Charlie Kirk WARNED: The Right CANNOT Give Into THIS Temptation | The Glenn Beck Podcast REPLAY

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Glenn Beck Program

Episode: "Charlie Kirk WARNED: The Right CANNOT Give Into THIS Temptation"
Date: September 20, 2025
Host: Glenn Beck
Guest: Charlie Kirk

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Overview

In this compelling and spirited conversation, Glenn Beck sits down with Charlie Kirk, founder of Turning Point USA, backstage at a Student Action Summit. The discussion centers on the state of American conservatism, lessons from the past, generational hope, and the ideological temptations facing the political right. Beck and Kirk delve deeply into topics such as authenticity in politics, the perils of government overreach, the importance of individual liberty, and the spiritual roots of America’s founding, offering both personal anecdotes and philosophical frameworks for understanding current cultural battles.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Hope in a New Generation (00:57–04:03)

• Beck challenges the stereotype that young Americans are lazy, expressing optimism after witnessing the energy at Turning Point USA events:

  “I think one of the biggest lies today is the rap that is given to, you know, 15 to 30 year olds... But I don’t think that’s true... Today's guest gives me real hope that I'm right on this.” (Glenn Beck, 00:57)

• Turning Point USA’s impact: Beck describes the movement's fast growth and cultural significance, crediting Kirk for sparking activism among thousands of young Americans.

2. Authenticity and Leadership in U.S. Politics (04:03–12:43)

• Charlie Kirk recounts his admiration for Beck’s influence and the importance of admitting when one is wrong:

  “It’s really refreshing to hear people say, no, I was wrong about something. I’ve been wrong about stuff...” (Charlie Kirk, 04:24)

• Beck’s personal story of a candid call from President Trump (05:02–08:27), highlighting why authenticity matters more than political pandering.
• The appeal of “clarity over agreement”:

  “At least he told me the truth. He was not pandering to me.” (Glenn Beck, 11:38)

• Both agree that the public’s yearning for authenticity transcends left-right divides.

3. Division and Temptations on the Right (14:38–22:57)

• Emergence of the “new right”: Kirk signals a coming division within conservatism, specifically around the temptation to use government power to enforce moral standards, such as banning pornography or controlling tech companies.
• Beck warns against this:

  “You are no different than what you're fighting against.” (Glenn Beck, 15:44)

  • Cites historical roots in the Progressive Era (Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson) of such thinking (16:02–17:33).
• Liberty vs. Government Power:
  • “You can't control other people's morality. You can teach why it's destructive, but you become the fascist when you decide this is immoral. And thus I'm gonna make sure nobody does it.” (Glenn Beck, 17:05)

4. Debate Over Trust-Busting and Big Tech (18:28–22:57)

• The complications of capitalism: Beck and Kirk discuss historic trust-busting, the power of monopolies, and the risk of repeating Progressive-era mistakes by using state power to correct market outcomes.
• Beck’s prescription:

  “You have to make the government so small that there's no one really to bribe.” (Glenn Beck, 21:51)

5. America’s Mission Statement and Individual Liberty (23:08–28:59)

• Founding ideals: Extensive exchange about the Declaration of Independence, the necessity of letting individuals both succeed and fail, and the dangers of “tyranny of the majority” or minority.
• Religious and philosophical grounding:

  “...if you are not allowed to succeed, well, then you’re not going to be able to fail. And if you’re only allowed to fail because the entire system is failing, you won’t know the sweet. You won’t grow.” (Glenn Beck, 31:36)

6. Human Nature, Progressivism, and Original Sin (28:59–36:19)

• Contrasting worldviews: Kirk introduces the idea that the political left sees individuals as fundamentally good, corrupted by structures, while the right sees the “brokenness” of human nature (original sin).
• Philosopher Kings and American skepticism:

  “Every man has to start over... I reject both of those [philosopher king theories].” (Glenn Beck, 29:52)

• Historical example: Discussion of Winston Churchill as a case study in personal growth and complexity.

7. Religion, Atheism, and the Search for Meaning (36:19–40:02)

• Rise of atheism:
  • “I call them evangelical atheists because they evangelize more than evangelical Christians do.” (Charlie Kirk, 32:17)
• Nietzsche, God, and Replacement Idols: Beck discusses how removing God from society inevitably leads to state worship or new “gods” like science or the environment.
• Personal stories: Beck shares a moving story about his friendship with atheist Penn Jillette and their dialogue over religion and respect.

8. Vision for America and Its Exceptionalism (40:02–48:54)

• Preview of Beck’s message to students: He discusses the iterative, collaborative nature of America’s founding documents (presenting Kirk with an engraving of the Declaration’s first draft).
• Slavery and the founders: Citing Jefferson’s personal stand against slavery in the Declaration’s draft, Beck debunks the narrative that America was “built by racists.”
• American uniqueness:
  • “We are not the nation we used to be.” (Glenn Beck, 48:41)
  • “No, we're not [just like every other country]. We are an exceptional country.” (Glenn Beck & Charlie Kirk, 48:04)
• Cultural artifacts: Beck shares rare historical items, such as a WWII leaflet warning Japanese civilians before the atomic bombings, to demonstrate American exceptionalism and moral consideration.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On authenticity:

  “The American people would much prefer someone who’s authentic... Even if you might fundamentally disagree with... [I’d] deal with that way more than an establishment Republican in a heartbeat.”
  — Charlie Kirk (11:07)

• Against government overreach:

  “You can’t control other people’s morality... You become the fascist when you decide ‘this is immoral and thus I’m going to make sure nobody does it.’”
  — Glenn Beck (17:05)

