How Books Can Shape Success

Summary

The Duct Tape Marketing Podcast

Episode: How Books Can Shape Success
Host: John Jantsch
Guest: Todd Sattersten, CEO of Bard Press
Date: September 3, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this episode, John Jantsch talks with Todd Sattersten, publishing veteran, business book expert, and CEO of Bard Press. Todd shares insights from his latest project, “100 Books for Work and Life,” a curated guide to essential reads that have helped shape thinking on business, personal growth, and success. The conversation explores how impactful books are chosen, their transformative potential, the crossover between work and life lessons, and specific recommendations for entrepreneurs.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Criteria for Selecting the 100 Best Books ([01:35]–[02:40])

• Selection Criteria:
  Todd emphasizes two main factors:
  • The book offers new teachings or a different approach that change the reader’s thinking.
  • Clarity and quality of writing—“Is the writing good? Do I understand what they're trying to teach me?” (Todd Sattersten, [01:50])
• Judgement is both subjective (books he’s read and liked) and objective (impact, quality of ideas, storytelling).

Agonizing Decisions & Book Coverage ([02:40]–[03:42])

• Limited list slots led to tough omissions, including Duct Tape Marketing itself.
• Todd aimed for broad coverage—drawing parallels with Duct Tape Marketing’s approach of “cover[ing] this really broad set of topics within your book, like, what are all the things that a small business owner needs to think about?” (Todd Sattersten, [03:07])

Timing and Impact: The Book at the Right Moment ([03:42]–[05:42])

• Books can be impactful based on when they’re read in one’s journey.
• Todd cites Your Brain at Work by David Rock as particularly formative, helping to understand workplace challenges through neuroscience.
• Re-reading at different times brings new takeaways, sometimes unanticipated even by the author.

Work Meets Life: Blurring the Lines ([05:42]–[08:12])

• Todd describes his past work as constrained by the “business book” label and how his new project intentionally crosses into personal development.
• Grit by Angela Duckworth is highlighted as a book that bridges business and personal lessons.
• “The problems we're dealing with in the workplace often look an awful lot like the problems we're dealing with in our personal lives...” (Todd Sattersten, [06:26])

Relationships and Broader Applications ([07:30]–[08:12])

• Books on topics like relationships (e.g. John Gottman’s work) offer insights for both personal and professional contexts.

The Research and Curation Process ([08:12]–[09:46])

• Project spanned four years.
• Structure: 25 chapters, each focusing on a specific topic with 4 books each.
• Todd read extensively to select, compare, and contrast books, ensuring diverse yet complementary pairings.

Hidden Gems: Books That Deserve More Attention ([10:46]–[11:59])

• Tiny Habits by BJ Fogg is cited as “criminally underrated,” excelling at both habit formation and breaking bad habits—recommended over more popular works in the same space.

What Makes a Book Timeless? ([11:59]–[13:52])

• Timeless books are written in a universal way where “time is not in the text”—e.g. 7 Habits of Highly Effective People, How to Win Friends and Influence People, and Peter Drucker’s The Effective Executive.
• “We still read books like 7 Habits... because they are largely written in a way where time is not in the text.” (Todd Sattersten, [12:23])
• There’s also value in “timely” books that address current contexts.

Renewed Relevance of Classics ([13:52]–[15:19])

• Classics like How to Win Friends and Influence People resonate anew in today’s context.
• “Summarize that book: don't be a jerk—right.” (John Jantsch, [15:03])
• Importance of core human skills (kindness, remembering names, genuine interest).

The Transformative Power of the Right Book at the Right Time ([15:29]–[16:50])

• Todd advises reading outside one’s comfort zone for genuine self-improvement, rather than seeking validation or simply entertainment.
• The book offers 25 different topics, each with 4 book recommendations—encouraging listeners to target areas of true challenge.

Discouraging the “Badge” Mentality ([16:50]–[18:05])

• Huge book counts for their own sake are questioned.
• True learning comes from deep engagement: “I think if you're reading that fast, we can question comprehension... are you working on and learning about the topics that are really difficult for you?” (Todd Sattersten, [17:05])
• The unifying theme across the top books is self-awareness, a predictor for creativity, empathy, and leadership.

