Ep. 51 - Your Pain Is Your Genius | Shadow Work, Trauma & Metanoia with Steven Twohig

Summary

The Drop the Needle Podcast

Episode 51: Your Pain Is Your Genius | Shadow Work, Trauma & Metanoia with Steven Twohig

Release Date: January 15, 2026
Host: Jim Alstatt
Guest: Steven Twohig

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Episode Overview

This episode explores the depths of shadow work, the impact of trauma, and the transformative concept of Metanoia with Steven Twohig—a veteran in spiritual transformation who blends deep spiritual work with strategic business consulting. Jim and Steven discuss how facing one’s pain and unconscious patterns is the pathway to true genius and spiritual awakening, and the conversation effortlessly weaves between psychological insight, practical application in life and business, and the healing power of music.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Layers of Consciousness & Shadow Work

(Starts ~04:39)

• Steven’s Model:
  Steven invites listeners to picture themselves as floating in a boat on a river—a metaphor for one's consciousness and personal story. The river has many "boats" (possibilities) on its surface, representing the multiplicity of thoughts and roles.

  “You’re floating down the river of the story called you in the boat called Now…and your mind is anywhere but now.” – Steven Twohig [04:39]

• Surface vs. Subconscious:
  Most people focus only on the “surface” (their daily thoughts and actions), unaware of the deep currents (subconscious and “deep conscious”) that actually drive their behaviors and suffering.

• Shadow work, according to Steven, is about “diving beneath the surface” to recalibrate those underlying signals, so that we’re not endlessly chasing external solutions to internal problems.

2. Repetitive Thought Patterns & Survival Instinct

(~08:36-12:43)

• Repetitive Thoughts:

  • 95% of our thoughts are repetitive; 87% of those are survival-driven, negative, or protective.

    “95% of the thoughts you think are repetitive…about 87% of the 95% are survival rooted attack thoughts.” – Steven Twohig [08:36]

• Origins:
  These patterns are rooted in ancient evolutionary biology, archetypes, and learned scripts passed down through generations (“13.5 billion years,” as Steven says).

3. Beyond the Hero’s Journey: Waking Up to Your Genius

(~10:57-15:48)

• Moving Beyond Old Narratives:
  Most people live life by the “egoic hero’s journey” template—going from crisis to crisis, overcoming challenges, and seeking external validation. Steven argues it's time to “evolve past that.”

  “That model is dead. We need to evolve now past that. Michael Mead calls it the story of the genius, where there’s a unique expression that can only come through…you.” – Steven Twohig [10:57]

• Spiritual Crisis & Transformation:
  The universe and modern pressures (like AI and societal acceleration) are “forcing us to the table” to transform—what Steven calls Metanoia.

4. Chasing Metanoia: Structural Change at the Soul Level

(~13:03-15:48)

• Metanoia Defined:

  • From Greek: a total spiritual or structural change, often catalyzed by crisis or tragedy.

  • In mythology, Metanoia is “a character of unknown origin that hangs out with Kiros, the goddess of transformation.”

  • It’s about a shift from seeing ourselves as surface-bound, consumption-focused beings to recognizing ourselves as creators and healers.

    “We are creators that have been programmed to be consumers… But the universe is saying—it’s time for you to wake up.” – Steven Twohig [13:09]

• Speed of Change:
  Events that used to take millennia now happen in years; adaptation demands inner recalibration.

5. Shadow Work Meets Business and Leadership

(~18:21-34:44)

• From Tony Robbins to Ayahuasca:
  Steven shares his journey of recovery, shadow work, and eventually working for Tony Robbins for 14+ years. He integrated shadow practices into business settings—proving these principles are not just spiritual, but also practical and scalable.

  “It doesn't matter. It scales. The math adds up all the way in, all the way down. [...] Business is a spiritual sport at the end of the day.” – Steven Twohig [24:21 & 25:50]

• Practical Impact:

  • Businesses are run by stories, patterns, and shadows. The parts of ourselves we “hide, repress, and deny” show up in business and leadership roles.

  • Shifting from “paycheck employees” and internal competition to “integrated leadership” and engagement unleashes creativity and collective genius.

    “Companies that are only...the research is profound—the amount of people that are not happy with where they are, they're not engaged. If I'm not engaged, I'm only paper thin...That organization that's moving at the speed of light has to be conscious.” – Steven Twohig [27:58]

6. Your Struggle is Sacred: Transforming Pain into Genius

(~37:52–47:53)

• Pain as Portal:
  The show’s titular theme—“Your pain is your genius”—comes alive here. The core wounds and traumas from childhood become “open secrets” that reverberate through our lives until faced.

  “It's in the suffering of me...there's a part of me that was not given.” – Steven Twohig [43:13]

• Personal Anecdotes:
  Both Steven and Jim mention childhood traumas (from family dynamics to abuse) and how these unconsciously dictate lifelong patterns—until illuminated through shadow work.

  “There's this part of me that feels trapped… like I'm always waiting to be stuck back in that basement… But now because I’ve gone down in there…I can go into the basement called Jim and go 'Hey buddy, come with me.'” – Steven Twohig [44:30]

• Healing Process (“RAIN” framework):

  • Recognize you’re in the struggle.
  • Allow and accept it.
  • Investigate its root.
  • Nurture the part of you that needs healing.

7. Mental Hygiene in the Age of Acceleration & Artificial Intelligence

(~47:53–51:38)

• Necessity of Mental Cleanse:
  Old wounds and “mental meanings” clog our perceptions. Steven calls intentional soul work a form of vital “mental hygiene.”
• AI & Adaptation:
  As AI becomes exponentially intelligent, humans must go “inward” for relevance and presence.

  “The illiterate of today's age will be the people that can't learn, then unlearn, and then relearn again.” – Steven Twohig [48:59]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On shadow work and the repetitive mind:

  “Most people spend their lives chasing something outside of themselves to solve a signal that’s happening underneath the water. My work goes underneath the water and basically retunes and recalibrates that signal.” – Steven Twohig [06:00]

• On the trap of success:

  “The more success I had…the certainty of going to be a bum…the gravity of it increased. The farther away I got, the farther up I got. Because my mind is still holding on to the same ‘You're gonna hit the ground,’ but now it's like you're five stories up.” – Steven Twohig [22:55]

• On collective awakening:

  “We’re trying to get to that space where…when Jim's genius comes out, when your unique expression of you is finally able to sing its song…your presence automatically liberates others.” – Steven Twohig [37:52]

• On the importance of deep healing:

  “Our first rule of shadow work is that you lie to yourself first. Where I can see how I'm lying to myself, I'm much bigger than what I think I am.” – Steven Twohig [41:00]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |-------------|---------------------------------------------------------------| | 04:39–07:40 | Steven describes consciousness, shadow, and his healing model | | 08:36–12:43 | Repetitive thoughts, survival instincts, belief systems | | 13:03–15:48 | Metanoia: total transformation (definition, urgency, AI era) | | 18:21–24:21 | Steven’s story: Tony Robbins, recovery, business consulting | | 25:20–34:44 | Shadow work in business, leadership, real-world examples | | 37:52–47:53 | Pain as genius; healing childhood wounds (RAIN process) | | 47:53–51:38 | Mental hygiene, AI, the necessity of inner work |

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Music, Memory, and Healing

(Segment begins ~52:24 with musical questions)

Steven and Jim reflect on how music shapes memory, emotion, and healing. Steven shares his personal “soundtrack”—from the Eagles’ “Take It Easy” on childhood road trips to Tool’s “46 & 2” as the anthem of his shadowy years.

