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Foreign.
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Hello and welcome to the Entrepreneurs on Monocle Radio. This show all about inspiring people, innovative companies and fresh ideas in global business. Coming up on the show, we reconnect with one of our favorite guests of 2025 to check in on his highlights of the year. Highlights aside from appearing on this fine.
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C
Program, of course, what we say about Mandarin Oriental in Vienna is that we composed an Asian symphony in Vienna in a way bringing the Asian touch in hospitality into the heart of old Europe.
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And later we'll hear from the leader of a sustainable fashion label that's expanding globally while navigating the challenges inherent to a commitment to positive impact.
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One of the main slogans of the brand is humanity in motion. So it's never a challenge when you speak about humanity. It's obviously a challenge when you try to understand what's happening.
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This is the Entrepreneurs with me, Tom Edwards. You're listening to the Entrepreneurs now. Regular listeners to the show will be familiar with friend of the program and group CEO of Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group, Lauren Kleitman. Since we last spoke to Lauren back in September, Mandarin Oriental began began celebrations for a very special anniversary and expanded its portfolio with the opening of its debut property in Austria. Our Laura Kramer caught up with Laurent at our pop up studio at the recent international luxury travel market in Cannes. And she began by asking him about the group's landmark moments of 2025.
[01:48]
C
Pretty important milestone. 150 years of the Mandarin Oriental Bangkok that we call the Oriental Bangkok, really founded in 1876. So we're starting the festivities of the 150th anniversary of the Grande Dame on the Chao Phra River. So it's a huge milestone for us really and how we can conceive the property for the next 150 years. In a way, that's what really is about the anniversary we're about to celebrate.
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A
And you also opened a new location in Vienna.
[02:19]
C
Sure. So that's part of the legend continues. And we are now entering Austria with a beautiful property in the heart of Vienna. What a magnificent capital city in Europe and just opened a week ago. And I'll do and do the ribbon cutting next week. So you see, this is still very hot of the press. A beautiful new hotel there.
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A
Well, tell us about it. What can visitors find there?
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C
Well, you know, I mean Vienna is one of the most visited capital city and so much linked to arts and fine arts and music. What we say about Mandarin Oriental in Vienna is that we composed an Asian symphony in Vienna in a way and bringing the Asian touch in hospitality into the heart of old Europe. And just to show that old Europe has a lot to offer. So there's going to be here, I mean, a magnificent food and beverage offering for once. We're not going to do a tea lounge, but a coffee lounge. Giving. The culture in Austria is very much around coffee, so we have deployed a range of creative recipes around coffee.
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A
So.
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C
So I hope you can come and visit us.
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A
Oh, me too. And I love my coffee. Now, when you look at expansion, is it more about planting more flags or deepening the experience in the places that you are? How do you calibrate that?
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C
You know, this is when the brand is so loved by our guests and our fans, as we like to call them. I think our job is to make sure we have Mandarin Oriental hotels where they travel. So if you love Mandarin Oriental and you want to go to Rome today, you can't. And in a year or so, you'll be able to have a Mandarin Oriental in Rome. Same in Vienna. If you really love the brand, you need to be where the guests are going. So it's really planting the flag, but not any flag anywhere. It's really about the right destination and where we capture the essence of each destination in our hotels and then deepening the experience of our guests in the relevant location. Yes.
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A
And I wondered how important is providence for that? Because when you're building something new, how do you make sure that it has that sense of place which you alluded to, but it also feels rooted, but also not generic, let's say.
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C
Interesting as a question, because this is the art of developing hotel. It's really about that Fil rouge that makes sure, you know, you are in a Mandarin Oriental with a sort of authentic service culture, our legendary service culture that we bring from the Oriental in Bangkok and the Mandarin in Hong Kong, how that is really, what is the point of difference across all our properties more than, or in addition to, of course, the design or the food and beverage that we are famous for, or the wellness offering as well. So it's that balance of who we are as a brand and where we are as a destination.
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A
I'm glad you brought up wellness because it has, in a way become a little bit of a buzz world. But at the same time, the research shows people care about this, of course, they better than anybody. And I wondered, what does it mean for the Mandarin Oriental specifically? You know, that goes beyond the green juices and yoga mats, let's say, you know.
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C
Well, I mean, a couple of things. First, I want always to remind that we have invented wellness in luxury hospitality, I mean the first ever spine hotel was in 1993 in Bangkok, in the Oriental at the time. So we in a way have been participated to the massive trend of wellness development in luxury hotels. But I must say today guests want more than just a yoga mat, as you say, or a green apple. They want first of all the choice. They want to have not just wellness, but well being offering throughout the journey. And it's not just about the spa or not just about the fitness that you can provide, but it's about the overall care you can, we can show for their entire well being. So how do you care for their sleeping routine? We have a new signature sleeping moment that we deploy along all our properties where we do have a new ritual in terms of beverage, for turn down service, a number of amenities that we bring to facilitate the sleep, which as we know today sleeping is probably the most challenged activities we have to go through and the most deprived in terms of sleep. So there is a lot of, there is a larger definition of well being nowadays that goes well beyond wellness or spa.
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A
I love that. And also the way that you talk about it, there is a sense of fun to it at the same time because I think sometimes we hear wellness and it seems very serious. And I wonder, do you think in hospitality, are we afraid of having fun and hospitality sometimes or should we just be leaning more into it?
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C
You know, there's truth in what you say about luxury hospitality sometimes being too stiff. What we're trying to provide the guest is a very relaxed, a very natural service and giving the choice. I come back to that notion of choice because nowadays in a property they want to have the indulgence of a three star meal full of butter if they want to. And at the same time the best ever detox menu or vegan menu in the same property on the same day. So we have to adapt to these diversity of needs and to be more flexible and in fact to listen more to our guests, listen more to our guests, more than sort of give them what we believe luxury hospitality is, but by creating the experience they want from a luxury place that we offer.
[07:47]
A
And I think that's so important, of course, the listening part of what the customer wants. But what about local communities? And it's not just about the backdrop anymore, but how do they become real partners in the experience when you go.
[08:01]
C
Into a new location, we want to work with the communities to create experiences. So everywhere we put new hotel very much ahead of any set up, we get in contact with the communities, we recruit people from the communities, we train people from the community. We are the best allies of the community. A best example perhaps is our property in Beijing in Tianmen, where we have renovated a hutong area very close to the Forbidden City. And we still have neighbors, so we are still completely immersed in a community. The chief concierge is a man who lived and was born in this area and lived all his childhood in this neighborhood, is now our chief concierge in Mandarin Oriental Tianmen, Beijing. This is the way we really embrace the community. And the best experience is when you have a tea ceremony, not a fake tea ceremony, but in fact you go to the place he used to go, he used to live when he was a child, and you do the tea with him. And this is where we really believe we belong to the community and support the community.
[09:08]
A
And you touched on talent there. It's such an important discussion and I wondered, do you still believe in the traditional hospitality schools or is it more about instinct and attitude these days? How do you find the best talent then?
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C
