Our Son Is Famous in Our Small Town for All the Wrong Reasons

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Dr. John Delony Show
Episode Title: Our Son Is Famous in Our Small Town for All the Wrong Reasons
Date: December 1, 2025
Host: Dr. John Delony (Ramsey Network)

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Episode Overview

This episode of The Dr. John Delony Show centers on callers confronting deeply challenging family situations—addiction, public shame, mental illness, and crises within a small-town community. Dr. Delony provides empathetic, practical, and direct advice on coping with pain, setting boundaries, and navigating overwhelming public scrutiny. The main theme is resilience in the face of public and private hardship, with a particular focus on how to maintain one’s sense of self and compassion when the actions of family members or the tragedies within one’s community draw outsized attention.

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Key Call #1: Lynn from Ontario—Parenting Through Addiction and Public Scrutiny

[01:47–18:57]

Situation:

• Lynn shares her struggle as the mother of a 27-year-old son with addiction and severe mental illness.
• Her son, a twin, is infamous in their small town for criminal behavior (including kidnapping), public disturbances, and threatening behavior.
• She describes the pain of community judgment, personal shame, and uncertainty over whether she failed as a parent.

Discussion Points & Insights:

• Recognizing Limits of Control:
  Dr. Delony validates Lynn’s pain, emphasizing that other people’s judgments cannot be controlled; only her reactions can. He stresses the importance of holding dignity in public spaces despite gossip and blame ([03:11]).
• Public Figure in a Small Town:
  He likens her situation to public figures, noting, “In a small town, everyone’s a public figure, right?” ([06:39]).
• Setting Boundaries for Safety:
  Lynn details how her son is not allowed indoors; police are called when safety is threatened. Dr. Delony applauds her for this hard boundary, crediting her and her husband’s teamwork ([08:05-09:38]).
• The Guilt and Maternal Pain:
  The heartbreak of having to turn away her injured son out of fear and safety is discussed in depth. Dr. Delony offers deep compassion:

  “You shouldn’t have to sit on the front porch with a very, very ill son while he’s bleeding and not be able to hug him because he might hurt you. It’s not supposed to be that way." ([09:38])

• Complex Emotions Are Allowed:
  Dr. Delony normalizes Lynn’s anger, sadness, and even thoughts she feels ashamed of:

  “There’s no bad thoughts, okay? You’re allowed to be mad at your son. You’re allowed to be scared of your son… All those thoughts are okay. You’re not crazy.” ([11:29])

• Cultural Stigma & Reframing:
  He reframes her son’s addiction and mental illness as neurological disorders—comparing them to cancer or other recognized illnesses:

  "You have a son who's very, very sick. And instead of having cancer, your son has neurological disorders that society has said are moral failures and character failures." ([05:36])

• Handling Social Media & Public Grenades:
  Dr. Delony draws boundaries around responding to unhelpful or cruel messages:

  “If you’re not going to call me and talk to me, or come over to my house and sit with me, then your opinion doesn’t matter too much to me… If somebody just wants to throw grenades, I can’t do anything about it. Right? And you can’t either.” ([06:40])

• Practical Strategies for Encounters:
  Dr. Delony coaches Lynn to respond to probing townsfolk with strength and honesty:

  “My boy is really, really sick right now, and the authorities are involved. I’m letting the professionals do their job.” ([16:23])

• Choosing Compassion Over Shame:
  He recommends a posture of grace toward others’ judgment:

  “When somebody mouths off to you somewhere, you can exhale and just take a long blink… and just say, dear God, be with that person and give them grace.” ([15:44])

• Tending to Her Own Well-being:
  He encourages minimizing exposure to “outside voices” and asserts that the only thing she can control is her own next right action ([13:03], [15:42]).

Notable Quotes:

• Lynn: “You question yourself, am I doing the right thing? Do I help more? Do I sink in more? Do I put myself at physical risk? ...When the delusions and hallucinations get really bad, then I am always his target.” ([04:50])
• Dr. John Delony:
  • “You have enough to carry with this thing.” ([10:48])
  • “You can minimize the amount of voices you allow into your heart and mind.” ([15:42])

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Key Call #2: Rochelle from San Diego—Grappling with the End of a Family Line

[24:28–38:52]

Situation:

• Rochelle, age 48, shares her worry that her only son (29), who lives with her along with his girlfriend, has no plans to have children, threatening the continuity of the family line.
• She is also struggling with the economic reality of multiple generations living together in expensive San Diego.

Discussion Points & Insights:

• Intergenerational Patterns & Existential Worry:
  Rochelle expresses a longing for legacy; Dr. Delony identifies this as a distraction from more immediate, practical challenges ([26:47]–[27:23]).
• Purpose Crisis and Avoidance:
  Dr. Delony questions whether existential distress about lineage serves as a “great Xanax for avoiding what I hear in your chest: I’m not on a sustainable path and I’m about to be 50.” ([38:10])
• Challenging the Listener to Action:
  Dr. Delony gently confronts both Rochelle and her son about avoiding hard realities, noting the interplay between parents’ and children’s patterns. He offers examples of people reinventing themselves later in life (his mother earned her PhD at 57) as encouragement ([36:31]–[37:13], [37:39]).
• Concrete Next Steps: He presses Rochelle to envision what she wants for her own life at 55 and begin reverse engineering her actions now ([38:10]).
• Letting Go of Control:
  He emphasizes that she cannot control whether her son has children or finds purpose, only her own choices and boundaries.

Notable Quotes:

• “The change that has to happen is not with him, not with them. It’s with you. What do I want to. Who do I want to be when I’m 55?...I’m going to start right now so that at 55...I am running and gunning.” ([38:10])
• “Of course you want grandkids… But going back to the dawn of time and projecting that all the way down to your son and making him carry the weight of the human—that is a great Xanax for avoiding what I hear in your chest.” ([38:09])

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Key Call #3: Marie from San Antonio—Helping Kids Cope During a Community Child Abuse Scandal

[42:12–55:43]

Situation:

• Marie, a mom of five and activity leader, learns that parents in her community have been arrested for the murder of their child; their other children are returning to activities.
• She seeks advice on how to help her kids and other children navigate the situation with sensitivity.

