How to Overcome Fear

Summary

The GaryVee Audio Experience

Episode: How to Overcome Fear

Date: June 4, 2026
Host: Gary Vaynerchuk
Guests: Joe Gatto, Dina Ayata, Nick Cassano

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Episode Overview

In this energetic and wide-ranging episode, Gary Vaynerchuk gathers with comedian Joe Gatto, rising music artist Dina Ayata, and content creator Nick Cassano. Held as part of his "Podcast With Friends" series (and streamed live on Twitch), the conversation explores the role of fear in personal and creative journeys, the importance of self-esteem, building resilience, and the pursuit of authentic success. The episode is rich with personal anecdotes, actionable advice, and the infectious, supportive energy characteristic of GaryVee’s style.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introductions & Personal Journeys

[Timestamps: 00:57–13:00]

• Dina Ayata shares her path from Morocco/Belgium to LA and NY, discovering her musical talent, going viral on TikTok, and making the leap from law school to pursuing music full time.
  • “After my exams, we went to LA and … a lot of producers, labels, artists started reaching out to me… I might want to drop out of law school because this music might be for me.” [06:24]
  • “I just got off tour with TJ. That’s amazing.” [07:27]
• Joe Gatto recounts his journey from improv in New York to failed Hollywood dreams selling pants at Nordstrom, culminating in a decade with Impractical Jokers and a new focus on stand-up, family, and a nonprofit for senior dogs.
• Nick Cassano discusses leaving a traditional fitness/coaching path when a spontaneous TikTok video went mega-viral, jumpstarting his career as a digital creator.
  • “My first TikTok got 2 million views. …I had not put myself out there, I wouldn’t have realized I did have a gift.” [12:08/15:45]
  • “I was always the class clown. It just always felt so good but it came natural.” [11:30]

2. On Fear, Self-Esteem, and Public Sharing

[Timestamps: 14:54–22:30]

• Gary urges listeners to act on the encouragement of friends and internal intuition, pushing past fear and self-doubt.
  • “Everyone who feels that they’re good, that’s listening, should only live putting themselves out there 24/7. Because nothing bad can happen because you’re good.” [16:53]
• The crew discusses managing judgment, with Gary emphasizing not internalizing external opinions, and Nick sharing his “dinner table” analogy:
  • “When people come to me, I think to myself, are you sitting at my dinner table? …If not, I’ll take what you say, but I’m not going to internalize it.” [19:36]
• On Self-Esteem:
  • Gary: “I basically feel … my content is going to be super weird because all I’m going to want to say is it is self-esteem versus insecurity for sure. …If you are insecure, someone made you insecure—get therapy, meditation, cut your friends out that make you feel that way.” [16:19]
  • “What somebody saying you’re shit actually means—it means actually nothing, right?” [18:19]

3. Judgment & Kindness

[Timestamps: 20:31–24:43]

• Gary suggests that people vulnerable to judgment are often judgmental themselves, and he strives to approach people with empathy.
  • “If I don’t know people that are in my inner circle, I definitely don’t know anybody.” [21:03]
  • “I just hope you’re good… Life is amazing and at times hard. I cheer for people.” [22:03]
• On Kindness and Values:
  • Joe: “My mother used to say, watch how people treat old people and animals. That’s all you need to know.”
  • Gary: “I resent the way humans blindly treat animals and not each other. …I wish the world treated each other [the same way].” [23:18]
  • “People are comfortable with animals because they can’t talk back… Humans are petrified of other humans.” [24:36]

4. Trust, Energy, and Meeting New People

[Timestamps: 24:48–29:14]

• Dina: “When I meet people, my first impression is always important. But I can’t trust you right away. …Also, not think negatively about other people right away.” [25:11]
• Joe: Describes being protective of his family in public due to fame, and the challenge for kids of public figures.
  • “Most kids that have a parent of notoriety hate it. …They don’t want people to like them because of you.” [26:33]
• Nick: “I try to control the controllable…I’ll put as much good as I can out there…even if I gotta force it out. The universe is gonna reciprocate that energy back.” [27:08]
• Gary: “If someone’s really not about that [comfort and kindness] towards me, I go into…my God, I just came in here and love bombed the fuck out of this room…now if I see darkness, I’m like, that person is in a deep, bad place.” [29:15]

5. Resilience, Principles, and VeeFriends Analogy

[Timestamps: 28:09–38:37]

• Trading and relating to VeeFriends characters:
  • Dina: “Tough to Beat a Worm from the Dirt”—resilience and coming from humble beginnings.
    • Gary: “If you’re lucky enough to be born into humble environments and you have love, you become undefeated. …Resilience is required.” [34:22]
  • Joe: “Polished Poodle” — reflects growth, self-work, and his love for dogs.
    • “I did some real self work over the past couple years. I think I’m a little in this stage of me right now.” [35:18]
  • Nick: “Principled Praying Mantis”—recognizing his foundation in family values and hard work.
• Gary: “The tenacity to fight for calm. Emotional tenacity—the tenacity to fight for peace of mind … that’s the impact.” [38:29]

6. Success, Peace, and Intuition

[Timestamps: 38:29–43:03]

• Redefining Success:
  • Gary: “If I can market to the world the redefining of success to be peace of mind and smiling instead of fucking stuff, I could leave the biggest impact of all time.” [38:29]
  • Nick: “Social media is great, but dangerous. A lot of people try to define what success should be for you.” [38:58]
• Dreams & Intuition:
  • Dina: “I want to get nominated for the Grammy Awards next year…But soon for me means whenever God is handing it to me. Whenever it’s God’s plan, it’ll come.” [40:16]
  • Gary: “I feel like God’s plan is a cousin to the intuitive stomach…Intuition is underrated.” [42:14/42:18]
  • Joe: “You’re your own compass… as long as you put the work in.” [42:35]

7. Overcoming Fear – The Central Theme

[Timestamps: 45:05–46:12, 49:19–49:57]

• Nick: “Fear is afraid of you too. …Fear is deathly afraid of the day you turn around and be like, I’m not afraid of you. And then it loses all power… You can be afraid and still do all these things.” [45:05, 45:26]
  • “You have to embrace every emotion, but you can’t be every emotion.” [45:28]
• Gary: “Fear is fake. Fear hangs out with Santa Claus.” [14:14, 46:09]
  • “Fear is on fire… Politicians have weaponized it. Parents have weaponized it. School systems have weaponized it. It is the weapon of choice, and I fucking hate it more than anything on Earth.” [49:19]

8. Authenticity and Dealing with Critics

[Timestamps: 52:48–53:23]

• Gary: “If someone comes on your platform and comes to you—they come to your home… and they look you in the face and say you’re ugly, they are a piece of shit.” [53:04]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Nick Cassano:
  “Fear is afraid of you too. Fear is deathly afraid of the day where you turn around and be like, I’m not fucking afraid of you. And then it loses all power.” [00:00, 45:05]

• Gary Vaynerchuk:
  “Fear is fake. Fear hangs out with fucking Santa Claus.” [00:14 / 46:09]
  “It is self-esteem versus insecurity for sure. …If you are insecure, someone made you insecure—get therapy, meditation, cut your friends out that make you feel that way.” [16:19]
  “If I can market to the world the redefining of success to be peace of mind and smiling instead of fucking stuff, I could leave the biggest impact of all time.” [38:29]
  “Fear is on fire… I hate fear more than anything on Earth. I fucking hate fear as much as I hate Bill Belichick.” [49:19]

• Dina Ayata:
  “I want to get nominated for the Grammy Awards next year. I see myself winning a Grammy soon… But soon for me means whenever God is handing it to me.” [40:16]

• Joe Gatto:
  “I’m an 18 year overnight success. …What’s done in the dark one day comes to light.” [43:04, 43:29]
  “My mother used to say, watch how people treat old people and animals. That’s all you need to know about their heart.” [23:05]

• Nick Cassano (on self-esteem & criticism):
  “It’s nobody’s business. It’s not your business what other people think of you.” [18:11]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Dina’s Journey: 02:57–07:27
• Nick’s Viral TikTok Moment: 11:40–15:45
• On Self-Esteem & Internal Validation: 16:14–19:36
• The “Dinner Table” Analogy (dealing with criticism): 19:36
• Judgment & Empathy: 21:03–22:03
• VeeFriends Card Discussion (Values/Resilience): 28:09–36:36
• Redefining Success / Tenacity: 38:08–38:29
• Dreams & Intuition: 40:16–43:00
• The Central Lesson on Fear: 45:05–46:09, 49:19–49:57
• Handling Haters/Critics: 52:48–53:23

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Overall Tone

True to GaryVee’s brand, the episode is energetic, brashly honest, supportive, and encouraging. The conversation is laced with practical wisdom, personal humility, and an open-handed approach to both success and struggle. There’s real camaraderie and mutual respect among the guests, and plenty of moments of laughter and New York-style banter.

