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A
Hi just listeners.
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I would love for you to check.
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A
Out our new website. It has all the pesky information you ever wanted or ever needed. An episode link to every one of my podcasts. There's the gist. There's not even mad. There's funny you should mention more to come. Just starter packs. This is a great way to pitch the gist to someone who you think might like it. Easily shareable. Collect and trade them all information about the substack. Just list Pesca profundities and information about all the subscription options. Check back later this month for a big announcement on update. Don't worry, we won't just put it on the website. But the website's really good. I'm kind of proud. And those starter packs are a way to get people involved. Mike pesca.com. It's Friday, January 9, 2026 from Peach Fish Productions. It's the gist I Mike Pesca the oil tanker Marinera, formerly known as the Bella one was intercepted between Ireland and Iceland by US forces. Now it was rebranded Marinera, which is.
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B
Also to not be confused with the.
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A
Pasta sauce from Rao's. But it was rebranded this because I guess Marineura shares zero consonants with Bella one, so great ploy, guys. The Marinera is often described this way. I told you it was a busy day. It continues now. This is new video on the Caribbean. Check this out. That's the U.S. coast Guard seizing another Ghost Fleet tanker. So these are also called shadow tankers or the Shadow fleet or a ghost ship, yes. You know how ghosts are always trying to hide their identity and slip between Ireland and Iceland? You know, I've watched a lot of Scooby Doo that doesn't seem the most ghostly of behaviors. Ghost oil tankers. I've had that happen to me. You meet an oil tanker, they seem great, but then they won't return your calls. Bella, she told me her name was Marinera. So the real characteristic of the Ghost fleet of the ghost ship is that they're massive vessels that are into the old switcheroo. They switch names, flags, paperwork, GPS signals. Anything that makes the ownership and cargo harder to trace. A ghost ship can also mean a vessel whose providence is intentionally obscured, or a ship found drifting, abandoned, often with cannibal rats. That is an entirely different problem. And it means spooky, spooky tales of a ship as well, maybe as told by a scout leader with a flashlight under his chin. So the ghost ship has a few different names, but so does the ghost everything. When you call something a ghost doesn't really mean much. There is the ghost pepper, which is super spicy. There's the ghost gun, which I used to think we were all afraid of because of the branding. But then law enforcement officials told me, no, they're real and they're worrisome. But ghost guns are untraceable print at home. Firearms. Ghost oil tankers are not printed at home. Imagine the inkjet fees. Then there are ghost towns with abandoned places, the exact opposite of the oil tankers. Not abandoned. The whole point is to just rebrand it so you could use it.
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B
What the government or the US Government wanted Venezuela to do was to abandon it.
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A
Then there are ghost kitchens, which really do exist as kitchens. They're real. They might be spicy, they might not. But they just don't want you to know when you order from them that there's no actual restaurant involved. So it's a little like a ghost ship in that you got the obscuring aspect. And also they're connected to oil, but not like ghost ships. It's more the ship is more like the delivery guy in the ghost kitchen scenario. So we have ghosts that are abandoned ghosts, meaning DIY ghosts that are deliberately.
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Obscured ghosts that float with rats, ghosts.
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That tell you stories of campfires. Everything can be described as being a ghost. And if everything's a ghost, then nothing's a ghost. So maybe it's like in the Sixth Sense, maybe we're the ghost. I see dead people on the show today. I spoil the Sixth sense. Also, I will explain why the Trump administration thinks it's playing its hand correctly in Minnesota, though it is not. But first, he has a couple famous brothers. But also advice for us. And I got to tell you, if you are set to fly to Kilimanjaro tomorrow, you might want to read Reconsider. It's all part of the discussion in Eat yout Ice Cream. Six Simple Rules for a Long and Healthy Life. Zeke Emanuel. Up next.
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Logan Fury did something smart. He saved hundreds on auto insurance, switching to Progressive. With that money, he bought a mini treadmill. Is walking on it during video conference calls more distracting than he thought? Yes. And is that because he overestimated his foot eye coordination? Definitely. But it's Logan's savings. And if he wants to burn calories and any chance at a promotion, we say, good for you, Logan. Switch and see if you could save with Progressive and treat yourself. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates.
