99.5.) Jason Lee & Rosenberg Square Off On ‘Culture Vulture’ Comments

Summary

The Ebro, Laura, Rosenberg Show Episode: 99.5 – Jason Lee & Rosenberg Square Off On ‘Culture Vulture’ Comments Date: May 14, 2026

---

Episode Overview

This episode pivots around media mogul Jason Lee’s much-anticipated appearance, where he and Peter Rosenberg directly confront Lee’s past labeling of Rosenberg as a “culture vulture.” The conversation swirls through their personal and professional history, the power dynamics in media, what it means to be an “ally,” and the shifting landscape of modern hip-hop commentary and gossip. The tone jumps between fiery, vulnerable, and introspective, hitting heavy on the evolution of independent Black and hip-hop media, internet trolling, and personal accountability.

---

Main Themes & Segments

1. Setting the Stage: Honest Talk About Burnout & Motivation

[00:00 – 15:00]

• Rosenberg opens up about work-life balance: Shares struggles with “too many jobs,” being a new parent, and feeling the pressure of “validation” from his father.
  • “This is a labor of love… even if the money was pouring in, I don’t think that would much alter the fact that the busyness is hard." - Rosenberg [01:48]
  • Discussion on “validate me,” Rosenberg’s new project and parental expectations.
• Personal moments: Rosenberg shares the joy and bittersweet aspects of early fatherhood. Laura joins with her own experience about snapping back after childbirth and internet criticism.
  • “We’re living in a snapback world… everyone thinks you’re supposed to just snap back.” – Laura [14:10]
• Musing on authenticity and audience expectations.

---

2. Jason Lee Enters: Clearing the Air on Past Beefs

[15:12 – 24:00]

• Accusations aired: Jason Lee confronts Rosenberg/Ebro about feeling slighted by the show during previous press runs (“y’all didn’t want me here”).
  • “I don’t expect to be wanted everywhere I go.” – Jason Lee [15:41]
  • Line blurs between perceived offense and “the clip economy” – both sides admit to using viral moments to drive engagement.
• Admits to “running with the clip” taken out of context for viral leverage, recognizing the realities of independent media:
  • “When you’re independent… you need the viral to–” – Jason Lee [17:16]
  • Key Quote: “Nobody cares about the truth. They don’t care about streets.” – Ebro [17:32]
• The real beef: “Culture Vulture” comments:
  • Tension peaks as they revisit Jason’s labeling of Rosenberg. Rosenberg pushes Jason: “Why did you publicly label me?” [30:24]
  • Escalates to identity politics and the boundaries of allyship:
    • “You ain’t suck dick and you ain’t Black. So you’ll never really know.” – Jason Lee [35:06]

---

3. Deep Dive: What is a “Culture Vulture”? Who Gets to Decide?

[24:05 – 38:00]

• Rosenberg’s defense: Breaks down decades of commitment to hip-hop, amplifying Black artists, and breaking new acts.
  • “Being a culture vulture is taking from the culture, not giving back. I have always and always will prioritize giving back.” – Rosenberg [32:52]
• Jason’s rebuttal: Holds fast to his opinion, acknowledges its subjectivity:
  • “If I feel you’re a culture vulture… I would say it, you know.” – Jason Lee [29:17]
• Ebro steps in to contextualize: Differentiates music journalism, gossip, and the varied career trajectories within hip-hop media.
  • “There’s the music and then there’s the gossip… There are different ways to approach the whole thing.” – Ebro [38:18]

---

4. Media, Truth, & ‘The Clip Economy’

[38:16 - 52:00]

• Jason’s evolution: Describes shift from “reckless” viral moments to more responsible, measured commentary post-therapy and entering politics.
  • “I have to be more responsible. And that’s why you’ve seen probably less viral moments than when I was out just recklessly not giving a f**.”* – Jason Lee [41:05]
• Paid Media & Viral Loops: Reveals how podcasts, The Shade Room, Hollywood Unlocked, etc. now accept payment for posts—sometimes; relationships and virality matter more than cash.
  • “Sometimes we do or don’t. It just really depends.” – Jason Lee [51:23]

---

5. Independence vs Corporate Media: Big Picture Threats

[52:02 - 56:36]

• Corporate takeover warnings: Both Ebro & Jason discuss the existential risk posed by major corporations (CBS, Ellison family/Oracle, VCs) to Black and independent media.
  • “That’s why I’m moving in the space of acquiring other platforms… to buy the block back.” – Jason Lee [54:25]
• Politics, activism, and authenticity: Jason shares efforts to influence politics, frustrations with Democratic power structures, and the need for media platforms to represent community interests.

---

6. Personal Growth, Redemption, and Therapy

[49:54 – 61:38]

• Jason reflects on lessons from his feud with Karen Civil and Charlamagne, therapy’s role in his growth, and his philosophy on second chances:
  • “I see it… I believe everybody deserves redemption.” – Jason Lee [50:04]
• Shares insights into his own “glow-up”—weight loss journey, therapy, changing his approach to work and relationships.

---

7. Politics & Social Change: Vision for the Future

[61:51 - 67:45]

• Jason on running for city office: Outlines concrete contributions in Stockton, from housing grants to opening new health facilities for youth.
• Corruption, homophobia, & dissemination: Discusses the attacks he received as a gay Black public official, the tabloid campaigns to discredit him, and how he counters with transparency and community work.
  • “I don’t play that with people… my constituents know me.” – Jason Lee [59:21]
• Candid takes on the 2026 elections, Democratic strategies, and the erosion of voting rights and Black empowerment.

---

8. Notable Quotes & Viral Moments

• “We live in a clip-based world. I’m the sum of the clip.” – Jason Lee [17:01]
• “You ain’t suck dick and you ain’t Black. So you’ll never really know.” – Jason Lee [35:06] (context: limits of allyship)
• “All I’m trying to say is, to me, being a culture vulture is taking from the culture, not giving back.” – Rosenberg [32:52]
• “When you’re independent...you need the viral...” – Jason Lee [17:16]
• “Opinions are opinions. So I could say whatever I want. It’s my opinion. That’s why I said you’re perfect for politics.” – Rosenberg [69:02]

---

Memorable Moments & Timestamps

• [17:32] – “Nobody cares about the truth. They don’t care about streets.” – Ebro
• [35:06] – Allyship debate: “You ain’t suck dick and you ain’t Black. So you’ll never really know.” – Jason Lee
• [41:05] – “I’m in therapy. I have the platform. I gotta be more responsible.” – Jason Lee
• [50:04] – “I believe everybody deserves redemption.” – Jason Lee
• [54:25] – “That’s why I’m moving in the space of acquiring other platforms… to buy the block back.” – Jason Lee
• [66:32] – “Give [Kamala] her flowers because she literally told us what was going to happen.” – Jason Lee
• [69:02] – “Opinions are opinions… That’s why I said you’re perfect for politics.” – Rosenberg

---

Post-Interview Reflection

• Ebro, Laura, and Rosenberg debrief, agreeing the conversation was valuable, if ultimately unresolved. Rosenberg laments Lee’s unwillingness to engage deeper, Ebro calls Lee “a troll” but recognizes his drive and real contributions in Stockton.
  • “He doesn’t care very much about truth. And then that’s it, we move on.” – Rosenberg [71:02]

---

Summary: Takeaways for Listeners

• Nuanced Media criticism: The line between advancing the culture and exploiting it is hotly contested—sometimes along lines of race, history, and intent.
• Internet rules all: “Clip economy” is king—authenticity, controversy, and virality drive reach and revenue, often at the expense of context or truth.
• Personal battles impact professional dynamics, especially when histories are remembered differently or minimized.
• Black and independent media remain under threat: Corporate consolidation and political headwinds require solidarity, not infighting.
• Redemption and growth are possible, but hard-won and often underappreciated in public discourse.

---

For those who missed the episode, this was a raw, at times combative, but ultimately human conversation about respect, pain, cultural belonging, and survival in both media and politics. The debate over what—and who—defines hip-hop’s center is far from settled, but everyone left the table with at least a little more understanding of the other side.

---

Full Show on YouTube, clips incoming.

Transcript

[A]

Just don't call it a podcast.

[B]

The Ebro Laura Rosenberg show.

[A]

Oh, there you go. There was a delay. You hit it once and then it didn't respond. So I thought I had to hit it again. But that was actually stopping it. It's not starting it, but we're starting the show. The Thursday show. The Ebro Laura Rosenberg Show.

[C]

Hello.

[D]

Hello. Patreon is up.

[C]

Patreon is up.

[A]

Now. Rosenberg, I asked you earlier this week, I believe, how you felt about the Patreon, because you were not happy during the Patreon.

[D]

I just wasn't in a good mood.

[A]

Was it just a bad mood or was it tired from the weekend? Like, I'm really trying to understand what was going on.

[D]

Was it that, I don't know, was it that crazy? I felt like it was like my,

[C]

I mean, not weekend because it was Wednesday. So, you know, it's like, no, we

[D]

taped it on Monday. We don't need to lie to these people anymore. Well, no, I mean, because Ebro ends up confusing and he goes, yesterday, I mean, people saw our outfits. It was the same as our Monday outfits.

[A]

Sorry, sorry.

[D]

I'm sorry. I appreciate, I actually appreciate continuity efforts. Yeah, no, it was just, I don't know, you keep asking me about it. I, I struggle with certain things and then if I'm in a bad. Which I think all people do.

[A]

Yeah, it's completely.

[D]

When I'm in a bad mood though, I, I sort to some of those things. And it's Monday and I have a lot going on and you know, we have a one in four month old and I get home from work and then there's more stuff to do and then I'm in bed again and it's run it back again and it's just, you know.

[A]

So you're feeling the weight of the work.

[D]

Yeah, My Monday through my first four days of the week, it's just a very hectic start to the week. Always.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

You know, and I don't know if you know this, but like, you know, the big bucks aren't rolling in from the work that we're applying to the show at this point. So like this is a labor of love and we need to make sure everybody's paid to do the show and business has to get run. And even if, by the way, even if the money was pouring in, I don't think that would much alter the fact that the busyness is hard.

[A]

Yeah, I was going to call, I was going to call bullish on the money.

[D]

Yeah. Because I was making the money before, and I was still selling. Yeah. So it's all of the things. And, you know, Omar and I have been finishing this room over here to get Validate Me ready, and I have nerves about that. My dad this week was like, so what will, like, success look like for that show?

