S6 Ep7: New Yorkers Brace for Mamdani (with Harry Siegel)

Summary

The Focus Group Podcast

Episode: S6 Ep7: New Yorkers Brace for Mamdani (with Harry Siegel)
Date: October 18, 2025
Host: Sarah Longwell (The Bulwark)
Guest: Harry Siegel (Senior Editor, The City; co-host FAQNYC)

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into the unique dynamics of the 2025 New York City mayoral race, where Democratic Socialist Zoran Mamdani is on a clear path to victory. Host Sarah Longwell and New York politics expert Harry Siegel dissect what’s propelling Mamdani, why Andrew Cuomo is floundering as an independent, and how New Yorkers are feeling about socialism, affordability, and representations of antisemitism in the campaign. Using fresh focus group audio, the episode reveals not just policy debate but a deeper malaise and hope among New York’s electorate.

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Key Points & Insights

1. The State of the Race: Background and Stakes

[01:07 - 07:26]

• Zoran Mamdani, a Democratic Socialist assemblyman, is the frontrunner after decisively defeating Andrew Cuomo in the Democratic primary.
• Cuomo is running as an independent in a three-way general election (with Republican Curtis Sliwa also on the ballot).
• Siegel notes that, despite frenzied media moments (e.g., an NFL headquarters shooting), nothing has seriously changed Mamdani’s lead.
• The consensus: Mamdani is winning because the political center has collapsed in New York.
  • “Eric Adams said, ‘I'm the Joe Biden of New York City and the future of the Democratic Party.’ He was not.” — Harry Siegel [06:03]
  • The race is seen as locally important, but not a model for the rest of the country.
• Large stakes for centrists and socialists in upcoming state races (mentions Hakeem Jeffries, Dan Goldman, Elise Stefanik).

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2. The Mamdani Voters: Why Are They Excited?

[09:59 - 14:39], [22:48 – 25:26]

Focus Group Highlights

• Participants cite Mamdani’s communication, authenticity, and focus on affordability and core services.
  • “I believe that [Mamdani’s policies] will be good for the real, real New Yorkers, not only like the rich New Yorkers.” — Participant 3 [10:41]
  • Mamdani’s history as a local representative who actually communicates stands out.
  • Young newcomers to the city, especially, see Mamdani as uniquely responsive to the affordability crisis.
    • “Zoran seems to be the only candidate that takes that seriously in a way that aligns with my personal ideology.” — Participant 1 [12:05]
  • Supporters value a positive, non-negative campaign tone.
    • “His ads on social media…never like a hit on anybody else. It's just promoting what he does. And politicians like that are just far and few between.” — Participant 1 [12:38]

Ideological Appeal

• Healthcare, anti-deregulation sentiment, distrust of corporate wealth—these loom large.
  • “He's going to tax the wealthy people and he's not going to deregulate anything… Deregulation does not work.” — Participant 2 [12:53]
• A focus group member calls out the political use of accusations of antisemitism and defends Mamdani:
  • “I wanted to know because I didn’t buy it [accusations].” — Participant 4 [14:27]

What’s New?

• Siegel notes Mamdani’s achievements—like free bus pilot programs—are limited, but his messaging is unrivaled.
  • “What the popular conversation is missing is how wildly ambitious what he's promising is and how inexperienced he is and the question of what he's actually going to be able to deliver on.” — Harry Siegel [15:05]
• Voters are alienated by Cuomo’s lackluster, reactionary campaign and attracted to the “bright, appealing young guy saying, let's see if we can do more.”

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3. What’s Driving Support: Policies vs Personality?

[22:48 – 32:00]

• Mamdani’s resonance with voters is guided by both his policy platform and likability—but affordability is the unifying thread.
  • “New York City is…the greatest city…but it's like, how great can it be if, like, nobody can live there and nobody can afford to live there?” — Participant 1 [22:52]
• He’s seen as a “new breed” and an alternative to both party establishments.
  • “He is a new breed within the Democratic Party…with socialist tendencies, which…I think it is good to have diversity.” — Participant 3 [24:50]
• Siegel emphasizes Mamdani’s post-primary pivot: softening positions without direct contradictions, managing his image carefully, and being “just enough” broad and positive to hold his coalition.
  • “He's such a good messenger… the campaign’s just trying to say as little as possible and play for time and space. They're winning.” — Harry Siegel [25:41]

The Affordability Factor

• Practically every issue—immigration, crime, healthcare—is now filtered through the lens of affordability for ordinary New Yorkers.
  • “Affordability is the thing. And if I think David Frum had it…if normies aren't gonna solve the affordability crisis, people are gonna start looking at both the populists on the right and left to do it… You could see how they get to socialism.” — Sarah Longwell [31:03]

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4. The Cuomo (and Anti-Mamdani) Voters: Reluctance, Anger, Resignation

[38:00 – 41:47]

Focus Group: Dismayed Classic Democrats

• Many Cuomo supporters are motivated by fear—or loathing—of Mamdani.
  • “I pick Cuomo because he's the least worst out of everybody… I don't want Ma' am Panty. He never had a job…I read body language. He is so polished. My God. Now who does that remind you of, ladies and gentlemen? Oh, Adams.” — Participant 2 [38:00]
  • Polished youth and inexperience are red flags.
  • Disbelief at Mamdani’s promises; a sense that “there’s no reality here.”
  • Reluctant voters are forced to choose Cuomo despite serious reservations, including his widely reported history of harassment.
    • “He's a disgusting sex pig. He's an asshole. He should not be running. But he's the only person running against Mamdani, so what am I going to do?” — Participant 1 [40:18]

Attitudes towards Sliwa and Mamdani

• Sliwa, the Republican, is dismissed out of hand.
  • “Sliwa is not even on the table. Mamdani, same thing. Not on the table.” — Participant 4 [41:09]
• The choice is forced, grim, and mirrors the national mood of frustrating political trade-offs.
  • “I can't believe that as women, we're being forced to make a decision between a raving anti-Semite and, like, a sexual harasser.” — Sarah Longwell [41:27]

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5. If Mamdani Wins: Realignment, Dilemmas, Unanswered Questions

[42:21 – 46:23]

• Siegel predicts the Democratic establishment will “realign around Mamdani as a starting point.”
  • Hochul and (soon) Jeffries will endorse; Schumer may hedge.
  • There’s anxiety about Mamdani’s ability to bridge divides, especially on Israel and when dealing with potential Trump administration crackdowns (e.g., on immigrants).
  • Worries about an untested administration, especially as Mamdani has avoided detailed answers on disruptive protests, public safety, and balancing values with governance.
    • “I want to know how he wants to handle really disruptive pro-Palestinian protesters, if they have some special license. I want to know…with anti-ICE protesters… Does he want the NYPD involved? Does he want to keep them at arm's length? I don't even know what the right answer to that is.” — Harry Siegel [44:45]

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6. The Jewish Community and Charges of Antisemitism

[53:22 – 60:24]

Focus Group: Deep Skepticism and Anger

• Jewish and pro-Cuomo participants are deeply skeptical of Mamdani’s attempts to reach out, viewing them as insincere or offensive.
  • “I'm Jewish, so for me that's like a non-starter… the antisemitism is rife within his world… the information [is] so rife all over the place that I would never take the risk.” — Participant 2 [53:22]
  • “All of the world's worst, most anti-Semitic, most hateful, most extremist, most terrorist supporting people are for Mamdani. That's who he is. That's who his people are. And I really resent him trying to pretend that Jews support him too.” — Participant 1 [54:32]
• Charges of performative outreach—references to Mamdani’s Rosh Hashanah video and coalition with radical Jewish groups.