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It's all pretty simple, right?
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A
You just got to do a few.
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Simple things to maintain your health. I don't know, six to eight cups of water a day, getting your 10,000 steps. Stretching, that's what, five to 10 minutes. Moderate cardio meditation. That's good for five to 10 minutes. Oh, do you know about movement? Snacks for joints. Do one or two of those an hour. Balance two to three minutes a day. Plus you're going to want to eat, of course, 0.75 grams per body weight of protein. And then five to seven plant servings. And you got to get your fiber. And of course, you. You want a glass of alcohol a day. No, wait, you want no glasses of alcohol a day. And it's all very, very doable. Oh, no, you got to get eight hours sleep, maybe nine. It's impossible. What can you possibly do to keep this healthy lifestyle? So many small minute suggestions that are supposed to keep us healthy. Well, I got a big one.
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A
I got a change in all of.
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Those little mini suggestions. And it is the title of Ezekiel.
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Emanuel's new book, eat your ice cream.
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B
Now, does the doctor really mean that you should eat ice cream? In fact, he does, but also he gives you six simple rules for a long and healthy life. Dr. Emanuel, welcome, I believe, back to the gist.
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D
Yes, it is a blast. Thank you for having me.
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A
So do you.
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B
How much of those. Eight minutes a day on this and 12 minutes a day on that. And of course, I didn't even get to, you know, your mindfulness practice. How much do you do?
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D
How.
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How important is that stuff?
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D
So I will tell you what I do. I wake up and do 20 minutes of yoga with my wife. We Sometimes add on 5 minutes of core or not, depending on how rushed we are. We then eat a good breakfast, which I think is very important. It's actually a pretty big breakfast, but it's got a lot of protein and a lot of fiber in it. And I'm off to doing work and other things. And then three days, four days a week, I do vigorous exercise and some muscle strengthening. That's really the core. Now, in addition, I have dinner parties. So I have people over and we have. We talk, and I like to make new meals. But that's. That's the routine. And the routine is what you just do every day without thinking about it.
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A
Yeah.
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B
And in the book, you also say if you and your wife are in different cities, you'll do yoga via video.
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So technology helps.
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B
It's not only an impediment to actually getting active. Now, did you write the book as six simple rules? Because I know you read a bunch of the wellness literature out there, and by literature, I'M putting it in quotes, just books that purport to tell you how to live your life and they often have bullet points and a certain number. And so were you trying to give us that sort of regimentation because you see it was working for them, the enemy?
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D
No, actually, I will be perfectly honest. About four years ago, I think I answered a question that Arianna Huffington posed to me. Like, why isn't there more wellness in medical schools and teaching doctors when you see the doctor? And I said, well, look, wellness is six simple things and they're just not complicated. No one's making a ton of money on it, so there's no push for it. And so those six simple things actually are before I even read any wellness book. And I didn't actually know what they were saying, but I do think that they're the same. It's just that simple. And under each one there are of course some details, but in general you already know almost all of them. And I would say that a fair number of your listeners already do, a lot of them. And they do that as part of their everyday life.
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B
So when you told Arianna that and you said no, there are just six simple things. Were these things that you had determined or people go to medical school learn six things. How did you know that it was six and what the six were instantly like that?
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D
I had been thinking about it. First of all, you learned zero in medical school about wellness. And certainly 40 years ago when I went to med school, there was, as I say in the book, I had all of two lectures about sleeping and we still didn't know anything about it and nothing about nutrition at that point, zero. So I think it just, you know, I had been reading literature and it boiled down to six things that I had sort of been knocking around in my head not thinking about a book at all. Just, you know, these are the things that you gotta do.
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B
So the six things are, and I'm not going to exactly quote the chapters because a couple of them might get in the way and require a little explanation, but those are the ones I'm going to dig into there. Sleep, move, eat healthily. And there's big definitions about what that is. Stay mentally sharp, be social and avoid self destructive risks. Now of course, you being you, chapter one, avoid self destructive risks is called don't be a schmuck. Easier said than done for many of us. Now I think most of us know that being a schmuck constitutes or not being a schmuck means don't drive unsafe cars like you and Your brother Ari bought with bar mitzvah money. And I think we know don't get addicted to opioids. But let's start off with that thing that's right there in the beginning of the book. Glass of wine, one serving of alcohol a day. Going back and forth on that. What is the definition of schmuck when it comes to alcohol?