You need both. You need well trained students that come and work for us. We have a program called Rising Fan program where we provide and propose 18 months graduate program in Mandarin rental, going through different functions and then getting to know the culture and getting to know the brand from within and then graduating and taking on more responsibility inside the group. So we need that, but also we need the attitude and the character. Very often I'm touring the hospitality schools and the question I'm most often asked is about what would it take to be successful in hospitality? And well, I say, I know I'm older than the students, but I hate giving advice because. Because it feels like I'm very old person talking down to young people, which I'm not. And nonetheless, I answer the question by saying I believe to be successful in hospitality, you need to love others more than you love yourself. And it's really about putting the other at the heart of your life. And having the joy of seeing someone else fulfilled and happy is what should fulfill yourself and create your sense of purpose in your profession. So if you love others, I think hospitality is a profession for life.
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A
I think it's a really good life lesson there too. Not just in hospitality. It's really beautiful. You alluded to it earlier. Where are the new openings this year? Where are you taking us?
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C
So we're going to close the year with 45 hotels. We just opened Dubai Downtown, our second property in Vienna. And next year we've planned to open a beautiful resort in Mallorca, in Punta Negra. And a beautiful resort that all opened in April 2026. Then we're going to return to Manila. You know, we're born in Asia. So very happy when there is a new Asian capital city on the map for us. And we'll close the year with our first Alpine resort in Cortina in Italy. The entry of Mandarin Oriental in the ski resort and Alpine resort. We're very happy to be coming to that market very soon.
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A
Oh, that's so excited. And when you look ahead to 2026, then where should we be heading? What's catching your eye in terms of the direction of travel, I guess for the hospitality industry? Luxury industry, for sure.
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C
Well, I think everybody is probably saying similar things and this is really a very favorable cycle we're in at the moment, the search for new experiences. But I would say one of the most important, important one is the desire for more privacy, the desire for more generosity, the desire for new destination. We are well placed at Mandarin Oriental to capture those trends.
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A
And how much is it about also discovering or helping somebody discover a new destination too? Because we have these established regions that we all go to that we love, but sometimes it's fun to be the leaders and to pave the way.
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C
Yes, absolutely right. We like to be in destination you expect us to be. And we like to be in destination you don't expect us to be. So for example, our project in Japan that will open in 2027 is in a formidable area near Takamatsu where we're going to have a resort in two different locations that you will have to cross the sea to go to the second one. And on the famous Sodoshima island where you have a wealth of art and museum. So this is a destination where there is no luxury offering and we're very happy to offer a Mandarin Oriental to art lovers in this part of Japan, which is a beautiful region of the country.
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That was Lauren Kleitman, Group CEO of the Mandarin Hotel Group, talking to our Laura Kramer. You can find out more about Laurent's business by heading to mandarinoriental.com.
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Welcome to the land of wine, cuisine, fashion and the art of joie de vivre France. The Monocle Handbook is the third installment in our series of hardback guides for the best things to do, see and discover in all corners of Leczagon. Over 220 pages, Monocle's latest book showcases the creme de la creme of the country, from the Atlantic to the Alps and the windswept Normandie to the sun kissed Riviera. Plus top tables in Paris, Nonts not to miss hotels and where to splash out in Marseille and plenty more to try from Piste to Plage. If you're looking to stay longer or put down routes, the book also spotlights the neighborhoods to know and introduce you to the plucky entrepreneurs who have already made the move. France the Monocle Handbook is out now. Buy your copy today@monocle.com books.
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You're listening to the entrepreneurs. Rania Masri is the CEO of the Giving Movement, a sustainable activewear and lifestyle brand homegrown in the United Arab Emirates. A seasoned luxury and retail leader, Rania joined the company only recently. The mother of two moved to Abu Dhabi 25 years ago from Canada and has since played a significant role in shaping the Emirates retail and fashion ecosystem. I caught up with Rania on a recent trip to the UAE's capital and began by asking her where the Giving Movement's focus on responsible, sustainable practices began.
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D
It's great to talk about this today because if you would have asked me maybe I would say five years ago when it was founded, it was not as important, I feel, as it is today in the sense of the customer base, you know, LinkedIn their personal values to the brands that they engage with. Today in the region, there's a lot more attention to that. And the younger generation is really the one that's spearheading a movement that is not only about being conscious about what they wear and which brands they engage with, but also the whole idea of just wanting to be part of a movement that's kinder, kinder, obviously to the planet, but most importantly to each other. You know, we've seen the world go through such, you know, it's not the first time that the world's gone through such difficult times, but it's with the social media. Everybody's part of all the wars and the famines and, you know, and the misery that we see around us. So a brand that is very much rooted around the idea of giving back really took off. And it was founded in 2020 during COVID It was a time where everybody was very engaged, engaged through social media. So the story really took off, was a very simple brand that started just with T shirts with a very big logo that said the Giving Movement. And everybody was wearing it very proudly.
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F
And just on that point about the consumer demanding more, actually from businesses that talk about these kind of themes, does that become how challenging is it when there is a singular moment? You mentioned wars and things like this. Obviously there's been quite an outspoken stance on Gaza for example, which is very popular with consumers.
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But is that difficult as a steward.
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F
Of a business to know where to set those boundaries? Is that a challenge to balance? Or actually, if you come back to those principles, is it actually easier because you say, well, now we're just not moving from our course?
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D
I mean, one of the main slogans of the brand is humanity in motion. So it's never a challenge when you speak about humanity. It's obviously a challenge when you try to understand what's happening. But I think all humans are connected in the fact that we just don't want to see humanity go through what it's been through. Now, as a brand, we had a lot of support here in the uae and we worked through Dubai Cares in order for us to support many charities regionally or globally. The brand was able to support build a school in Delhi for orphans. And that was the brainchild of a lady called Lucy, and it's called Harmony House. And today we are actually. We have two employees with us that have gone through and graduated from that school. So from building the school to having graduates that came for an internship with us and that I stayed with us. And that story, just for me, just shows you that it's tangible results and it's not just, you know, where's the money going or what are we doing and how are we supporting?
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That's amazing.
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And that's proper circularity, right? We talk about it in economics, economic terms, but that's harmony.
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D
Yeah. I mean, when I started and I. I walked into the office and I actually met the team and I had read so much about diversity and inclusion and, you know, how. How loose this term could be in many organizations. But a funny story, I'll tell you this. It was my first day in the office, and I went to the coffee machine and I was putting my coffee, and this young man looks at me, me, just very, very seriously, and goes, do you want to hear a joke? And I'm, you know, this is like the CEO starting first day. And I, I was caught off guard. I'm like, sure can't remember the joke. But it was a very, you know, the elephant and the. And the mouse type of joke. So I.
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F
Maybe it is a classic.
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And he just. And I just cracked up when he finished this joke, and he just looked at me straight in the eye and just moved on. And I said to myself, you know, what was that? And when I spoke to my executive team, I'm like, they said, doesn't this happen?