• Song that feels written for Steven:
  “Landslide” (performed by Robin Sherwell)

  “There’s something about it that’s humbling and cleansing in the same way…watching those lights come on is…the jam, man.” – Steven Twohig [63:34]

• Theme of music and genius:
  The conversation celebrates music as a “tie that binds us all,” and a tool for unlocking both joy and self-understanding.

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Guest Contact Information

• Steven Twohig:
  • Website: MasteringChange.com
  • Shadow Work App: Download via your phone app store
  • Non-profit: Evolving Mind Project
  • 65+ active integration groups monthly

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Conclusion

Steven Twohig’s message: The suffering, struggle, and “basement” parts of ourselves are not obstacles, but essential portals to genius and transformation—both spiritual and practical. By embracing shadow work and turning inward, we not only heal ourselves but become catalysts for healing and creativity in business, relationships, and beyond.

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For more, explore the show notes for Steven’s curated playlist and how to join his community.

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“The only way out is through, and the only way through is in.” – Steven Twohig [48:59]

Transcript

[Steve Duhig]

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[Jim Alstatt]

Welcome to the Drop the Needle Podcast, your backstage pass to the mystical realm. I'm your host, Jim Alstatt, and here gifted souls step up to the mic, sharing their spiritual journey. We're hitting the high notes and the low notes of their awakening, creating a symphony of enlightenment. This isn't just another interview show. This is where divine insights are channeled and universal truths are revealed. So crank up your stereo and sit back because who knows, this just might help you compose the next transformative chapter of your soul's purpose. Are you ready? Let's go. Hi everyone and welcome to the Drop the Needle podcast. I'm your host, Jim Alstott, and I am so happy you all decided to join us. You know that part of yourself you try to keep locked in the basement? The angry one, the scared one, the one that reminds you of your worst moments? Yeah, that one. Well, today's guest has spent over 20 years not just talking to those parts, but inviting them to dinner. Steven Tueg started his shadow work journey after childhood trauma. He studied under Tony Robbins for a decade and somehow figured out how to blend deep spiritual work with strategic business consulting. He's worked with everyone from Fortune 500 companies to people coming off of Ayahuasca ceremonies. And he wrote a book called Turning Reclaiming your soul from shadow. But here's what grabbed me. Stephen doesn't pretend he's all healed and enlightened. He straight up admits he's still got a traumatized three year old trapped in his body who can show up anytime. He calls himself a soul friend and describes his work as chasing Metanoia. And that means complete spiritual transformation, but with coffee in hand. So if you've ever wondered whether your biggest mess might actually be your greatest message, or if you're curious what happens when you stop running from your shadow and start dancing with it instead, stick around. This conversation's about to get real. Welcome, my brother. How are you doing?

[Steve Duhig]

I'm doing great, man. How are you doing?

[Jim Alstatt]

I'm very well and I'm so glad we are here together today because we've got so much to talk about. And one of the first things I would say is if you're okay, I'd like you to maybe give a, just a brief description of yourself, what you do, and then I'm going to start digging into it a little bit deeper, especially Metanoia concept. So fire away.

[Steve Duhig]

Thank you, brother. So what I do and, and I want to be very clear that people spend years working with me trying to understand some of it. And most of the stuff that I do at a, at a basic level can take at least a weekend just to kind of embed. So I'm going to attempt to jump across all that and give a structure. Everybody that's listening in your mind right now, in your mind just say the word hello and there they are. And they don't ever shut up. And you're floating down the river of the story called you in the boat called Now. And you've always been in that river. And you've always been in the boat called now. Now your mind is anywhere but now. Imagine on the surface of that water. Imagine there's an infinite number of boats that you can be in at any given time. There's 14 trillion things you can be doing at any given moment. You can be anywhere you want. The boat that is you is more than just the boat. There's all these different thoughts that are always. And you're on the surface of this water, and it's just cluttered with all these thoughts, just thoughts everywhere. There's all these different boats, little constructs of meaning. They're all interacting with each other. And we think that we're just the surface. That's just not true. Then you have the subconscious. Well, what does hello mean? H E L L O. You didn't have to worry about. Learn that sound. Everybody say hello. You knew. Intrinsically, you knew what hello meant. You didn't have to reassociate to the sound. That thought is the subconscious. It's the structure of meaning that you know that presents to you like a. Like a. Like a simulation, the presentation that you're experiencing. And then you have all the water. Most people call that unconscious. I like to call that the deep conscious. Because everything down there is moving in a very specific way. It's alive. It's anything but asleep. Well, Robert Fritz says that the mind takes the path of least resistance. The problem is we haven't gone down into the. Into the very bedrock of the flow of the river and what kind of makes it move the way it does. And we all have these stories that we've told ourselves that the part of me that's in the boat doesn't want to hear. I don't want to hear that I'm not good enough. I don't want to hear that you're not going to love me. I don't want to hear that. And so what I do is I project that out into the everyday world and try to avoid that thing that I don't want to happen, that some part of me underneath the water is projecting onto the top of the water. Most people spend their lives chasing something outside of themselves to solve a signal that's happening underneath the water. My work goes underneath the water and basically retunes and recalibrates that signal. So I stop chasing the thing that is causing the thing that's chasing the thing that's these loops and cycles of suffering and trauma that we all experience. I've been doing that for 25 years. I've been chasing different contexts. Chasing the dragon, so to speak.

[Jim Alstatt]

Gotcha. Gotcha.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

So I was thinking about when you're the friend. I was thinking maybe you should start. Maybe you should change that to the scuba diver because you're going under the water there, Doing a little. Doing a little underwater work there. No, that's some big stuff because that's where real change starts to occur, when you can be present and, you know, mindful moments and just examine it in the now. Because you're right. Well, of course you're right. You're an expert in this area. But I mean, it's crazy how we get stuck and what, what was it like 85% of our thoughts or something like that, maybe even higher, are the same thoughts each and every day, so.

[Steve Duhig]

Well, it's a little higher than that. Right. 87. So the National SC foundation suggests just think. And this is a subjective awareness. Just look past. Call it your emotional home. We can call it your default mindset. Just call it the identity you live out of. Just go back and look at your week. Go back and look at your month. Go back and look at your year. 95% of the thoughts you think are repetitive. So, yeah, yeah, yeah, right. Just look at. You've been thinking the same thing week after week after week. You've been navigating from the same internal construct of reality. Week after week, 95%. And the reason is simple. It takes over. It takes over 20% of your caloric intake to process the mind, the brain, that's a lot. It's more than any other organ. And so the mind, you have the thought, the new thought, which is a new concept, new idea, which is a very limited amount. But then you have old thoughts. These are thoughts that have already been thunk. They're more efficient. So the primary directive of the mind is to create, navigate meaning. And then it goes and it evolves that meaning. And then third, which is a hijacking, we've been hijacked to survive. 87% of the 95% of the thoughts. Go back and look at your weeks. Everybody that's listening, go back and look at your weeks, your months, your years, and notice that you're maintaining circumstance. Most people don't build the ideal. Most people manage the circumstance. And that circumstance has been handed by somebody that's been handed by somebody that's been handed all the way back 13.5 billion years. And it's like, well, hold on a minute. Where are you navigating from? Like, what is the idea that carries you? We find that most of those ideas are, I need to solve this problem, which is one type of thought, or this is What I want, this is the thing that I'm yearning for. Most people don't design the ideal. Most people manage circumstance. About 87% of the thoughts that we think are survival rooted attack thoughts. Negative bias, confirmation bias. Right? Yeah, yeah, that's the number. It's 87%. Yes.