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Summary

This episode serves as both a pep talk and a practical masterclass in overcoming fear—whether in the pursuit of creative dreams, navigating judgment, or facing the day-to-day challenges of public life. The guests each exemplify resilience, self-awareness, and the choice to lead with kindness. Gary’s core message is unmistakable: Fear is fake. It only wins if we let it. Chase your dreams, nurture your self-esteem, and always bet on authenticity and kindness.

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“Fear is fake… Fear hangs out with Santa Claus.”
— Gary Vaynerchuk [46:09]

Transcript

[Nick Cassano]

Fear is afraid of you too.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Interesting. Break that down.

[Nick Cassano]

Like, fear has so much control, but it's the same feeling as happiness. Like nobody runs from happiness. Fear is deathly afraid of the day where you turn around, be like, I'm not fucking afraid of you. It's funny you say, and then it loses all power.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Fear is fake. Fear hangs out with fucking Santa Claus. This is the Gary Vee audio experience Vaynernation. How are you? Welcome to another episode of podcast with Friends. This episode is actually podcasts with former Friends because Joe is literally fucking 30, 26 minutes late the whole show, give or take. I have a hard stop at 11:30, so I want to apologize for you two youngsters. Joe has ruined your closure.

[Nick Cassano]

I was a fan of the show

[Joe Gatto]

and you know, well, what happened the Long island expressway. And don't pretend like you don't know.

[Nick Cassano]

There was an accident. I will say there was.

[Joe Gatto]

I was 10 minutes from my house, 37 miles away. I mean, come on, I did what I could.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Listen, you grew up in this area. Who life?

[Joe Gatto]

I did.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You should have been here nine in the morning.

[Joe Gatto]

You're right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Let's go into the show. Ladies first. Let's introduce ourselves. The Vayner Nation. The concept of this show is incredibly simple. There are individuals in the world that, you know, me and my team spend an ungodly amount of time watching human beings move in society. You know, Tyler Walsh and Boyd music, Tyler Schmidt and Zach. And overall culture, I play a lot of role in it. And we just kind of decided I wanted to do new content this year in 2024. And the thing that most excited me was getting people to introduce each other and get to know each other that may not know each other, admire each other from afar, but more importantly a get my audience to meet different voices, different people to follow their journeys on. Everyone's in different parts of their journey and executionally wise, I really wanted to finally start streaming. It's something I've been watching for a decade and have just never found my way in because I'm so busy. That's why vlogging worked. You know, Drock could follow me in my day to day, but this whole concept of now twitching, especially in my office. We tried it last week where like after the show I was on mute and just streaming in the back and people loved and I unmuted a couple times and I loved it and so huge. Shout out to the Twitch army, all of you that are tuned in right now. Barry, Gaynor, Chuck. That's a great name. Big Name for me in high school. I'll never forget the day my friends figured out if they reversed my two letters that they could really have some fun with me. So I see Vari Gaynerchuck's in the building. First time chat for JBoy for Clay Ferno. Let me know how you got here. I just tweeted it. I just sent it to my text. Or you're an OG. I want all 300 of you to right now reply OG text or Twitter. Let me know how you got here. But purpose of the show is for the audience to get to know you and for us to talk about shit that's popping in society or sitting on our chests or our minds. We will start. Ladies first. Why don't you tell the vaynernation who you are, what you do?

[Dina Ayata]

Yes. How far do you want me to go though?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It is your space.

[Dina Ayata]

Okay. So my name is Dina Ayata. I'm 19 years old. I'm Moroccan. I was born and raised in Belgium and I've always been into music. I'm an artist, so I was an artist since a little kid, like my mom and my dad knew, but it didn't really take me serious. So I participated with the Voice Kids in Belgium when I was 15, super young, still in school. And then that whole experience made me realize that maybe being an artist is what I want to do when I grow up.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

So.

[Dina Ayata]

So after that, my brother, he used to make beats. So then we sat together and we. We decided to just make songs together, have fun. And. And then I was 16, I met my producer Chuckie and my manager Dro. We recorded a vlog on Chucky's channel. 16 year old girl freestyling on my beat. And that had like 1 million views in a couple of weeks.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Damn.

[Dina Ayata]

Yeah, a couple of months. So I was like, wow, I really want to happen. Yeah, it's.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I saw like what happened on the Voice. Did you do well on the show?

[Dina Ayata]

Yeah, it was very nice. I got to the half to the semi finals. Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

So you got a lot of exposure from that?

[Dina Ayata]

Yes, a lot. It was nice being on stage. My first time being on stage, I was very nervous, very young, but it taught me a lot.

[Joe Gatto]

So what a stage to be on for your first one.

[Dina Ayata]

Yeah, exactly, exactly.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And so then after that YouTube video popped off, what happened next?

[Dina Ayata]

After that I was like, well, I want to sit down with my producer and manager. We're a team, so I want to find my own sound. Something that sounds like Dina Ayata and not other artists. So it took us like three years. We was locked in. Yeah. And we really took it serious, so. And then I decided to post a TikTok in December on my birthday. And it was a TikTok of me freestyling on a random beat because I don't listen to beats before I hop on a beat.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Oh, interesting.

[Dina Ayata]

Yeah. So I can never do that.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

So then I really resonate with that. If I had any musical talent, that would be more my style. I'm so much more improv in nature. Like, it just comes so natural to me.

[Dina Ayata]

Yes.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

As a human. It's how my speaking. Like, I literally sometimes don't even know who I'm speaking to.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

In like 4000 people events until I get to the location and meet the organizer. I'm like, okay, tell me about the audience. Like, I don't. I'm more comfortable. Yeah.

[Nick Cassano]

But if I threw a beat on right now, you're telling me, no, I

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

have no musical talent. If I had musical talent, I'd be the biggest rapper in the world.

[Nick Cassano]

I believe that.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'm being dead serious. I have so much real shit to say.

[Nick Cassano]

Oh, absolutely.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I just have no musical tal.

[Joe Gatto]

You already have a rapper name.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Everyone's always really nice. And Gary, you could do it. I'm like, yeah, Barry Gaynor. Check Barry Gaynor. Chuck in the Building. And so. And so where are we at? At the Journey now.

[Dina Ayata]

So I was 17 at that moment. No, I was turning 17 on my birthday and I posted a TikTok. Didn't overthink it. I was like, man, just let it flow. So then it took me a couple of days and in the meantime, so I was telling my manager, bro, I want to go to la. Let's go to la. I know I'm in school, but we can go after my exams. So, so basically I had. I was in law school the beginning of the year, and then we booked our flights, booked everything. We was ready. And then after we booked our flights and everything, my tik tok starts going crazy. It blew up. And I was like, maybe this is God's plan.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah.