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D
Well, the definition of schmuck is drinking alone, binge drinking, and not planning for what happens if you have a glass and how you're going to get home and things like that. I look 65% or so of the American adult population drinks alcohol. We're not getting that to zero. Whatever. The surgeon general, the WHO and other people say, look, there's no health benefit to any alcohol. There are health risks like cancer, cognitive impairment, sleep disruption, cirrhosis of the liver, and other things. We're not getting to zero. So I think we have to be quite reasonable about it. One drink a day, half a drink a day. So three drinks a week, that's probably the max. That's in the low risk category, as they put it in England. But, you know, you should not. You should definitely not binge drink. And you should use it either as a celebration or to lubricate your social interactions.
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A
Yeah, that's what I was going to say.
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B
That I think I look at it as less of an evil to be managed and more of fitting in with a bunch of your other chapters. Socialization often occurs around having a drink or sharing a drink. And the lowering of temperatures often is, you know, let's talk this out over a beer, over a drink. I remember when my wife at the time was pregnant and we looked at the advice about drinking when you're pregnant and it's. You're not supposed to. And the American advice was something like, don't do it. And either the Canadian or English advice started with the sentence, alcohol is one of the great pleasures of life.
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A
And I said, yes, that they're meeting me where I am.
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B
So even if the literature on this changes, I do think that there is probably something to be said for drinking in quite a bit of moderation that actually fits in with an overall healthy lifestyle, even if the drink itself isn't the healthful part.
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D
I agree, and I think you've put it really well. It's an overall lifestyle. And as I say in the book, I'm a professor. You don't have to get. This isn't about perfection. We are not training to be Olympic gymnasts where one mistake and you don't get the gold medal. We are living a life for 40, 50 years. And here, 90% right is an A and 85% is a B. And that's a pretty damn good grade too, right? So, you know, if you're going to not drink but decrease your social life, that's probably a bad trade off, right? Now, no one's ever done that study. Probably you couldn't do that study. But it really does matter, the context. The same thing is true, by the way, of food. You know, people talk about this food being bad. And, you know, the question is, all right, you're not using butter in your cooking. What are you using? Is it worse for you or better for you? And those are the kinds of decisions people are making all the time. And what you want to do is get to a point where you're doing the healthy, the basic healthy things, and then the other stuff will take care of itself, like the ice cream.
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B
Well, I did read in your book, okay, not butter, but olive oil. Like a teaspoon and a half of olive oil a day has a decrease, 28% decrease in dementia, death. What would be the pathway to that being a correlation?
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D
Well, probably cardiovascular changes. Olive oil is really. Of all the oils and things, it's the best. So if you can afford it, and it is expensive and getting more expensive, if you can afford it, it's really the best thing for your salads to put in your frying pans and things like that.
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B
Oh, so are they saying that if you're going to use something as a butter substitute, that's the best, or are they just saying, even if you're not getting your olive oil consumption a day, take that teaspoon and a half, it doesn't have to be extra virgin. But we also haven't done the study on what lesser grades of olive oil do to you.
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D
They're saying the latter. And my point is there are plenty of places you can get your olive oil in that enhance your eating. And you don't take it on a teaspoon. That's just like, not a good idea.
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B
So the first chapter is, don't be a schmuck. Not doing stupid things may be the most important action you could take. I appreciated at the end that you addressed climbing Mount Everest because it is a pretty stupid thing to do. You know, it has a 1% death rate. This is the same reason why I don't skydive. I don't know, maybe you can make. Okay, it's okay. Go ahead, tell me.