[Jim Alstatt]

That 87% has got to be a survival instinct. That, that's so far you brought it right up.

[Steve Duhig]

It is.

[Jim Alstatt]

So when you're talking about those thoughts going back in eons. So is that then belief systems and then patterns that occur from that? Or is it patterns then beliefs or.

[Steve Duhig]

Does it really matter which came from. Yeah, well, what is a belief? So we start to get underneath the water, we start to talk about archetypes, we start to talk about symbols. We start to talk about. Because the mind craves patterns. And like for example, the third facet of a construct of meaning is story, which is the flow. How is this going to end up? And most of us have been taught to orient our existence through the egoic hero's journey, which is the. We go down, we go into the darkness, we go through trials and tribulations, we fight the big ordeal, we get the much. That is the experience, that is the new awareness of who we really are. And, and then we bring that back to the tribe and we cycle through that. That's been the old model, but that model is dead. We need to evolve now past that. Michael Mead calls it the story of the genius, where there's a unique expression that can only come through Jim, that can only come through you. You can't. You're only floating down the river. The story called you. And consciousness is first person perspective. Like if you really think about it, everything that's conscious is always seeing through their. Through first person. There's no information that's not first. Yeah. And so that structure, there's a misalignment that thinks that somehow I need. We become aware of that. And now the question becomes, what is this for? It's time to wake up to the fact that Jim, you're a genius, you're God having a human expression. And what does that mean? Because if we don't come to that because of AI, because of limitless energy, because of, because of, because of, because, because, because. Because of the wonderful things it does. We, we have to come to some kind of awareness of who we are as a creator because we're not going to be able to continue to move forward. It's forcing us to the table.

[Jim Alstatt]

Gotcha.

[Steve Duhig]

That's what's happening. Okay, I Don't know if I, I got off a tangent.

[Jim Alstatt]

No, no, no, no, no, I, you know what? I led you to the rabbit hole and you jumped.

[Steve Duhig]

So that's, it's your fault, Jim. I blame you.

[Jim Alstatt]

I will take the blame. So let's talk about the Metanoia concept.

[Steve Duhig]

Yes.

[Jim Alstatt]

You're you chasing the Metanoia or Metanoia with coffee in hand.

[Steve Duhig]

Yes. The. In my book Turning Within, I tell the story. Metanoia is a, is in, in, in Greek mythology is a character of unknown origin that hangs out with Kiros. And Kiros is the, the goddess of transformation. And I think that just right there is just the richness of God goddess. And Metanoia is a total change at the structural level. We have a misorientation that we are, we are surface dwelling, survival rooted. We're trying to get everything on the flat plane, materialistic. We are creators that have been programmed to be consumers. Which means that I try to solve the signal that's going on down there externally. But again I'm going to come back to say the universe is saying it's time for you to wake up. Everything is getting faster. And what used to take Terence McKenna called it, I think it was zero point. But the amount of novelty that happened every thousand years is now happening about every hundred. And what happened every hundred years is about happening about every 10. And, and the amount of new things, novelty things that happen that used to take 10 years are now happening about every year. And that's both collectively as a species and individually. In my life, my life is really moving fast. I can turn on the News and hit 57 channels of survival rooted programming. Right. It's everywhere. I'm taking in more, I'm processing more. We are speeding up and that speeding up is causing us to have to change the whole way that I have to change the way that I orient my reality. Because I mean just again, 87% of your thinking is survival rooted. And what is that? Well, the mind, it predicts and it steers. That's what it does. But what does it predict from? Well, it predicts from what it knew and what happened back there because of how fast we're going is no longer going to like when we move forward another couple steps, we're not very far off from it. We now are going so fast that the thing that I thought was happening back there that I, because that's really what it is. It's not what really happened. It was my, my blind, deaf and dumb perspective from a three year old. Again, we talked about the three year old. Right. My three year old trying to project onto where we're going. He's not, he's just going to sit and be dumbfounded because it won't line up it. We're being forced to start to make new meaning from the very essence that is now. We have no choice. AI is forcing us to deepen our conscious. So that's a, that's a, that's a metanoia. That's a total, total transformation.

[Jim Alstatt]

So what's interesting with some of the things that you're talking about the universe speeding up and things of that nature, there are a lot of people that.

[Steve Duhig]

Are.

[Jim Alstatt]

Of the belief that our universe, we're leveling up and it is, it is a time where we'll just call it from a spiritual perspective. Spiritual awakenings will start happening to a lot of people. And what I started to think about is where the people are being forced to get up to speed. There's also, it seems like there are a number of people that may not be cool with that leveling up an exit. So I'm wondering if it's coincidence or it's just part of that, that programming or their soul contract or whatever you might want to call it to either get with the program or get out type of thing. And so they're making their choices to head for the exit.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah, I, I, I don't, I just don't, I don't think anybody's here that doesn't know that they're here. Like some part of you came here because of here.

[Jim Alstatt]

There's a reason. I know.

[Steve Duhig]

No, no.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah, I, I absolutely agree with that, that, that people, some people maybe believe in reincarnation, some people may not. But part of that theory or thought process of the reincarnation is that there are lessons to learn or experiences to have. Human experiences to have in our instance, 14 trillion.

[Steve Duhig]

You could have different in any given moment that you can be doing as a human right now in our time and place. Never a time in better time in recorded history to be alive. At least as far as we know. Right?

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah. So far.

[Steve Duhig]

Right, Right.

[Jim Alstatt]

So far. Who knows what the, the next six months is going to have in store based on how things are speeding up, you know, from a hundred. Yeah.

[Steve Duhig]

Wow.

[Jim Alstatt]

I don't think we're going to make it a year before we have these next leaps, you know, it certainly seems that way. So I don't know. You know, I mentioned in, in the opening working for or working with Tony Robbins and to do shadow work. Why don't you tell everyone a little bit about that experience about working with Tony.

