Draft Show: Finding the Perfect Fit

Summary

---

The Draft Show: “Finding the Perfect Fit”

DallasCowboys.com Draft Show – April 8, 2025
Hosts: Kyle Youmans, Bryan Broaddus, Nick Harris, Tommy Yarish, Voch Lombardi
Producer: Jasmine Marshall

---

Overview

In this episode, the Draft Show crew is just over two weeks away from the 2025 NFL Draft, breaking down the aftermath of the Dallas Cowboys’ 30 pre-draft visits and strategizing how those meetings inform the team’s intentions. The panel analyzes prospects who fit best outside of Round 1, discusses positional priorities (with particular focus on running backs, safeties, and corners), and identifies underrated players and sleeper “perfect fits” for the Cowboys on Days 2 and 3. Lively debates, scouting reports, and memorable moments abound as the crew balances draft philosophy with targeted Cowboys needs.

---

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Significance of the 30 Pre-Draft Visits

• Bryan Broaddus underscores how these visits are a crucial chance for front office brass (Jerry and Stephen Jones) to get to know prospects on a deeper level beyond the Combine. These are fact-finding missions for personality, fit, and on-field acumen.

  • Quote: “The 30 visits are the opportunity for Jerry and Steven to kind of sit down with kids and have a little bit of an understanding of maybe what makes them tick.” (01:32)

• The visits aren’t always a direct draft indicator, but they signal strong interest, especially in multi-positional prospects or those with special traits.

  • Tommy Yarish: “30 visits are… not always necessarily an indicator of interest. They obviously can't pick all 30 guys, so that's something to remember.” (06:01)

• Discussion on the flexibility these visits allow—putting prospects on the whiteboard, getting them around core players like Dak Prescott, and gauging intelligence and fit.

---

2. 30 Visit List & Position Priorities

Main Reported 30 Visit Names:

• Ohio State: TreVeyon Henderson (RB), Emeka Egbuka (WR), Quinshon Judkins (RB)
• Texas: Kelvin Banks (OL), Alfred Collins (DT), Safety Andrew Mukuba
• Others: Walter Nolan (Ole Miss, DT), Shamar Stewart (Texas A&M, DE), James Pierce Jr. (Tennessee, DE), Luther Burden III (Missouri, WR), Savon Revel (East Carolina, CB), Jonah Sava (Arizona, OL), Tet McMillan (Arizona, WR), Omarion Hampton (UNC, RB) (03:03)

Notable Interpretations:

• Heavy focus on RBs, WRs, and corners in early rounds; safety (Andrew Mukuba) gets unique attention as the "blinking light" due to the otherwise light focus on the position in reported visits.

  • Voch Lombardi: “That, that means we're in the running back business, we're in the wire receiver business, but they may not be in the safety business, but they're in the Andrew Mukuba business.” (05:31)

• Consensus: Dallas must address running back (likely by Round 3), with strong consideration for wide receiver and cornerback needs, but flexibility depending on how the draft board falls.

---

3. Deep Dive: Safety Andrew Mukuba

• Pros/Cons Debated:

  • Strong coverage skills, football IQ, but undersized (6’0”, 186) and tackling questions (13 missed tackles in 2024 per PFF, largely due to aggressiveness).
  • Is he a “full-time nickel,” or flexible safety/rover type best used floating in coverage?
  • Broaddus: “I think he's a second round player regardless of where you play him. I don't see any real, real weakness to his game.” (06:31)
  • Youmans: “Coverage, change of direction, football IQ…all of that stuff jumps off the page.” (07:27)

• Draft Range:

  • Panel consensus is that if you want Mukuba, #44 (Dallas’s Round 2 pick) is the spot; he won’t last to Round 3. (07:12)

• Comparative Value:

  • Discussion centers on whether a playmaking safety is a rarer “difference maker” compared to second-tier RB options available later.

---

4. Running Back Strategy and Dilemmas

• Dallas is “painted in a corner”—they must address RB by Round 3 due to current depth and need for a featured back (Rico Dowdle not comparable).

  • Broaddus: “I think Dallas has kind of painted themselves in a corner here. So for running back, and I think they have to do it by the time the third round hits.” (12:22)

• If Top RBs Go Early:

  • What if Hampton, Henderson, and Johnson are all first-rounders? Do you reach at 44? Wait for Day 3?
  • Harris suggests: “Don’t be surprised if we get to day three and a running back hasn’t been picked yet.” (14:52)

• A few “sleeper” RB names for later rounds: Jonathon Brooks, Kyle Manungai (Rutgers), Jarquez Hunter.

---

5. Cornerback: Savon Revel Jr. (ECU)

• Physically gifted (size/speed), ball skills, versatility, but only one year of starting experience and coming off an ACL tear.

  • Harris: “Physically gifted… most physically gifted defensive back in this class. He can play inside, outside… plays to his size, got ball skills, can return pick-sixes.” (16:35)

• Cowboys have medical edge (Dr. Dan Cooper did his surgery). Potential for great value if healthy, but question if he can contribute immediately.

  • Broaddus: “My first round corners, they've all got questions… but every one of them are damn good football players. And [Revel and company], when you watch their tape, they make plays.” (20:47)

---

6. Panel’s Most Underrated Draft Prospects (27:05–41:02)

Highlights from “Twitter on the 20” segment.

RJ Harvey, RB, UCF

• Voch Lombardi & Bryan Broaddus: Productive, strong runner, not enough round two talk, concerns about age (will be 25 as a rookie), but “just get a playmaker and run with it.” (27:09, 28:31)

Tommy Oladejo, EDGE/LB, UCLA

• Tommy Yarish: Hybrid edge with untapped potential, versatile, twitchy, improved production late. Only started at EDGE recently, developmental but big upside. (29:20)

Lan Larison, RB, UC Davis

• Nick Harris: Small school standout with ridiculous production, receiving ability, tested as elite athlete at combine, “major sleeper.” (34:55)

Caleb Rogers, OL, Texas Tech

• Nick Harris: Versatile, high motor, can play 4/5 OL spots, “Senior Bowl guy”, beloved by Tech staff. (34:03)

Trevor Etienne, RB, Georgia

• Broaddus: Elusive, explosive, natural hands, good vision & blitz pickup, not the biggest but highly effective. (37:37)

Johnny Walker Jr., Edge, Missouri

• Kyle Youmans: Shrine Bowl standout, productive late season, versatile pass-rusher, “tweener,” good upper-body strength, Day 3 target. (39:28)

---

7. Perfect Fits for the Cowboys (Outside Round 1) (48:47–62:17)

The panel discusses ideal later-round Cowboys fits, with an emphasis on realistic team needs and overlooked gems.

RB Kyle Manungai (Rutgers)

• Scouting profile by Harris: “Downhill guy, great pass protection, zero fumbles in 669 carries, lacks speed/explosiveness but a ‘dog’ who’ll grind.” (50:47)

CB Maxwell Hairston (Kentucky)

• Harris: True nickel/versatile, Day 1 starter, can bridge Diggs’ injury, “best fit in class.” (52:41)

RB Bashaw Tootin (Virginia Tech)

• Harris, Voch: Undersized bowling ball, home run speed, tons of breakaway runs, main issue is ball security (8 fumbles in 2 years). (53:47)

WR Trey Harris (Ole Miss)

• Tommy: If McMillan (Arizona) is gone, Harris is the “second-best X, go up and get it guy,” excellent 50/50 balls, good size, strong hands, not a burner but fills a need. (55:21)

LB/EDGE Teddy Buchanan (Cal)

• Broaddus: Long, physical, twitched-up, strong blitzer, can drop, high finisher, “big-time athlete.” (56:54)

LB Carson Schwesinger (UCLA)

• Voch: “Does it all… sideline to sideline, strong diagnostic ability, reminiscent of Sean Lee. Size is NFL-ready at 242 lbs.” (58:15)

  • Nick notes: “Cowboys’ LB coach worked him out individually at his pro day. Second-round target.” (59:35)

CB Trey Amos (Second Round)

• Youmans: Big, physical, plug-and-play outside CB, would stabilize immediate need. (62:17)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Broaddus on Jerry Jones during 30 visits:
  “One of my favorite things is when these kids get pictures with Jerry in his office… whether they get selected here or not, it’s something they’ll always remember.” (01:32)

• Voch on RB urgency:
  “That means we're in the running back business, we're in the wide receiver business, but they may not be in the safety business, but they're in the Andrew Mukuba business. What that mean?” (05:31)

• Yarish on flexibility with RB picks:
  “30 visits are…not always necessarily an indicator of interest. They obviously can’t pick all 30 guys, so that’s something to remember.” (06:01)

• Harris on running backs in the later rounds:
  “Don't be surprised if we get to day three and a running back hasn't been picked yet.” (14:52)

• Broaddus, on Savon Revel’s athleticism & readiness:
  “My first round corners, they've all got questions… but every one of them are damn good football players… when you watch their tape, they make plays.” (20:47)

• Voch (on LB Schwesinger):
  “I want that [diagnostic ability] back in Dallas, so bad… as a sideline to sideline guy, covering guy backwards, downhill tackler, blitzing, sometimes get some sacks.” (58:24)

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Start & 30 Visit Recap: 00:34–03:58
• Running Back/Position Debates: 03:58–16:05
• Savon Revel/Corner Analysis: 16:05–21:43
• Most Underrated Prospects (Twitter on 20): 27:05–41:02
• Perfect Fits for the Cowboys (Round 2/3 focus): 48:47–62:17

---

Podcast Tone

• Conversational and energetic with friendly jabs, deep scouting analysis, and candid panel disagreements. The panel maintains fan-centric focus while offering insight on team-building logic, draft philosophy, and on-the-ground prospect evaluations.

