The Find Out Podcast – Episode Summary
Episode Title: What To Do If Confronted By ICE
Released: January 29, 2026
Host(s): Tim, Rich, Zach, Luke
Special Guest: Eliza Orleans (Manhattan public defender, Survivor alum)
Episode Overview
This episode dives into the legal and political chaos surrounding recent ICE (Immigration and Customs Enforcement) actions during Trump’s second term, focusing on extrajudicial killings, state vs. federal legal battles, and what everyday people should do if they are confronted by ICE. The panel is joined by Eliza Orleans, a public defender and outspoken advocate, who brings clarity on constitutional rights, state law, qualified immunity, and practical steps to protect oneself and one's community from unlawful ICE activity. The tone is frank, passionate, at times darkly comedic, and fiercely committed to demystifying legal tactics for listeners worried about increasingly aggressive law enforcement.
Key Discussion Points and Insights
1. The Legal Situation with ICE Killings
- ICE Involved Deaths: The hosts highlight that public focus has centered on two deaths (Renee Good, Alex Preddy), but actually nine people have been killed, mostly people of color ([01:14]).
- Extrajudicial Executions: Eliza points out that even the death penalty requires a conviction. Public killings without due process are unlawful:
“Even if you’re committing a crime, allegedly, you can’t be executed without due process and a trial and a conviction.” – Eliza Orleans [03:25]
- Even being present, recording, or passively observing cannot legally justify execution—these are “extrajudicial executions.”
2. Misinformation, Political Spin, and Legal Definitions
- False Narratives: Discussion of officials (e.g., Kristi Noem, Stephen Miller) spreading made-up claims, calling victims “domestic terrorists” without basis ([02:55]).
- Eliza clarifies the legal fog around “domestic terrorism,” noting the term is weaponized politically and not credibly applicable to these cases ([04:30]).
- Media Spin: Major right-wing media figures and politicians manufacture narratives where activists or those recording are cast as criminal threats, which the panel finds “completely ridiculous” and dangerous ([04:55]).
3. The Right to Film Law Enforcement & Public Misconceptions
- First Amendment Rights:
“You have the absolute right to film law enforcement. It is your First Amendment right.”
— Eliza Orleans [03:25] - Even “obstruction”-type charges are minor misdemeanors and never justify violence from law enforcement ([07:28]).
- Jury decisions (not police) must decide if someone’s actually impeding law enforcement ([08:40]).
4. Use of Force by Law Enforcement
- Lethal force is only justified if there is an immediate, ongoing threat—not because someone is fleeing or annoying an officer ([10:16]).
“You can never use [deadly force] against a fleeing person unless they pose an ongoing and immediate threat.” – Eliza Orleans [11:09]
5. State vs. Federal Jurisdiction & Accountability
- ICE Agents Can Be Prosecuted by States:
“Federal agents are not immune from state criminal law.” – Eliza Orleans [12:19]
“Being a federal officer does not give you a license to kill.” – Eliza Orleans [12:39] - There is “no such thing as absolute immunity” for criminal prosecution—contrary to right-wing claims and J.D. Vance’s assertions ([14:08]).
- Progressive DAs in several states are publicly pledging to prosecute unlawful killings, and activists should pressure their local prosecutors to do the same ([13:27]).
6. Federal Obstruction of State Investigations
- Active Federal Obstruction: Federal agencies are withholding evidence from state officials investigating ICE actions, forcing states to sue for access ([16:11]).
- Political context: The panel suggests this is more about political cover for federal officials than protecting ICE officers, and may backfire by energizing opposition ([18:12]).
7. Law Enforcement and Political Realignment
- Even conservative cops and the NRA are distancing themselves from the current wave of ICE-led violence—illustrating how egregious the misconduct is ([20:20]).
- Gun rights and “stand your ground” laws are cynically and inconsistently applied depending on political context ([21:36]).
8. Historical Context and the Need for Justice
- The group draws historical parallels to Reconstruction and Nazi Germany, warning against simply “moving on” after mass state violence ([29:34]).
- Emphasis on real accountability—no more blanket forgiveness, no “time for healing” that covers up wounds:
“You don’t heal a wound just by covering it up, right? You have to clean it out first.” – Eliza Orleans [29:23]
9. Direct Guidance: What to Do If You Encounter ICE
- Your Rights:
- You do not have to answer ICE’s questions.
“Silence is not suspicious. It is legal.” – Eliza Orleans [33:50]
- Never open your door for ICE with only an administrative warrant (judge’s signature is required!).
- Never consent to a search; say clearly you do not consent ([33:51]).
- Always ask for a lawyer if detained; say, “I am exercising my right to remain silent” ([33:50]).