- [15:42]
D
Let's just get. This is where you know, I want to do the data for. For you and for people. That's part of why I did the book is I sort of get hung up on data. So climbing Mount Everest. And by the way, I have not climbed Mount Everest. I've come, I've climbed Kilimanjaro. And. But climbing Mount Everest, which is 10,000ft higher than Kilimanjaro, the death rate, all comers, including the experts and the Sherpas, 1 in 100. And if you're over 59, it's 1 in 25. Now, those odds are insane in my opinion. And to climb so you can crow that, oh, I've climbed to my own Everest, seems like a really schmucky move. Skydiving, on the other hand, 1 in 100,000 deaths. So actually, it's pretty good as you go because there's a lot of safety precautions in that. The other thing I would say is I had initially thought, God, BASE jumping must be the stupidest thing you can do, right? You know, you got that Michelin squirrel suit. You jump off a mountain. There's no parachutes or anything. Turns out that the death rate there is 1 in 2700. So it's 27 times safer than going up to Mount Everest. But I have found something even more dangerous than climbing Mount Everest.
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B
Go ahead.
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D
Being president. So we've had 45 men president and four have been shot. Lincoln, Garfield, Kennedy. And where am I missing one? Oh, McKinley.
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B
Okay, well, four have been shot and killed.
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One in 11.
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A number have been shot and not killed. Jack Reagan.
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D
That's eight of them. So we've had 12 who, you know, eight of them ended up surviving, but four of them died. So that's probably. You know, Mike, you should reconsider running for president because, well, very dangerous job.
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B
You don't have to tell me. I'm not in that position. But it's. You know, you have a brother who very well might be running for president. What do you tell him?
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D
I gave him the data, okay?
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The data. That's all we could do.
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A
And what if he disappoints you and.
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Says, I've decided not to run, but I will be climbing Everest? You don't get it wrong.
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D
That will be easy when you look.
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B
At the charts comparing US lifespan, which has reversed slightly and it is gaining since the pandemic because you understand lifespan. I don't know how many people do, but it's extrapolation of what would happen if the. If the facts of a year are obtained throughout one's entire life. So during a pandemic, we have to assume, what if there was a pandemic every year? And then of course, lifespan would go down. But compared to our peer countries in the oecd, it's lower. Is most of that the schmuck elements?
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D
No. For example, we have a lower smoking rate than almost every country in Europe, just as an example, we do have a much higher obesity rate. We have a much higher eating of ultra processed foods. But that's not the fundamental. I mean, the obesity rate is contributing to the low life expectancy through heart disease, kidney disease and other things. The fundamental problem is we have a very, very bad prevention system. The incentives to actually do prevention, including things like exercise and a better diet, are very bad. In the US we also have a food system that is quite poor. We subsidize soybeans and corn and wheat and rice instead of fruits and vegetables, for example, or dairy. We do subsidize dairy, but not to get more kids drinking milk and having unsweetened yogurts, which would be a very good thing for kids to do. So it isn't in the schmuck move, but it's in the rest of the wellness book. The eating well, the sleeping, the sociability, all of those are critical things, right, that undercut our life expectancy.
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B
Well, for a while, we had a much higher opioid death rate. When I say much higher Europe, except Scotland didn't have essentially an opioid problem and we have a much higher murder rate. That doesn't come into play on a national level so much, but it edges it up a little bit. Even our auto deaths, I think, per mile driven costs, our cars are so much bigger, but also maybe because of other danger factors. And from what I understand, wearing seatbelts even a couple of percentage points lower than they do in Europe, this all factors in. But you of course are absolutely right about what changes, what's the big difference between us and Europe? But this gets me to eating your ice cream. Ultra processed foods ice cream, for the most part, unless you get a very homemade or bespoke one, is an ultra processed food. So why should we eat it?
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D
Because it's dairy. That's the fundamental benefit of that. You know, dairy's gone from, you know, really essential to sort of get a bad rep recently. And the usda, the Department of Agriculture, pushes dairy mostly for the calcium, but that's totally wrong. So the positives of dairy are you get taller, especially if you consume it younger in age.
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A
There are Dutch huge dairy eaters Very.
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B
Tall people block your view at a Dylan concert.