---

Final Takeaways

• The Cowboys are casting a wide net on early-impact skill positions but must thread the needle between urgent needs (RB, CB) and draft value.
• Flexibility and depth in scouting pays off, especially with overlooked or medically risky prospects like Revel, Mukuba, and RB/WR sleepers.
• The panel is collectively bullish on the quality of Day 2/3 options at key positions—so long as the team is decisive and prepared to pivot as the board falls.

---

For deeper player-by-player breakdowns or specific timestamps, see headings above.

Transcript

[A]

Lowe's knows Sundays are for football, so tackle your home improvement projects by Saturday.

[B]

And earn your Sunday with great deals.

[A]

On LG and Bosch appliances, Select Bounty and Swiffer cleaning products and more. Then once your to do list is.

[B]

Done, get ready to kick back, relax and enjoy the game.

[A]

Shop in store or online now and earn your Sunday with help from Lowe's, official partner of the NFL. This is the Dallas Cowboys.com draft show.

[B]

Your war room for insider news and.

[A]

Draft analysis from deep within the confines of Cowboys headquarters at the Star and Frisco. And now your host, Kyle Yeomans. Today is Tuesday, April 8, 2025, and we are 16 days away from the NFL Draft in Green Bay, Wisconsin. Welcome into the Draft show presented by Miller Light, the only beer of the Dallas Cowboys. It's Miller Time alongside Nick Harris, Brian Broaddus, Tommy Yarish, Voch Lombardi with Jasmine Marshall running everything in the back. I'm Kyle Yeomans. Glad you're with us. All right, gentlemen, we're just over two weeks out. 30 visits are now in the rearview mirror. There's been a lot of reported names kind of circling around Cowboys camp and who they've been talking to. Brian, let's get right into it. What does the, the list and some of the names mean to you?

[C]

Well, you know, the, the 30 visits are always important because this is really the first opportunity for Jerry and Stephen. They do go to the combine. They do see the workouts they do are a part of all that, but they're not part of all the interviews and stuff like that. So the 30 visits are the opportunity for Jerry and Steven to kind of sit down kids and have a little bit of an understanding of maybe what makes them tick. One of my favorite things is when these kids get pictures with Jerry in his office. I think that's the neatest thing in the world. And whether they get selected here or not, it's something they'll always remember. Just having a few moments with him is always something kind of fun. But yeah, it's a good opportunity. And then it also allows them to kind of maybe go into a little more in depth. You know, at the combine, you have a limited amount of time that you could talk to these people and maybe you want to put them on the board, maybe you want to put them in a group setting, maybe you want to have some of your own players meet with them, with Dak Prescott and others to come over and say hello and get an opportunity. So it's still about fact finding and it's just done More on a personal level. And so those things are always important because when you, when it comes down to it, the familiarity that Jerry and Steven have with these players, I think goes a long way to seeing who gets drafted.

[A]

What do you think, Nick, just based off of the names that you've seen out there?

[D]

Yeah, we can run through the names. Just.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

Quick. 15 of the 30 have been reported. We can go with Ohio State running back Trayvon Henderson, Ohio State receiver Mecca Igbuka, Ohio State running back Quinshawn Judkins, Texas offensive lineman Kelvin Banks, Texas defensive tackle Alfred Collins, Texas Safety Andrew Makuba vs. Virginia Tech Running back Michelle Tutton, Ole Miss defensive tackle Walter Nolan, Texas A and M defensive end Shamar Stewart, Tennessee defensive end James Pierce Jr. Missouri wide receiver Luther Burden III. East Carolina corner Savon Revel, which I've learned.

[A]

Savon.

[D]

Savon. Courtesy of Tommy across from me, it's Savon. Very, very strange. Arizona offensive line and Jonah Sava, NAIA Arizona wide receiver Tet McMillan and North Carolina running back Omarion Hampton. But yeah, from the names, I mean, you're looking at the Cowboys taking a look at multiple different positions in these first couple of rounds. Like all of those guys that I mentioned are guys you would take on either day one or day two.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

And the majority are first round type options. I mean, you look at, you look at Shemar Stewart. I mean, I don't think that's going to be a guy that's there at 44. You look at a Marion Hampton, that's probably not a guy that's there at 44. Ashton Jensey was one of the Dallas day guys that they brought in. That's not going to be a guy that's there at 44. And then there's a lot of second round options. You know, Trayvon Henderson is a Mecha Ibuka going to slide. You know, is that a guy you would hope would be there? Tutton is going to be there in round two or round three. Savon Revel, that's another guy we've talked a lot about. They're keeping their options open as far as position groups on these first two days. And I think they're just going to kind of pick how the board falls. And you know, Schottenheimer talked about it at league meetings last week in Florida. He's like, we are trying to set up, set ourselves up in a position where we can take the best player available. And you know, they're looking at multiple different position groups. And you know, that would make sense to a certain extent. Because I think on the first two days, they have to come away with a receiver in a corner nevertheless, but the board might fall that way.

[B]

But I'll say this, though, right? What about that safety? Like, that's that one blinking light that's just on there. Like, we've been talking about running backs for months, wide receivers. One takes linebacker. You know what that one safety mean? What's he doing there?

[C]

And is there other safeties what Andrew Macuba doing? And is there other safeties that we don't know about that they're potentially looking at, too? Maybe some guys that they brought in was like, what, 15 other names potentially that they could have brought in then, and maybe there's other safeties there. I think it's a fascinating question having.

[B]

Having five running backs mean. All right, y'. All, we in a running back business.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Whether it's early or whether they were last year, too. Yeah, they loved a lot of us.

[D]

Nick, you ain't. They did.

[B]

But look, that, that, that means we're in the running back business, we're in the wire receiver business, but they may not be in the safety business, but they're in the Andrew Macuba business. What that mean? So now. So now I just want to ask. Sure, Tommy. Now I want to ask where you take this guy? We have a general idea about where all these guys go, but when I see Mox, I see nonsense like have him in the third. He's, he's, he's, he's safety one for me. The Cowboys ain't got to believe what I believe, but he could go 44, he could go third or something like that. Where does he go, Tommy?

[E]

So two things. One, you know, 30 visits are. Just to clarify, it's not always necessarily an indicator of interest. Right. It's. It's a lot of guys that there are interest in, but not necessarily. They obviously can't pick all 30 guys, so that's something to remember. But you do bring up a good point because Makuba is an interesting one. My question to the group would be, would you play Makuba at nickel?

[A]

Yeah, that's.

[D]

That's something I wanted to bring up, too.

[A]

I would really think about it because.

[E]

If that's the case, then I think you make a case for him in the second round. I think he's got the coverability to play nickel.

[C]

I think he's a second round player regardless of where you play him. I don't see any. I don't see any real, real weakness to his game. People talk about he's 6 foot. He's 186. But I'm watching. I'm watching some tape the other night, and he happens to show up. I'm watching A and M or something. I'm watching somebody, and he just keeps showing up, showing up, showing up. Then you watch the playoff games. He's showing up, showing up, showing up. So, you know, to me, I think. Yeah, I think. Me personally, I think you have to take him at 44 if you want this player. You have to. I don't think he gets to you in the third round. I mean, and there's some good safeties on the. On the board, but you look at all the things that he can do, and we all know that. Yeah, you talk about.

[E]

If you're.

[C]

If you're Talking about playing McNickel, you tell me right there, you think he can cover. You think that he's one of the best guys when it comes to carrying routes all over the field. You know, if you think that you got to take this guy at 44, I agree. If that's the case.

[A]

And I think he's great in coverage, too. When you look at his ability and his strong suits, coverage, change of direction, football iq, all of that stuff jumps off the page. It's really the size and it's the tackling that I kind of had a little bit of a question mark over. I think the tackling was mostly just missed tackles at times when he was trying to be over aggressive. Pff. Had him logged as 13 missed tackles this past year, which. That's a significant number. But you're trying to play downhill and you're trying to do too much. I think moving him to nickel will be fine. I think it would be fine. I think he'd be fine as a safety as well.

[D]

He's not the longest in the world. I mean, his wingspan is more. So in the negative catego, he is an undersized safety, quote, unquote. It would make sense. I would like to see. I would like to see the idea of him getting brought up to a. To a nickel position.

[A]

Yeah.

[E]

I think for tackling concerns, go watch the Michigan tape.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay. I saw him against Georgia, Arkansas, where he really struggled.

[E]

Against Arkansas, he does miss, but it's because in terms of tackling flying at you because he wants to take your head off.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

And if that's what we got, I'm okay with.

[A]

You're fine with that?

[E]

I'm good with that.

[A]

Do you kind of have that in Donovan Wilson already?

[E]

You do, you do. But if we're talking about playing, you have that covered.

[C]

Donovan Wilson covered.

[A]

I'm saying the downhill same player we're talking about.

[E]

If we're talking about recover at nickel, then, then that's fine.

[A]

What's wrong with Jacksonville?