[C]

For Validate me.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

And in my brain, I'm going, oh, this is so deep. This is why I need the show in the first place. You don't even know, like, my dad. I love my dad so much, but, like, he doesn't understand that him even asking me questions like that is putting on me his concerns about what I do being worthwhile to other people because, you know, there's no validation. Like, the validation your kids get. You see what I'm saying? My dad gets validated by my successes. So when he asked me, like, what does success look like for that? It could just be a totally innocuous question. It could also be him being like, I'm concerned it might not be successful and look like.

[A]

But it. It could also be. I'm concerned that you don't even know what successful looks like for this endeavor, and you're burdening yourself with another thing.

[D]

Could be.

[A]

And I'm worried about you, because you got a lot of things could be.

[C]

Could be. Yeah. And if you don't get the numbers you expect and that you're gonna. It's gonna send you somewhere else.

[D]

Sure, sure. Which would be ironic about. I don't really. Yeah. So maybe it is just that. But when it comes to him, you

[A]

know him better than I do.

[D]

No, no. But you're presenting a reasonable thought. But when things come from your dad. And, like, Natalie caught a video. It's so good. I got to send it to you guys. Natalie caught a video. My parents were here of me getting recognized on the street. We were outside, and someone's like, Rosenberg. Natalie immediately pulled out her camera and from inside the car, filmed my dad. Yo, It's. It's beautiful. It's. Honestly, it's like tear jerking. To see, like, on my dad, how. How happy he is and proud to see when people come up to me, like, makes his day.

[A]

Was there ever a time.

[D]

Which is great, but it also applies pressure, because then if someone doesn't, you know, he'll literally ask me, like, did they know who you were? I'm like, I don't know, dad. I don't know.

[A]

So let me. But let me ask you this. So. And chime in on the chat. Super chat. All the things. We have a special guest coming Today, Jason Lee.

[D]

Yeah, I think he just got here.

[A]

By the way, Hollywood Unlocked. He and Rosenberg have some unfinished business. And he's even said a few things about me. So we're gonna get into those things. I'm not sure I care that much. But he went harder on me. I mean, yeah, it was more about.

[D]

Insulted the culture.

[A]

Culture. Yeah, the dog thing. I didn't take serious.

[D]

No. But. But after a while, I did start to feel away about.

[C]

Wait a second.

[A]

But let me ask you. Was there ever a time. Was there ever a time where your path, your professional path, your dad and mom were negative or questioning your professional path, meaning you were like, this is what I aspire. And they were like, no, that's a terrible idea. Or what is that?

[D]

Never.

[A]

Are you gonna.

[D]

Never Outright terrible idea about the radio stuff. I think they always believed I would be good at it, and they saw I was clearly taking it seriously.

[A]

And did they think it was a good profession? Did they think you could sustain your life?

[D]

Yes, they definitely never. Like, you can't do that. You need to be. They never did that.

[A]

Good.

[D]

But there were other times where, you know, like, yeah, between jobs, I recently, I think I told you guys this, but I like, found a little diary on my computer that I had written in 05. Oh, my God, I was a fucking mess. Oh, my God.

[B]

Good Christ.

[D]

I just, like, I'm a disaster. But one of the things that's in there is. I'm talking about the. From the validation, the stuff I'm writing about women. And like, I just, like, it's just, I'm a mess. But my. In it, I say that my dad, like, had called me out and said that I wasn't really a hard worker. And, like, I'm fooling everyone. I told my dad this and he was, like, embarrassed by it. And he was like, I can't believe I said that. And I was like. I said I agreed with you in the day. Like, he actually called me out accurately at the time.

[A]

Well, and then the reason.

[D]

It still was hard, but he was hard on me. Like, he was like, you come off like, you're a hard worker and. And you're doing all this stuff, but really you're not doing shit. And, like, what are you really doing? Like. And at the time, I was. What I was doing was smoking weed for the first time. Being single for the first time as an. I was a mess. I was just trying to, like, going out and DJing here and there. I was. He wasn't wrong.

[A]

Right.

[D]

He wasn't Wrong at that time.

[A]

Well, but. So I ask you that for that how much? Because in your path to create this podcast and validate me and what you just articulated about the pressure of your dad and asking you the question is because I do believe all of us and everybody watching this, at a certain point, it could have been insignificant to your parents. They said something to you that really, really, really stung you right now.

[B]

Right?

[A]

They're not thinking about it like that. They're just like you said. He was right. He was calling and I love you.

[D]

And I'm saying it's my truth and I love you and I'm. You're my son.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And pushing you. But. But now you went on this tear to just make, make, make, go, go, go without any end in sight. No off ramp, no plan. Like just the engine went on and you went, I'm doing it all. Wrestling sports podcast. They're never gonna tell me I'm lazy ever again. You know what I'm saying? And then you. But you never look up. You don't even know.

[D]

But that's part of full circle. And I know we gotta get. Bring Jason here. That's part of why I was in a bad mood on Monday. Because sometimes I do look and I'm like, I have all these multiple things that I'm doing that I love, but this is also a bit too much. Where. Where am I going to find the space? And the truth is, like, the rubber for me has to meet the road somewhere. Like over the next. Over the next three to four years. Like this either needs to become the be all, end all. You want one thing and it really works. Or my ESPN New York radio. But the two daily things, that's where people think the wrestling and the once a week validate me. That stuff's fine. It really doesn't add up to that much. It's the two daily jobs that adds up to a lot. Do you know what I'm saying?

[A]

I know you know exactly what I'm saying.

[D]

Many jobs, you can add the other little things for one hour here or there, I can figure out it's this. That's a lot.

[A]

This is much easier. What we're doing now is so easy for me, relative to what the Hot 97 thing was.

[D]

Yeah, no, that is true. It is.

[A]

This is so easy.

[D]

But I added the baby in that. Like, this is all still.

[A]

Yeah, well. So. So, yeah. And. And Pete, when you have your first child, you forget that they're gonna turn 4 and 5 and 6 and then they're gonna Be at school all day, and you're gonna be like, oh, I don't pick my kid up until shit.

[C]

But then, even though you have that, you have to be more present when they are home, because they're already not. They're in school.

[A]

So when they get home, you got to be locked.

[C]

Yeah. So it's the pressure of, like, doing all this and making sure you're home for that moment.

[D]

Guys, on the days, you know, when we have everything, I sometimes will get with her 20 minutes in the middle of the day and 20 minutes at night.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And that's it. And then I, like, look forward to the time where I get more. But, like, I do get sad. Like, she's.

[B]

This is.

[D]

You know, it's amazing time, and it's hard.

[A]

Listen, when Issa was born, we were. I was in. It was. I mean, we could talk about it on that. Remind us talk about this on next week's page. When Issa was born in 2014.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

Do y' all remember what was happening?

[D]

Everything was.

[A]

Everything was shifting, so I didn't even heard that first. Probably four years of her life.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Like, I'm working two jobs a day. That's when that started.

[D]

Oh, you had just started Apple.

[A]

I started Apple 2015, and they had.

[D]

You had gotten moved from PD to on air.

[A]

That's right.

[D]

You're navigating that political disaster awkwardness of the whole thing, changing everything. Yeah. Plus your start. Plus you're not comfortable at Apple yet. You're the new guy.

[A]

Well, I was fortunate. Everything was new at Apple Music. They had just acquired Apple Music.

[D]

Right, right. But still. But still, you're not where you are now.

[A]

No, no, no, no, no. But it. But yes. So I very much know what you're going through, and I guess what I'm saying is, is your child's gonna get older, and, yes, you're going to miss some things, and, yes, it's going to suck, but ultimately, you'll get it done.

[D]

But you know what she does now? Sorry, last thing. This is just this week. As of this week, after bottle, like she does. She still does a nighttime bottle. And when she finishes her milk, she'll, Like. She wants to get off. When she gets off, I go, you book time. And I pull the book out, and then she comes back and wants to climb up and just sit and listen and. And then she puts her arms back to hear book time. And I have this one book. I have. I guess we got it from someone maybe in Natalie's family, because it's called Good night Lailatov. Which is good night in Hebrew. So it's like probably an Israeli book. I don't know. Sorry. Rosenberg reading Zionist propaganda to his baby.

[A]

Well, Jewish and Zionist is different, you know.

[D]

And by the way, it's not necessarily Israeli, but it is Hebrew. Okay, Good night, Lila. Tov. It's a very. You guys know, I think some of these books are ass, right? Some of these books, I read them like. This isn't even cute. This is stupid. These lyric. These are bad bars. This is a really.

[A]

There are some bad.

[D]

No, they're bad. Like, I'm like, you should not have made this. This is such a sweet book. And she just loves it. So anyways, just a brand new thing. But reading books to her every night where she's like into it.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

So anyways, Shane Gillis will star in Drake's upcoming music video.

[D]

Okay, that is so Drake. That is so. And by the way, I really, I do sort of like Shane Gillis. Like I've been. He's been growing on me. Even though he lives in that world of sort of. You can't quite feel it.

[A]

That's why I read the headline.

[D]

But I do think he's probably a good dude. And he doesn't give me the same vibes as Tony Hinchcliffe. Like, I think he's sincerely funny too. But like you also do know that he plays in this in between racial stuff and, and like,

[C]

yeah, it's just

[D]

like the, like, it's like always. Does he know what he's doing? Does he know that he's making that a thing though?

[C]

I don't know if he does.

[A]

Shane Gillis.

[D]

That is no Drake.

[A]

What does he know? The Aiden Ross. Does he know with the Shane Gillis? Does he know? Does he academics promotion of Donald Trump, the. The Super Maga.

[D]

You could have just picked. There's so many. But like, listen, Shane Gillis is funny. So I haven't seen it yet. Maybe it's really funny, you know, but it's just. I hear. And I go, really? Of course.

[A]

No, he is funny.

[D]

He is funny. He is funny.

[C]

So let's see, let's see. Guys, wait, wait, wait. Before we go, remember, merch is still live.

[A]

Pow.

[C]

That's right. Ibrah. Laura Rosenberg show dot com. You wanted the blood in the water. It's back. White version, new logo. It's up for sale. Very limited. And for those of you who've been asking for that 3X, we got you.

[A]

Oh, bow boom.

[D]

Let me tell you who's not asking for the 3X Laura Stiles.

[A]

She was never wearing a 3X.

[D]

No, no, I know, but I'm just saying she. That was my way of saying she looks good.