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And they're.
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And they said, yes, this is Ahmed and he's on the spectrum. I said, wow, okay, so we're literally, you know, and then I started meeting so many different people and to be honest, you know, I've worked for 25 years and I've never had, you know, one on one interactions when they talk about diversity and inclusion. But really giving a platform for people to engage of all sorts of life, that warms my heart a lot.
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F
No, it's a lovely story.
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Well done, well done. Ahmed.
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F
It's funny you mentioned your, your kind of career and your duration. You've obviously worked in some other kind of sectors. You had lots of really interesting jobs. Do you, I don't know, it sounds you're so passionate about what you're doing now, but do you miss, I don't know, media landscape? So many interesting moves. We've been having some kind of conversations with various players in that field. Do you look back sometimes and miss the rough and fumble of some of these areas? Or is it always exciting to see how you can build on your experiences with what's coming next? How does it work?
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D
Yeah, I mean, this is what. And again, a lot of people that know me have said, wow, this was probably the missing puzzle for you. And I think that I've built my career in a way. It was actually very organic and natural. But from working in luxury and working in retail, everything at the heart of what I did was very much around brand and creating communities. And then when I, you know, got the opportunity to come and work in Abu Dhabi the past couple of years in media, although it was a first for me, but it really revolved around the same things. What we see saw happen was a transformation on the way that people engage and communicate. So at the end of the day, you're trying to build a brand, you're talking to a community you're not talking to, you know, and the same thing with news and media. So I found it fascinating when I moved into that area that traditional media can no longer sustain itself if they don't partner with the communities, because this is where the conversation and the narrative is happening. So when I started talking to the investors that are behind today, the giving movement, I thought, you know what? I did the luxury bit, I did the school, I have my foundations in retail. I looked at what's happening in terms of how people are engaging with content today. And I really, really felt very close to a lot of the causes. Because when you're in news, you're not, it's not luxury. Right. So when I found a perfect Mix between what I love to do, which is building brands, working in fashion, homegrown, which I'm very passionate about, and then finding a message and a narrative that's actually very strong and real. Then I found that it was the right. You know, I think it's that circularity, that circularity.
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F
And just on that, it's funny because there was a big rebrand imi, so kind of recently, and you were kind of in the vanguard of that. Is that just the perfect project for you? Is that the kind of thing where you're like, I'm going to roll my steam? So, yeah, I get to this. Were there some attendant challenges? Because it was quite a big shift, if you think in strategic terms.
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An easy job?
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C
Probably not.
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D
Look, it wasn't easy, but I never go after easy jobs. I don't know what it is. I don't know if it's probably the city that I live in as well and the country that we live in. From day one, I mean, I came here, I was 24 years old, but from day one, it was all about building. It was all about trying to understand the ecosystem and trying to make something out of it. It was never an operating role. First, we worked with the Inditex brands to launch them, and then Ralph Lauren was coming into the region, and I let that. But my last stint with the Shelhu Group, which is the largest retail luxury group in the region, was chief Transformation Officer. Within transformation of any organization, be it luxury, retail or anything, there are many pillars that you have to work with, but one of the main ones is culture and people. So when I went into that role and what excited me about the role, first of all, was the CEO, because I follow people, you know, Andrani Rahed was and is a very big name in the media industry, and he wanted to create something, a big foundation for media for the uae. And I found the idea of the transformation a lot more interesting than just the industry itself. You know, how do we create a brand? You know, but how do we create a brand that resonates with the journalists and the people and the brands that are under that umbrella? But also that could play to the strength and to the power of the country that we're part of. I mean, the uae, you see what's happening in culture today, but really, you look at AI, you look at, you know, genomics, you look at everything. So media had to be the next frontier, if you want to. And.
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F
And it's the same thing, as you said, it's storytelling, transformational.
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D
Absolutely.
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F
These things Run through it. Well, let's come back then to Giving Movement and talk to us a little bit, Ronnie, about the next phase, expansion globally. You know, again, the story plays super well here, but it plays pretty well around the world. How do you marshal that? You know, some things travel in a slightly more circuitous way, so you've got to be the steward of that journey. Is it difficult to speak to millennial audience compared to your Gen Z audience, compared to your boom holders, whatever? How do you kind of make sure you're marrying up all the threads, keeping coherent, keeping your hand on the tiller? Presumably that's another fun challenge that you like. But how do you do it? Give some strategic insights?
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D
I mean, look like every brand. And you know this more than anyone, I'm sure. You know, you need to know your audience, you need to curate your offer, curate your teams, your experience for that audience. But what I love here and what I'm, you know, part of our strategic direction is to really come back to our roots and be very true to who we are. You know, you look at the teams will do competitive mapping and they'll look at the other players and you have huge players that are coming into the region or into the world. You have Lululemon that's been there for a while, and then you have Alo yoga and now there's Viori that's also coming and you run. The teams are like opening stores and skims. Just signed a deal with Unas and they have a huge pop up. But I don't look at that because I don't think that we're competing when it comes to our message, and I don't think that we're competing when it comes to our DNA. True, we might be competing when it comes to the actual product, but why a customer or why a community will choose us is very different. So I really want to double down and trickle down on that. And I think it's important that we don't consider. I mean, the money will come, the commercial part will come, the growth will come. You know, it's. Those are very simple. You open more stores and you, you know, have events and you perfect your product and you perfect your team. But what you really need, need to make sure is to always stick to what your promises and to what your values are. And here it is a brand that was built on that. So it's very important that we continue on that promise and that we scale that movement. So, yes, regionally, here we are known, maybe more in the UAE than the rest of the region. Although I was very surprised at how big the equity of the brand brand actually is, because when my announcement got up, I'm like, is it about me or is it about the brand? Why is everybody so excited? But yeah, the region, you know, is very proud of it because it also has the Arabic element to it. So I really want to feature, first of all, a lot of people from the community that are doing good. I want them to be our ambassadors. I'm not as interested to have models that look, you know, very nice and are outfits only. That's also good. But it's really about who fits these values, who does our customer relate to? And that scalability is very possible across the world because everybody can resonate with that. So how do we take this to Europe? How do we take this to the US how do we take this to South Asia? How do we work with that same heart in commerce?
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B
That was Rania Masri, the CEO of the Giving Movement, talking to me in Abu Dhabi. And you can find out more about the business and its work by heading to thegivingmovement.com. And that's all for this episode of the Entrepreneurs. We'll be back at the same time next week. The program's produced by Laura Kramer with audio editing by Jack Dewas. You can listen again and find out more about the show@monocle.com and while you're there, why not subscribe to Monocle magazine, support our journalism, and read more about better businesses every month. You can also follow this show and catch up wherever you get your podcasts. If you'd like to be in touch with the team, email Laura on lrkonical.com I'm Tom Edwards. Goodbye, and thanks for listening to the Entrepreneurs.

