The Dave Gerhardt Show (Exit Five): ABM (Account-Based Marketing) Overview with Brandon Redlinger
Date: March 19, 2026
Host: Dave Gerhardt
Guest: Brandon Redlinger (VP Marketing, Crosschq; ex-Engagio, Demandbase; Co-Founder, Forge community)
Episode Overview
This episode delivers a deep, tactical breakdown of Account-Based Marketing (ABM) with Brandon Redlinger, a veteran who built ABM functions at notable SaaS companies like Engagio and Demandbase. Brandon walks through how to know when your company is ready for ABM, how to select and score target accounts, the importance of cross-functional alignment, effective plays for generating pipeline, measurement, team structures, and career growth tips for marketers.
Key Discussion Points and Insights
1. Company Readiness: When to Start ABM
- ABM isn’t just a marketing decision: It requires organizational alignment—especially with sales, implementation, and customer support (04:43–06:33).
- Brandon’s rule: “It’s not just the marketing team, it’s across the whole organization. And that’s why this is a whole company wide thing. It really should be.” (Brandon, 06:09)
- Red flags for false starts: Failing ABM launches often come from orgs not equipped for enterprise sales/life cycles.
2. Sales and Marketing Alignment
- Critical for ABM: Not just buzz—true alignment means shared goals, joint planning, unified language, and ideally similar comp plans (07:21–10:17).
- Quote: “There’s aligning with your sales counterparts strategically and then there’s also the tactical side of it.” (Brandon, 07:32)
3. Deciding If ABM Is the Right Approach
- ABM fits best for larger, enterprise deals—not for high-velocity, low-ACV SaaS (13:21–14:04).
- Deal size guidelines shift: Modern tech and buyer journeys have lowered the threshold, but “high velocity inbounds” means you might not need ABM.
- Existing customers: ABM is effective for both new business and expansion/upsell in complex orgs.
4. The Danger of Lack of Focus
- Start small: “Honestly I even think a thousand [accounts] is too much… Focus matters more than anything, especially at startups and especially like, that is what ABM is all about. It’s about focus.” (Brandon, 15:52)
- Lesson: Too many accounts = missed SLAs and diluted results.
5. How to Select and Score Target Accounts
- Step-by-step:
- Analyze closed-won deals—especially large ones—then involve CS and Support for qualitative feedback. (16:54–18:39)
- Examine closed-lost deals for patterns to avoid.
- Build the “ICP” (Ideal Customer Profile): Primarily based on firmographics and technographics.
- Layer in intent data (from vendors like ZoomInfo) and engagement data (your own marketing/CRM data)—but don’t overvalue intent data.
- Quote: “Account selection is probably one of the most important pieces, right? Because if you get this right, a lot of the other dominoes fall easy.” (Brandon, 16:54)
- Scoring: Assign weights/percentages to each factor (ICP, intent, engagement), culminating in an overall “fit” score (0–100), then stack-rank (19:50–25:17).
Notable Quotes
- “I will tell you, I’ll tell you why I’m not that hot on intent data… first-party engagement data is your strongest data.” (Brandon, 21:12)
- “If you, if you selected your accounts correctly and you have proper messaging, it’s almost just a matter of doing as many activities as you can to just catch that person at the right time.” (Brandon, 36:59)
6. Team Ownership of Account Selection
- Historically owned by Sales, but now best led by the RevOps function—bridging sales, marketing, and customer success for data quality and shared visibility (31:39–32:09).
- Emphasizes collaborative trading/bartering between sales, ops, and marketing to arrive at a “blessed” list.
7. Right-sizing Reps’ Capacity
- Calculate how many target accounts each seller can meaningfully work (i.e., enterprise = approx. 12 active opps per rep). Monitor SLAs, actively manage account assignment volume (32:45–34:44).
8. First Steps After You Have Your List: Initial Outreach & Plays
- Don’t overthink multichannel campaigns to start; first, ensure core direct, relevant outreach is happening (36:21–36:59).
- “What’s the pitch?” Get your messaging right. If it flops, refine targeting or the value prop before scaling.
- Multi-touch plays:
- Executive events with strategic partners (“Get customers and prospects in the same room so the customer’s story sells the prospect”). (38:11–41:56)
- Industry research reports/surveys targeting both prospects and customers to gather pain points, priorities, and context for personalized follow-ups.
- “ABM isn’t just about personalization (‘Hey, we like the same hockey team’), it’s about showing true knowledge and insight into their industry and needs.” (Brandon referencing ITSMA, 40:46)
- ABM is not just outbound; it’s about being perceived as the niche expert and building trust over time.