[Steve Duhig]

Oh, that was. Again, I'm from Iowa, so I'm a. A Midwest boy from Iowa that had the opportunity to. I had the opportunity to start doing this shadow work. Somehow in the middle of. In the middle of po Dunk, Iowa, there's these group of geniuses that got together and they're doing this thing that's called shadow work. And I got to. I got to. It was in recovery, and these. These guys were all in recovery, and so they started doing their work. And so everybody here has got their path, right? That was the path these guys had found. And I ran into these guys and I was at a workshop and one of them said, this is Tony Robbins stuff. And the next thing you know, I saw Tony Robbins was hiring. And I just kept bugging the guy because I couldn't afford to go to his workshop. So I kept bugging him till they hired me. And that's how I. And so I spent actually a little longer, total about 14, 15 years working for him. And yeah, started working as a par, which is a account manager, which was great. You kind of go to the events and these people are all from a spiral dynamic standpoint. They're striver drivers. They're all just trying to be the very best of. The very best of who they are. They use competition to do so. And just an amazing group of people. And then I started working in the business end because that was kind of my nat. My knack. One of the things. It's just more systems at the end of the day. And the reason I went there is because I saw Tony, he stood somebody up, and within about 15 minutes, you're not going to be able to know what you now know. Like, the thing they saw, they thought was blocking them wasn't the thing that was blocking them at all. They saw that they were creating the very reality. And that's really what I've been. I'm like, he's doing the same thing these guys are doing, but he's doing it on a global level. So I went to work for him and he was just building this business program called Business Mastery. And so they, they. They moved me in there and I kind of got a knack and it's like, well, I want to see if business Matt. I wanted to see if shadow was the same was. Was. Was impacting business was the goal. So I just kept doing shadow, my depth work. I just kept asking the same prompts that kept delivering the same where. Where in your Life. Do you suffer? Where are you finding struggle? And then we go into the struggle, and I keep diving down in there and 99.99. Like there's a book out called Billion Dollar Losses. It's like they went and researched. It's like 87% of all business. It's like you're running the wrong way to begin with. It's like you don't even know when. When they go down and really did the research that at the end of it, it's shadow. The parts that we hide, repress, and denied. I'm projecting something on it and I can't see it. I can only see it from my steering, my predicting, my anticipation. And so I just kept doing that. They ended up building. I mean, he took. When I started working for Tony in the business department, we were doing business mastery events for about a hundred at a time. And we were doing two a year. And by the time I got done, we were doing 5,000 head. We were doing 5,000 head in Las Vegas, and we were doing them in Florida, and we were doing them. Yeah. I mean, it was. It was kind of really a blessing for me because I got to see that this is. This work, it doesn't matter. It scales. The math adds up all the way in, all the way down, all the way and all the way out. But I got the impact at that time. I had this part of me, like, everybody has what I call core shadow. And one of the core shadows, one of them I have is I'm going to be rejected. So first off, the reason I ended up in sales was because that was one of my shadows. You would think, why would somebody who was constantly a fear of being rejected, number one job you probably shouldn't do is go into sales. Well, it allowed me in my structure. Water finds its light consciousness. I could project out on the world. The reason why I'm feeling like I'm going to be rejected is because they're going to reject the. It gave me. I could feel my rejection and go, this feels good. And at the same time, I had also a hero's journey, a structure that if I can get that person to say, yes, maybe, maybe I'll be okay. And then it was, if you can. If you can speak in front of enough people, if you could change enough lives, if you can make a big enough impact. The other one was, I'm going to be a bum. And so I started to bigger, bigger crowds. I grew like, again, I was, structurally speaking, traveling around the world teaching what's called the seven Forces like I was just really more than a small town, Iowa boy should ever, ever. They should have never gave me the keys to that car. Like, you know what I mean? Yeah. But I was. It was. The more I got. The problem was, the more success I had, the more I was certain, the more the. The certainty of going to be a bump. The. The. The gravity of it increased. The farther away I got, the farther up I got. Because my mind.

[Jim Alstatt]

Rubber band pulling you back.

[Steve Duhig]

Well, yeah, because my mind is still holding on to the same. You're going to hit the ground, but now it's like you're five stories up. So the. The fall is going to be much greater. It's going to hurt much more.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah. So just the utter. And so then I had to do something. And we came. We were living in Florida, and I went and Googled ayahuasca. Here we go. Ayahuasca and Orlando. And then I got. At that time, they were going through all kinds of weird struggles and, And. But they were serving ayahuasca here and Orlando. Largest at the time, it was the largest ayahuasca church in the Northwest. It was run by a guy that was. He was in it for the. I think he was in it for the money. I don't know that he was. He was there for the message, but he'd tell you that he never really. His. His awakening was after the medicine, and I think it was all financial, and that's neither here nor there. I came to sit with the medicine and. And had this, and I knew then I'd found another teacher. And so at that point, I left Tony. I quit. I quit a job where I was. The amount of money that I gave up, the role that I gave up, the, the prestige. I was. I just come back from Serbia and two weeks later, I. I said, well, sorry, y'. All. Tony, sorry, brother. It's. It's like he. I gotta go. And I quit. And then a week two after that covet hit to follow around to work. Spend the next five years. Yes, it was. Could not have like timing is everything kind of thing.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah, yeah.

[Steve Duhig]

It was dark night of the soul. I, I. As soon as I jumped off the system, the universe. The system that is the universe. Instantly my mind structured into that. That heroic journey. And I instantly went into trials and tribulations like, you can never start a business at a worse time. Yeah. Well, we were going to do live events where the people would come in an Airbnb and I would teach them this technology and they're not Doing that nobody's flying into Florida, you know what I mean? So it's like, now what are you going to do? So I sat with this plant for. And did their integration, director of integration for like five years a long time research, kind of sitting with the plant and doing integration and doing my own integration and developing all following Tony and it all, everything Tony. If you've followed any of Tony's stuff, it plugs in all the way down to the very mother says it's all pretend, all the way down to the gaze of God, all the way down. His structure works and that's why he's got the following that he's got.

[Jim Alstatt]

And that's, that's interesting because, because I, you know, in the, the spiritual arena and I guess it's all the same, you know, when you're talking about shadow work, that it can be personal shadow work at a soul level. It can also be professional too. Right? Because you're still, you still have those stumbling blocks. You still have those roadblocks that are really, I would say almost always self imposed.

[Steve Duhig]

Always. Well, the reason why you are where you are is I've yet to run into but anybody. My belief is that you're God having a gym experience. And that's not. Woo woo. Very practical. You're, you, you are the primary creative force in your reality. And when somebody says I'm here because of that, well, now what you've done is you've handed off your power to the very thing that you're standing in front of. You're coming from what I call without focus, thinking, this is the reason I feel this way. It's like, stop. You're emanating from within. Stop. And notice that you're standing. Are you standing at the same door that you stood at before? Like again, you could be doing 14 trillion different things, but you're doing this specific thing. And what are the odds that I'm standing in front of here having this? So business is a spiritual sport at the end of the day now I start to work with. I've got 200, I've got a whole community of people now that are. We're trying to get to 144,000 active practitioners so that we can get underneath the water and do a. Everybody flip the switch all at once and see if we can hit a collective where we all wake up from the dreams that we keep forgetting. It's not a forget. Like you said, I'm a three year old on my best day. We keep forgetting that we're having right.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah, that's an interesting talk because I can tell you. So I come from the business world. I've been doing talent acquisition recruiting and I'm really a partner in, you know, strategic thinking and things of that nature with business leaders. And I think a lot of times the thought is you can't have one. There has to be a division of church and state, so to speak. You know what I mean? That you can't bring spirituality into business. But I'm here to tell you that you can. Then it just becomes syntax. It becomes almost a dialect or a different way of communicating the same things. You have to communicate that message in corporate ease.

[Steve Duhig]

Well, there's a message being it isn't the awareness that I think again, this is something that we will come to this awareness either now or very close to now that I call it integrated leadership. I, I as a leader have to understand the structure of the stories that everything's moving in and I have to know where the bottlenecks are in the flow of awareness. Because companies that are only most, most companies, when you go in and look at it, the research is just very profound. The amount of people that are not happy with where they are, they're not engaged.