The Intentional Reader ([18:22]–[20:24])

• John shares the value of reading with a specific purpose or intention—even drawing lessons from unrelated fields.
• Todd discusses the “Starting” chapter, which captures different types of beginnings (new jobs, businesses, days), demonstrating the power of thematic reading.

Should You Read the Summaries Only? ([20:24]–[21:40])

• Todd’s book provides interpretations and takeaways, not just reviews or summaries.
• His goal: “I want to convince you to go read the book.” (Todd Sattersten, [20:38])
• The book provides opening quotes, synopses, actionable takeaways, and frameworks—but is meant to inspire deeper reading.

Top Three Book Picks for New Entrepreneurs ([21:40]–[25:15])

1. Badass by Kathy Sierra

   • Focus on making your customers as skilled and successful as possible (ideal customer concept).
   • “Make the metric of how much making your customers [successful].” (Todd Sattersten, [22:47])

2. Influence by Robert Cialdini

   • Essential for understanding and responsibly using persuasion in all spheres—investors, employees, customers.
   • “We've got to have good influencing skills... if we don't understand the basics of those pieces, I think we're really missing out.” ([23:00])

3. The Coaching Habit by Michael Bungay Stanier

   • Coaching seen as the primary modern leadership skill for entrepreneurs and managers.
   • “Coaching is such an important skill.” (Todd Sattersten, [24:06])

“The sooner you learn that you don’t have to have all the answers if you’re going to have employees, the better off you’ll be, no question.”
—John Jantsch [25:21]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Reading for Growth:
  “Read in a spot that you are uncomfortable.”
  —Todd Sattersten [15:53]

• On Self-Awareness:
  “If there's one theme that exists across all of these books is the question of self-awareness. All of these books are about building broader self-awareness for whatever it is that we do.”
  —Todd Sattersten [17:40]

• On Habit Books:
  “If you love process, if you love here are the steps, here are the things—I think [B.J. Fogg] does it better than anybody.”
  —Todd Sattersten on Tiny Habits [11:26]

• On Timelessness:
  “They are largely written in a way where time is not in the text.”
  —Todd Sattersten [12:28]

• On Synthesizing Books:
  “You write interpretations of the books... rather than reviews.”
  —Todd Sattersten [20:38]

• On Building Customer Success:
  “Make that the metric... make your customers better than your competitors' customers.”
  —Todd Sattersten [22:47]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Criteria for Book Selection: [01:35]
• Agonizing Over Choices & Book Coverage: [02:40]
• The Impact of Neuroscience Books: [04:11]
• Blurring Lines Between Work & Life: [05:42]
• Including Relationship Books: [07:30]
• Research and Curation Process: [08:41]
• Underrated Books—Tiny Habits: [10:46]
• Timelessness in Business Books: [11:59]
• Classics Regaining Relevance: [14:27]
• Advice on Reading With Intention: [18:22]
• Should You Read Summaries?: [20:24]
• Top 3 Books for Entrepreneurs: [21:56]

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Resources & How to Connect

• Find Todd Sattersten’s work: bardpress.com
• Learn about “100 Books for Work and Life”: The 100 Best (numbered)
• John Jantsch’s resources and consulting: Duct Tape Marketing

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Summary

This episode offers a deep dive into how carefully chosen books can transform both entrepreneurial and personal journeys. Todd Sattersten demystifies the curation process, champions intentional, self-aware reading, and leaves listeners with actionable advice and concrete book recommendations—making the case that reading, when approached thoughtfully, is a critical lever for growth in business and life.