Summary7 min read

The Entrepreneurs – Mandarin Oriental’s Vienna Opening & The Giving Movement’s Growth

Podcast: The Entrepreneurs (Monocle Radio)
Host: Tom Edwards
Guests: Laurent Kleitman (Group CEO, Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group), Rania Masri (CEO, The Giving Movement)
Date: December 24, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode features wide-ranging conversations with leaders from hospitality and sustainable fashion. The first half focuses on Laurent Kleitman of Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group, discussing the group’s historic celebrations and its landmark opening in Vienna, as well as industry insights into luxury hospitality evolution. The second segment turns to Rania Masri, CEO of UAE-born activewear label The Giving Movement, talking about the brand’s deep sustainability ethos, real-world impact, and plans for global expansion.

[01:03] Segment 1: Mandarin Oriental’s Year of Milestones

Guest: Laurent Kleitman, Group CEO, Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group
Interviewer: Laura Kramer

Key Discussion Points and Insights

Mandarin Oriental Bangkok’s 150th Anniversary

Milestone: Celebrating 150 years of Mandarin Oriental Bangkok, opening in 1876.
- Quote: “So we’re starting the festivities of the 150th anniversary of the Grande Dame on the Chao Phra River. …how we can conceive the property for the next 150 years.” (01:48 - 02:15)
Focus on honoring the property’s legacy while innovating for the future.

Vienna Opening: “An Asian Symphony in Old Europe”

New Property: First Mandarin Oriental hotel in Austria, situated in the heart of Vienna.
Concept: Blending Mandarin Oriental’s signature Asian hospitality with Vienna’s rich cultural traditions.
- Quote: “What we say about Mandarin Oriental in Vienna is that we composed an Asian symphony in Vienna, bringing the Asian touch in hospitality into the heart of old Europe.” (02:41 - 03:17)
Local Integration: Replacing traditional tea lounges with an innovative coffee lounge, reflecting Viennese culture.

Expansion Philosophy: Quality Over Quantity

Approach: Expansion isn’t just “planting flags” but deepening brand experiences at chosen destinations.
- Quote: “It’s really about the right destination and where we capture the essence of each destination in our hotels and then deepening the experience of our guests in the relevant location.” (03:32 - 04:11)
Creating hotels where Mandarin Oriental loyalists travel, while maintaining authenticity per location.

Rootedness & Sense of Place

Challenge: Maintaining the Mandarin Oriental signature while being grounded in local culture.
Fil Rouge Concept: Continuity in legendary service culture, balanced with localized design, F&B, and wellness.

[05:00] On Wellness: Beyond Buzzwords

Mandarin Oriental’s Innovation: Claiming innovation in hotel wellness, starting with the first spa in a hotel (Bangkok, 1993).
- Quote: “First, I want always to remind that we have invented wellness in luxury hospitality... the first ever spa in hotel was in 1993 in Bangkok.” (05:19 - 06:00)
Today’s Demand: Guests seek holistic well-being, not just amenities.
Example: “Signature sleeping moment” for guest sleep routines – enhanced turn-down rituals and specialized amenities for quality rest.

[06:39] Injecting Fun & Flexibility Into Luxury

Striving for relaxed, natural service—avoiding the stereotype of “stiff luxury.”
Catering to guests’ diverse desires, from indulgence to detox.
- Quote: “Give them what they believe luxury hospitality is, by creating the experience they want...” (06:56 - 07:46)

[08:00] Community Partnerships & Local Talent

Integration: Early engagement with local communities—employment, training, and collaboration.
Example: Mandarin Oriental Tianmen, Beijing – rejuvenated hutong, neighbors remain, chief concierge grew up there.
- Quote: “…the chief concierge is a man who lived and was born in this area… and you do the tea with him. This is where we really believe we belong to the community and support the community.” (08:00 - 09:07)

[09:20] Talent & Hospitality Values

Mix of formal training and intrinsic attitude seen as essential.
Quote: “To be successful in hospitality, you need to love others more than you love yourself.” (09:20 - 10:31)
The “Rising Fan” program: an 18-month graduate path within Mandarin Oriental.

[10:41] New Openings and Looking to 2026

2025 Openings: Dubai Downtown, Vienna.
2026 Pipeline: Mallorca Punta Negra resort (April opening), Manila’s return, and entry into Alpine resorts with Cortina, Italy.
Industry Trends: Growing demand for privacy, generosity, and unique destinations.
- Quote: “The desire for more privacy, the desire for more generosity, the desire for new destination. We are well placed at Mandarin Oriental to capture those trends.” (11:30 - 11:54)
Surprise Destinations: Example of upcoming Japanese resort projects (2027) in lesser-known art-rich areas.