Discussion Points & Insights:

• Validating the Ripple Effect of Tragedy:
  Dr. Delony recognizes the catastrophic fallout for the affected children and community, stating:

  “Their lives are destroyed… if these are true stories.” ([47:23])

• Grace for Initial Emotional Reactions:
  He gives space for the range of adult reactions, noting that shock, fear, and anger are natural and rooted in the vulnerability such events expose ([48:00], [49:07]).
• Modeling Safety and Compassion:
  Dr. Delony offers a practical approach for Marie’s class:

  “You are going to be one example of a safe, regulated adult… If when every kid individually walks in, you look at them and… say, I’m so glad you’re here. And when that boy walks in the door… you do the exact same thing with them.” ([51:04])

• Limiting Gossip and Maintaining Boundaries:
  He advises addressing any gossip or inappropriate questioning directly and setting clear expectations "(Hey, we’re not talking about other people’s parents today...)" ([53:02]).
• Direct, Age-Appropriate Conversations at Home:
  He encourages talking with one’s own kids openly about what they know and how the family can respond with kindness ([53:04], [54:41]).
• Focusing on What Can Be Controlled:
  Emphasizing again that only the next action—offering kindness and structure—can be controlled.

Notable Quotes:

• “All I can control is what I’m going to do next. And I’m going to age appropriately talk to my kids...I’m going to give them a human response, which is, I want you to know your parent has feelings, too.” ([49:59], [54:33])
• “What that kid needs more than anything is, for a minute, a reprieve from the ash that is their life.” ([53:02])

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Memorable Moments & Quotes

• Dr. Delony, on judgment and control:

  "You cannot control other people’s image, judgment, gossiping about you. The only thing you can control is how you choose to… hold your head up high." ([03:11])

• On shame and compassion:

  "You can either swallow up and cover up with a big blanket of shame or stand tall and walk right through that anxiousness." ([18:57])

• On a mother’s pain:

  “Moms aren’t… I mean, moms are supposed to. But the way the world works, you shouldn’t have to sit on the front porch with a very, very ill son while he’s bleeding and not be able to hug him because he might hurt you. It’s not supposed to be that way.” ([09:38])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:47–18:57] – Lynn from Ontario: Coping with a son’s public addiction and violence
• [24:28–38:52] – Rochelle from San Diego: Fear of her family line ending, facing personal and financial instability
• [42:12–55:43] – Marie from San Antonio: Supporting children and community after public child abuse allegations

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Episode Takeaways

• Radical Acceptance & Boundaries: Even in the face of public scorn or injustice, individuals can only control their own responses, boundaries, and compassion.
• Permission for Complex Feelings: Anger, guilt, and shame are natural responses to family crises; they do not make you a bad parent or community member.
• Courage in Facing Reality: Avoiding tough realities—whether about a child’s choices or one’s own life—just deepens suffering. The hardest questions are often the most necessary to ask ourselves.
• Power of Community and Example: Being a safe, compassionate, and consistent adult has a ripple effect on children and communities in crisis.

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Tone and Language

Dr. Delony’s tone throughout the episode is compassionate, direct, validating, and sometimes humorously blunt. He oscillates between empathetic listening ("Can I sit here with you on that one?") and challenging calls to action ("Look in the mirror first on this one… It’s time to level up"). He offers reassurance, tough love, and clear, actionable advice without minimizing the pain or difficulty of callers’ situations.

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Summary Conclusion

This episode is a rich exploration of familial pain, existential worry, and public crisis. Dr. Delony guides callers toward acceptance, action, and compassion—for themselves and others—while giving specific, actionable scripts and reframes. Listeners are reminded that though we cannot change others or erase tragedy, we can shape our own responses, provide safe refuge, and model dignity in the messiest parts of life.

Transcript

[A]

All right, let's talk about your marriage. Right now we have February and October weekends on sale for the money in Marriage Getaway. It's the best marriage retreat on the planet. Tickets start at 749 bucks a couple. Get [e-mail] Getaway.

[B]

As the parents of a drug addict son that regularly terrorizes the small town we live in, how do we live daily life while navigating personal embarrassment, anger and guilt? He was arrested for kidnapping a minor at the age of 14. Like I'm talking major, major things.

[A]

Yeah. What's going on? My goodness. I'm so glad you're here. So glad you're here. I'm John. This is the Dr. John DeLoney Show. Glad that you pulled up a seat or wherever, wherever you happen to be. If you're sitting down somewhere, if you are cleaning something up, if you're driving somewhere, I'm glad that you've chosen this podcast or if you're watching us on the. On the YouTubes. I'm glad that you're here. There's a trillion other shows you can be watching or listening to and I'm really grateful for your time on this show. We talk to real people. I'm a real guy. I'm a real boy, not an AI like, whatever. I'm a real person that sits with real hurting people who are going through real challenges. And I'm glad that you're here. If you want to be on the show, I'd love to have you go to John Deloney. D E L O N Y. John Deloney.com, ask a S-K and fill out the form and we will get you on the show. Let's go out to North Bay, Ontario and talk to Lynn. What's up, Lynn?

[B]

Hello. Hi, Dr. John.

[C]

How are you?

[A]

I'm great. How are you?

[B]

I'm okay. Navigating.

[A]

Navigating. Dude, that's a great word. Well done. That's awesome. How can I help?

[B]

So I'll just read you the question as I wrote it in and then we can expand from there.

[A]

Sounds good.

[B]

So my question was, as the parent of a drug addict son that regularly terrorizes the small town we live in, how do we live daily life while at the same time navigating outsiders, assumptions, personal embarrassment, shame, anger and guilt.

[A]

Oh, man.

[B]

It's a lot.

[A]

Yeah. Have you ever said that out loud before?

[B]

Not to anyone other than my husband.

[A]

Okay. Thank you for sharing that with me. That's hard to say out loud, isn't.

[B]

Is you have other kids worth A lot. I do. So this. I can't believe I'm gonna cry.

[A]

You're good. You're good. Sometimes we hold all of this in, and when you finally share it with somebody, it's just your body says, oh, thank you, and there's a big release. So thank you for sharing that. Yeah. You have other kids?

[B]

Yeah. So this son is actually a twin and they are both 27. And so he's not a child, he's a grown man. And I also have another one that's 25.

[A]

What I want you to get out of this phone call is that this one underlying important thing. You cannot control other people's image, judgment, gossiping about you. The only thing you can control is how you choose to or not to hold your head up high when you walk in the local grocery store, how you choose to tip, when you see people whispering, how you choose to. When somebody's pointing at you in a restaurant, you pick up their tab if you can. Like, that's the only thing you can control. And I also know that is. It's a nightmare. It's a small town, right? This is. Everyone knows everybody and everybody's in everybody's business and all that.

[B]

And you can't do not. It's not like he's doing little things that people aren't finding out about. So 21st September, he was arrested for kidnapping a minor the age of 14. Like, like I'm talking major, major things that wind up on news reels. And you know, so then we get telephone calls from people or messages on social media from people that we don't know telling us things like, you know, you're not doing enough, you're leaving him to the community and he's terrorizing everyone. Yeah. And you know, he's screaming at himself downtown, outside the local bank. And you know, it's like.

[C]

I mean.