Transcript

[A]

You know, over the years, you've heard me talk a lot about marketing systems. Today I get to share something really special. My daughter, Sarah Nay, who also happens to be the CEO of Duct Tape Marketing, just released her first book. It's called Unchained Breaking Free from Broken Marketing Models and How Small Business Can Finally Take Control of Their Marketing lead with strategy and scale with AI. I know, a mouthful, right? But it's everything we've learned taken to the next level. In fact, we're even calling it duct tape marketing 3.0. As a dad, I couldn't be prouder. But I want you to check it out at DTM World, slash Unchained and get ready to take your strategy to a whole new level. Hello and welcome to another episode of the Duct Tape Marketing podcast. This is Jon Jansen. My guest today is Todd Satterston. He's a publishing veteran, business book expert and CEO of Bard Press. He's helped launch and shape bestsellers like the One Thing and the Gift of Struggle. With a career spanning more than two decades in the book industry, Todd is known for discerning eye for Transformative Business and self help books. With that in mind, we're going to talk about his latest project, 100 Books for Work and and Life. It distills a lifetime of reading and curating into an essential guide for anyone seeking wisdom, growth and practical tools for success. So, Todd, welcome to the show.

[B]

John, thanks for having me.

[A]

Out of the billions of books out there, you have called out what you're calling the the 100 best. So was there a selection process or was it really just like, hey, these are all books I've read and liked. Was there a criteria?

[B]

Well, I think both are true and I think there's certain criteria. I think the first thing that I look for in books now, are they teaching me? Are they approaching the project in a different manner? Right. Like all of us have been doing this long enough. Whether I've just started in the industry or I've read lots of books and I have lots of experience, we need something that changes our thinking about really important topics. I think that's the first thing. I think the second thing is, gosh, I want clarity, right? I want books that when I read them, I'm going, yes, this makes sense. I understand it. It's good storytelling. Like, you're really judging the book just as a book. Like as a almost in an art kind of way. Like, is the writing good? Do I understand what they're trying to teach me? I'd say those are probably the two most important things I would say.

[A]

So were there any. Let's just get this out of the way right now, okay? Were there any books that you just. Just were, like, agonized over? Not including.

[B]

Yes. Duct tape marketing. Like, of course I had to. I had to agonize over that. Well, here's what I think is interesting. I was thinking about these parallels before I came on that I think the Hundred Best has a lot of Perilous 2 duct tape marketing. And what I mean by that is what I love about your book and what I've loved about it from the start. You and I hung out in the old 800 cre days that you cover this really broad set of topics within your book, like, what are all the things that a small business owner needs to think about? I tried to do something similar in the 100 best, where I said, let's make a small chapter on customers. What does an ideal customer look like? Let's make a small chapter on marketing, on sales, on influence. So there's a. Where do I go put duct tape marketing was like kind of one of those problems that we had to go solve. So, yes, of course there were books I had to leave out. Cause you get to a point, there's only 100 slots. How do you, you know, how do you get there?

[A]

So. So are there any. Are there any books that. That are on the list that you would say, hey, this hit me at the right moment? Because I think sometimes books are impactful because that's what you needed to read. Right. And there are times when I've gone back and reread a book, and I was like, wow, when did they put that in there? You know, because it didn't mean anything to me at the time because I didn't understand. So were there any examples of these books that you feel like, hey, they've really changed my career, my direction?

[B]

You know, I think that when you look at books in general and you look at the last 20, 25 years of business and self help, I think the neuroscience, just the study and expansion of how much we know about neuroscience, has really changed our view on a whole wide range of things. So the book that I think does this best in encapsulating that and encapsulating that in a work setting in particular, is a book called you'd Brain at Work by David Rock. I think he's done the best job of taking this neuroscience, saying, hey, when you're frustrated at work, this is probably what's going on. Hey, when you get into A situation where you show up, work late for a meeting, and you're going in, you need to try to bring your best self to that meeting. Here's the things you need to be aware of that are probably going on with you, like, literally in your brain, that if you don't slow down just a little bit, you're probably going to miss an opportunity in those next moments that are really important to you. So I just love how he finds these moments that are normally challenging for us in a variety of different ways, and then shows us what's going on and then gives us a different approach to those. So I gotta be honest, that's one that I keep coming back to. I relate to what you were just talking about, John, that my experience is going back to the book where you go, how come I don't see the thing that I thought this book was about? Or where you just end up having a whole different thought that sometimes the author didn't even intend, and you end up with this completely different learning. So I sometimes like those experiences as well.

