Your Laziness is Trying to Tell You Something.

Summary

Podcast Summary: The GaryVee Audio Experience

Episode: "Your Laziness is Trying to Tell You Something."

Date: July 15, 2026
Host: Gary Vaynerchuk
Guest: Jimmy

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Episode Overview

This episode features Gary Vaynerchuk in a candid, fan-driven fireside chat with Jimmy, a listener who won the chance to appear on the show via Gary’s text platform giveaway. The conversation explores Jimmy’s journey, the evolution of technology and social media, the realities of life as an Uber/Lyft driver, and—centrally—the real meaning behind “laziness.” Gary challenges conventional ideas around lack of motivation, reframing it as a signpost for self-awareness and true interests, while giving actionable advice on content creation, personal branding, and the value of happiness over “hustle.” The episode is rich in practical insights, personal anecdotes, and trademark GaryVee energy.

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Key Discussion Points

1. The Backstory: How Jimmy Landed on the Show

• [00:01-03:32]
  • Jimmy won a guest spot after entering a text-platform Twitter giveaway.
  • He’s been following Gary since 2009, first seeing him on Chris Pirillo’s Ustream.
  • Jimmy’s early exposure to social media and tech paralleled Gary’s push for direct audience engagement, even before mainstream platforms caught on.
• Memorable Moment: Gary underscores his personal involvement with the Community texting platform, promising direct access in a world of free content.

2. Early Social Media & Customer Experience Stories

• [03:32-07:27]
  • Jimmy shares a 2010 story of using Twitter to make a Dunkin’ Donuts customer happy, despite resistance from management—a real-world application of Gary’s “Thank You Economy” philosophy.
  • Gary highlights the long road businesses have traveled (and still have to go) in embracing genuine customer care online.

3. Life as an Uber/Lyft Driver

• [10:07-13:24]
  • Jimmy drives full time in Alabama, appreciating the flexibility, but notes challenges (vehicle wear, fluctuating demand, economics vs. time).
  • The realities of content consumption for drivers: Jimmy prefers terrestrial radio and CDs over streaming/podcasts due to tech limitations.

4. Flipping & Side Hustles

• [13:24-14:02]
  • Jimmy has experience flipping thrift items on eBay (e.g., a $1 calculator sold for $70).
  • Gary pitches “flipping + ride-share driving” as a powerful combo for enterprising side income.

5. The Real Meaning of Laziness

• [14:02-17:16]
  • Jimmy admits he doesn’t flip more due to “laziness.”
  • Gary reframes laziness:

    “I actually think being lazy is a good thing. Let me explain…If you’re lazy, you’re actually giving yourself an indication that you don’t like it.” — Gary [14:28]

  • Emphasizes laziness as a clue toward what you’re not passionate about, and advocates using “laziness” for self-discovery, not self-blame.

6. Pursuing Authentic Passions

• [17:17-18:54]
  • Gary encourages listeners to view “laziness” as feedback, to stop apologizing, and to spend more time testing what excites them.

7. Sports Fandom & Identity

• [19:08-22:34]
  • Banter about Jimmy's regional sports loyalty (Red Sox, Bruins, Patriots) and Gary’s lifelong Jets dream.
  • Gary jokes about “manufacturing” Jets fandom in America to ensure his future ownership transforms cultural relevance.

8. Content Creation: 100 Pieces a Day & Personal Brand

• [23:12-27:44]
  • Jimmy asks how it’s possible for regular people to make 100 pieces of content a day.
  • Gary breaks it down:
    • Most can come from platforms like Twitter: retweets, reactions, original thoughts.
    • Content is “documenting vs. creating”: photos, daily snapshots, thoughts—let the audience decide what’s valuable.
    • Dismisses preciousness—volume and honesty trump over-curation.
    • “Take a photo of us talking right now and tweet it and be like, holy shit, I’m doing this with Gary Vee right now.” — Gary [26:01]

9. Building a Personal Brand vs. Niche Page

• [29:07-30:29]
  • Should Jimmy brand as “Birmingham Photographer” or just use his personal name?
  • Gary: Execution and quality matter more than the label.

    “Whether Google called itself Google or Schmoogle...it was the execution that made it okay.” — Gary [30:12]

10. Monetization and The Artist’s Path

• [31:08-32:50]
  • Jimmy is happy doing photography for himself, not as a service. Gary champions this, stating:

    “If you’re happy, you’ve won.” — Gary [33:08]

  • Personal sustainability should be built first; monetization or platform-building can emerge from genuine, public proof of passion.
  • Documenting “visiting every US county” is a unique journey that could attract sponsorship serendipitously.

11. Audience/Brand Building and Platform Opportunities

• [34:24-40:26]
  • Gary urges Jimmy to document his “every US county” quest—potential brands might sponsor such unique, authentic content.
  • Discussion on photography platforms:
    • Gary has fondness for Flickr ("means the world to me"); Instagram is the modern equivalent.
    • Hashtags on Instagram still work, though not as much as before.
    • Disrupting stock photography is tough; the leverage lies with platforms, not creators, unless the creator can build unique brand demand.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Laziness:

  “I actually think being lazy is a good thing...laziness can be a mechanism for self-awareness.”
  — Gary Vaynerchuk [14:28]

• On Content Creation:

  “Content is...taking a picture. Like, I see content right here. Like, I see content in everything.”
  — Gary Vaynerchuk [25:39]

• On Personal Branding:

  “Whether Google called itself Google or Schmoogle...it was the execution that made it okay.”
  — Gary Vaynerchuk [30:12]

• On Winning at Life:

  “If you’re happy, you’ve won.”
  — Gary Vaynerchuk [33:08]

• On Documenting Unique Journeys:

  “Maybe there’s some map company that wants to pay him to, like, travel...maybe AAA or some other travel infrastructure, and they're gonna reach out to you cold and...pay you for a year to go to every county. I believe that to be true.”
  — Gary Vaynerchuk [34:24]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:01-03:32] — Introduction, how Jimmy won the guest spot
• [03:32-07:27] — Early tech, social media, and real-world case studies
• [10:07-14:02] — Uber/Lyft driving, side hustles, flipping
• [14:02-17:16] — The meaning of laziness and self-awareness
• [23:12-27:44] — Content creation volume tactics
• [29:07-30:29] — Name vs. niche in personal branding
• [31:08-32:50] — Monetizing passion, the value of happiness
• [34:24-36:20] — Audience-building with unique projects
• [36:37-40:26] — Photography platforms, stock photography disruption

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Overall Tone & Takeaways

Gary is at his most practical and philosophical, blending actionable guidance with energetic, direct engagement. The discussion is affable and relatable—constantly circling back to the idea of leveraging self-awareness, finding real joy, and not overthinking how others perceive your path or output. The conversation with Jimmy stands as a real-world case study in transitioning from passive fandom to active creation, using humility and personal curiosity as rocket fuel.

This episode is essential listening for anyone who feels “lazy,” is uncertain about their side hustle, or is overthinking their “niche” or “brand.” As Gary sums up:

“If you’re happy, you’ve won.”

Transcript

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

This is the Gary Vee Audio Experience. Hey, everybody. Welcome to a very special episode of the podcast. My friend Jimmy is here. We've met for a hundredth of a second. So we're going right into this. Because I'm excited about this, Jimmy. I think it's gonna be really fun for everybody. Please tell everybody why the fuck you are here. And more importantly, actually, what I'm actually asking, Jimmy, is how did you get here? Remind everybody on the opportunity.

[Jimmy]

I answered the. The giveaway that you had on the text platform, went on to Twitter, use the hashtag, explained. You know, I think there's a little bit about, like, you know, why do you want to be on the podcast? Yep. I got a question on the AskGaryVee show three years ago. Been doing a little bit of stuff, but not like really going hard at it, you know, like I should be. And I just put my story out there a little bit.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Let me frame it up, because I'm gonna let you take over from here. Everybody who's listening. The reason this podcast is fun for me is obviously I've started doing a lot of text messaging on this platform called Community that I'm using and couple things. One, yes, it's me. Every single text, every single time you get a reply, it's always me.

[Jimmy]

I believe you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Thank you. That's why I'm using audio and video. So for everybody's wondering, it's always me. Obviously, I'm putting out stuff every day, every other day, every couple days. But what I'm obsessed with is if I'm gonna put out, hey, watch Drock's new movie, or hey, sign up for WineText, if I'm gonna be in the right hook on a text. I think unlike social, I need to be very careful there. It's a very special place. Your phone numbers. So I'm obsessed with bringing value. So I've decided that for everybody who signed up for my text messaging platform, it's gonna be the place where I create access 5 minute facetimes flying people in. We had the group. Have we aired the one with the three people that won the last thing? Not yet. So by the time you listen to this, you've already heard the podcast with the three people that were chosen. Now Jimmy's here. He was chosen. I'm gonna continue to use that platform as a way to get the ultimate thing in a world where I put out all my content for free. The only thing left is time with me. And I've decided to make my texting the most important Like a really important platform. I'm gonna use that platform as really the place to get to me. Dinner's with me, hanging out with me and Jimmy, getting the ultimate, which is being a guest on my podcast with me. So I pushed out a thing. I always like to put it on Twitter. Cause it's easy for me to find, it's fun to watch it get trending. And it's been a lot of fun. And I know a lot of you have done that. This one was to be a podcast guest. Tell me why you should. Many catch my eye. Many are worth it. And then serendipity and luck and life takes over. And that's how we got Jimmy here. So Jimmy. What? Tell us real before you tell us more about you. And then the rest of the floor is gonna be yours. You're gonna ask questions, I'm gonna answer them. But before we get that you're on my text platform A answer a couple questions. How long have you been consuming my content?

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

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[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Let's go.

[Jimmy]

Almost as long as you've been putting it out from a bit so 0909

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

so when I kind of started first business first. When's the first time you saw me?

[Jimmy]

I went, I went into this for about 45 minutes the other day to try to figure it out. The first oldest video that I can remember seeing of you was a video that you did with Chris Pirillo around

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

2009 when I was live with him on ustream.

[Jimmy]

Yeah. So I remember I ready for this.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Talk about doing things for free for Expo. Chris Perlo had a huge ustream show. I believed in live.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And he was an awesome dude. Really. In the tech culture, I'd really gone head first. Dignation and Kevin Rose and those guys, Perillo, Leo Laporte, that whole scene.

[Jimmy]

And I struggled. I, I, I didn't struggle. I didn't struggle with you. My. It's funny because I laughed. Everyone else, everyone in my inner circle struggled with you. Like, you know my, a little bit of my family. My dad was like this guy's full of shit. He's trying to sell books. He's trying to, you know. You know. And I was like man, he a lot of sense, you know and, and I Was just getting out of a business that I was in for a long time. And so I was burnt out with that. So it wasn't using it for that, but I was doing it.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Just clicked for you, right?

[Jimmy]

Right. Like.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And you were a tech. You were into the tech scene because to know Perillo's. You stream back then, like, what?