[Dina Ayata]

So after my exams, we went to la and we were supposed to stay there for one month, but we extended the trip. So we stayed two months. And a lot of producers, labels, artists, they start reaching out to me. So we was really just working over there, like, locked in. And I knew, like, maybe when I go back to Belgium, I might want to drop out of law school because this music might be for me. And when I got back to Belgium, I was. I Was talking to my parents. I was like, yeah, I think this might be the right move for me to make right now. Like, I believe in it. So I. I dropped out and I did it online. I remember my manager calling me five minutes later. He was like, dina, somebody's flying us out to New York next week. I was like, this is God's plan. So it's been an amazing journey. After that, I just continued posting on Tik Tok. Everything blew up. A lot of people reaching out and then. And in the beginning, I told every label I want to. I want to do a support act at the end of the year. And I just got off tour with tj.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's amazing. So proud of you. Thank you, Joe.

[Joe Gatto]

That's me. I'm a freestyle rapper. My name is Joe. I kick the funky flow I rock the ass from here to Idaho.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Hey.

[Joe Gatto]

Former impractical Joker comedian. Improv. Started with improv when I was 19. Ran that to the ground. Got some improv experience here in New York. Moved to LA to chase a dream to be a filmmaker. Ended up working at Nordstrom selling men's pants. Moved back here in New York with the boys performing real quick, Just real

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

quick, just for the kids. Your. Your big plan to become this movie mogul?

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Go to la.

[Joe Gatto]

Yep. Pick it up, pack it up, go.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

The. The chapter in the book on that was you ended up just working at Nordstrom selling pants.

[Joe Gatto]

Yep, Selling pants.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

All right.

[Nick Cassano]

Were you good at selling pants?

[Joe Gatto]

I was fantastic. I was selling pants to all the celebrities. I worked at the Grove in la, which is all a hot spot.

[Nick Cassano]

What makes a good pair of pants?

[Joe Gatto]

I worked at the rail, which was the menswear section.

[Nick Cassano]

Okay.

[Joe Gatto]

And this is what Von Dutch was big. You'll remember that. And so I was. Yeah, I was rocking it out there and helping celebs and stuff. And that was my claim to fame. And then I just, you know, I loved sales. I was always a salesman. Came back to New York and I was doing comedy on the side till we got the. Me and the guys got together to figure out what our TV show was. We felt, we tried a couple that failed miserably, found jokers, made that, found that concept and did that for a decade. Then life gave me a couple options of different ways to go and decided to focus on family and figure it all out. And now I've been doing stand up on my own and been doing touring that for two years, writing movies, actually working on something, getting something started there, which is great. And kind of been performing some Big rooms, which is great. I'm playing the Beacon here in New York, which is the one I haven't done, so. Yeah, the Beacon in January 20th.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Can people get tickets?

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah, they can?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah. How did they find out?

[Joe Gatto]

Joe Gotto official dot com. No matter where you live? I'm. I'm on tour. But yeah, the January 20th is at the Beacon, which is the one.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I haven't done my official.

[Joe Gatto]

Because the other one's taken the real. Yeah, the real.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It kind of goes like the rule, right? Like, it's your name if you can get it. If you can't get your name, you get the real, and if you can't get that, you go with the official.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah, Yeah. I even had to do underscore gatto for my. All my handles. I'm an underscore guy.

[Nick Cassano]

You're an underscore guy.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I really feel like if you're an underscore person, like, shit's just not going.

[Nick Cassano]

You know, you could probably find.

[Joe Gatto]

It's just a common name.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I mean, you got don't have a common name in New York. I it up. I like too silent. Ease to it. I'm supposed to be this boy branding expert and, like, completely it up. Anyway.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

How. How are you enjoying stand up right now?

[Joe Gatto]

I love it. I love it. Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Is that your, like, favorite place to

[Joe Gatto]

be to entertain us, to make people laugh? And now you can get in front of people and do it that way. But I enjoy writing. I enjoy all of it. I've always enjoyed all of it. You know, I've been doing a bunch of different avenues now that the time is like, you know, I've had the time now, wrote a kid's book, which is coming out next year, which is.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But there's 800 people now on Twitch, which is a real number.

[Joe Gatto]

There you go.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And I feel like I should say something to them.

[Joe Gatto]

All right, everyone watching on Twitch, we just wanted to get you all together and say, you know, be kind to each other.

[Nick Cassano]

Oh, amen.

[Joe Gatto]

You got to be kind because, you know, life sucks. Suck harder. Friends. Get out there and do what you

[Nick Cassano]

got to do, right?

[Joe Gatto]

And you just keep smiling and spread some joy.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I love that, my brother.

[Nick Cassano]

So my name is Nick Cassano. I go. I'm on Instagram, tick tock. YouTube.

[Joe Gatto]

The official name, the official

[Nick Cassano]

Nick with an underscore at the end. But, yeah, I started.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

No, really. What is your hand?

[Nick Cassano]

Nicky Cast. Nikki. So I started. Yeah.

[Joe Gatto]

No, but wait.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

So funny story.

[Nick Cassano]

So that's the same handle that I had in high school. So, like, what I was. My whole thing was, like, I was a big sports guy. I played baseball my whole life, and I didn't really think that this was ever in the cards. And then one day, I was training clients in a gym. I thought I was gonna open up a gym and do this whole thing. I was training clients out of my garage. I always had, like, the entrepreneurial spirit. Anytime I wanted to, like, make. Make some money, my dad would tell me to go wash the cars or, like, I'd sell stuff on ebay. So, yeah, grew up like that. But my. But I was always the, like, the class clown. So like every sports team I was on, I was always, like, bound to make you laugh. And it just always felt so good. But it came natural. So I was never like, yeah, even

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

the way you talk, this is a talent.

[Nick Cassano]

You know what's funny? So I was. So I was.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

No, okay.

[Nick Cassano]

No. All right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I believe that.

[Nick Cassano]

No, yeah. For real, because I would. I used to play on this travel baseball team. I was the only kid from New York. Oh. And every time I open my mouth, people I didn't even fuck, but they were all from the side. I'd say, like, all right, here we go, kid. They go, all right, here we go, here we go. So it was the whole thing. I never. Like I said, it just kind of came natural, so. Posted on TikTok, the first video blew up.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And the first one.

[Nick Cassano]

The first one got 2 million views. Yeah, 2 million views.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Your first TikTok.

[Nick Cassano]

My first TikTok got 2 million views. So I was working in.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

What year was this?

[Nick Cassano]

This was 2020.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah, I was trying to tell.

[Nick Cassano]

It was right before the pandemic.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

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[Dina Ayata]

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[Gary Vaynerchuk]

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[Dina Ayata]

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[Gary Vaynerchuk]

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[Dina Ayata]

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[Gary Vaynerchuk]

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[Dina Ayata]

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[Gary Vaynerchuk]

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[Dina Ayata]

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[Gary Vaynerchuk]

boy. You know this.

[Nick Cassano]

I was right you were talking.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Know this. I was trying to tell everybody.

[Nick Cassano]

But see, like, I got on because of you. I didn't have like, it wasn't part of like, my buddies were just like. Because I would send the shit to my buddies.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Nick Cassano]

And they're like, post it. And I'm like, you know, I'm just going to open up the gym.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

By the way, I'm back. Because I just want to give value to the audience.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

By the way, 807, all of you share the shit out of this link right now. And this is where I'm going. Don't share it on social. Share this link right now to that thread. We all have that thread. We all have that WhatsApp or iMessage group text where like to your point, everyone's their best version in their best friend's text group.