[A]

So this isn't just about business, obviously. You cover a lot of work, certainly, but you cover a lot of life. Are these so interrelated that you felt like, you know, I don't have to choose one or the other or have a balance. It's like, you know, these things all go together. So were there any books that you felt like. Or you feel like, really blurred the lines between those two?

[B]

Yeah. So one of the reasons I wrote a book about 15 years ago called the Hundred Best Business Books of All Time. And what I found with that is it was super helpful. A lot of people loved it, but I found that categorization a little confining, that there were topics that I couldn't talk about that I wanted to. And to your point here, I love that I think we've gotten to a point in most work settings that we realize the problems that we're dealing with in the workplace often look an awful lot like the problems we're dealing with in our personal lives. Whether it's, you know, at home, whether it's. I'm on a. I'm on a community board, whether whatever the case might be. And so I love the fact that I can put both of those together. So one example I would think of that I think really fits this is I'm a huge fan of Grit by Angela Duckworth. Is that a business book? Kind of.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Is it a personal development book? Yeah. But when I create this frame for the hundred best that I can Put both in there. I think then there's an opportunity for us to have these bigger discussions of things we're trying to do in both parts and maybe even break down the barrier between the two.

[A]

Yeah. And I think especially I work with a lot of entrepreneurs, you know, that there is no. There's no blurring of the lines because there is no line. And so, you know, I will often have people come on, talk about health and fitness, you know, on. On my show, because it's really applicable. Right?

[B]

Yeah. I mean, I always think about. There's a chapter in here about relationships now, and relationships wouldn't be something that I think would necessarily fit in a book about business books. But I love the fact that I might read a book by, say, John Gottman, who I think is probably the. One of the leading experts on sort of marriage and long partnerships, and that if I don't learn something that lets me bring. That I can't bring into my workplace, that I can build better relationships in those places, then I think I'm missing something. So I just love this opportunity to bring more books. And I think people generally want to read those kind of books where they can. They can see an improvement across all aspects of their lives.

[A]

So how much research, additional research did you have to do? I'm. I suspect half of these books you read professionally or because you were personally interested. I wrote a book a few years back where I had to actually do a deep dive into most of the transcendental literature, so Emerson and Thoreau and whatnot. And I mean, I had spent six months, you know, reading stuff that I was familiar with but certainly hadn't read. Did you kind of have a similar thing where you kind of had your topics together and then you just went on this giant reading bench?

[B]

Yeah. So it took four years to put the book together. And so it sounds kind of similar in that I would say that going in, I probably knew 60 to 70 of the books that should be in here. And I probably knew there's 25 chapters. We haven't said that yet. There's 25 chapters. Each chapter has roughly four books. So you get this really concentrated view of a very particular topic or problem that you're trying to work on. And my experience was that I, you know, so I'd read probably two thirds of the books over those last 10 or 15 years. I read 50, 60, 70 books a year, probably a book a week. And so I had a lot. I had a wonderful backlog. But then in that additional time, what are the books that belong next to those, or how do I decide that the one thing should be in focus rather than goal setting, rather than habits? So some of that sorting of where do you put a book and create interesting books next to each other to kind of create good contrast? I would say that was where the additional work was, the sorting and then figuring out where do I fill in the blanks?

[A]

You know, over the years, you've heard me talk a lot about marketing systems. Today I get to share something really special. My daughter, Sarah Nay, who also happens to be the CEO of Duct Tape Marketing, just released her first book. It's called Unchained Breaking Free From Broken Marketing Models and How Small Business Can Finally Take Control of Their Marketing lead with strategy and scale with. With AI. I know, a mouthful, right? But it's everything we've learned taken to the next level. In fact, we're even calling it duct tape marketing 3.0. As a dad, I couldn't be prouder. But I want you to check it out at DTM World Unchained and get ready to take your strategy to a whole new level. I know a lot of these books, probably, especially in the business category, probably had half of the authors on my show, but there's some that I've not heard of. I mean, on this list, if you're going to pick one title that you think is like, criminally underrated or misunderstood, is there one?