[Jimmy]

People don't like Perillo. He's awesome.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

He's super fun to like.

[Jimmy]

I just liked Chris.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But were you techy at that? Like, did you know what Twitter was like?

[Jimmy]

Yes.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You have to understand, Jimmy, you may take this for granted. A lot of people did it. People didn't know you existed. People didn't know Twitter existed.

[Jimmy]

Yeah, I was working for Texas Roadhouse in 2009, 2010. Went to the manager, said, hey, you know, if I could, I could run a little bit of social. The Twitter for the restaurant, they had to, like, email corporate and get approval and, like, what's Twitter? And, like, you know.

[Interjecting Voice]

Yeah.

[Jimmy]

And. And I ended up doing it. Long story short, if I could tell it for, like, 40 seconds, like, this was probably 2011, 2012. I was working. I don't want to mention any names because I don't want to throw. Throw the company under the bus. I was working at a shitty company. Shitty. The good company, but ran by shitty people.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Okay, got it.

[Jimmy]

Long story short, they serve coffee and donuts.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Jimmy, I like you already. Keep going.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

They.

[Jimmy]

So basically, I'm sorry, I'm just kind of nervous.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Don't be nervous.

[Jimmy]

Basically, I had a customer come in. I was running social for the company, and I knew about the location. This was 2010.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Keep going.

[Jimmy]

And I knew about location search on Twitter. Used to search our location for Dunkin Donuts. Literally found a customer that had a bad experience. That's exactly what you said. I mean, when I was learning your stuff, when I was learning your stuff, it was. I drove the wine to the customer from Wine Library. Reached out to this lady on Twitter that said she had a really bad experience. I said, I'm the manager at the store where you came. Come in. Your breakfast is on me tomorrow. I just want to show we're sorry. Yeah, I literally gave this lady a sandwich and a coffee, and I thought the owners were gonna fire me. Like, they were. They were so pissed that I gave this lady something for free.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's wild.

[Jimmy]

Like, and, you know, and. And long story short, I didn't run social anymore for the.

[Interjecting Voice]

For the.

[Jimmy]

For the restaurant. And it was just, you know, silly. I just knew of it. I just knew it was a thing. It was y. I think a little bit after that you came out. It may have been around that time. Thank you. Economy. And it was like, man, this just makes sense. Like. Like, this is how a business should be ran. 100,000, you know, and we're still not there. I don't think the world had the infrastructure to even really understand it, run it like that, at scale, you know, and so let's bounce.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Let's bounce around. This is fun. Let's go back to the present real quick. You see the text. You. You do your thing. How do you find out that you won?

[Jimmy]

Oh, yeah. So I literally fell asleep.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

This is better than I could have imagined. That was literally my dream beginning to.

[Jimmy]

It was one of those things, like, I mean, you guys know, like, when you enter a contest, you know, five minutes goes by and you're like, I'm gonna freaking win. There's like 104,000 people entered, you know, And I'm sitting there, and I'm just on, like, Instagram and Twitter and went back to Twitter. I was looking at, you know, and, you know, all the tweets are like, oh, Gary fell asleep on us and this and that, you know, And I'm sitting there watching, like, I don't know.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Right. That one. I think I had to go to, like, some meetings, right? So I was a little behind. Yeah, Yeah, I think it was a little like. One of them was.

[Jimmy]

I was literally. Anyway, I was literally laying in bed. I was watching.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Where do you live?

[Jimmy]

Alabama.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Go ahead, keep going.

[Jimmy]

I was watching, like, Leon Lush or something on YouTube, and I fell asleep, and I did the math. The next morning, when I figured out when you announced it, I woke up, looked at my phone, and I had, like, 100 at replies on Twitter. And I'm like, what the hell is with my Twitter account? And I looked, and it was some random chick. The first one I saw was some random girl. And she was like, you realize you won, right? And I'm like, that was the first tweet you saw? Yeah. You realize you won, right? So I woke up, my girlfriend told her, and she was like, no, you didn't. And I'm like, I swear to God, you know? And so, you know, of course, the entire morning, you know, we're at the apartment and Twitter's going off and replies, and I'm at replying to everyone. And, you know, and she's like, okay, okay, I get it. You won. Whatever. I still gotta go to work. She's like, I didn't win. I Gotta go to work. So. Yeah, you know. And so that was it.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah, I love it. A couple things and then let's go into some questions and let's banter a little bit.

[Jimmy]

Okay.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Does your whole inner circle still hate me or have some thought out over the last decade? Damn it.

[Jimmy]

Most. No, no, no, no. Most. Most of them are cool. Most of them.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Most have thought out.

[Jimmy]

I have a few friends in Alabama that are a little on the religious side that don't, you know, is the cursing. Yeah, I respect that. I don't care. I mean, I grew up in the northeast, so, um, the. But most of my family, I think, is. Is on board. I think my dad understands, but my dad has a cynical under. He just likes giving me, like, if I. If. Honestly, no matter what, if I bring up Gary Vee, it's like, you know,

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

what's your dad's name?

[Jimmy]

James.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

James. I think we have to get James on the podcast next. There's a substantial chance that James will be in the podest in a year. Jimmy. So what are you up to now?

[Jimmy]

I work full time as an Uber and Lyft driver.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Love it.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

How's it going?

[Jimmy]

It's. It's okay. It's. It's.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Has it gotten tougher as supply and demand has shaked out?

[Jimmy]

Yeah. Summer comes in, teachers do it, teachers fall off, students come back on it.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Do you love it? Do you love the autonomy?

[Jimmy]

I. I love the flexibility. It's. It's a struggle at times. It can be a struggle.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like any job.