• Cultural divide on the right:

  “This is the coming divide, though, Glenn... I don’t like something, this is horrible, this is evil... You are no different than what you’re fighting against.”
  — Charlie Kirk, mirrored by Glenn Beck (15:39–15:44)

• American aspiration:

  “We hold these truths to be self-evident... That is the greatest mission statement of all time.”
  — Glenn Beck (26:41)

• On the necessity of failure and individual freedom:

  “Everyone has to be able to fall. Everyone has to be able to bleed. Everyone has to be able to succeed because it’s about the individual, not the group.”
  — Glenn Beck (25:49)

• Rejecting statism as a replacement faith:

  “The left, their God is the planet, Global warming, socialism. And if you don’t genuflect... you are a part of the problem and you must be run out of town because you’re a heretic.”
  — Glenn Beck (33:56)

• On American exceptionalism:

  “We are not the nation we used to be.”
  — Glenn Beck (48:41)

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Important Timestamps

• 00:57 – Beck's introduction and optimism about new generations
• 04:03 – Charlie Kirk joins; mutual reflections on leadership and authenticity
• 07:12 – Beck details candid call with President Trump
• 14:38 – Turning Point’s generational impact and hope for the future
• 15:32 – The coming divide on the right: policing morality and government power
• 17:05 – Beck warns against repeating progressive overreach
• 22:13 – “Make government so small that there’s no one to bribe”; curing corruption
• 26:41 – Beck recites the Declaration as the “greatest mission statement”
• 31:36 – Growth through adversity: Churchill as an example
• 36:19 – Religion, atheism, and meaning in public life
• 40:02 – Beck’s historical show-and-tell: Declaration drafts, anti-slavery evidence, unique American artifacts
• 48:41 – Closing affirmations of American exceptionalism and generational hope

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Final Reflection

This episode highlights both the philosophical and practical struggles within the American right. Beck and Kirk’s dialogue urges today’s conservatives to resist the temptation of wielding government for culture war victories, emphasizing a return to foundational principles of liberty, individual responsibility, and national exceptionalism. Through stories, history, and pointed warnings, the conversation provides an unapologetically hopeful vision—if the right resists the urge for authoritarian measures and doubles down on persuasion, authenticity, and faith in the next generation.

Transcript

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[Glenn Beck]

And now Ablaze Media Podcast hello America. You know we've been fighting every single day. We push back against the lies, the censorship, the nonsense of the mainstream media that they're trying to feed you. We work tirelessly to bring you the unfiltered truth because you deserve it. But to keep this fight going, we need you right now. Would you take a moment and rate and review the Glenn Beck podcast? Give us five stars and leave a comment. Because every single review helps us break through Big Tech's algorithm to watch, to reach more Americans who need to hear the truth. This isn't a podcast. This is a movement and you're part of it. A big part of it. So if you believe in what we're doing, you want more people to wake up, help us push this podcast to the top rate, review, share, together, we'll make a difference. And thanks for standing with us. Now let's get to work. You know, I think one of the biggest lies today is the rap that is given to, you know, 15 to 30 year olds. They're all called lazy, self centered participation trophy generation. You know, gosh, we're all going to be destroyed when they finally take over. But I don't think that's true. I mean, I think there are those dirtbags, but that's not the majority, at least the ones I've met. And today's guest gives me real hope that I'm right on this. He saw a problem and he didn't wait around for someone else to fix it. Instead, he inspired high school and college students across the nation to be the voice of freedom. He's a guy who, when he was a kid, watched my show on television, and by the time he's in high school and then in college, he wants to change the world. He's somebody who President Trump has called a great warrior and is no stranger to leftist criticism. He's been called every name in the book for daring to support free speech on college campuses while questioning affirmative action and white privilege. He is the founder of an organization that was nowhere, didn't even exist just a few years ago. It's Turning Point usa. It is the largest, most impressive, and fastest growth youth movement in the country, chapters at over 1500 schools in America. It's also worldwide now. Recently, I was invited to speak at their fifth annual Student Action Summit, and what I saw amazed me. Over 5,000 students attending on their own dime from all across the country and fired up about the truth of America. But before I took the stage, my guest and I had an opportunity to sit down, and we shared what we've gotten wrong, what our country must get right, and the amazing things that happen when people work together and do it. On this episode of the Glenn Beck Podcast, backstage with Charlie Kirk.

[Charlie Kirk]

So, Glenn, so great to be sitting down here, and it's an honor to be able to speak with you.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah, likewise. Thank you so much.

[Charlie Kirk]

I grew up listening to you and watching your show with the blackboard.

[Glenn Beck]

Well, thank you very much.

[Charlie Kirk]

It was more instructive than you could have ever imagined.

[Glenn Beck]

Wow, that is meaningful.

[Charlie Kirk]

And you've been right about everything that you predicted.

[Glenn Beck]

Not everything wrong about Donald Trump.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, I was talking more back in 2012 or 2013, but it's really refreshing to hear people say, no, I was wrong about something. I've been wrong about stuff. I endorsed Cruz, and I was behind him, and I think Trump surprised all of us.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah. You know, I haven't really even talked about this on the air. I think. I think I maybe have obliquely referenced it recently, but must have been about six months ago. The President called me, and we haven't spoken since before the election.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

And we always had a friendly relationship, you know, and he. If I was traveling, I would stay at Mar a Lago and he'd be someplace else. But we haven't spoken to each other since the election. And he called me up and. And I'll never forget my Scottish assistant who was part of the Royal Marines. He comes in while we're shooting a show and he's off stage and he's like, the president wants to talk to you. And I said, cut. Stop for a second. What? And he said, the president is on the phone. And I said, the president of what?