[B]

You question yourself, am I doing the right thing? Because it's like, do I help more? Do I sink in more? Do I put myself at physical risk? Because when the delusions and hallucinations get really bad, then I am always his target.

[A]

Yeah, but Lynn, let's be honest. Let's be honest. That's. That's rumination. That's spinning out on a thing on. On an outcome that, you know, intellectually you can't even think about. He's a 27 year old man beneath that. That, beneath that I should be. What if I should be beneath that? Is this looming question, did I fail him as a mom?

[B]

100%.

[A]

And you got to Sit in that. And I'm going to suggest the answer is no. You have a son who's very, very sick. And instead of throwing up or instead of having cancer, your son has neurological disorders that society has said are moral failures and character failures. You have a very sick young man. And it's heartbreaking, the judgment on it. And by the way, before I came in here, Kelly was at my desk, we were talking. I got a letter that was like, I don't know, 50 pages, telling me what's wrong, that I'm theologically out of bounds, like it was. Somebody mailed me a letter, a long letter, telling me that my theology's bad. Right. And by the way, I don't even talk about my theology on this show. It's the things that just comes with being a public figure. The challenge for you is you're in a small town. I asked for this, you didn't. In a small town, everyone's a public figure, right?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And then when your son, the person who shares your last name, does something that gets him on the news, people feel like it's their job to just bomb you on social media, to bomb you via, like. And it's all safe at distance. Right. Nobody comes over, knocks on your door and says, hey, we got a problem here. They are keyboard warriors. They are telephone warriors. They are anonymous grenade throwers. And I've come to the place in my life where if you're not going to call me and talk to me, if you're not going to come over to my house and sit with me, then your opinion doesn't matter too much to me. Unless. Unless what you're putting on, on the table is constructive. Like, if somebody reached out and said, hey, your son is. Is all over the news here and here and here. I have a homeless shelter that specifically works with people like this. I'd love to take your son in then. Great. When somebody calls me and says, hey, you said something about nutrition, and you're actually wrong here. And here's where it was. I love that kind of stuff. But if somebody just wants to throw grenades, I. I can't do anything about it. Right. And you can't either. What you can do is the next right thing. If he comes over and threatens somebody in your home, and then I'm going to call the police and have him arrested because he's not safe, because now he's a man in the community that's putting my life at risk or my husband's life at risk.

[B]

Yeah, we do that on a regular. So he hasn't actually been allowed in my home in two years. Okay, can I.

[A]

Can I stop right there real quick? Can I applaud you for that? Because I know that's devastating. That's so hard. Right?

[B]

It's very difficult. And I have to give all the credit for that to my husband because I took his lead on that, because I was reacting from a far too emotional space. And he tends to be way more logical thinking.

[A]

It's not that. It's not that. It's not that. I don't want you to think that there's something deficient in how you're approaching this. You're a mother. You're supposed to go down on the Titanic with your kids. And your husband is also in this space where he's going to ride or die with his kids and he's going to protect his wife.

[B]

And that was the conversation that him and I had two years ago where he said that my husband explained that I was. Not that he was saying I was getting in his way, but that I was making it difficult for him to be able to protect the house and home, which is then expected of him, especially as. From society. And so that's when we came to the decision that, like, the front porch is okay. And so when he shows up at 2 o' clock in the morning with a busted head or whatever, then I just sit on the porch and call 911 or call the police if I have to, or. Yeah, whatever's going on. I don't know. I just.

[A]

Hold on, hold on. Can I sit here with you on that one? Like, I don't want to blow by that. Moms are. Aren't. I mean, moms are supposed to. But the way the world works, you shouldn't have to sit on the front porch with a very, very ill son while he's bleeding and not be able to hug him because he might hurt you. It's not supposed to be that way.

[B]

It's really not.

[A]

It's heartbreaking.

[B]

And then you run into them in town.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it's scared. You're. I'm instantly scared if I'm by myself. I feel like. Sounds crazy, but it feels like my butt's gonna fall off. I get like this tingly feeling where my legs and my butt connect.

[A]

No, it's your body telling you to run. And also there's that maternal instinct that says, I'm not running anywhere, but right into the arms of my son. All of that tension is real and it's true and it's right. You're not crazy. And then people. That's when people decide to throw grenades at you.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You have enough to carry with this thing.

[B]

Then you get angry at yourself because you're angry at him.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So there's moments where you feel like, you know, you're the one that's putting me through this crap.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And the craziest part of the whole situation, jails or when he's in the psychiatric hospital. He thrives.

[A]

Yeah. Because he gets structured and he's. And somebody makes him. Takes his. Take his medication. And there's a part of you that says, I should have been able to do that for him. And that thought is. Is right.

[B]

There's no pride.

[A]

Listen, listen to me. Listen to me. Listen, listen. There's no bad thoughts, okay? You're allowed to be mad at your son. You're allowed to be scared of your son. You're allowed to have had the thought, I wish I'd only had one of them instead of twins. You're all those thoughts are. Okay. You're not crazy. And then there's that scary, harrowing thing, which is why I'm glad you've got a ride or die husband. Because there's probably moments when he's over analytical and there needs to be some compassion in that home, which is the role you play. And there's also some moments when someone says, hey, this house isn't safe. A hug's not going to solve this one. We need to call the police. And that's why y' all work together as a team. It's good. You're both a gift to a really messy situation. The question you're going to have to answer moving forward is, do you have the courage to just delete Facebook?

[B]

Yeah, I can do that, but I don't think it would really change much because, like, you know, like you said, I get the points and their snickers and fine people will say some nasty things like, where's your face? You know, like they. And I don't know if they know that they're being nasty or if they just think they're entitled to your information or.

[A]

No, it's. It's different than that. There's this. I don't. I won't get all nerdy. Some people when. When something happens to them, it's fundamental attribution error to just be a nerd for a second. When I do something, it's because I have a good reason. When somebody else does something, it's because they're a bad person. Right. If I'm Speeding, it's because I really got to get a. Get to work. If you're speeding, it's because you're on drugs and you're trying to hurt people and you don't care about anybody. Right.

[B]

Perspective.

