Find Something Worth Suffering For | Ep 950

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Game w/ Alex Hormozi — "Find Something Worth Suffering For" | Ep 950

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Alex Hormozi challenges the modern conception of "following your passion," reframing it as finding something worth suffering for. Using personal stories, business analogies, and philosophical insights, he argues that true fulfillment in entrepreneurship (and life) comes not from seeking constant pleasure but from enduring meaningful suffering in the pursuit of a greater goal. The episode is a candid reflection on sacrifice, ambition, the myth of passion, and the meaning behind relentless pursuit.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Real Meaning of Passion

• Origin of the Word: Passion stems from the Latin passio—meaning "suffering." Hormozi emphasizes:
  "It's not about doing what you love, it's about finding something that you love enough that it's worth suffering for." ([00:02])
• The "passion of Christ," the term's earliest usage, is a story of suffering, not pleasure; the modern interpretation is fundamentally flawed.

2. The Myth of Loving What You Do All the Time

• Most advice about "following your passion" is misleading:
  • 95% of daily work, even in your passionate pursuit, won't be enjoyable or related to what you think your passion is. ([00:52])
  • The rarity of enjoyable moments is what makes them valuable.
    "If you do the same thing all the time that you 'love', you'll stop loving it because you'll get so much of it." ([02:13])
• Passion only exists as a vague concept, not a specific set of tasks.

3. Suffering Is Inescapable—So Choose Your Hard

• Whether you’re an employee, entrepreneur, rich, or broke, there is suffering in every path.
  "Entrepreneurship is hard. Being an employee is hard. Being broke is hard. Being rich is hard..." ([05:38])
• Changing paths doesn’t eliminate suffering; it only changes its flavor.
  "Suffering is a fixed cost, right?... The secret to getting what you want is doing lots of things that you don't want." ([06:36])

4. The Importance of the "Why" Over the "What"

• The why and how will persist—these are internal and can endure through the inevitable suffering ([09:45]).
• Cites Viktor Frankl: "If a man has a big enough why, he can overcome almost any how." ([10:32])
• Rogan quote: "A man will crawl through broken glass with a smile. You need a goal worth suffering for." ([10:40])

5. Making Duty Cool Again

• Hormozi expresses a desire to restore respect for duty and providing for others:
  "For me, my passion, what I’m willing to suffer for, is helping men provide... I see the core components of me and men specifically as provide, protect, procreate." ([13:14])

6. Personal Stories & The Cost of Pursuit

• Shares his toughest year owning a gym, where pursuing his "passion" nearly broke him ([15:48]).
• Vivid accounts of sleeping on a dirty gym floor, social status loss, and enduring uncertainty in the early stages of entrepreneurship ([20:31-21:47]).
• The only thing that carried him through:
  "I didn't know when I would succeed or if I would succeed, but I did know that I wouldn't stop." ([22:40])

7. Accepting Suffering as the Toll

• No path is "greener" without toil—the grass is "greener" because “it’s fertilized with shit.” ([09:06])
• Good and bad are part of a steady state of existence; your subjective well-being rarely changes drastically with circumstances ([19:25]).
• "We work because on some level, we think the suffering will end and it just won't. If you can accept the suffering as the toll that you pay on all these paths, then at least you get to pick where you go. And I think that is something worth fighting for." ([26:03])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Passion:
  "Pick something worth suffering for." ([00:09])
• On the myth of constant enjoyment:
  "Passion only exists in the vague, not in the specific." ([00:46])
  "You want good days, not a never-ending work state of this jolly thing that you love. Eventually you'd adapt and get bored." ([02:51])
• On Suffering:
  "Success and failure are on the same path. Failure is just an earlier exit." ([06:29])
• On the why:
  "Do not try to be passionate about what you do, but try to be passionate about why and how you do it." ([09:45])
• On life's toll:
  "Everything is hard and no one cares." ([24:50])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:02 – The true meaning of passion (etymology and history)
• 00:52 – Passion as illusion: why the specific tasks aren't enjoyable
• 02:11 – The value of rarity in passion; pizza analogy
• 03:06 – Excuses around passion mask your resistance to suffering
• 04:45 – Video game analogy: suffering is part of the game
• 05:38 – Every life path entails suffering; desire to escape it is a fallacy
• 09:06 – "Greener grass" and the reality of hardship
• 10:32 – The power of a greater "why" (Frankl and Rogan quotes)
• 13:14 – Hormozi's personal mission: helping men provide
• 15:48 – Story: owning a gym and the reality behind "living your passion"
• 20:31 – Details of sleeping on a gym floor; literal cost of pursuit
• 22:40 – The endurance mentality: not stopping is the differentiator
• 24:50 – The universal challenge: "Everything is hard and no one cares."
• 26:03 – Final takeaway: accept suffering as the cost and choose a worthy pursuit

