Giorgio Orlandi (2:49)

Good morning.

Emma Nelson (2:50)

So how popular is Giorgia Meloni?

Giorgio Orlandi (2:54)

Well, she's very popular, I would say number one. Giorgio Meloni is Italy's first female prime minister. She leads a government that has become the third longest lasting executive in the country's history. And after more than three years in office, her party is still leading the polls. And these are indeed facts that cannot be disputed. As a result, the so called Meloni phenomenon as, as is constantly being referred to is being reviewed by international media outlets. Time magazine recently featured Meloni on its cover under the title Where Giorgio Maloney is leading Europe. The Economist also reported on her leadership using the headline why is Meloni an exceptional politician? Highlighting the fact that she's helped the country gain greater political stability. And as of today, I think this is Meloni's main asset.

Emma Nelson (3:48)

And explain to us how she's gone about doing this because up until Meloni's arrival there was this sort of almost perpetual assumption that Italy would be a revolving door of chaos.

Giorgio Orlandi (4:00)

Indeed. Well, in a way she's managed to keep the status quo in the country. And by that I mean that she has been able to maintain Italy's political contradictions while still gaining support. And looking at these more closely leadership as both some positive and negative aspects. One of the main positive aspects is the fact that she's been able to turn into more moderate political leader. Let's not forget that she joined the neo fascist MSI party when she was only 15 and today she's been able to mediate between the two other ruling partners. One is Forcitale, which is more pro eu, pro Atlantic partnership and the other one which is the League Party, which is often linked to a more euro, kept its stance and has had some pro Russian impulses in the past few years.

Emma Nelson (4:55)

And how much has that made Italy a right wing country? Because you mentioned the two areas that she, you know, the fact that she, she joined this neo fascist movement when she was a teenager and it's what just this weekend that they celebrated the 13th anniversary of Fratelli d', Italia, which is her party, which, which is born from very strong right wing broods.

Theatre Critic (5:15)

Indeed.

Giorgio Orlandi (5:16)

Well, she's been able to sort of, she's avoided, to sort of deny that where she comes from and that that background, although she's never sort of openly sad, she's, she's to be considered a neo fascist leader, of course, but so she's sort of sided with those values without open, openly saying it. So in that way she's, she's maintained support. At the same time she's become more moderate and this is, I think nowadays has paid off when it comes to foreign policy, for example, this is where I think she's made the most gains.

Emma Nelson (5:55)

She.

Giorgio Orlandi (5:55)

Well, under her leadership Italy has become bolder and more credible on the international stage. And Italy has indeed secured a seat within Europe's diplomatic circle. And even, as you mentioned in the intro, Donald Trump appears to be listening to her. And this is also reflected in both the fact that she's pro Kiev, pro Ukraine, and at the same time she's maintained strong ties with Washington.

Emma Nelson (6:23)

This is an incredibly difficult balancing act that she has to, to, to execute here. So let's go through this sort of systematically. First we'll talk about Europe and then we'll go back to Donald Trump, which has been her great, sort of a huge international achievement. But the most interesting thing you find about with her, with her relationship with Europe is that she is from a right wing party. As you mentioned, she is a Eurosceptic. Yet she has become the most European of them all, hasn't she? Exactly. Indeed.

Giorgio Orlandi (6:50)

She's basically realized that Italy cannot alienate itself and distance itself from the eu, from EU policies. Let's not forget that Italy received the largest share of the EU recovery fund to help countries recover from COVID And this is something that has helped Italy avoid a recession and improve several economic sectors. So Italy cannot live without support from the eu. And so if this is true, this is happening outside of Italy, of course, when it comes to internal divisions and the government itself, she has managed, as I mentioned before, to balance and to keep this sort of like balance together.

Emma Nelson (7:36)

How does she do it though? Because in order to be Eurosceptic at home, you can't start wooing the European Union. And she on the diplomatic stage, on the international stage, she is a powerful and quite conciliatory figure. But how does that work? When she takes the message back to Italy.

Giorgio Orlandi (7:54)

It'S very simple. Obviously she's relying on the support that is given to her that's provided to her by both coalition parties. One is for Zatella and the other one is Slovenia's League party. So she uses the fact that there are two opposite sides within living together within that coalition that she can rely on. And so of course part of her Eurosceptic stance has been mediated by that. And of course, I think she's also been relying on wonder leyn support, which indeed she comes from more conservative field. And that also has helped us sort of carry on her, let's say, right wing stance. But as I said, like, she has indeed become more and more moderate when it comes to some of the most extreme stances that she's had in the past. And these has helped us sort of like maintain this balance.

Emma Nelson (8:59)

Explain now a little bit more about the Trump situation insofar as that when there is a difficult situation, they put Giorgia Maloney next to Donald Trump. And we heard right at the beginning of this program when Trump in August was saying, prime Minister Meloni of Italy, she served such a long period of time, you're going to be there a long time. What is it about her which makes her so successful with one of the most problematic characters in the world?