[Charlie Kirk]

Some university or Bolivia or.

[Glenn Beck]

He's the president of Costco. Why are you interrupting? And he said, of your country. And I said, oh, crap. And I didn't even know what to do. And I strangely said, can you ask him if I can call him back? I'm in the middle of shooting a show. What a stupid thing to say. And so he said, okay. We finished up the show. I called him back about 30 minutes later and we talked for about a half an hour.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

And it was a. It was a really. I wish more people knew him and could hear him like that. Because he. He started in and he said, you know, I want to thank you for, you know, saying some nice things about me. And he thought I was taking this a different direction. And I said, well, I don't know if you know this, but during the last election. And he cut me off and he said, oh, no, I'm very aware of that. I said, no, no, no, not that I'm clear. You are aware of that. I said. What I said was, I want to be wrong. I don't think I am, but I want to be wrong. And I'm gonna judge him. I'm having to judge him on what I think he's going to do.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

Now once he's the president, I get to judge him for what he is doing. And I said, so there was never any doubt in my mind, at least, that if you did the things that you said you were going to do, I'd be a supporter. I just didn't think you'd do them. And, you know, we talked about Israel, we talked about trade. And I said, I strongly disagree. I bet we spent 15 minutes just on trade.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

And he did not shy away. He didn't tell me what I wanted to hear. Real, frank, honest conversation, which you don't have usually with a politician.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes.

[Glenn Beck]

And I think that's what people like about him, is that he really will tell you what he's thinking. The problem is sometimes, and yet the blessing is he is just P.T. barnum.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, and I'll tell you your a great example that shows the success of his presidency from a conservative worldview, which is there's more people supporting him that are saying, you know what? I was hoping he'd succeed. And he has, and he has been able to deliver results.

[Glenn Beck]

What's interesting is, at the time we're recording this, it's just, what day after the impeachment and last night, the president had a rally up in Michigan of those who attended were Democrats.

[Charlie Kirk]

That's right.

[Glenn Beck]

And I think there's a lot of people who, you know, I heard Ben Shapiro say the other day, it's whether you think the president is a killer or a coroner. These things, the press and everything else, they've been dead for a long time. Now he's standing over the body saying, they're dead. And the press now, and everybody else is saying, look, he killed the press. No, he didn't. They killed themselves a long time ago. So is he a coroner or is he the killer?

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

Half the country above 40% are convinced that he's the killer. The other half recognize this stuff has been rotted for a long, long time.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes. Well. And, Glenn, you and I both share the belief that America is exceptional. And it felt that before Donald Trump and I would make the argument, most Republicans who are running for the presidency would not have done what President Trump has done.

[Glenn Beck]

No.

[Charlie Kirk]

The international tpp, Iran deal, renegotiating nafta, those are almost untouchable for both parties. You can't go there. But it felt as if there was a management of the decline of America, and you led the Tea party movement in 2011. Those are my words, not yours. Okay, so 2010, 2011, you were a big part of it, and you were a very vocal piece of it. And President Trump, in a lot of different ways, has led the revitalization, has given a lot of Americans hope that they thought that this country could not be turned around.

[Glenn Beck]

You know, it's really strange. He has the same thing that Tulsi Gabbard has, and they don't agree on anything.

[Charlie Kirk]

Basically anything.

[Glenn Beck]

You know what I mean? But Tulsi is a. She's so far out of the mainstream, and she is so far left. But at no time do I believe she hates America. I believe she loves America. We just disagree.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes.

[Glenn Beck]

And what used to bring us together is that we can disagree, but we have a fundamental understanding that this country is a positive force and you can make it.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, I have a working theory about this. This is why Bernie Sanders has a group that really appreciates him and follows him, and why even some people on the right will say, oh, I don't like Bernie Sanders, but I think he really believes what he believes. I think the new era of politics and the bipartisan cartel that has ruined this Ruling class, essentially series of destructive policies that have borrowed too much money and eroded our freedoms and liberties and grew the fourth branch of government. I think the American people would much prefer someone who's authentic, who says why they believe what they believe. Like that conversation you had with the president on trade. Even if you might fundamentally disagree with terrorists. I respected him and say, I'll deal with that way more than an establishment Republican in a heartbeat.

[Glenn Beck]

I made argument after argument and he tried to dismantle and I built, but wait a minute, Mr. President, this. Blah, blah, blah. And in the end he said, I'm just gonna shoot straight with you. I love him. I love trade barriers. I love the fact that we can get things from people if we just use our muscle a little bit. I fundamentally disagree. But I hung up the phone going, at least he told me the truth. He was not pandering to me.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, and that's clarity over agreement.

[Glenn Beck]

Yes.

[Charlie Kirk]

Or the false agreement that the bipartisan coalition that has really, like I said, ruined our country in so many ways. Not completely, but I find the American people have this yearning and this interest, especially young people, for authenticity in our candidates. And that's been deteriorating. So I have a question for you. In 10 years, do you think America will be more or less socialist? I ask this question of everybody, by the way.

[Glenn Beck]

Can I answer with a caveat?

[Charlie Kirk]

Of course.

[Glenn Beck]

If we continue the spending and if we continue the erosion of. Of who we are and the truth, we will be much more socialist if we have this real collapse, an actual depression. People who right now say, I am absolutely against socialism, they will want it to be able to weather that storm. And I'm afraid that we're on that track. However, I've been really hearten. I mean, Charlie, I don't think, you know, the impact you say, oh, Lauren, you made an impact on my life. Do you realize the impact you're having on the country? I mean, your organization didn't exist five years ago. It didn't exist tonight. I'm talking to 5,000 people. And I, in this place, had paid to come across the country. I was on a plane with all kinds of 18 to 20, 24 year olds yesterday. And I realized the people you have. You remember when I did the thing in Washington, D.C. and restoring honor?