Siegel’s Nuanced Take

• Polling shows about 60% of Jewish New Yorkers support Cuomo, 29% Mamdani—a clear split but not total condemnation.
  • Mamdani’s support among radical Jewish groups is seen as real but limited.
  • Siegel hopes Mamdani can move beyond performative gestures and lead with real empathy toward the city’s significant but politically diminished Jewish community.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On National Lessons:
  “New York City is its own place. It's never a national model.” — Harry Siegel [04:51]

• On Mamdani’s Appeal:
  “A bright, appealing young guy saying, let's see if we can do more is really refreshing.” — Harry Siegel [16:31]

• On Voter Mood:
  “We already know how this movie ends and we're just gonna... hope for the best, put our heads down and fight it like New Yorkers.” — Participant 1 [40:15]

• On The Affordability Crisis:
  “Affordability is the thing. There is one issue that is plaguing people above all others...” — Sarah Longwell [31:12]

• On The Cuomo Dilemma:
  “He's a disgusting sex pig. He's an asshole. He should not be running. But he's the only person running against Mamdani, so what am I going to do?” — Participant 1 [40:18]

• On the Jewish Vote:
  “There are a lot of different Jews in New York. The idea that all the Jews who don't think that Mandani's anti-Zionism is disqualifying aren't Jewish, seems absurd to me.” — Harry Siegel [56:50]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 01:07 — Intro & overview of the NYC mayoral race
• 03:18 — Primary to general election dynamics; impact of outside events (e.g., Middle East peace claims)
• 09:59 — Focus group: Mamdani supporters explain their enthusiasm
• 15:05 — Siegel evaluates Mamdani’s campaign strengths and weaknesses
• 22:48 — Focus group: Policy vs personality
• 25:41 — Siegel on Mamdani's post-primary pivot
• 30:29 — Affordability as the dominant issue
• 38:00 — Focus group: Reluctant Cuomo supporters voice frustration
• 42:21 — Siegel on realignment and post-election Democratic harmony
• 53:22 — Focus group: Jewish participants respond to Mamdani; charges of antisemitism
• 56:18 — Siegel discusses polling and Mamdani’s repair efforts

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Takeaway

The episode powerfully illustrates a crossroads for New York liberals: enthusiasm for ambitious change, dread of youthful inexperience, wariness about extreme rhetoric, and a city consumed by the cost of living and a yearning for a government that delivers tangible results for everyone, not just the rich. Mamdani’s unique blend of authenticity, accessibility, and issue focus is problematic in some ways, but it connects with New Yorkers’ lived realities—and leaves old-guard politicians and their supporters bracing for a generational shift, even as they worry about what it might mean.

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Transcript

[Sarah Longwell]

What do you think makes the perfect snack?

[Harry Siegel]

Hmm, it's gotta be when I'm really craving it and it's convenient. Could you be more specific? When it's cravinient.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

Okay.

[Harry Siegel]

Like a freshly baked cookie made with real butter, available right down the street at a.m. p.m. Or a savory breakfast sandwich I can grab in just a.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

Second at AM pm.

[Sarah Longwell]

I'm seeing a pattern here.

[Harry Siegel]

Well yeah, we're talking about what I.

[Sarah Longwell]

Crave, which is anything from AM pm.

[Harry Siegel]

What more could you want? Stop by AM PM where the snacks and drinks are perfectly craveable and convenient. That's cravenience. AM PM too much good stuff.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

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[Sarah Longwell]

2.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

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[Harry Siegel]

4.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

I use it.

[Harry Siegel]

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[Focus Group Participant 1]

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[Focus Group Participant 2]

Are you.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

Are you playing me off? That's what's happening, right? Okay, give it a [e-mail] Switch upfront.

[Harry Siegel]

Payment of $45 for three month plan.

[Sarah Longwell]

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[Harry Siegel]

See mintmobile.com foreign.

[Sarah Longwell]

And welcome to the Focus Group podcast. I'm Sarah Longwell, publisher of the Bulwark and this week is the first show in a series of the big off year elections of 2025. I am of course talking about the New York mayoral race. This is a big one. Not because there's that much doubt about the outcome. It looks like Zoran Mumdani, the Democratic Socialist state assemblyman who is up against about 15 points in most polling averages, which is still worse than a generic Democrat. So he's gonna be the next mayor. Barring some wild pollingness. His main opponent is Andrew Cuomo, who's running in the general election as an independent after a pretty epic defeat in the primary. And the Republican candidate, Curtis Sliwa, who my guest called a smart man but not a serious man. He also has a curious taste in headwear, like hats. He's a weird hat guy, but Zora Mandani has been held up by many as a national model for how democratic socialism can win elections. I want to explore a couple of groups of people on the left of center, people who are supporting Mamdani now but didn't turn out for him in the primary, as well as his hardcore Democratic detractors who picked Cuomo in the primary because I'm curious How much of his appeal is his ideas and how much is his telegenic personality? My guest today is a repeat from the show we did before the primary. Harry Siegel, senior editor at the nonprofit Newsroom, the city creator and co host of the FAQNYC podcast, and a Moynihan Public Scholar at City College. Harry, thanks so much for coming back. You were such a fun surprise guest for me the first time. I wanted you back as soon as possible. If I was going to be forced to talk about this race, I wasn't even going to do it unless you were the guest. I was like, I'm going to ignore it completely. But you said you'd come back, so thanks for doing it.

[Harry Siegel]

Thanks for having me. It's a pleasure to be back.

[Sarah Longwell]

Yeah. You're a guy who, like, really knows New York politics, and so you have this podcast miniseries called City Hall, Free for all. I like that title. So what have been the craziest things to happen in this mayoral race since the June primary? And then I guess, just how does that stack up against other primaries you've covered?

[Harry Siegel]

It's been a really weird cycle. We have our primaries in June now, as you mentioned, it used to be in September. So it's a long race. And basically, in a lot of ways, nothing has changed. There've been all these moments where people sort of pretended at a change or the Post started crusading to create a change. The NFL headquarters shooting, as it turned out, in Midtown was one of those. Mamdani was away in Uganda on his honeymoon. There was a lot of speculation early on about what the shooting was about. And it was like, this is going to be some sort of moment when people realize that his politics are unacceptable or terroristic or dangerous, that he doesn't have the experience, all these things. And that did not whatsoever play out that way. To this point. I don't think the race is totally over. There's two debates happening. The first one's this week, the next one's next week. Trump has just declared today as we're recording this piece in the Middle East. It's a big moment and things can shift. There are big externalities in the world, but he is clearly running away with it. And bluntly, you know, my job is to do some horse racing, but, like, one horse has been way ahead since crushing Andrew Cuomo in the primary. It's a three way race, which makes it harder on Cuomo with Sliwa still there as the Republican nominee. And Mamdani has been running away with it. Now the Idea that this is the answer to Democrats nationally is, you know.

