Podcast Summary: How to Get Better Friends

Podcast: The Fr. Mike Schmitz Catholic Podcast
Host: Ascension (Fr. Mike Schmitz)
Episode Date: October 16, 2025

Episode Overview

In this episode, Fr. Mike Schmitz reflects on the challenge of building authentic friendships in the modern world, drawing from personal experiences and classical wisdom, particularly Aristotle’s three types of friendship. The episode aims to help listeners evaluate their own relationships and pursue deeper, virtuous friendships that can profoundly enrich their lives and faith.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Friendlessness Crisis (00:18)

• Fr. Mike opens with a relatable anecdote from his childhood about being encouraged by his mom to make friends, highlighting how nowadays it feels much harder to form meaningful connections.
• He labels the present situation as a “crisis in friendlessness,” noting how common it is to feel surrounded by people yet remain lonely.

Aristotle’s Three Kinds of Friendship (01:10)

Fr. Mike introduces Aristotle’s classic categories—utility, pleasure, and virtue—to frame the discussion:

1. Friendships of Utility

• Definition: Relationships based on mutual usefulness; often formed in work or team environments.
• Examples: Office friends, project partners, teammates.
• Value: Not “bad,” but typically lack emotional depth.
• Quote:

  “You spend time together because it helps you accomplish something...not that deep. Always.” (02:11)

2. Pleasant Friendships

• Definition: Connections where people simply enjoy each other’s company, often based on shared interests.
• Examples: Friends for hobbies, group hangouts, casual get-togethers.
• Value: “Actually pretty dang good,” yet may still leave a deeper longing.
• Quote:

  “We get together and we just enjoy each other's presence. Nothing wrong with that.” (03:35)

3. Virtuous Friendships

• Definition: Bonds rooted in shared pursuit of goodness or virtue, not just utility or pleasure.
• Characteristics: Go beyond utility and enjoyment—focus on mutual growth, shared worldview, and striving for something greater.
• Quote:

  “There's this new level of we see the world in the same way...you probably help each other pursue that thing bigger than yourselves.” (05:11)

Personal Story: Friendship with Nick (06:00)

• Fr. Mike shares the evolution of his friendship with Nick Davidson, illustrating Aristotle’s framework:

  • Began as a “useful” connection (Nick sought religious guidance).
  • Grew through shared work (youth ministry).
  • Became “pleasant” with social visits.
  • Evolved into a “virtuous” friendship—shared desire to serve Christ and others, even across continents.

• Memorable Moment:

  “Even if we’re not in the same space, I find that I’m still inspired to pursue the good because of my friendship with him...that is the virtue that we both want to help each other achieve.” (08:32)

• Nick now lives in Cambodia as a missionary, yet the virtuous connection persists and inspires both men, regardless of distance.

Virtuous Friendships Rooted in Christ (09:18)

• Aristotle and Christian writers alike view virtuous friendships as deeply fulfilling for the heart.
• These friendships offer mutual knowledge, acceptance, and a shared pursuit of God or a greater good.
• Quote:

  “We’re known as we are and chosen as we are...but then it's not about the relationship, it’s about the pursuit, going side by side after something bigger than oneself.” (09:34)

Practical Application: Finding and Building Virtuous Friendships (10:28)

• Fr. Mike challenges listeners to reflect: Do I have any virtuous friendships?
• Encourages starting with people you know through work (utility) or shared interests (pleasure), and exploring whether there’s a common pursuit of goodness or a shared worldview.
• Suggests that appreciating others for their character, even when they aren't particularly useful or always pleasant, is the basis for truly virtuous friendships.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Depth of Virtuous Friendship:

  “You want to bring Jesus to people, and you want to bring people to Jesus. And even if I'm not working with you on that, I also want to bring Jesus to people and people to Jesus.” (07:42)

• A Litmus Test for Friendship:

  “Even if they were not useful to you at all...I like their character. And they could say the same thing about you.” (10:52)

Important Timestamps

• 00:18 – Recognizing the friendlessness crisis
• 01:10 – Introduction of Aristotle’s three kinds of friendship
• 03:35 – Value and limits of pleasant friendships
• 05:11 – Transition to virtuous friendships
• 06:00 – Story about Nick and developing friendship
• 08:32 – Inspiration found in virtuous friendship
• 09:18 – Fulfillment in friendships rooted in Christ
• 10:28 – Practical reflection and application for listeners

Final Takeaway

Fr. Mike encourages listeners to reflect honestly on the nature of their friendships. Start with utility or pleasant friendships, but seek out and nurture those rare, virtuous connections—especially those anchored in a shared, faith-driven pursuit of goodness. These friendships not only meet our hearts’ deepest longings but also propel us ever closer to Christ.

“That friendship that you could ultimately say is virtuous friendship.” (11:16)