[Nick Cassano]

100%.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I've got a Jets one and a Knicks one and a college one and like, like a sports card one and like we all have them. And I feel like for the reason I'm jumping in right now. I apologize. Jumping in is I believe that there's 25 people listening right now for sure. That are in a thread where their buddies are saying, you should do fantasy football full time.

[Nick Cassano]

For sure.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You're the smartest and best one in

[Nick Cassano]

our crew, for sure.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But they're like, nah, I'm not Matthew Berry. Or you're funny. Which is obviously very common because humor is this foundation of group chats. But like humor or knowledge.

[Nick Cassano]

Yep.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Hey everybody, hope you're enjoying the podcast right now. Make sure you follow the podcast. That's why I'm interrupting. Let's keep going on this show, but follow the podcast. It'll make my mom super happy. I'm telling you, for the 25 out of the million that listen to this podcast over the next three years in the long tail of consumption, please use this as a sign. God's plan. Back to your point as like, you know what? Fuck it. My friends have been telling me for two years. I've secretly been thinking about it for two months.

[Nick Cassano]

Right? For sure.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Use this. This dude first TikTok.

[Nick Cassano]

The first one.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Wow.

[Nick Cassano]

The first fucking one. And to be honest with you, to that point too, like, if I.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

If I didn't myself to a bunch of your.

[Nick Cassano]

Everyone posted. I was. It was eight minutes. I'll never forget. It was a Wednesday night, 7:52 2:00pm I'm working in the gym in my college, right? So I got six clients that I'm training. I worked in the athlete gym Downstairs at the school that I was at, I was like, you know what? Like no one's coming in. I'm just gonna make a video. So I made it's quick 15 second video post it. Didn't think anything of it. The next morning I woke up and it was just going ballistic. But then I deleted that.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You didn't have, you didn't have alerts on, so you didn't know nothing.

[Nick Cassano]

I, Gary, I woke up in the morning.

[Dina Ayata]

What?

[Nick Cassano]

And I'm going to do my routine in the morning and my phone.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

What is your routine? Morning. I mean, be very personal. Okay.

[Nick Cassano]

So I wake up. The first thing I do, I take my pills, I take a heart medic, not a heart. I take a multivitamin, I take a probiotic.

[Joe Gatto]

You confused medication and a multivitamin.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah, no, I did, I did. There's no, there's no going back, but. Well, because my buddy takes a heart medication and we were on the topic, but yeah. Anyway, bottom, bottom line, I had not put myself out there, I wouldn't have realized that, that I did have a gift, that I did have talent and that I actually love the sport of business. So the, the onset of like just put yourself out there. I think like I was always kind of good with, with me, no matter what. So like if I, if it just didn't work out, I'm like, I don't care.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You had self esteem.

[Nick Cassano]

Correct. And so it matters. Oh for sure.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

20 years into this journey, 15 and especially 5 to 7 on the. I'm talking about. Yeah, this is a binary. I, I basically I feel, I can already feel at 48 that my 65 year old content is gonna be super weird because all I'm gonna want to say is it is self esteem versus insecurity for sure. I don't want to talk to you fucking people about anything else. Like if you, if you are insecure, someone made you insecure, go to get therapy, meditation, change a routine, cut your friends out that make you feel that way. Yeah, like enough.

[Nick Cassano]

So many healthy ways.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Stop. Like all you fucking people out there, right, that are just willing to lean into cynicism and negativity and darkness. I promise you, it's just a pure reflection of what's in your heart. Like this is a binary game. You were good. And this is why I'm jumping in again. Everyone who feels that they're good, that's listening should only live putting themselves out there 24, 7. Because nothing bad can happen because you're good.

[Nick Cassano]

100%. There's no fear of what are people going to say if it doesn't do well? And like my friends, My friends would say, like, I remember I went to lunch with this, with one of the. I'm not really friends with anymore. But he, he was like, like, you just don't ever feel like, weird, like putting stuff out.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'm like, no, man, that's him feeling like he couldn't do that. Yeah, he would worry about what the girl that he thinks is cute thinks. Right. He would worry about what his mom thinks.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

He would worry about what you would think about him for sure. Like, everything good in my life is based on the fact that I deeply care about people. Right. But not their subjective opinions about me. Yes, I deeply care about people. Even strangers or acquaintances that are becoming strangers become acquaintances. Acquaintances become friends. Be friends.

[Nick Cassano]

Boom, there it is.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And. And most of all, back to Mike, Boyd and Dustin's on this journey. And you'll get there over time. And then friends become fucking family.

[Nick Cassano]

Amen. It's nobody's business. It's not your business what other people think of you. And that's something that's always stuck in

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

my head so weird.

[Nick Cassano]

It's just not your business.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I just really want to have this combo while we're on it. Like, please explain to me what somebody saying your shit actually means. It means actually nothing, right?

[Nick Cassano]

Like, actually, yeah, no, it literally means absolutely nothing.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, absolutely nothing.

[Joe Gatto]

Well, I will say this though. Don't you think, like, I mean, we all have confidants, right? So if you are in. Because I feel like sometimes there is that fine line not caring what people think versus caring what people think who care about you. And I think you have to look about where a place that comes from. Because I've been in different places.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

There's a fine line of not being delusional. I'm not sitting here saying I hate when people say, like, I'm trying to be a little bit better about, like other people's opinions don't matter. Actually, they do matter. Like, I use people's feedback, confidants or strangers, by the way, for me, Neil Cut comp and salsa chick Linda. Like, their opinion does matter to me. Like, do they think I'm too abrasive? Do they think I'm awesome? Do they think like it I. I use it as feedback, but I can't internalize it for sure as the thing that gives me validation for my life. By the way, the key for me is not accepting the accolades. The reason I think I do well with negativity is because I don't believe when people call me great.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'm just in the middle.

[Nick Cassano]

I think one of the things. Because in the world of what we do, like, everybody's a critic. And, And. And what I've come to realize. And, like, even. Even though, like, if you're secure in yourself, like, I, Like, I would say, like, if everyone at this table is pretty secure in themselves. But there are times where you. You do question, like on the. On the journey up. Like, I'm sure when you were coming up and when you were doing your thing, like, I. I've developed this analogy called the dinner table. And so I get six chairs at my dinner table. I pick six people. When people come to me, and they either say, like, you should do this, you should do that. I don't like this. I like that. I think to myself, are you sitting at my dinner table? If you're not, I'll take what you say. But again, I'm not going to internalize it. So for me, that's been super valuable in the whole. Because when you're. When you're out there every day, like, people are getting perceptions of you and, like, who you are.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Nick Cassano]

And if you try and live up to that expectation of what you think it is, you're not. You're not being you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I, you know, I also think it starts at home of how, like, for me, one of the reasons I also don't struggle that much with. With judgment is I don't judge. I've been paying attention to a lot of people that are struggling with it. I'm like, oh, right, yeah. You're in the business. You spend all day going through the feed and judging people, too. You're judging people, which is why you're vulnerable to judgment. I don't know these people. I don't even know Dustin and Boyd like that. These are guys I really know, but I don't really know. I know some nuances, but I haven't been in their home 30, 50, 100 times.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It's not like I've had, like, I'm not having a monthly dinner for two hours with them. Like, so, like, if I don't know fucking people that are in my inner circle, I definitely don't know anybody.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, I don't think anybody really knows anybody besides themselves. Even your parents and your siblings. I think when I'm about to say, will hit for all of us, you know that not a person on earth knows absolutely everything.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Every one of us right now has some shit that we know about ourselves that we know not one person on Earth. There is not one person on earth that fully knows you besides yourself.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah, sure.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And so people are just sitting out here judging people 247 because it's become a fucking national pastime.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Which is why they're fucking susceptible to judgment. I'm on some. Here's my judgment. Back to the joke you made. And I know that we connect on this because I see you, see me, and I'm very grateful for it. Here's my judgment. I just hope you're good.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, I struggle seeing anyone in my feed. You should see me at the airport. Like, I just want to talk to everyone. I love people. I hope you're good. Life is amazing and at times hard. I cheer for people. It's the format of this show. What do I want on this show? That these 800 people and these 80,000 people that listen this week start liking you more? Start listening to music, watch your videos, go to your show. Like, if you're not leaving positive deposits, what the fuck are you doing?

