And so my challenge to you would be the greatest gift you could give your kids on top. Like, so obviously this, like, just. This is like a duh statement. Of course, if you're the breadwinner in your family, you're gonna work real hard. And of course you're gonna show up and be present with your kids during important moments for bedtimes and whatnot. All that's right and good.

[Thomas]

Yep.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You should not go to every practice. It's okay if you miss games. It's really important that your kids have a lived experience of their dad having friends of a grown man having things that he loves to do and that he practices getting good at and that he fails at. That's important also. And so what you have to make peace with is your feelings are going to be what they are. There's not a lot you could do with them. That's a cocktail of genetics and your childhood experiences. Maybe your dad didn't show up for you as a kid, and so you over hit the pendulum. Great. All that's good. You're going to have your feelings. You can't control those. What you can control is what you do next. I'm gonna go. I'm gonna put it on the calendar. I'm gonna make myself go. And the moment I get in the car and pull out of the driveway, any thought I have to, what if I should have that is simp. You're not going to help your kids in any way with that sort of thinking. You're just going to take away from the thing you're going to do. So the moment you get in the car and shut that door and head to the airport, the moment you get in the car after kissing your wife and tucking your last kid into bed, and you head over to your buddy's house to play poker, do whatever y' all going to do. Watch. Play Dungeons and Dragons. I don't know what you guys do, but we go fishing. Whatever it is, I'm going to be fully present wherever I'm at. And then that allows me to show up connected whole. My body knows it's got a gang, it's got a tribe, a group of men that will be there in any moment and that will allow me to show up for my wife and kids when I'm with them at a level of depth and presence that I did not know was. Was possible. Does that make sense?

[Bill]

Yeah, that's.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That.

[Bill]

Yeah. I can sit here and say, yeah, that also. That all sounds good.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Rubber meets the road. Rubber meets the road. Your homework assignment for 2026 is to put at least one thing per week on the calendar where you are away from your home.

[Bill]

So what do my wife and kids

[Thomas]

do

[Bill]

they find something else to do or I just. That's up to them.

[Ashley]

Or.

[Bill]

I mean. Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Really? Are they. Are they incompetent? Are they unable to have joy without you?

[Bill]

I wouldn't have said so. No.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Are you gonna feel like you're missing out? Does your wife know how to laugh and have fun with her kids?

[Thomas]

Yeah.

[Bill]

Yeah. She definitely. She's definitely. And maybe another part of this is she is definitely more of a homebody.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Great.

[Bill]

So she doesn't understand.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's awesome.

[Bill]

Why I.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

My wife is too. To be my wife's dream night begins and ends with her in bed at 8:45. And here's the thing. I'll never understand it.

[Bill]

Me neither. But agreement and not agreement and understanding

[Dr. John DeLoney]

isn't the goal for me. It is. How do I love her? Well. And so I. I go to. I've played music with my buddies and we sometimes stay too late. I go to a local comedy club a couple times a week. That doesn't happen till late. I make sure I share with my kids the next morning when I bomb. Your dad got up in front of strangers right before Nate Bargazzi got up, right before so and so got up and I tanked. And they go, ooh, was it bad? I'm like, oh, so bad. Right. And I also tell him, your dad crushed last night. I also say, hey, Josephine, my daughter, do you think this joke is funny? She's like, I think you could. Right? I bring him into it. My son's 15. I try to take him wherever I can now, But I don't. My wife doesn't understand why I don't want to just get a full night's sleep because I feel so good when I do.

[Thomas]

But.

[Bill]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But she's. She's like, how can I love that guy? Well, loving that guy well, is he needs to have a couple of crazy things that he's doing at all times. Awesome. Because I also know he's a man that's going to get the crap done that he needs to get done around the house to be a man I can trust and support and love.

[Bill]

Yeah, that's. Yeah. Very well. Very well said.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Game on, homie. Not only do you need to have one thing a week that you go, do you need to have at least one big thing, a quarter that you go for a couple of days.

[Bill]

I have a friend.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Go ahead.

[Bill]

I have a friend wanting to take me to Vermont. Snowboarding.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It goes on the calendar before the day's over.

[Bill]

I keep saying no because I know what will happen when I drive away. The tears and everything else that'll be shed because I'm not there. And I just.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But those aren't your. Those aren't your tears.

[Bill]

I know, but it just. It robs the joy of the trip. Maybe that's. Yeah, I guess that's my problem.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. You're taking their sadness, by the way. That's good sadness. They love their dad. They like him around. But it could also be codependence. I have to make sure my dad's okay so that I can be okay. And that's not healthy.

[Bill]

No, I don't. Yeah, I don't think it's that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So let him cry. Let get in that car knowing, dude, I'm such a good dad. My kids actually freaking miss me when most kids in the country are like, thank God my dad's gone for the weekend. Yeah, be excited about the reunion on your way home. All that's good. And by the way, if this was every weekend and four nights a week, I'd be having a very different conversation with you. I am one who is guilty of setting up where I've got something going on every night of the week. And that's not good for my family. Right. It's not. But nothing is not good either. Go back to first principles. It's important for kids to see their dad with friends. Bring him if you can. Talk about it on the way and on the way home. All that's important. It's important for kids to have independent relationships with their mom and with their dad. It's important for everyone in the family to have shared experiences. It's important to get around a table and eat dinner together as often as possible.