[14:01] Segment 2: Purposeful Growth with The Giving Movement

Guest: Rania Masri, CEO, The Giving Movement
Interviewer: Tom Edwards

Key Discussion Points and Insights

[14:34] Origin and Momentum of The Giving Movement

COVID-19 Roots: Born out of a desire to “give back” during the pandemic. Started with simple T-shirts with bold “The Giving Movement” branding.
Generational Shift: Younger consumers in the UAE and wider region now expect brands to align with deep social values.
- Quote: “It was not as important… as it is today… the younger generation is really… spearheading a movement that is not only about being conscious… but also… just wanting to be part of a movement that’s kinder… to the planet… [and] each other.” (14:34 - 16:05)

[16:23] Navigating Social Impact and Advocacy

Mission: Slogan is “humanity in motion.” The brand actively supports local and global charities (e.g., working with Dubai Cares, building orphan schools in Delhi).
Measurable Impact: Hired graduates from supported schools.
- Quote: “From building the school to having graduates that came for an internship with us and that stayed with us… shows tangible results.” (16:37 - 17:46)

[17:52] True Inclusion—A CEO’s First Day Surprise

Company Culture: Real diversity and inclusion—employees from all backgrounds, including neurodiverse staff.
Memorable Story: CEO’s first-day encounter with Ahmed, an employee on the spectrum who broke the ice with a joke.
- Quote: “I went to the coffee machine… this young man looks at me… goes, do you want to hear a joke?... They said, yes, this is Ahmed and he’s on the spectrum. …I started meeting so many different people… giving a platform for people to engage [from] all sorts of life, that warms my heart.” (17:52 - 19:18)

[19:22] From Luxury and Media to Purpose-Led Fashion

Rania’s career journey: Luxury/retail, media, and now impact-focused activewear.
Emphasis on storytelling and community-building throughout her professional path, regardless of industry.
- Quote: “At the end of the day, you’re trying to build a brand, you’re talking to a community… traditional media… can no longer sustain itself if they don’t partner with communities.” (19:48 - 21:44)

[22:03] Transformation, Leadership, and Strategic Vision

Rania’s ethos: Embracing challenging, transformative roles over “operating” ones, always centered on people and culture.

[23:53] Scaling Without Losing Soul

Global Expansion: Promise-driven, not just commercial.
Differentiation: The brand’s message and values set it apart from big players like Lululemon, Alo Yoga, Vuori, etc.
- Quote: “We might be competing when it comes to the actual product, but why a customer or why a community will choose us is very different.” (24:31 - 27:12)
Commit to community-driven ambassadors over traditional models, emphasizing authentic stories and representation.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Laurent Kleitman on the Vienna opening:
“We composed an Asian symphony in Vienna... bringing the Asian touch in hospitality into the heart of old Europe.” (02:41 - 03:17)
On Well-being:
“Guests want... not just wellness, but well being offering throughout the journey... a new signature sleeping moment... deploying along all our properties...” (05:19 - 06:39)
On Success in Hospitality:
“To be successful in hospitality, you need to love others more than you love yourself.” (09:20 - 10:31)
Rania Masri on humanity in business:
“One of the main slogans of the brand is humanity in motion. So it’s never a challenge when you speak about humanity.” (16:37 - 16:52)
On diversity and culture:
“I’ve worked for 25 years and I’ve never had… one-on-one interactions when they talk about diversity and inclusion—but really giving a platform for people to engage of all sorts of life, that warms my heart a lot.” (17:52 - 19:18)

Timestamps for Major Segments

[01:03] – Introduction, Mandarin Oriental’s Bangkok anniversary & Vienna opening (Laurent Kleitman)
[05:00] – Wellness and the evolution of luxury hospitality
[08:00] – Community partnerships and local immersion
[09:20] – Talent development and “loving others”
[10:41] – Global expansion and future Mandarin Oriental openings
[11:30] – Industry trends: privacy, generosity, and new destinations
[12:09] – Unconventional new locations (e.g., Takamatsu, Japan)
[14:01] – The Giving Movement’s ethos and origin (Rania Masri)
[16:23] – Navigating social impact, advocacy boundaries, real outcomes
[17:52] – Diversity, company culture, and a CEO’s first day
[19:22] – Career journey through different sectors
[22:03] – Transformation leadership style
[23:53] – Strategic global expansion, staying authentic

Episode Tone

Warm, insightful, and purpose-driven, the conversations mix pragmatic business insights with a strong focus on community, culture, and creating positive impact—both within established luxury hospitality and fast-rising ethical fashion.

This summary covers all major content from the episode, omitting ads and promotional sections. For more, visit the respective websites: mandarinoriental.com and thegivingmovement.com.