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D
The Danes, also the Danes, you get a lot of protein from dairy. And if you have yogurt or kefir, you also get fermentation. And that's probiotics. Good for your microbiome in your gut, which is good for the right absorption. All sorts of positive benefits there. So. And by the way, it also decreases your risk for diabetes and for colorectal cancer, two big problems in America, probably mainly through affecting the microbiome. So that's the area. Now, if you eat good ice cream, by good, I mean the stuff without the emulsifiers. Yes. There is sugar in that and that's one of the reasons you don't eat it every day. Although I know plenty of people who eat it every day. It is actually good for you. And that's what the data show. And so I'm a data driven guy. You can have ice cream and I don't know, is it two times a week, three times a week, that's probably the limit. And you can enjoy it and make sure that, I mean, here's one of the important things that Americans have to learn. You know, a little moderation on it. Three times a week. And you don't need a whole pint at the sitting. Right. You have a scoop or two scoops.
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B
You write at the end of the book, why you wrote the book. At the end of 2023, I read one of the seemingly endless books being published by the Wellness Industrial Complex. It infuriated me. It emphasized exercise with smaller sections on diet and sleep, totally leaving out social relationships and mental engagement. Plus, if you did all these unproven things, that would take up all your day. So I too am often inspired by a little bit of anger at what's out there. I'm going to assume this book was atomic habits. I don't know if the book was atomic habits. So here's the thing. This the experience you had. You're a man of science, you have some connection to the publishing industry, and people like Harris Wisher and Adam Grant will help you out. But mostly I think the average person has no defenses against this. And so you would see you. You realize why, inundated as they are by a great story about how regular medicine isn't up to the task, you have figures like Casey Means, who quit med school at the last minute and subscribes with her brother to a lot of, I'd say, outlandish theories. And now she's poised where she's Surgeon General. What one piece of Advice is, you know, follow your six rules. But what about in general, just the information environment that we're in? Is there anything that your profession is not doing correctly such that the wellness industry has rushed in and exploited all the deficits that medicine, Western medicine has allowed to be exploited?
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D
Wow, that is a super complicated and really penetrating question. Really insightful. So, first of all, it is the case that I think medicine, the profession of medicine, the hospitals, the doctors, we have failed on the wellness side, and there's lots of reasons for it. The reimbursement system doesn't incentivize us to prevent. To focus on prevention and wellness is about prevention. We aren't taught that and systematically. We always think it's someone else's job. So there is a deficit there. And then I think often patients feel they go to the doctor's office and they want to ask about this, and the doctor isn't. It's not part of their regular routine. They don't know what to say on the fly. They don't say, here are the six things, or give them a pamphlet that they've created or anything like that. And then we have had in the recent years a change in the media environment so that people can get up there and spout off whatever they want and there's no check on them. And then I do think there are some things that people like Kasey Means are pushing, which are totally right. The problem in America is chronic illness, and we have to confront that. It is 90 cents of every dollar in healthcare goes for chronic illness. They're all connected. They're connected to our diet regimen, as we mentioned. They're connected to exercise, sleep, et cetera. And so we have to confront those elements if we really want to improve things. But I would also take a step back, Mike, which is there's a history to all this wellness stuff. You know, 150 years ago, beginning in the roughly the 1870s, there was a big wellness boom, a huge one. And many of the titles of books from that time, you could sell them today. There were magazines that fit right in between Self and Men's Health. So there's something beyond just the medical profession. There is something related to the underlying social moment. So what is it? Well, we have a lot of immigration, a lot of concentration of people in cities. There's an industrial revolution. It was the second industrial revolution, machinery and stuff at the end of the 19th century. Today it's AI there's a lot of income inequality. In both those moments, there's a lot of nationalism and xenophobia at those moments. Antisemitism was prevalent at both those moments. We could go on and on. What is the wellness response? The wellness response is my world is out of control. I don't know if I'm going to have a job. I don't know how everything's changing. I want to focus on things I can control that I have autonomy over. And that, I think, is part of the appeal of the wellness moment today. And it does reflect a moment when the medical profession isn't doing prevention, isn't doing wellness at all. And so I think it all is a problem. One of the things I think we need to focus on is what would it take to change the medical system so that wellness, focusing on wellness, like eating well, exercise, encouraging sociabilities is part of the focus of the care we get. And then I think the influencers might be less potent and people would be healthier.