[Joe Gatto]

Right.

[Nick Cassano]

Do you think, though, that's because of the things that you pull value to, like, as a human being? Like, the things that you find valuable, maybe?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You mean like the New York Jets?

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah, the New York Jets.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Not buying them. I mean, like, watching them.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah, like the New York. Well, I mean, you are fucking nuts.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Back in J. I find value in one place. Kindness.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I find value in, like, the warmth of knowing that if I'm struggling for a period of time, that if I can call Brandon Warnicke or my mom, I'll be good in a second. Because those are go to people for me, where I know if I call, it's gonna be a smile, and I'm that for the world.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah. My mother used to say all the time, watch how people treat old people and animals. And that's all, you know, how their heart is. Like, mom made the whole thing. She was like, kindness speak. She was Italian. No, she passed. Yeah. Yeah. I feel the same way.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Well, yeah, you feel more than I do. You know, I actually have a weird relationship with animals. I actually resent. That's a clip. I have a real statement here. It's a very. My team always tells me not to bring this up. They're always scared that it's gonna be clipped out of context.

[Nick Cassano]

Uh.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Oh. I resent the way humans blindly treat animals and not each other.

[Nick Cassano]

Mm.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It pisses me off. I don't know what else to say. I wish the world treated each other.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

The Way that the just happened is that this Google screen. I think you had double, like, fingers or something. The is the thing. I thought it was broken. Let me finish this thought. It's incredibly important. We are. You see a dog, you're just like, oh, pure love.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

We see humans, and most people have fear when they see a stranger.

[Dina Ayata]

I feel like I'm very scared of. Of animals.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Me too.

[Dina Ayata]

Like, but.

[Joe Gatto]

Wow.

[Dina Ayata]

Yeah. But I think it's important to. To really, like, have that bond with a. With animals, too. Like, the same way you have a bond with people. Like, should treat everybody the same way.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But people. People are comfortable with animals because they can't talk back.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah, exactly.

[Joe Gatto]

Oh, they don't feel like they're judging them.

[Nick Cassano]

Exactly.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's right. Humans are petrified of other humans. They deep. Like, let's play it. Let's go around the horn.

[Nick Cassano]

All right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

What's your general vibe when you meet strangers or new people? Like, how do you. How does it usually play out? Cautious. You know, trust is earned. Give. Like, how do you kind of roll when you meet people?

[Dina Ayata]

I'm very real talk.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, real vulnerable. Real talk. Like, from all three of you. I fucking mean it. Cause I want value out of this show, like, for y', all, but also for the audience. What is your default when you meet people?

[Dina Ayata]

Honestly, I feel like I don't trust very easily. I always. I always. When I meet people, I always have good energy. Like, I smile and I make sure that they. Like, my first impression is always very important. But I can't trust you right away. Like, I gotta know you. I gotta talk to you, communicate with you, to know what type of person you. You are. And from there on, like, we got to build up our relationship. But I think it's very important to also not think negative, negatively about other people right away. And don't judge.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Right. So it's not that you feel negative, but it's a neutral with a caution because you want to make. Because trust is important.

[Dina Ayata]

Exactly. Okay.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah.

[Joe Gatto]

I think it depends on my mind space.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Okay. You're in.

[Joe Gatto]

Reflects directly.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Makes sense, by the way. That's everyone directly.

[Joe Gatto]

Like, if I. And also, like, if I'm with my family, like, I'm super protective, like my kids, because everybody always liked strangers. Taking pictures of my kids is weird. Like, I was. Everybody always wants a picture, as you know it is. And I always get super. Like, I go into dad mode. And sometimes I just have to explain I'm being a father right now, not a, you know, famous. I'm with My kid right now, that kind of thing. So they do that. Most do. Some don't, but most do. And then again, that's not my problem. That's theirs. Like, that's what I'm doing. I have to worry about my kid, my daughter, my son.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And, you know, like, I'm going through it now. Like, what you never think about is, like, most. I've come to learn most kids that have someone who's a parent of notoriety hate it.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Hate.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

They don't think it's cool. They think it blows.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

They don't want people to like them because of you.

[Joe Gatto]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

They don't want. They don't want people taking the time away from them and you in the limited time you have.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah. For the. But for the most part, I'm there to make. Like, I truly believe I live to make people laugh. I'm here to make people smile. So for the most part, I'm there. Unless I'm running for a plane, I'm late. But overall, I think that. And I think people get that from me too. But I'm just in a weird place because people. I've been on TV 10 years.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

They've seen.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah, they've seen me.

[Joe Gatto]

I wasn't playing a character. So they feel like they know me.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Joe Gatto]

You know, it's like. It's like I come in a different way. But that, I think, really depends on where I'm at.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah, I think. I think I try to control the controllable. So, like, for me, I'm not. I'm not concerned about the person's reaction. I just know that I can control my own energy, and I'm huge on energy. So, like, I'll put as much good as I can out there, even on days. And I used to say, all the time, like, during the pandemic, like, discipline is. Is a thing that you do with, like, if you're trying to accomplish something. But I also think discipline is a thing that you. You do when you treat people. So, like, even if I'm not feeling 100, I try and give. Even if I gotta, like, force it out. Yeah, give it out. Because I do feel like the universe is gonna reciprocate that energy back. Like, my godmother always used to say, be the energy that you wish to attract. So I just try and be consistent with that. If somebody's not feeling it, bro, I

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

love you for this. Like, on Real Talk. And honestly, you know what's so funny? I used to be on the track of, like, fuck em. But I didn't mean it. Right. You know where I'm at. It's not fuck them. It's actually, I'm in full. I feel bad.

[Nick Cassano]

Yes.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

My compassion. The compassionate catfish is here. Actually. Let's open these packs. We're doing the be friends part now.

[Nick Cassano]

Ooh, nice to see that.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Oh, I'm excited right now. Hold on. It's huge. They just traded packs. I want to see who got him real quick. I want my instincts. I caught him off guard. Yeah, I like that. All right, all right. What I want you to do is go through these V friends, look at all your cards, and decide which character you most associate with. You getting glasses?

[Joe Gatto]

You ready for this?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah. Here it is.

[Nick Cassano]

There he is.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

By the way, I'm going through it too, brother. Dude, I'm, like, getting close. I'm going to have to do. Oh, I got my favorite. Literally, I got my favorite underrated character. Here's some alpha for be friends. I'm getting serious about developing this character. I just got.

[Joe Gatto]

I got a Polish poodle.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You pulled a good one. She pulled a shiny. Oh, it's a rare one. No, no, but look at the names.

[Nick Cassano]

We're picking one. Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Pick one character that most represents you. But you know what's funny? Back to compassionate catfish. Being here, I was never fuck them. I was always, like, first. In youth, I was like, they don't matter. Like, no peer pressure. Didn't feel it. Now, in my older age, when someone's coming with the wrong energy, to me especially, I'm like, you. I come out the gate, like, fucking fire hose across the street.

[Dina Ayata]

Yeah.