[A]

Yes. And so I'm gonna. I'm gonna expand that a little bit. Anytime you get in the mind of somebody else and try to figure out why they just did what they did, you're wasting your time and your energy because you're never going to know. My gut tells me that when somebody makes a comment, they're doing anything, they're looking for any reason in the world while. Why. Why they're not a failure? Well, they're not less than. Because, by the way, I got two amazing kids, and I don't think I'm doing a great job most of the time. And so if I can see a kid who's acting out in a restaurant, it makes me feel better to be like, well, at least my kid's not that right. But here's the deal. You have no idea why people are saying what they're saying. Maybe they are just mean. Maybe they're trying to make themselves feel a little bit better. Maybe their kid drinks but doesn't do drugs. Maybe their kid has depression, but not bipolar one. The reason I'm telling you all this is you're never going to know why somebody says something cruel. And you're never going to be able to stop all the extrinsic, all the outside actors from doing the things that they're going to do or saying what they're going to do. The only thing you can control is what you do next. And so you can minimize the amount of voices you allow into your. Into your heart and mind. If somebody snickers at you and points at you, you can lash out and defend yourself. You can bury your head in shame, or you can whisper a quick prayer. God, be with them, because they must be really struggling. And one of those is going to make you overwhelmed with shame. One of those is going to make you feel powerful for a second. And one of those is going to give you the grace and compassion that you so desperately wish other people would give you.

[B]

I'd rather give it to other people if I want it.

[A]

That's right. And so. But when somebody mouths off to you somewhere, you can exhale and just take a long blink. Don't close your eyes while you're walking on the street, but just take a long blink and just say, dear God, be with that person and give them grace.

[B]

And I've started to about since the 21st of September when this last crazy bill happened. I've started when people come to me and say, like, so I've heard this. It happened. I just say, for my own mental health and well being, I can't discuss this right now.

[A]

Okay. If that's the boundary you need right now, great. The next level of challenge I would put before you is to just look them directly in the eye and say, my boy is really, really sick right now and the authorities are involved. I'm letting the professionals do their job.

[B]

That's even better, because then at least I feel like I'm saying something. I'm not blaming the whole thing on him because I struggle a lot with. I can't defend his actions. And I don't want people to think that I'm defending his actions because the Lord knows I'm not sure. And.

[A]

But also, he's still your son, and.

[B]

I don't want him to be out there all alone, swinging in the breeze, thinking, someday, like, even my mom wouldn't stick up for me. You know?

[A]

That's right. But when you say the words my son, which is you taking ownership, is very, very sick, period. I'm allowing the professionals and the authorities to do their job right now. It's not safe for him to be out, period. In that. In those two sentences, you're saying, that's still my boy. And also, he's not safe to be out. And so I'm letting the professionals in the system do its job. And in a weird way, you're looking at the person who's asking you questions. Do you have anything else? Right? And listen, every time you want to say, I can't talk about this because of my mental health.

[B]

I feel like I'm making myself a victim.

[A]

That's exactly right. You are taking your feelings and your ownership and you're squashing it so that you feel a little bit better in that moment and you avoid that person. And. And anxiety is fed on avoidance. I mean, anxiety eats avoidance. That's what makes it stronger. And so nobody needs to know the. The intimate details. Nobody needs to know the ins and outs. Hey, your story's wrong. It's all mixed. I'm not. You don't know any. You need to know any of that because if you were in my inner circle, you would already know that.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

And so I'm not. This. On the sidewalk or at your local church or in the grocery store is not the time to decide if this person's in My inner circle or not, you would already know. So I'm going to look at somebody. And by the way, this is not easy. It's devastating, it's heartbreaking. But in two sentences, you can take ownership of that's my son. And my son's very sick and he's hurting people. And the best place for him right now is in jail or in a psychiatric facility, period. Anything else? And there's a weird. That's how you reclaim your autonomy and you reclaim your strength. And if you get called to testify, the best thing for your son is for not for you to say, oh, he's a great kid. He needs to be let out, because you know that's not true. The greatest thing for your particular kid is this, like psychiatric care. 100 is being in jail. And that's, that's, that's bananas to say out loud, but that's your reality. That's the truth. And in those moments when it's 2am and you're sitting on the front porch and it's cold outside and your son's bleeding and you just called 911 again, I'll be sitting there with you. Not, not, not physically, but in spirit. And millions of listeners to this call will be sitting right there with you, too. Thank you for the call, Sister. You can't control what other people say and think about you. All you can control is your next action and your choice to either swallow up and cover up with a big blanket of shame or to stand tall and walk right through that anxiousness. Thank you for the call, Sister. Call anytime and I'll be here for you. Go do the next right thing. When we come back, a woman asks how to cope with her son not wanting kids, which will ultimately end the family blind. Same thing every year. Every Christmas, we promise ourselves that we're going to slow down and focus on the right things. And then we sprint right into December. Shopping and parties and wrapping and travel expectations. And before we know it, we are exhausted. And the things that should matter most, like peace, connection, prayer, they all get shoved to the bottom of a long, endless to do list. We tell ourselves, next year, next year we're going to be different. And then we just do all of the same things all over again this year. Make it different. You can still choose peace. You can still choose rest. And that's why I want you to check out Hallow's Pray 25 challenge. Be still. It's guided by people you probably recognize, like Jonathan Roumie, Chris Pratt, Gwen Stefani and others who will walk with you through the Nativity story and and this is a story of real people facing chaos, fear and uncertainty and choosing peace. Hallow has thousands of prayers, meditations, and even original Christmas music to help you slow down, breathe and reconnect with what really matters. You deserve to find that peace this Christmas. So hit pause on the noise and be still with Hallow. Get three months of Hallow for free at hallow.com DeLoney and experience greater peace and stillness today. That's Hallow. H-A L L O W.com DeLoney this time of year we are giving our time, our money, and sometimes without meaning to giving away our personal data to everyone all over the place. That's why I recommend Delete me and listen. I like a good deal as much as the next guy. Just remember, every email, click or every newsletter sign up is another piece of your personal life that you're just hand to somebody else. If it's free, you are the product and they take your data and they sell it everywhere. They grab it, bundle it and give it away to other shady data brokers. This includes your name, your phone number, your address. It's all floating around out there in the digital wilderness. And this is how you end up with all those spam calls and weird text messages that makes it feel like somebody's always looking over your shoulder. Because they are. If you want to take back your privacy and your peace, you need delete me. They're like a digital cleaning crew. They go in to the Internet in the darkest parts of the Internet and they find your personal information and they get it removed and they keep it gone. Peace does not just come from turning off your notifications. It comes from knowing your data isn't for sale anymore. Right now you can get 20% off your annual delete me plan. When you go to join DeleteMe.com/Deloney go be safe in the digital world. That's JoinDeleteMe.com Deloney all right, we are back. Hey, take two seconds and hit the subscribe button if you're listening to this show on podcast. If you're watching the show on YouTube, take a second. Hit the subscribe button. Share this episode if you know somebody that one of these calls would help. Thank you so, so much. Let's go out to San Diego, California and talk to Rochelle. Hey Rochelle. What's up lady?

[D]

Hey, Dr. John. I'm so excited you decided to take my call.

[A]

I didn't decide anything. It's grandma Kelly decided. But shout out to Kelly. So what's Up.