[Sarah Longwell]

I love that laugh.

[Harry Siegel]

New York City is its own place. It's not even clear that Madani and socialism are the natural answers here. We had a very unique and weird election. Corrupt. Eric Adams was looming over the whole thing. He was in the Democratic primary, swearing up and down. He was running in that. And he was a faithful Democrat until the day he had to submit his petitions. And then he said, ah, never mind, I'm running as an independent. Later, he says, I'm not running, although his name will still be on the ballot, which is still another challenge because that may suck up a few anti Madani votes, even with him not campaigning. But like, as of now, these off years, they're cool for New York City people, because real quick, right, there's one year where the mayor has all the leverage and gets to go out to Albany and say, I have a mandate, give me stuff. And we're the marquee thing, with all due respect to New Jersey and Virginia, but it's never a national model. And of course, any decent candidate who wins is gonna say, the people have spoken and this is the future direction of things. Eric Adams said, I'm the Joe Biden of New York City and the future of the Democratic Party. He was not. Madani is winning because the center's collapsing and Andrew Cuomo is the last centrist standing in a very weird race where, you know, he resigned as governor. He's supposed to be the bully who he got crushed in the primary. So I'm not stunned that Mamdani is cruising. It's a big moment for socialists and their organization and structure. He is speaking much more clearly about the threat Trump is presenting than Cuomo, who's thinking a lot about the Trump voters. He needs to have any shot here. But I think the national projection is much too much. The big thing that's at stake this year, if Mamdani wins and we have big socialist challengers next year, and to people like Hakeem Jeffries and Dan Goldman and all that, plus Elise Stefanik running for governor against Kathy Hochul is, guess what? Whatever happens with the House, which is a very big deal, and how those primaries might impact things and whatever else, but most of those districts aren't competitive. If Stefanik beats Hochul, who only squeaked by Lee Zeldin three years ago, all bets are off in New York. And suddenly the governor decides what America do. Cities don't exist in the Constitution. The states are what counts. It's a totally different picture here. So the stakes are very high for the centrists and for the socialists who think maybe this wave isn't done yet. And you have lots of people raising their hands to volunteer about the more moderate, sometimes more Israel friendly incumbents who they may be interested in challenging.

[Sarah Longwell]

Yeah, that's interesting. I wanna follow up on just one thing you said. Cause you kind of breezed by it. But I'm curious what you meant when you say Trump declared peace in the Middle East. Obviously, I have seen this. How do you think, though, that that specific claim would impact the New York mayoral race?

[Harry Siegel]

It probably won't, but it's a big moment. So much of this race has been about Mamdani and his Israel politics, and Mamdani that pivoting and saying, but I'm not here to talk about Israel and I'm not gonna travel anywhere. I'm gonna stay in New York City and so on. I think some of the swings and it's bought him a lot of space. I think his politics there are actually pretty radical. He was talking about apartheid, genocide a decade before October 7th. Right. That's his origin story about his politics. And then he says, I just want universalism and I want that for all nations. But in this way, that seems to only apply to the one Jewish state. So the same way as his political mission is involved identifying some of the inherent tensions between Zionism and democracy, he's done a masterful job of pointing to those as political events have moved the Democratic voters very much in that direction, even as a lot of their leaders have lagged behind. But the tensions in his own movement and what I see as it's a Israel obsession have been largely, I think, overlooked. So the way Trump's announcement could play out is I saw the polling right after the Iran attack, before it was clear how it happened, that Trump is Trump and he's saying, everything is a tremendous victory and we've done it.

[Sarah Longwell]

Total obliteration.

[Harry Siegel]

Yeah, yeah, it's ridiculous. But Democrats immediately saying, oh, Trump did this, against it. This is bad news, seeing people sort of indicating sympathies with Iran. So with all that as backdrop, there've been very intense protests here. I expect those to stay muted because a lot of those protesters are also very sympathetic with Madani and they have some understanding of the moment. But if that blows up in some interesting and unexpected way or spills over or creates real chaotic and disruptive scenes, potentially that could change some of the valences of this race. But that's if, if, if, if, if, if.

[Sarah Longwell]

Sure. Well, like I said, we have two primary buckets of people we're gonna talk through during this show. One group is people who did not vote in the Democratic primary in June for whatever reason, and who are planning to turn out for Mumdani in the general election. The other are people who voted for Andrew Cuomo in the June Democratic primary. Spoiler. Most of them are sticking with Cuomo. So let's listen to how the pro Mamdani voters are talking about him.

[Focus Group Participant 3]

I used to be listed as Democratic because I feel like my ideology and principles typically align mostly with the principles and ideology of Democratic Party. In the past few years, I thought it's almost kind of beard and sort of silly to have like a political affiliation listed on my identification card because I don't think it should be the case that anybody should be just one political party affiliation because I feel like being independent of that kind of gives us more mind space to kind of contemplate on different way of thinking and perspective. And I think that is important. And as for why I want to vote for Mamdani is because one of my best friend actually canvases very actively for Mamdani. So I heard a lot about his policies and what he means to do for New York. And I agree with what he plans to do for New York. I believe that it will be good for the real, real New Yorkers, not only like the rich New Yorkers. Right. So I feel they will do good for all of us. And also he was an assembly member for the 36th district, which included where I live, Astoria. And when he was the assembly member, I noticed that we would get regular email communication from him, which was different from like, when we had other people representing that district. So that I feel like, kind of touched me personally to kind of see his sincerity in bringing about change and then communicating with people.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

I just graduated college in May and moved out here because I was attracted to the entertainment industry in New York. And I moved here with five of my roommates from college. We all live in the same apartment and broke one together. And the thing that, like, scares all of us the most about this city is just how expensive it is. So I, yeah, I couldn't vote in the primary because I wasn't here yet. But Zoron seems to be the only candidate that takes that seriously in a way that aligns with my, like, personal ideology. And so, yeah, really, it just seemed like the obvious pick. If you're a young person who's new to New York. And the prices here scare the shit out of You. And then on top of what other people were saying, his sincerity also just shines through a lot. Like his history, the way that he presents himself, not only interacting with people, his ads on social media, they are made in a way where it's never like a hit on anybody else. It's just promoting what he does. And politicians like that are just far and few between. So, yeah, for me, just seems kind of the obvious person for what I'm.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

Going through here with Zoran. He's going to tax the worldly people and he's not going to deregulate anything. There is no reason to deregulate. In fact, you need more regulations to protect people, to ensure. My focus is always on healthcare because I see people die because of the lack of funding, because of the bureaucracy, because of so many things, things that were preventable, things that could have changed, so many things for that person. I mean, it's not just one person dying, it's the entire family being affected by it and them losing faith in everyone, even their own politicians, not even just your doctors. So I don't want anyone to defect. The health system, the research system. I definitely do not want any reduct in regulations. Deregulation does not work. Jekyll and Obama does not work in capitalism. It just does not work. Otherwise, Elon Musk right now wouldn't have $500 billion to his name and that's it.