[Nick Cassano]

100%.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And love. I'm always trying to make people feel comfort. Yep. Because I'm so comfortable, and I know most people aren't comfortable. So I'm trying to make the whole scene comfortable. If someone's really not about that towards me, I go into like, my God, I just came in here and love bombed the fuck out of this room. Went humble. Especially now that I have, like, notoriety now. My. Like, I did this when I was 19, and no one on earth knew who the fuck I was. And it would work as a good thing for people. Now you carry some reputation, so it's even double reps. Everyone's like, oh, okay, cool. So now if I see darkness to that, I'm like, that person is in a deep, bad place. And, like, I need to, like, double down and try to get them out.

[Nick Cassano]

I go, like, why? Like, why? Like, what has gotten you to this?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I usually think it's, like, real Fucked up shit. Yeah, right. You know, like, by the way, just, like, talking about real life. Back to gratitude, everybody. Big shout out to everybody here. Western Jack, what's good? Good since 82. First time chat. Let's clap it up for good since 82.

[Joe Gatto]

All right, there you go.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

All my intuition is they were born in 82, so find that awesome. But Podcast Twitch. Who's watching live? If you're listening to the podcast, go to garyvee.com twitch subscribe up. Make sure you catch us live in the future. My big thing now, though, is like, look, for example, real talk. I had a 6 to 7pm meeting today with a journalist, literally, because Joe was. I don't know if you guys know this Twitch. I don't know if you know this podcast. We listen. Joe was so inappropriately late, right. And made this episode much shorter. If you're watching right now, you're like, wait a minute, most are 60 minutes. Why is this only 35? That's Joe. It's all Joe's fault. But because of Joe being so wildly late.

[Joe Gatto]

We had a great conversation.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

We did. But. But I got. I got to see this text from my admins. This. This meeting is canceled tonight because she's on a plane right this second to Chicago because her mom had a heart attack. Like, I don't think people understand how life actually works. We're worried about all this dumb shit and real life shit. Real life shit is happening. Since we've done this podcast, ungodly amounts of tragic things have happened in the world. And I don't see that as dark. I see that as my God. I'm so grateful that that hasn't happened to my inner circle yet.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yet Nobody lives to 100 without heartbreak.

[Joe Gatto]

Yes.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah.

[Joe Gatto]

You know, for sure, nobody comes out.

[Nick Cassano]

But that's the thing too, though. Like, if you're in the landscape that we're on, you're putting out, so people are just seeing the product. But, like, day to day, I mean, it's. I mean, I don't know how it is for everyone, but I'm by myself creating ideas, wearing all these different hats. I mean, I got a team now that they helped me. I'm so grateful for. But, like, we're human beings at the end of the day, too.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

So I come down. Just a joke. President 2024. I'm sorry to interrupt you. Brother Joe, are you willing to announce your presidential run right here on Podcast with Friends? Sure, let's do it. How many votes do you think you're gonna get?

[Joe Gatto]

Seven. Team Present company not included. I got two in this room. I don't know. I'm still working on you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Are you out of your fucking mind?

[Nick Cassano]

You show up late to the campaign.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Let's go. Which character out of the V friends you pulled most spoke to you?

[Dina Ayata]

I got.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Ooh, I love this.

[Dina Ayata]

I got tough to beat a worm from the dirt.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

There is a worm in Vee friends whose name is tough to beat a worm from the dirt. Why did that connect with you?

[Dina Ayata]

I wanted to ask you, like, can you explain?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I can, but why did it associate on your first reaction? What hit you? You like worms or.

[Nick Cassano]

I do.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I fight with worms too.

[Dina Ayata]

You like worms and flowers? Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Oh, the flower.

[Nick Cassano]

I like worms, yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'll explain this really simple. This is one of. Truly one of. There's 283 characters. This is. Oh, I'm sorry. This is literally, literally, genuinely one of my favorite characters. See if I get the light here.

[Joe Gatto]

There you go.

[Nick Cassano]

Boom.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

So let me tell you why I love this character. I feel like this is me and I feel like it's all the people I fuck with. I believe that if you're lucky enough to be born into humble environments and you have love around you, you become undefeated. That you know that. I think there's incredible vulnerability with privilege at youth. And it leads to a lot of the things I think about, which is insecurity and confidence. When you come from the dirt, you know what life feels like when you don't have stuff and fame and money and fancy things and even the toughest upbringings have many days of happiness in that dirt. And I think it gives you a better perspective of life. Like, I just think that that worm, it's kind of like. I mean, I'm gonna go actually even deeper. This is an alpha story. Growing up, I used to play with worms a lot. We were 80s kids. We were like, this is just what we did in New Jersey. And then I just like the dirt. And then I thought about dirt and worm. And I think a lot of kids, there's 10, 15, 19, 16, 7, 9, 10, 13 and even 20, 30, 40 year olds right now who don't give themselves enough credit for their resilience.

[Joe Gatto]

Oh, sure.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And resilience is required.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Nick Cassano]

One hundred and anything and anything resilience is required.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

So the worm is one of my favorite characters. I'm a big fan. I'm glad you picked that Joey.

[Joe Gatto]

I went with polished poodle.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Please tell me why you're so sad. Because when I look at you, the last thing I think about is Polish.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah. But the first thing you think about is poodle. I'm a dog guy. I mean I have, I have a, you know, a non profit around dogs, old dogs. So gather Pups and Friends. Shout out to the.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Shout out that. Let's do that again as fast. Shout out the URL so people can go and maybe.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah. Ghetto. Pups and Friends is our nonprofit. Launch last year. Yeah. That's a dot com. That's not an official. Let's see how to find some friends.com or on Instagram at ghatto. Pups and Friends, it's our nonprofit. We started last year. Mostly senior and unwanted dogs. At our 57th adoption last week. Cinnamon roll the home. So it was great. But I'm a dog guy. I love dogs and I feel like I'm a little polished right now because I did some real self work over the past couple years.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'm proud of you.

[Joe Gatto]

So I think. I feel like I'm a little in this stage of me right now. So that's proud to me. So awesome.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Nikki.

[Nick Cassano]

I got the principled praying mantis. Okay. I picked that because I wouldn't be where I am today without principle. Because I think you talk about growing up in. In humble beginnings, growing up like we were very fortunate. Like I had a roof over my head. I had a loving family. But I also had a father that worked every day. Yeah. And when he worked every day like he was a leader and like leader, they when, when there's a natural born leader, it's action. It's not telling you. Like he just got up and fucking went. Not preaching, it's putting, it's 100%. And whenever I wanted to do something, whenever I wanted to accomplish something, he instilled in me that you have to work for what you get. And so being that I didn't really necessarily come out of the mud, but when I was nine years old, painting my whole fucking fence back to front.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You know, it's funny. Let's talk about that. There's a lot of kids that grow up in middle class, upper middle class and even occasionally wealthy families.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That the parents are just like this. And like, you know, yes, we're not poor, but like we're not giving you money after 10. And so like you want money 10.

[Nick Cassano]

If I wanted Madden, it was go watch each windows, $5 of the car. The whole thing. So I think your dad taught you instilling those principles in me.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I love it.

[Nick Cassano]

And seeing principals be expressed has led me to.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's a rookie Card, too. There's series one. As you can see, these white backs right here where. Those are my original.

[Nick Cassano]

Those are sick.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah, those are my original drawings. But this is series two.

[Nick Cassano]

That's your original. I'm sorry, G. That's your original drawing.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I drew that. I drew. You were.

[Nick Cassano]

You weren't kidding with the. No. Artist.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

No, you. Bro. What about. Look at this. That's.

[Nick Cassano]

You drew that.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

All right, that. That's. I don't even know what that is.

[Joe Gatto]

Making it side by side.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Wait a minute, wait a minute. I'm about to. Really with you.

[Nick Cassano]

Okay, go ahead.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You. I drew this, and this is fresh. Wow.

[Nick Cassano]

Wow.

[Joe Gatto]

All right. Respect.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Respect.

[Nick Cassano]

Okay, but hold on, hold on.