[C]

Oh, thank you. Thank you.

[A]

Oh, you was trying to act like our girl got big or something.

[C]

No, but I did for a little bit.

[D]

I'm just saying she looks really good.

[B]

What?

[C]

I mean, I did. After I gave birth, it was. I went through it.

[A]

Well, I mean, but that's. Yeah, that's why.

[C]

But I still. It still. I still was getting cooked left and right.

[A]

By who?

[C]

By the Internet.

[D]

You got cooked? I didn't know you got cooked. No, that. I didn't know you got cooked. Yes. Oh, really?

[C]

Yeah, like, just people being mean. Men.

[D]

Did they say it looks like you floss with chopsticks?

[C]

No, no, no, no.

[D]

That's on the one.

[C]

Yeah, they were just like, put down the cheeseburgers, you know, And I was like, word.

[A]

I never saw that.

[C]

Just had a baby.

[A]

Ron, is she lying?

[C]

No, no. Seriously? Yeah.

[D]

I'm going to a dark place. But I was just saying you look good.

[C]

Well, thank you. Well, all I'm saying, you have to understand that there's. We're living in a snapback world where everybody's like, I just had a baby, had my surgery. I'm back, and they're showing their abs. So everyone thinks that you're supposed to

[D]

just snap back sometimes. The snap some time.

[A]

If you're trying to do it naturally, you're trying to get to the gym and change your diet and get. Take some time beyond the emotions of your having a child. And I mean. Yeah, I didn't even process what you're saying. I didn't even.

[C]

Yeah, well, Kenza's five now. And now I'm like, there you go.

[A]

You're finally getting in your groove.

[C]

I am in the place where I have.

[B]

I was.

[C]

I'm smaller than I was pre Kenza.

[D]

Wow.

[C]

Yes. Yes. And. But in a healthy way. In a healthy way. So. Yeah.

[D]

I remember when I hugged you at Shell's event, I was like, she's like, mini styles.

[C]

Well, not many, but. But thank you. Thank you.

[D]

Thanks, guys. Listen, Bat downside, worst day of your life. Upside, you looked really good. Thank you. You look beautiful. Worst day ever, but you look fantastic. Shells would appreciate that.

[A]

Jason comes in.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Give it up, Jason Lee, let's go.

[D]

That's Councilman Jason Lee to you and me, folks.

[A]

Hollywood unlocked. So before we get active, we saw you talking shit, and so we was like, you know what? Let's see why he's talking shit. Let's just go ahead and get into this. What interview did we not want to have you on for?

[B]

Oh, I guess during my last press run when I got the report from my team, they said that you all didn't want me here, which was fine. I mean, I wasn't mad that you didn't want me here. I didn't expect to be one. I don't expect to be wanted everywhere I go.

[A]

Right.

[D]

Is that true though? Do we not want him?

[A]

I don't know if maybe we use a scheduling thing.

[B]

Yeah, I don't know.

[A]

You took it, but it sounds like you took offense to it.

[B]

Well, no, I wouldn't say offense because I'm not like a sensitive pussy. You know what I mean? Like I, it's okay, it's okay to be emotional. No, I saw, I'm not emotional. I saw it. I was just like, okay. It's interesting because I had saw that, you know, you all are independent. Congratulations on that. I've been independent media since I started and it's a hard fucking hustle, you know what I mean? It's sucks. And so I resonated with the message that I saw, but I didn't understand it from the messenger because I'm like, well damn, you know, so I, I, I made a comment about it and that's really what it was. And it wasn't like I didn't spend.

[A]

Oh, this was the US saying we couldn't get interviews, right? Which was a, which was, you know, look in the clip economy which we live in today. I was joking because Mona Scott asked. He was, she was like, yo, send me something about your new show.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I was basically like, yo, I gotta send you stuff about my. So then when I got on the air I was like, yo, we can't even get interviews now. Cause Mona Scott's asking me for a one sheet on our new show.

[C]

But you didn't say Mona Scott.

[A]

I didn't say her name.

[C]

Yes, you didn't say.

[A]

I didn't say her name, but it was a joke. And obviously in the world we live in today, us post Hot 97 people ran with it like we was being really serious.

[B]

No, I saw the whole thing. I took the clip and I just ran with the clip.

[A]

Oh, you took the clip.

[D]

He knows what the.

[B]

Obviously I mean, we live in a clip based world. I'm the sum of the clip.

[D]

By the way, you've been in this car clip.

[A]

Wait, you clip. You're the one that clipped us.

[B]

No, no, no, I Saw the clip and I went back and watched the whole thing.

[A]

Oh, God. Well, at least you did your research. At least you did.

[B]

I mean, listen, people don't research me. That's why I don't really care, though. Like, I. I love all of it. Because when you're independent, it's just. You need the viral to.

[A]

Yeah, I'm with it. The algorithm hustle. I'm with it. I'm with the shenanigans.

[B]

And then I saw you come back and clarify the whole thing. I'm like, well, we already saw that. But, you know, nobody cares about.

[D]

Right, right.

[A]

Nobody cares about the truth. They don't care about streets.

[B]

It's all Mona's fault. It's not even my fault.

[A]

So now, wait, hold up.

[B]

Rosenberg.

[A]

You can't. Y' all can't talk. You guys can't act like.

[D]

I want to tell him to pull his mic closer.

[B]

Pause.

[A]

Hey, yo, y' all can't listen. He done called you a culture vulture.

[B]

He said his dog was fucking ugly.

[D]

By the way, that was the. When I rewatched it yesterday, that was the one. I was like, that was fucked up, bro.

[B]

People actually stop me and go, damn, did you have to attack his dog?

[D]

My dog's so sweet, too.

[B]

I'm like, his dog. I haven't even seen his dog. I don't fucking care what your dog looks like. It's not even about none of that. It's just about the clips. It's just about the moments.

[D]

But what happened? But what happened? Because we did. We. I rewatched our interview, and you were a fucking hater.

[B]

You know what you did.

[A]

No, no.

[B]

Yes, I'm gonna tell you what you did. First of all, I'm gonna tell you what you did. And I'm glad that y' all. Independent me, I hope y' all go through all the shit I went through.

[A]

Please.

[B]

All the fucking days, hating ass culture leaders pop up.

[A]

You know, we won't go through the same.

[D]

Not the same thing. But go ahead, tell me what happened, because I think.

[B]

Good to see you. Good to see you. Poor Laura, she's just here, like, what? I get in the middle of this shit, but she's tough, too. Okay, here's the deal. Karen. Civil. You know, at the time when she went after my Instagram and all that shit from years ago, like, that was like, in the middle of, like, this meteoric rise that Hollywood unlock was going through where, like, yeah, we got the 50 million dollar valuation now, but when you have no barely figuring out how to pay your Staff like, you're hustling all day long. You know, you come in the game and you're like the bad guy out the gate, when really you have intentions of just, like, you're trying not to be the bad guy, but the way people don't take your calls or don't support you, you know, I didn't have the. The infrastructure of a hot 97 or anything behind me starting in the game. It was like. I just thought, like, people were gonna fuck with me because I was cool at the time. You know what I mean? I'm still cool with it, but they sort of did.

[D]

But over time.

[B]

But yeah, yeah, but I think that, like, when I got in it and then Karen is somebody that I let get close to me, and I don't really let people who are outside my world get that close. And when she took advantage of me and then she, you know, she did her rounds trying to, like, clear up the air. I didn't feel like you guys really, like, did a thorough deep dive into, like, what was happening. And it happened like, it dropped on, like, the day before, after Charlemagne. And there's interview did. And then it was just all weird. So I felt a certain way. Then after that, when I went and did that other interview on that podcast, I forgot Fuzzy. Fuzzy's podcast.

[D]

Quincy. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And then saw, like, the comments online and people were sending me stuff. I'm like, okay, I don't. I don't think we have beef. I didn't think we had a reason to have a problem, but I'm like, okay, well, shit, if that's what it is. And it is what it is.

[A]

Hang on, hang on, hang on. Y' all know I got a bad memory. I don't remember any of this.

[D]

Well, I don't remember.

[A]

I don't remember the carrot. And I'm not saying it didn't happen. I just need a refresher on the Karen Civil. Just remind me and remind me what I said in the moment, because you

[B]

said we didn't do something you don't remember because. And I. And I can appreciate this part. It was insignificant to you because at the time, it's like, okay, you took his Instagram down. Okay, but you. Karen Civil, who at the time was a friend of mine and a neighbor.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

She didn't like some reporting we were doing when people were alleging that she was a scammer. Remember Cameron?

[C]

I remember that.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

I didn't. I just. Whether she was a scammer or not, it's not my investment it's this. This is what people are saying. We're a platform, so we're going to share it. She warned me to take it down. I didn't. She then went, had her hackers hack it. I met the hacker. I mean, I got introduced to the hacker because I met his brother somewhere. And the brother told me, my brother hacked you. And I put the two pieces together. When I figured it out, I told Karen, when I get a chance, I'm going to get you. I don't know if it's today, tomorrow, 10 years from now, whether I'm dead, you're dead. I'm going to get you back because you're going to pay for this. And it happened. So once it happened with Joyner and all the things came out, I was like, boom, this is the time.

[D]

And then Karen came on our show.

[B]

Is that what you're saying, Karen? No, no, Karen.

[D]

We just did the story. We just covered it.

[B]

We did the story.

[D]

Got it.

[B]

But it was like. It was very. And I mean, y' all were cool with Karen. So obviously, like, if somebody calls me and says, cardi or this person or this person, like, I'm going to have a. Probably a slanted opinion, but, like, in the world of what we do, it's really hard when you're reporting on friends to not do that. Sure. You know what I mean? Like, we're talking about Amber Rose today. If I bring up Maga, you're her friend, so you're gonna have an opinion that's maybe different.

[D]

I love her, but we haven't been talking.

[B]

Okay, well, then, hell.

[D]

Well, are you. Are you and Amber talking?

[B]

Yeah, we're cool. We're not talking, but we're cool.

[D]

Right?

[A]

Are you not talking to her because of her political espousings?

[B]

No. I mean, I think that everybody. Wait, did we close the lid on.

[D]

No, no, no.

[B]

But let me say this.

[D]

No.