Loading summary

Transcript59 lines

[00:00]
A
Foreign.
[00:12]
B
Hello and welcome to the Entrepreneurs on Monocle Radio. This show all about inspiring people, innovative companies and fresh ideas in global business. Coming up on the show, we reconnect with one of our favorite guests of 2025 to check in on his highlights of the year. Highlights aside from appearing on this fine.
[00:29]
C
Program, of course, what we say about Mandarin Oriental in Vienna is that we composed an Asian symphony in Vienna in a way bringing the Asian touch in hospitality into the heart of old Europe.
[00:43]
B
And later we'll hear from the leader of a sustainable fashion label that's expanding globally while navigating the challenges inherent to a commitment to positive impact.
[00:52]
D
One of the main slogans of the brand is humanity in motion. So it's never a challenge when you speak about humanity. It's obviously a challenge when you try to understand what's happening.
[01:04]
B
This is the Entrepreneurs with me, Tom Edwards. You're listening to the Entrepreneurs now. Regular listeners to the show will be familiar with friend of the program and group CEO of Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group, Lauren Kleitman. Since we last spoke to Lauren back in September, Mandarin Oriental began began celebrations for a very special anniversary and expanded its portfolio with the opening of its debut property in Austria. Our Laura Kramer caught up with Laurent at our pop up studio at the recent international luxury travel market in Cannes. And she began by asking him about the group's landmark moments of 2025.
[01:48]
C
Pretty important milestone. 150 years of the Mandarin Oriental Bangkok that we call the Oriental Bangkok, really founded in 1876. So we're starting the festivities of the 150th anniversary of the Grande Dame on the Chao Phra River. So it's a huge milestone for us really and how we can conceive the property for the next 150 years. In a way, that's what really is about the anniversary we're about to celebrate.
[02:15]
A
And you also opened a new location in Vienna.
[02:19]
C
Sure. So that's part of the legend continues. And we are now entering Austria with a beautiful property in the heart of Vienna. What a magnificent capital city in Europe and just opened a week ago. And I'll do and do the ribbon cutting next week. So you see, this is still very hot of the press. A beautiful new hotel there.
[02:38]
A
Well, tell us about it. What can visitors find there?
[02:41]
C
Well, you know, I mean Vienna is one of the most visited capital city and so much linked to arts and fine arts and music. What we say about Mandarin Oriental in Vienna is that we composed an Asian symphony in Vienna in a way and bringing the Asian touch in hospitality into the heart of old Europe. And just to show that old Europe has a lot to offer. So there's going to be here, I mean, a magnificent food and beverage offering for once. We're not going to do a tea lounge, but a coffee lounge. Giving. The culture in Austria is very much around coffee, so we have deployed a range of creative recipes around coffee.
[03:18]
A
So.
[03:18]
C
So I hope you can come and visit us.
[03:20]
A
Oh, me too. And I love my coffee. Now, when you look at expansion, is it more about planting more flags or deepening the experience in the places that you are? How do you calibrate that?
[03:32]
C
You know, this is when the brand is so loved by our guests and our fans, as we like to call them. I think our job is to make sure we have Mandarin Oriental hotels where they travel. So if you love Mandarin Oriental and you want to go to Rome today, you can't. And in a year or so, you'll be able to have a Mandarin Oriental in Rome. Same in Vienna. If you really love the brand, you need to be where the guests are going. So it's really planting the flag, but not any flag anywhere. It's really about the right destination and where we capture the essence of each destination in our hotels and then deepening the experience of our guests in the relevant location. Yes.
[04:12]
A
And I wondered how important is providence for that? Because when you're building something new, how do you make sure that it has that sense of place which you alluded to, but it also feels rooted, but also not generic, let's say.
[04:25]
C
Interesting as a question, because this is the art of developing hotel. It's really about that Fil rouge that makes sure, you know, you are in a Mandarin Oriental with a sort of authentic service culture, our legendary service culture that we bring from the Oriental in Bangkok and the Mandarin in Hong Kong, how that is really, what is the point of difference across all our properties more than, or in addition to, of course, the design or the food and beverage that we are famous for, or the wellness offering as well. So it's that balance of who we are as a brand and where we are as a destination.
[05:00]
A
I'm glad you brought up wellness because it has, in a way become a little bit of a buzz world. But at the same time, the research shows people care about this, of course, they better than anybody. And I wondered, what does it mean for the Mandarin Oriental specifically? You know, that goes beyond the green juices and yoga mats, let's say, you know.
[05:20]
C
Well, I mean, a couple of things. First, I want always to remind that we have invented wellness in luxury hospitality, I mean the first ever spine hotel was in 1993 in Bangkok, in the Oriental at the time. So we in a way have been participated to the massive trend of wellness development in luxury hotels. But I must say today guests want more than just a yoga mat, as you say, or a green apple. They want first of all the choice. They want to have not just wellness, but well being offering throughout the journey. And it's not just about the spa or not just about the fitness that you can provide, but it's about the overall care you can, we can show for their entire well being. So how do you care for their sleeping routine? We have a new signature sleeping moment that we deploy along all our properties where we do have a new ritual in terms of beverage, for turn down service, a number of amenities that we bring to facilitate the sleep, which as we know today sleeping is probably the most challenged activities we have to go through and the most deprived in terms of sleep. So there is a lot of, there is a larger definition of well being nowadays that goes well beyond wellness or spa.
[06:39]
A
I love that. And also the way that you talk about it, there is a sense of fun to it at the same time because I think sometimes we hear wellness and it seems very serious. And I wonder, do you think in hospitality, are we afraid of having fun and hospitality sometimes or should we just be leaning more into it?
[06:57]
C
You know, there's truth in what you say about luxury hospitality sometimes being too stiff. What we're trying to provide the guest is a very relaxed, a very natural service and giving the choice. I come back to that notion of choice because nowadays in a property they want to have the indulgence of a three star meal full of butter if they want to. And at the same time the best ever detox menu or vegan menu in the same property on the same day. So we have to adapt to these diversity of needs and to be more flexible and in fact to listen more to our guests, listen more to our guests, more than sort of give them what we believe luxury hospitality is, but by creating the experience they want from a luxury place that we offer.
[07:47]
A
And I think that's so important, of course, the listening part of what the customer wants. But what about local communities? And it's not just about the backdrop anymore, but how do they become real partners in the experience when you go.
[08:01]
C
Into a new location, we want to work with the communities to create experiences. So everywhere we put new hotel very much ahead of any set up, we get in contact with the communities, we recruit people from the communities, we train people from the community. We are the best allies of the community. A best example perhaps is our property in Beijing in Tianmen, where we have renovated a hutong area very close to the Forbidden City. And we still have neighbors, so we are still completely immersed in a community. The chief concierge is a man who lived and was born in this area and lived all his childhood in this neighborhood, is now our chief concierge in Mandarin Oriental Tianmen, Beijing. This is the way we really embrace the community. And the best experience is when you have a tea ceremony, not a fake tea ceremony, but in fact you go to the place he used to go, he used to live when he was a child, and you do the tea with him. And this is where we really believe we belong to the community and support the community.
[09:08]
A
And you touched on talent there. It's such an important discussion and I wondered, do you still believe in the traditional hospitality schools or is it more about instinct and attitude these days? How do you find the best talent then?
[09:20]
C