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Conclusion and Takeaways

Alex Hormozi dismantles the conventional advice to "follow your passion," instead urging listeners to find a purpose compelling enough to endure hardship for. Whether you're an entrepreneur, aspiring business owner, or seeking meaning in your current struggle, his message centers on embracing suffering as an integral, unavoidable toll. By attaching your efforts to a "why" greater than yourself, you can persist through difficulty and ultimately find satisfaction not in the absence of pain, but in the achievement of something meaningful and lasting.

Final thought:
"...If you can accept the suffering as the toll that you pay on all these paths, then at least you get to pick where you go. And I think that is something worth fighting for." ([26:06])

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For those seeking specific tactical business advice from Hormozi, see his free 10-stage roadmap at acquisition.com/roadmap ([03:22-03:59]).

Transcript

[A]

People want to follow their passion, but

[B]

don't even know what it actually means.

[A]

So the root of the word passio is Latin for suffering. So it's not about doing what you love, it's about finding something that you

[B]

love enough that it's worth suffering for. And so pick something worth suffering for.

[A]

And what's interesting about this is that the first usage of the word passion came from passion of Christ, which was literally Jesus Christ's crucifixion story. And so it's interesting that this has been bastardized into following your passion means

[B]

doing what you love.

[A]

And the reason I'm making this video is because I had a young man stop me say that he quit his

[B]

job, went all in on entrepreneurship, but

[A]

then he didn't like what his life looked like. And so he asked me what he should do. And the reality was that he quit because he thought that he was doing

[B]

something wrong, because he wasn't loving every second of it.

[A]

So here's the big problem. Your passion only exists in the vague,

[B]

not in the specific.

[A]

So even if you start a business

[B]

around what you believe to be your

[A]

passion, 95% of what you do every day, if you're successful, will not be your passion. You'll just have very brief moments where you'll do that specific thing, if at all. And then assuming that that thing never

[B]

changes, which it will.

[A]

And so this kind of like passion window is very short lived, or it's only possible as an employee where you actually stick to doing the same thing

[B]

every single day within kind of a

[A]

larger machine or a solopreneur that chooses not to scale. Not a business owner, unless you choose

[B]

to love business ownership as the thing

[A]

you're, quote, passionate about, which means that

[B]

you're willing to suffer for it, right?

[A]

And the ultimate version of this comes at the very end. If you keep doing the thing that

[B]

you are, you know, that you suffer for, for a long period of time,

[A]

eventually you can get to true ownership where something, you know, operates on its

[B]

own and then you have all your time back, right?

[A]

And so let me give you an example. So I run, every month I meet with 10 entrepreneurs.

[B]

It's the most expensive quote service that we sell.

[A]

It's obviously unscalable, but I meet with

[B]

bigger businesses, usually the average business size around 10ish million.

[A]

And we meet in a group of 10 and I meet with them and it's something that I absolutely love doing. I look forward to the days whenever they're coming up, but I would absolutely hate it if I had to do it every day. And so how can that be true, right? How can I love something but if I did a lot of it, I would hate it? Well, it's like, well, I love.

[B]

There's a certain pizza place that I love going to once or twice a year and it's amazing. If I was forced to eat it

[A]

every single meal, I, I wouldn't like it as much. And so we have this misconception about following your passion. And in both scenarios, if you do the same thing all the time that you quote love, you'll stop loving it because you'll get so much of it. The fact that it's rare is what makes you love it. And if it stays rare, then it means that the vast majority of your time you're not really doing it. And so it's just a complete myth. And I understand why people tell younger people or other newer entrepreneurs like, oh, follow your passion. It's just because it's politically correct and it's easy to say, but it's not the truth, right? And so you're not going to have the perfect amount of sunshine for the perfect amount of time.