[B]

Oh, that's a great question. So I'm looking at my shelf right here. I have all 100 sitting right here. Here's what I would say. I think that Tiny Habits by BJ Fogg is criminally underrated. I think there's. What's fascinating to me about the habit space is that you had a book like A Power of Habit, Charles Duhigg. A lot of people love that. A good summary of all the research. Kind of very meta journalist take, right? You have Atomic Habits, which if you don't have a copy, you have three copies. And if you haven't tripped over it in any bookstore, 25 million copies. Thanks, James Clear, right? But B.J. fogg is a book that came out roughly in the same era as Atomic Habits. And I think that if you love process, if you love. Here are the steps, here are the things. I think he does it better than anybody. Both figuring out how to form good habits, but then actually also how to break bad habits. I think it's. He perfectly addresses both of those. And I think we all have both of those that we got to work on. So, yeah, please go check Out Tiny Habits.

[A]

I know that was unfair to say which. You know which one, but. But I think you nailed it. So some of these books are old, decades old. Right. Some are much more recent. Any patterns that you would say, hey, this is what makes a book truly timeless. A business book particularly. Or was there a recent book, frankly, that you think, hey, this is going to stand the test of time?

[B]

Yeah, I think we still read books like 7 Habits of Highly Effective People. We still read how to Win Friends and Influence People because they are largely written in a way where time is not in the text. They're talking about something. They're talking about literally a conversation with someone, a situation they found themselves in. And you wouldn't know if it was today or if it was in 1920. And so I think the books that stand the test of time, Peter Drucker's Effective Executive I think is another book that fits in this category. Here you've got these books that are written in the 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s, I guess into the 80s. Like that's what 7 Habits was. I think those are the kinds of books that stand the test of time. So I think that piece is important. I also think, though, we should have books that we put next to those that do speak to a modern context. Like, if you think about books that work, I don't know what the dividing line is. Maybe it's 2010, maybe it's 2005, sort of pre iPhone, post iPhone. Like, it's hard to know what to do if they're focused on technology. Like, how do you. Right. How do you figure out which book to work on? So I think that you can write a book that's timeless. And I also think there are timely books that are also important. Important and understand that they're helpful. Right now I'm going to use that information, the context is right, and that there may be another book that readdresses that five or ten years from now.

[A]

All right, are there any books that you feel like, let's see, the right way to answer are kind of newly relevant. Like you mentioned, Peter Drucker, one of my favorite books is the Practice of Management. And I think it's actually in some ways newly relevant. I mean, the language is old fashioned. I mean, he uses a lot of the man, you know, pronouns, you know, when he's talking about business and whatnot. But I think that some of the idea of trust and that marketing and innovation are, you know, the key components of a business I feel. Feels newly relevant. Did you find any books that did that for you.

[B]

I think the book that I always go back to and that I'm. That I'm frankly shocked by is how to Win Friends Influence People.

[A]

Yeah, it's crazy, isn't it?

[B]

I was at the, I was gonna say hairdresser, I guess the barber the other day. I was talking about the book and they're like, oh my God, I love how to Influence and Influence People. I thought you've read how to Win Friends and Influence People and they're saying it's so topical. It fits what I try to do. Every day it makes more sense. It makes so much sense to me. And again, what are we saying? We're saying these are the same things. I mean, humans have not changed a lot in the last hundred years.

[A]

Summarize that book. Don't be a jerk.

[B]

Right. Know someone's name, pay attention to what's going on with them. Like, gosh, those are just good human qualities. And by the way, it might make them feel more warmly about you.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

In these days and times when everybody kind of looks like this, and for those who are listening, I'm looking at my hand that looks like my phone. Some of those reminders are really important.