[B]

Ain't nothing wrong with Jacksonville, just. Just not here. Not him. Hell, he can go to Indianapolis, wherever you want to go. But I think if Andrew McCuba's on his team, I don't know if I share the idea with the table that he's a possible nickel guy. I don't know if I would like him at full time. I think he'll be a cool sometimes nickel. I like when he's just floating around, just looking, looking for nonsense and the ball just kind of floats to him. I think that's kind of where he's at his best now. Sure. If you want to put him in there to kind of, you know, because he's not the biggest guy in the world, you want to put him in nickel to kind of help him out a little bit. I mean, that's cool. But just when he was floating and roaming and just doing all types of different things, that's when I liked him the best. He get picks down and he gets picks back. You know what I'm saying? He's a pick getting guy, so I wouldn't want to just leave him there to my Donovan Wilson point. Look, man shouts out Donovan Wilson, man, you know, he's got fans. I'm a fan of him also. But if there was a glaring wart in his game, it'll be coverage. So I would have to wonder, we got new DC up in here, brand new staff up in here. I wonder if they looked at that and said, hey, and if Andrew Makuba is here, if you had to pick between who's the better safety guy, I think they would probably pick Makuba. But we got dudes on this team that I think cover better.

[E]

I would, real quick. I would argue that playing Makuba at nickel would give him a chance to cover more of the field, I think, than if you put him at safety.

[B]

Sure, it could.

[E]

And that would be in terms of taking the ball away and flying all over the place. I think that would be a better spot for kind of like how he's sort of lined up there.

[A]

Sure.

[E]

In that clip.

[C]

Yeah, no, no problem. If you're going to draft a nickel, just draft Harrison. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I mean, if you're, if you're, if you're going into this with the Plan of spending a pick on a nickel in 44. And I understand what you're saying about the safety, and I agree. I mean, I think this kid's a hell of a player. I think. You know, I was asked on Twitter this morning, like, the value of the most undervalued player, and I was thinking about him, and I was thinking about my. My LSU tight end Mason Taylor.

[A]

Taylor.

[C]

I was thinking about those two guys. I mean, you don't nearly hear enough about both those guys. And Makuba might be the most undervalued if you had to. If you had a Nick Makuba, say Amos or Henderson.

[A]

Ole miss at 44.

[D]

Yeah, I go Henderson.

[C]

Is it just because of the absolute need at running back?

[D]

No, Henderson's my RB2. I think I can play all three downs. He's going to be a captain for you. He's going to play a long time, and he's still relatively low on mileage. I'm a big Henderson guy.

[C]

You guys, I would put.

[E]

What did you do at 12?

[A]

Yeah, that's a good question.

[C]

You took. Well, I took the wide receiver out of it.

[A]

Okay.

[E]

Okay.

[C]

So I gave you. I gave you. I gave you Makuba, I gave you Amos, the corner from Ole Miss, and I gave you the running back from Ohio State.

[E]

Yeah, take Henderson, too.

[B]

I'm taking the safety in that situation. I think. I think safety is rare, and I think safeties that get picks can be rare, and I think he has a really good feel to get picks. I think when you find a dude that can get. Now, there's a ton of running backs here, and Nick Harris put it on my mind a long time ago. Like, hey, man, some running backs in the third, fourth, fifth and sixth year. Like, and. And when he said that, we just started watching film and I'm with him. There's a ton of running backs here, but I think when you have a safety that can really change what defense looks like, like that. I'm going with the safety. Plus, just on my board, I just got him the highest.

[A]

I have Amos as the. Out of those three, but it's not by much. They're all in the same area.

[C]

Okay. The question now, I want to ask you guys then about that running back. Do you think Dallas, with no. 4 right now, is. They. They can't go day three to get a running back. I agree. They have to have a running back in the first three rounds. Now, you say that.

[B]

They say that last year. Now they.

[C]

No, no, no, no, no.

[B]

We.

[C]

We learned our lesson. Here we learned our lesson here. We. We have no other comparison. We can't use Rico Dowdle as. Oh, he's not as good as Rico Dowdle. You know, that's the thing. To me, I think Dallas has kind of painted themselves in a corner here. So for running back, and I think they have to do it by the time the third round hits.

[A]

You don't think they would try to do that with a guy like Williams or Sanders. The guys that are in the building. If they can do that for Rico Dowdle, they could definitely say that for.

[C]

If they do that, then. If they do that, then, man, I don't. I can't. The only thing you've improved the running game here. The only thing you, in my opinion, is the coaches. That's the thing that's helped you in the running game. You don't have a running back here, in my opinion. You don't.

[B]

Would they be willing to take the running back earlier than they want to take the running back prior to the run happening? Right. And then you can just cross reference this with the Hampton news going on right now. What if we say running back at 44, but Hampton goes first round, Henderson goes first round, Johnson goes first round. So now we're like, all right, second round, do we want to take Harvey here? Do we reach for running back or do we go something else and wait for running back around three? Are the Cowboys going to have to.

[C]

The only reason I wouldn't consider running back at 44 is if they're all gone. Sure, that's the only. But to me, if one of those guys, if his guy Henderson's there, Johnson, Hampton, one of them.

[B]

What if he's not, though? What if he's not, though? Then what do they do?

[C]

See, that's the problem, that.

[A]

That's where you go, man, Cuba or somebody like that.

[C]

Yeah, but see, to me. Yeah, to me, I just. Like I said, I think they've painted themselves in a corner, in my opinion, that by. By the third round, because you and I've had this discussion before about guys that can carry the load. Could be the featured guy. Can you get that guy in the fifth round? Do you see or you see, guys? See, I don't think they've set them up to have a back that could split time. If you still had Rico Dowdle here, here and took a fifth round guy, I kind of feel like you got. Okay. You're okay there.

[D]

The thing about the running back position that I think is fascinating when it comes to this team is you have Your third down guy, you have your receiving, you have your pass protecting guy. And Javonte Williams. Yeah, I think that's comfortable. You just need to get your early down guy. Get your guy that can open up the game for 5, 6 yards of carry on those, you know, opening carries of drives and sustain drives and get drives going. There were so many times last year where I think I brought it up on the show. Beginning of the game, handoff, Rigo Daddle, two yards and it just. You stall the drive before it even gets started.

[C]

Sure.

[D]

I still feel like there are some complimentary guys that you could throw in in the later rounds. I'm not saying that's my preference. I'm just saying don't be surprised if we get to day three and a running back hasn't been picked yet. Because I think there could be some guys that are there on day three. You look at it all so you don't see that Brooks or a Kyle Manon guy or a Jarquez Hunter. I mean these are guys that I think could be early down type guys that would, that would make sense team.

[C]

I would agree with you if you had a fourth round pick.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

If they, if they somehow, somehow hook or crook a four from somebody or another three, I'm with you on that. But if they sit there and wait from the third to all the way the fifth, watch these running backs come off that board. We saw it last year. Yeah, we saw the same thing last year. People are going to see value and it's a good group of running backs. Don't get me wrong. I just think that they've kind of painted themselves in a corner that if they. With the players. And I like what you're saying about Williams. I mean you're right about the catching and the blocking and stuff like that, but I just want a guy that maybe I want a guy that could do all. And Henderson is that guy. You give me the opportunity to draft Henderson, then I ain't worried about Williams and Sanders and those other guys so much.

[A]

While we're kind of on the topic of conversation and not to derail the running back convo, but we were talking safety, we're talking secondary and 30 round visits. Siobhan Revel Jr. East Carolina. I know there's some injury history there, but give me a little bit of a scouting report on Revel because I don't believe we've really done dove into what he could bring corner in the draft corner position. A lot of people believe that.

[C]

Well, it. Depending on where you, if you Have Hunter. You know, there's people that have Hunter, Travis Corner, and there's people that have him as a wide receiver. But go ahead, Nick.

[D]

Yeah, I think the one thing that's fascinating about Revel is he only has one year of starting experience and he's going to be coming off of this torn ACL as well. So there's going to have to be a little bit of an adjustment period. I mean, coming up from the American Conference into the NFL and if he were to be drafted to this team, he would need to be stepping into a role immediately to start potentially at week one. That's. That, I think would give me a little bit of concern. But you talk about being physically gifted. He's probably the most physically gifted defensive back in this class. And I think that's going to give him some versatility at the next level, too, whether that be in a man scheme, zone scheme, being able to play inside. I think he has that ability, too. But I would place this guy on the outside. He's explosive, he's physical, he can tackle, he plays to his size, he's got ball skills, he can return pick sixes. I mean, if you had a guy like him and a fully healthy Diggs and a fully healthy Duron Bland, this would be a turnover machine of a secondary. But the thing that would worry me about Revel for this team is what does that look like from week one to week eight of his rookie season. And granted, you're not drafting a player for the first eight weeks of his career, you're drafting him for the first four years and what that looks like, but man, you do need help at corner in the first eight weeks that can provide immediate help. I'm not sure if you can bank on Rebel being ready to go to do that, but his ACL surgery was done by Dr. Dan Cooper. He's the team physician here for the Cowboys. The Cowboys have just as much info on this, on this guy and his injury than anybody else. He tore his ACL in October. He's. It's going to be close for him to get fully cleared before training camp. That's what Dr. Cooper did. Send out in a memo in February to teams that he will be ready to go. But they also said that about Jonathan Brooks last year and he was not ready to go. He didn't make it until halfway through the season. So I think there would be a little bit of holding your breath with this guy. But if he comes back fully healthy and he's ready to go by training camp, I think this would be an awesome pick. I have him at the top of the third because of the injury and because I don't know what that's going to look like 100%, especially at the corner spot. Tearing your ACL as a corner is so tough and you rarely see guys come back and be 100% off of that. That's, that's the only reason why if I didn't, if he didn't have this knee injury, I'd probably have a first round grade on him.