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B
The name of the book is eat your ice cream. Six simple rules for a long and healthy life. Thank you so much.
- [28:08]
D
Thank you. And the book party is going to be at an ice cream factory. I will say.
- [28:19]
A
And now the spiel. It may eventually be the case that the killing of Renee Nicole Good falls into what they call the category of awful but lawful. If so, public officials who have already deemed it murder will have been proven factually inaccurate, even as they would claim the mantle of moral truth. Zoran Momdani is among them. But what interests me here is not the moral framing. It's how the Trump administration is handling this politically. The protesters have an answer to how the Trump administration is handling everything, and that is infuriatingly. Democrats in the affected states or figures like Mamdani speaking from outside them. The Trump response is unconscionable. A top DHS official said rioters began blocking ICE officers. And one of these violent rioters weaponized her vehicle, attempting to run over our law enforcement officers in an attempt to kill them. An act of domestic terrorism. Maybe a couple of the verbs in that statement are accurate. But what about the broader American public, most of which voted for Trump and roughly 40% of which still supports him? I think the administration is handling this very poorly, even by the lights of its own self interest. So not what I consider the interests of the country, not what I consider the best for humanity, just for their own self interest. There is a tendency to believe that Trump operates from a reliable playbook, that he leverages cynicism and nefariousness into political wins almost all the time. And it's true. Some of the time. But he also racks up political losses by being stupid and authorizing stupid responses rhetorically. And actually, the administration's initial reaction, treating a woman in an SUV as a rioting terrorist, looks like an embarrassment that will redound to their detriment. Consider what happened the other day on cbs. Tom Holman, the border czar, was shown the video of the killing for the first time. Asked to react, he said this.
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E
It'd be unprofessional to comment on what I think happened in that situation. Let the investigation play out and hold people accountable based on the investigation.
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A
That response was correct. It was proper. Activists and Democrats might not like it, but that's what a responsible public official should do. Precisely the tone the administration should have adopted from the start. It was Homan's instinct, because for whatever his flaws, he's done this before. The interviewer, Tony decouple, then asked the obvious follow up. Well, if that's the case, why didn't Kristi Noem and other DHS officials take that approach initially?
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F
I think many members of the public are calling for the same thing, and so they're confused. Maybe you can help me understand how the Department of Homeland Security could conclude so swiftly that this is a, quote, act of domestic terrorism, that this woman, quote, weaponized her vehicle by the very same standard you described, this investigation is just getting started.
- [31:32]
E
That's a, that's a question for Homeland security on the border.
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A
On the border czar, the Trump administration operates on two related assumptions, that whenever it fights the libs, it wins and that whenever it injects chaos, it wins. Those assumptions clearly inform the decision to mobilize the National Guard and send it into blue cities or blue states over the objections of local officials. But sometimes, sometimes they lose the habit of picking fights with the libs, or the left sometimes also puts them on the wrong side of the moderates, the non liberals, members of their own coalition, or, and this is really important, people who barely pay attention to politics. Trump backed off the Jimmy Kimmel threat because he has enough sense, call it reptilian cunning, to recognize when he's lost too much of the public, when people who normally don't even watch politics say, what are you doing? The administration softened its tariff bluster for slightly different, different reasons. It became clear that the bond market, which isn't liberal, was pushing back in a way that could really, really wreck things. And here too, I am not making a moral or normative claim. There is an is ought distinction going on. Trump and Kristi Noem ought to have done things differently. Many, many things. But my point is more narrow. What the administration has done in the early stages of this burgeoning crisis is guaranteeing that it will be more of a crisis than it would have other is not going to help them. Even on their own terms, they may believe blowback is their friend. This looks less like that and more like reaping the whirlwind. And that's it for today's show.
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B
Corey War is the producer.
- [33:16]
A
Kathleen Sykes helps me with the gist list. Astrid Green redid our website. It's a really good website now. It has these starter packs that you could survey or send a friend to get to know me. Leah Yane is our production coordinator. And Michelle Pesca is the chief Blowback officer of Peachfish Productions. Oompuru Jeepuru Duparu. And thanks for listening.