[Joe Gatto]

Then you also drew this.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Exactly. That's a jolly shotgun. What is that like, Honestly?

[Nick Cassano]

What is.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's your worst nightmare. That's gonna come to your house. Your. I think I'm gonna be scared of that, is what I'm saying. Yeah. Yeah.

[Nick Cassano]

Maybe. Maybe you took a couple art classes in between.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

All right, let me give you mine.

[Nick Cassano]

Okay.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

The tenacious termite word. Oh, is that your favorite?

[Joe Gatto]

Tenacious. My favorite. What am I saying?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Obsessed with tenacity. Like, again, back to, like, what I think everyone's trying to do here. And by the way, you said something earlier about, like, the concept of it being an emotional thing, not a physical thing. I don't recall the. What the reference was, but that's how I think about tenacity, you know? Like, I. I think the emotional success that. I think everybody who's watching right now are listening. I think this is probably the most interesting thing that I'm personally working on. I've been in the lab, and that means in my head.

[Nick Cassano]

Mm.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Shower, flights, driving. It's the best. It's the lab. It's the actual fucking lab. Right. That's how you get. I've been in the lab, and all I'm thinking about is if I can market to the world the redefining of success to be peace of mind and smiling.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Instead of fucking stuff. I could leave the biggest impact of all time. And I don't know why one wouldn't try.

[Joe Gatto]

Totally.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And so I just. I think tenacity is an incredible trait, but it's. But it's the tenacity not to go on tour every day or make music every day or be an entrepreneur, build content. It's the tenacity to fight for calm.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah. That's what I'll try.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Emotional.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah. 100%.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

No.

[Nick Cassano]

100%. And I think, too, like, when you get to the place where. Because social media is great but it's also a dangerous place because there's so many people telling you what they think you should do. Even if, even if you're so deep rooted in who you are. And a lot of people are trying to define what success is and what they think your success should be. And like if you kind of tune into that, it could be a dangerous place.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

By the way, Nikki, on that I know people have this take on social. I will say this pre social that my issue was you only had a couple of voices.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Your parents define success. Right. You were stuck in that two person game for sure. Whereas now all these other voices to your point, there's unlimited garbage.

[Nick Cassano]

Yes.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But if you try to find the gold, there's more gold out there than way we grew up. We didn't have these voices for sure. There was none of us.

[Joe Gatto]

And you also get, you get the world instead of your neighborhood. Right? Think about the circle of people that are influencing you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Talk to me about some. I'm going to end with dreams. Tell me a dream you have. We've gone deep. You could make it far more light. I'd rather it actually be a little more selfish than the selfless talk we just did like a fun thing like winning an Academy Award or like you know, you're so young in the journey compared to us old guys. We're young. By the way, anybody under 90 is young. 92 year olds. I apologize. Where you at? What's a dream of yours at this point?

[Dina Ayata]

I have a lot of dreams because

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

break them down, shoot them.

[Dina Ayata]

I have the vision but I want to, I want to get nominated for, for the Grammy Awards next year. I see myself winning a Grammy soon.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah.

[Dina Ayata]

I believe in my dreams all that's why everything I speak into exist.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Why do. What do you, what do you value? Soon.

[Dina Ayata]

Soon. Because I, I believe like I can make it work soon.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Do you feel like wanting it soon potentially has any impact on your output? I'll tell you where I'm going. I'm worried about soon because for me it's like if you win a Grammy in seven years you're a child and that's fresh and amazing and I think it takes a little pressure off your chest because when you put soon or fast on sometimes changes the things people do because they think they need to achieve it in a window to put an ideology on a pedestal. Thoughts?

[Dina Ayata]

No. Yeah. I feel like soon for me means whenever God is handing it to me. Whenever. Like God's plan. Like it'll come whenever it'll come.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

So fight for it as fast as possible. Because that's the tenacity. But you're chill if you get it in 19 years, not in 19 weeks.

[Dina Ayata]

Yeah.

[Joe Gatto]

Put the work in now.

[Dina Ayata]

Yeah, right. Yeah, exactly. I just want to make it work. I just want to, like, I honestly, like, I always take my time with everything. I just dropped an ep. I took my time with that too. It came together very organically. I wasn't forcing it. I was like. I think it was God telling me, like right now, Dina, is your time to put it out there. So other than the Grammy, I want

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

to work you like intuition.

[Dina Ayata]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You go with it or do you overthink it? Like when what you feel in your stomach does your brain have say, is it a partner to your stomach or does it actually overrule your stomach?

[Dina Ayata]

It used to. Cause I used to overthink a lot. But right now I really just go with my intuition. Like I trust my gut feeling. So whatever my gut feels. Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I feel like God's plan is a cousin to the intuitive stomach.

[Nick Cassano]

I'm all in touch.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It's a tag team. Yeah. I think it's the biggest miss in society right now. I think we've over rationalized in the last hundred years and that if you go back 100 years, there was unlimited people walking around of like, you know, like evil eye and stomach and. And I think, I think intuition is underrated.

[Joe Gatto]

Yep.

[Dina Ayata]

It really is.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah, I agree with that. I think you got to go with, I mean, everybody. You're your own compass, you know, because

[Nick Cassano]

you know that feeling, you know the feeling when it's right.

[Joe Gatto]

You're accountable for your own.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah. Right.

[Joe Gatto]

So it all falls on you.

[Nick Cassano]

100.

[Joe Gatto]

I think that's part of it, you know?

[Dina Ayata]

Exactly.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Keep talking amongst yourself. I'm trying to buy more time in the podcast.

[Joe Gatto]

Okay.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Keep building on that.

[Joe Gatto]

Well, I would See the thing about. It's funny because, like, I think it's also a young thing too because like when I was 19 years old.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah.

[Joe Gatto]

You know, and I look where I am now at 47. So different. Right. Like it took me. I'm an 18 year overnight success. It took me as almost a year older than you. Right. To make it like I was doing improv in little buildings, you know, so you gotta. You gotta really take your time with it too, which is good. But I love that as long as you put the work in, I think that's what's important.

[Nick Cassano]

But I love how you said 18 year overnight success because like, it looks

[Joe Gatto]

overnight where these guys come from, and

[Nick Cassano]

you don't realize all the work you're putting in behind the scenes. And nobody sees it. Nobody does it. What's done in the dark, one day comes to the light. Yeah. And when you. When. When it happens, it's like everybody. Oh, overnight. No, I've been 18 years. Like, the whole. The whole way here, I've been. I've been working.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But let's get a question or two from Twitch. Twitch, what do you got? I agree. Dina is a superstar. This is gonna be fun. This is gonna be a lot of fun to watch in, like, nine years. Like, and be like, she was in our office.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah, right. Like, you know, I remember Joe. We miss him. Rest in peace.

[Nick Cassano]

That ain't even right. I hate that.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Don't do.

[Nick Cassano]

Don't even put it out.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I don't like that.

[Nick Cassano]

Don't even put that. Does that all the time. I'm like, no, stop.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Grandmas are supposed to do that. That's a leverage. Yeah. Like, if you don't listen

[Nick Cassano]

one day,

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'm gonna not be here.

[Joe Gatto]

You're gonna do it while I'm here. You're gonna miss me when I'm gone.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Eat the meatballs forever. 16:20. Let's go with you, Nikki, because you're so early in your career. What's your biggest takeaway so far from your career? Will Joe Gotto be at VCON next year, August 8th to the 11th in LA? Want to come up and, like, make some people laugh?

[Joe Gatto]

Do. I'm there.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

All right. We're going to work on it.

[Joe Gatto]

I'm actually. Yeah, I'm not touring then.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

All right, we're going to figure that out. At this point, you're two seconds in, but at this point, your single biggest takeaway from this career you have as a emerging public figure that you wouldn't have thought the day before you posted that first TikTok, you didn't see it coming. You're like, oh, shit. This

[Nick Cassano]

fear is afraid of you too.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Interesting. Break that down.