[A]

And you're making the jump, like you said, from the American to the NFL. It's not like you're already at the.

[D]

NFL, already established with only one year of starting experience. Yeah.

[A]

So there's, there's a lot of question mark there. Where do you see him?

[B]

This would be fantastic if the Cowboys can find a way to work a little bit of voodoo magic and just get him in the second round somewhere.

[A]

Get him at 44.

[B]

I just want everybody to panic about that knee and just let him fall. And if you can get him at 44, then cool. And he got all the things that Cowboys love in their corners. He tall, long, can run, tackling, all this kind of stuff. And you know, there's this one thing going around, all the competition that he played against. That's cool, man. Watch Michigan. Watch Michigan. And he looked just as good as Michigan as he did versus app. State twice.

[A]

Well, in the UTSA tape, there were two guys drafted out of that UTSA team in 23. I mean, there's guys there that he's played against.

[B]

Yeah, he could play. He's a cornerback. Three for me behind Hunter and Baron.

[E]

Tommy, I think these two guys nailed it, you know, especially with the fact that Dallas, and specifically Matt Eberfluss, you look at the corners that he's had in the past, you think about Jalen Johnson, Tyreek Stevenson in Chicago. He likes those bigger, longer armed corners who can take the ball away. And Dallas, when it's been at his best, when you saw when Dan Quinn was here with Duron Bland and Trayvon Diggs fully healthy, they take the ball away. And Savon Revel can do that for you when he's fully healthy. I think that I share the concern with Nick of. Okay, can you come back and be what you were after an ACL tear? Especially when you are going to be borderline able to participate in training camp according to Dr. Cooper. And you're going to be expected to be thrust kind of into the fire here with this cornerback room because then the question Dallas has to ask themselves is okay, if you want to give Revel a Runway, does that mean that you trust Kair Elam enough to start week one for you? Opposite of Duron Bland? And if you do, then there's your answer. But that, that's, that's the big question that looms there. And I don't know if I would. I think I would, I would want to start Revel over him. But do you have the option? That's the question. I like the player a lot and I think that if he's able to come back fully healthy and the medicals check out, which like Nick mentioned, the Cowboys are going to have a better inside track on that than anybody else, then I wouldn't mind the pick at 44 at all.

[A]

Brian, you said he's the best corner.

[C]

I think he is if you don't include Hunter over there. But I have Hunter at wide receiver. So I think this guy. And I understand what Nick's talking about there and you know, but my corner, my, my first round corners, they've all got questions, but every one of them are damn good football players. Revel, Baron, Morrison, they're all really, really good players. And you know, and I know they're talking about with, you know, we've heard, we've kind of gone back and forth about the whole Will Johnson thing, you know, with, from Michigan and stuff like that. And, you know, if it all checks out, we'll see. But, you know, and that's, that's my only problem really with, with Johnson is that I've got three corners above him. But those corners all have some questions about him. But I know, I know one thing. All three of those guys, when you watch their tape, they make plays. And that's something that a lot of cornerbacks in this league don't do. But those kids, I think you could plug those kids in and they'll go make plays for you.

[A]

Yeah. Couple of question marks around those 30 visit guys. We'll continue to give you some scouting reports as those names trickle in over the next couple of weeks. When we come back here on the draft show, it's time for some Twitter on 20 who's the most underrated player in this NFL draft? I want each of our panelists to answer that question right after this with more of the draft show.

[B]

This is Julian Edelman from Games with Names.

[A]

Now let's get into the serious stuff.

[B]

We're talking football food, specifically Daisy French onion dip.

[C]

That is serious.

[B]

Gotta try these delicious new dips from Daisy. These are so delicious.

[A]

They're like homemade dips made with real.

[B]

Herb and spices and other ingredients you'll find in your kitchen.

[A]

Also made with some Daisy sour cream.

[B]

Daisy sour cream is a long standing.

[A]

Staple for Taco Tuesday. You know what I do when I get my street burrito? I get the squirt Daisy.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And every bite. I know you.

[C]

I know you.

[B]

I'm a huge sour cream guy. I love sour cream. So I think burritos can't live without sour cream.

[A]

I completely agree with that.

[B]

They also have daisy ranch dip.

[C]

I love ranch.

[B]

Yeah, it was great. I love it with crackers, wings, plain potato chip, the ones with the little crinkles, maybe some bell peppers. So get out there and give Daisy French onion dip a try. You will not regret it.

[A]

Lowe's knows Sundays are for football, so tackle your home improvement projects by Saturday.

[B]

And earn your Sunday with great deals.

[A]

On LG and Bosch appliances. Select Bounty and Swiffer cleaning products and more. Then once your to do list is.

[B]

Done, get ready to kick back, relax, and enjoy the game.

[A]

Shop in store or online now and earn your Sunday with help from Lowe's, official partner of the NFL. Life is a workout, and Smoothie King is here to help you power through. Whether you're maxing out overhead presses, pushing through chest flies, or being the hero your golden retriever needs to carry them over that scary bridge, Smoothie King has the fuel to help you go all out, build muscle and boost your recovery with 45 grams of protein, 0 grams of added sugar, and delicious customizable ingredients in the Gladiator Smoothie. Available in chocolate, strawberry, and vanilla only at Smoothie King. Hi. Drew Pearson, former Dallas Cowboy and now.

[B]

Pro Football hall of Famer here.

[A]

If you're struggling with your vision and tired of those contacts and glasses, don't.

[B]

Throw a Hail Mary. Go where I went. Laser Care Eye center, the official LASIK.

[A]

Partner of the Dallas Cowboys.

[B]

Boys, Drew, thank you so much for trusting us with your vision correction procedure. At LaserCare Eye center, we offer six different vision correction procedures to help patients see. Check them out@dfw eyes.com tell them Drew sent you.

[C]

Hood. Hut.

[A]

I'm Dak Prescott, quarterback of the Dallas Cowboys. And they snap at the Prescott, who looks right.

[B]

It's not there.

[C]

He escapes left.

[B]

He'll run for a first down. Just like football, when it comes to.

[E]

Crypto, it's important to have a team you can trust. With blockchain.com I know I'm in good hands. Since 2011, they've been trusted by millions around the world to buy, sell and trade cryptocurrency.

[C]

Prescott's gonna run this himself.

[A]

Run it up the middle and he scores. Whether you're new to crypto or an.

[E]

Active trader, they've got you covered.

[A]

What are you waiting for?

[E]

Get [e-mail] Cowboys fans, when it comes.

[D]

To navigating the ever changing world of.

[A]

Tax, your business needs a partner it can trust to tackle even your biggest tax challenges. Ryan is the largest firm in the.

[D]

World dedicated exclusively to business taxes. Our team of tax professionals has local.

[A]

Expertise in all areas of tax and can help you uncover savings opportunities you didn't know you had.

[D]

Learn more about how Ryan can improve.

[A]

Your overall corporate tax performance by visiting.

[D]

Ryan.Com Ryan, the official tax partner of the Dallas Cowboys.

[A]

This is the Dallas Cowboys.com draft show. Back here on the draft show, the 60th Academy of Country Music Awards are returning to Ford center at the Star in Frisco on May 8. Enjoy live performances from Lainey Wilson, Blake Shelton, Eric Church, and more. Don't miss this celebration. Six decades in the making, all hosted by Entertainment icon Reba McIntyre. Tickets are available now at SeatGeek.com Reba Pretty cool event.

[B]

What's she saying?

[D]

There's a lot I just know she was on that show when I was a kid.

[A]

Oh, yeah. She had like, a Chedro. Oh, she's big time.

[D]

My grandmother was obsessed.

[A]

Pretty much anybody down here is.

[C]

Is.

[D]

Yeah, that's the one. There is the one.

[B]

Jazz.

[E]

I went to high school with her niece.

[A]

With Reba's niece. Interesting. She's from Oklahoma. Where was that?

[E]

Ridgeland High School. Nice.

[C]

Okay. Good for you.

[A]

Nice flex.

[E]

Great.

[A]

So if we need Reba to come over on the draft show, the one we're hitting up. Sure, yeah.

[E]

Why not?

[B]

Why would we need that?

[E]

That and Chuck Norris was at my high school graduation.

[A]

Dude, stop bragging, okay? We don't need a name drop here on this show.

[E]

Just saying.

[A]

All right. Let's get into some Twitter on the 20. Let's go, Jazz. It was pretty good. Tom wants to know, who do you think is the most underrated in this 2025 NFL Draft class?

[D]

Don't come to me first.

[C]

RJ Harvey.

[A]

Looking right at you.

[B]

RJ Harvey.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

The reason I put him here, I've been talking about him for a while, man. He's a. He is a. A running back that's in this group of backs just for me. On my board, we always talk about Genti Hampton. You know, Johnson, Henderson. I think you could take him in in round two and get you a bell cow type guy, big play, runs hard, catches the ball well, you gotta work on that blocking, man. But that's a common theme by a lot of these running backs in this. In this damn class. But balance, vision. RJ Harvey's the last guy in round two running back wise, that I would look at and say I would give that, you know, give him the ball 22 times and feel decent about it. But the reason why I feel like he's the underrated guy. Cause I don't think people talk about Harvey like that. I don't think they talk about him in a round two type fashion.