[Jim Alstatt]

Correct.

[Steve Duhig]

If I'm not engaged, I'm only, I'm what we call. We're paycheck employees. Paycheck employees are only paper thin. Well, how do I make the most efficient, effective. This isn't woo woo. This is very practical. How do I get the most out of an organization? Why? That organization that's moving at the speed of light has to be conscious. We have to be actively conscious, which.

[Jim Alstatt]

Means that all things happening.

[Steve Duhig]

That's right. I had a guy that I'll give you, I'll give you the top example and then I'll give you the bottom example. The top example. Client sold his business, but he started out the family owned business and he wanted to take it to this, the first peak. He said, if I get to this peak and sell it, it'll be great. We get to that first peak and now all of a sudden he sees a second peak. I want to go to that peak. Said, okay, great, we run to the second peak. He sees the third peak. Like, I want to go for this third peak. I'm like, well, you know, right? I'm like, well, you know, there's just another peak after that peak. At that point I told him everything is fractal, right? He's like, no, I want to get to that peak. I said, okay, but when we get to the Next peak. I said you're certain that's the peak? Yep, that's the peak. I said when we get to this next peak I'm going to hold you to that. So we get to the next peak and sure enough he sees yet another peak.

[Jim Alstatt]

Summit. Yeah.

[Steve Duhig]

Right. Well there's, he thinks it's the summit but guess what he's going to find at the end of that peak.

[Jim Alstatt]

Another one.

[Steve Duhig]

He's going to find yet another peak. Well his wife is. His wife has said hey you said that we were gonna. The whole goal was to exit. We've got family, we've got this, we've got that. What when it are you going to really. She starts to wonder if he's going to do what he says he's going to do. Her shadow starts to get triggered. He gets all of his identification. The structure identity is the most powerful force in the human condition. We do anything to stay consistent and persistent with the rules and the labels and the roles that we use to.

[Jim Alstatt]

That you've created for yourself.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah, because I have to steer and I have to predict and that goes all the way down to the beginning of me. So that has to stay consistent so that I know what's what. So now he's got to become something. What's going to happen if I get all my muchness from what's going on here? And now that's all gone.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right, right.

[Steve Duhig]

That's what the real problem. It wasn't each summit. It was that he didn't know what was on the other side of the summit and he knew where he, he knew how to get to the next summit but he didn't know the invisible summit which was the one within. There was, he was, he had to face that. And when he faced that completely different being.

[Jim Alstatt]

Oh it's a breakdown.

[Steve Duhig]

I mean very present, very conscious, very. He's no longer dealing with the strategies. Second thing, let's go with the strategies. If I don't have, if I'm a business owner that that's just got paper thin employees or maybe even employees. Let's talk about challenge versus competition. Most companies inside the structure will pit one team against the other.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yep.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah they have a stack ranker, all that stuff and that builds competition but really what that builds is individual. There's a resistance. Now I may see you as a teammate but some part of me also sees you as a threat. Yep, it has to. The math has to add up.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's with hiring all the time because they don't. They get fearful that somebody's going to look better than them. So the higher.

[Steve Duhig]

Exactly.

[Jim Alstatt]

Lesser individual. So they.

[Steve Duhig]

That. That's even. That's not even. That's not. That's not even. That's the unconscious. They don't even own that that's going on. They'll tell you that. Everybody else does it. Nobody. Nobody wants to say they're the one doing it. Right.

[Jim Alstatt]

No, no. Of course.

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[Jim Alstatt]

Not because then.

[Steve Duhig]

Now that individual. That individual either. If we go to competition, they end up at some point becoming in a silo in their mind because they're having to sing for their food. You lose creativity. So in this, we call it the eight. There's eight directions. We kind of work with the inside. When we go in, there's an archetype. We call it the genius archetype, which is again, the unique expression that can only come through Jim. Well, that's very tender. It's a quiet. It's. Genius is very difficult to. The idea has to come through. It has to be given. You have to breathe life into it. Like genius is born. It's not created. It's not. It's not constructed. Genius comes into the structure, intelligence. If you go and look at AI the way that AI, AI has grown. It wasn't created. It was grown. The data is they tried to grow it. They tried to. They tried to build AI and when they tried to build AI it was a dismal, dismal flop. But when they grew it, which is a completely different structure, that intelligence that's in there, they don't know. They don't really know why. Well, that's because it's grown. It's not, it's not created, it's not, it's not constructed. It's grown. Right. Well, we grow. Now we have this employee that. Yeah. And he's only, he's pinched off the amount of voice that he can bring in because he's worried about what other people are going to do or what happens if they get a hold of my idea. So that's now pinched off at some level. Right. And now how committed am I if I'm a paycheck employee, how committed am I to the outcome of the bottom line? And I'm walking down the road and we'll go back in. One of my clients, front end worker sees the way to save 10 cents on this one thing. Well, 10 cents on a giant corporation is a lot of money at the end of the year if you do that 10 cent thing over and over.

[Jim Alstatt]

Sure.

[Steve Duhig]