[Focus Group Participant 4]

The conflation of Zionism with Israelis and Jewish people more broadly is, has long been annoying, but it has also proven to be a really useful political cudgel for politicians across the political spectrum to say that, ah, this other politician over here, he's anti Semitic. This or this politician over here, she's anti Semitic. And it's, it's been useful. And, and I think Macomo insinuated the, the same rhetoric against Mamdani. Definitely. A few months ago, I remember being like, ugh, I like roll my eyes like this again. And I was partly, you know, listening to folks in the city, you know, just nationally on the news and stuff like that. Like, are people buying this? I wanted to know because I didn't buy it.

[Sarah Longwell]

So Moudani's campaign has like really ignited thousands of hot takes. People all over the news talking about this guy since he won the Democratic primary. What do you think the popular narrative about him has gotten right and gotten wrong? You know, because he's a caricature now. Like, I have a vision of Momdani. It's rooted in some conversation up here. So, like, tell us what Is the popular conversation getting right, getting wrong?

[Harry Siegel]

That's a great question. I think what the popular conversation is missing is how wildly ambitious what he's promising is and how inexperienced he is and the question of what he's actually going to be able to deliver on. The one thing he promised that had any connection with his six years, five years in elected office in his previous life was free buses. Is he was involved in getting a pilot program passed for a year. He was. Then one of the reasons that didn't get renewed for a second year, which is like an inside Albany story, but that was it. The free bus thing was super important. Not just because it gave him this rhythm of childcare and rent frees and free buses, but. But because he could say, I can do this because I've done it. And he couldn't say that about anything else. It was one line in each borough. It was one year. It actually had mixed signs of success and he derailed it, ha ha. The second year. So there are these big questions there. And I think what the narrative has gotten right and you could hear it in what several of the people in your focus group were saying there and hearing the whole thing is that the credible, sensible centrists are not really offering of vision or clarity. Andrew Cuomo is the development guy and he just put out his first development plan and it was keep Rikers open and don't open these borough jails. We're supposed to have sort of came out of nowhere and late. It just seemed weird. And what's he about? He's imitated a lot of the Mamdani things. Mamdani has the free buses. Cuomo now has free trains and buses for poorer New Yorkers. Again, came out of nowhere. It just seems like a messaging effort. And then you're trying to backend a policy. And if I win, I'll figure it out from there. So you have people who have checked out, checked out of the Democratic Party, have checked out of our politics more generally who are like, these people aren't delivering. You know, maybe some of them were kids in 2008 and came from places that, unlike New York, had really long staggered recoveries. And this screwed them up when they were leaving college or whatever. And here's somebody saying, we can do more, we can do better. This isn't all just about compromise. And there is a clarity there and a messaging success that's broken through in large part, I think, just because the alternatives are so unappealing, one, and exhausting, two. So it's impossible to even start Talking about Andrew Cuomo, you know, Trump charges Tish James. Cuomo puts out a very. Both sides. They all do lawfare statement without anyone's name, and then a second statement saying, this is bad and this shouldn't happen to Tish James using her name once, Right. But he leaves office. He resigns, this governor, after she puts out a report confirming some of the sexual harassment allegations against him and adding another one. And that's a really complicated can of worms that I'm just touching on here. And everything with him is an exhausting, complicated can of worms with, like, no bottom. He spent 60 million in public funds, mostly since leaving office, on his related legal bills. To all that, because it happened when he was a public official, a bright, appealing young guy saying, let's see if we can do more is really refreshing. And as some of those folks were mentioning, the woman who knew her assembly district and the number, like, God bless you, right? He is actually talking to people all over the city, reading stuff, taking in that information, responding to it. Of course, some of that's performative. It should be he's a politician, you know, and you're representing people. But, like, it seems like there's some actual exchange that relates to ordinary New Yorkers. And you do not get that sense from his primary opponent, Andrew Cuomo. You didn't really get that from Eric Adams, who just had all sorts of compromises and crumbs and inside friends and then relations with Trump. And it's given him tremendous running room. And I think an awful lot of people who are not actually socialists, who are not like that one lady was saying, I don't know about capitalism. You don't need to get to all that to get there. You don't really need to get to Israel, particularly, to get there. And it was notable to me hearing, again, the full extent of the focus groups. It comes up, but it was not at the center of their conversations or concerns one way or the other. It's just locally, the city is draining. It can feel exhausting, very expensive, arduous, dangerous across classes, income scales, neighborhoods. That's a real thing. And there's one guy talking about it. And it means the let's close our eyes and hope for the best, swallow a little disbelief and see if this guy could do it. He's run a very good campaign. It's shifting dynamics in Albany. People are very on board for that. I do think the execution will be brutal. And I think these pressures coming from the Trump administration are going to be incredibly intense. And so the affordability Guy, if he's at all competent, is going to have to function as the austerity mayor. And then he's done a wonderful job of messaging his principles when it involves there's lots more money we can raise. This corporate tax only be the same as New Jersey's and it's not really true, but whatever. It's like good enough to have your one liner and move on. But he's going to have to figure out how to do more as he's promised, with less. And the idea that there's some way to extract money from Albany, that's all going to go to New York City, right? That's not how Albany works. And that that money's there, it comes with no other concessions, is on the face of it, ridiculous. But the hope of someone who's listening, who's identifying actual problems, who sounds like a human being, who's speaking more or less directly has had a lot of appeal. And lastly, it's just drawing new people in, right? And you can hear that in that group who couldn't figure out the Democratic Party, we're necessarily voting, we're new to New York and all that. And there's a suggestion in that that like he's going to again outperform his polling numbers because you're not just dealing with your triple primes, right? Who show up for every election.

[Sarah Longwell]

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[Focus Group Participant 1]

I think he said something that I saw online a little while ago that I thought was just very poignant, which is like, New York City is, like, the greatest city in the world, but it's like, how great can it be if, like, nobody can live there and nobody can afford to live there? I think that sort of is just, like, underlying all of his policy. I think there's a very clear through line with, like, affordability and access and, like, making sure that this place is available to the people that live in it and the people that want to live in it, not just the people that can live in it. So I think especially, like, taxing large corporations, taxing, like, 1% of earners in New York. That's great. That helps get money for public good, I think making things like transportation more affordable. Like, right now, the bus is $3 a ticket. I don't know. People should be able to go on the bus without spending $9 a day or whatever across the board. Housing, childcare, all these things making things more affordable for people. These things that should be like, public good or just communal good. That's great.