[C]

I think when he breaks tackles and stuff like that, and he gets enough.

[B]

Credit for that, he whoops ass Brian Brothers. And honestly, I think people got third round grades on him just by nature of what running back is and what this running back class is. But if you take RJ Harvey in about five years, you're gonna look at him like, man, why won't we. Talking about RJ Harvey?

[D]

The thing about him, in five years, he's going to be 30 years old in five years.

[B]

Perfect.

[D]

And that's the. I think that's the one concern because. But I'm with you. I'm with you. I'm a big R.J. harvey guy. I think that's just probably where the concern stems from, is that he's already had an ACL tear and that he's going to be 20, close to 25 when his rookie season starts.

[B]

Then let's not give him that second contract. Some of these teams tend to do.

[A]

This perfect well, and that's why people would have him in the third.

[E]

If that's the case.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Then that means you're going to take.

[A]

A first or a second round player. I know he's a damn good player.

[B]

But that sound like something Mike Mayock would say. Teams suck at drafting. And if he's a dude and if he's on the board there, he may be 25, I get it. But you know, running backs, we typically don't want to hold on to them very long anyway.

[A]

So just, you know, get a playmaker and run with it.

[B]

Take them and just celebrate, you know what I mean?

[C]

Okay.

[B]

But the Cowboys taking Hampton at 12, so there's no need to worry about this.

[A]

That's fair.

[E]

Didn't know we had Mel on the show.

[A]

What's up, Tommy?

[C]

That should bother you, by the way. No, no, it should bother you in the fact that Mel Kuiper is usually right about this thing. If you're against taking a running back at 12 other than Genti, you should worry about Mel Kuiper because he has not wavered from this in his last.

[A]

I believe three, three mock drafts and he hasn't. He's not alone now. He was alone initially, now he's not alone. There's a couple other guys on that train too. Who's your most underrated?

[E]

Tommy Oluwafami Ola Dejo UCLA linebacker edge hybrid this was a guy that Nick Kyle and I had the chance to talk to at the Senior bowl and he's really only scratching the surface, I think, of what he can do. He kind of started off playing linebacker and UCLA moved him to the edge and he had a pretty solid season. You can look at me and say, Tommy, he only had four and a half sex, that's fine. He's built like a demigod and he's going to only grow from here when he gets to the NFL and gets more polished. You got to love what he's able to do. One on one, he looked great at the Senior bowl and one on one reps, just so twitchy. You look at that move that he just made there on the screen and there's a lot to like with, with what he can do. He had 14 tackles for loss last year, 57 total tackles. This is a versatile guy that you can play in a lot of different spots in your defense and you've got so much room to grow with him that I think you can, you can really take a chance on this guy early, develop him, and he can be a staple of somebody's defense going forward.

[B]

Tommy, let me ask you a question, sir, and I'm only saying this to you because you just picked him. I'm not making you a part of this fight. I just want to know what you think.

[C]

Fight.

[B]

What's the difference between. No, no, I'm not fighting Tommy, I'm fighting the world. What's the difference between him and Mikel Williams? Because it sound like you just described Mikel Williams. Fantastic rundown dude, got some room to grow, good size athlete. Boy, all this X, Y, Z, boy probably got a little room to develop as a pass rush, but boy, once he learn, boy, he gonna be ready to go. What's the difference, Tommy?

[E]

I think Oladejo has only just started playing Ed because they only just moved him to edge, whereas Williams has been there, if I'm not mistaken, his whole career. Williams has the edge as a run defender right now and I think the his build is better suited for it. But I think that Ola Dejo just has so much more room to grow. That spot where they tried him at linebacker so much and it just didn't work. So Williams, I think he's got the running run defense part of it down and I think his next step is getting after the quarterback, which I think he's further along in the process in. So you can look at Oladejo and say, okay, maybe we need some more time to get this guy up to speed. But I think that, that overall, I think he's. He's Ola Dejo' twitchier and I think that's going to benefit him long term.

[B]

He's a little bigger too. This ain't me fighting or no.

[A]

Michael Williams is a little bit.

[E]

I think. I think I touched on that. Sorry if I did.

[B]

I'm sorry, Tommy. This ain't me fighting you. I'm fighting the world.

[E]

You can.

[C]

We.

[E]

We can.

[B]

I think I'm not fighting you. This ain't me fighting. I think Oladio is a much better run guy right now. I think he has a much better feel for. Mikel's bigger, but he has a much better feel for rundown stuff. And then like, Mikel's probably going to do B gap things sometimes. And Oladejo won. I think Ole Dejo's a much better pass rusher right now. I think he projects to be a much better pass rusher right now. That's why I got Mikel in the third. That's why I got Ola Dejo ranked over him. I'm not fighting you, but I've been fighting people on the Internet for the past couple of weeks. And your breakdown was perfect. Was perfect. It was exactly how I would break it.

[C]

It's the compliment sandwich. Get ready. He's back.

[A]

He's gonna just destroy you in a second.

[B]

I'm about to get the I'm not fighting talk, but I was like, man, that show sound like Mikel Williams. This damn third round player that we described. That show sound like my kid. I just wanted to just hear you describe it. Tommy. This ain't just.

[E]

That's fine, that's fine. Part of the show's having disagreements and talking them out. So I'm all for it.

[C]

That's fine.

[B]

I agree with you, if anything.

[C]

But I could say he's actually thanking you for presenting the way you did.

[E]

Well, I. I think you could say if we're having the argument of camera time. Okay, they've gotten you a couple times.

[A]

With that in the last.

[E]

The Last one was much funnier. Yeah, but, but no, I think you could say, okay, they're kind of in the same situation of you're kind of banking on, okay, what is the ceiling? Right. We've had the conversation in the past of floor guys and ceiling guys. I think Williams floor is a lot higher than Oladejo's right now because of what he gives you with his size and what he's able to produce thus far. I think Oladejo is not as far along as a pass rusher than what Williams is. That's not to say that Williams is borderline and elite pass rusher. I just think he's further along since Ola Deja still kind of grasping the edge position. And I think that Ola Dejo is still behind a little bit too in the run sport. But I think that his experience as a linebacker is what can give him more room to grow in that department against Williams. I hope that all makes sense because.

[B]

I think Mikel ran down the middle of people and I think you're bendy as hell. But it's all good. Go ahead.

[A]

It is a little bit different. You're saying that the, the, the ceiling is similar for both, but the floor is much higher for Williams?

[E]

No, no, no, no, no. I think, I think, I think Michael Williams ceiling is higher.

[C]

Okay.

[E]

I, that's not to say Ola Deja ceiling isn't high, but I think Williams size and what he's already established and where he is in his progression is further along and I think that he, he has the higher ceiling.

[D]

Okay, y' all are going to hate me, but I, I, I couldn't just pick one guy. I'm gonna start with, I'm gonna start with Caleb Rogers, offensive lineman out of Texas Tech. Okay. This is a guy that I think is versatile. I think he could play four of the five offensive. He's a unit. He's played 4,200 career snaps at Texas Tech. He's got a violent punch. I like his feet. I think he could clean up his feet work, but I like where his feet are coming from. Sometimes he can like over commit on athletic edge rushers and give them a little bit too much breathing room. But I still think this is a guy that is going to be a offensive lineman in this league for a long time. Senior bowl guy, Senior bowl guy. I know a lot of people up at Texas Tech and they just rave about this guy's character as well. You see him playing left guard in this cut up. You see him playing right tackle, left tackle, Right guard. I mean, he's a guy that can come in and play pretty much any spot. This is a Dayton type talent for me. Really impressive guy. And the second guy I have to give. Did y' all know us necklers in this running back class?

[B]

What?

[A]

That was like 35.

[C]

Please don't tell me you're about to say Trevor ATN.

[D]

No, no, no, no. It's lan Larison out of UC Davis. This guy had 2400 yards last year and 24 combined between rushing and receiving.

[A]

It's a lot of yards.

[D]

This is a guy that could be a three down back early down physicality. He can get into the second level and he's got a crazy receiving ability you talk about. This is a guy you can line up in the slot at times in the game too. He had 62 receptions in 2024. He could be deployed out, out wide. I would like to see a little bit more wiggle and twitch. But what he brings in the past catching department, the route tree that he has coming out of the backfield, this is a major sleeper in this class, I think at the running back position. This is the guy that is not being talked about enough. 6 foot 215, can run a 4, 4, 5. He's going to have a jump in competition from the Big west, but so did Austin Eckler. And that's the spirit of the conversation.

[A]

What's his name?

[D]

So he's got great pass protection. Lan Larison. L A N. First name, last name. L A R I S O N. I have a fourth round grade on this guy.

[C]

Okay, 500 people.

[B]

Because me, me and Brown are like two, two, like 2:10. And you keep bringing up people I've never even heard of.

[D]

Go watch this guy and come back to me. Or throw us in the group chat if y' all don't want to bring him up.

[C]

Can you tell me. Can you tell me who the players you have around him in the fourth round?

[D]

I have him.

[C]

I have him with the running backs.

[D]

Yeah, I have him above Jarquez Hunter, Taj Bro. I have him right behind Ollie Gordon. I have him above Jaden Blue. I have him above Trevor Atn. I have him above Rashard Smith, Laquin Allen School, UC Davis. Yeah, he's Big west is the Big west is bad.

[B]

He is bad football.

[D]

But under the radar team. They are a really good team. They're top 10, top 15 in the country last year and he had 1500 rushing yards and 800 receipts.