- You have the First Amendment right to film police activity in public—so long as you do not physically obstruct them ([35:28], [36:01]).
- You do not have to answer ICE’s questions.
- Caveats:
- Stay safe and maintain a reasonable distance (optical zoom on phones helps) ([36:33]).
- Fear is understandable, but knowledge and calm help protect your rights and those of your neighbors ([32:18]).
- If ICE lies to enter a home or uses children as leverage, those acts are illegal and potentially unlawful coercion ([38:48]).
10. The "Liam Ramos" Case
- Panel discusses the case of a 5-year-old, Liam Ramos, whose father was detained as an asylum seeker; ICE tried to get the mother to open the door under false pretenses ([38:48]).
- Eliza confirms: Police lying to coerce home entries is not legal, and using children as bait is a due process violation ([39:48]).
11. Call to Action: Political & Local Engagement
- With ten months until elections, listeners are urged to vote, get involved locally or nationally, run for local office, and support organizing groups ([44:57]).
- Oversight and control of the House and Senate are critical for investigations and future prosecutions ([45:55]).
- “Run for Something” and similar organizations get a shoutout for empowering down-ballot engagement ([46:26]).
Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments
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On Executions without Due Process:
“These extrajudicial executions that they are committing out on the streets in public for not even committing a crime—it's just, it's beyond anything I could possibly [imagine].” – Eliza Orleans [03:25]
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On the Weaponized Use of “Domestic Terrorism”:
“They think that if they start calling us ISIS basically, or Al Qaeda... that they could create something from thin air.” – Tim [05:37]
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On the Flimsy Nature of ‘Impeding’:
“These are not real crimes. These are crimes when you’ve annoyed a police officer in some way... they can’t shoot her in the face.” – Eliza Orleans [07:44]
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When Law Enforcement Turns:
“We are seeing cops, actual conservative Trump supporting cops say, hey, this is...not okay. Everyone knows you don’t take a shot like that... Law enforcement is turning on the MAGA movement.” – Eliza Orleans [20:20]
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On Knowledge vs. Fear:
“Fear is understandable, but I think fear is also what makes people vulnerable to giving up their rights. Knowledge is [power]...” – Eliza Orleans [32:18]
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Historical Lesson:
“It’s only been in the last year I’ve heard people say things like this is happening because we never sufficiently punished the South... We need to learn that lesson and actually tie this shit off...” – Tim [28:38]
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“You don’t heal a wound just by covering it up, right? You have to clean it out first.” – Eliza Orleans [29:23]
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Survivor Trivia:
Eliza’s unexpected, lighter segment about being cast on Survivor—and whether she prefers regular or double-stuf Oreos—brings a break from the heavy content with the same candid, irreverent banter ([47:08–52:59]).
Timestamps for Key Segments
| Topic | Timestamp | |-------------------------------------------|--------------| | Introduction & Eliza's background | 00:17–01:10 | | ICE killings and official misinformation | 01:14–03:25 | | Filming law enforcement & rights | 03:25–06:28 | | Legal definitions: “Domestic terrorist” | 04:06–06:28 | | “Impeding” and minor charges | 07:28–08:58 | | Justification for use of deadly force | 09:47–11:25 | | State prosecution vs. federal agents | 12:00–14:08 | | Qualified immunity vs. “absolute” immunity| 14:08–14:47 | | Federal obstruction & local investigations| 16:11–18:12 | | Law enforcement/NRA distancing from ICE | 20:20–21:36 | | Historic and cultural context | 29:34–31:36 | | What to do if confronted by ICE | 32:18–36:31 | | ICE entering homes, rights on warrants | 33:51–36:01 | | Case of Liam Ramos & ICE’s coercion | 38:48–41:48 | | Importance of November elections | 44:52–45:55 | | Local political organizing | 45:55–46:44 | | Survivor story & Oreo debate | 47:08–52:59 | | Closing | 52:59–53:54 |
Conclusion
The Find Out Podcast delivers a raucous, insightful, and practical hour full of real-world advice on what to do if confronted by ICE, the difference between administrative and judicial warrants, and how not to let fear erode your rights. With a blend of legal expertise, political strategy, and irreverent humor, the hosts and Eliza Orleans underscore the urgent need for accountability, clear-headed activism, and solidarity in facing the ongoing challenges of Trump’s second term.
Follow Eliza Orleans:
- Instagram: @eorlens
- Substack: Objection Everything
- [Other social platforms: @ElizaOrleans everywhere]
Find Out Podcast:
“Fear is understandable, but you just need to know a few things... You don’t need a lawyer to protect yourself—just know your rights.” – Eliza Orleans [32:18]