[Focus Group Participant 4]

Like rising prices. And I'd heard about this stuff before, and it was always the root cause was politicians that claimed that it was everything from whoever the boogeyman of the moment are, you know, immigrants one day, it's regulation the next. And I'd really, you know, I started, you know, reading more about capitalism, and I started thinking. I was like, well, I think that's it. And so, you know, voting for folks in the past who were like, things are bad, but don't touch capitalism, or at least don't touch finance capital that supports a lot of the political establishment we have in terms of Republicans and Democrats, I thought I was like, all right, are they trying to trick me? I think I know what's going on. And younger me didn't know this, or younger me wasn't confident in articulating this. But I think maybe older me is sort of like, you know, sitting with folks who are, like, telling me everything is the problem, except what I think the problem is.

[Focus Group Participant 3]

I think he is a new breed within the Democratic Party. And also he has socialist tendencies, which I feel like A lot of politicians, regardless of a political affiliation, they kind of fear as American. I think that might be due to the lingering effects of the Cold War era. I'm not sure what it is about, but I think it is good to have diversity within the Democratic Party. And definitely what Zoran brings to Democratic Party represents something that's more like kind of down to earth. They can connect with younger people. So I feel like it's necessary.

[Sarah Longwell]

Has Mamdani pivoted at all? You know, because I saw that the DSA was maybe threatening to un endorse him because he's not being socialist enough. Like, tell me what's going on here about his normally, like the centrist, broad pivot. Has he done that at all?

[Harry Siegel]

Yeah, he's done just enough of that. And a lot of it is, you know, your half step, two step stuff. He told the New York Times he was going to apologize to the police for something he said in the George Floyd moment about them as like racist and homophobic and a threat to public safety. He hasn't actually given that apology and clearly doesn't intend to. And then he signifies he's just such a good messenger. I'm having all sorts of conversations with police officers and sort of suggesting that thus it's already happened and things like that. So he's trying to straddle that carefully with the policies versus personality stuff. It's been a big pivot since the primary. He has NYPD security now. He can't really be all about the city in the way he was before. It's actually been a big life shift for a young guy and his new wife. And there's been this obvious shift now since they brought in grownups, as people have referred to them inside the campaign. That's not me being condescending where the campaign's just trying to say as little as possible and play for time and space. They're winning. That's what any winning campaign would do. And then the social media has continued to be without being policy making, really lively, personality driven, positive. As one of the respondents was saying, you can feel the split between the two. The campaign is performing the functional messages of a winning or leading campaign. And just any day that things don't change is a good day for us. And then occasionally stepping in it, as with the police apology thing, as with a promise he made about ending gifted and talented programs for kindergarteners that it's not clear he really intended to make. That reopened a big can of worms from the de Blasio era. By the way, my man is talking about the $3 bus fare. And people spending nine bucks a day is not a person who takes the buses. I will assure you there are no tickets. There's a cap for how much you can spend in the course of a week. And there's actually a fair fare thing that gets half price fares for poor New Yorkers. But I could just hear that as someone who does take the buses regularly. So I was sort of amused because you could feel the space between his principles and I think his lived experience of the city, or I felt like I could, but I did think the lingering effect of the Cold War era, the person who brought up root causes like, look, New York is already a place that is taxing the wealthy a good deal, and the wealthy who choose to be here understand that. And that's a complicated dance. And there's always a little more you can squeeze. But how much is a little and how much is a sea change? A stock exchange opening in Texas, people move to Florida, all these things which are perennial, but you have too much of it. There's only a few thousand of those golden gooses around. But I will say it has not been a great 20 years for capitalism in New York City. Actually, I mentioned 2008 and the financial crisis before. We had an unbelievably blessed recovery here. It was basically like a news story we were reading about, unless you were a homeowner in Southeast Queens, because so much happened to pump up the markets, and the markets are so important to New York's bottom line that that crisis passed incredibly quickly. Since then, however, this feeling of just a draining, expensive, difficult to live in place where all the costs sort of keep rising under you, where housing is impossibly expensive. So even if you're lucky enough to own, if you ever want to sell and move, that feels paralyzing and nearly impossible. The public schools are something of a struggle, and that's its own story. And Mamdani is barely engaged with education, while suggesting he'd be very sympathetic to the unions and some of the left wing causes. But without any policies there, I don't think he knows all all that much. And he hasn't had to. I don't think Cuomo knows all that much about it either, and it's been conspicuously absent. But any system of government, and this goes to Trump populism. And Mabani is definitely a left wing populism. I'm not trying to overly compare the two. You have like 20 years to deliver. And if people at that point are like, I'm doing not quite as good as my parents were or I expected to be. My life is more frustrating. We'd love to have a second kid, but obviously we'd have to move out of New York City. City at that point. In fact, people are doing so. People get tired and they get open to more radical solutions. And they say, you promised that this stuff is working for us. I see the ads the city has on the trains and the buses about all the things that make it good and nice here. And everyone's smiling, and I feel like, shit. Excuse me. You only get so wrong with that before more radical solutions come along. And sometimes that could be depending on the moment. Rudy Giuliani. I'm not stunned in the year after Trump's victory, in hindsight, that the answer there appears to be pending the general election results, but here we are. Azora Mamdani.

[Sarah Longwell]

That is so interesting. I mean, look, if I were running anybody's campaign right now at any place, I would be like, affordability, affordability, affordability. And I think Democrats who talked about sort of income inequality, I know that's like a comfortable spot for them. And I think that there's even more real truth than my sort of ex Republican self felt like 10 years ago. But more importantly, the affordability thing, it's all I hear about across the political spectrum. There is one issue that is plaguing people above all others. And to the extent that the other issues matter, it's because they're related almost to affordability. It's like people. The immigration stuff is in a lot of ways, a place to put blame for the fact that people think things aren't going that well. The health care issue isn't also an affordability issue, but, like, crime is sort of a. People can't afford things, so they're just walking into Starbucks and taking them part of the crisis in places like San Francisco and others are because they have an enormous homeless population, because you can't afford to live in the cities anymore. And so everywhere you turn, affordability is the thing. And if I think David Frum had it, which is like, if sort of centrists aren't gonna secure the border, the authoritarians will or the fascists will sort of feel that way. It's like, if normies aren't gonna solve the affordability crisis, people are gonna start looking at both the populace on the right and the left to do it. Like, you could see how they get to socialism. Does that sound right to you?