[C]

What's his measurables?

[D]

6 foot 215, ran a 4, 4, 5 at the combine. This is one of the most athletic guys in this class, in my opinion. Opinion. This is going to be a guy we're going to still be talking about two, three years from now.

[B]

Wow. See, Nick watches seventh round players first.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And then he works.

[D]

Honestly, I just, that's all, that's gotta be it.

[B]

He hasn't watched.

[C]

Did you just because it was combine stuff.

[D]

No, no, I, I actually watched this guy back in February. I brought him up early on one of the early shows. The, the reason I watch this guy is because, like, sometimes I get bored watching film and I'm like, let me go find a guy that has like crazy stats and see if there's like any NFL traits to back it. And I saw him and I was like, like, oh, yeah, he's got NFL traits to back it. And then he went to the combine and he, he had an awesome day, awesome week at the combine. I, I, I love this guy.

[B]

Shout out to you, Nick, you work.

[D]

That's going to be, it's going to be a, a, a sleeper on day three.

[A]

I've got 514 prospects in this magazine and he didn't even, I, he wasn't even on.

[D]

That's what I'm saying now. You got 550.

[A]

I've got, I've got to get a 515. We're going to send out a revised edited edition. We're going to get him in there. That's under the radar. Good call.

[C]

Yeah, it's very under the radar. All right.

[A]

What you got, Brian?

[C]

Yeah, I, I, I answered the question with Mason Taylor, tight end. I don't think he' but I think I mentioned the name Trevor Atn from Georgia and I mentioned this is because of his. He's not the biggest guy at 5, 9 and 198, but he's super elusive in the vision and the sharp cuts, the instant acceleration. You know, he does a really nice job of catching the football well. He's got very natural hands. He plays well with the ball in his hands. I think that he could take like good gains and make them into great gains with the way he runs the football. But he makes good decisions. He's physical. Physical. He hasn't had a bunch of carries during his career, but he's made up with what he's had. And I think he's good on the blitz pickup stuff. But like I say, don't let the lack of height throw throw you off here. He really does do a good job in that area and I respect how he's able to make defenders miss and bounce around until he finds daylight. And he can be a weapon out of the backfield. So Travis, excuse me, Trevor Atn from Georgia, a transfer from Florida, is one of my guys. I don't think it's getting enough credit.

[E]

You want to see his vision, you want to see his best tape? Go watch him play Texas both times he torched Texas and Texas is one of the better run defenses in college football this past year.

[A]

Yeah, good player. Had great production throughout his time at Georgia, too. Lots of good to talk about there.

[E]

Real quick just because I'm seeing some some discussion in the comments and maybe I was confusing and if I was, I apologize to the Williams Oladejo debate. I think Williams has a higher floor and ceiling. Just to clarify. Yeah, I don't know if I made that clear.

[A]

No, you said that.

[E]

Make sure.

[C]

Yeah. You're saying he's a better player?

[A]

Yeah, pretty much.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

I'll throw a name in, but I.

[E]

Still think all the days is dang good.

[B]

I'm wrong.

[A]

They don't like your you in the comments.

[E]

I see why you're saying it.

[A]

Johnny Walker Jr. Edge out of Missouri did not give oh wait, no, this is, this is a prospect.

[B]

I thought it was.

[A]

I thought it was a Twitter on the 20. It's a prospect. Johnny Walker Jr. 1 because he's got a great name for the Cowboys specifically to be a possible draft pick, but he was a Shrine bowl guy who had a ton of production at the Shrine Bowl. Had eight and a half sacks, including eight or nine and a half sacks in 2024 with Missouri, including eight and a half over his final seven games. He finished with 12 and a half tackles for loss. Yet he did not get an invite to the scouting combine. He was left off the list. I liked his tape. I thought he was a vertical edge rush or versatile edge rusher that can stand up or put a hand in the ground. He can do a little bit of both. He's got good first step quickness, packs a punch upon first contact, upper body strength to get blockers off balance. Initially, only thing that I kind of knocked was he doesn't have a ton of pass rush moves to kind of go with kind of straightforward pass rusher. And then at the same time he's a little bit smaller. He's a bit of a tweener. 246 pounds is what he ranked at the Shrine Bowl. So I think he's a good player off the edge. I think I Would take him probably early day three, but some people don't even have them on a board because I don't.

[C]

Who do you have around on your board?

[A]

Let me get to my edge rushers. I have him around. Some of these other guys like Savion Jones from lsu, Q. Robinson from Alabama, Baron Sorrell, Texas, Jordan Birch, Oregon. Guys like that are kind of right, right around that fourth round for you then in fifth, probably fifth round. If he sneaks up into the fourth, it's because of the production.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

That's what it is. And he had a great Shrine Bowl. I thought he, I, he ended up having two sacks. Multi sack performance against Alabama and Iowa had two sacks in the Shrine bowl at AT&T Stadium. I, I was kind of, I was intrigued why he didn't get an invite to Indy. I was wondering why that was the case. I didn't know if there was an off the field thing. I didn't find anything.

[D]

So I think that may have benefited him because I worry about his link a little bit. That's why you see him on stand up rushes a lot on these. He's gonna have to go to a scheme that can really, you know, hide, hide that deficiency from him. Yeah, I'm trying to think about like a, a pass rush heavy scheme that sends five rushers. I mean he would have to be on the, on the field with a five rush set, in my opinion. But I, I still think he's, I.

[A]

Still stand him up. Put his hand down.

[C]

You stand him up?

[D]

Yeah, that's, that's where he would have to go to a scheme that can, that can work in that sense. I, I would stand him up just because that's what he's got experience doing, but there's not a lot of teams in the NFL that do that still.

[A]

So, so just kind of wrong time kind of guy.

[D]

Not necessarily. I think there's a role for this guy. He just has to land in the right system. Yeah, I do think there's a role for this guy. He's got to land in the right system.

[A]

If you have production, I think that system could be here in the sec. I think you can have some success anywhere. Yeah, the way that he dominated at the end of the year in the SEC schedule. All right, let's try and fit in one more Twitter on the 20 question. We've only gotten the one so far.

[D]

We got.

[A]

What was the second one?

[D]

Oh, that was one.

[A]

Yeah. That was all one question. You know, this one's kind of fun. Brian, I mentioned this before the Break. Before we came back, AC Wants to know what a pin throw is. Let's define this for me.

[C]

A pin throw is when you fake like you're mad when a guy got pecked, but you're really happy inside. So you have to show the room that you're like, oh, damn, I can't believe we lost that guy. But inside you're kind of like, excited that it happened, that he's got, that he's gone.

[A]

So you're saying a fake pin throw because he said that you and I have different definitions.

[C]

And I think that's my, that's my definition of a pin throw. I'm like, oh, damn. See, I would call that, but in real life, I'm kind of happy because we didn't take the guy.

[A]

See, I would call that like a fake pin throw. Whereas a pin throw is where you actually are upset.

[C]

No, my pin throw is. When I throw my pin, it's usually because I think the guy's gone.

[A]

So there you go.

[E]

So does that mean your fake penthro is. Is a real pen?

[C]

Isn't actually, whatever happens. No. If I, If I, If I drop like an F bomb, then. Then you know that we lost a.

[A]

Guy that I like. Yeah, you hit the table. Yeah, whatever.

[D]

A pin throw is for Brian's. When will Johnson and Mikel Williams get drafted?

[C]

Yeah, well, if they go before, right. If they get picked before, then I'll just go, ah, I can't believe that happened.

[A]

Pin throw.

[D]

Darn.

[A]

Okay, good to know.

[E]

Now that we've cleared that up, gonna throw 12 pens. If Michael.

[B]

If he goes to Dallas.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

You're gonna have to go buy a package if. And then throw it.

[B]

If Mikel gets a Dallas, I'm just going to lean back in my chair and huff and puff and act like we. Hey, yeah, I'll tell you why. He'll fit perfectly up in here. But if he goes to Carolina or something, give me a pen.

[D]

To think. That's crazy, man. That's crazy.

[B]

I like my man. He just, you know, just not at 12.

[A]

We're going to get in a heap of trouble if Mikel Williams ends up being the pick.

[D]

If it's Mike, Will Johnson or James Pierce, we're going to have a lot of discussing to do at this table.

[B]

Let me tell you.

[A]

And this is the clip they're going to take. And it's going to be Nick talking about it. And then it's going to cut to me kind of smiling half heartedly at the camera. All right. When we come back here on the draft show we've got some we Talked about the 30 visit guys a little bit. I want to hit another name out of the 30 visits and then I also want to hit Perfect Fit. That was a question mark around who could be a perfect fit for the Dallas Cowboys. But I don't want to do first round guys. I want to talk about guys later on in the draft who you feel like can be that fit for Dallas. Right after this with more of the draft show. Did you know Tide has been upgraded to provide an even better clean in cold water? Tide is specifically designed to fight any stain you throw at it, even in cold butter.

[B]

Yep, chocolate ice cream.

[A]

Sure thing. Barbecue sauce. Tide's got you covered. You don't need to use warm water. Additionally, Tide pods let you confidently fight tough stains with new coldzyme technology. Just remember, if it's got to be clean, it's got to be tied. Lowe's knows Sundays are for football, so tackle your home improvement projects by Saturday and earn your Sunday with great deals on LG and Bosch appliances, select Bounty and Swiffer cleaning products and more. Then once your to do list is done, get ready to kick back, relax and enjoy the game.