[B]

Amber and I, we're cool. I see her out. We speak. We're not photographed together and hanging out together and all the things that we used to be, because we are completely different. I'm a black gay man in America right now, and we're living in some crazy, crazy times. But, like, I think that, like, my issue with Amber is not about her views, because she can decide to believe whatever she wants. It's that she was trying to convert me to Maga. Like, calling me, like, pressuring me to, oh, believe in Maga and believe in Trump and get. And, you know, well, that's why.

[D]

That's why I didn't I mean, I feel bad, but that's why, like, I didn't really, really have the conversation because I knew where it was going to go. And it's like, I don't want to do this. I love you. Yeah, but I don't know what's going on, and I don't want to do this.

[B]

So I just, I said the same thing.

[A]

And neither one of y' all was like, what the Are you talking about? Like, nobody was like, yo, this isn't your lane. You don't know what the. You're talking about. You're being led astray. What. What. What are you trying to. Who you trying to get pardoned?

[B]

What?

[A]

Trying to deal. You trying to. And why you want me?

[D]

Like, I'm not. No, I'm not gonna like you. She's an adult. Amber is a smart girl.

[A]

I have real people in my life that voted for Trump, and I'm still talking to them just like this. You're an idiot with the fuck.

[D]

Yeah, but they didn't become public surrogates. It's a lot.

[B]

There's a difference. For me, it's not about, like, do we have. It was. It did get heated at. It did get heated. It was getting heated because she really is passionate about. Trump is great. Trump is great. Everything he's doing is great. And I'm like, nah, he's not. Like, if you're Latino, he's not. If you're a woman, he's not. If you're black, if you're, if you're gay, if you're at this point, if you're an im.

[A]

Venezuelan immigrant, if you're working class, if

[B]

you're just, if you're breathing okay. So we couldn't see eye to eye on that. So I just said, you know, I, I, I'd rather just remove myself. And I remove myself. But I mean, when I see her out and say, how are you? But it's not like I hate you, right? You know, speaking at rnc, I mean, that was probably crazy, but that's her life. I don't know if she's getting a bag or pardons or what, but I don't know.

[A]

All right. But anyway, so you saw the coverage of the Karen Civil thing, and you jumped straight to he's a culture.

[B]

Well, no, not just that. I was more disappointed. Let me tell you why, because I remember you when you were at 102.5 in Sacramento when I was from stock. I mean, living in Stockton. And I remember, you know, I had a lot of respect for you. Because in our area, you know, it was a bunch of no disrespect, white boys doing.

[D]

Oh, my God.

[A]

In north. In Northern Cal, in Northern California, we

[B]

did not have any dealing with racism. You were the only one. When I think about, like, when. When. When 102.5 used to have the concerts and shit, Stockton didn't really have anything

[A]

because, you know, y' all would come

[B]

to sack, we would come to sack, and I would come and you would be. You were the guy. And then you moved on and you became the man. And I feel like I've watched your career, whether you remember me or not, I've watched your career as sin. And I'm like, okay. You know, there's different people that I've seen, like, Charlemagne doing this thing, you doing your thing. You know, Angie, you know, now Nori and some of the podcasters, whatever. I'm like, yo, I find inspiration in shit. Everybody does. And so, you know, Hot 97, Wendy Williams, like, the history of, like, how important you all in this, in that station was to the culture here in New York. I'm like, damn. You know, I didn't understand why, you know, I wasn't given the opportunity to be, you know, to consider what I was going through, to consider the destruction of somebody who literally took her relationships and attacked something that I was building as independent media. So there was that. Then when I did your show at Hot 97, you had a slanted opinion about Wendy Williams and how nasty she was and da, da, da, da, da. And, you know, and I have an extreme affection for her because she created a lot of the shit that we all do now. The shade rooms, the Hollywood unlocks, the radio. I mean, give her, you know, don't want to give her flowers or not. Wendy was one of the first people who did what she did, what we do now. And so I just kind of took all that together, like.

[D]

But I watched it. We had a back and forth about it. It was a We. We had the disagreement then. I didn't think it was an unpleasant conversation. Wendy's not my cup of tea. She's super important to you. She's super important to Charlamagne. For me, it was. She wasn't for me. But I thought we had a good exchange. I think the part that got lost,

[A]

just to be clear, y' all being too nice.

[D]

I. I think that. I think that things. No, no. I think generally when there's. When there's friction between people, usually there's some sort of miscommunication or you feel a certain way about something that I don't recognize. Like, for example, your whole Karen thing, to Ebro's point. You have to remember, by that point, we've already been on the air every day, four hours a day, for years. So just truthfully, some stories, you read them, you keep it moving. It just doesn't mean that much. And it's a big deal in your life, and I get that. Right. But then after we did our show. After you did our show and you said it was a shitty conversation on Drink Champs, I watched it back. It wasn't. It was a good conversation.

[A]

Matter of fact, the comments confirm what he's saying.

[D]

People in the comments.

[B]

Fuck the comments.

[A]

No, no, you're. Now. You're in the algorithm. You're on the Internet.

[B]

No, I do.

[A]

No. You want engagement. You love the comments.

[B]

Watch it. Fuck you. You know what?

[D]

So anyways, I watched. I watched it back, though. It was a fine conversation before I put up a comment about you. When. When Fuzzy and Quincy did your interview, and I was like, why'd you have this guy on he sucks or whatever. You had already said shit about me post our interview that I felt was fucked up. Because I'm like, you did our show. Yeah. We didn't agree on everything, but we were pleasant to each other. I had you on our. We had you on our platform, and then you shit on me afterwards. That's when I put up the comment in a petty way where I'm like, oh, why are you giving this guy a platform?

[B]

I think you called me a clown.

[D]

I called you a clown? Sure.

[A]

We called him a culture voice.

[D]

Well, you went way past clown, bro. You went.

[B]

You went. Well, here's the deal. Like, you know this isn't a measurement of each other's dick, right? You said this, I said this, this hit harder. This was this or that. I don't really care about those things. What I'm saying is I didn't call you a cultural vulture prior to you calling me a clown. If you think I'm a clown, I'm on some clown. You could check my valuation there.

[D]

But you dissed me after you left my show. That was. What was the clown?

[B]

Well, dis. Dis or criticize. Right? You can criticize me, but why would you.

[D]

But you were right there in my face. You did our show. It was cool.

[B]

Now we're talking.

[D]

I appreciate the difference, so. No, I appreciate it.

[B]

I don't switch up when I leave the room.

[D]

But I did.

[B]

Hold on.

[D]

No, you precisely switched up.

[B]

I told you what? I thought in that conversation, I'm gonna just bring the tone down so that way people can hear me. Because I think sometimes my delivery people be like, oh, they get lost in it.

[D]

And I'm sure, again, I do the same.

[B]

Okay, so whether we have pleasantries today, I have an opinion here, which I will tell you when I leave and I get online and say my opinion. It's not because I left the room that my opinion changed. It's because at the time I'm addressing whatever I'm addressing. That is my opin right there. So I don't switch up. I can code switch, but I don't switch up. Let me just tell you that. You calling me a clown, Cool. If you feel like I'm on some clown shit, that's your right to say whatever you want. If I feel you're a culture vulture. If I feel like you don't understand, you know, as a black entrepreneur in media, independent media, you understand now, cool. I'm going to have that opinion. But I would say it, you know. You know, I don't know why you're telling another person. Why are you having this clown on your show? Because it's their show.

[A]

Fair enough.

[B]

It's their show.

[D]

At that point, I was offended that you had left our show after a good conversation that I thought was cool and talked shit. Okay, so that's it.

[B]

Got it.

[D]

And then. No, no, but hold on. But not that slant. Then you went on Drink champs and spent 15 minutes basically calling me a privileged suburban culture vulture. You knew everything about my life, apparently, and what my journey was.

[B]

So you have to respect people. Research.

[D]

No, no, I did. No, listen. But. But I was just curious what your. It's. It was such a. It was a lazy way to attack me. Like you have. You have the right to not like me. You have the right to think I was a dick to you. Totally fair game. And I appreciate a culture vulture because I know the people who really do what that is. Pull from this culture, from hip hop, black culture, make their living off of it while not contributing back to it. You made that up about me without any real information. You knew it just sounded good and people would believe it.

[A]

Whoa, whoa. But it's cause you're white.

[D]

Because a white guy named Rosenberg, call him a culture vulture.

[B]

My mama white. So that's lazy. That's as lazy as has been. It's not because you're white. It's because that was my opinion and that's what I found.

[D]

What are you basing it on?

[B]

Well, I don't have to validate my opinion to you.

[D]

You publicly labeled me. You publicly labeled me. Why did you publicly label me?

[B]

Do you believe your dogs are ugly?

[D]

No, my dog's adorable.

[B]

Okay, so then there's another dispute, right? You get it. You get the right to choose how much you're gonna. But this is.

[D]

This is not a but. Like, I'm asking reasonably why you chose to go with culture Vulture for someone like me.

[B]

You literally just defined it for the.

[D]

Why is that me?

[B]

Wait, but you just defined it.

[D]

So why is that me?

[B]

So why is it not? What have you done? What have you done? And maybe this. Educate me. Educate the viewers. Educate the.

[D]

No, my audience knows. They do know.

[B]

Well, I saw mixed reviews. Okay, okay. And so. But that's the thing about the Internet. Somebody's going to watch this interview and go, we love what Jason's saying. And somebody's going to say, we believe in what Rosenberg is saying. There's going to be people like Nori, who's a fan and who knows your history in the podcast game, who's going to defend certain things. And then there's.

[D]

He didn't that day. But yes, he does love me. But sure. So.

[B]

And then there's that. Right?

[D]

So, like, you know, Nori loves clip. Clip hustling. But.

[B]

But I clip hustling. That's a new.

[A]

I'm going use.

[B]

So I'm still That your culture.

[A]

Culture Vulture.

[B]

Exactly. But I can admit it.

[D]

That's the thing. I could have not. But I take it super seriously. I would never. I would never do that.

[B]

But this is.

[A]

No, no, no.

[D]

I've been about hip hop culture.

[A]

So can I.