[Charlie Kirk]

I do. Right on the Washington Monument. Right.

[Glenn Beck]

And I said that day, somewhere in this crowd there is maybe he's 7, maybe he's 15.

[Charlie Kirk]

I saw that speech.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah. Somewhere in this crowd is the next George Washington that will feel it right now. And I am so overwhelmed with the people that I have met from your organization and the people who are coming. You're raising the next generation. You are. You and your organization.

[Charlie Kirk]

Thank you.

[Glenn Beck]

Really responsible for what I think will be the next great generation. But also some real sucky ones are going to come out of this group too. You know, there's always. There's always. There's always a big government, progressive left or right in every.

[Charlie Kirk]

I want to talk to you about that because that's a great point. And I think the. You're starting to see the coming divide on the right. And I have some sympathy with some of the arguments and it's definitely 100% sympathy with the observations of where the right comes from. This. But there's a new right movement where they're okay with using government to trust bust or using government to solve societal, cultural problems, banning things, growing government.

[Glenn Beck]

So this idea of banning porn, that's been kicked around.

[Charlie Kirk]

So that's part of it.

[Glenn Beck]

Right.

[Charlie Kirk]

So let's talk about. I did a whole podcast on that. I don't know if you've commented on that publicly or not, but. This is the coming divide, though, Glenn.

[Glenn Beck]

I know.

[Charlie Kirk]

I don't like something. This is horrible, this is evil, it's immoral, it's a sin.

[Glenn Beck]

You are no different than what you're fighting against.

[Charlie Kirk]

Talk about that. This is the divide, Glenn, that you're gonna. By the way, some of the students tonight are gonna be looking for that clarity because they're being told, which way do I wanna go on this?

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah, that's the diff. This is the divide that started with the Progressive Era.

[Charlie Kirk]

Woodrow Wilson.

[Glenn Beck]

Yes. Theodore Roosevelt and Woodrow Wilson. Those two believed that the government and a group of experts could decide for everyone else.

[Charlie Kirk]

Philosopher kings. Yes.

[Glenn Beck]

Right. That's insanity. And that is the exact opposite of what our founders believed. What our founders believed was, look, you are going to some people, and I know this because I come from a suicidal family. I've had two people, my mother and my brother, commit suicide. So I know it. Some people's bottom is death and there is nothing you can do about it. When people say, oh, that, that guy was an alcoholic, that star was an alcoholic and depressive, we should have seen this coming. Most likely the people in their life did see it coming and they tried to do things. But until the individual decides to change, nothing will change. They'll just hide it deeper and deeper and deeper. And you will cause more strife by trying to force them to sober up. Get better, be happy. You know what I mean? And you can't control other people's morality. You can teach why it's destructive, but you become the fascist when you decide this is immoral. And thus I'm gonna make sure nobody does it.

[Charlie Kirk]

There's an argument to be made. It's the efficacy of banning. It also is questionable. Black markets pop up.

[Glenn Beck]

Look at the drug war.

[Charlie Kirk]

Sure.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah, look at the drug war. And look at. It's not Spain, it's the island. Portugal or Portugal. Yeah. Are you familiar with.

[Charlie Kirk]

They legalized all drugs. Basically.

[Glenn Beck]

They had the highest addiction rate, I believe, in the world on heroin. They were losing their entire country. They are pouring money. What they decided to do was legalize all of it and then take half of the money they were spending and work on drug programs like aids, AA programs. Just fund things that work to get people off that. They've completely healed their country. I mean, there'll always be drug problems, but they've healed their country. We keep going down the same path. Bad slap the hand. Bad slap the hand. It doesn't work.

[Charlie Kirk]

And that's growing on the right, Glenn.

[Glenn Beck]

I know it is.

[Charlie Kirk]

And it's almost. I don't want to.

[Glenn Beck]

I don't remember progressives started in the Republican side.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes. And you're seeing it especially with the issue of tech. Tech tyranny, Facebook, Google. And there's calls on the right now to either trust bust them. Where have we heard that before?

[Glenn Beck]

Or.

[Charlie Kirk]

And a lot of it is by bad history, by the way that the trust busting was almost. Is glamorized from the early 1900s. And you educated me on this quite well about really the reality of trust busting.

[Glenn Beck]

Look, it is the one part of capitalism that I can't come up with a comfortable answer on. How do you control it? When people become so wealthy and so powerful that they can control. So do we take their money away? Do we take their control away? Do we bus them up so they don't have that much? This country was really built by the railroads. You know, people say, oh, look at the Vanderbilts and what they had. Just because they built the railroad. The average American has about twice the benefits and lifestyle that the Vanderbilts had back then. We have a much better life on average and just below average.

[Charlie Kirk]

And they were the top of their.

[Glenn Beck]

And they were the. No one was even close.

[Charlie Kirk]

Just ask Anderson Cooper.

[Glenn Beck]

No one was even close. I've actually. I've gone into the private residence of the Breakers. There's two floors. Anderson introduced me to the family. I don't know if you know this The Vanderbilt still live in the Breakers?

[Charlie Kirk]

No, I didn't know that.