[D]

Shop in store online now and earn.

[A]

Your Sunday with help from Lowe's official.

[D]

Partner of the NFL.

[A]

NFL I'm Darren Woodson, former Dallas Cowboy player and super bowl champion. When I played in the NFL at a high level, I relied on my.

[B]

Vision to see the field.

[A]

As I started getting older, I noticed.

[B]

My vision wasn't as good and I.

[A]

Was getting frustrated from wearing my glasses all day. I went to Lasercare Eye center and Dr. G talked about all the options. Thanks to Technology and LaserCare Eye Center, I can see near, far and between. Don't fumble your vision anymore. Long Visit [e-mail] and tell them Darren sent you. They got me back on my game. Star Sports Tours is the only official fan travel partner of the Dallas Cowboys, offering exclusive game weekend travel packages with.

[B]

Pre game sideline access and photo ops.

[A]

With current players, cheerleaders and cowboy legends. Want to stay at a team hotel?

[B]

Attend the best tailgate party in Texas.

[A]

Tour the Star and talk X's and O's with me.

[B]

Everson Walls With Star Sports Tours, you.

[A]

Can visit cowboystravel.com to book your travel package. Today, life is a workout and Smoothie King is here to help you power through. Whether you're maxing out overhead presses, pushing through chest flies or being the hero your golden retriever needs to carry them over that Scary Bridge Smoothie King has the fuel to help you go all out, build muscle and boost to your recovery with 45 grams of protein, 0 grams of added sugar and delicious customizable ingredients in the Gladiator Smoothie. Available in chocolate, strawberry and vanilla only at Smoothie Kit.

[C]

How about them Cowboys?

[A]

Or how about them Tyson Cowboys Nuggets?

[D]

As we cheer for the stars on the field, we love that we've also.

[C]

Got some stars on our plate thanks.

[A]

To Tyson brand star shaped Cowboys Nuggets. That along with all our other favorite Tyson foods products sure make game day special.

[D]

Score some delicious Tyson Cowboys Nuggets and.

[A]

Become a game day star just like our Cowboys.

[D]

As you enjoy your stars on and off the plate.

[C]

Remember, tailgates and game day have always been Tyson.

[A]

This is the Dallas Cowboys.com draft show. Cowboys fans get ready for Draft Weekend presented by Miller lite at the Star in Frisco. The action kicks off Thursday, April 24 with the ultimate Draft Party and it continues Friday with Draft Hangout and wraps up Saturday with The Draft Day 5K presented by Baylor, Scott and White Health. Three days of football fun and fan experiences you won't want to miss. Visit Dallas Cowboys.com draft for details. Of course, the Draft Magazine is out now. The Dallas Cowboys Star Magazine Draft Guide. I've actually got some fun additions here. I'm going to go we're going to give away some draft magazines that are signed by the Draft show crew. So watch out for that tweet. You'll get an opportunity to win some of these Draft show signed magazines. Everybody's on there. Got the five of us here and then we'll have Bobby sign it here and Zach Wolcheck sign it on Thursday whenever they come in for the show later in the week. All right, Talked about perfect fit. What are you gonna are you gonna try and get continue Twitter on the 20 here?

[B]

No, no, Kyle, I just got hijack one thing. No, what do you want?

[A]

I just felt like a hand on my back and I was like, here we go. You remember that thing I sent in.

[B]

The rundown me and Nick Harris said something very important on the break and I just wanted to make sure everybody heard it right. I don't hate. No, hate is a strong word. I may only hate two or three players, right? It's just I may hate the way you're drafted.

[A]

You know, sports hate.

[B]

Like for example, Sean Oakman I didn't think was very good at all.

[A]

Yeah, right.

[B]

I'm like, man, I don't want to draft Sean Oakman at all. You know what I'm saying? I would draft Mikel Williams. We just disagree where. You know what I'm saying? So I don't want nobody to go around and say, oh, man, Vosh hate Mikel Williams when he go out and do something good in preseason. Get a little tackle or something. I would love to have him just not as high as the Cowboys are drafted. My bad guy.

[C]

Go ahead.

[A]

Do you have anything to add before you move on? Okay.

[B]

They hate when I do that, Kyle, but they'll be all right. Man, I ain't coming back next year. I'm getting fired.

[A]

I just. I love the fact that he's in this back chair and he just put his hand on my back.

[B]

I can reach.

[A]

You hold on.

[B]

Yeah, exactly. You feel me? Energy.

[C]

Yeah. All right.

[A]

Charles Davis and a couple of the NFL Network analysts put out a Cowboys perfect fit. There were a couple different elements of this, but it's from NFL.com and his perfect fit for the Cowboys was later on in the draft. He brought up Kyle Menungai, the running back out of Rutgers. Kind of an interesting out of left field sort of player. We've talked about him on the show. I think we're all kind of fans of him. Where he would end up being selected probably early day three or right around there. But at the same time, it kind of stokes the question of what other positions in this draft are there a perfect fit, quote unquote with the Cowboys. And you can't do anything in the first round because people could say Genti or people could say Tetaroa McMillan or whatever it may be right outside of the first round. Where's your perfect fit for the Cowboys?

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

First, I do want to start just with a brief scouting report on Manga. I mean, this is one of the. Tommy can attest this is one of the running backs I enjoyed watching during the season.

[B]

Look at this.

[D]

More than any last year. I love Kyle Manon guy. I do have a couple of concerns. Well, I'll start with the strengths. He's a downhill guy. He can get out and have outside zone running success, too. He's got receiving ability. I think he's probably the second or third best pass protector in this class, in my opinion. I got Travion Henderson up there. I also have Dylan Sampson up there as well. But I. He lacks speed to be like that explosive type weapon in the NFL. And that kind of proved itself at the combine. Zero fumbles and 669 carries. There's a. There's a positive and there's a negative in that. The positive is that there was zero fumbles. The negative is that there's 669 carries. Yeah, he was a starter for three and a half years at Rutgers, but I mean, this guy's a dog and I don't know how long he'll last in the league. I don't know if he ends up finding a starting role in the league. But regardless, we're going to have fun watching it. I understand where Charles Davis is coming from because this is a guy who could be an early down type guy and kind of give you those hard earned yards because he falls forward, he's got contact balance, he's got these big thick thighs that fight forward for extra yardage. So I understand where Charles Davis is coming from. I personally, when I was looking at all of these backs and okay, who is the best? Who is the best compliment to Javante Williams specifically. I had put down Caleb Johnson and I had put down Michelle Tutton out of Virginia Tech. Both of those guys, I feel like, can be those early down home run speed type guys. I personally like Tutton a little bit more as a fit just because he does have that athleticism and you need that home run hitter on this, on this offense. But if we're going for another position, Maxwell Harrison, I, I've, I've claimed it so many times out of Kentucky at corner because I think he play nickel, I think he can play outside. He's got the speed to be able to kind of elevate the athleticism in that second room. I think he's, he's a guy you bring in and he's gonna be a day one starter and he can start for you in multiple spots. He can give you time for Trayvon Diggs to get healthy. I, I really like Maxwell Harrison is probably the best fit in this class for this team.

[A]

No, it's a good one. Can somebody tell me a little bit about Tutton? I don't think we've talked about him on the show.

[D]

I don't mind. I just don't want to take anybody's. Well, I don't mind.

[E]

Watch.

[D]

Y' all got it. Y' all got it. Go ahead.

[B]

Big speed and, you know. Yeah, you know, watching combine first and then watching him kind of made you go into it like, all right, you better be fast. And he is fast. He does kind of break away from those runs, but I was very impressed to see how heavy he ran, like the sense of gravity that he, he's not like a slashy type dude. Just because he's fast. Like he does finish runs. And I was like, all right, cool. Bet. I think if they threw the ball to him more, he'll catch more passes. So I mean, maybe in the league hurts him there.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

The only wart was he fumbling the ball, man. Fumbling the ball, putting him around eight of them.

[C]

Ate them in two years.

[B]

Eight fumbles in two years. Man, that's tough. But I think that's because he's trying to run so tough. He's trying to whoop ass so bad that he just ends up fumbling the ball. But what is coaching for, man? Please just tap on the show like, hey, keep that run thing that you're doing, that hard running that you're doing and just, just two hands, man. Put the ball on it. But Basho's a dude, man. You know, like, you know, I was thinking fifth round maybe, but he may be a third round type guy.

[C]

Sure.

[B]

You know, by the time we end up, you know, you know, the Cowboys end up looking at him maybe in the third round. I don't know. We'll see. But shows a dude and I like him a lot.

[D]

I have him in the third RB7 for me. Played two seasons at North Carolina A and T. So he's, he's already experienced that jump in competition, which I think is in this specific era. In the Nil era, you're starting to see these guys that already have that experience of the jump and leap in competition and I think that's helps their NFL progression and their NFL transition a lot more. Tutton, I think, is going to be a perfect example of that. I think he's going to step into an offense and provide that home run speed, provide that physicality on early downs as soon as his rookie year. The only thing I, I worry about from a longevity standpoint is will his body hold up. He is five foot eight and a half right around 205 pounds. He's a load. He's a bowling ball. But I, that's, that's the only thing that I, I worry about. He, he battled an ankle sprain last season, but he didn't miss any games. So there's, there's no injury history. But I just kind of worry about the body a little.