[D]

One second. Ebro. My life has been about it and contributing to it. And the reason Ebro found me in the first place and thought I'd be a fit at the time at Hot 97, which at that time cared about the culture, was because he saw I was out there as an independent YouTube creator who loved hip hop and thought he could contribute. He brought me up here. My first gig was I was getting a shift rate to do a Sunday night show where I was breaking underground artists. They eventually gave me 60k to do weekend mornings with Cypher Sounds, living in New York, hosting underground events at sobs, djing, getting shit on by all the artists who were going, who is this white boy? Why is he here? I loved it. Continued to promote underground artist after underground artist, many of which became some of the biggest stars of music today. Who you know, you should do, you should ask your friend asap, Rocky, what he feels about Peter Rosenberg. Ask him if he's a culture vulture or if he helped make his career. And he will say, oh, Rosenberg. Rosenberg is the guy who took my songs, cleaned them up for radio play, and gave them to other DJs so he could play my music.

[B]

Right.

[D]

So all I'm trying to say is, to me, being a culture vulture is taking from the culture, not giving back. I have gotten things from hip hop culture. It's helped make my life, and I'm incredibly grateful. But I have always and always will prioritize giving back to that culture, helping uplift other people, people of color specifically. That will always be a part of my life. So when you just lackluster, throw out culture vulture. Yeah, man. On a big platform like drink champs. And you have a big voice. And by the way, you're a very entertaining, charismatic talker. It sounds really good. Yeah. That's some hurtful shit to say about someone. That's not who I am.

[B]

Okay, so I'm going to just say this. I'll be with Rocky tonight at his son's fourth birthday, and I'm going to tell him to his face that I don't give a shit what his opinion is about his support for you, your support for him, what he's done for you, what you've done for him. Because me and Rocky talk about Rihanna, we talk about his children, we talk about how proud he is of me running for office and his love for Harlem and helping kids. We don't talk about you or anybody else. I didn't interrupt you, so I just said. Let me. Wait. Do you want.

[D]

I just said meaningful content. You're talking.

[B]

Do you want me to respond or do you.

[D]

Right now, you're just showing off about you're being friends with rock.

[B]

No, you. You told me. You. You invited me, and I'm giving you.

[D]

I just gave you facts. You're giving me.

[B]

You invited me to talk to my friend about you. And I'm telling you that I'm not going to do that, because his opinion of you does not matter to me. Here's what I'm saying to you, and I'm not saying it on social media. I'm not saying on drink champs. I'm saying it to you on your show.

[D]

Okay.

[B]

That I said this about our mayor, where I'm the vice mayor. She's the mayor. She appointed me. I said they love our penises, not our policies. I love that you love hip hop. I love that you've done a lot for hip Hop. I love that you put a lot of people on. I love that you believe that you're the reason why. Asap. Rogers didn't say that. Whatever you said. And I believe you love hip hop, and I believe you've done a lot from what I've talked to Nori and other people about hip hop. I. Hot 97, which I did over there, was great. What you're doing here is great. What he's doing at Apple is great. What you're doing on your own is great. None of that. I'm not taking any legitimacy away from the work that you've done. I'm talking about when, like, George Floyd are dying. That's the real shit that I speak

[D]

out about that, too.

[A]

Hold on.

[B]

Great.

[D]

No, no. I speak out about that. Always have.

[B]

Okay? But guess what?

[D]

Spoke out about LGBTQ rights. Always have.

[B]

But you ain't suck dick and you ain't black. And so you know. What?

[D]

So I can't contribute.

[B]

Let me tell you something.

[D]

So I can't control.

[B]

You'll never really know.

[D]

That's great.

[B]

And you'll never really know if you

[D]

want to draw lines. If you want to draw lines with allies over the fact that I'm not black or I haven't, quote, sucked dick. Yeah, but you don't know that I have stood up. You don't know that I have risked my livelihood. I. I risked my livelihood wearing a Black Lives Matter on live television, getting in trouble with bosses standing up. What. What. What groups have you stood up for that you're not related to?

[B]

And I got shot. And I now run the city whose streets. I used to.

[D]

And I'm. And by the way, I think it's very clear.

[B]

It's not a measurement, but.

[D]

But yet you keep bringing out measurements

[B]

for your clip farmers that need this moment. I don't really care about all of your resume. Of all the things you've done, why

[D]

do you say anything?

[B]

Here's the deal. Because I said there, and I'll say now. I think you're a culture vulture. That's my opinion.

[D]

Full of.

[B]

But that. Okay, great.

[D]

You're perfect for politics. You are full of two truths.

[B]

Can be inexpensive.

[D]

No. I gave you a lot of information. You couldn't accept it. Hey, maybe I did misjudge you, and I. Maybe you did misjudge me, but you won't do it. You won't back off of that.

[B]

You shouldn't have unrealistic expectations of me.

[D]

You're a human. No, you're. You're a smart guy, dude. You can hear that I'm making points.

[B]

Say if you show me a picture of your dog and it's not ugly, I will admit I was wrong because my dogs are gorgeous.

[D]

What do you have?

[B]

Gucci and Chanel? Gay dogs. You know what I'm saying? Like, I don't know that.

[A]

You don't know that your dogs are gay.

[B]

They ain't each other and they're a boy and a girl. They're gay. And it's okay.

[A]

You're a troll. And you're a big troll. No, but listen. No, but listen. There is something that's interesting that's taking place because when you were talking about Wendy Williams and you were talking about Hot 97, and I think this is great, you're a great person to have this conversation with, and I think it's useful. There's the music and then there's the gossip. Wendy at a time was doing the gossip and, and telling salacious stories and the insides. And who would. The who's in the whatsits on radio with also having the music playing at the same time? So some of us that are existing today got in the game for the music, some got in for the talk. Right? Because there were radio people who just. They wanted to host, they want. They didn't care what songs were playing. Wendy was one of those people. Whether it was going to be a pop station, a hip hop station, she wanted to get on there and, and talk that entertainment talk. Right?

[B]

Right.

[A]

When I came up in the game, I didn't like that.

[B]

Right, right.

[A]

Still today, if you watch our program, I don't care who fucking who, I don't care who beefing with who. I don't watch reality shows. I don't report on reality shows. If it's the biggest story of the day, I'm gonna turn to Laura and go, yo, Laura, what are the people talking about?

[B]

Right?

[A]

So I was always here for a conversation and talking about the music, playing the music and. Or talking about the community and talking about politics. Rosenberg was a music guy, he's a dj. He wanted to play the music, he wanted to find the music, he wanted to help artists, and he wanted to share this hip hop thing that we all fell in love with. So I just wanted to have that combo. Because a lot of times people who are having conversations in and around the hip hop culture today get either all thrown into gossip.

[B]

Right?

[A]

They're not all gossiping.

[B]

True.

[A]

You know what I mean? And I think it's. You're a great person to have that conversation with. Because you are somebody who is reporting on the lifestyle. Like, whatever. The lifestyle, the relationship, the money, the controversy, the problems, the beef, the who's doing, what's it with who, who's cheating on who, whatever, whatever. I don't know that stuff.

[B]

Well, let me.

[A]

And I just think you're a great person for the audience to see that there are different ways to approach the whole thing.

[B]

The whole thing in this. Cameron didn't get into the this world talking. He got into it in music and now he's talking Nori music talking. Everybody now has a podcast shout out to Fat Joe and.

[A]

And Jada.

[B]

And Jada.

[D]

Right.

[B]

Like, and. And it's great. Like, the evolution of the world right now is everybody is. Has a platform. Social media has changed. Where, yes, I remember when you were at 102.5 was all about the music. We weren't. There wasn't a lot of people wanting to know what's happening now we're in the know of now. You don't have okay magazine anymore. You have Hollywood Unlocked or Shade Room or. Or Neighborhood Talk or whatever. You know, I don't.

[D]

It.

[B]

I didn't really even know what I was doing until Charlemagne said, yo, I don't even know what you do. I think you're like a critic. You're a culture critic. And I went trademarked. I said, yeah, I'm a culture. I have an opinion. I don't really care who you're dating, who you're dating, who you're. I don't even. Like I said, I even see your dogs, right? It's me having an opinion and putting it out there and letting the Internet do whatever it does. And to some people, they would say, well, that's reckless. That's this. That's this. That's irresponsible. That's good. That's your opinion. I'm not going to argue that. What I will say is that I. I got into the game wanting to unlock Hollywood in a way that was different, where you had TMZ creating the story. I said, well, I'll give people the platform that they can trust. That was during the boss of Media Takeout Rise and people were not fucking with the blogs. Like, they were like, oh, no, hell no. You guys are all out to get us. That was not what. I wasn't out to get nobody. So then when I saw, okay, well that's not really gonna work. Let me just have an opinion. And you know, once you have an opinion that, that there's going to be people that fall on Both sides of it. Because there's people heavily invested in Sabrina Carpenter. So if you say something bad about Sabrina Carpenter or criticize her, those people are not going to be happy. When you're independent media, you don't have this ecosystem of brands will cancel you, this person or whatever. No. All my money is coming from small business owners, brands that I have partnerships with that just want the virality of what I do. They don't really care about this or that. And the millions of dollars that I've made has not been centered around don't mess with T Mobile, don't have an opinion about Ciroc or whatever. Nah, I didn't really focus on that world because that world comes with an attachment to walk a fine line. I don't want to walk a fine line. I want to have an opinion about whatever it is I'm talking about and go about my business. And so it's kind of evolved into this thing where now that I have the platform and I understand, when I look at my Drink Champs interview, I'm like, okay, I'm sober now. I'm in therapy. I have the platform. I gotta be more responsible. And that's why you've seen probably less viral moments than when I was out just recklessly not giving a.

[D]

And you have constituents now, but see,

[B]

they know who they elected. They know who they elected. They've watched this. They were literally a council meeting last night saying, damn, he wants to be on Beauty and Black because he wants to. The owner's son. Well, I don't. I did say on my podcast, like, if Tyler Perry brings it back and they do write me and I would. The son.

[A]

You know what I mean?

[B]

But, like, my constituents don't have. They love him, but they want.

[A]

But they don't want you. They don't want you to be intoxicated.

[B]

But I stopped that for me, because I had gained all the weight.

[A]

I was.

[B]

I mean, you know, when you do have a platform and you're. You're, you know, partying and you're drinking and you don't care like that, you can be unintentionally reckless. You know? Do I hate you? No, I don't hate you. I had a moment. I said what I said. You thought I was a clown.

[A]

Hang on, hang on. This is important.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You knew his name would move around, though, so you used his name for the clips. Keep it real.

[B]

No, no, no, no.

[A]

I keep it a honey. Because you wouldn't have used his name if nobody. If his name didn't matter.

[B]

No, no. You know, once I saw how y' all handled the Karen thing, I was like, yeah, okay, all right, all right. No, no, no.