[Glenn Beck]

Top two floors.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah, it's phenomenal. The attic is nothing but Louis Vuitton steamer trunks that just say, Vanderbilt silver, Vanderbilt china. Okay. The things that they did was crazy, but they helped us grow. The problem was, is they decided themselves that they could control things. Henry Ford was an awful. He was a socialist. He was an awful guy. He believed. I mean, he supported the socialists, the National Socialists in Germany. He believed himself. I'm gonna tell my workers what to do. If you wanted to buy a for, you had to come see him. And he would go over your financial records to see if you were even qualified to own. So these people want to control things.

[Charlie Kirk]

So how do you square that to a free market skeptic?

[Glenn Beck]

I can't square it, other than it works itself out. We are going through what we went through in the late 1800s.

[Charlie Kirk]

Do you think it's a gilded era almost that we might be going through?

[Glenn Beck]

I think it's a. The big, huge houses that are built.

[Charlie Kirk]

The Austin tenacious lifestyles.

[Glenn Beck]

That's going to be the breakers of this century.

[Charlie Kirk]

Okay.

[Glenn Beck]

And it will bust itself up eventually.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, the counter argument people will say, but no. It took a Teddy Roosevelt to break it up. No, that's what someone on the far left or the new right would say.

[Glenn Beck]

Here's what Teddy Roosevelt did. He broke up the corruption in politics in New York. You want to fix this, you have to make the government so small that there's no one really to bribe. Okay. You clean the corruption up.

[Charlie Kirk]

It's impossible to lobby a government so small that doesn't exist.

[Glenn Beck]

It was Woodrow Wilson that really started this lobbying campaign, and they did it in World War I.

[Charlie Kirk]

And so some people that. And mind you, Glenn, this is a growing intellectual community and I respect a lot. I agree with them 100% on a lot of their observations. Not always with the conclusions they'll say, but that's not achievable. We're not going to get back to constitutional government.

[Glenn Beck]

Why?

[Charlie Kirk]

They say the fourth branch of government is untouchable. Not enough representatives. What is achievable, though, is broad consensus of trying to use the instruments of power towards a moral good. And it's not an insignificant amount of people, Glenn, that believe this.

[Glenn Beck]

I know. We cannot become a group of people that don't understand the tyranny of the majority or the tyranny of the minority.

[Charlie Kirk]

And both of which are just as bad. Yes.

[Glenn Beck]

Okay. And we are a nation of individuals. You must allow me to fail, and you must allow me to succeed. You can't. It's something that, if I may speak in religious terms here.

[Charlie Kirk]

Sure. I'm a Christian. Yeah.

[Glenn Beck]

All right. So you know the war in heaven when a third of the angels are lost, okay. And Satan's up there and he's like, I'm going to bring all of them back. I'm going to bring all these people back to you, God, but you got to give me the credit. And what was his plan? To take away choice. To take away their choice. They'll do what I say they should do, and then they'll be clean of all sin and so they can come back.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

That wasn't the plan that God chose. God said, no, he'll sacrifice himself. They must be free to fail.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

Okay. This is the same argument that has been going on if you're a spiritual person since the beginning, and I've always wondered up until the last 10 years or so, how do you stand in front of a group of angels who know who God is and a third of them are convinced, yeah, God's the bad guy. How do you do that? You do that by saying, you know what he wants? You know what he wants? He wants these people to go down there and suffer and hurt and be in pain and stumble and fall, and some of them won't even make it back. What kind of dad would do that? What kind of God would do that? That's how you get a third of the angels to fall away. That's what capitalism stops. They say capitalists, true capitalists say, you know what? There are going to be places and people whose heart is so big they want to help, and we as a society are going to promote the general welfare. Meaning we're gonna show. We're gonna point those people out and say, good job, good job. Hey, you want help? Go to them. And then there's something that is so big that only the government can take care of. We'll consider that. But everyone has to be able to fall. Everyone has to be able to bleed. Everyone has to be able to succeed because it's about the individual, not the group.

[Charlie Kirk]

And so well said skeptics will say, but that's doomed to fail because of the law of hierarchies, so that you'll have so many people in the competence hierarchy that will get so good and will only multiply their wealth and multiply it. And over time, the mob will be created no matter what.

[Glenn Beck]

What is.

[Charlie Kirk]

It's a more pessimistic way to look at it. And I'm just saying I believe it.

[Glenn Beck]

What is our mission statement as a country?

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, that's how I would articulate it.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

Boy, I would go back to the American trinity, which is liberty in God we trust, E pluribus unum, which means out of many one. And also to be able to live free and make choices you see fit, as long as they don't hurt somebody else.

[Glenn Beck]

So may I take that?

[Charlie Kirk]

And that was on.

[Glenn Beck]

Right, right, Right on the floor. May I take what you just said, please?

[Charlie Kirk]

Go ahead and rip it apart and re.

[Glenn Beck]

State it. No, no, no, no. It's right. Let me restate it a little more eloquently. We hold these truths to be self evident that all men are created equal and endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights. And among these rights, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. And governments are instituted among men to protect those rights. Okay, that is the greatest mission statement of all time.

[Charlie Kirk]

Thank you, John Locke.

[Glenn Beck]

And everyone says, yeah, well, we never achieved it. Yeah, we haven't. We haven't. Do you realize that aspirational statement, those founders that wrote that said, I believe man can do this, that's like John F. Kennedy. My father was born in 1926, and we talked about the moon launch, and I said, what was that like? And he said, son, you have no idea. When I was growing up, we didn't think we could go to the moon. Nobody even talked about it. We didn't even think about it. We didn't even have electricity. The moon was just there and we were here, and there's no way we're ever going to go to the moon. John F. Kennedy says, we're going to go to the moon. We're going to put men on it, and we're going to return them home by the end of this decade. Everybody thought, that's insane. We did it. We did it. Okay. This is the biggest idea any man has ever had, any group of people. What we do is we just say we suck instead of saying, wait a minute, we failed. But have you seen the progress over here? Have you seen this person, this group? Have you seen what they. These people have done? And promote the general welfare and domestic tranquility by saying, look at how we're advancing as man.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes.