[Harry Siegel]

It really does. And, you know, look, at a certain point, if Prices keep going up to the things people are sensitive to. All other issues feel like a backdrop. And this is not Weimar Germany, we're not Argentina. Currencies aren't getting revalued instantly. But it's been a very long period of a rising tide that seems to be drowning a lot more people than it's raising. And that's not sustainable for any political establishment. And the space between inequality and being like these people are so obscenely rich and whatever, and that has lots of ideological and complicated balances and affordability is just if enough people feel like things aren't affordable enough, that I'm working, I'm doing things, and this is too much of a strain. You can't maintain any sort of political establishment and people are going to be open, as you're saying, to more radical solutions. And I agree. All these other issues are tied to that. There's been a lot here about the Deliveristas. I know in Chicago, they've been one of the big targets of enforcement. It is painful to me to see a class of people who have come here who are some sort of undocumented, not full citizens. Some of them are applying to be here legally. Others are just using other people's Social Security numbers, right? But it's all men. They're driving around on these bikes that set off horrible fires just in any building that other people in that class, like poor people, sometimes not so poor, happen to be living there or next door or whatever, are endangered by working for these giant tech companies that they don't even nominally work for. Right? This is the gig economy. So those companies are not responsible for their bikes or their circumstances. And then you have New Yorkers who want to order food, who are not as tied to their physical environments, who absolutely rely on that. And it's gross and weird to look at. And again, you get to just a sense of a city with a hollowed out middle in a country with the same where if you're lucky, someone else is actually dealing with their physical environment to bring you their food and doing that continuously, like in a video game, for 10 hours to build just enough life to get a day's rent and you feel like you're hanging on and don't even have time to go out and eat and interact. These are not healthy signs. And I will say Mamdani has spoken more directly and honestly about a bunch of this than his more moderate opponents. My great hope for Donald Trump, by the way, in 2016, was that he was going to come really hard at the tech companies because I felt like in a Weberian way they were getting big enough and complex enough that they were actually sort of a threat to government authority and thus what it is to be a country. And this and that and that. This guy who I thought was a brute and a liar and just not my sort of person, but he talked a decent gambler, like maybe you'll get that thing right. Of course he did nothing this term. He's been very invested in crypto, at pardoning people involved in the crypto industry and such things. But I do think there's a growing frustration and among normal convincible people like regular voters that this just doesn't feel like a good system or society to work in. I don't feel stability in my own life or I feel morally uncomfortable with just the accommodations I'm making to get through the day. And if someone is offering credible just rhetorically changes to that, they have a lot of Runway. And the polling shows also that Mamdani, his people are much more enthusiastic than Cuomos, which I find interesting. There's a new Quinnipiac poll, It's like a 30 point gap there. Who's highly enthusiastic or very enthusiastic. I'm very skeptical about his chances of success, but I'm very skeptical about Cuomos. It's like a super challenging moment. I don't want to get into tech and AI and all these things, but in a vastly changing world, there's something to be said for offering the possibility of doing better, which goes from policies, but you start with those. I have this thing, that thing and the other thing. Free. Free. Free. You say it fast. Two personality. I'm saying it with a smile. I'm not mostly just trying to drag someone else's negatives up, you know, I'm trying to establish myself as a person. I think once he has power and what he does with it is a whole other set of questions. But it's been a very impressive campaign and there are messaging lessons I believe to take from it.

[Sarah Longwell]

So many messaging lessons. This show is sponsored by Quince, one of my favorites. Cooler days call for layers that last and Quince is my go to for quality essentials that feel cozy, look refined and won't blow your budget. This is one of those sponsors that has really become a mainstay in my house. Think $50 Mongolian cashmere, premium denim that fits like a dream and luxe outerwear you'll wear year after year. These are the pieces that'll turn into your fall uniform. I love a fall uniform. I'M eyeing their wool coats and their fleece vests. You know how I love a vest. They look designer level but cost a fraction of the price and the quality honestly, just as good, if not better. Fall is like the super bowl for lesbians and the fleece vests are a key part of that. Because Quince partners directly with top tier ethical factories, that cuts out the middleman. They deliver luxury quality pieces at half the price of similar brands. It's the kind of wardrobe upgrade that feels smart, stylish and effortless. And I like clothes stuff that's effortless. Find your fall staples at Quint's. Go to quince.com the Focus Group for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns now available in Canada too. Lucky Canadians. That's Q-U-I-N c e.com the Focus Group to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quint.com the Focus Group. Thanks Quince. Right now I want to pivot to the Cuomo voters. Like I said, these people had Andrew Cuomo as their top choice in the June primary and pretty much everyone is sticking with him in the general election. Let's listen to how they sounded as they weigh their choices.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

I pick Cuomo because he's the least worst out of everybody. But I always respect, respected what he did as a governor. And I knew his dad actually when they were trying to close down my college in your college many years ago, they kept trying to close us down. And I met his father who was the class act in the world. I don't want Ma' am Panty. He never had a job. I mean, come on. You know, it's kind of stupid. He is a billionaire or his parents are. I don't know how somebody could relate to that. He's not going to get any of this stuff approved. It sounds nice. And I read body language. He is so polished. My God. Now who does that remind you of, ladies and gentlemen? Oh, Adams. When he first stopped. Very expensive suits, swagger he's got and that, that Mac the Knife smile, you know, and you could, you could see all the glow around his smile. There is no substance. He's 38 freaking years old. Why doesn't somebody offer me a real kick ass job? I'll go in the big brother house for three months and make it three years and you know, I won't have to do a damn thing. You have to have experience. Now I don't want Trump coming to our city and saying, I mean it's embarrassing because now like, even Andrew said the same thing on the View. Here's something going to be the joke across the United States, like he said, because everyone's going to think that Democrats are socialists. I don't care if I have a free bus. I like the half senior fare, because where is he going to get the money out of thin air? Is ET Going to come back and drop a bunch of stuff, you know, in New York? There is no reality here. And he's going to encourage, encourage Trump. Not that I wouldn't even listen to him, but a lot of New Yorkers don't want him.

[Harry Siegel]

If you read the polling where Mandani's winning either way, but just for me, like, like, I know I want to vote for Cuomo, but they're both siphoning votes. And I think no matter how you turn it, like, it's, like, it's over. Like, we already know how this movie ends and we're just gonna, you know, hope for the best, put our heads down and fight it like New Yorkers. But at least for me at this.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

Moment, moment, I can't say for sure.

[Harry Siegel]

Who I'm voting for.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

He's a disgusting sex pig. He's an asshole. He should not be running. But he's the only person running against Madani, so what am I going to do?

[Focus Group Participant 2]

He's not Weinstein, so there's that. You mean Epstein? You know, he's not going around criminally raping people from our understanding. So it's like, okay, he's old school where that was, you know, something that we ladies know. And so it is what it is. I still feel he's the best choice. It's not ideal in that regard, but at least he's outed for it. And let's move on, because, like Trump, he has raped people is what we're hearing. And that doesn't seem to be a problem for any voter when it comes to politicians.

[Harry Siegel]

It's the lesson of the evil.

[Focus Group Participant 4]

Sliwa is not, not even on the table. Madonna, same thing. Not on the table.

[Harry Siegel]

Cuomo.

[Focus Group Participant 4]

A lot of people have said he has the experience.

[Harry Siegel]

Has he made mistakes?

[Focus Group Participant 4]

Yes, but he has this experience and the background.

[Harry Siegel]

Can't believe that as women, we're being.

[Sarah Longwell]

Forced to make a decision between a raving anti Semite and a, like, sexual harasser. But, you know, like somebody who said.