[B]

Right?

[A]

And so let me reframe how I think through this is that you want moments, you want good days, not a never ending work state of this jolly thing that you love. Because eventually you'd adapt and you would

[B]

get bored just like everything else.

[A]

And so here's the underline. You are using the excuse of a lack of passion to disguise your inability to handle passion, difficulty to handle being able to repeatedly do things that you don't enjoy, to have something that you do find meaningful have happen.

[B]

Real quick, I'm going to show you

[A]

the exact 10 stage roadmap from 0 to 100 million plus that less than 1% of companies finish. I've now done multiple times.

[B]

And so I can say with a

[A]

lot of confidence that these are the stages as headcount increases that you need to get through. And I broke each of these down by eight different functions of the business, what the constraint feels like, like what

[B]

are the symptoms of it when you're going through it.

[A]

And, and then what steps we actually took to graduate. And we've done this across software, physical products, service businesses, brick and mortar, all of this. And it works. And it's my gift to you. It's absolutely free. And so the links in the description,

[B]

but you just go acquisition.com forward/roadmap, just enter info and it'll spit it right back to you, all free.

[A]

And so this is what actually Happens

[B]

in the real world, right?

[A]

So unless you get very good at your passion, you will have to do things that you like less to pay your bills, period. Like that's, that's real, right? And then number two, as soon as you are good at your passion, your demand will outstrip your supply of time. And 95% of what you do will, will not be the thing you love, but stuff that you do to support the thing you love, which you may indeed not love. And so the 5% of your passion that's left over will only be there if your passion doesn't change, which it also will, which means the vast majority of your life you will not be doing things that you are passionate about. And in the tiny instance you do, it's likely short lived. And so let me, let me frame why I think this is so important.

[B]

If you were playing a video game

[A]

and day one, I said, enter this cheat code, you have max life, max strength, max money, max good looks. And then you go through the whole game and it's incredibly easy, what would you do?

[B]

You just never play the game.

[A]

It wouldn't even be fun, right? And so we on some level know that we have to suffer. It's not about winning the lottery, right? It's not about the outcome. We can't say, oh, I'm really ambitious, I won the lottery. The ambition and the passion go hand in hand in that you were stating to the world, and more importantly to yourself that you were willing to suffer for this thing because you have deemed it important enough to suffer for. Which is why the striving, the suffering is quintessentially human and not something to be avoided. Growing a business is really painful and sucks. Being in a plateaued business is really

[B]

painful and it sucks.

[A]

Being in a decaying business is really

[B]

painful and it sucks.

[A]

Entrepreneurship is hard. Being an employee is hard. Being broke is hard. Being rich is hard. Married people want to be single. Single people want to be married. I'm not saying all the time, but I'm saying there is suffering in every path of life. And so I see the core issue, especially with entrepreneurs, especially newcoming entrepreneurs, is that they look at their existing state and think, I am suffering. And therefore there's something wrong with this. I need to change this. Because if I change this, I will no longer suffer. But change will also cause suffering. And so it's the fact that you claim there's a problem with suffering that's creating even more suffering and also sacrificing the thing that you said you would suffer for. Because you're not going to achieve it. Because you never walk down the path. And so one of my favorite sayings around this, it's of myself, it's my

[B]

own saying, so it's a bit self aggrandizing.

[A]

But success and failure are on the same path. Failure is just an earlier exit.

[B]

That's it.

[A]

To that younger entrepreneur who I was talking to. No matter what path you choose, it will be hard. And so pick one that pays better if that's what you think is worth it. And so suffering is a fixed cost, right? The suffering on all paths is a fixed cost. And so the secret to getting what you want is doing lots of things that you don't want. And so no matter what you do, it will suck. And so pick the things that pay better. The goal is to reframe reality so that bad things are good, not to try and only experience good things. I'm going to say that again. The goal is to reframe your living experience so that bad things are good, not to try and only experience good things. It would be like looking outside and saying every day that it rains, I will be upset. Rather than there are benefits to rain and there are benefits to sunshine. And so you have to change your frame, not your conditions, your perceptions, not reality. And so let me give you a hypothetical. What if I told you you had two options and both rides cost 10 bucks, right? And one ride is one that you want and the other one is one that you hate. Which one would you pick? They both cost 10 bucks. The thing you hate and the thing you love. Well, you'd pick the thing that you love. Now let me say, let me give you another option, a third option. Lynn. Give you the option. That's the thing that you love. Unbelievably, like huge love. It's so, it's so unbelievable that you're not even sure you want to try to ride the ride because you're not even sure if it's going to finish the way you want, but it still cost 10 bucks. Which one would you do?