[A]

You provide, I think, some guidance in this about when to read what in life. So can you share any stories, examples, how the right book at the right time can be transformative?

[B]

Yeah, I mean, the first thing I want to say is that I think we love reading books that we're really comfortable with. Like what things that we already know things about or validating.

[A]

Almost.

[B]

Yeah, validate. Yeah, lots of almost. Reading for business entertainment. Like, I'm entertained because, oh gosh, such an interesting story. Whatever else, the encouragement I would try to give your listeners today would be read in a spot that you are uncomfortable. So if, you know, if you open up the end pages, the very front of the book in the hundred best, we have 25 different topics. My guess is there's something you're trying to work on that's really difficult. And I'm going to give you four books to sort of survey that problem, kind of survey the area of where that problem, what that problem might look like and four different solutions for how that, how you deal with it. So if there's anything I would love people to do is I'd love people to do read more for really true self improvement rather than maybe for, I don't want to say fake, but maybe for a validation. I like your word really well there.

[A]

Well, there definitely are. You see it all the time in Social posts. You know, I've read 473 books this year and I'm wondering if you're sort of suggesting like reading for volume or for the badge, you know, is probably not going to help you any.

[B]

Yeah, I think that if you're reading that fast, I think we can question comprehension. Yeah, I think if you're reading that fast we can also again question are you working on and learning about the topics that are really difficult for you? One of the things I always remember, John, is that when they do eye scans of people reading, it's amazing how fast they go back over what they read. That it isn't some continuous down the page, it's a sentence. Wait, let me read that sentence Prior, let me read that sentence again. That kind of reading is the reading that I want to encourage people to have that they're being challenged by what it is. Like if there's one theme that exists across all of these books is the question of self awareness. All of these books are about building broader self awareness for whatever it is that we do. And it turns out self awareness is a high predictor of creativity. It's a high predictive ability predictor of empathy.

[A]

So leadership, Leadership.

[B]

Right on and on. Just changing your awareness of a problem, of being willing to look at the problem changes how you view the problem. Like that's what the self awareness mindfulness folks say. So gosh, that would be my biggest piece of advice I think I would give to anybody.

[A]

You know, and I think you mentioned this specifically in there. This idea of reading with intention I have for years, kind of, I must admit I, you know, I have to do a lot of professional reading sometimes that is to do this job. But there's many times where I have, especially early on in my career when I would pick up a book with the intention of trying to find an answer to a specific problem or with the intention of saying I'm going to read this unrelated book and it's a book about architecture, for example, and I'm going to look for examples of how to build community for, you know, as a way to process like a new way to look at something that nobody's. I mean the author did not intend that to be in the book, but it was rife with examples that I could then apply to a whole other way. I'd love to hear your thoughts on that. But then just really more on this idea of reading with intention.

[B]

Yes, I think the most interesting chapter for me in the Hundred Best is a book is a chapter called Starting and In that chapter I have, what is it like to start a new job? What's it like to start a career if I'm in my 20s? What's it like to start my morning? Miracle Morning by Hal Elrod. What's it like to start a new business? So I love what you're talking about there, John, because I'll bet you I could read through that chapter and be inspired in new things that I'm trying to do independent of the timeframe almost that we're speaking of. And I think in each one of those, you would see something new or different or like the example I gave earlier. Go read all the books on relationships and see all the other relationships that you might be able to influence, whether it's business relationships, whether it's personal relationships. There's a power in a relationship's relationship, no matter what. Like, it's only what barriers we put between them that cause the trouble that we get ourselves into, frankly.

[A]

So you synthesize most of these books into, some cases a page, two pages. Am I going to, like, get the essence there and, like, thanks, Todd, for reading that book for me, or do you really suggest that, like, if something resonates, go get the book?

