The GaryVee Audio Experience

Episode: Why “And” is the Answer: How to Create Content Outside of Your “Niche”
Date: January 20, 2026
Host: Gary Vaynerchuk
Guest: Kayla (owner of Sweat fitness app, major influencer in female fitness)

Episode Overview

This episode centers around the challenge of evolving as a content creator and public persona—specifically, how to break out of a single “niche” without alienating your audience or diminishing your brand. Gary sits down with Kayla, renowned for her global fitness app and massive personal brand as a trainer, to discuss strategies and share lessons from his own career arc (“Gary the wine guy” to entrepreneur and media mogul). The heart of the conversation is about why the “and” mentality (“you can be both/and, not just either/or”) is essential for sustained relevance, fulfillment, and growth in the digital age.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

From One-Dimensional Brands to Multifaceted Creators

Getting Boxed In by the Audience:
Gary and Kayla open the conversation by acknowledging how audiences frequently try to keep public figures in a box, with comments like “stay in your lane.”
- Notable Quote:
  - “When you have actual self esteem and you're a real person and you know what the fuck you're doing, you can't hear the outside noise... They said that to me too. Shut up and drink wine and spit it. What do you know about business?”
    — Gary (00:00, 03:51)
The Path from “Wine Guy” to Business Influencer:
Gary reflects on transitioning away from wine to business content, noting the criticism but emphasizing that truth and authenticity matter more than outside opinions.

The “And” Mentality: Content Expansion

Embracing New Topics Without Fear:
Gary prescribes a simple, actionable approach: just begin creating content on new topics. Expect an initial dip in engagement but prioritize long-term authenticity over short-term metrics.
- Notable Quote:
  - “The game is about ‘and.’ Everybody got taught the wrong thing, which is stay in your lane, niche. Don't confuse the audience. It's all wrong.”
    — Gary (07:10)
- Advice to Kayla:
  - “The only brave thing you need to do… is you need to start making content that at first will not get as many views.”
    — Gary (02:21)
Let Go of ‘The Precious Grid’ and Short-Term Data:
Creators must be willing to release perfectionism (the “precious grid” of a carefully curated feed) and not let view counts dictate direction.

Personal Fulfillment Over External Validation

Happiness as the Compass:
Both discuss the necessity of following what feels right to you, not what your audience demands.
- Notable Quote:
  - “The only thing you should be thinking about is what makes you happy. And when you do those things… it's going to compound.”
    — Gary (11:38–12:04)
Freedom to Iterate and Change:
If a new direction doesn’t feel as expected, pivot again. The power lies in experimentation and self-direction.
- Notable Quote:
  - “You may do it for six months and be like, meh, I don't want to do that. It's not as cool as I had it in my mind. And then you get to do something else.”
    — Gary (14:29)

Overcoming Critics and Internal Obstacles

Ignoring Anonymous Criticism:
Gary recommends not internalizing negative feedback from strangers—“It's Sally Pants 49. It's not your mom.” (08:51)
People-Pleasing and Enablement:
Both admit to tendencies as people pleasers, but recognize setting personal boundaries is essential for personal and creative growth.

Gender, Human, and Niche Expectations

Niche Policing Affects Everyone:
Kayla suggests women face particular pressure, but Gary argues that “niche police” comments are universal to all creators.
- Notable Quote:
  - “They do it to men in general. It’s a human thing.”
    — Gary (07:16–07:18)
Rarety and Opportunity for Female Founders:
Gary notes the unique hunger for female founder stories and diversity at the top, with a nod to his early investment in Canva and a significant recent exit by a female founder he supported (07:28).