Giorgio Orlandi (9:25)

Well, I know that Meloni, she's been quite popular among conservatives in the US and this was already happening before Trump came to power. So she's sort of like preparing the ground to get close to Trump. And nowadays I think she's someone that has put probably her political Persona, head of anything else. She has been able to build, build a personal relationship with Trump that goes beyond bilateral meetings and goes beyond summits and meetings and official, let's say, official appointments. And this is something that has paid off. And she's very much credible. As I said before, under her leadership, Italy has a bolder image when it comes to being listened to and become more credible on international stage. And we've seen that recently with like peace talks around, well, on Ukraine, she, she's always managed to stand out from the crowd. She has never accepted the idea to be sidelined by other EU leaders. In fact, after, after talks, talks took place in London recently among EU leaders. She decided to then invite Zelensky to Rome to have a bil with him, just, just to stand out from the crowd. So in a way, she's been able to, as I said, to keep all these contradictions together. And this is really like her, I would say, the reason behind her success.

Emma Nelson (11:07)

So finally, what lies ahead for in 2026 in terms of will she be able to maintain this balancing act? Will she be able to maintain coherence in Italy?

Giorgio Orlandi (11:16)

Well, that's the big challenge, I think, when it comes to 2026. I think she's, she's, her party is still leading the force, which is great for Meloni. She's still the most, the most supported leader in Italy right now. She's gained a lot of, a lot of support. But obviously the challenge is whether or not she'll be able to maintain that. And in fact, on the downside, there are many actually things that have not been achieved by Meloni and that critics have pointed out. Number one, she has not really pushed for Italy's much needed reforms. And when it comes to press freedom, for example, which is a sensitive issue, number one, Melon is always, is quite, is not really keen to talk to the press in general. And she's, she's been attacked for not doing much to improve press freedom in the country. So lots of challenges ahead. And so the main question is whether Meloni or will be able to, whether or not she'll be able to keep this status quo which has maintained her in power for the past few years.

Emma Nelson (12:25)

Joining us on the line from Rome, that's Giorgio Orlandi, international correspondent for euronews. Thank you so much for joining us. On the Globalist.

UBS Narrator (12:36)

Craft is a matter of perspective, a unique outlook, an obsessive attention to detail. With UBS chief investment office Houseview, we're focused on identifying the latest investment opportunities and market risks to help you achieve your financial goals. So you get the big picture broken down into thought provoking insights delivered daily and curated by over 200 globally connected, locally active analysts. UBS banking is our craft.

Emma Nelson (13:11)

Now here's a look at some of the other headlines we're keeping an eye on today. The U.S. coast Guard is pursuing another oil tanker off the coast of Venezuela. The operation is the third of its kind in the last two weeks. Washington's accused Venezuela of using oil money to fund drug related crime. Venezuela's describing the tank seizures as theft and kidnapping. Israel has approved 19 new settlements in the occupied West Bank. The far right finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich said the move was aimed at blocking the establishment of a Palestinian state. And the state parliament of New South Wales in Australia is debating reforms to gun ownership. It follows last week's mass shooting at Hanukkah celebrations at Bondi Beach. The proposals include limits on the number of firearms a person can own. But critics say the legislation is rushed. This is the Globalist. Stay tuned. 7:13 here in London. Let's have a look at the papers. Lyn o', Donnell, journalist and columnist for Foreign Policy magazine, joins me in the studio. Good morning. Hello. Now, we were talking just before we came on air that I went to a Christmas carol service last night. I went to St. Bride's Church off Fleet Street. Now, for those of us who do not know what St. Bride's Church is, just talk us through it because your eyes lit up. So you've been several times.

Lyn O'Donnell (14:27)

Well, it's known as the journalist church. And one of the things that you just said when we were off air was you only go there when something bad happens. And I must say that I have been there a few times recently, once for a memorial for Kim Sengupta who died a year ago. He was quite a legend as A foreign correspondent and war reporter for the Independent for many decades and for a, I guess, kind of like a celebration or a memorial, generally, a general memorial, if you like, for war reporters who were dying and being killed in Ukraine. And it is just such a lovely place, isn't it? It's so full of light and the acoustics are marvelous. And even though you go there for what can be very sad reasons, it's an uplifting experience.

Emma Nelson (15:22)

I find it is absolutely well worth a visit. In the middle of it, if you find yourself in London and you're short of something to do, go down to Fleet Street. It's tucked down. I think it's Salisbury street, and it's there. So thank you for that, Lyn. Right. You've been having a look at some of the papers and what's been going on at the moment. Well, something that's been covered all over the press at the moment is this chase, which is going on at the moment in the Caribbean, of this the US Coast Guard is chasing a Venezuelan.

Lyn O'Donnell (15:49)

Tanker, the third one, it seems to be, as we know, a couple of Venezuelan oil tankers have been stopped and boarded by US Coast Guard in what seem to have been military stuff actions. And that follows the pounding of fishing vessels allegedly carrying drugs to the United States or drugs destined for the United States market with absolutely no evidence. It seems to be a continuation of the Trump administration's decision to force the president of Venezuela, Maduro, out of power. Oil, as we know, is Venezuela's lifeline. And I think, you know, I've heard of some links to the Secretary of State, Marco Rubio's determination to also crush the Cuban government because he's the son of Cuban immigrants. And a lot of this oil is allegedly going from Venezuela to Cuba to keep the administration there afloat.