You need both. You need well trained students that come and work for us. We have a program called Rising Fan program where we provide and propose 18 months graduate program in Mandarin rental, going through different functions and then getting to know the culture and getting to know the brand from within and then graduating and taking on more responsibility inside the group. So we need that, but also we need the attitude and the character. Very often I'm touring the hospitality schools and the question I'm most often asked is about what would it take to be successful in hospitality? And well, I say, I know I'm older than the students, but I hate giving advice because. Because it feels like I'm very old person talking down to young people, which I'm not. And nonetheless, I answer the question by saying I believe to be successful in hospitality, you need to love others more than you love yourself. And it's really about putting the other at the heart of your life. And having the joy of seeing someone else fulfilled and happy is what should fulfill yourself and create your sense of purpose in your profession. So if you love others, I think hospitality is a profession for life.
[10:32]
A
I think it's a really good life lesson there too. Not just in hospitality. It's really beautiful. You alluded to it earlier. Where are the new openings this year? Where are you taking us?
[10:41]
C
So we're going to close the year with 45 hotels. We just opened Dubai Downtown, our second property in Vienna. And next year we've planned to open a beautiful resort in Mallorca, in Punta Negra. And a beautiful resort that all opened in April 2026. Then we're going to return to Manila. You know, we're born in Asia. So very happy when there is a new Asian capital city on the map for us. And we'll close the year with our first Alpine resort in Cortina in Italy. The entry of Mandarin Oriental in the ski resort and Alpine resort. We're very happy to be coming to that market very soon.
[11:18]
A
Oh, that's so excited. And when you look ahead to 2026, then where should we be heading? What's catching your eye in terms of the direction of travel, I guess for the hospitality industry? Luxury industry, for sure.
[11:31]
C
Well, I think everybody is probably saying similar things and this is really a very favorable cycle we're in at the moment, the search for new experiences. But I would say one of the most important, important one is the desire for more privacy, the desire for more generosity, the desire for new destination. We are well placed at Mandarin Oriental to capture those trends.
[11:54]
A
And how much is it about also discovering or helping somebody discover a new destination too? Because we have these established regions that we all go to that we love, but sometimes it's fun to be the leaders and to pave the way.
[12:09]
C
Yes, absolutely right. We like to be in destination you expect us to be. And we like to be in destination you don't expect us to be. So for example, our project in Japan that will open in 2027 is in a formidable area near Takamatsu where we're going to have a resort in two different locations that you will have to cross the sea to go to the second one. And on the famous Sodoshima island where you have a wealth of art and museum. So this is a destination where there is no luxury offering and we're very happy to offer a Mandarin Oriental to art lovers in this part of Japan, which is a beautiful region of the country.
[12:46]
B
That was Lauren Kleitman, Group CEO of the Mandarin Hotel Group, talking to our Laura Kramer. You can find out more about Laurent's business by heading to mandarinoriental.com.
[12:58]
E
Welcome to the land of wine, cuisine, fashion and the art of joie de vivre France. The Monocle Handbook is the third installment in our series of hardback guides for the best things to do, see and discover in all corners of Leczagon. Over 220 pages, Monocle's latest book showcases the creme de la creme of the country, from the Atlantic to the Alps and the windswept Normandie to the sun kissed Riviera. Plus top tables in Paris, Nonts not to miss hotels and where to splash out in Marseille and plenty more to try from Piste to Plage. If you're looking to stay longer or put down routes, the book also spotlights the neighborhoods to know and introduce you to the plucky entrepreneurs who have already made the move. France the Monocle Handbook is out now. Buy your copy today@monocle.com books.
[14:01]
B
You're listening to the entrepreneurs. Rania Masri is the CEO of the Giving Movement, a sustainable activewear and lifestyle brand homegrown in the United Arab Emirates. A seasoned luxury and retail leader, Rania joined the company only recently. The mother of two moved to Abu Dhabi 25 years ago from Canada and has since played a significant role in shaping the Emirates retail and fashion ecosystem. I caught up with Rania on a recent trip to the UAE's capital and began by asking her where the Giving Movement's focus on responsible, sustainable practices began.
[14:34]
D
It's great to talk about this today because if you would have asked me maybe I would say five years ago when it was founded, it was not as important, I feel, as it is today in the sense of the customer base, you know, LinkedIn their personal values to the brands that they engage with. Today in the region, there's a lot more attention to that. And the younger generation is really the one that's spearheading a movement that is not only about being conscious about what they wear and which brands they engage with, but also the whole idea of just wanting to be part of a movement that's kinder, kinder, obviously to the planet, but most importantly to each other. You know, we've seen the world go through such, you know, it's not the first time that the world's gone through such difficult times, but it's with the social media. Everybody's part of all the wars and the famines and, you know, and the misery that we see around us. So a brand that is very much rooted around the idea of giving back really took off. And it was founded in 2020 during COVID It was a time where everybody was very engaged, engaged through social media. So the story really took off, was a very simple brand that started just with T shirts with a very big logo that said the Giving Movement. And everybody was wearing it very proudly.
[16:06]
F
And just on that point about the consumer demanding more, actually from businesses that talk about these kind of themes, does that become how challenging is it when there is a singular moment? You mentioned wars and things like this. Obviously there's been quite an outspoken stance on Gaza for example, which is very popular with consumers.
[16:23]
B
But is that difficult as a steward.
[16:25]
F
Of a business to know where to set those boundaries? Is that a challenge to balance? Or actually, if you come back to those principles, is it actually easier because you say, well, now we're just not moving from our course?
[16:38]
D
I mean, one of the main slogans of the brand is humanity in motion. So it's never a challenge when you speak about humanity. It's obviously a challenge when you try to understand what's happening. But I think all humans are connected in the fact that we just don't want to see humanity go through what it's been through. Now, as a brand, we had a lot of support here in the uae and we worked through Dubai Cares in order for us to support many charities regionally or globally. The brand was able to support build a school in Delhi for orphans. And that was the brainchild of a lady called Lucy, and it's called Harmony House. And today we are actually. We have two employees with us that have gone through and graduated from that school. So from building the school to having graduates that came for an internship with us and that I stayed with us. And that story, just for me, just shows you that it's tangible results and it's not just, you know, where's the money going or what are we doing and how are we supporting?
[17:46]
B
That's amazing.
[17:47]
F
And that's proper circularity, right? We talk about it in economics, economic terms, but that's harmony.
[17:53]
D
Yeah. I mean, when I started and I. I walked into the office and I actually met the team and I had read so much about diversity and inclusion and, you know, how. How loose this term could be in many organizations. But a funny story, I'll tell you this. It was my first day in the office, and I went to the coffee machine and I was putting my coffee, and this young man looks at me, me, just very, very seriously, and goes, do you want to hear a joke? And I'm, you know, this is like the CEO starting first day. And I, I was caught off guard. I'm like, sure can't remember the joke. But it was a very, you know, the elephant and the. And the mouse type of joke. So I.
[18:35]
F
Maybe it is a classic.
[18:37]
D
And he just. And I just cracked up when he finished this joke, and he just looked at me straight in the eye and just moved on. And I said to myself, you know, what was that? And when I spoke to my executive team, I'm like, they said, doesn't this happen?
[18:51]
E
And they're.
[18:52]
D