[B]

Now?

[A]

You probably pick the one that you

[B]

really, really love, right?

[A]

So then what if I told you that you're going to suffer the same

[B]

amount in all three paths that you pick in life?

[A]

The thing that you hate, the thing that you think is a moderate or reasonable goal, or the thing that you

[B]

really want to swing for the fences for?

[A]

All three have the same amount of suffering. Like, think about it, you will suffer the same. You'll suffer regret more here. You'll suffer difficulty More here, but you'll suffer the same. It's a fixed cost. This is why aiming big is so, is so real for me is that like, what's the alternative? Aiming small and also still suffering. Like the fears that we have on the downside are not true, they're just suffering. And so I say all this to say delaying your pursuit because you're waiting to find your passion is a fool's errand. Find something that people value, do that thing, even though it sucks. Realize there is no greener grass on the other side. It all sucks on both sides. One of my favorite CEOs that I've

[B]

ever had, Suzanne, used to say, it's

[A]

greener on the other side of the

[B]

fence because it's fertilized with shit.

[A]

And so there's shit on both sides of the fence. You just haven't gotten over and stepped in it yet. And one of my favorite Chinese proverbs is, everything must be hard before it can be easy. And so my two sentences, do not try to be passionate about what you do, but try to be passionate about why and how you do it. The reason for that is because your why and your how will persist. They are internal. Your what the thing you like doing. You like carving little miniature ships, you like playing video games, you like painting. Whatever it is, it's external and you

[B]

have little control over that.

[A]

Those are treats, those are moments, they can't be requirements. And so this is from a personal

[B]

level, me having gone through a little bit of this myself, like questioning the reason for working when you no longer need any money, right? That's, you know, whatever your opinion about me, like that is very true. I do not need to work.

[A]

What I had to realize for myself

[B]

was I am not the goal.

[A]

I am the goal in terms of

[B]

who I want to become.

[A]

But the self servingness cannot be the goal because you will satisfy your own

[B]

needs relatively quickly, especially if you get good at anything. Everyone's bar is different, but you will satisfy. It doesn't matter who you are.

[A]

And so that why has to be bigger than you or you'll only be able to come overcome obstacles that are smaller than you.

[B]

And this is why I believe it

[A]

has to be eternal.

[B]

And so Viktor Frankl famously said, if a man has a big enough why, he can overcome almost any how. And Rogan had this quote that I love about this, which is, a man will crawl through broken glass with a smile. You need a goal worth suffering for.

[A]

The goal is your passion, not the path. If you love the goal enough, the

[B]

Path stops mattering, right? So let me give an example to make this concrete. Imagine your future family and your future wife, right?

[A]

People who go to war fight for different reasons. Freedom, duty, protecting their loved ones, not letting their friends down. None of this is their love. But they love them enough that they'll do anything, including die for them. And my definition of love from an operationalizing perspective is that you measure it by what you're willing to give up

[B]

in order to maintain it.

[A]

The man who loves the journey will

[B]

walk further than the man who loves the destination.

[A]

But the man who walks to protect his family will walk until the other man dies. So let me tell you something cool about this. So they've done research on this where

[B]

they have someone get shocked, and then eventually they tap out, right?

[A]

At a pain threshold, when they told the same people that their loved ones were in the other room and every shock they took, their loved ones wouldn't have to, their threshold tripled. Think about how crazy this is. And the reason I think this is so relevant is that, like, if you want to do big things, it will cost you great pain. And so the why is your passion, not the path. And so this is why people talk about finding your passion, because it'll get you through the inevitable hard times that come. But whenever you hear someone say that, first off, I don't think they have bad intent.