Brand-Value and Endorsement Advice

High Standards Over Mass Deals:
Gary advises Kayla to approach sponsorships and deals with exclusivity and premium positioning, comparing her brand to luxury goods:
- Notable Quote:
  - “Treat yourself like a premium brand… You’re not an $8 candy bar. You’re a $4,000 handbag.”
    — Gary (09:57)

Personal Stories and Joy in Multiplicity

Authentic Passion as a Business Driver:
Gary shares why he still loves public speaking and content variety, even if it doesn't maximize financial ROI.
- Notable Quote:
  - “They still do not understand that I'm gonna die one day and I want to be happy... The literal answer is because I like it.”
    — Gary (13:14, 13:35)

Memorable Moments & Notable Quotes with Timestamps

On Audience Criticism:
“Shut up and drink wine and spit it. What do you know about business?”
— Gary (00:00, 03:51)
On Starting New Content:
“All you have to do is give up on two things: One, the short term data on views… And two, the precious grid.”
— Gary (02:21)
On the 'And' Mindset:
“What about the concept of ‘and,’ which is, you can do unlimited fitness content and unlimited business content and then pick a third thing.”
— Gary (06:48)
On Personal Fulfillment:
“The only thing you should be thinking about is what makes you happy.”
— Gary (11:38)
On Value and Endorsements:
“You’re not an $8 candy bar. You’re a $4,000 handbag.”
— Gary (09:57)
On Criticism from Strangers:
“It's Sally Pants 49. It's not your mom.”
— Gary (08:51)
On Experimenting and Pivoting:
“You may do it for six months and be like, meh… And then you get to do something else.”
— Gary (14:29)

Important Timestamps

[00:00] Dealing with critics about leaving your “lane”
[01:36] Kayla introduces her background and challenge
[02:11] Advice: Just start creating new content
[03:51] Gary on not listening to niche critics
[06:48] Explaining the 'And' philosophy for content creation
[07:16] “Niche police” affects everyone, regardless of gender
[09:57] Branding and endorsement standards
[11:38] Shifting from pleasing audience to pursuing happiness
[13:14] On finding personal fulfillment in work and life
[14:29] The ability and permission to pivot creatively

Conclusion

Gary’s core message: Success and fulfillment require the courage to expand, to experiment, and to ignore “stay in your lane” thinking from both audiences and internal doubts. Real growth is found in the embrace of “and”—in being many things, not just one. Both Gary and Kayla reinforce that happiness, truth, and value creation come from being authentic, not conforming to singular roles or external expectations.

The GaryVee Audio Experience

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points and Insights

From One-Dimensional Brands to Multifaceted Creators

Getting Boxed In by the Audience:
Gary and Kayla open the conversation by acknowledging how audiences frequently try to keep public figures in a box, with comments like “stay in your lane.”
- Notable Quote:
  - “When you have actual self esteem and you're a real person and you know what the fuck you're doing, you can't hear the outside noise... They said that to me too. Shut up and drink wine and spit it. What do you know about business?”
    — Gary (00:00, 03:51)
The Path from “Wine Guy” to Business Influencer:
Gary reflects on transitioning away from wine to business content, noting the criticism but emphasizing that truth and authenticity matter more than outside opinions.

The “And” Mentality: Content Expansion

Embracing New Topics Without Fear:
Gary prescribes a simple, actionable approach: just begin creating content on new topics. Expect an initial dip in engagement but prioritize long-term authenticity over short-term metrics.
- Notable Quote:
  - “The game is about ‘and.’ Everybody got taught the wrong thing, which is stay in your lane, niche. Don't confuse the audience. It's all wrong.”
    — Gary (07:10)
- Advice to Kayla:
  - “The only brave thing you need to do… is you need to start making content that at first will not get as many views.”
    — Gary (02:21)
Let Go of ‘The Precious Grid’ and Short-Term Data:
Creators must be willing to release perfectionism (the “precious grid” of a carefully curated feed) and not let view counts dictate direction.

Personal Fulfillment Over External Validation

Happiness as the Compass:
Both discuss the necessity of following what feels right to you, not what your audience demands.
- Notable Quote:
  - “The only thing you should be thinking about is what makes you happy. And when you do those things… it's going to compound.”
    — Gary (11:38–12:04)
Freedom to Iterate and Change:
If a new direction doesn’t feel as expected, pivot again. The power lies in experimentation and self-direction.
- Notable Quote:
  - “You may do it for six months and be like, meh, I don't want to do that. It's not as cool as I had it in my mind. And then you get to do something else.”
    — Gary (14:29)

Overcoming Critics and Internal Obstacles

Ignoring Anonymous Criticism:
Gary recommends not internalizing negative feedback from strangers—“It's Sally Pants 49. It's not your mom.” (08:51)
People-Pleasing and Enablement:
Both admit to tendencies as people pleasers, but recognize setting personal boundaries is essential for personal and creative growth.

