The Gist (August 22, 2025)

Episode: "The Working Class Party with the Post-Graduate Jargon"

Host: Mike Pesca
Guest: Mackenzie Wilson, Director of External Affairs and Message Strategy at Blue Rose Research

Overview

This episode of The Gist explores the Democratic party’s ongoing struggle to appeal to the working class and low-information voters, particularly in light of their disappointing 2024 election results. Host Mike Pesca and guest Mackenzie Wilson dive into why Democrats are losing ground among key demographics, the pitfalls of post-graduate jargon, and what practical messaging and policy strategies might reverse these trends. Additional segments delve into the topic of conspiracy versus conspiracy theory, perceived media biases, and listener feedback around the Israel-Gaza conflict.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Election Losses and Voter Demographics

[05:52]–[10:14]

• Democrats’ 2024 Election Performance:
  Pesca opens with a stark breakdown: "Democrats lost 4.3% of women and... 21% of black men and 19% of Hispanic men... Every demographic except they made little tiny gains with white women. This is not good here too." (05:52)

• Longer-Term Trends, Not Just 2024:
  Wilson underscores that these declines reflect a “much longer trend than just this past election cycle” and that, compared to 2016, "the scale of losses that we saw in 2024 was equal to that scale of losses. So we did that erosion once again.” (07:30)

• Younger Voters Turning Right:
  “Millennials were the most liberal generation in decades. And it looks like Gen Z is about to be the most Republican or most conservative generation in decades since the Great Depression. Yeah, it's not great for Democrats right now.” (08:07)

• Low Propensity/Low Information Voters:
  Wilson notes a dramatic reversal: “It used to be if you could figure out a way to get them to the voting booth... they were probably going to vote for Democrats... now more Republican or more conservative.” (10:02)

Quote [10:14], Wilson: “It used to be if we could just get everyone to turn out to vote, we’d win. That is no longer true.”

2. The Democrats’ Policy & Messaging Dilemma

[11:02]–[18:25]

• Relying on GOP Mistakes?
  Pesca asks if Democrats hope “Republican mistakes might make up for Democratic deficiencies.” He wonders if relying on opposition blunders allows Dems to avoid introspection and needed policy shifts. (11:02)

• The Economic Issue Trifecta:
  Wilson: “For the last few years, the only thing that voters across every demographic prioritize as their number one issue is the cost of living... Number two is inflation. Number three is the economy. It's really the same thing.” (13:16)

• Popular vs. Effective Solutions:
  The hosts debate the popularity—but also the limits—of ideas like rent freezes and price controls, which sound good to some voters but are problematic in practice:

  Pesca [14:58]: "...almost every economist in the world will say this is one of the most tried and true terrible ideas."

• Winning vs. Solving:
  Pesca: “Great politicians correctly diagnose the problem, great leaders solve the problem. But those are two different things.” (16:31)

• The ‘Trump Advantage’ on Diagnosing Sentiment:
  Wilson explains that Trump’s campaign managed to connect everything to inflation and elite disconnect, striking a populist chord that crossed ideology. (17:11)

3. Democracy vs. Cost of Living: What Motivates Voters

[18:25]–[21:19]

• Autocracy Concerns Don’t Motivate Swing Voters:
  Pesca asks why “threats to democracy” messaging doesn’t seem to resonate with the median or low-information voter. Wilson acknowledges the disconnect:

  Wilson [19:11]: “A majority of the electorate saw Kamala Harris as the extremist and Donald Trump closer to themselves... If we don't acknowledge that pain that voters are going through and offer solutions... we can't win elections and we can't stop what is happening.”

• Distrust in Institutions:
  “An overwhelming majority of Americans are feeling distrust in the system itself, distrust in the economy. And so it is very hard... to want to protect the democracy or protect institutions that you feel like are not delivering for you.” (20:48)

4. The Jargon Trap: Post-Graduate Language and Alienation

[21:19]–[24:24]

• List of Buzzwords to Avoid:
  Pesca notes a memo with terms for Democrats to ditch: “Privilege, violence is an environmental violence. Dialoguing, triggering, othering, microaggression, holding space...” and more. (21:19)

• Disconnect from Working-Class Voters:
  Wilson is blunt: “Fundamentally it is all postgraduate or PhD level, either idealism or just sort of messaging. And in general, we can't talk about being the party of working class voters when people don't even understand what half of those words mean.” (22:41)

• Not Even Activists Know the Lingo:
  The host references a viral ‘holding space’ moment from the Wicked cast—neither actor knew what it meant, perfectly illustrating the alienation.