[Thomas]

You.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's also important for your kids to learn how to manage boredom, sadness, and all those things that are just a natural part of being alive. But by and large, the research tells me families get a better version of both parents when both parents have friends outside the home, have experiences outside the home, have relationships outside the home too. So go make it happen. You're a move brother. Today's your independence day. Go get some friends. Go do fun crazy stuff. Don't carry your kids frustrations or annoyances or tears and shove them in your chest and call that guilt. That's not what that is. That's just kids loving their dad being kids. It's supposed to be that way. And then feel all your feelings and go have the time of your life. And don't break your leg snowboarding. That'll make this call really sad at the end. Appreciate you, brother. We'll be right back. Two things my listeners care about are sleeping well and healthy kids. And that's why I'm proud to endorse Beam and their science backed wellness products. When I need a good night's sleep, I reach for Beam's Dream Powder. It's a powder that I mix with my favorite drink and it helps me fall asleep faster than stay asleep longer and wake up feeling clear and not hungover. I love that Beam Dream Powder supports all four stages of sleep using ingredients that your body actually recognizes. Magnesium, L theanine, Apogenin, Rishi, Melatonin and more. No weird chemicals, no added sugar and it tastes incredible. And when it comes to my kids health, I give them Beams Kids Super Powder. It tastes like hot chocolate and they love it. It's packed with greens, vitamins and probiotics. It's super healthy and it tastes amazing. If you're ready to raise your sleep standards and if you're ready for your kids to be a little bit healthier, check out Beam. And when it comes to Beam's Dream Powder for a limited time, Beam is giving my listeners their best offer yet. The 50% off beam's dream Powder with my discount code Deloney. Go to shop s h o p shop beam.com DeLoney and use code DeLoney at checkout. That's shop beam b a m dot com DeLoney and use code DeLoney for up to 50% off their dream powder. All right, we are back. Hey listen, I talk to so many of you every day who are frustrated with the state of your marriage. You like the person you married and you want it to be better. And you'll look at each other and just get right back in the same dance over and over and over again. I've been hearing this for years since I've been doing the show and sitting with people behind closed doors. And so here's the deal. The path forward is almost never a big firework show. It's a thousand microhabits, a bunch of tiny little things that you do day in and day out. Yes, they're boring sometimes or they're pretty awesome, but it's just the constant doing over and over again, and it's hard to know where to start. So me and my friends created the Together app. It's on your phone, and you know how much I don't like apps. This one is actually awesome and helps you start small and gives you simple activities that you can do for yourself and for your spouse every day. These are microhabits for your marriage. It's. It's incredible, dude. Your marriage is built in, in the small, everyday moments, and this shows you how to do it. It's six bucks a month. I know everyone's out there struggling financially. I got you six bucks a month. Your marriage is worth it, I promise you. Click the link in the show notes or search together in the app store and you Android people. I'm working on it. I'm working on it. Relax, relax. It's coming. But if you got an iPhone, go to the Together app in the app store. All right, Alex, something cool happened today. What's. What's up? Yeah, Maddie said something awesome happened. After listening to your show, it is apparent that so many issues adults face today stem from insecurities in their childhood. So I started doing something with my four year old daughter. It's called FaceTime. Once a day I yell facetime, and she comes running and puts her face in my hands. I get down on her level, look in her eyes and hold her face and say, I love you and I'm proud of you. You are beautiful, you are brave and you are capable. I will continue to do this as long as she is under my roof and for any, any other future kids as well. Thank you for all you do. That's awesome. I've talked before in the past on, man, you can get kind of nerdy. But physiologically, kids, all of us have a lot of nerve endings in our face. There's something powerful about somebody touching our face and how it, what it does to your nervous system. But doing that with your kids, especially getting down on their eye level, we forget. Adults forget that we're humongous to a 4 year old, right? Or to a 6 year old or even to a 10 year old. We're huge. And so getting down on their eye level holding their face and looking them directly in the eye. Even if they, like, flinch or they look away, they're like, oh, stop, dad. Stop telling your kids. So proud of you, and I love you. What that does is it sets the table for when you have to have challenging conversations, when you have to have accountability conversations, when you have to say, hey, in this house, we don't do that. You've already built a firm foundation, so they know that that challenge is coming from a place of not criticism and anger, but from a place of love and connection. So it just sets the stage for their entire life. So good call. What was her name? Maddie. Maddie. You're changing your family tree, and that's amazing, everybody. And by the way, my kid, now my son, he's taller than me. Still try my best to stand up on my tippy toes, man, he loves looking down on his old man. And I do the same thing with even my older kids. Constantly put your kids h heads. Constantly put your hands on their face and tell them that you love them. Look them in the eyes. It'll change everything. Bye.