Podcast Summary: The Gist — Episode: C. Thi Nguyen: "Beliefs Are Tools, Not Truths"
Date: February 25, 2026
Host: Mike Pesca (with guest C. Thi Nguyen, referred to as C. T. Wynn in the transcript)

Episode Overview

In this engaging episode of The Gist, host Mike Pesca welcomes philosophy professor and author C. Thi Nguyen (C. T. Wynn) to unpack the central theme from his new book: “Beliefs are tools, not truths.” The conversation explores the nature of beliefs, the impact of mindset on pain and life satisfaction, the distinction between belief, fact, and faith, the pitfalls of rumination, the power and limits of positive thinking, and how beliefs shape individual and societal actions. With practical examples from psychology, anecdotal stories, and philosophical insights, this episode challenges listeners to revise their relationship with belief and consider how adopting a flexible, evidence-based approach can improve well-being and decision-making.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Role of Belief in Pain and Healing

[07:53–11:47]

• Wynn recounts the story of Sophie Hawley-Weld from the music duo Sofi Tukker, who suffered from chronic back pain unhelped by traditional medicine but alleviated through pain reprocessing therapy (PRT).
• PRT counters the typical approach to chronic pain, advising movement and fun rather than rest and avoidance.
• The real source of chronic (neuroplastic) pain is often a “fear-pain-fear cycle”: fear of pain increases vigilance, leading to more pain.
• Quote:
  • “Pain is real. It’s just that pain doesn’t necessarily mean damage.” (Wynn, [12:16])

Distinction:

• Sickness = bodily (physical) cause
• Illness = mind/brain-based experience
• 80% of healthcare spending treats “illness” rather than “sickness.” ([13:11–14:02])

2. Difference Between Fact, Faith, and Belief

[14:40–17:34]

• Wynn clarifies:
  • Fact: Objective truth, true regardless of belief (e.g., “the Earth is a sphere”).
  • Faith: Conviction requiring no evidence (e.g., “God rewards the righteous”).
  • Belief: Strong conviction open to new evidence.
• Many societal issues arise from conflating faith, facts, and beliefs.
• Quote:
  • “Beliefs are tools, not truths.” (Wynn, [15:29])

3. Overcoming Limiting Beliefs and Rumination

[14:02–19:47]

• Wynn defines limiting beliefs as those that restrict potential and increase suffering, contrasted with liberating beliefs that motivate and reduce suffering.
• Strategies to address rumination:
  • Reality/rumination log: Listing both good and bad outcomes for a balanced view.
  • Scheduled worry time: Allocating specific time for concerns, reducing incessant rumination.
  • Most rumination is rooted in limiting beliefs rather than objective reality.
• Quote:
  • “A limiting belief is a belief that saps motivation and increases suffering. A liberating belief supplies motivation and decreases suffering.” ([16:57])
  • “If you say to yourself, look, I have time to worry about this, it’s literally on my calendar…. Nine times out of ten, that thing…doesn’t even matter.” ([19:15])

4. Skepticism About Positive Thinking & The Right Way to Visualize

[20:31–23:15]

• Wynn critiques superficial positive thinking, manifesting, and vision boarding, referencing research (Gabriel Oettingen) showing that positive visualization alone can decrease motivation.
• Effective visualization focuses on actions and handling obstacles (mental contrasting), not just desired outcomes.
• Quote:
  • “I have a big problem with positive thinking. I think there’s a real negative side to positive thinking because…our blood pressure actually lowered as they were doing this…and they became less likely to actually do the things that they said they were gonna do.” ([21:16–21:51])

5. The Selectivity of Belief—Attention and Confirmation Bias

[24:38–27:01]

• Wynn emphasizes the brain’s selectivity: of the 11 million bits of information encountered each second, we consciously process about 50. This tiny “keyhole of attention” is defined by existing beliefs.
• People rarely examine whether their beliefs serve them; most are inherited passively from family, culture, or media.

6. Practical Application: Challenging and Choosing Beliefs

[28:02–29:23]

• Wynn urges listeners to deliberately examine areas of life where they are “stuck” for underlying limiting beliefs.
• He opposes telling people what to believe, instead recommending an ongoing process of assessment.