[Jimmy]

You're putting. Yep. Wear and tear in the car.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

What are you doing? What do you listen? Are you listening to podcasts?

[Jimmy]

Not really.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You're trying to put music for the guest.

[Jimmy]

The. No.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Okay.

[Jimmy]

The only reason, honestly, is because I don't have, like, what do you call it? Spotify or whatever in my car.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Got it.

[Jimmy]

So sometimes I'll listen to Apple music, but like on podcast, but every time something comes in.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

What do you listen to? I've actually been really fascinated by this.

[Jimmy]

What do you mean?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Well, I always think about, like, music. Yeah, I always think about, like, what I listen.

[Jimmy]

I listen to everything. I mean, I grew up a deal.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Are you listening to music while you're driving or sports radio or usually.

[Jimmy]

Usually terrestrial radio.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah.

[Jimmy]

Yeah, because I don't. I don't have XM or anything. Believe it or not. I still listen to CDs sometimes in my car.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I believe you. Yeah, it's very easy to believe. It's content consumption is completely predicated on

[Jimmy]

the distribution But I mean, I listen. I listen.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

If you have a CD player in your car.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Do you garage? Actually, this is a really funny question. Have you thought about garage sailing and then, like, buying CDs for your car? This is one of the things I've been thinking a lot about is, like, I'm being serious, like, arbitrage.

[Jimmy]

I.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You can buy a fuckload, you can buy. I pass on them because it's a lot of, like, there's not enough margin. But, like, over the last couple trash talks, like, there's like, massive CD collections you can buy for, like.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

10 bucks.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And, like, you could sell it for 100 on the Bay if you had those kind of hours, which is why it's a good buy. But specifically for your life. That's like a real arb.

[Jimmy]

Yeah, but I don't like them enough, though.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You don't like music enough?

[Jimmy]

I mean, I like music. I love music, but I. I like.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You have your six things you like,

[Jimmy]

and why that I probably wouldn't.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You don't need to buy a Lionel Richie cd, right?

[Jimmy]

Yeah, Yeah, I do like Lionel Richie, though.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I love.

[Jimmy]

I know.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's so awesome, man. No wonder we're friends.

[Jimmy]

Yeah, I used to be a dj.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

What? I heard that.

[Jimmy]

Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, I grew up with tons of music.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, have you flipped?

[Jimmy]

I know I've been pushing that. I flipped a little bit. How's that?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, tell me about that. I thought that's it. Because I love places like Bama and other places where I think there's real arbitrage.

[Jimmy]

So the. The best I've had small ones, but the best flip I have because I know you like hearing these stories.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Dude, you know me so well. You look right to what I wanted. I love you, Jimmy. Go ahead.

[Jimmy]

The best flip I had was one of those scientific calculators.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah.

[Jimmy]

I got at. I don't know, it wasn't a Goodwill, but it was some, like, thrift store. Yeah. Like a thrift store. And, like, somewhere in the hood in Birmingham. And. And it was literally. There was no batteries in it, it was greasy, it was dirty, and they were selling it for, like, a buck. And, like, I don't think they knew what it was. And I was like, well, I'll pick it up for a dollar.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Did you know there was value in

[Jimmy]

it or you were going to hunch? I knew if it worked, it was worth more than a dollar, you know, and so I was like, well, I'll buy it for a dollar. So, you know, if. If Anything. I can sell it as broken for five bucks, you know, So I was like, I'll buy it for a buck. And it sold. I cleaned it up, washed it, you know, put new batteries in. It worked perfectly. I sold it for like, 70 bucks on eBay.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Love.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Why don't you do more flipping when you follow careful? Like, I always thought the Uber Lyft driver and flip combo combo was a monster. Was a monster because you're naturally driving around anyway.

[Jimmy]

Like, plus, you could pitch to your passengers if they have anything they want to get rid of.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Well, that's, that's taking it a little far, Jimmy.

[Jimmy]

But.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But just being on the road at all times puts you in play to finding random closeouts for stores rolling up on a garage sale. Do you just not like it, or is it hard? Like, why don't you do more flipping, is my question. In a world where I think you could clean up because you have the knowledge.

[Jimmy]

I don't know. I don't know exactly why it is. I, I, I mean, I'm ashamed to say I think a little bit of it might be laziness, but actually, let's.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Can we stand?

[Jimmy]

I don't know. I mean, I'm not.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Jimmy.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'm going to lean into this because I want to bring value to everybody listening.

[Jimmy]

Yeah. I.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

This is going to actually probably confuse some people. I actually don't spend a lot of time on laziness. Right. Actually, think about it. I don't talk about it. Right.

[Jimmy]

You mean in your content?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah. By the way, my content is a manifestation of what's in my mind. So not even in my own mind when I hear that. I appreciate why you say it, but it's so funny. It's funny how that just went through my mind. I actually think being lazy is a good thing. Let me explain. This is gonna be an interesting moment. Yeah. No, you're freaking out, right?