[D]

I'm feeling.

[B]

I was like, you know, okay, okay. Because when I tell you that was a time where I was tested, I have. I don't get tested like that because I'm willing to go.

[D]

I can see how much I'm willing

[B]

to die for what I do.

[D]

Right. Well, I can see how much I'm

[B]

willing to die for what I do. I don't move recklessly. And there's been a lot of situations that have been handled in private because I don't hide behind my platform. I'm outside. I do what I do. But I don't want no smoke either. But I'm willing to die behind everything I stand for, because that's how real everything is to me. When that happened to me with Hollywood Unlocked, it affected my employees. It affected, like, you know, these are like dreams I had of, like, starting my own business. I had left my career to really put everything into what I'm doing, and then somebody recklessly just took it.

[D]

And by the way, you weren't a kid then, too. Like you when I was watching. You were 42 when we did our interview. So, like, you've been grinding for a while.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, for years. But. But it. But it's. It's also like, you know, when you are independent media and, you know, when I see people that. And I'm not saying you or the show, but like, when I see people complaining about, like, the state of the world as it relates to being an independent business owner, especially black or brown in America or, you know, whatever, like, yeah, it is fucking hard. It is a hard ass grind. This was a hard to get in here. Was hard. And my friends who've been around for 20 years, who watched it, who saw me go from that studio apartment, losing my car, you know, you know, being rejected, denied that they weren't. They. They were there then, but they see the White House invitations and the this and the Rockies and all that. That wasn't what it was. Coming up by the Biden White House, right? Biden White House, yeah.

[D]

I'm just making sure because I heard you say that the other day, and I was like. I was looking, I was doing research yesterday. I was like, he met Biden, right? He did.

[B]

Then I would be a clown then.

[D]

You would be a clown, right? At least we agree. We agree on that. We agree on that part.

[A]

Now, Jason, you were very close to Kanye west and working with Kanye West. When you see kind what Kanye west is trying to do today with the new album and, you know, apologizing and all of those things, obviously you saw some things up close that were enough for you to be like, yeah, I don't want to be a part of this.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

I mean, just the Candace Owen. All lives matter. All lives do matter. We know that. Nobody black has ever said that. All lives do matter matter. We're saying black lives need to matter too, or brown lives matter.

[D]

And they said white lives matter. Remember? They went specifically.

[B]

No, I know, but that's when I. That was the moment where I was like, yeah, you know, I love you, but I gotta go. Like, no, I'm not gonna go online and bash you. I'm not gonna attack you. I'm not gonna do all that. It's just for me, I don't, you know, I got all my money up front, so it's not a money issue. I just. This is not something that I can legitimately support. I didn't understand it, you know, when I got into the role, it was for me about going to Gap and saying. Or Adidas and saying, you know, how much money has Jay made? 3 billion. Okay, so how much have you put into the. The community? None. Okay, we need 5%. So let's figure out what 5%, 3 billion, investing our communities look like. And, yeah, put me in a position to do that. Well, then it became, you know, he just lost focus of what we were trying to build.

[D]

And so you were really supposed to be like his community outreach person.

[B]

It was media and brand partnership, so over everything. So, you know, we, we, we. We repaired lots of relationships with the media. We got things on track. He. I mean, he, he was moving in the right direction, but he had lots of outside influences. And anybody who can just let anybody whisper in their ear and tell them what to do, and then they just go all the way left and ruin everything. I can't be a part of this. Too reckless.

[D]

I looked yesterday. I was like. I said last night I was doing some research and I checked my DMs with you. First of all, when you were on Drink Champs, I guess you said you would have me on your show. So I did DM you. I was like, yo, if you. I was like, I'm in LA if you want to have that chat. You didn't see it, it's fine. And I did see another DM I sent you after that, when you did the yay thing, I DM'd you. And I was like, yo, good shit. Walking away from. From. Yay. Like, that was actually at a time.

[A]

I didn't see those.

[B]

No, you didn't see those. My social media said to where, like, unless we're friends, I can't really see messages because I get so much good and bad.

[A]

I get it.

[D]

I just want you know that I'm a man of my.

[B]

Listen, you said I didn't see that. You know, look, I don't know. I don't know here today if you're a hater. I'm just saying you hated on me. You feel like I hated on you.

[D]

But you also. Could you admit that you have. The Karen thing, for example. Can you admit maybe now looking at

[B]

it, fuck, no, I'm not.

[D]

No, no, no, hear me out. That. That really personally affected you in a way. But now you could see that for us just doing our job and burn

[B]

your house down for that. No, let me tell you. No, I don't really care what it was. I don't care because, like, the nigga, the nigga that shot me. Because you know what you're hitting up. You're hitting a sensitive spot. The nigga that shot me. Yeah. And he's doing a great job, by the way. The nigga who shot me can't explain to me anything today about how he accidentally shot me. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter.

[D]

So you think we really did harm you then?

[B]

It was lackluster research. All the research you say you did last night, you didn't do it that day. That was the day that mattered. That was the day that mattered.

[D]

Well, that's to you.

[B]

To me, to you now. But I understand how in the realm of, like, all the work. 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 4. Give me a break, give me a

[D]

break Break me off a piece of

[B]

that, that Kit Kat bar Gimme a break, give me a break Break me off a piece of that Kit Kat bar that chocolate crispy taste gonna make your day and wherever you go you'll hear the people say Give me a break, give me a break Break me off a piece of that Kit Kat bar have a break, have a Kit Kat. It's, it's like, okay, that's not a. That's an insignificant thing. I could see it and I could

[D]

see how it's big for you, however.

[B]

Yeah, it's big for a lot of people. Because as much as people want to dismiss Hollywood unlocked as gossip or this or this or that, that platform can change anyone's day at any moment. It can change the value of a brand or person at any moment, it can become a thing. And I've heard people say, it ain't gonna affect me, okay? And then now here the Bloods and Crips come calling. Yes, I know the power of my platform. I don't need to validate it. I don't need to defend it. And it is what it is. But when somebody who worked hard to build that watch somebody recklessly try to take it away and then see their friends or peers in our industry kind of just minimize its impact. And minute, like, to me, that's like, okay, cool. Then you on the other side of that then. For me, that's just how I think.

[D]

No, I see how. I see how. What I'm saying is, what I was trying to say was I see how from your position, something that was so important to you that you see minimized, I see how that would be hurtful to you.

[B]

It was important to my staff, who could have lost their job, but thank God that Floyd Mayweather sponsored the podcast so that way we could keep the jobs. It could have been somebody that was weak and that was afraid to continue to be in pursuit of their dreams. They could. They could say, oh, I'm just. I quit. I'm gonna go do something else. I could see all those variables, but for me, that's just not how I think and how I operate. I really do. Like, you know, I love the. When I tell people I love 48 laws of power says, destroy your enemy, and all these different things. Don't shine the master, whatever. I, like, believe in that shit. I really do, and I live by it. So I, I. I just feel like, you know, and. And me and Charlamagne had a similar conversation from when I went on Breakfast Club. And then, like, right after the Breakfast Club interviews, here she comes doing an interview with them. I'm like, yo, so you were waiting in the backstage area to, like, come and try to, like, trump, no pun intended, what I had to say. And it backfired on everybody because nobody watching understood or believed anything that she said, didn't understand why, you know, they were so in defense of Karen Civil. But I get it. She was important to a whole bunch of people, you know, and me and her have had words since then. You know what I mean? I ran into her at Kamala Harris house and said, yo, you and I can talk at some point. We haven't pieced it up and become friends, but I am at a point now where I'm like, that was the moment in time.

[A]

Therapy, kicking In.

[B]

I see it years ago.

[A]

I see it. I see it. I saw you guys. You finally got back to the therapy 14 years ago. They gave you tools. Look you. You came off. Look at you. You landing it.

[B]

Because I also believe everybody deserves redemption, right? So, like, she deserves to have redemption. Now, whether you want to hire her or not, that's on you. Whether you. Whatever you want to believe. You want to believe. But I do believe because, like, when do I deserve redemption? Of course, you know, when do your dogs deserve redemption? You know, when do we all.

[D]

My dog, first of all, I only have one living dog. He's more than redeemed. He's 15 years old.

[A]

He's doing.

[B]

I mean, that's.

[D]

No, no, listen.

[B]

Okay, don't do the odd thing now. Here we go. Now.

[A]

So one thing you got to know is the reason. The reason Laura hasn't talked the whole interview is because she might stab you.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

Right. So we got her sitting there just in case. But I do have a question for you. Have. Have.

[B]

Do.

[A]

Do media companies pay the shade rooms, the baller alerts, the Hollywood unlocks to post their clips? Is there.

[B]

Is there a. Oh, like, I mean, so it's been an evolving experience. Like, early on, we hit all the red carpets. We try to cover everything. We try to post everything. But then at a point where you're like, okay, earned media now is becoming more paid media. So, like, yeah, now if we're gonna talk about music, it needs to be paid. If we're gonna post podcasts things or this and that. Sometimes we do or don't. It just really depends. I think initially some will start by paying as part of their marketing, but then, like, if we have relationships with people, obviously we share their content.

[D]

Or if you think it's just a great, like, you know, it's gonna move around and it's a good clip for you to post.

[B]

Yeah, there's some. But, like, some I really don't care. Like, I'm not gonna say any names, but, like, there's some where, like, I wouldn't care if the host died on air. I wouldn't post it. You know what I mean? Like, it says, because, like, you're still dead, everybody's going to say you're dead. I don't need to say you're dead. People may come over to see if. I said, but.

[D]

But if it's a different thing that you have interest in that you think would be good for your audience, because

[B]

obviously, we all need each other. Everybody needs each other. So it's you know, in a, in a, in a way, this ecosystem, in the way it works, the clip economy. Yeah. Like, I know why I'm here and I know what this is going to do, and I know it's going to benefit all of us because people are going to see it or whatever. People are still going to like me or not like me or hate you or not. Like, whatever.

[D]

I don't.