[Glenn Beck]

Instead we keep saying, man sucks. He'll always suck. And he's got to have a big government being Big Brother to hold him in place. I'm telling you, that is an evil plan.

[Charlie Kirk]

And so. So you come from the place and the opinion that man Is broken by nature, original sin.

[Glenn Beck]

Every man and every man has to start over.

[Charlie Kirk]

And I hate to oversimplify it, but I think a lot of the American left because they don't come from a biblical worldview.

[Glenn Beck]

Yes.

[Charlie Kirk]

And they look at things, I believe in more Platonic terms and less Aristotelian terms. They believe that it's the structures and the systems, not the man that is broken. So they'll make the argument no man's actually good, but it's the capitalistic patriarchy.

[Glenn Beck]

Or they will make the problem that man is nothing more than cattle. And a group of supermen. Can philosopher kings rise up, can be the ranchers of those cattle to protect the cattle. I reject both of those.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes.

[Glenn Beck]

Okay. Every man is put here with everything he needs. Every man has it in him. Every. I love Winston Churchill.

[Charlie Kirk]

Probably the greatest man in the 20th century.

[Glenn Beck]

Right. Unless you're an Indian from India, then that man is a monster. A monster. Kill them all. Shoot them. Put them down. They are not capable of self rule. Crush the rebellion. If you only know him there, he's a monster. If you only know him in Europe, he's a miracle. So, Charlie, which one is he?

[Charlie Kirk]

Somewhere in between?

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah. He's both. He's both. Is he the guy he was in 1935 when he got kicked out of.

[Charlie Kirk]

The Navy or the British Navy or whatever? Yeah.

[Glenn Beck]

Is he the guy in 1930 or is he the guy in 1945 or is he the guy at death? What matters is was he better earlier or better towards death? He admitted his mistakes. By the time he was old, he said, I was lost. I didn't think it through. I had a different view of things. He was progressing as a human. And that is the individual responsibility for all of us. And unless you go through the crucible, unless you are put into the refiner's fire of life, if you are not allowed to succeed, well, then you're not going to be able to fail. And if you're only allowed to fail because the entire system is failing, you won't know the sweet. You won't grow.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes.

[Glenn Beck]

So you have to be able to grow. Winston Churchill is no different than our country, than you, than me. We all have a dark side and we all have a light side. And it's a battle in between. It's a battle our whole lives. The idea is for you to understand that there is forgiveness for you. So thus you should provide forgiveness for others. And you should provide understanding and grace to others. Because you know when you do something wrong and nobody will ever forgive you. It's just spirals into darkness.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes. And I find one of the root causes of this, where also progressivism is able to catch hold, is the fastest growing religion in America, which is atheism. And the rise of atheism, not just agnosticism and not just being deferential, but the committed. I am an atheist and I want to tell the world about it. I call them evangelical atheists because they evangelize more than evangelical Christians do. And you've talked about this at length. There's a direct connection to that, to statism, when you are able to get people not to believe in a higher power, not believe that natural rights actually come from a creator. Well, why not government? Government then becomes God.

[Glenn Beck]

You know, for most of my life, I thought Nietzsche was sticking his fist up and going, yeah, God is dead. He didn't say that God is dead. Paraphrasing. Now what? Because man needs a God, so what are you going to replace him with? And he was warning, you're replacing him with science. And God help you with the direction that you're going right now. And look what happened eugenics into the Holocaust. All right? So man has to have a God. The left, their God is the planet, Global warming, socialism. And if you don't genuflect when you are told to genuflect, if you don't say the rosary the right way, you are a part of the problem and you must be run out of town because you're a heretic.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes, okay.

[Glenn Beck]

It's the same thing. It's just their God is different than the invisible guy in the sky. There is a difference, if I may say, between atheists. I know atheists that are not a part of the problem because they're also strong libertarians. And so they don't want to force it on somebody else. And you know, my friend Penn Jillette, he said to me one time, we were just chatting, and he said, you're Christian. I'm like, yeah, you know that. He said, well, I know. I didn't know if you knew that. And I said, what are you talking about? He said, you know, you never asked me what I know about Jesus and to be baptized. And I said, well, I figure you're smart enough to know and I shouldn't. He said, but doesn't that. Isn't that part of your creed to be able to do it? And he said, I actually kind of feel bad that you didn't think enough of me. And I said, no, I was actually trying to respect you. And not do that. And he said, yeah, but it's in your creed to do that. So I know people that like Penn, who's changed. When I first met Pennsylvania, I asked him. I said, I just finished a show with him. This is like 2006. And I said, hey, next time you're in town, let's get together, have lunch. And he looked at me. This is off air. And he said, are you. Are you kidding? And I said, no. Why? And he said, it'd be like me having lunch with a disease. You're a Christian? And I said, whoa, yes. And he said, I would never have a religious person in my house. It'd be like inviting the plague into my house. And I said, penn, boy, I've thought a lot of things about you in my life, but not that you were a bigot. And he told me later he got into the elevator and he just kicked himself. But he was angry about 9, 11, and he had grouped all religious people into one ball.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

And through our friendship, you know, of me just being there and, you know, always being his friend, he changed. And he is. He is not preaching the hate and division. In fact, he's preaching to his atheist friends. I saw him on stage at the atheist convention saying, don't be what we've always said the worst Christians are to us. Don't try to run them out of the square. Just live with one another and respect one another.