And they said, yes, this is Ahmed and he's on the spectrum. I said, wow, okay, so we're literally, you know, and then I started meeting so many different people and to be honest, you know, I've worked for 25 years and I've never had, you know, one on one interactions when they talk about diversity and inclusion. But really giving a platform for people to engage of all sorts of life, that warms my heart a lot.
[19:18]
F
No, it's a lovely story.
[19:20]
B
Well done, well done. Ahmed.
[19:22]
F
It's funny you mentioned your, your kind of career and your duration. You've obviously worked in some other kind of sectors. You had lots of really interesting jobs. Do you, I don't know, it sounds you're so passionate about what you're doing now, but do you miss, I don't know, media landscape? So many interesting moves. We've been having some kind of conversations with various players in that field. Do you look back sometimes and miss the rough and fumble of some of these areas? Or is it always exciting to see how you can build on your experiences with what's coming next? How does it work?
[19:49]
D
Yeah, I mean, this is what. And again, a lot of people that know me have said, wow, this was probably the missing puzzle for you. And I think that I've built my career in a way. It was actually very organic and natural. But from working in luxury and working in retail, everything at the heart of what I did was very much around brand and creating communities. And then when I, you know, got the opportunity to come and work in Abu Dhabi the past couple of years in media, although it was a first for me, but it really revolved around the same things. What we see saw happen was a transformation on the way that people engage and communicate. So at the end of the day, you're trying to build a brand, you're talking to a community you're not talking to, you know, and the same thing with news and media. So I found it fascinating when I moved into that area that traditional media can no longer sustain itself if they don't partner with the communities, because this is where the conversation and the narrative is happening. So when I started talking to the investors that are behind today, the giving movement, I thought, you know what? I did the luxury bit, I did the school, I have my foundations in retail. I looked at what's happening in terms of how people are engaging with content today. And I really, really felt very close to a lot of the causes. Because when you're in news, you're not, it's not luxury. Right. So when I found a perfect Mix between what I love to do, which is building brands, working in fashion, homegrown, which I'm very passionate about, and then finding a message and a narrative that's actually very strong and real. Then I found that it was the right. You know, I think it's that circularity, that circularity.
[21:44]
F
And just on that, it's funny because there was a big rebrand imi, so kind of recently, and you were kind of in the vanguard of that. Is that just the perfect project for you? Is that the kind of thing where you're like, I'm going to roll my steam? So, yeah, I get to this. Were there some attendant challenges? Because it was quite a big shift, if you think in strategic terms.
[22:02]
B
An easy job?
[22:03]
C
Probably not.
[22:04]
D
Look, it wasn't easy, but I never go after easy jobs. I don't know what it is. I don't know if it's probably the city that I live in as well and the country that we live in. From day one, I mean, I came here, I was 24 years old, but from day one, it was all about building. It was all about trying to understand the ecosystem and trying to make something out of it. It was never an operating role. First, we worked with the Inditex brands to launch them, and then Ralph Lauren was coming into the region, and I let that. But my last stint with the Shelhu Group, which is the largest retail luxury group in the region, was chief Transformation Officer. Within transformation of any organization, be it luxury, retail or anything, there are many pillars that you have to work with, but one of the main ones is culture and people. So when I went into that role and what excited me about the role, first of all, was the CEO, because I follow people, you know, Andrani Rahed was and is a very big name in the media industry, and he wanted to create something, a big foundation for media for the uae. And I found the idea of the transformation a lot more interesting than just the industry itself. You know, how do we create a brand? You know, but how do we create a brand that resonates with the journalists and the people and the brands that are under that umbrella? But also that could play to the strength and to the power of the country that we're part of. I mean, the uae, you see what's happening in culture today, but really, you look at AI, you look at, you know, genomics, you look at everything. So media had to be the next frontier, if you want to. And.
[23:50]
F
And it's the same thing, as you said, it's storytelling, transformational.
[23:52]
D
Absolutely.
[23:53]
F
These things Run through it. Well, let's come back then to Giving Movement and talk to us a little bit, Ronnie, about the next phase, expansion globally. You know, again, the story plays super well here, but it plays pretty well around the world. How do you marshal that? You know, some things travel in a slightly more circuitous way, so you've got to be the steward of that journey. Is it difficult to speak to millennial audience compared to your Gen Z audience, compared to your boom holders, whatever? How do you kind of make sure you're marrying up all the threads, keeping coherent, keeping your hand on the tiller? Presumably that's another fun challenge that you like. But how do you do it? Give some strategic insights?
[24:31]
D
I mean, look like every brand. And you know this more than anyone, I'm sure. You know, you need to know your audience, you need to curate your offer, curate your teams, your experience for that audience. But what I love here and what I'm, you know, part of our strategic direction is to really come back to our roots and be very true to who we are. You know, you look at the teams will do competitive mapping and they'll look at the other players and you have huge players that are coming into the region or into the world. You have Lululemon that's been there for a while, and then you have Alo yoga and now there's Viori that's also coming and you run. The teams are like opening stores and skims. Just signed a deal with Unas and they have a huge pop up. But I don't look at that because I don't think that we're competing when it comes to our message, and I don't think that we're competing when it comes to our DNA. True, we might be competing when it comes to the actual product, but why a customer or why a community will choose us is very different. So I really want to double down and trickle down on that. And I think it's important that we don't consider. I mean, the money will come, the commercial part will come, the growth will come. You know, it's. Those are very simple. You open more stores and you, you know, have events and you perfect your product and you perfect your team. But what you really need, need to make sure is to always stick to what your promises and to what your values are. And here it is a brand that was built on that. So it's very important that we continue on that promise and that we scale that movement. So, yes, regionally, here we are known, maybe more in the UAE than the rest of the region. Although I was very surprised at how big the equity of the brand brand actually is, because when my announcement got up, I'm like, is it about me or is it about the brand? Why is everybody so excited? But yeah, the region, you know, is very proud of it because it also has the Arabic element to it. So I really want to feature, first of all, a lot of people from the community that are doing good. I want them to be our ambassadors. I'm not as interested to have models that look, you know, very nice and are outfits only. That's also good. But it's really about who fits these values, who does our customer relate to? And that scalability is very possible across the world because everybody can resonate with that. So how do we take this to Europe? How do we take this to the US how do we take this to South Asia? How do we work with that same heart in commerce?
[27:12]
B
That was Rania Masri, the CEO of the Giving Movement, talking to me in Abu Dhabi. And you can find out more about the business and its work by heading to thegivingmovement.com. And that's all for this episode of the Entrepreneurs. We'll be back at the same time next week. The program's produced by Laura Kramer with audio editing by Jack Dewas. You can listen again and find out more about the show@monocle.com and while you're there, why not subscribe to Monocle magazine, support our journalism, and read more about better businesses every month. You can also follow this show and catch up wherever you get your podcasts. If you'd like to be in touch with the team, email Laura on lrkonical.com I'm Tom Edwards. Goodbye, and thanks for listening to the Entrepreneurs.