[D]

Well, that last call about broke my heart. My family went down that road. My mom, my grandma dealt with that with my aunt and sister. Luckily, thank God, my son was able to escape the ADHD bipolar matrix that is my family. But now I'm kind of left with another issue that I'm struggling with with him, which is, you know, he's 29. Since he was about 16 years old, he's been saying that he's pretty sure he doesn't want to have kids.

[A]

How old is he now?

[D]

My. He's 29 now.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I was going to say he.

[A]

I said a lot of crazy stuff at 16.

[D]

Right. And that's what. And I think that's why I'm calling you. Because when I say this to other people, even my best friend who's an mft, they're like, well, you know, when people are young and this and that, and I'm like, this is my only sh. Right. Like, I'm my dad's only daughter. My sister wasn't able to have kids, mainly because of psych meds.

[A]

Hold on, you're only shot at. What?

[D]

My genetic material being passed on. I know that sound. Does that sound crazy?

[A]

No, I mean, it's, it's really, really existential, Right? It's very like.

[C]

Existential.

[A]

Yeah, it's really like, like it's not a 30,000 foot view, it's a hundred thousand foot view. Right.

[D]

I think about all of the humans since the dawn of time who had to survive this harsh world to get to my son. And he's just like, meh, okay, let.

[A]

Me, let me, let me challenge you.

[D]

Okay.

[A]

Is that cool?

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

What is staying up 100,000ft above the air? What is that protecting you from.

[D]

On a personal level? I don't know. I feel like I've tried to think this out. Like, what is my problem with this? Do I have an ego problem? Do I have a, you know, just missing out on, you know, I see my friends having grandkids and I feel like I've already grieved that part of it. Like, okay, I missed out on also having a wedding too. I missed out on a lot of things in life.

[A]

Okay. That's what I was aiming at. And again, I can be way out to lunch here.

[D]

I think that's the smart go too, but I feel like I've already kind of dealt with that.

[A]

What about your 29 year old son? If you could sit him down and just shake his shoulders for a second and, and hold his face and put your head on his Head like y' all touch foreheads. What about his life right now or over the past nine to 10 years? What about that, if you allowed yourself, would be heartbreaking and disappointing.

[D]

What about him as a, as how he's lived his life or his decision to not have children?

[A]

Him as like a young man growing into a middle aged man? What are you watching happen in real time over the last nine to 10 years since he's 20, that you think, oh, don't do it like that, don't do it like that.

[D]

I think it's been more like since he was 24. Tell me he got out of the Marine Corps.

[A]

Okay.

[D]

Which was the first thing that made me nervous because I know that he's not a generally and I wasn't either generally ambitious like person.

[A]

Okay, so he had a lot of structure, he got in shape, he started saying yes ma' am and no ma' am, and he like, you saw all that, what that benefited him. And then he drops that structure and.

[D]

And he waffled for a long time with jobs that exacerbated injuries that got from the Marine Corps. And then so he went and got like a VA rating, disability rating, and so he brings in income. But he's still at 29, kind of trying to figure out what's his next move he wants to use. He's very, he's one of these artsy, fartsy, creative, you know, people and he, he always was active all the way through high school and he was a band nerd and yada yada and martial arts and all that. And he's his longtime girlfriend who also. We all live communally here in San Diego because we'd either have roommates or we have each other as roommates because it's too expensive. He, him and his girlfriend live with us and he, they helped me take care of my dad and so on. But anyways, I've just noticed that like instead of going out and getting an actual job, he is trying to kind of like develop these ideas that have to do with art that aren't bringing in any money. But he does bring in to pay his portion of the household. His girlfriend works part time job, she's artist too.

[A]

Okay, hold on, let's, let's sit, let's sit in that. Okay, let's sit in that. Because I have to believe there's part of you that thinks a grandson would give him the structure that he used to have with the military that, that he doesn't have. There's gotta be, there's gotta be part of you that says I have a 30 year old man living in my house. And by the way, I'm considered artsy fartsy. Right. That's not. That's you two. That's not a bad thing. Several of the folks on my team are artsy farts like that. And we have to go pay bills. Right. There has to be part of you that is a 30 year old man who's. Who's, who's. You can say he's thinking about art and coming up with creative ideas. You can also say he's wasting his life.

[D]

Well, and I think that's another piece of it that you're hitting on is that neither one of them has a real sense of purpose. And I noticed this with the young people that I work with as well. There's not a huge sense of purpose. They're about consumption.

[A]

Okay, but listen, but listen. You can't control any of that.

[D]

You're gonna.

[A]

You're taking me back up in a hot air balloon to a hundred thousand feet. I want to stay in your living room. I'm gonna quote My friend, Dr. Henry Cloud. Okay. You know what your son desperately needs? Desperately problems. He needs the weight of a light bill and a rent payment, which he does have. Yeah. But it's. If he doesn't come up with it, he's not gonna be homeless. He lives with his mommy. He's 30.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

His girlfriend with a part time job.

[D]

I will say this that we've been discussing lately. My. My dad is ill. He's at the end of his life and once he's gone, I don't make all that much more money than my son does. If I'm being honest, I'm not a super high earner. I also was not career ambitious. So once my dad's gone, it will.

[C]

It.

[D]

We will be out on the street if he doesn't pull his weight, so.

[A]

I know, but do you hear what I'.

[D]

Yeah. For right now. He doesn't see it that way.

[A]

But you don't see it that way. You don't have a sustainable life either.

[D]

Not without. Yeah. Not without, you know, additional income. Yeah. If he. If he was gone tomorrow, I would have to get an extra job in perimenopause.

[A]

I know, but look at the. The existential crisis starts inside your own chest.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

Which is reality. That besides taking care of your dad, what's my purpose on this planet?

[D]

That's exactly it. And. And I have purpose through my job. I work in healthcare. But I also feel like when I. When I get up to that hundred thousand foot view is what I'm wondering is what was my purpose if my son never has children?

[A]

That's, that's, that's a distraction. You don't make a living wage. Let me say it that directly.

[D]

Well, I do in terms of you don't like because our house is paid down enough where I can handle it and all that, but it would just be like really tough for the next.

[A]

That's, that's what I mean. Here. That's what I mean.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

And so it's easy when inside our own chest we're asking ourselves, why am I here? What am I doing? I'm trading now, by the way, you're in a special situation because you're taking care of an aging, dying parent. That's, that's all. That's. Life goes on. Often goes on. Pause. The math problem of our life doesn't the bills have to be paid? We have to make a certain amount of money. Right. You know that. I know that.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But if you sit in this for a second, you have kids living with a parent and that parent is living with her parent and we are avoiding reality by living in one of the most beautiful places on planet Earth, which happens to also be one of the most expensive places on planet Earth, of.