[Jimmy]

I was gonna say, isn't, like, stop watching Netflix kind of, like, related to laziness?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Stop watching Netflix is under the context of stop using something to escape your real life. If you don't realize you're trying to escape your real life, don't use Netflix or watching the New York. Let's get very much into clarification on this episode. I watch the jets for four hours on Sundays. I do that because it allows me to escape and, like, it gives me balance to my insanity. But I don't watch the jets on Sunday to get away from the fact that I hate my job. And instead of doing something, like, for My job, I'm gonna use this because Netflix is a seven day a week thing, 2K and Fortnite is a seven day a week thing. And even sports people that watch the Yankees and the Mets and the Knicks and the jets, the way I watch the jets, that's why football worked for me one day a week. You know, some people use entertainment as a reset and a balance to their other life, which is work, family. And then other people use escapism as a way to just get by because they hate their life and it's the way for them not to have to think about it. Right? Laziness has my attention because I think if you're lazy, you're actually giving yourself an indication that you don't like it. So I think laziness, you don't like what? Whatever the task at hand for you, you just prop I, you'll appreciate this. And I think you can see it in trash talk. I mean I'm never. Drock will tell you who hangs out with me a lot that between trash talk and the baseball card show in Chicago, he's never seen me happier. I get an incredible thrill, deep inherent happiness from getting into a car on a 6am on a Saturday and going to find something to buy for 3 bucks and sell for 100. This is not about the cliche shit that people say in my comments of like, you didn't make that much money. It was the gas. You know, it's not all those things. I love it. School, I hate it. I am lazy around housework, around logistics. I think quote unquote, laziness can have a more thoughtful conversation of actually, is it laziness or are you showing yourself that you don't like that thing and and it becomes a mechanism to self awareness.

[Jimmy]

I think it's that, I think it's that you don't like that thing.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I think me too. Yeah, I don't think you're lazy and

[Jimmy]

I think a little bit of the.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You're not lazy.

[Jimmy]

I think a little you're fucking.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I apologize, but I want to give you a compliment. You're driving around hardcore, grinding, lifting. You're not lazy. You just don't get the same thrill or enjoyment.

[Jimmy]

And I think a little bit of

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

it is, hey everybody, hope you're enjoying the podcast right now. Make sure you follow the podcast. That's why I'm interrupting. Let's keep going on this show, but follow the podcast. It'll make my mom super happy. What it is, Drock is I think we need to stop apologizing for being lazy, all of us, which is probably subconsciously why I don't talk about it. And we need to use it as an indicator of I don't like that thing, this job, this relationship, this school, this startup. And then use it as a starting point to try something else on the side that eventually can become your thing and you can stop doing that thing that you're, quote, unquote, lazy about.

[Jimmy]

So this may sound weird to you, but I was just thinking of it as you were saying, talking. I think a little bit of it, too, for me, like, because I do like the flip stuff on ebay. Like, I do enjoy it when I do it. I think a little bit of it for me is also the economics of it. You know, where I'm thinking, like, okay, if I'm out doing this, it's taking away from me. Doing that analytical side of me. I like, that prevents me from doing anything for four years. Like, the analytical side of me thinks, like, well, if I'm garage sailing from 6 to 8, like, how much could I have made with Uber and lift?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

No, no, that's. You know, by the way, that's exactly right.

[Jimmy]

Right.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And then in the comments of this, wherever that may be.

[Jimmy]

And I'm one of those cynical people, when you. When. When you first got onto garage sailing, I was like, yeah, but the gas and the ebay fees and this, the boxes and, you know, and then my girlfriend said, you ain't gonna store the here. Like, you know that. Not that. Not that she would say, say that,

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Jimmy, I think you'll like this. And that makes sense.

[Jimmy]

My dad did, though, when I was living at home. When I was living at home, my dad was like, you ain't keeping that. James is.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I mean, this guy, I can't wait to meet him. Is he a Bama guy?

[Jimmy]

Are you both you Bama guys he rooted for? So 22nd story. My parents moved to Alabama. My dad got a job offer down there. He owned his own from Massachusetts.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Okay. Are you a Patriots fan, Jimmy?

[Jimmy]

I'm borderline. Like, I'm a Pats fan because I grew up. But like, a Pats fan.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Right?

[Jimmy]

Honestly, don't. What are you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Are you a real fan of anything?

[Jimmy]

Probably the Red Sox and Bruins.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Okay.

[Jimmy]

Yeah. Yeah. But like, Pats, I mean, it's not your passion. Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You're more of a baseball.

[Jimmy]

Like, I'll catch a game if it's on, but it's not. Like, Right. I don't care if they lose.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I understand.

[Jimmy]

Yeah. Like, I was probably like, the Game

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

7, the Stanley cup this year broke your heart. Yeah, but the Patriots losing the Eagles, not so much.

[Jimmy]

Yeah, like I was actually. It's so funny because like I have this thing with like Gary buying the jets literally every time the jets are playing. Like I have this innate like. Yeah, I'm kind of a Jets fan.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, well Jimmy, this is the masterful thing I'm doing.

[Jimmy]

I know.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'm literally going to turn America into a collective monster Jet fandom by the time I buy it. So when I buy it on day one, they become the most popular team in the league.

[Jimmy]

I could see that.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Dustin, you haven't been noticing. I love your face right now. You think I'm fooling around around here, Dustin? I've got everything figured out.

[Jimmy]

Let's say the jets just started winning all the time.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I won't care. I'll pivot to the Knicks. If the jets won back to back Super Bowls in four years, I probably will change the narrative to the Knicks. I'm about the thrill of the hunt and I think them winning and becoming the kind of. That's if you listen to Patriots during Jimmy's dad's years for sure. And how old are you, Jimmy?

[Jimmy]

37.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

So even a little bit of Jimmy, a little bit like he's right on the cusp. Like the Pats were real bad.

[Jimmy]

I understand though your underdog thing, it's

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

like the Red Sox especially.

[Jimmy]

I mean I, I understand that.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

37. So you, you.

[Jimmy]

Oh, I watched what year I was bit. No, forget about born.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah. What year?

[Jimmy]

82.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Right. So you don't remember 86.