[Charlie Kirk]

I'm afraid that's the minority of atheists, though. A vast majority of atheists. And Dennis Prager has the best question about it. He spoke at the atheist convention once. They've invited him, and he asked the question, do you hope you're wrong? And it's a great question to ask, Penn, because if you don't hope you're wrong, then you want to be right more than what is good. Think about it. We want to be right more than ever. Having an afterlife, mercy, forgiveness, believing there's a ubiquitous creator behind everything that we know to be true.

[Glenn Beck]

I don't think Penn would say he hopes he's wrong.

[Charlie Kirk]

So he hopes there's nothing. He wants to just be nothing more than a clump of cells and bacteria.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah. He thinks that we live a good, decent life now, enjoy every second, be good.

[Charlie Kirk]

So he thinks this is perfect?

[Glenn Beck]

No, he just thinks make the best out of it.

[Charlie Kirk]

But he should at least hope there's an after meaning. Would you believe the Bible if it's true, Penn? That's what I would ask him.

[Glenn Beck]

I have asked him that, and I've asked A few of my atheist friends, If I could prove it to you, which I don't think you can either way.

[Charlie Kirk]

But there's good evidence to get people. Yeah, but within striking distance, I agree.

[Glenn Beck]

But faith is required. Okay, so if I could prove it to you, would you change your mind? That's the question to ask. If they say no, If I said no, if they came to you and said, if we could prove that there is no God, I reject that immediately, because you can't prove that. But if you could, and here's the evidence, Charlie, there is no God, would you change your mind?

[Charlie Kirk]

So we have to answer that the same way. We'd have to be as open minded.

[Glenn Beck]

Right. We'd have to. Knowing that no proof on either side would actually ever do it.

[Charlie Kirk]

That's correct.

[Glenn Beck]

Right. But, yeah, I am. I am. I mean, I look at my faith, you know, people are like, you actually believe in that stuff. You know what? But I'm a recovering alcoholic and even more important, a recovering dirtbag. I spent a lot of my life being an absolute dirtbag. And I know what my will got me. And it got me nowhere except into the center of misery. And when I went looking for faith, I went looking for God. I was looking just for something that would make me a happier person, make me nicer, make people. Make me just love people, you know? And to control the worst urges in me, I don't care if I have to drink chicken blood, if it works for me. Celebration. Celebration. You know, if I get to heaven and God is like some big space octopus and he's like, you never saw this one coming. I'd go, no, never thought that. But I guess I have to embrace that.

[Charlie Kirk]

Sure. Absolutely. So I visit campuses a lot, and we're so thrilled you'll be able to speak to our students. And the rise of socialism is real. And the destruction of our public education system.

[Glenn Beck]

Can't wait.

[Charlie Kirk]

And so can you give a little bit of a preview or, as this will record indefinitely in perpetuity, give it to those that can't be there. Give me the love.

[Glenn Beck]

I can't give it to you.

[Charlie Kirk]

And our students look up to you and admire you so much, Ben.

[Glenn Beck]

It's really nice. And if you could remember my name, I would believe it.

[Charlie Kirk]

I was saying Glenn Beck. Ben.

[Glenn Beck]

I'm kidding, I'm kidding. Relax. Okay, let me just start on a couple things. First, this is an 1830 engraving of the original Declaration of Independence. The first draft.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

Okay. And if you look at it here, you can take that one. If you look at it, you will see on the sides when in the.

[Charlie Kirk]

Course of human events.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah. And on the borders, you'll see things like Franklin or Adams. That's like a Google Doc where Franklin went in and said, don't like that line. And so he would write, franklin or Adams. Do you see that?

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah.

[Glenn Beck]

Isn't that amazing? So I want you to notice that. Look through.

[Charlie Kirk]

They scratch stuff out here.

[Glenn Beck]

I know. There's a lot different in this draft.

[Charlie Kirk]

And so this is the first draft.

[Glenn Beck]

This is the first pass right before.

[Charlie Kirk]

It got the King's eyes.

[Glenn Beck]

Right. So before Congress got ahold of it. Okay, this is Franklin. This is Jefferson. Then Franklin and Adams going, okay, I kind of like that. Let's present it to Congress. They presented it to Congress. They talked about it. Now, what does the Declaration of Independence say at the very top, when in.

[Charlie Kirk]

The course of human events?

[Glenn Beck]

No, the very top.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, I'm gonna read this. Is that okay?

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah, go ahead.

[Charlie Kirk]

A declaration by the representatives of the United States of America in general Congress. All right, so something that did not officially exist.

[Glenn Beck]

Right. But what does the official. The one that was approved. I don't know.

[Charlie Kirk]

I don't know.

[Glenn Beck]

Unanimous declaration.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

Okay. So they started, and Thomas Jefferson said, you have. Do we all agree that if we aren't completely in lock sync that the King will find a way to worm himself between us and he'll split us apart one by one, and we'll be done.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

So does everything have to be unanimous, yes or no? They all voted yes. Jefferson, you go write it. Okay, so I want you to notice that the only words that are capitalized.

[Charlie Kirk]

In that are United States of America.

[Glenn Beck]

Okay. Look at.

[Charlie Kirk]

This is incredible, by the way.

[Glenn Beck]

Look at. Thank you.

[Charlie Kirk]

I can do this stuff all day.

[Glenn Beck]

Look at that page. Do you see anything capitalized or printed?

[Charlie Kirk]

Christian and men.