7. Science, Belief, and Public Messaging: COVID Example

[29:23–32:49]

• During COVID, US messaging often conflated “science” with unassailable fact, which Wynn argues backfired. In Singapore, officials (like Lawrence Wong) addressed opposing views respectfully and made clear that guidance was evidence-based and subject to revision.
• Quote:
  • “Before I listen to anybody share a political opinion…before you tell me your opinion, I need to hear how well you can share your opponent’s opinion…If you can’t…in good faith, steel man your opponent’s opinion…shut the hell up.” ([31:10–31:27])

8. The Power and Mechanisms of Placebo

[32:49–37:04]

• Wynn breaks down research showing placebos are effective even when labeled as such, provided there is an anticipatory response (expectation).
• Placebo effects are growing stronger over time as more people believe in their efficacy.
• The vitamin industry is cited as an example of widespread applied placebos: “if it works, maybe it’s not such a bad thing.” ([36:33])
• Quote:
  • “Placebos work if you tell people placebos work.” ([34:51])

9. Optical Illusions as a Tool for Openness

[38:21–41:09]

• Wynn discusses the obligatory use of optical illusions in psychology books to demonstrate the fallibility of human perception, priming audiences to loosen rigid thinking.
• Even presented with evidence, people may not shift beliefs because their perception and beliefs operate through pre-existing “lenses.”
• Quote:
  • “Even when I tell you the truth, your eyes in conjunction with your brain won’t stop lying to you.” ([39:35])

10. Changing Minds: Perspective Taking

[40:49–41:09]

• To change someone’s beliefs, it’s crucial to genuinely understand their perspective (steel manning), rather than simply presenting facts.

Notable Quotes and Moments

• On the role of belief in pain and healing:

  • “Pain is real. It’s just that pain doesn’t necessarily mean damage.” — Wynn [12:16]

• On the distinction between fact, faith, and belief:

  • “Beliefs are tools, not truths.” — Wynn [15:29]

• On limiting beliefs:

  • “A limiting belief is a belief that saps motivation and increases suffering. A liberating belief supplies motivation and decreases suffering.” — Wynn [16:57]

• On positive thinking and visualization:

  • “I have a big problem with positive thinking. I think there’s a real negative side to positive thinking because…our blood pressure actually lowered as they were doing this…and they became less likely to actually do the things that they said they were gonna do.” — Wynn [21:16–21:51]

• On confirmation bias:

  • “Your brain is already lying to you, damn it.” — Wynn [25:09]

• On challenging others and self:

  • “Before you tell me your opinion, I need to hear how well you can share your opponent’s opinion…If you can’t…shut the hell up.” — Wynn [31:10–31:27]

• On placebos:

  • “Placebos work if you tell people, placebos work.” — Wynn [34:51]

• On the power of perspective:

  • “If we wanna change their minds, we have to try and see it from their perspective. We’re never gonna change their minds just by seeing it from our point of view.” — Wynn [40:49]

Segment Timestamps for Key Topics

• State of the Union quiz, banter & intro to guest: [01:43–07:21]
• Sofi Tukker and pain reprocessing therapy story: [07:49–11:47]
• Defining neuroplastic vs. physical pain; all pain is “real”: [11:47–14:02]
• Belief, fact, and faith; beliefs as tools/open to revision: [14:40–17:42]
• Rumination, strategies, and scheduled worry time: [17:42–19:47]
• Skepticism of positive thinking/visualization: [20:31–23:15]
• Attentional selectivity and confirmation bias: [24:38–27:01]
• Advice on choosing beliefs; practical application: [28:02–29:23]
• COVID, science messaging, and Singapore’s approach: [29:23–32:49]
• Placebo research and the power of expectation: [32:49–37:04]
• Optical illusions and open-mindedness: [38:21–41:09]

Conclusion

This episode underscores that beliefs, while not absolute truths, are powerful tools that shape our reality—health, happiness, and perception hinge on their flexibility. Wynn advocates for actively inspecting and revising beliefs based on evidence and personal utility, not dogma, and urges listeners to apply perspective-taking in both personal growth and political/social discourse. Replete with practical tips and engaging anecdotes, this conversation challenges listeners to hold their beliefs lightly and intentionally to live a more examined and empowered life.