[D]

Course, go hand in hand, which has.

[A]

A very unique vibe to it. Everyone I've ever met from San Diego, I, you know what? In all of COVID all that, I never heard one person say I've got to get out of San Diego ever. Oh, no, it's, it's its own universe.

[D]

They keep raking us over the coals.

[C]

With no, no, no, no more stuff. And we're like, we love it here.

[A]

But, but listen, you can't blame, you're not getting raked over the coals. It's a choice we're making to stay here.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

Okay, it's a trade off.

[A]

But you, I, I, it's easy when you feel that spin inside your chest. It. Let me, let me take it out of this because this is really personal. Let me come over to the person who is, has working a job. They work 16 hour days and they got passed over the third time for the promotion. The easiest thing to do is to blame the boss to start challenging the direction of the company. The leaders don't even know what they're doing here. The harder thing to do is to look in the mirror and say, a, I haven't done what it takes to get that promotion here and this is going to be my life or B, I'm legitimately being kicked to the margins for whatever reason. I'm a woman. I'm the wrong color. I'm fill in the blank. I have to go. But it's easy when you're sitting there going, what's my purpose? The moment that this, that my, My purpose right now is taking care of my aging father the moment he passed away.

[C]

Sure.

[A]

Everything gets real existential. And it's easy to look up and say, well, I'm really helping this artsy fartsy kid of mine, and why aren't you gonna carry this, this, this legacy on? And by the way, if you're. You're 30 year old, what, like, if he looks at his environment and his world, what. Why would he have a kid?

[D]

Yeah, because he doesn't want that. He's kind of nihilistic too, on top of it.

[A]

Of course he is. He's a good. He's a good ex marine. Like, they've seen it.

[D]

Yeah, they know.

[A]

You know what I mean?

[D]

And then, and then he's got the whole, like. I think he just doesn't want that level of obligation. He always said that if he had a wife who wanted kids, he would, he would do it.

[A]

Yeah, but that's him putting that off on somebody else too.

[D]

That's exactly what I think it is. And then in his current girlfriend, she also doesn't want children. She's got her own reasons for that that has to do with, you know, her own stuff.

[A]

But, but, but, like, why would they want anything in their life to change, right?

[D]

Because they can Uber eats and they can play video games and they can.

[B]

Do their art, and they are avoiding.

[A]

Reality, which is very similar to their mom. I'm only saying this because I love you.

[D]

Right, I know. I'm hearing it.

[A]

And so here's the deal. How old are you right now?

[D]

48.

[A]

Okay, 48. I'm gonna take every excuse away you have. Have you heard the story of my mom yet?

[D]

I don't think so.

[A]

Okay.

[D]

I know she's a teacher.

[A]

She was sort of. At 47, my mother took her first community college class. Her very first one.

[D]

You were sending me back to school, huh?

[A]

No, I'm just. I'm not doing that. I'm just. I'm just. I'm painting you a picture.

[C]

Okay?

[A]

This is a woman who grew up in a. In a tradition that said women should not go to College. So at 40, my dad was always encouraging her. The world is encouraging her financially. We could have used the money. At 47, she took her first class. I'm sorry, at 42, not 47. At 42, she took her first class at 57. She graduated with a PhD.

[D]

Yeah, that's wild. My sister got her nursing degree at 52.

[A]

Okay.

[D]

Bipolar disorder. So she's pretty amazing too. I, I see the examples for sure.

[A]

And she had this whole crazy second life and she's in her mid-70s and she retired, I think, a year and a half ago from being a professor. Here's why I tell you that. The question I want you to wrestle with is this. You are 48 years old. In seven years, you're going to be 55.

[D]

Right?

[A]

Do you want to be 55 and be a physician's assistant? Do you want to be 55 still wondering if you need to get a roommate?

[D]

All right.

[A]

Do you want to be 55 and still worried that your kid, your son, who's awesome and very creative and has proven to himself and the United States of America that he can like with, with good boundaries and good mentors and good accountability, be an amazing contributor?

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

What do you want for yourself at 55? And can you start reverse engineering that now? And yes, of course you want grandkids, of course you want your family line to continue and all those things, great. But going back to the dawn of time and projecting that all the way down to your son and making him carry the weight of the human, that is a great Xanax for avoiding what I hear in your chest, which is, I'm not on a sustainable path and I'm about to be 50. And so the change that has to happen is not with him, not with them. It's with you. It's with you. What do I want to. Who do I want to be when I'm 55? Do I want to visit San Diego because it's so amazing, but I want to live in a place where I can actually afford a house, where I don't have to have my 30 year old and his girlfriend with a part time job chipping in nickels every month so we can keep everything going? Do I want to have the courage to love my son enough to say, hey, it's time for you to, to go find your own place? So that's my challenge to you. And yes, be sad if he says it. You know, the genetic line stops with me. But I have to wonder when he gets out into the world and watches his mom say I'm making some changes, if he doesn't feel inspired to do the same. Maybe not. But what you're doing now isn't working. So what if we thought I'm going to shake the snow globe and say, at 55, I'm going to have my own house. I'm going to own my house outright, which means I'm going to buy a small house in an affordable area and I have a job serving and helping people and I'm going to take the skills I've learned at my, at my healthcare job and taking care of my, my aging dad. I'm going to help other people. Like whatever it is, I'm going to start right now so that at 55, at 53, at 52, I am running and gunning. And that may start with son, you got six months and then you got to get some problems and hopefully they don't include a video game controller. Thank you for the call, sister. Look in the mirror first on this one. You're pretty amazing, mom. But it's time to level up. Not just for him because you're worth it, too. We come back, a woman asks how to support her kids through a public child abuse trial. We'll be right back. All right. I travel all over the country and I've got social media clips all over the place. And if you've ever seen me out and about or on the Internets, you've for sure seen me wearing poncho shirts. I love wearing poncho shirts and right now it's cold outside and I can wear my super favorite poncho denims and flannels like the one I'm wearing right now. Poncho's performance denim has that soft broken in feel with a little bit of stretch like you've worn it a thousand times, but it still looks amazing. And poncho flannels come in original or western styles and they're guaranteed to be the softest shirts you own. Somehow they're both durable and comfortable. They're amazing. Poncho shirts come in slim or regular fit and they're built for real life. Whether you're outside doing work, you're outside fishing or hunting, or if you're on stage, they hold up to whatever life throws at you. When you're shopping for the men and the boys in your life this holiday season, go to poncho outdoors.com DeLoney you can sign up with your email and you'll get 10 bucks off your first order. I want you to tell them that you heard about Poncho right here on this show. And if you take a picture of yourself on social media, tag me and tag Poncho. Hurry and place Your order now to get free shipping before the holidays. That's poncho outdoors.com/deloney. All right, San Antonio, Texas. Let's talk to dear Marie. What's up, Marie?