[Glenn Beck]

Hmm. Now, why. Why would you notice that? That's nowhere else.

[Charlie Kirk]

And it's underlined, too.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah, it's nowhere else in the document. He doesn't print anything. Everything is in cursive. He does his handwriting changes at that point. Okay, you know what that is? That's Thomas Jefferson alone at night, writing the first draft. And in it he says, and the worst usurpation, the worst thing he has done is this Christian king handwritten out. That's all printed.

[Charlie Kirk]

That's all caps, Lock. Basically, right in today's time, Right?

[Glenn Beck]

He's mocking. This Christian king has taken a group of people who never offended him from.

[Charlie Kirk]

Another part of the world, basically criticizing slavery maybe, or. Yeah, because it says bought and sold.

[Glenn Beck]

Right, Right. Put them on a boat if they survived. He sold capital letters men on the open market. Really important because blacks weren't men. How could Thomas Jefferson write all men are created? Oh, he knew. He knew. That's why in his own zeal, he capitalized men. He sells men on the open market. And now he's taking the people who are trying to free those people. We have tried over and over and over again, and he blocks us every step of the way. And now he's telling these people that he'll buy their freedom if they will kill the people who are trying to set him free. Okay, Jefferson didn't understand slavery. The founders didn't include this. Remember, unanimous declaration, two states out of 13. Two states said that has to go. Two out of 13. So don't tell me we were built by racists that didn't understand. They understood. They knew.

[Charlie Kirk]

And inspired by this document, in 1777, Vermont abolished slavery. I mean, this document inspired the abolition movement. It took 30, 40, 50 years. But the lie of the left is that we're a racist country from our founding.

[Glenn Beck]

Correct.

[Charlie Kirk]

What else you got here?

[Glenn Beck]

Let's see. I'll show you this. This is really kind of cool. This is.

[Charlie Kirk]

And we only got a couple minutes because then we got a free answer. Yeah.

[Glenn Beck]

So this is handwritten. This is to Cesar Rodney, one of our founders, written by Thomas Jefferson. Just read the last couple of lines.

[Charlie Kirk]

This is incredible.

[Glenn Beck]

You might recognize that letter.

[Charlie Kirk]

I'm not great at reading cursive. I'm going to confide in you, Glenn.

[Glenn Beck]

He says, basically, I see the storms.

[Charlie Kirk]

The world entire from the calamity threatened.

[Glenn Beck]

Yeah, I see storms.

[Charlie Kirk]

We are the world. We are the world's last hope and its loss will be on our heads. God help you and preserve you. I think that might be a Latin phrase at the end.

[Glenn Beck]

I mean, that's Jefferson. One of his more famous lines. We're the world's last great hope.

[Charlie Kirk]

Disneyland.

[Glenn Beck]

Just quickly, this is the original prospectus for Disneyland.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow.

[Glenn Beck]

Hand colored by Walt.

[Charlie Kirk]

Which was actually Disney World.

[Glenn Beck]

No, this is Disneyland in California. Yeah. This is Disneyland 1955.

[Charlie Kirk]

Okay. Was that first in Florida? He never saw the Florida one be built. Is that right?

[Glenn Beck]

No, he died before. He died in 66, I think. And that was opened in 72.

[Charlie Kirk]

Amazing.

[Glenn Beck]

And Epcot was not supposed to be what EPCOT is now. You know what this is. Have you ever seen this?

[Charlie Kirk]

No, but it looks eastern. So it looks like, if I had to guess, a picture of bombers, obviously from 1940s probably World War II. Japanese. You know, Japanese.

[Glenn Beck]

This American. Okay. On the back it says, we have a new bomb.

[Charlie Kirk]

So we were letting people know before we dropped the bomb.

[Glenn Beck]

Only 70 million of these were dropped. Leaflets, leaflets were dropped from the sky over 11 cities. These are the cities here. And Hiroshima and Nagasaki are two of the cities. And on this, it says, get out of the city. We have more firepower in one bomb than all the bombs we have already dropped in Europe. Get out. Food and water will be scarce. We are not after you. We are after your emperor and his imperial ambitions. Not after you. Tell me where that is in history. We don't even know.

[Charlie Kirk]

Only Israel would do that with the Palestinian Authority. And they do.

[Glenn Beck]

Correct. I have Lincoln's bloody collar in here. I have the torch from the 36 Olympics.

[Charlie Kirk]

But, Glenn, we're just like every other country.

[Glenn Beck]

No, we're not.

[Charlie Kirk]

We are an exceptional country.

[Glenn Beck]

You know, we may be on that road. Walt Disney in 1954, in the. I think it was November of 1954, said, I want to build a park, and I'm going to build it in Orange county. Okay? And it was a orange grove in the. In the.

[Charlie Kirk]

Now Anaheim, California, right?

[Glenn Beck]

In the. In the fall of 54, in July of 55, it was Disneyland.

[Charlie Kirk]

It's amazing.

[Glenn Beck]

So we are not the nation we used to be.

[Charlie Kirk]

Now you have to get environment. You'd have to get environmental impact statements. You'd have to get that done. They would march in 20 years. No, that's. Well, Glenn, such an honor to be able to speak with you.

[Glenn Beck]

Thank you. Likewise.

[Charlie Kirk]

Can't wait to have you speak to our students.

[Glenn Beck]

I'm. I'm proud to be here. I'm proud of you.

[Charlie Kirk]

Thank you.

[Glenn Beck]

Just a reminder, I'd love you to rate and subscribe to the podcast and pass this on to a friend so.

[Charlie Kirk]

It can be discovered by other people. Sam.