[Nick Cassano]

And if you, like, fear is like. Like, has so much control, but it's the same feeling as happiness. So if you run at, like, nobody runs from happiness. Fear is deathly afraid of the day where you turn around and be like, I'm not afraid of you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It's funny.

[Nick Cassano]

And then it loses all power.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It's.

[Nick Cassano]

And you could be afraid and do all these. Like, I've given. I've done a ton of scared out of my mind, but I'm still me because I'm not gonna let fear beat me. And I think, you know, like, for the past three years, I've been afraid in multiple occasions. But my godmother told me, you know, you have to embrace every emotion, but you can't be every emotion. So when. When I do feel fear, I'm just like, all right, well, I'm afraid, but I'm still gonna do what they're not meant to do.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It's. It's so funny. It's literally incredibly similar to one of my favorite quotes for myself that I say occasionally, but I say to myself all the time, which is, fear is fake. It's a. Yeah, it's fake as fear hangs out with Santa Claus.

[Joe Gatto]

Wait a minute. Wait. What are you saying?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'm saying, oh, my God. This reminds me of something that I got to tell you. You know what? Do you know when I stopped telling jokes? Fourth grade. Do you know why?

[Joe Gatto]

Why?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Denise Laurie, if you're out there, big shout out. Denise Laurie was my sister's best friend, okay, in first, in kind of. She was in kindergarten. I was in fourth. My sister was in first grade. We come home from school, we're all. This is 80s, like, all outside chilling.

[Nick Cassano]

It wasn't even a dog.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It was the best. You were just outside constantly living. Parents knew. There's parents right now that have trackers on their kids. In College, I was 6. My mom had no clue where the I was. I was in the neighborhood somewhere.

[Nick Cassano]

Different world, though, guys. You know, Same super.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Bingo.

[Nick Cassano]

All right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

They fucking tricked you. Yeah, it's fucking safer, all right? With all these phones and everything. Kidnappers are like, fuck this shit, right? What's AMBER Alert?

[Joe Gatto]

Somebody had to see you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It's so safer to see you. That's. It's 10 times safer. It's just that the news became a business. And selling fear, which is fake, fucking works anyway, Joe, last time I told the joke. So I hear this joke, it fucking rips all day. In fourth grade, I'm killing people. They're like, you're the fucking. You're Richard Pryor. I'm like, I'm Richard Pryor. I'm fucking killing it. I come home and I tell this joke to my crew. Robbie Turnick, Marissa Bird, Andy Greco, Denise Lori. Big shout out, giving all the shout. Eric Godfrey, Ellen Godfrey. I'm like, gang, let me fucking. I'm on my way. I'm gonna be a practical joker in the future. I'm that guy. Like, here's the joke, all right? If the Tooth fairy, the Easter Bunny, and Santa Claus were In a room. And I threw a quarter in the middle of the room. Who would get it? No one. Cause there's no such thing as the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus, and the Easter Bunny.

[Nick Cassano]

So I tell this joke.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Everyone's dying laughing, except Denise.

[Joe Gatto]

Laurie starts crying because you dropped the truth bomb on that ass.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Because she still believes. It gets worse. It gets worse.

[Joe Gatto]

Oh, father came to see you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Worse. At the door. Worse. Where is he? Ding dong.

[Nick Cassano]

Oh, shit.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Get to the. Get to the door. Denise's mom, who is literally, may she rest in peace, one of the greatest women I ever met in my life. You want to talk about sweetness, Sweetness again, back to 80s, all the moms.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah, right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

By the way, you want to talk about how different shit was in 1985. If you got fresh or did some wrong shit in the neighborhood and you were on your friend's lawn, their mom could smack you.

[Nick Cassano]

Yeah, for sure.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I was smacked by women that were not my mom. And I said, thank you very much. I'm sorry.

[Joe Gatto]

I'm sorry. Apologize to them.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah. Imagine that shit happening now.

[Nick Cassano]

Nah, come on, now. Nah, I can't.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But I ruined her life. She came over, and nothing hurts more than. And I was a. I was a good leader in the neighborhood. She just looked me dead in the face and she said, I'm disappointed. Honestly. I can't even tell you what's going on in my body. I never told this story. It was devastating. Anyway, I don't know if you know this, but Santa's fake, okay?

[Joe Gatto]

There's just all people crying in the chat, and.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And fear hangs out with Santa. Fear is fake. Fear is some shit you made up, and we need to get the fucking shit out of the system. Because right now, unfortunately, if you want to know what's going on in the world, it's that fear is on fire. It has momentum. It is on fire. Politicians have weaponized it. Parents have weaponized it. School systems have weaponized it. Humans have weaponized it. Young generations have weaponized it. On old generations. It is the weapon of choice, and I fucking hate it more than anything on Earth. I fucking hate fear as much as I hate Bill Belichick.

[Nick Cassano]

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[Gary Vaynerchuk]

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[Joe Gatto]

That's a lot.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah.

[Nick Cassano]

Drop that mic. I think we were talking about dreams.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah. I want to. I want to own a pony.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

HBCU set grad said Gary, tell me more about becoming a full time streamer. I said the this the other day. I'm very real on this. I think what I'm doing right now, everyone, for me, I don't have time. If I was 22 I would get in front of a camera and stream all day. It is very clear to me that live is the opportunity right now for all three of you. I couldn't push you more enough to do TikTok live all day long. All day long. Brushing your teeth, driving, you know, make pretend you're late on the train to a meeting. Like whatever you're up to in life.

[Joe Gatto]

I drove by the way I drove.

[Nick Cassano]

You drove your own car?

[Joe Gatto]

Drove my car. Good for you.

[Nick Cassano]

I do it all the time.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I just really, really, really think that live and so anyway, what did I mean? I mean that I really genuinely believe that streaming is a huge platform. People are interested in people.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You don't have to put on a show. I don't have to give a keynote. I'm about to stop this and go on mute. And you guys are gonna watch. People are gonna watch in the background me going on with my day. And that's interesting because it's an insight because I can tell you this 16 year old me would have looked up to Gary Vee and would have thought it was cool to see how he does his day. I'm like, okay. Like I didn't.

[Nick Cassano]

I bet to me like I'm huge on watching people being observant and watching how people move. So if I, if I take the bushes. Yeah, I got binoculars, I got the whole thing. But like I've, I've pushes, I've.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Nikki lives in the bushes.

[Nick Cassano]

No, I do. No, no, no. Like I'm watching everything.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's great.

[Nick Cassano]

And so like when I see that, like, when I watch people work, I take what I can, and I almost like. And that's the thing. And that's why, like, I'm so blessed to be living in this area is like, there's so much free fucking game out there. You just got to pay attention.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah.

[Nick Cassano]

And you just got to look for it. And you just got to have the hunger, Blondie.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I need to get rid of my fear of the camera. My friends, if someone says you're not attractive, they're a piece of shit.

[Joe Gatto]

Yeah, for sure.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, I don't know what else to say. Like, can we just. Can we make you like this one? Like, I don't know what.

[Nick Cassano]

I don't.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, if someone comes on your platform and comes to you, they come to your home.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Your page is your home.

[Joe Gatto]

Yep.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And they don't take off the shoes and they look you in the face and say, you're ugly. They are a piece.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Of for sure.

[Nick Cassano]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's how we're ending show. Thank you, guys. Thank you.

[Joe Gatto]

Thank you.

[Nick Cassano]

Thank you,

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Everybody. If you enjoyed this podcast, please go back and look at the prior episodes. They're loaded. I appreciate your attention, and thanks for being part of this journey. See you later.