But if I'm a paycheck employee and I'm not engaged. Yeah. If I'm not engaged and I'm not, that 10 cents never shows up over here. That has to be seen touching it. You have to kind of be active and engaged. That person that's inside there when they see that and they go huh. And they turn around and engage that. Now they've saved the company. I think we had one in one instance is $187,000. That's a conscious company because everybody is looking around, everybody is active, everybody has the light shining from them. Here's a great metaphor. Here's a great metaphor. Drop the needle. This is a great metaphor. We. My wife was trying to manifest Luke Bryan tickets. Ah, she was certain. And, and I'm, I'm into the law of cultivation. I'm not in the law of attraction, but she's really into the law of attraction. She's going to win these Luke Bryan tickets that are on the, the radio. And I'm. I love my wife and I. And, and I'm absolutely love my wife and, and so I'm going to support her in that. Let's see what happens. Because I believe belief is really what dictates it. So let's see. I said let's see and said my wife is going to win these tickets and come to the end of the event, come the end of the thing. And she hadn't won them but she was certain something was going to happen. And later on that day, interestingly enough, my daughter, my second oldest daughter calls me and she says, what are you guys doing Friday? This is. The concert is Friday. I said, well, we're probably doing what we typically do, which is to go to the grocery store and get ready because we got seven kids, we got a lot of kids, we got plans, and they're all based around taking care of the home life. Right? Yeah. And. And she said, well, if you had the ability to go to a Luke Bryan concert, would you rather go to that? I said, have you talked to Valerie? She said, no. I said, you need to call Valerie right now. So she hangs up. Sure enough, she's got these tickets now. And when that had happened, I had a busted up foot at the time. But there's. It's the. The theater, the concert hall in. In Orlando, the Amway Theater, I think is what it is. And it's giant. And sure enough, we get to the seat and I've got a catacan I'm walking with. There's this. We are literally, Jim, I'm telling you, like, if you're on stage to imagine you're on stage and you're looking out over the crowd, okay, it's the highest, the very top, the tippy top seat. And it's literally the farthest, like, straight across from. It's. I know it wasn't the worst spot because the worst I was. There was this giant cement pillar that was right next to the seat, right? That was the worst view. There was nobody there. The pillar was the worst view. We were right next to that. Okay. So I kept telling my wife, you need to manifest better. Like, I was giving her, because it was. You could look over and you could see these people. Like, it felt. It's a good thing I didn't drink because, man, if you drank too much, it felt like you could just fall right over, you know, terrified. So we're playing it's the end of the night and it's the end of the night and the lights go down and Luke pulls out this piano and he starts to sing that song, Drink a beer.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yep. I know that song.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah. And. And I'm watching my wife because my wife again, she's where I'm there to watch my wife watch the concert. I love. He's great. He's a great performer, great music. But really, for me, the game is watching how she lights up by watching this. Yeah. The joy of the music, the way it moves in her. And this song comes online and she starts. The tears start coming down her eyes and the lights are down low and. And you can't see Any. I can't see this far in front of my nose. And slowly what starts to happen is the people take their phones and they. You know, these lame ass. You've seen it, right? They used to be the lighters. Now it's the phones. And they all start to come on. And as they start to come on, I start to watch as these. This. It's all of a sudden, it's like watching the night sky. Yeah. The glow lighting up. Yes. And at some point, Jim, at some point, the room lights up. It goes to this. There's this quantum jump. There's this. We went from here to here. And I'm telling you, Jim, you can. There's no longer a need for the light even to light up. You can see the guy in the front row drinking a beer kind of thing. You can see. You can see the entire room. And I have gone from having the literal worst seat in the house to the very best possible seat that I could have. I can see God. And I saw that something entered into that room, and we no longer needed that one light to see what was going on. We could see the entire space because everybody lit their own light. That is where we're trying to get to. We're trying to get to that space where. When Jim's genius comes out, when your unique expression of you is finally able to sing its song, as you are liberated from your fears, your presence automatically liberates others. It invites me to sing my song. And through your song and my song, there's this third thing, this third song, there's this third level of genius that presents itself that is undeniable. And we've been seeing this on the carpet, and we've been seeing it on Zoom Calls the book. The information that I'm getting back from how the book is impacting people, it's time to wake up from the dreams that we keep forgetting were happening. I believe that shift from darkness to light. It's 144,000 active practitioners all holding on to this one spot and going, what if I was God having a human experience and it was my struggle that was trying to wake me up and to not say, I get it, but to stop and wrestle with that, like, longer than just a beat, because it's more than a bumper sticker. I believe your struggle is. I used to say suffering is sacred. But I had a practitioner just earlier in the week goes, suffering. The word suffering. She got hooked on that. Struggle was the word that. It's like your struggle is sacred. If I can stop and see When I'm in the struggle and take a breath, recognize that I'm in it. I call it the rain process. It's like, go look at your day. It's the story that carries you the struggle. It could be, I'm not going to be a good dad. It could be I'm not going to be able to afford this. It could be, I don't like this. I don't like that. What is the idea? Recognize where it's struggle, where it's suffering, where it's the same story. Notice you're in it. I recognize it. Then the A is allow and accept. Take a breath. It's okay. You're here, you're humaning, and you've translated your humanness for whatever it is and you're projecting it onto the screen. And this is where you think you're going to die. It's okay that you're here. Take a breath. Now we investigate. I. And that's a. It's a. It's a process. We call it closing the circuit, but just basically investigation is. Where did you pick this idea that somehow you're not. Whatever the translation is? Because suffering doesn't sit in the data, it sits in the story. And then what do I need? What is the part of you need so that it can be the unique expression of God, so that you can carry the grace of God in you? It's like, well, I. That's a lot. It is a lot. And I think we need to wrestle with that. Like, seriously wrestle. Not a. You know, and where we wrestle with it is tell me the story that attempts to steal your joy. Tell me where. Because when you can see where you're lying to yourself, our first rule of shadow work is that you lie to yourself first. Where I can see how I'm lying to myself, I'm going, if I'm lying to myself, if I'm the one causing that, I'm much bigger than what I think I am. And if I'm much bigger than what I think I am, then this thing that I think is going to kill me is nothing. You know what I'm saying? It's either everything or nothing. One of the two.

[Jim Alstatt]

You know, here's the thing. We could probably keep going on this for days, but unfortunately, I'm down to my last question. I can ask you in this segment. Your pain is your genius. Is that kind of what we're talking about? Is that where you're talking about the suffering? Isn't it? Buddha talks about life is suffering, but your pain is Your genius.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah. Gordon Globe has called them disclosure moments. We have these open secrets. It's, it's in the suffering of me. So in the seven layers, at the core of it is the hero's journey. There's a part of me that not given. We once processed a guy who's 70 some years old that just was angry, bitter old man. And we got down to the core of it and what, where it was operating from was. He had. When he was 6 years old, his, his. He was going to tell his life story, he was going to write his life story. And he went to his mom and dad, they read at some kind of a function and he said I'm going to tell somebody who's talking about their life story, said I'm going to write my life story. And mom said, oh sweetie, you're six years old, you don't have a story yet. The most loving way possible. But in his mind, what he took in there was. Nobody wants to hear what you have to say now fast forward. He's a seven year old man. In this entire. That, that moment, it echoed through his whole life. Anytime somebody would cut him off, he would instantly go to that sick like we talked about, the three year old, that six year old little boy would come online and the structure of his ability to orient. And so then he never put himself in a situation where his story would be relevant for fear that that little boy held on to that somehow nobody wanted to hear it. And this beautiful man is now absolutely beautiful soul is wrapped up in this bitterness that comes from this place that he's holding on to back there. And when you can see that, when you truly go down and see where that part of you is existing, it's like all of that is me. All of that is you. And then you find again. When I was three years old, my stepmother, she physically abused me. She, she, she, she beat me, she'd starve me, she. And then she'd stick me in the basement during the day and then she'd bring me out at the end of the day, say, if you say anything, I'll kill you and your sister both. Like this went on for long enough for my mom to figure out what's going. And there's this part of me that feels trapped and like I'm always waiting for you to. Some part of me deep down in me is always waiting to be stuck back in that basement and be abandoned and be trapped down there. And so he orients from there. But now because I've gone down in there, I'VE gone into the interior of my meeting and I've found where that's happening and I'm tending to that. I can now go into the basement called gym, right? And I go, hey buddy, come with me. I want to show you something. I, I can go down there and why? Because I, I live down there. I spent my, my addiction was all.

[Jim Alstatt]

Based on light switch on and we'll shed some light on this, right?

[Steve Duhig]

That.

[Jim Alstatt]

So while you were describing that, something came to mind. And so if nobody, if there's somebody out there who has never gone to therapy or something like that, or seen a therapist, psychologist, whatever you want to call it, the easy thing for that person that you might be having a discussion with could be a loved one, could be whoever who's not.

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[Jim Alstatt]

Some sort of help, right? They'll say, how long are you going to blame your childhood trauma on something you know, get the hell out of it. That's bullshit. Get out of it. And you're talking about a time frame in your childhood, especially early adolescence. 3 years old to 9 years old. Your belief system is being solidified. So how could it not if it's screwed up? How can that not follow you unless you do the work?