[Focus Group Participant 3]

Earlier, I feel like this is just.

[Sarah Longwell]

Mayoral politics mirroring the big presidential stage.

[Focus Group Participant 3]

And become normalized that this kind of behavior for men is okay.

[Sarah Longwell]

But, yeah, it's not going to be mamdani.

[Focus Group Participant 3]

For me.

[Sarah Longwell]

So I guess it's going to be Cuomo. So these are Democratic primary voters, but they still have a kind of like bracing for impact attitude towards Mamdani. I mean it is funny how much people hated Cuomo who were going to vote for him. So is this going to cause an inter party schism around Mumdani if he wins the race? And I do want to ask you about the Trump administration's potential relationship with them. Just first, Mamdani very likely wins this. And so like what does that do to Democratic politics in the city?

[Harry Siegel]

They realign around Mamdani as a starting point. You know, Kathy Hochul has endorsed him. Kim Jeffries is going to so late that it won't matter, but we'll get around to doing so. I'm interested with Schumer, but like is going to win. Voters will have spoken both in a weird ranked choice primary and then in a weird three way general election eventually. Three way. But that's how politics works and on some level should work. It is like a very complicated dance of being a leader and being where voters are. And in this case Mamdani was in a lot of ways closer to the voters on some of this. And I understand why it's complicated for the national figures in particular Schumer and Jeffries. Right, because they're thinking about swing voters in other states, people who really do just hear socialism and recoil. I will note you can feel the diminished impact of the Holocaust in our discourse and you start thinking about the passage of time. It's been a long time since the end of the Cold War. And again, it has not been a great century to this point for capitalism and not just in the United States, like internationally. And you can see all these sort of snapback and rise within democratic political systems and among citizens and voters in different places of more radical solutions. And we're getting some taste of that here. Shout out to Kurt Weill while we're talking about these things. The Mac the Knife smile, I love that. And by the way, Mamdani is 33. He'll be 34, I believe later this month. So he is not 38 years old. He's got five years less experience than that lady was crediting him for. But it is hilarious to hear the people who voted for Cuomo tend to vote for Cuomo again, mostly saying, you know, at least he's not Weinstein, the least worse of everybody. I mean, you know, it's remarkable how what a defensive crouch that's in. So I don't know If Mamdani is anti Semitic, I don't think the discourse around that has been healthy or good. I think excessive interest in Jews is generally a sign of bad things. And again, I think Mamdani's had excessive interest in the Jewish state and holding it to a universal standard he hasn't held other places to for a long time. But I do think this discourse has become exhausting and deeply counterproductive and has turned a lot of people off who I think could have otherwise been convincible that there's something wrong with what he's saying. But using that as like a five alarm fire or a red line I think has eroded its value. And it's really disheartening for me to see that happen to term after term in America. I think it happened with racists at a certain point. I think that ended up rewarding some real racists and giving them a step closer to the political center and real points of power. I'm worried that's happening with anti Semitism and I don't think this line of attack as it's been expressed is helpful. I want to know how he wants to handle really disruptive pro Palestinian protesters, if they have some special license. I want to know relatedly in getting to Trump what he's going to do with anti ICE protesters and people blocking vans, taking over streets being really disruptive. Does he want the NYPD involved in that? Does he want to keep them at arm's length? I don't even know what the right answer to that is. I think they're really difficult questions. But it's strange given his messengering, that we just don't have answers to them blasting. It just kills me that Andrew Cuomo has run such a weak campaign. Maybe it's because he's older, he's in a weaker position. He did resign as governor. He lost the primary. And when your appeal is being a bully, that's harder. But he hasn't managed to pressure test Mamdani on more of this, which you do by getting close by appealing to voters concerns which assuming Mamdani is going to be mayor, I'll be polling for him. I'll pull for whoever's running the cities where I live. But I wish that we had answers to some of these things before handing all this power to him. And it's clear we're not going to, I suspect until after.

[Sarah Longwell]

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[Harry Siegel]

I really hope that's happening behind the scenes and with the grownups there. And with him is a young, extreme, extremely energetic guy, right. Who walked the wank the Manhattan at the end of the campaign, both to talk to people and to demonstrate. I have the energy to talk to people that way. It's exhausting, right? He reads a lot, he talks to a lot of people. He has grownups around him now, so to speak. And I hope you can work out how to cook and like, keep the messaging and the human impact he's had, both with affordability and by the way, he's been very clear about the moral thread. He sees the Trump administration presenting to New York City in ways that Andrew Cuomo, Eric Adams and largely Curtis, SLU and FOL have not. There's this sense that this is happening elsewhere. They're testing it in Chicago. It's coming here. Like a reporter got taken to the hospital at 26 Federal Plaza last week. So, you know, oh, it's immigrant ladies showing up to their court dates, getting slammed by masked men. It's reporters, they're swarming. It's Brad Lander and, oh, he assaulted an ICE officer. Actually, we're releasing without charges. Like this is really happening now with just enough control that people don't realize they're staked in this. I have a more direct understanding, maybe because I'm a student, wives and whatever, but really because I'm in journalism and I'm seeing the palpable threats to members of the press functioning in ordinary and proper ways inside of public spaces. And I understand that we are the canary in the coal mine for the public that's not showing up at the immigration court to see what's happening, but does want to read about it and understands. And if those people are getting roughed up then accused of being bad and disruptive actors when they're clearly just recording and monitoring what's happening there, something is already terribly wrong, and Mamdani has spoken to that. I'm actually skeptical of his solutions. I'm worried about some of the consequences. But I will greatly credit him. He sounds like a human being. And the other people here sound like they're triangulating and they're thinking about their voter bases, they're thinking their funders and these other parts. And also where they might want to do business with Trump, the earlier points in the race when they had bigger paths to victory. And they don't sound like they're just moral human beings who have some sense. This isn't open borders, this isn't communism. But this seems wrong to me. I want kids to be able to go to school. If you feel that way, and maybe you don't, and you think only citizens or people are properly documented should be able to go to schools or hospitals, I'd very strongly disagree, but that's defensible. But he sounds like someone who has a principle at stake, who's talking about values that New Yorkers are wrestling with. And what are we supposed to do here? What do you do if the government is sending in massed national police? And again, this is already happening. It's just inside of courthouses and sort of in strange corners. And you have one candidate who's talking about any of that. I'm very fearful of the solutions, but I am impressed and appreciative of for his clarity of communication about what's going on at the same time.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

Yeah, hey, this is Sarah. Look, I'm standing out front of a.m. p.m.

[Sarah Longwell]

Right now and, well, you're sweet and.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

All, but I found something more fulfilling, even kind of cheesy. But I like it.

[Sarah Longwell]

Sure, you met some of my dietary.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

Needs, but they've just got it all. So farewell, oatmeal.

[Sarah Longwell]

So long, you strange soggy.

[Harry Siegel]

Break up with bland breakfast and taste AM PM's bacon, egg and cheese biscuit made with K tree eggs, smoked bacon and melty cheese on a buttery biscuit. AM PM Too much Good stuff.