9. ABM vs. Demand Gen Functions
- “I think [ABM is] the same thing… ABM is a function of demand gen. It’s just a different way to do demand gen.” (Brandon, 44:20)
- Trouble comes when legacy orgs split teams. Newer orgs should unite ABM and Demand Gen under one umbrella, with shared process and accountability for revenue.
10. Measurement and Metrics
- Funnel math still applies: Value, Volume, Velocity, Conversion at each stage—analyze separately for ABM and Demand Gen (46:13–48:10).
- For ABM, also track engagement, “coverage” (are you reaching all key contacts?), and intermediate milestones.
- Measurement is about improvement and signals, not just justification or self-defense.
- Quote: “It gets really hard if your CEO is expecting you to use metrics to justify things rather than… help you improve, move things.” (Brandon, 46:29)
Career Advice Segment (48:10–53:04)
Brandon’s Career Tips for Aspiring Marketing Leaders
- Surround yourself with people smarter than you, both “two steps ahead” and much more experienced.
- Seek community (professional groups, communities like Exit Five).
- Don’t get hung up on formal mentorship—“mentors from afar” work (following content from Dan Kennedy, Russell Brunson, etc.).
- Always optimize early career for learning, not title or pay:
- “Earlier on in your career, you should really be optimizing for learning—a hundred percent.”
- Apply knowledge—don’t just absorb it.
- Embrace turbulence (strategy shifts, industry changes) as a learning opportunity.
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
On readiness and focus:
"Focus matters more than anything, especially at startups...that is what ABM is all about."
Brandon Redlinger (15:52)
On tactical vs. strategic sales-marketing alignment:
"There's aligning with your sales counterparts strategically and then there's also the tactical side of it…If you can find a way to be compensated similarly, it’s always going to be a huge plus for alignment."
Brandon Redlinger (07:21–08:17)
On account selection and involving customer teams:
“Let’s actually look at the larger deals and then let’s also get CS involved...they actually have more anecdotal evidence than [sales] can.”
Brandon Redlinger (16:54–17:50)
On intent data:
“Now that I don't work at a company that sells intent data, I'll be honest, I'm not that hot on intent data…first party engagement data is your strongest data.”
Brandon Redlinger (21:12)
On ABM being more than personalization:
“A lot of people think it's about personalization. I think personalization is actually just one piece of it…the number one reason is actually knowledge of their market.”
Brandon Redlinger (40:46)
On the need for organization-wide buy-in:
"You need to have a strong company story and strategic narrative and reason for existing and why this company is here to solve the problem for X—like, this, like any other marketing tactic, is going to be really damn hard [without it]."
Dave Gerhardt (43:23)
Timestamps for Key Segments
- [02:40] Brandon’s background & early ABM experience
- [03:32] Why Crosschq isn’t pursuing ABM (yet) and what foundations are required
- [07:21] Strategic & tactical sales/marketing alignment
- [11:45] When (and why) to consider ABM as a go-to-market strategy
- [15:52] Danger of picking too many accounts
- [16:54] How to select, score, and refine your target account list (ICP, intent, engagement)
- [19:50] Data vendors, intent/engagement data explained
- [25:17] Scoring system and tiering accounts in practice
- [31:39] Who owns account selection? RevOps role
- [32:45] Seller capacity planning for enterprise ABM
- [36:21] Plays for engagement (outreach, events, research)
- [38:11] Executive events with partners: a proven, high-impact play
- [41:56] Industry reports/research for ABM
- [43:23] Org-wide buy-in and ABM’s strategic narrative
- [44:20] Should ABM and Demand Gen be separate teams?
- [46:13] Metrics and measurement approaches
- [48:10] Brandon’s career advice for marketers
- [53:04] Closing thoughts and where to find Brandon
Final Takeaways
- ABM is a discipline—and a company-wide initiative—not just a marketing campaign.
- Start with focus, cross-functional buy-in, and clean alignment before tactics.
- Analyze your best (and worst) deals, involve the whole customer journey team, and deliberately prioritize a tight account list.
- Don’t confuse activity or personalization with real commercial insight—be the expert in your prospect’s business.
- Organize and measure ABM with the same rigor as Demand Gen, but tailor to complex, multi-contact buying journeys.
- Early career? Optimize for learning, find “mentors from afar,” and learn by doing.
Contact:
Find Brandon Redlinger on LinkedIn (search “Brandon Redlinger”).
Listen to more episodes and join the Exit Five B2B marketing community at exit5.com.