[Steve Duhig]

Yes. I call it mental hygiene. It's, it's, it's a requirement. Like we do a thing called the mental cleanse, which is a four week experiential process where we go in and we clean that lens out because that. That. And we're. We're just walking around in sludge. All the meaning that we're living in. These kids that are living in this meaning they've disassociated. Why are they disassociated? Would you want to be turned on at that level in this world? They've disassociated. Thank. Thank them. Thank you, mind for keeping me safe. And I believe what we're seeing here is a structure where we've got to go in. We're being forced to go in. And I'm not going to be able to keep projecting that. You're going to. If this idea that carries me is big enough, I have to stop looking at Jim as though he's a. He's a threat. Going to lock me in the basement. Because, Jim, you and I won't be able to connect on the very soul level that needs for this work to breathe. You know what I mean? It's like it's forcing me to let go. There's no other mother teaches. The only way out is through, and the only way through is in. I have to be willing that the illiterate. The illiterate of our age are not the people that can't read and write. The illiterate of today's age will be the people that can't learn, then unlearn, and then relearn again. Because we've got to deepen. We have to come at it from a soul perspective. We won. I won some money at a home in Iowa. And because the check was written in such a way, it was just a bit off. My. My bank blocked it, and I spent three days on the phone with four or five people. Try. They would. They would put me on hold. They would come back and they would be all angry. I'm like, look, people, this is the hard rock. They're printing these things. You know what I mean? Like, I don't understand what the problem is here. And like, we can't get a hold of anybody. I finally got to a pro. It was a. It was a. It was a fraud specialist supervisor. It wasn't the fraud specialist. It was a fraud specialist supervisor. Her name was Penny. Penny, if you're out there listening, I love you to death. And she said, hold on a minute. She came back. She said, I just get a busy signal. I said, I'll tell you. I can dial the number right now from my. She said, hang on. She came back again. She said, I figured it out. Give me a minute. And Then she came back and she said, here was the problem. She said, everybody that you talked to before, what they were doing is they were calling, they were doing, they were following protocol. Go up on the Internet, find a, find a, find a, a reputable way to validate that this check was real. Call them, verify that it's real, release the funds. They would call and they would get a busy signal. And the reason why was because the bank would not let them call into a casino from an inside line. They didn't know that. They didn't know that. And so they were calling and they were hitting that wall. And Penny said they need to think three layers. They're only trained to think two layers deep. We need them to go a third layer. And I'm here to tell you, Jim, every single person before Penny is replaceable now by AI We've got that guy. We're being forced now to wake up and be present because if we're not, there's already some, somebody. The, the average mind synopsis is a hundred. It's 100 synapses a minute. The through. Through AI and computers, we're talking 10,000 synapses a minute. We're talking a thousand times faster. A system can think over us. And by the year 20 and within the next eight years, AI is going to be smarter than every human on the planet combined. We got that guy. The only way out is through. The only way through is in. We have to wake up from the dreams that we keep forgetting. That's the only additional resource we have is to go in and clean that out so that I can be present with you and be more than just the surface of it.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's, that's a real interesting story there, how that worked. And it's, it's crazy. You know, I was thinking about it. The timing for us to segue into music with have been that Luke Bryan, that would have been perfect. Totally screwed that up.

[Steve Duhig]

But it's a great story. I knew I had to tell it here. I knew, had to tell it here.

[Jim Alstatt]

Absolutely. But here's the thing, you know, I wanted, there's so much more. I wanted to talk about the, the Ayahuasca Church. I wanted to talk about all those other things. So maybe what we'll do is we'll, we'll have you come on again because I, I've really enjoyed this. If you're, if you're up for it, maybe, you know, a little while from now, we'll, we'll do that. But right now, if you're okay with It. We'll get into the musical questions. You cool.

[Steve Duhig]

You gave me those questions. I have to tell you, Jim, you sent me on a two and a half hour going back in time. I had to go back and look, where was I in this time period? And what was. Oh, I remember that song. And then I was sitting in the space in the bubble. The beautiful. Because that's the muchness of life right there. It flows that like the emotion. Your life is the sum quality of the emotions that you experience. And. And we leverage music to. To activate those emotions. So you had me on going on a full fledged.

[Jim Alstatt]

I love that.

[Steve Duhig]

Almost like a witch hunt. It was beautiful.

[Jim Alstatt]

I absolutely love that. And I love the fact that you recognize that that was an opportunity to do what it. It did. Because I In. In part of it. I always say that music is a tie that binds us all together. And I do believe that. And the other thing that the real reason I have those questions is the soundtrack that follows your life because everybody's got it right. So where do you start? And where you start is. What's the first song you fell in love with from the radio?

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah, for me, I had to go look at that. Because the first song, I'm reminded of going to driving with my dad to Gothenburg in his galaxy for. Galaxy. Yes. And then we were in the middle. We were on I I 80, that road that they sing. Bob Seeger sings the song Turn the Page. Okay. That area, that absolute area when he's playing when he wrote that song that, you know, on a long, long and loathsome highway east from Omaha, that's where I was literally. And the song was taken easy by the Eagles.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's a great song.

[Steve Duhig]

Oh, yeah. And at that time be standing like the memory, like, oh, wow. This is. This is the area that Bob sings about. And it was. Take it, take it easy. And it gives me that feeling of being on the road and just moving and allowing. Allowing the flow to just be what it is. You know what I mean?

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah, I do, I do. I'm. I'm a big fan of that. The Eagles version and I'm also a big fan of Travis Tritt's version. I think that's a. That's a good one.

[Steve Duhig]

Oh, yes, yes. It's a good version. Yes, yes, yes. Yeah. Yes.

[Jim Alstatt]

I enjoy that. So with that, when you're talking about road trips, did you guys have a song that you would belt out when you're.

[Steve Duhig]

You asked that question, which song did we belt out? We didn't have anything. We didn't have. Our family wasn't like that. We didn't. My family didn't. When they sung songs it was a different kind of environment. Like so we didn't have any songs. We built it out. We were driving down the road. We were usually doing the Alphabet game.

[Jim Alstatt]

Well you know what, it could even be if I know we're going to fast forward but if you and some buddies were taking a road trip to go on spring break or go someplace like that, it doesn't really matter.

[Steve Duhig]

Well yeah, so then, so then we fast forward a bit. That would be Poison Bel Biv devoe. Right. So that would be going to like going to striper concerts or going to you know, go into. That would be the song that was playing in the background for that. Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's awesome.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

So what, what about. Let's, let's think about this senior year in high school. You're rolling with your boys, windows down. I don't know if you're smoking cigarettes or not. Back then what was. What was your song?

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah, well back then it would have been that. It would have been that big Belbiv DeVoe used to. Back then I was break dancing and so it was Sir Mix a lot and.

[Jim Alstatt]

And did you bring cardboard with you in the trunk?

[Steve Duhig]

Hey, that's not funny man. Me and my buddy used to go up and sit on the. Again you're talking a Midwest boy from Iowa. Right. So I, I didn't actually know where the. I wasn't on the meat. The mean streets of Sioux City South Sioux City, Nebraska. Right. But we would take a cardboard up on the main avenue and we would sure enough we would. An Egyptian lover and just music that was. It would make us move and yes we would sit on cardboard. We used to go to sock ops and, and I, I have walk and stuff like that. Oh I was on Moonwalk. I was on. I. I have awards for. It was a thing like I was a dancer.

[Jim Alstatt]

I enjoyed here.

[Steve Duhig]

Oh brother. When, when the music. Oh yes. There's the. There's the song, there's the dancer and then there's the thing that comes between it. Right. Oh for some part of me just love to be but love to be in the dance.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's very cool. No that's, that's. That's excellent. How about after high school? Did your musical taste change?