• Need for “100% Issues”:
  “We have to think about the hundred percent issues and not issues that are, you know, only matter to a smaller and smaller portion of the electorate.” (23:49)

5. Substance Over Slogans: When Language Is (and Isn’t) the Issue

[24:24]–[27:02]

• Clarity in Messaging:
  Wilson: “Sometimes we come up with catchy phrases. I mean, this is how you get into a defund the police. Right. Like we have to explain what we're even talking about.” (25:55)

• Don’t Shy from Core Values But Stay Grounded:
  “Some of our values and ideals are baked in. But... when we, you know, alienate the people that we are trying to reach with the very language we are using, we are not just ineffective. We're, we're quite literally talking to a circle of ourselves.” (34:53)

6. The ‘Sister Souljah’ Question and Cultural Issues

[27:02]–[32:20]

• Is a ‘Sister Souljah’ Moment Possible Today?
  Pesca wonders if Democrats can “clearly separate themselves from some of these albatross issues.” Wilson is pragmatic: “I think it's possible... but when you look proportionally... what voters care about the most, it's even less on the Republican or independent side on those cultural issues than it is the really tangible policies.” (28:35)

• Stay on Message—Play Your “Greatest Hits”:
  “No one goes to see Elton John to go listen to the new stuff, they want to hear Tiny Dancer... We have to start be creating our greatest hits so that people know and have familiarity with what we mean when we're talking about what Democrats really stand for.” (29:53)

7. Issue Focus: Health Care and Immigration

[30:57]–[32:54]

• Health Care as a Winning Issue:
  “Democrats have to constantly be bringing things back to health care. It is what we kind of think of at my firm as, like... an issue where Democrats have a massive trust advantage... It's also incredibly important to voters.” (30:57)

• Events & Grassroots Action:
  Wilson suggests actionable tactics: hospital events, nurse walkouts, protests against Medicaid cuts and looming ACA premium increases.

• Immigration Realism:
  Even among Hispanic moderates, “a lot of Trump's immigration policies... are popular. And so it's hard for me to say... how certain demographics will necessarily respond to everything. But at least right now, that's not what we're seeing.” (32:54)

8. Who’s Getting It Right?

[34:09]–[35:52]

• Andy Beshear (KY Governor):
  Wilson singles out Gov. Beshear for “constantly bring[ing] it back to... being unapologetic about being a Democrat” while using language the electorate actually understands:

  Wilson [34:53]: “He had a recent appearance where he was talking about we can't be saying justice involved individuals. We're talking about inmates. And that's okay, right?”

Notable Quotes

• “Cost of living three times. Right? ...This was, I think, a pretty red flashing light for Democrats and Republicans.”
  — Mackenzie Wilson (13:23)

• “The way to win is, as I see it, just at least correctly diagnosing the problem in a way that resonates with Americans, which is what Trump has done and which, as all the polling shows, the Democrats haven't done.”
  — Mike Pesca (16:31)

• “A majority of the electorate saw... Kamala Harris as the extremist and Donald Trump closer to themselves.”
  — Mackenzie Wilson (19:11)

• “We can't talk about being the party of working class voters when people don't even understand what half of those words mean.”
  — Mackenzie Wilson (22:41)

• “No one goes to see Elton John to go listen to the new stuff. They want to hear Tiny Dancer. ...We have to start be creating our greatest hits.”
  — Mackenzie Wilson (29:53)

• “When we... alienate the people that we are trying to reach with the very language we are using, we are not just ineffective. We're, we're quite literally talking to a circle of ourselves.”
  — Mackenzie Wilson (34:53)

Additional Segments

The Antoine Tig: Conspiracy Theories vs. Conspiracies

[37:10]–[56:32]

• Pesca tackles listener emails on the difference between conspiracies and conspiracy theories, arguing that some real-world conspiracies (e.g. Catholic Church abuse, Enron) were not “conspiracy theories” prior to exposure.
• Critiques how some listeners misapply “conspiracy theory” to known or proven events—draws sharp boundaries on definitions.
• Discusses perceived inconsistency in media attention to global conflicts—contrasts the Gaza coverage with overlooked wars in Yemen, Tigray, Sudan.
• Addresses (briefly) accusations that he is too pro-Israel; responds by highlighting attention and coverage disparities.

Quote [54:41], Pesca: “I will never, ever stop myself from criticizing someone or something that I think is wrong or worthy of critique because it is left or because it is right. ...I got to stop punching left because there is a burgeoning autocrat in the White House. Just not what I do.”

Summary & Takeaways

• The Democratic Party’s messaging and priorities are deeply misaligned with the current electorate, especially as key demographics shift rightward and working-class voters tune out 'post-graduate' progressive jargon.
• Real-world pain—cost of living, inflation, economic insecurity—dwarfs institutional or abstract concerns around democracy for the median voter.
• Democrats need to return to “greatest hits” issues—like health care and economic security—with plain, clear language.
• There is skepticism about whether the party can—or is willing to—shed divisive language and symbolic cultural fights.
• Guests and host agree: Addressing everyday concerns in relatable terms is not only strategic—it’s existential for Democrats’ political survival.

For listeners looking to understand the strategic, linguistic, and policy crossroads for the Democratic Party in a post-2024 landscape, this episode is a candid—and at times, bracing—conversation about what it takes to reconnect with the American electorate.