[B]

I think they just don't think about it as much.

[A]

But when you hear that, just remember it will get you through the inevitable hard times that come. Is the definition of passion. It is the requisite for it being your passion. If passion, the literal translation in Latin is suffering and endurance to endure suffering, the passion of Christ, this crucifixion story, the first usage of suffering in this context, then don't you think that, like, the thing that you're going for, maybe it's to set yourself up financially, to

[B]

set your family up financially, to move

[A]

in a better neighborhood, to set your kids up, to have something that you didn't have. Like, don't you think that's worth suffering for, whatever that is for you? And so, like, I want to make duty cool again. I want to make it cool for, like, a man to go in a field and work a rice paddy and know that they did a job because of who they did it for. And so for me, my passion, what I'm willing to suffer for, is helping men provide. It's something that I feel deeply about.

[B]

And that's, to be fair, it's not like I don't want women to provide. I want them to provide too. But I'm saying, like, what is the closest to my core? Obviously, business tactics work no matter who's using them. Right.

[A]

But I see the core components of

[B]

me and men specifically as provide, protect, procreate.

[A]

And I can't help do all of

[B]

them, to be clear.

[A]

Right, so that's on you. But what I believe I can help

[B]

with is at least one of those three. And there are many days where I

[A]

do not enjoy some of the downstream

[B]

effects of what I do, but I do enjoy what happens as a result.

[A]

And I spend so much time on my books and this content because I think on my deathbed it will matter

[B]

more than any wealth that I accumulate.

[A]

And the ironic part about my role is that in order to influence more people, I need to continue to gain

[B]

access to increased credibility.

[A]

And so our outcomes are inextricably linked. I have to succeed. I have to learn the next step

[B]

so that I can teach it.

[A]

And that carries me through the pain

[B]

of uncertainty and the failures of my many misjudgments.

[A]

And you can become passionate about your work because you become passionate about what

[B]

your work gets you.

[A]

And I think for some reason talk about it's the journey, that destination, but like, in some ways it's about the destination so that you can tolerate the journey. I don't think Frodo on his in his quest to destroy the Ring was like, man, I'm not sure if I'm passionate about this. I think he absolutely was passionate about it. He was willing to die for it. He was willing to give up his home for it, his friends for it, his family for it. And so I think we all on some level strive to have that. Something that I've been saying to Layla

[B]

a lot is that like something I

[A]

believe to my bones is that a man must have a quest. You have to drive towards something. And so the problem is that we believe that when we see monsters and dragons on the trail, society is telling us, oh, this is not the right path for you, because it's not all sunshine and rainbows and unicorns. No, that path, not only does it not exist, even if it did exist, it would be short lived and you'd adapt to it because you're human and hedonistic. Adaptation is a real thing. And to be clear, there are elements of my work, of my path, that I love. I love writing. But basically anything besides that, I don't like 10 out of 10, enjoy. I love riding. I enjoy lifting. Lifting, I would say, is super high on my like, enjoyment list. I enjoy eating and hanging out after I work out with people I like. And those are basically my emotional highs. But if I did it all the time, which I know because I tried to do it, I owned a gym. I started a gym because I thought, oh, if I eat food with people I like and work out all the time, then my life's gonna be happy. And let me tell you, the most miserable year of my life was the first year I started the gym. The most miserable of the last 15.

[B]

The hardest year of my life.

[A]

And so the thing is that you habituate to the good, but you still suffer through the bad. You get used to it. And so, definitionally, you need something that you cannot achieve in order to continue to strive, to continue to fight, especially when you don't want to. And so I'm not gonna speak for,

[B]

you know, women and men, but especially

[A]

for men, I believe that we need to give ourselves permission to earn, permission to strive, permission to suffer and grow

[B]

as a result of that suffering.