[C]

Hi, Dr. John. How are you?

[A]

Phenomenal. How are you?

[C]

I am doing really well. I'm really excited to talk to you.

[A]

Excellent. What's up?

[C]

So, well, first of all, I want to say I've been listening for about three years to every episode. I've read all your books, and I find myself very regularly with my kids saying things that I affectionately call deloneyisms. And they look at me and go, mom, did Dr. John say that?

[A]

Well, good. There's. There's many people in my life that are like, I probably shouldn't say that because that's what John said. So I'm glad you're picking up the good stuff. That's good.

[C]

So my question is, let me give you. I'll just give you a little bit of background and then, and then you can, you can give me all the wisdom, I hope. I have five kids. They, they range in age from 20 to 5. So we're in all these extracurricular things all the time, all over the place.

[A]

20 and 5, that's quite the range. It is.

[C]

I was potty training and teaching a kid how to drive at the same time.

[A]

At the same time. Very good.

[C]

At the same time. Sometimes quite literally. So anyway, we have quite a large circle of families that we know who are in similar activities. And one of these families we found out about three weeks ago lost one of their sons. And so our whole community just kind of began to rally around them and provide meals and all that sort of thing. And then about a week after that, my phone blew up one afternoon asking, have you seen? Have you seen? Have you seen? And when I looked at the news, it turned out that this family, both of the parents, had been arrested and charged with capital murder in their son's death.

[A]

Oh, gosh. And these are friends of yours or in your circle?

[C]

They're kind of in my circle. It was kind of a, hey, how are you? How is your week? Sort of relationship.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But my, my kids are in a lot of the same activities, and they, they would consider some of these children from this other family their friends. Yeah. And, you know, I know the news doesn't report the whole story, and I know who knows what, like, it's still under investigation, but what's being reported is horrific.

[A]

Sure. And they don't, by the way, they don't make capital murder charges lightly.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Or a DA is not going to want to lose that case. So if they're putting that on the table, then they've probably got something. Right.

[C]

Yeah. And the news is reporting that their other children have confirmed the abuse and said, yeah, this is what I saw. This is what happened in my house.

[A]

God, I'm so sorry.

[C]

But needless to say, this has sort of blown up my whole community. And most of the parents are kind of reacting with this, like, oh, my gosh, how did we let these people around our kids? How did we not know this was happening? And, you know, just a lot of fear and a lot of anxiety. And so as I'm the leader of one of these activities and one of their kids is in my group, and I've just found out this week, actually, that the foster family that has these kids going to try to start bringing them back into some of their activities. And, and which means that one of these children in this family is going to be in my class this week, and my son's in the same class as well. And so, so I'm kind of, I, I'm wondering two things. First of all, how can I help my kids navigate this? I want to, I don't want to teach them to ignore it and pretend everything's fine. I don't want to teach, I want, I want to teach them, how do you support your friend in the middle of like, literally their whole lives blowing up in a sensitive and appropriate way? And then also, what I'm trying to get some wisdom on what do these kids need from me? I'm, I know I'm not their counselor, I'm not the social worker, but I am an adult who cares.

[D]

Right.

[C]

And I don't, I don't want to have them come in and out of my life every week and just pretend nothing's wrong.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And I also don't want to overstep.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And so I would love your wisdom on how to handle.

[A]

Those are great questions.

[C]

Yeah. It's tough.

[A]

Thank you for loving your community. It's pretty cool.

[C]

It's really, it's made me really angry at times how, how many people are just reacting out of fear and anger and not even considering these, these kids whose lives have just blown up like. So I, I, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to, I was just going to say, I just keep thinking, like, at this point it doesn't really matter. I mean, it matters, but it doesn't matter if these parents are convicted or exonerated, these kids lives are forever changed.

[A]

They're not. They're.

[C]

Let me put traumatic.

[A]

Their lives are destroyed. I'll say it.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

They're destroyed.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Either there is a complete and utter unbelievable. Miscommunication and the family's gonna have to leave the community to restore any sort of. What it. Right. I mean, it's. It's either either these accusations are so wild and so public and all that, or what's more likely is that these are true stories.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And I have come to the. The place I spent my whole life with people behind closed doors. You're wise to know I don't actually know what happened. And that's. That's a wise thing to hold because it's easy to make up stories about things that we get partial bits of information and run with it. Right. So it's wise to just say, you know what? I'm not there. I'm not looking at the files. I don't know. I'm never gonna fully know. But I've. I've come to a place where I give people a ton of grace with their initial responses. Because this type of atrocity and this type of evil, if true, causes all of our parental, our personal, our childhood, our. We look at our own kit. Right. It just brings into light how fragile everything is, including the lives of our kids that we send into the grocery store to grab some coke for us, or that we send to school, or that we send to the Boy Scout camp or the baseball coach. You know, it just calls into question everything.

[C]

Right, Right.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

And so if. If. If you are thrown into that chaos, it exists all the time, but it takes moments like these for us to, as parents, to, like, catch that sharp inhale of breath, like, oh, that could have been my kid.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Or the scarier question, it couldn't have been your kids because you would never do that, but could have been your kid going to their house.

[C]

Right.

[A]

Right. And so if somebody reacts to that with fear, with anger, with rage, with it, like, I can't control their innate trauma responses. I can't control. I don't know what they experienced in childhood. I'm not going to spend any energy on trying to police how other people are responding to wild situations. All I can control is what I'm going to do next.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm going to age appropriately, talk to my kids. And by the way, kids hear a ton of things.

[C]

Yes, I know. That's one of the things that I've. I've been kind of thinking about is like, when I get back in this room with a bunch of 9 to 12 year olds, they will have all have a variety of different things that they've heard, that they've seen on the news that they've heard mom and dad talk about. And they're all going to be coming in with their own stories.