[Sarah Longwell]

All right, just do. Before we get out of here, as a last matter, I want to touch on Mamdani's relationship with the Jewish community, which he's tried to repair since the Democratic primaries, since the last time you and I spoke. Because I think the last time you and I spoke, he had just done the interview with Tim where Tim Miller of the Bulwark had said, yeah, but what do you make of people who say you know, from the river to the sea as a chant like that. We all know what that means. And he was like, well, you know, that's. I'm not gonna tell people how to police their words or whatever. And so like, that was a real moment, but he's done work on that. And so we asked these voters, and there were a lot of Jewish folks in the pro Cuomo group who were not having it. So let's listen.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

I'm Jewish, so for me that's like a non starter. So that wouldn't work for me because of everything that I hear that the antisemitism is rife within his world. So that just turned me off. I think it's a big problem with different politicians we've seen, like, ooh, well, that could be a problem. But then it becomes not a problem. But he seems so vocal about it and the information so rife all over the place that I would never take the risk. Like, I think that could be a very bad path. And I don't think he's that capable. So it's like, oh, that's just another straw.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

I also will concur that Mandani's anti.

[Harry Siegel]

Semitic tirades are unacceptable. And I also think that Mandani is a little too polarized against specifically the rich. You can begin economic inequality, but at the same time, you can't simply demonize.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

People simply by being at a certain economic level. There's a lot of propaganda that people have fallen for, and that includes some Jews who don't know any better. And Mamdani has been grasping onto those Jews as his token Jews and trotting them out on TV and telling everyone that some of my best friends are Jews. You know, he just had a Rosh Hashanah video that made me vomit. I know him. I've followed him. I know what he did in college. I know all the speeches he's given. I know all of the people who are supporting him. All of the world's worst, most anti Semitic, most hateful, most extremist, most terrorist supporting people are for Mamdani. That's who he is. That's who his people are. And I really resent him trying to pretend that Jews support him too. They don't. I became deaf and blind to anything more Mamdani has to say, wants to say. Hateful views, dismissive, derogatory, hateful views towards Jews came out from old videos to statements that he made. Everything that he's trying to do now.

[Harry Siegel]

Is, I think, backpedaling.

[Focus Group Participant 1]

It was so offensive. It was so raw, it was so jumping on almost like a global wagon of Jewish, Jewish hating world, that I almost blocked him out.

[Sarah Longwell]

I presume Mamdani has been doing some work with the Jewish community to try to repair some of that. How have you seen his sort of attempts at that evolve over the course of the primary?

[Harry Siegel]

He was just celebrating Sukkot with these Satmar anti Zionist Hasidic Jews in Brooklyn the other day. You know, he's been very tight with Jewish Voices for Peace, which is like a really radical organization that's done a great job of wearing T shirts emblazoned with that and being show Jews who are really anti Israel. At the same time. I think two years after October 7th, there are a lot of Jews who are very upset by the death and destruction in Gaza. A lot of ones who would not use the term genocide, I would not certainly, but are sort of open to some of this messaging. I think the messaging at its core is actually pretty virulent. However you notice you have that guy saying it was so offensive and atrocious and so on. He didn't have a quote to go with that id and the way Mamdani has messaged this, a lot of this is what lines people want to read between about what the implications are. And those are in very different places. What I will say is right now the polls have 60% support with Jews, Madania, 29%. The new Quinnipiac. I think SLU is at 8. That's a lot of Jews. There are a lot of different Jews in New York. And the idea that all the Jews who don't think that Mandani's anti Zionism is disqualifying aren't Jewish, seems absurd to me. And like the term antisemitism, like sinking into that or saying this is all just for show and this isn't representing actual realities, I think is out of touch with reality. With polling, which, like focus groups, I always find really useful for just getting, oh, here's how people are actually speaking and talking. And there's plenty of Jews who feel that way. They're distinctly a minority, a measurable minority. But there's enough of them there to sustain what appears to be at this point, an easily winning coalition. So I think that there's a lot to take in about that. And I'll just note that this is also, as the middle class has shrunkier, as you have new alliances winning political alliances that are coming in, as you have newly conscious South Asian voters and white Muslim voters who are excited about it. First who have formed a much more coherent political identity post 9 11. And that's circumstantial. But most political identities, in fact national and ethnic ones, are very circumstantial. All that's worth considering at this moment and I very much hope Mamdani, who has been trying to do repair work, is serious about that and thinks about the terms he's using. It's great that he now frowns upon other people using the phrase globalize the Intifada. Right, which we talked about actually the last time I was on and that was fresh. I hope that in having these conversations he isn't just performing and he's thinking about some of this. And again he pivots to universalism, but he seems to only be interested in these universalist values when those relate to the Jewish state. And I think there's something upsetting and disturbing to a lot of Jews about a 2 to 1 charity according to this polling. If you want to use that as a proxy about that. Israel's a very young state. Speaking of the Holocaust now being a little farther off and Judaism's relationship to a state of Israel, to the idea of it, to a temple, all these things has always been in flux and the object of conspiracies. I'm very much hoping that as mayor he may demonstrate a kindness and an empathy and understanding of this large and politically significant but diminished population. Along, by the way, with black voters. Right, we're seeing the second straight black mayor the only two New Yorkers had end up as an embarrassment and a one term mayor. If he is as gracious as he seems, if his smile is as wide on the inside as on the outside, he has some listening and thought to do about how he wants to present this and what it means to lead a decent and unified city.

[Sarah Longwell]

Harry Siegel, thank you so much for coming back on.

[Harry Siegel]

Sir, thank you for having me on again. And feel free to check out FAQ NYC and City Hall. Free for all. If you want more of this after.

[Sarah Longwell]

An hour, go listen to all Harry's stuff. I have become a real devotee because nobody knows New York politics like you do.

[Harry Siegel]

It's dizzying. Thank you really for having me. I can't even imagine trying to take in what's happening nationally right now. It is so much.

[Sarah Longwell]

Yeah, it's no great. Thanks to all of you for listening to another episode of the focus group podcast. We are going to be back next week but in the meantime I need you guys to go and rate us, review us, subscribe to us on YouTube that actually really, really helps us out and become a Bulwark plus member at thebullwerk.com Harry, you're the best. You are a great guest. See you guys later.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

Hey, this is Sarah. Look, I'm standing out front of a.m. p.m.

[Sarah Longwell]

Right now and well, you're sweet and all, but I found something really more.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

Fulfilling, even kind of cheesy. But I like it.

[Sarah Longwell]

Sure, you met some of my dietary.

[Focus Group Participant 2]

Needs, but they've just got it all. So farewell oatmeal.

[Sarah Longwell]

So long, you strange soggy.

[Harry Siegel]

Break up with bland breakfasts and taste AM PMs bacon, egg and cheese biscuit made with cage free eggs, smoked bacon and melty cheese on a buttery biscuit. AM P M Too much Good stuff.