[Jimmy]

No. Jimmy, no.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You can't imagine.

[Jimmy]

Oh, I know.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I don't know if you know this. Like you probably don't. And I mean all you non sport, you three guys, you non sports fans, for everybody listening, the Red Sox were winning by two runs or I'm trying to remember, I think it was two runs.

[Jimmy]

One or two runs in game six

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

of the World Series. Up three games to two here in New York in the bottom of the ninth, two outs, nobody on. They're one out away from winning the World Series. The game is so over that the Mets in their stadium put on the Jumbotron. Congratulations. Boston Red Sox, 1986 world champions. And they lost that game a single, another single, then another hit. And then this famous play for Bill Buckner went under his. You know that play that happened in that game.

[Jimmy]

I actually. Wild pitch. I actually joke with people that Buckner didn't really like lose the game, but

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

it was because of the, you know.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You know. So it's, it's crazy. It was tied by then because of the wild pitch. Nonetheless, it is the most ridiculous thing that I've ever seen in sports to this day. It was over. Over. I mean I was. Listen, the Jets, Monday night miracle. They were down 30 to 7 with 10 minutes left in a football game

[Jimmy]

and came back and won 04 against the Yanks. That was pretty big though.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah, that was amazing. Three games to none for like by the way, I always think that the jets moment will happen through New England because it's like that's what the Red Sox did to the Yankees. I'm looking for the reverse. Nonetheless, Jimmy, to bring value to the audience. What apps are you into right now? Like what content are you consuming? What platforms?

[Jimmy]

I've always liked Twitter. I don't get on Facebook a lot. Even for family and friends. I don't get on it a lot. YouTube a little bit. A little bit. YouTube, Twitter. I'm trying to get into TikTok. Yep. Been playing with it a little bit. Yeah. A little bit of Instagram. Not. Not too, too much.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

What can I answer for you? Let's wrap up this show with two or three questions.

[Jimmy]

So God man, I have like 100 Rattle Way.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I'll go.

[Jimmy]

The first question that comes to mind is I love your message of like 100 pieces of content a day. You know that, that theory I'm my. My question on the the first call in show that we had was about travel blogging which was for me a little bit related to photography, travel, writing, video. I try to do video but it's not really my thing where my thing is like if you're working and you're doing your life stuff, if you put out so much content it would literally be like the same content every day.

[Interjecting Voice]

This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser but Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50 page restoration block or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense. There's no place like Chrome. Check responses Setup required compatibility and availability. Various 18

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I think it's a really good question. Couple things.

[Jimmy]

Especially if you're wanting to do something like travel, this is tremendous.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

This is where creativity and ideas has to be something I talk more about. So for example, when I think about 100 pieces of content a day and this is Great, because it seems like you're grounded in Twitter most, more than many, because you were part of that era with me. Yeah, I think Twitter is an incredibly important part of the hundred piece concept. You know, obviously this is catching and I'm getting asked about it more. So this is a great opportunity to create some clarity. Hopefully the team clicks this. Let's get Raghov to write a piece. You know, the 100 piece concept 2.0. I think we're working on something. But Twitter's incredibly important. As you know, one of the great things about Twitter is its trending topics and the ability to reply to it with retweeting and adding your $0.02 or typing original thoughts. So for me, one of the things that really stands out is if I was asking the normal quote unquote person to produce 100 pieces of content a day, I guarantee you that I'm probably subconsciously thinking that 50 of those are Twitter. You can write, you can retweet and add your two cents. All of a sudden you're kind of there. Right. The other thing is I don't think people understand document versus create. I think people think you need Drock or Jason following you or Dustin following you around. I think it's just taking a picture. Like, I see content right here. Like, I see content in maybe I have. This is probably my strength. I see content in everything. I think you should take a photo of us talking right now and tweet it and be like, holy shit, I'm doing this with Gary Vee right now.

[Jimmy]

Yeah, yeah, I did. I took right before you came in.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But like, there's Madison Square Garden.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

And you know, like, this is New York. You know, like, I think there's a lot more content. And by the way, I think that could be done 15 to 20 times on Twitter, Instagram stories and TikTok without any cost to the preciousness. That is the main reason that Everybody can't make 100 pieces of content.

[Jimmy]

Okay.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You know, taking a photo of what you see and adding one sentence is allowing people into your world. And you start creating around common interests. A lot of people are like, gary, should I separate my business and life? I'm like, I put my jets content in all my content. I put my garage sales stuff there. That has nothing to do with the marketing or the business running. I think it's there. But I do think it's a strategy mindset. And I think everybody thinks this is useless and nobody would care. And I think you should let them decide. I think when you Think something like, I think when you think, you know what? I wish I was closer with my sister. And I'm gonna start working on that. That. That should be a tweet. That one should tweet. Like, you know what? I've been underestimating sibling relationships. And I'm gonna work on that in 2020. That's a piece of content. And then you're walking into a restaurant, a fast, casual place, and there's 23 people lined up to the hottest place in downtown Alabama or New York. And you take a photo and be like, I guess cronuts are hot. That's a piece of content. And if you're more visually artistic than I love when the sunset hits, like, some avenue in fucking New York and everybody's taking a photo of that. And I have no interest, even though I'm into this content thing, I'm like, fuck that. First of all, I don't get it. Cause I don't give a fuck about a sunset. But I know that people do.

[Jimmy]

Or mountains or mountains.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Or. I'm looking at the creative guys in front of me here, gals. I know that they see beauty in a puddle catching a mini rainbow in it. That I'm not that kind of artist, but I'm an artist in a different way. Where somebody having a funny name on their taxi thing or like. Or what? You know, like, everything is. Do you. Do you.