[A]

Because the stretch between who you are and who is required, the person you have to become to handle your current struggle is the pain of growth. And we can't wish for the benefits of growth without accepting the cost or the price of growth, which is the suffering. And so you could even say that growth is your passion. But if growth is your passion, that means that you're willing to do many miserable things in order for it to happen, which means you're willing to suffer to achieve it, which means that if you're suffering right now in pursuit of the thing that you find meaningful, there is nothing wrong with you. You are not on the wrong path. And this is how it works. And the people who try to tell you otherwise either don't know better or actively are trying to destroy you. And I do this work because I really do find it the most meaningful. I put up with plenty of shit because I like. Like, it's hard for people to comprehend this. I took out $42 million in distributions before my $46 million exit at 31. Put that in a bank account and put 5% a year on it. I don't live that fancy. It was an active choice to take this on and do this, because when I took the year off, I was very miserable. I had no quest. And I remember being in Mexico.

[B]

Layla and I went there for a month or two.

[A]

I can't remember. And I remember every day, I would look out this beautiful ocean, this massive

[B]

mansion that we had rented while we were there.

[A]

And I had to Think to myself, like, what do I find meaningful? What moves me? And when I say moves me, I mean calls me to take action. What is a cause that I am

[B]

willing to suffer for?

[A]

And for me, it's helping younger me out because I know how much pain I was in. But a portion of that pain was because I had other people in my ear telling me there was something wrong with me for the pain I experienced, that there was something wrong with the path. And so they would sow these seeds of doubt and uncertainty into me. And then that made the path so much more painful because the whole time I was wondering, like, am I, Like, I'm going. I for sure know I'm going through the suffering, but I don't know if I'm doing it for the right reason. And so I think that if you provide for your family, like, you've won. And most people, like, if we're really being real, think back to the last major life change that you have. Once it's stabilized, you're probably close to about as happy as you are now. And I'll make a prediction. After your next major life change, you'll have a short period of improved subjective well being and then you'll return to baseline. And so, like, if we assume these things to be true, and our subjective well being, how we rate ourselves, how we feel day to day, is about the same pretty much no matter what, then that steady state becomes our existence. And so that's the $10, that's the fixed cost of living. But we can change the reward. We can change what we do it for or for whom we do it. And I think that's what got me

[B]

riled up enough to make this video.

[A]

Like, there's nothing wrong with you.

[B]

If you were pursuing something for the purpose of something that you find meaningful,

[A]

independent of how hard it is to make this real.

[B]

For some of you guys who are going through it right now. When I was sleeping on my gym floor, I say that in one sentence, I was sleeping on my gym floor. But what the sentence fails to compress is that, like, that's a turf floor that I used to get rashes on because it was like covered in sweat and I didn't clean it that often. And when I was sleeping there, I was barely sleeping because it was underneath of a parking garage and it had these metal dividers and it was a concrete box. And so these cars would drive over it at all hours of the night. Usually, like kids around my age, because I was 22 driving there, who were college kids or Just out of college, partying on the roof. And so I could hear these cars, they were like. And it would like wig me up, like. And I would do the billing until sometimes 11 o' clock at night. And then I would have this adrenaline and this sweat sleep that I'd go through because there was no AC in the gym because it was in California. And my first session would be five. People would get there at 4:30. So I'd open the gym at 4:15.

[A]

And the thing is you can hear that.

[B]

And I remember I would sleep for around four to five hours every night. But I did that consistently for about six months. And it got to the point like,

[A]

I remember where I could, I could

[B]

actually fall asleep leaning against walls. And I remember thinking to myself during that period of my life, like, anyone who ever has sleeping issues just simply

[A]

isn't working hard enough.

[B]

I don't think that's true. I for sure think that if you were sleep deprived enough, like, you will not have sleeping issues. But I bring this up to say that like I was like, I remember showering at the LA Fitness, didn't have flip flops and I still have athlete's foot in one of my feet because of what I caught at that place that I still deal with. And I literally had all my stuff in my car because I drove to California in my car and all my stuff was there.

[A]

And so when I say one line

[B]

of like I slept on the floor, like, you know, I get it, I understand that because like, while I was going through it, like I had no promise that it was going to work right? And like I had also given up something that was significant. I had a white collar job. And every person that I knew, and this might not be real for some of you, but every person that I knew when I decided to quit and start my own gym business actually had higher status than me. So because they all had white collar jobs. And I quit to start what most people would consider a blue collar business.