[B]

It doesn't even matter. But I think that getting to a point where, where I am now, it's not just the therapy and sobriety, but it's also like we're all under attack. Like, we're like, it is very different. Like, what's happening over at Hot 97 is interesting. What's happening over here is interesting. So, like us fighting each other, I think they're all counting on that because,

[A]

you know, stronger in the, in the, in that. In that framing is important. Right. Because, you know, the reason I asked that last question. So when the BOSS UPS and all of that stuff was happening, right. I was watching iheartmedia pay them to post clips, and I would go at it with Janelle and everybody over at boss of. Like, y' all don't with us like that. You know, I'm saying we're over here at HOT and you guys see us as the behemoth because we are the bigger brand as a radio station, but we're actually a small company. We're not the iHeartMedia. We're not the ones laying off people in markets and cutting budgets and squeezing radio, local radio, down to nothingness, where people don't even have voices on the air. Where, if I live in, you know, Jackson, Mississippi, I got the same morning show as the station in Detroit, all that local. And because I started in the 90s, as you pointed out, I started radio in 1990. So I watched corporate America, whether it was under the Clinton administration, whether it was under the Bush administration, literally squeeze and squeeze and squeeze black media, specifically on behalf of. On behalf of these larger corporations. And so the reason I asked that is because I've watched the narrative and I've watched this kind of shape over time because you have independent media who's scrambling to start a business, right, and they're going to take money or opportunity wherever it's, wherever it's going to come from, and not. Not realizing the bigger play. Now we sit here today, right, and we're looking at a conversation where you have CBS is ran by some psycho Zionists. You have, you know, the, the, the Ellison family is an oracle. Some other Psycho. I don't know if they're Christian Zion. I don't know. Christian Zionist, Christian nationalist, white supremacy, Zionist.

[C]

I don't the ticket taking over.

[A]

Tick tock, they're taking over. And, and by the way, VCs, the whole thing is just like eating, eating and eating and eating.

[B]

Which is why it's even more important to not take down the Hollywood unlocks. To not take down. I mean, I'll tell you guys something when I leave here that's off the record but like that's why I'm moving in the space of acquiring other platforms and bringing in partners who have the capital to be able to buy the block back. Because yeah, I do see it. I told Kamala Harris, look at how Rumble is doing their thing, trying to give academics this big deal to come to be free speech in a platform that's all right wing to. So that way we're all over there. Look at Elon buying X. Look at how now the false misinformation flags on Meta is going away. Like, come on now. Like, I see it but nobody wanted to hear that. But that was happening years ago when I saw it. Oh, it's, it's, it's, it's up now.

[A]

It might be done. It's done.

[B]

I mean, listen, Voting rights Act being under attack. I mean just everything happening, it, this was, this was their plan from the beginning. And I mean, I saw it. I mean I remember sitting with Kamala and all my folks telling her like, yo, like, we all speak to a billion people in a week. We need to help you. You need to help us help you. It wasn't really received and now we see how it all played out.

[D]

And like, so after you guys met and had these conversations, you don't feel like the campaign didn't do like take the advice or do any of the things.

[B]

I still got invited to Christmas parties. I still got invited to the cookout. But like I told him I'm, I'm not interested in being involved at the cookout because I'm going to make the same amount of money at home as I am going to have to buy an outfit, travel, put up security. I don't want to do that. I want to come where I can have impact. Like, let, let me show you how this works. So that's why I filmed her dancing to vibrant thing and I put it out super viral. And then like two days later I saw her at a luncheon. She's like, yo, 20 million views in a day. I'm like, yeah, that's how people want to see you be a human being, and they want to know that as a human being, you have a heart for their kids getting killed or for affordability issues or da, da, da. So the reason why I ran for office was I got tired of sitting on the sidelines saying what I thought or telling people I thought. I said, let me go ahead and change my community. Let me just jump in the game. I'm not going to leave what I'm doing. I'm going to just add more to my plate, and I'm going to go show my town we deserve good leadership. This is what it looked like. I'm going to change the political landscape.

[D]

You're built. You're building affordable housing in. In Stockton. Right.

[B]

Just got a grant from the governor for $13 million to build a health facility for young people. We brought over almost $200 million in health care, mental health funding. Like, we're doing real things and showing people like, this is how your government works for you. Now, I'm not going to be in it forever. So y' all got to figure out what to do with this when I'm gone and go on and do what you need to do.

[C]

I did find it interesting, though, because I saw when you were running, I saw that you were like, of course, Hollywood unlocked as a baby. You're like, I'm not going to step away completely, but I have other things I have to focus on. And I saw all the great things that you were doing. I did see, though, and I found it interesting because you're a provocative character. Right. And I saw how they tried to come at you for, oh, Jason is misappropriating funds. The wallet which you got cleared. Yes. But I just thought it was interesting how I. It's. This is politics. So they're going to find different ways to come at you. But how is that going? Because it's a completely different beast than the Hollywood unlock world. You know, it's nasty, but how nasty?

[B]

No, it's really nasty. I mean, the idea that, like, on the road, I was on the campaign trail, I was like, yo, you know, I'm gonna bring Nick Cannon here and wild n out. Cause I'm on the show, I'm gonna bring it here. And I did it as a promise, and people loved the idea. So when I got in and saw, like, our facilities are underutilized. We're spending $4 million a year in taxpayer money to keep these facilities open, and there's no business, I'm like, okay, I'm gonna do this. So Nick brought it. Staff used an approved fund to give him $50,000 to mitigate some of the risk. The city ended up making $640,000, which, if you're in business, that's a 12 time multiple. It was a great investment. It was great.

[D]

And then, and then one day of work.

[B]

One day of work. And then three weeks of selling out the arena. And then, you know, the manager we were firing. Right on. Two, three days before he left, he just threw this bomb out there that, you know, whatever, you know, it's different because I think they're also learning that I'm not a normal politician in the community. That's like working at the school. Like, you put it out there in the national news and TMZ and everybody's calling, and it's the thing we're like, now, how do you fix that? So then they spent 50,000 investigating to prove I did nothing wrong.

[C]

And then now a waste of money.

[B]

Taxpayers are pissed. But then it's like, yo, this is politics. So I had to get out my feelings. Like, I'm not above the drama we see every day in politics, but.

[D]

And you're a gay black man, so it's not surprising to see them coming for you. Like, that's where you, the establishment, they're still doing it. They're, they're putting out, Aren't they putting out. Sending out text messages right now saying openly gay politicians, you know, and, and taking shots of you in that way. That's something I literally saw this week.

[B]

About me.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Oh, really? Oh, yeah. I mean, I fly at such an altitude. I don't see that. You know what I mean? Like, I'm not in the gutter with that trash. They can say whatever they want. I mean, obviously I've talked about all types of things on my podcast, and I still do. I mean, I literally just said I would fuck the sun on Beauty and Black. Well, I mean, but here's the deal of age, right?

[A]

You also accused him of not sucking dick earlier.

[B]

See, I don't know what he does in his private time. I don't want to go there. Right? But here's what I'm saying.

[A]

That's why I said accused.

[B]

I don't, I don't play that with people. But, you know, whatever. I, I, I feel like my constituents know me. So, like, did anybody believe I needed 50,000? I went to the bank, put out 50 grand, and was like, please stop playing with me. Like, I. $50,000 is not, is not a lot of money. And to me, But I understand to the taxpayer, to the every everyday citizen, where affordability is real and just all that. Yeah, yeah. And then politics locally is in the ecosystem of the Trump and Epstein files and this and this and this. So, like, you're lumped into that naturally. So to your point, yeah, it is a different type of mess because if this is going to go viral in different spaces, but that goes viral in the news. And when people are sitting with their family watching the news, it's like, oh, he took the money.

[D]

You know, so that's all they see. They may not know.

[B]

Yeah. But trust me, with many. 9 million followers, soon as I was cleared, everybody saw that it was there and I worked it, I texted it that all my friends put it up. And then now all those people who are up for reelection, they're in trouble because the people are like, yo, you did that. This guy didn't have to. He didn't have to run for office. They know that.

[A]

Jason, we appreciate your time today, man. I mean, there's a lot. There's a lot we could get into. I appreciate the way you guys hashed it out. I think, you know, you was wrong

[D]

and that was as close as I was gonna get. You know, I think any admission and.

[A]

But, But I do wanna. I do want to say if we always have enjoyed having you on. Like, that's a. That's a fact. We've always enjoyed having you on. We think the conversations are great. So I was most offended that you were saying that we didn't want to have you on.

[B]

Well, that's what I was told.

[A]

Yeah. I was like, we all looked at each other as you, but you have

[D]

a busy schedule now. You know, sometimes you can't do stuff in it because you don't like somebody.

[B]

Well, you know, we make time for the things that are important to us. Right. So, you know, Hollywood Unlock getting deleted wasn't. It was insignificant. Me, my team pitching me for the show was probably insignificant. It is what it is. I don't. Again, I'm not. I'm adding my feelings. I say what I say and I go about my day.

[A]

Yo, how about this? I don't even remember Hollywood Unlock being. I don't even know, significant at the time.

[B]

And it was done by a person.

[A]

I was actually. I was actually going to go to the fact of what you. What I. That world.

[B]

I see you on Hollywood Unlock commenting.

[A]

Yeah, but I didn't know it wasn't like.

[B]

Hold on. Commenting on Hollywood Unlock. But y'.

[D]

All.

[B]

Anyway, I've worked through My trauma. I'm good. We good. I'm. I'm not mad. And even at the. Even the drink champs thing, I will say I looked at the drink champ things. Those glasses didn't go well with that outfit that day.

[D]

Wait, no, no.

[B]

My hair wasn't combed. Like, all types of things.

[D]

We are not gonna sit here and analyze how you looked at drink champs with how your look was when you did our show. That was pre glow.

[B]

I was fucking 300 something.

[D]

That was. Yo, that was the most impressive thing when I went back and looked. And by the way, I look like a goddamn mess on there too. But your glow up from there to now. Yeah, you put it.

[B]

What do you.

[A]

What you do? What are you doing?

[B]

Money.

[D]

It was just.

[A]

No, you guys still gotta change your food. You gotta stop drinking. You gotta stop doing stuff.

[D]

Your hair, your hair changed.

[B]

Stem cell nads, IV therapy, treatments. Treatments, yes.

[A]

So you still eat the same. You don't drink the same.

[B]

I mean, I went and had, like, surgery. I did all types not. I mean, I had the gastric sleeve and then I got on, you know, like nad. I mean, what do you call the GOP one. I mean, do all that. I might go to the gym now. I mean, I can actually run, you know, now without the fear of.

[D]

You look like a different yo. If you went back and looked over, he's a different guy.

[B]

I was wearing hoodies every day now, you know when you're wearing a hoodie every day, you're just fat for no reason.