[B]

Yeah. So my intention, both with this book and with the prior book, was always, I want to convince you to go read the book. Like, I want to give you. Like, someone described this to me the other day. He's. They said, I don't feel like they're reviews of the books, but rather you write interpretations of the books. Like, there's an interpretation there of here's something that's really important that this author is bringing up. I would think there's a rough summary, frankly, of what you get out of each one of them. But I try to give an opening quote to kind of frame up what I think the author's really talking about. Oftentimes it's the promise of the book followed by that interpretation. 600 words, 700 words. And then there's a takeaway at the end of every review of, like, here's something, if you wanted some more questions to think about, maybe a short framework that kind of frames up how the author talks about it. So I try to give a lot of different utility within those reviews that even if you just read the review, John, I think you would still get something out of it. But, gosh, do I hope you go read these books. Absolutely.

[A]

Okay, here comes the terribly unfair question. Okay, if I was a young entrepreneur just getting started, and I came to you and said, todd, give Me three. Give me three books. That's all I can afford right now. Are there three you would choose and why?

[B]

Yes, the first book I would probably choose Young Entrepreneur. That was the. That's the person, the Persona we're talking about. First book I would have someone go read is Badass by Kathy Sierra. And again, I'm going to tie this to your framework. One of the first things you say is make sure we understand who your ideal customer is. Kathy does it as well as anybody. And this is her. This is my favorite line from her. We shouldn't compete about. How does she say it? She wants us to compete for having the most educated, the most successful customers, like the best users, the people who can do it better than everyone else. So I think that's the first one, I would say. I think that one's really good.

[A]

I love that because, I mean, that's. They're going to get results.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You're going to actually help them.

[B]

Right, right, right, right. Make that the metric. Make the metric of how much making your customers. And if you do it better than your competitors, you're not going to have any problem being successful. Right?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So that's one.

[B]

That one's really important to me. I don't know how you can't probably read Cialdini book Influence. Gosh. Entrepreneurs we are. Whether we're talking to investors, customers, employees, other stakeholders, we've got to have good influencing skills. We've got to understand what tools are available to us in a variety of different situations. And if we don't, like, understand authority versus making, commitments versus scarcity versus liking, and we just don't understand the basics of those pieces, I think we're really missing out.

[A]

No, Robert told me that he actually wrote that book so people wouldn't be unduly influenced and then created, like, the greatest book on influence. Yeah.

[B]

Well, he said he was afraid he'd be too much of a dupe for the techniques that people would use. And so I feel like you can read that book and say, like, almost like you said, you can use them for forces of evil, but I think you can also use them for the forces of good. So I'm hoping.

[A]

Yeah, that certainly. Right, Absolutely. All right. We're up to number three.

[B]

Number three. I think if I am an entrepreneur, then the last thing I need to be able to do is I need to be able to coach people, frankly. And I think coaching is an underrated skill. I think it's becoming the primary skill of being a good manager is with these new with these, with the new generations, what kind of management they're looking for. They're not looking for how to be told what to do. They're looking for, gosh, how can you make me better at what I'm doing? So I think coaching's really good. I'm going to probably go with the Coaching Habit by Michael Bengay Stainer. It's a short book. There's seven questions. And if those seven questions don't improve the conversations again that you're having with your employees, that you're having with your spouse, when they're struggling, when you're having with your kids, I can't. I can't say possibly, like, it's the surest way into it and then go check out the other three books that I've got on coaching in the 100 best. But coaching is such an important skill. Am I, John, am I on the right track there? Do you agree, like, when you think about entrepreneurship coaching.

[A]

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it's unfair to say three because, you know, you could throw the mba, Josh's book in there.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You know, there's so many books you could throw in there, but certainly as a leadership skill, the sooner you learn that you don't have to have all the answers if you're going to have employees, you know, the better off you'll be, no question. So, Todd, I appreciate you taking a few moments to stop by the Duck Tape Marketing podcast. Where do you want to invite people to connect with you and obviously pick up a copy of 100 Best Books.

[B]

Yeah, I think all of our work [e-mail] if you want to find out more information about the book itself. It's the 100. The number. The 100 best.

[A]

Awesome. Well, again, I appreciate you stopping by and hopefully we'll run into you again soon out there on the road.

[B]

Thanks, John.

[A]

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