[A]

And so I lost all social status

[B]

that I had within, like the girls that I knew and the guys that I knew because I was no longer like on the investment banking, management consulting path. And like I went to this prestigious college so that I could open up that world and then instead left everything so that I could become a personal trainer, which requires zero credibility at all. And so like, if you are going through your version of hard time now, for you, maybe it is more sleepless nights, maybe it is physical exhaustion, maybe it's more the social stuff of feeling like your peers are getting ahead of you and wondering what's wrong with you. And, like, you're for sure sacrificing this time, money and taking on this risk, but you're not sure if it's going to work. The only thing that I can say is that every single person who was successful shares that path with you. And the only thing that I can tell you that got me through that period of time was that I committed to not stopping. I didn't know when I would succeed or if I would succeed, but I did know that I wouldn't stop and that if I didn't stop, that I couldn't be called a failure. And so that was the big thing.

[A]

Like, I realized that if I had to stop, then I would have to explain. Stopping that still meant that other people's

[B]

opinions mattered to me, to be clear.

[A]

But if I was like, if I just keep going, I can always be

[B]

like, I'm still doing it, I'm still doing it.

[A]

And as long as I had enough to cover food, which doesn't really cost that much, I was gonna be okay. And so a lot of times the

[B]

worst case scenario is, I would encourage you to think out in more specificity what really is the worst case scenario? As someone who slept in the car or slept on the floor.

[A]

Like, you know what? Just like everything else, it becomes steady state, right?

[B]

Like, I remember when I was broker

[A]

and had amazing memories, and I remember

[B]

being richer and having amazing memories. I remember having terrible memories now having more money, and I remember having terrible memories then having less money. For sure, money will give you options, but it will not really dramatically change your subjective wellbeing, because that is very internal. And a lot of us already know this, but we still want to make sure and go get the money anyways. But I see a man's work as something that's incredibly core to who we are. I don't know if it's the same for women. I can only speak to my own experience, but I see my work and what I choose to do with my hands and my mind, like, every day. My grandfather, who was the person that I was closest with my family, he came here. He was an immigrant, one of nine born in Macedonia. He was the smartest of them. So they sent him to boarding school because he was smarter than his siblings did. Well, then ran from the Nazis for multiple years during the Holocaust, and then from there came to the US after being in Europe after the World war to start his practice here. Then he had to retake all of the exams because none of the European standardizations mattered in the US they had to retake everything again in the US in language he didn't understand. And so, you know, obviously he. He. He became successful. He had my mother, and my mother had me. But he would.

[A]

He and I would sit there and

[B]

talk, and he says, you have two hands and one mind. That's it.

[A]

And.

[B]

And I always thought about that.

[A]

So it's like we have two hands and one mind.

[B]

And if we think that, like, no matter what path you choose, like, poverty is tough, right? And so is. So is growth, and so is risk. Like, everything sucks, right? I tweeted this thing the other day. Cause I was texting someone, it says, everything is hard and no one cares.

[A]

I am able to make these videos

[B]

despite some of the personal cost that comes with it. For sure, there's personal benefit, but there are costs and there are benefits.

[A]

Because when I have those moments where

[B]

you're like, shoot, what if I go off this ramp and I'm about to die? Or you have some health scare cause you see a lump somewhere and you're like, oh, my God, is it cancer? And it's not. Or whatever.

[A]

Those moments you do this quick check

[B]

on your life, and you're like, do I need to change everything about what I'm doing?

[A]

And for me, when I have those

[B]

moments, I look back and I say, like, this is what I would have done. Like, I feel like the work that I do helps people. And it's something that I find interesting.

[A]

And so I do it.

[B]

And much of my day does not include that. And much of my life leading up to this did not include that. And I've said this example before, but I will make it again. I thought that pursuing my passion meant being in fitness and because I liked working out.

[A]

But me working out with friends is

[B]

such a very small slice of my life.

[A]

And when I actually started a gym and took it all the way to the natural extreme, I'm back at the

[B]

beginning again right now with a gym that I can work out with the people that I like. And I do not have a gym business.

[A]

And so I say this to say that, like, the suffering will not stop. Like, we work because on some level,

[B]

we think the suffering will end and it just won't.

[A]

And so I think if you can

[B]

accept the suffering as the toll that you pay on all these paths, then at least you get to pick where you go. And I think that is something worth fighting for.