[A]

Right. And so sometimes, sometimes you can get a group of 9 and 12 year olds and say, hey, y' all may have heard a whole bunch of stories about everybody in this room. And when you come here in this room, we are all going to be kind to each other and we're all going to like, you can address some of that up front. You might not be able to in this case. It might be that the first time this kid shows up is when everybody's showing up and they're going to all take their cue from you.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And so you're right, you're not going to ever be a therapist. You might be a therapist, I don't know what your profession is, but you're not going to be this kid's therapist. You're not going to be this kid's foster parent. You are going to be one example of a safe, regulated adult. Every kid will take their cue from you. If when every kid individually walks in, you look at them and you put their. Your hands on either side of their face and you say, I'm so glad you're here. And when that boy walks in the door or that girl walks in the door, you do the exact same thing with them.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

They will take your cue for if you single that kid out, they're gonna know, okay, singled out. But if you let every one of those little kids know, I'm so glad you're here. That hug or that. Whatever's appropriate touchwise, I don't know what organization you're part of or your relationship with these kids, but whatever. The most welcoming presence you can provide that kid, that's the greatest gift that kid needs right now. And not, hey, you want to talk? Nope. That's for the therapist. That's for the foster kids. That's for that system. But when you come in this place, you're gonna feel that I see you, and then I'm glad you're here. And the other kids are gonna pick up that ethos, too. And if some kid, you hear him talking and asking, you're gonna call out in front of everybody, hey, we're not gonna talk about other people's parents today. We're here to learn basket weaving. We're here to learn how to fix a car engine. I don't know what y' all are doing, but, like, we're here to be with each other and you're gonna quickly put an end to it without any fanfare or without any drama, whatever. What the kid needs more than anything is for a minute, a reprieve from the ash that is their life.

[C]

Yeah, that makes sense.

[A]

And then I would. If I were. If I were in your exact same shoes, I would find, whether it's 30 minutes, whether it's in bed when you're talking your kids in, whether it's. You can. I mean, you've got 500 kids, and so it might be hard, but if you can escape for a breakfast over the next couple of weeks, I would be pretty direct with my kids. All right, tell me what you know about little Billy's situation. And I always put that on the table and I let them respond with what they know.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

Or what they're going to ask.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

I did the same thing with both of my kids. With Charlie Kirk's passing recently, I took my 15 year old out and said, all right, tell me what you. What you've heard. And I think him. And I did it in the car. And I said, are your friends talking about it? And he goes, yeah, dad, it's everywhere. And so I gave some. Hey, I'm going to really ask you to not do X, Y and Z. And I want to hear what questions do you got? Tell me what you're thinking. And then I explained to him, here's what I'm feeling. I'm a public figure, too. Like, I. Like, here's what I'm feeling. I did the same thing with my daughter. She had no idea what I was talking about.

[D]

Right.

[A]

And she's out. She's. She's early elementary. And so. But I. But I'm gonna put on the table and then I'm going to gauge my response age appropriately to what my kid knows, what questions they have. And then I'm going to give them a human response, which is, I want you to know that your parent has feelings, too.

[C]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know that my kids know too much at this point. We don't watch the news at my house.

[A]

Yeah. But I mean, they're going to get the gossip from.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

From, you know, what's going on at school and whatever. And that can be a great moment to say none of us really know at all what really happened. What we do know is your friend little Billy needs somebody to be nice to him. And in our family, we look for people to be Extra nice to. And so you're. One of your jobs in the next few months is to be really nice to little Billy. And it can be that simple. But it's letting them know I know I'm in control of my emotions and I'm gonna. Here's the actions that we as a family, this is who we are. This is the actions that we take.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And if somebody wants to show you something on their smartphone or if somebody wants to talk about it, it's a good idea to just to say, hey, I don't want to talk about that right now. Which, let's be honest, the sixth grader is not going to do that. But they're going to have your voice rattling around their heart and mind.

[C]

Yeah, that's true. That's true.

[A]

But the greatest gift of that kid, because that kid the whole ride over is going to want to know, is this place a safe place for me? And the regulated adult of in the room is the one that sets the tone.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And the question is, can you make that kid feel just for a minute, seen and known and safe? And that's an honorable, honorable thing. So I'll tell you, Marie, thank you for being that, that, that mom, that community member, that person who loves and cares. And when the adults in your world start spin up the conversation, you can just have the courage to say, ah. At this point, I don't talk about it. I'm gonna focus on those five kids that are hurting right now. I'm. Let the justice, like the criminal justice system do its thing. And I, I don't know, none of us are ever gonna know. And that makes you not cool. That's gonna be the parent that you don't get invited to the gossip rings. And so be it. So be it. Thank you for the call, sister. I'm honored to get to talk to you today. We'll be right back. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. The holidays are here, and they are a time of traditions. Some of them great, some of them not so great. And the holidays can be a busy, stressful, and for many of us, even a lonely season. And that's why it's a great time to reflect on what some of those traditions really mean to us. The good ones and the tough ones. And if you find yourself in a tough season, therapy can give you space to create new traditions and most importantly, take time to heal for yourself. To do that, I recommend better help with over 30,000 therapists. They're the largest online therapy provider in the world. And they've served over 5 million people globally with an average rating of 4.9 out of 5 stars. Plus, BetterHelp is totally online so it's easy to fit into your busy holiday schedule. You can even step out of your in laws house and get with better help in the garage to get started. Just answer a few simple questions and they'll connect you with a licensed therapist who will fit your needs. And if it's not the right fit, you can change therapists at any time for no extra cost. This month, start a new tradition by taking care of you. Visit betterhelp.com DeLoney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H-E-L-P.com DeLoney all right, what's up Grandma Kelly? What's something cool that happened?

[E]

I love that nickname. It makes me feel really good.

[A]

By the way, well, your name used to be Mena.

[B]

Mena Pause.

[A]

It's cool. Go ahead, go ahead. Wow. I thought you like Grandma Kelly better. All right, go for it. Okay.

[E]

There's a whole group of women out.

[A]

There that just cussed you. I hope you know.

[E]

All right. Krista from Carlsbad, California writes. As the head of our company's HR department, I lead monthly lunch and learn sessions. Last month's session was based around getting to know your co workers. The workplace edition of Questions for Humans were the perfect tool. I set it up as a speed dating style that allowed everyone the opportunity to learn new things about each other. For 45 minutes I witnessed such such joy, laughter and curiosity that build new connections. After the lunch and learn, several people came by to tell me how great it was and how easy it was to pause, work and enjoy the moment. So thank you for creating Questions for Humans.

[A]

Awesome. Very cool. I love that people send those stories in from all over the place that those cards are great tools for parents and kids and for relationships. By the way, they are we when this show's coming out, are we at Black Friday is or something?

[E]

We just passed Black Friday.

[A]

Just pla. Just passed.

[E]

It just passed.

[A]

Okay, so if you're interested in Questions for Humans, all the decks, there's all different kinds. Dating, romance, intimacy, blah blah blah. They're all as low priced, as low as they're going to be all year. So go check them out. There'll be a link in the show notes but go check them out. Awesome. Thanks for sharing that, Kelly. And you look younger and more beautiful every day. Thank you. It's so hard for you to accept any kind of kindness it makes because it's.

[E]

It's hard for me to believe. It's honest.

[A]

Well, we think you're younger and more beautiful every day. All the guys in there, we. They're all nodding.

[E]

All the voices in your head.

[A]

Love you guys. Bye.