[C]

54% of his runs were considered breakaway runs. Love that this kid can separate. And another thing you need to know about him is half the games this season he had 75 yards after contact. That's just a couple of metric things you might need to know about this kid. He's a heck of a player.

[D]

If you want any film nerds out there, go watch the Boston College tape from this guy last year. You want to have some fun? Let's go do that.

[A]

Also, it's Bashaw. Tootin Tootin.

[D]

Tootin.

[A]

Tootin is how you say, darn Tootin, right, Two toot. Yep. I mean, do you have anything to add on there?

[D]

You can take that headline, by the way.

[E]

Yeah. No, in terms of, in terms of best fit.

[A]

Yeah.

[E]

Give me Trey Harris from Ole Miss. I think that, you know, there's been so much talk about Ted McMillan at 12 in the first round for the Cowboys. Well, guys, what if. What if Ted McMillan is off the.

[A]

Board at 12 or they don't like.

[E]

Him or they pass on him and they're, they're saying, okay, we need another position here in the first round. We can wait till the second or the third to get a wide receiver. I think you look at in terms of just the X, go up and get it. Guys in this class think Trey Harris is the second best guy in the class behind McMillan. Incredible 50, 50 ball. He's 6 3, 200 pounds, I believe. I'm sorry, 6 2, 205 pounds, 317 eighths arms, 9 5th eighths hands. You could say, oh, he runs a 4, 5, 4, 40. Well, you're not asking this guy to necessarily be a, you know, a speed guy. You just want him to, to get open and to go up over a guy and. And get a 50, 50 ball. And I think he can do that for. You've got CD Lamb, who can be the yak guy for you and, and burn guys down the field. You've got Kevonte Turpin, who looks like he'll get used more in a wide receiver role this year. Don't know how well, but if that's what you. If you want speed, there you go.

[D]

That for three years.

[E]

Yeah, right. I feel like he. He adjusts really well midair, strong hands to bring the ball in. He's got good burst off the line of scrimmage. So, you know, like I said, not the best top end speed guy. He's got long strides, though. He gets the job done. And then one of the other things that I like about him that doesn't get talked a lot, he. He blocks really well outside for runners. So you can, if you get, you know, a guy like Travion Henderson, who I think is another good fit for the Cowboys, is you can get him outside blocking for him so that he can hit those home run Plays.

[C]

Yeah, I'm going to go into like this guy might be a late third, but if you can grab a fourth, the extra fourth or not the extra, but get a fourth back. Teddy Buchanan from Cal, Linebacker.

[D]

Okay, fun.

[C]

622-33-And he's speaking to Cal Davis.

[D]

Digging the bag, Brian.

[C]

There we go. I tried to, I tried to outdo you on this one. He's got great size for the position, like say 6, 2 2, 33. He's got some pop to his game and when he's taken on ball carriers, they stop in his tracks. This guy's a physical player. Surprise. Uses a blitzer. He can close on the ball. There's a couple of snaps where he was able to run down Cam Ward and force poor passes. If you watch the Miami game this year, he's a twitchy player and I really like that about him. He plays light on his feet, lateral ability covers some ground quickly. He's one of those guys that is a really good finisher. He makes big time, impacts on ball, cares some range to his play. He could track a ball. He had a 40 inch vertical jump at the combine and you can see some of that explosiveness in this game. So if you guys are hunting a linebacker right there, Teddy Buchanan from Cal would be a guy that probably is going to be a third round guy. If you could grab that extra four, maybe that's a guy you consider on day three.

[E]

Awesome hair too.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah, he definitely does have some great hair. Did you have one?

[B]

I mean, I was just up here kicking it with y' all since I talked about two, but I add one to it. Yeah, Carson swinger.

[A]

Oh, that was mine.

[B]

Ucla.

[A]

Yeah, that was going to be mine. Go for it.

[B]

I was sitting back daydreaming today thinking about him and over shown today. Go on my Twitter. I talked about it, but just, just watching that dude do all the things that I like from linebackers because I, I normally think that linebackers are either they're super athletic but they don't process really well or they process their ass off, but they not fast. Oh, Carson does it all, man. So as a sideline to sideline guy, covering guy backwards, downhill tackler, blitzing sometimes get some sacks and all that.

[C]

He had four sacks in 20, 24.

[B]

Sure. I'm like, man, give me him, give me him. Perfect fit. Next to overshone, let him do Mike things. Because the one thing that we was kind of worried about was the size of him. Weighing in at like 2, 242. 242 perfect. Here, here, sir. So Carson, Sweden, man, watch him versus Iowa. Just, just read and just get a snap of his fingers. Like I'm 32 years old, you know what I'm saying? So I saw Sean Lee for real, you know what I'm saying? I saw him with my eyes and I missed that. Super diagnosis. Not just the instinct, dude, that'll kind of flow his way into a play. But I've been watching film. I know what you gonna run prior to you running it, and at the snap of my finger, I'm there. I want that back in Dallas so bad. So Carson Schlesinger is a fantastic fit for me.

[D]

You look good for 32. Fudge.

[B]

Hey, appreciate you, man.

[D]

Dave Borgonzi, linebackers coach for the Cowboys. He was in attendance at the Carson Schlesinger individual pro day. Worked him out. So the Cowboys do have context on this guy for sure. This would be second round option potentially.

[B]

Now, Nick Harris, in your opinion, what's more important, sending a coach down there to talk to him or like this 30 visit, take a picture with, with Jerry, stuff going on, right? Like, like, is that something they want to keep in their back pocket quietly? Oh, yeah, we're gonna send a coach down. We're not gonna make a big thing. Like, what do you think is, is more impactful?

[D]

I, I think it depends. I think in a situation, I think in a situation like this, it would probably be more impactful to have the guy on a 30, because if you're, if you have a linebacker, you want to get him to talk to the dc, you'd like to get him to talk to, you know, some multiple position coaches, maybe even talk to Jerry and see how he operates against, around other players. For sure. Because he's going to have to be a leader in that defensive room. So I think in this specific case, maybe a 30 visit would be more important. But you look at a guy like Quincy Riley, corner out of luck, Louisville. David Overstreet, the defensive backs coach, was in attendance at his pro day. It's probably more impactful for the position coach to be at his pro day rather than getting him in for a 30. So I, I think it just kind of depends. It's, it's either or type of deal.

[C]

Can I ask you a real quick question about the 30? Any word about golden, the wide receiver from Texas visiting?

[D]

No, no word on Golden. As far as I know, he was not one of the 30s.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

That, that could be, that could be different. And I wouldn't, I wouldn't put too much Context into that because they trust me.

[A]

You got to limit that list.

[D]

The Cowboys know about Matthew golden, okay? Trust me.

[A]

Yeah, swinger was, was mine. I, I, I think you, you hit it right on the head. I actually compared him to Demo because a lot of his college tape remind me of Demo's tape. Sideline to sideline, just always around the football. He had 90 solo tackles his senior season. Next closest was on the leaderboard by 14, trailing by 14 points in terms of solo tackles. Finished with 136 tackles, tackles, nine double digit tackle games, most by a linebacker for UCLA since Eric Kendricks. He was out there.

[D]

So I'm going to be a sicko just for a second. I'm sorry.

[A]

Go for it. Be a sicko.

[D]

The Dallas day was last Friday. And if you're watching the film right here on, on, on the UCLA versus Hawaii, if you see that Hawaii quarterback and you're like, hey, he's not bad. He was at Dallas day this last week. Braden Shaker, he's a Highland park grad and he's going to be a UDFA type option. I don't be surprised if the Cowboys take a UDFA quarterback. Yeah, you look at Graham Mertz out of Florida. Quarterbacks coach Steve Schimko was in a 10 for his pro day workout. They had a couple of guys in attendance for Dallas day. Seth Hennigan out of Memphis, he's a Denton Ryan product. And then Braden Shager, AKA Shaker, bombs out of Highland Park. He was, he was in attendance too.

[A]

You and I got to cover him a little bit while he was there.

[D]

Great kid in high school.

[C]

Good kid.

[A]

I think he's got a connection with Babe Laufenberg.

[D]

Right. They both live in Highland Park.

[A]

I think they're both around. Yeah, that's fair. Good point.

[D]

Everybody in Highland park knows each other. Yeah, they all, it's like Beaumont, like everybody in southeast Texas is related somehow. It's same thing in Highland Park.

[A]

But since you took Swessinger, I'll just throw out Trey Amos because we've already kind of touched on his scouting report and what we say. I think as a second round guy, I think he would be a perfect fit from a big corner outside. Kind of help you out a little bit with the current corner situation. I would take Almost there at 44 and run with it if that's the case. All right, that does it for us here on the draft show. We'll be back on Thursday as then we're two weeks out from the NFL draft. It is coming up very, very, very quickly for Nick Harris, Brian Brus, Tommy Yarish, Fox Lombardi with Jasmine Marshall in the back of Kyle Y saying, so long. We'll see you next week or excuse me, see you on Thursday with more of the draft show Hoodie who. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys.com and the Dallas Cowboys football club.

[B]

How about this, Cowboys? This is Julian Edelman from Games with names. Now let's get into the serious stuff. We're talking football food, specifically daisy French onion dip. These are so delicious. They're like homemade dips made with real herb and spices.

[A]

Also made with some daisy sour cream.

[B]

Daisy sour cream is a long standing.

[A]

Steak maple for taco Tuesday, they also.

[B]

Have daisy ranch dip. So get out there and give daisy French onion dip a try. You will not regret it.