[Jimmy]

And I mean, I know there's 100 other people that do it, but I'm most familiar with Drock. Like, do you struggle with that, with your video people? Because they want everything to be very artistic?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

No, I fucking made them succumb. I beat Drock down and reframed him, and then he became the blueprint. Right? I mean, no, I don't. And by the way, this is Bing Ying and Yang. And we're sitting here. And we're sitting here on the day that we released a nice piece of film. That's 5 minutes and 50 seconds. And I value that as well. I'd rather go all in on that side once a quarter than every day spending four days on post production on a vlog, you know? So, like, you know, I like. I'm like a barbell. I like the extremes to the left and the right. And I think most people are in the middle. So that's how I see that. What else you got there? See? Notes.

[Jimmy]

Yeah. So a little bit related to the question I asked before. If you were wanting to get into, like, photography five minutes.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Drock.

[Jimmy]

Like, photography five minutes.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Go ahead.

[Jimmy]

If you want to get into like photography, travel, that sort of thing. Like, I own my name pretty much across social. I don't have the.com but I have the.co domain. Pinterest, Twitter, Instagram. Yeah. Should you, should you build more of your name as a person in your area or. I know this is gonna sound identical. Identical.

[Interjecting Voice]

Go ahead.

[Jimmy]

Because whenever I think about doing that, I think like, well, if you did it under whatever, like Birmingham something, people would instinctively be more. Understand it more because it's in the name.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

The execution will make the name. Let me explain. I understand the literal interpretation of Birmingham photography. If you call it at Birmingham Photography or if you call it Jimmy.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

The execution of the photos will become the end result. Whether McDonald's called itself McDonald's or McDonald's, whether Google called itself Google or Schmoogle, whether Facebook called itself Facebook or Base Book, and whether Nike called itself Nike or Schmikey. You got it?

[Jimmy]

I got you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

My name's fucking Gary Vaynerchuk. My username is Gary V with two silent E's. That's stupid. Yeah, that's stupid. It was the execution that made it okay.

[Jimmy]

So my follow up question is if you're building your personal brand like I'm wanting to do through photography, travel, writing, that sort of thing, one of the pieces of content that you had that I remember that I loved was, I think it was one of the. One of the guys you were interviewing. You mentioned about having different burgers where you have something else. Is that a different what? Yeah, beside like side thing. Having like a burger, you know, something you rely on.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yes.

[Jimmy]

You know, is it a good strategy to completely focus on you or to build some other stuff up so that you don't have to monetize an audience in the future as much?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's a really good question. So first of all, one never has to monetize an audience if they build themselves up. They just have to be capable of building something around it. Like the reason I get to be a hero and not monetize my audience is I was capable of building VaynerMedia. Right. You don't have to monetize. Now, let me give you an example. You putting out great photography for free, you by nature and the service you provide have the potential to monetize the audience in a way that's good. Let me explain. I am a strategist. I'm actually a thinker. I don't position myself that way. But what people want to pay me for, or would want to pay me for is to sit down with me and do this for hours. I give that away for free, and then I don't monetize that way. But if I was a photographer and they wanted me to shoot their wedding, I have no choice but to charge them for that. I got lucky that my output was thoughts, and I could give that away for free if. If my output was photography and I'm

[Jimmy]

not wanting to do client work, that's like. I just love shooting photos when I'm out. Like, I just. I've done it.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You just. You just won.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I mean, obviously you have to maintain a living.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But this is actually my favorite thing. You're like, almost my favorite person. If you have a life where you. Let's say you. I don't know how much you love shooting photos, but it seems like pretty solid.

[Jimmy]

I'd say 80%, 90%. I mean, it's.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It's like your thing.

[Jimmy]

It's my thing.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Right. You know, to me, the fact that you have your core hustle around Lyft and Uber, which allows you, you know, you know, I got you.

[Jimmy]

Oh, I know. I know where you're going. I know.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

To do that. You're actually. You're actually the fucking poster child of what I'm trying to get people to understand if you're happy you've won now, if you're telling me. Well, Gary, actually. Which would make sense, by the way.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I would love to just do photography all day long and I'd love to get paid four times as much to photography.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Like, I still think it's the same strategy, which is put out the best photography you can, and over time, serendipitously, you know, people are going to reach out to you and offer you gigs.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Not super complicated.

[Jimmy]

Yeah, I mean, I'm. I'm. What I'm doing right now is like, I've actually been doing this on my YouTube channel, just kind of for fun. I've been documenting. It is part of my, like, photography and U. S. Travel thing. There's a. A travel group online that I'm a part of that I'm trying to actually visit every U. S. County.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Excuse me?

[Jimmy]

I'm trying to visit every county in

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

the US isn't there like a.

[Jimmy]

There's like 6, 000. It's a thing. There's like 51 people that have done it.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Hold on. How many counties are there, do you know roughly?

[Jimmy]

Or the range of 3140. 3142. Something like that.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

3000 plus.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

30 fucking cool.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Anybody listening who can help Jimmy with this county thing? Maybe there's some map company that wants to pay him to, like, travel the. You know, Babin's doing some bullshit like that. Like, so why can't.

[Jimmy]

I love what Babin's been doing, by

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

the way, I'm sure Babin's super creative and, you know, Adobe's letting him do it. And so I think for you, like, AAA Car services CEO could be listening right now and said, fuck it, I'm gonna take Jimmy and I'm gonna, like, pay for his year. And he's gonna go to every county because the awareness of the GaryVee, you know, podcast, is probably work. Like, I. Basically, you're just a mini Babbin. We're gonna get you this gig. Somebody listening right now is gonna hit up AAA or some map company or some other fucking travel infrastructure, and they're gonna reach out to you cold and they're gonna pay you for a year to go every county. I believe that to be true. That will happen.