[D]

There's some people in the hoodie community

[A]

who are not fat.

[B]

I used to be like, yo, I need to find some clothes. He was like, you're at like 4x now. Like, just start knitting shit together.

[D]

Oh, my God.

[B]

But it's okay. I'm not fat. Shaming, by the way. But if you're fat, you can't change that.

[A]

How do you feel before you. Before you get up out of here, how do you feel about what's going to happen in the midterms and both in California for the governor? I think there's a governor election about.

[B]

Yeah, I'm getting ready to meet with both candidates to see who I want to support. I was going to support Eric Swalwell. I mean, literally going to start on Monday, the Monday that. That all broke. But you know what? He was weird shit about him too, because we had a mass shooting in our community where these kids were murdered. Shout out to burner boy, who. Who, you know, he paid for the funerals and stuff. But, like, He. He. You know, he called and said, you know, because when things like that happen, all the dignitaries will call. If there's anything you need, like, let me know. And then I called him to say, I need you for these kids, families. And he didn't call me back. I'm like, yo, you definitely can't be the governor. So shout out to all the women out there that say he was trying to. On him, you know. But now I'm gonna meet with the other candidates.

[C]

Becerra.

[B]

Is that his name? I'm meeting with Becerra.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I think today we talk or this week, and then I'll meet with Tom Steyer just to hear them out and then, you know, figure out.

[A]

Now, Steyer ran before. He's the billionaire environmentalist guy.

[C]

He did pretty good on that debate, though, right?

[B]

He did. They all went after Becerra, which made him look good. Because it's like, if you're all coming for me, it's obviously because I'm the front runner. So it's really interesting right now. But, yeah, not a lot. I don't know.

[A]

But.

[B]

So the primaries. Yeah, I want us, you know, and I'm not like, no, like, yes, I'm a registered Democrat. I'm a moderate. You know, I mean, you know, you make money and taxes and California is crazy. And guns. You can. You know, I'm a gun owner. I have lots of guns. And I feel like, you know, it's. It's a very unsafe state right now. Homelessness is crazy and all that. I do want to see some balance to our country, though. Like, we need to have the blue wave come back and bring some normalcy to this, because, you know, we kidnapped the Venezuelan president. We bombed kids in Iran.

[A]

Just.

[B]

The world is so crazy right now, and there's a new ballroom on the way for $400 million.

[D]

That's right.

[B]

And we're all paying for it.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

So you want to see the blue one?

[B]

I do. I want to see some checks and balances.

[A]

Yeah, I'm big on. I'm aligned on that. I'm aligned on that. The overt white supremacy and the Christian nationalism, and this especially what happened recently with the Voting Rights Act. Watching that unfold in real time is pretty dramatic.

[C]

Yeah, it is.

[A]

You know what I mean? It's like, I don't even. I don't even think most people understand the magnitude. Like, you have hundreds of thousands of black women out of work post this. Di. Wave. Right. You have accomplished, like, to the. To the highest level, accomplished people at the Federal level who were just escorted out because they were black. Right. You have, you know, the elections down in Louisiana where the governor's just basically like, yeah, I know I sent out violence, but now we just.

[D]

We're gonna cancel that. No, it's not.

[A]

This is like, this is. They're really. These are KKK members, bro. Like, these are active white supremacists playing in everybody's face. And there is no checks and balance.

[B]

Project 2025 was a real manuscript that they're following. And if you, you know, stop being lazy voters, like to upload it to ChatGPT and break it down for me, like, it's literally playing out right now. The thing that's frustrating, too. I mean, it really is this whole last national election, this is why I was a little frustrated with Amber, because it's like, you know, you identify as a woman of color, you know, and we're not going to get into the light dark and all that because I'm light skinned. And, you know, we know that's been a thing. But you saw a qualified black woman, regardless of what you think about her, she's the most qualified for the job. And we went against. And she told us what was going to happen.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

And now it's happening. It's like, yo, like, you know, you can not like her, but give her her flowers because she literally told us what was going to happen.

[A]

Well, and you've kind of admitted here today that, you know, I mean, look, Kamala is a part of the Democratic establishment. They didn't lean in in ways they could have.

[D]

No, they. They didn't go all the way. They were halfway thugs on the whole thing. They almost would. Like you'd see that, like, to your point, that vibrant video. There were these moments that happened where people felt her. They were scared to have her go on Joe Rogan and sit there and just have a conversation with people. They just held back in these certain ways that in the end didn't work.

[C]

But that's when I see you, when we talk about gatekeeping, I think about that. You know what I mean? It's like they were like, we can't have them come. We're the professionals. We know how to run the campaign. We know what works.

[B]

Let me tell you what Trump has done, though. He has changed the playbook for politics. That's why when I ran, I talked about all the shit I did. I said, whatever, because all the people want to know is, do you know what you're talking about? Do you have a plan? Do you have the determination to get it done. And can we. Even though you're a politician or elected officials trust you, like, that's really all people.

[A]

Are you gonna do what you say

[B]

you're gonna do it? And that's why I fight every day, just even last night with the mayor. Like, I'm fighting to at least do what I said I'm gonna do. Now, whatever y' all choose to do, that's between you and the voters. But I'm gonna do what I said I'm gonna do. And I don't. I don't need anything for other than just the. To know that, like, my community sees a difference. So. Yeah.

[D]

Hey, listen, this is all very important stuff. Is Cardi back with Stefan? What's going on?

[B]

I gotta go. I gotta go.

[D]

It's in the news. It's in the news.

[A]

You don't wanna. You don't.

[B]

I don't want to gossip.

[D]

No, no. By the way, you can't. That's what you do.

[B]

I critic y'.

[A]

All. Give it up, Jason.

[B]

Thanks, man.

[A]

Thank you for coming by the show. All right. Yeah.

[D]

All right.

[B]

All right.

[A]

Rosenberg, How'd you feel about that conversation?

[C]

I thought it was cool.

[D]

It was. It was as good as it could be.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

Am I. Was I impressed with his response to what I. When I actually offered real information? No, I. It made me feel you're not a serious person, but that's okay. You don't have to be a serious person.

[A]

Well, he just doesn't care about. He doesn't.

[D]

Doesn't care about, like his.

[A]

He doesn't care about your work that you put in to. You were looking for validation. He didn't validate?

[D]

Well, no, I just want you to. He. He tried to explain to me. He tried to explain to me what a culture vulture is. And I tried and I said, oh, I knew you were gonna go here. You don't know that. I've always been an out loud public ally on the right side of history since day one. You don't know that. Let me tell you that. I tell you that, and then you go, I don't care. Opinions are opa. Like, that whole thing, though, is like, opinions are opinions. So I could say whatever I want. It's my opinion. That's why I said you're perfect for politics.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

You see what I'm saying? I mean, am I being unreasonable? You guys didn't think that I gave a great, long, detailed breakdown, and all he said at the end was, I'm friends with ASAP Rocky, and I'm not gonna ask him about you because we talk about kids, we talk about other stuff. Like what? You didn't say any.

[C]

It's fine. I feel like right now it's like you said what you had to say, he said what he had to say, and that's it, we move on.

[D]

Yeah, that's it. No, listen, I don't care. At the end of the day, it's fine. We both occupy very different spaces. I certainly don't hate him. I just thought it was an unserious response and I think I had the right to be upset that someone would go on my friend's biggest huge platform and dedicate 15 minutes to saying what a low life piece of shit.

[A]

But you feel like he had valid reason to be upset about the past of stuff that you did or.

[D]

Well, we skip again. Again, we skip stuff. We sort of skip stuff. Which is the real timeline is he did our show after our show, he talked greasy about us. At some point in there, the Karen civil thing happened. Maybe that's what made him talk greasy.

[C]

That's what. Yeah, that's right.

[D]

So it's my guess is that he saw the Karen civil thing and then decided like F them, which I understand in your own head, as you could hear to him, yo, the Karen civil thing in his life. And I'm not mocking him, this is real. It's like the Hillary emails. Okay. It's like the biggest thing of his ascent.

[C]

Well, they took down his entire platform.

[D]

Right. He lost his livelihood. So to him it's the biggest thing ever. To us, on a given day, it's a story that we do.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And you recognize that.

[C]

Yeah, he recognized that.

[A]

Yes, but that doesn't mean it changes how he feels. He recognized it. Right, but he still change how he feels.

[D]

Right. And I think that was the impetus for them him saying nasty things about us or me. I don't remember what his first things were. I responded and then he went scorched earth at me on multiple platforms. But, you know, so, yeah, it's fine. It was fine. It was just fine. I told him. I told him. I told him how I feel and what the truth is. He doesn't care very much about truth. And then that's it, we move on.

[A]

Well, he's also just a troll, which is why I told him he's a troll.

[D]

And you know, you were right.

[A]

It, it's clear that while I think he's a entertaining guy and I think he's very charismatic. Charismatic, hard working all of the things. And he's Built something efficient.

[D]

Like, he gets things done.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[D]

All those things.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. No, all of it. All of it. And clearly for the community he's from, he's trying to do great work.

[D]

That. That. That part I wouldn't call into question at all. I've looked up what he's done in Stockton he appears to really be doing.

[A]

But take it from a troll. You're a troll.

[D]

Yeah, no, it was just like. Because once I present stuff and you just come back, you're like, well, anyways, troll, troll, troll, troll, troll. Okay, cool. I don't do it, though.

[C]

Welcome to the Internet, yo.

[D]

We know.

[A]

We know.

[D]

We didn't need a guru. Damn it.

[A]

You want to hit a guru?

[D]

I don't know.

[C]

Yeah. Sorry, guys. We'll give you a guru tomorrow.

[A]

No, we won't. Friday.

[D]

It's Friday. We'll give you a guru on Monday.

[C]

Original gurus, gmail.com. email us. We need to. Yeah, we need.

[D]

We need emails anyway. Send your emails.

[A]

Oh, now you want to blame the people like they ain't been emailed?

[D]

Yeah, send your emails.

[A]

You get. That was crazy work, y' all.

[D]

Just put it national gurus, gmail.com.

[A]

let us know how you felt about the conversation with Jason Lee. We know that joint gonna get clipped up. Crazy.

[B]

What?

[A]

And we appreciate you logging in. Subscribe and share. Please hit the hype button. It is the Ebro Laura Rosenberg show, and we will see you tomorrow, eight o'.

[D]

Clock.

[A]

Just don't call it a podcast.