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah, we would now shift into tool 46 and two distinctly remember. Yeah. It was a very dark time in my life. So drug ridden like again I come from just. And I remember it was odd Because I didn't know the words to the song. I didn't know. I didn't understand what it was. But some part of me felt the depth of that song. And if you've never played. Go Sit. If you want to hear a song about Shadow Tool 46 and 2. And I would just play that. Just blaring and just driving through the. There's this image of me just absolutely thinking I'm the shit. Driving through a trailer court in this. And this song is just blaring through the speakers. Oh, all angry. And I'm deep up in this. Whatever space Tool had created, Maynard had created. You know what I mean? I had no idea what I was. What I was hearing. But when I look back on that, even then I was aiming for the spot.

[Jim Alstatt]

I was just gonna ask you if. If you ever researched the song to see what it was about.

[Steve Duhig]

I didn't do that until. Until I tell. Until I actually. Until I started doing shadow work. And then when I started doing shadow work, I went. And it came up. And I'm like, no way. And 46 and 2 is the. Is the chromosome. And I believe that, you know, structurally speaking, we go in and we make those adjustments. Rupert Sheldrake. We goes into morphic resonance, and that's what sets that. And that's the. The frequency that my. I don't want to go in the microtubules. Like, let's not go that far. I followed it all the way down to the end of the road. But, yes, I absolutely.

[Jim Alstatt]

Rabbit hole hit it. Did it?

[Steve Duhig]

That's right. Well, it just keeps going.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yes, that's. That's excellent. So let's go the opposite way. What about a song that gets those positive juices flowing?

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah, there's. I mean, I can go. I can go on for days. So I. I had a hard time with this one because we have. In the work, we use music at a level that's.

[Jim Alstatt]

Frequency is huge.

[Steve Duhig]

We use that frequency. Right. So I just. I went with. Just listening. So then I went with the. One of the songs that I tried to go. It's like my ego wants to be very shiny here. Right? But. Pilot by Amber Run, have you ever heard that song?

[Jim Alstatt]

I have not.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah. He says. He says, I don't want to be. I don't want to be. I don't want to be known for something. I don't want to be the center of anything. He said, the song goes, I don't want to be the center of anything. I just want to be part of something bigger. And for some reason, that for me, allows me to just feel as I'm feeling my grandiosity because I'm a big deal, but yet I'm not that big deal at all. Like, I'm not God, but I'm not not God kind of thing. And I hold on to the paradox. Ness of that. It's like I want to be part of something big like that. I can see the structure of it. And then I went with collective soul. Shine would be the other one.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's a great song.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah. And again, talk to me in 10 minutes because we.

[Jim Alstatt]

They can change.

[Steve Duhig]

Those are the song. Yeah, those are the songs that I really.

[Jim Alstatt]

I'm the same way though, man. Especially because music is such a big part of me. One of my. One of my buddies, I have a. A friend who lives in Washington D.C. and we were talking about something and he was. There was a. A challenge. And we're trying to. Working together on, trying to. To solve that, you know, challenge, problem, whatever you want to call it. And then a song popped in my mind and he was just like, holy fuck. And he goes, that's it. And I started laughing and I said, it's funny how that happens. He goes, it must. He must be something to be you. Because he said, I envision you're walking around the house talking on the phone because I have a voiceover IP system for my day job and I have a wireless headset that'll get me 500ft away from the house before it breaks up. And I walk and talk most days. And when I'm doing that and in flow music pops in and it's usually the lyrics. There's a lyric of the song that comes in and it goes, here you go. And boom. And he is. It's got to be fascinating to be your brain.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah. Well, the way your mind. Because I think the deep conscious is trying to communicate with us and. And for you, because you're so musically oriented, you're structured, that music would be the. If we had a feminine expression of the hero's. Archetype of the hero's journey, the feminine expression of the hero's journey would be song. That's interesting, the flow of it. And there's a structure to it. Right. We can anticipate underneath the water that we know we are. We know we get in the ego and we kind of just ride with it and we know where it's going to take us from the flow of it. Right. You could just kind of feel it. I think that there's a lot of song is that just at the very bedrock. That's why it moves us the way it does.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's very cool. So I'm going to fast forward and go to the last question, but I want to get all of your songs so you'll be able to email me your song so we can put it on your playlist. That'd be awesome.

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

So this actually happens to be my favorite question. Sometimes there are songs you hear that ring so true that they can stop you in your tracks, and the song's lyrics either sound like they were written specifically for you or by you. What's that song?

[Steve Duhig]

For us, it would be. It's not the actual person that wrote it, but the. The person that sings it is Robin Sherwell, and it's Landslide. So took my love, took it down. That song, when it's played, I call it at the opening. When you crack open during a piece of work, there's something about it that resonates at a level that it just seems to be very. It's beyond space and time. It's like that eighth day kind of thing where it's all moments and times, and for a minute, I'm just there with that song and there's this beautiful flow cleansing out. It's like I took my love and took it down. I climbed a mountain and I turned around, going down in that space and feeling that it's very. There's something about it that's humbling and cleansing in the same way. And it. I can't hear that enough. I can't watch those lights come on. I can't watch that healing, the healing space that comes on when you play that again. Songs like that. But that song in particular is the one that really reminds me of that light coming on.

[Jim Alstatt]

Well, it's all about you, man. It's what it means to you.

[Steve Duhig]

Yes, exactly. For me, from this perspective, watching those lights come on is. It's the jam, man. It's the gym. Watching you wake up from the dream that you keep forgetting you're having somehow reminds me. It's okay. It's okay that I fall asleep, but it's also okay to wake up. So I love it.

[Jim Alstatt]

Well, it's just about time to cue the music for today's episode, but don't forget to like, like, comment and subscribe to the Drop the Needle podcast to stay up to date on our latest episodes. I'd also like to take a moment to thank everyone again for tuning in today, and I hope you enjoyed this episode of the Drop the Needle podcast. I'd also like to thank our special guest, Steve Duhig. Thank you, Steve, for being on today. How can people get in touch with you to be a part of your collective?

[Steve Duhig]

Yeah, so you can a couple ways. If you have a, if you have a phone, you can just download the app. If you go to Shadow Work app, the app is there. There's a couple programs on there. I'm at. MasteringChange.com is the main kind of. It'll get you into the front door. And then I have over 65 different integration groups that we run every month. We have a non profit called the Evolving Mind Project that's helping get us to that 144000 smoke signals, Jim. Smoke signals, telepathy. I don't care what it is. If you're thinking.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah, no, I'll. You know what?

[Steve Duhig]

All three.

[Jim Alstatt]

Son of a. You're right.

[Steve Duhig]

No, I'm not that good folks.

[Jim Alstatt]

I am. I gave. No, I'm just teasing it. So I'll make sure that I, I include that information so people can get in touch with you. Which then I would invite everyone to head on over to the show notes and I'm going to put a link in the show notes from today's episode that would include your playlist as well as how to get in touch with you. So we'll, we'll make sure everything's on there. All right. My drop the needle posse. Like Billy Joel says, from the highest to the lows, this is the end of our show. Until next time, this is Jim Alstadt wishing you infinite health and happiness and the perfect playlist for your life. Thank you again for being the best part of us. Catch you next time.