Gender, Human, and Niche Expectations

Niche Policing Affects Everyone:
Kayla suggests women face particular pressure, but Gary argues that “niche police” comments are universal to all creators.
- Notable Quote:
  - “They do it to men in general. It’s a human thing.”
    — Gary (07:16–07:18)
Rarety and Opportunity for Female Founders:
Gary notes the unique hunger for female founder stories and diversity at the top, with a nod to his early investment in Canva and a significant recent exit by a female founder he supported (07:28).

Brand-Value and Endorsement Advice

High Standards Over Mass Deals:
Gary advises Kayla to approach sponsorships and deals with exclusivity and premium positioning, comparing her brand to luxury goods:
- Notable Quote:
  - “Treat yourself like a premium brand… You’re not an $8 candy bar. You’re a $4,000 handbag.”
    — Gary (09:57)

Personal Stories and Joy in Multiplicity

Authentic Passion as a Business Driver:
Gary shares why he still loves public speaking and content variety, even if it doesn't maximize financial ROI.
- Notable Quote:
  - “They still do not understand that I'm gonna die one day and I want to be happy... The literal answer is because I like it.”
    — Gary (13:14, 13:35)

Memorable Moments & Notable Quotes with Timestamps

On Audience Criticism:
“Shut up and drink wine and spit it. What do you know about business?”
— Gary (00:00, 03:51)
On Starting New Content:
“All you have to do is give up on two things: One, the short term data on views… And two, the precious grid.”
— Gary (02:21)
On the 'And' Mindset:
“What about the concept of ‘and,’ which is, you can do unlimited fitness content and unlimited business content and then pick a third thing.”
— Gary (06:48)
On Personal Fulfillment:
“The only thing you should be thinking about is what makes you happy.”
— Gary (11:38)
On Value and Endorsements:
“You’re not an $8 candy bar. You’re a $4,000 handbag.”
— Gary (09:57)
On Criticism from Strangers:
“It's Sally Pants 49. It's not your mom.”
— Gary (08:51)
On Experimenting and Pivoting:
“You may do it for six months and be like, meh… And then you get to do something else.”
— Gary (14:29)

Important Timestamps

[00:00] Dealing with critics about leaving your “lane”
[01:36] Kayla introduces her background and challenge
[02:11] Advice: Just start creating new content
[03:51] Gary on not listening to niche critics
[06:48] Explaining the 'And' philosophy for content creation
[07:16] “Niche police” affects everyone, regardless of gender
[09:57] Branding and endorsement standards
[11:38] Shifting from pleasing audience to pursuing happiness
[13:14] On finding personal fulfillment in work and life
[14:29] The ability and permission to pivot creatively

wavePod

Why “And” is the Answer: How to Create Content Outside of Your “Niche”

Summary

The GaryVee Audio Experience

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points and Insights

From One-Dimensional Brands to Multifaceted Creators

The “And” Mentality: Content Expansion

Personal Fulfillment Over External Validation

Overcoming Critics and Internal Obstacles

Gender, Human, and Niche Expectations

Brand-Value and Endorsement Advice

Personal Stories and Joy in Multiplicity

Memorable Moments & Notable Quotes with Timestamps

Important Timestamps

Conclusion

Transcript

Summary

The GaryVee Audio Experience

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points and Insights

From One-Dimensional Brands to Multifaceted Creators

The “And” Mentality: Content Expansion

Personal Fulfillment Over External Validation

Overcoming Critics and Internal Obstacles

Gender, Human, and Niche Expectations

Brand-Value and Endorsement Advice

Personal Stories and Joy in Multiplicity

Memorable Moments & Notable Quotes with Timestamps

Important Timestamps

Conclusion