[Jimmy]

3242 County.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Jimmy, this is what you want to do with your life. Like, you would like it.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I would not take that in a negative way.

[Jimmy]

It would take me at least 10 to 15 years to do it.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You're a young.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Who are these 50 people? And, like, do you, like.

[Jimmy]

You know what's so funny?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

What?

[Jimmy]

So I'm gonna tell you something because you're gonna love this, because I know the business part of you.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yeah.

[Jimmy]

I've looked up. I've googled every. Every single one of their names because I'm like, if 50 something people have done this, one of them.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

What's the. What's the common denominator of the 50 people?

[Jimmy]

What do you mean when you looked

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

up these 50 people, they're old. That's solid. It takes a lot of time.

[Jimmy]

No, I mean, I mean, I think, you know, they were doing it over, you know, 30 years, but nobody has documented it. There hasn't been a single person that has done it, that has documented. It's sort of like a word of faith type thing. You know what I mean?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You want to document it?

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

How many are you in?

[Jimmy]

So I visited in my life, technically, because I figured this out, probably 180.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

But you haven't documented.

[Jimmy]

But I have a document, so I'm. I'm redoing it.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Right.

[Jimmy]

I've been like seven, eight.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Great.

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

You have a big journey in front of you, just like I do, which makes it the most fun.

[Jimmy]

So can I ask you like a couple more questions real quick. Real, real quick. Okay.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

My team kills.

[Jimmy]

So you know, because I love this platform and I'm hoping it's not. Not bullshit. You know that Flickr was bought by SmugMug.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I did see that.

[Jimmy]

What are your thoughts on Flickr as a platform for photographers? Flickr, Honestly. Honestly, Honestly.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Flickr owns my heart. There's like I have like six photos on Flickr. What is it? G Nuts. What is the username? Because that's what I used to use back in the day. Flickr was. Flickr means the world to me because it was one of the sites that got me into tech.

[Jimmy]

Were you glad that it was bought by SmugMug?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

I don't know what SmugMug's gonna be, but I definitely remember Flickr super well. Stuart Butterfield, right. Who went on to be the co founder of Slack.

[Jimmy]

Yep.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

They sold it to Yahoo. It was one of the big exits. I remember it like yesterday. And I still think that Instagram really is what Flickr could have become if it was in the mobile age. And my heart is huge for Flickr. It was the first time I saw photography that way. It was a preview to the current state of the Internet.

[Jimmy]

If you're doing Instagram right now as a photographer, should you still be using Instagram as a photographer does, or should you be posting most of your story on your post?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

There is no should. And can you use Instagram as a pure play photographer at scale? Yes.

[Jimmy]

Are people still searching hashtags?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Not as much, but.

[Jimmy]

But a lot.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Yes.

[Jimmy]

Yeah,

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

it was Gary B. With. With no double E. Right. Did we change it? Go ahead.

[Jimmy]

And my last question. I'm hoping it's a decent one for photographers.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

This couldn't have gone back. When you play the game of I think somebody.

[Jimmy]

I think this couldn't have gone better. I think an industry that needs to be massively disrupted, that hasn't really been disrupted yet is stock photography.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Okay. I tried to. I, I was an investor in a company called Fope F O A P where everybody's photos on their phones would be uploaded and it was a marketplace against Getty Images and things of that nature. And I thought it was a super good idea.

[Jimmy]

So what about what would a. What would it look like from a business person standpoint like yourself for a photographer down the road to do that

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

themselves to build a platform?

[Jimmy]

Yeah.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Well, to understand it's a super difficult business to build.

[Jimmy]

Okay.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It's a two way marketplace. It's like ebay and Uber and those are the toughest ones to build. You want the world to upload photos, right? Because they have it.

[Jimmy]

No, I'm saying. I'm saying your own iPad.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Well, your own ip. I think you need to build your personal brand and demand and create demand for you. You want to get my creative directors at Vayner, production people, brands to be like, we need Jim.

[Jimmy]

See, I've always thought stock photography should work the other way. Where right now, if you go on to, like, you know, Getty or Istock or whatever, it's like, I mean, you guys probably know this as content creators that you go on stock photos and you, you know, upload whatever and they pay you 38 cents for a photo.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

It's like it's supply and demand, right? The reason you pay 38 cents is because 8,000 other fuckers are putting up a photo of a Robin.

[Jimmy]

But it's like, I'm wondering why a company hasn't come out that have approached some of the top stock photographers and say, pay us $400 a month or $800 a month and you get 100% of the royalties.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Because the business model in the other way is better and the leverage sits with the platform, not with the photographers. You're thinking about it from a selfish standpoint of the photographer, because that's what you want to be, which is right. The answer to your question is the photographer doesn't have the leverage.

[Jimmy]

But if a photographer built themselves up

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

big enough, they would, then they wouldn't need the platform.

[Jimmy]

Or they could have leverage to create the platform with someone else.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

They could, if they know how to build a platform. Just because you're Shaq doesn't mean you can build the NBA.

[Jimmy]

Right?

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

Got it.

[Jimmy]

Got it.

[Gary Vaynerchuk]

That's a really good way to end this. Thank you, Jimmy, everybody. If you enjoyed this podcast, please go back and look at the prior episodes. They're loaded. I appreciate your attention, and thanks for being part of this journey. See you later.