Emma Nelson (17:07)

Yes.

Lyn O'Donnell (17:08)

Yet another seizure on the way. And it's almost like we're watching it happening in real time now, and we're.

Emma Nelson (17:13)

Watching it happening in international waters.

Lyn O'Donnell (17:15)

Well, this is the thing. It's like the fishing boat attacks are extrajudicial murders of people who are not proven to have done anything wrong. There is no evidence that we as a public, the international public, are being offered to back up allegations that these are drug boats. Maybe they are, but this is still extrajudicial murder. In, in my humble opinion.

Emma Nelson (17:42)

It's an interesting thing insofar as it then changes the rules for everybody else, doesn't it? I mean, because you have spent years and years and years looking at areas, especially Afghanistan, where rules have been invented, reinvented and it's a very, very structured way of going about things in, in, in the way that the, for example, the Taliban is absolutely, you know, clamping down on people in what you can and cannot do. But when you have the likes of the Americans throwing the rulebook out of the window, that must strengthen the narrative and the positions for people who actually live by imposing rules.

Lyn O'Donnell (18:17)

I saw that happen very clearly during President Donald Trump's first term in office when he declared the media to be enemies of the people. There was, you know, a very touchy, self defensive president of Afghanistan at the time, an American citizen called Ashraf Ghani. And he picked up on this immediately. One of the very few good things that happened in Afghanistan during that 20 year democratic experiment was the development of a very feisty and free media. And suddenly in echo, the echo of Donald Trump calling the media the enemy of the people was picked up and it led to a crackdown on media freedoms in Afghan. So yes, I've seen that. And the degradation of rule of law internationally is, it's a dangerous slippery slope.

Emma Nelson (19:24)

Let's move on to a story that's been doing the rounds about insult, political insult. Tell us about Snowflake is no longer no more. It's a new one. It's called Theatre Kid. What does this mean?

Lyn O'Donnell (19:39)

Oh, it's the same, isn't it? It's just one more step in the degradation of language. The don't hold back. Yeah, where do you go with this? It's like there doesn't seem to be any decency or respect in public discourse anymore. And this comes from a story in the New York Times yesterday, Happy Solstice by the way, in which Zoran Mamdani, who the young feisty mayor elect of New York City was referred to as a theatre kid after making a speech even though he's appeared shaken hands in the Oval Office with the President who seemed to have a little bit of a back slapping moment with him. But this is the Theatre Kid is just yet another way of denigrating somebody as all style and no substance. And I think it comes the fact that Mamdani is apparently a former student of improvisational theatre. And maybe that's where his public speaking ability and his very well honed, jolly well hail fellow well met personality seems to come from. But yeah, it's, you know, there's an.

Emma Nelson (21:08)

Interesting point in the New York Times article that this is all derives from is that the idea of. It's a Republican strategist who talks about the rise of social media and the way that you can pigeonhole someone because they say in politics, just like in journalism, and this is something that you and I trade in. You're always trying to make 10 words five. Five words, three. Two words, one. And the idea that you can come up with phrases which encapsulate an entire culture, an entire societal slice, is something which is actually quite clever.

Lyn O'Donnell (21:36)

Donald Trump has lowered it to his greatest achievement, hasn't he? The nicknames he gives to people. What was Bide?

Emma Nelson (21:46)

Sleepy Joe Biden. Sleepy Joe turned us into a plaque.

Lyn O'Donnell (21:48)

Yeah, well, yes, but this is a man who we now see publicly falling asleep in his cabinet meetings. Dozy Don, perhaps.

Emma Nelson (21:57)

Thank you so much for joining me in the studio. That was Lyn o' Donnell and a very merry Christmas to you. Thank you. You're listening to the Globalist on Monocle Radio. Now, Christmas is but, what, three days away and we're all preparing to face the music, relatives, loved ones, things and people drawing us temporarily into their orbit. Well, we thought it might be helpful to share some protocols for delicate relations over the holidays. We are Monocle, after all. So here to help is the diplomat himself, Agony Aunt Agony Andrew.

Agony Andrew (22:36)

Dear Agony Andrew, every year my mother insists on inviting over the neighbours for a festive drink, while the rest of the family just wants to loaf in pyjamas in private. How can I deter her? Or does turning down our community during the holidays make me the Grinch?

Andrew Muller (22:50)

This seems kind of a self solving problem. Which is to say, by all means, let your mother have the neighbours around, but don't change out of your pyjamas or desist from your loafing. Indeed, go all in feign sleep, snore. Not only will the neighbours not stay for that, they will also deduce that your mother and indeed your entire family are insane and duly duck her invitation next year.

Agony Andrew (listener) (23:19)

Dear Agony Andrew, every year my family has their traditional Christmas argument. This year to save me from tears, I'm not going to try and prevent it. Instead, I'd like to win. What are some of your top tips on how to emerge victorious from the festive dinner bust up? I need a battle strat. Topics will range from the usual politics in religion to whose fault it is that the potatoes are somehow burned and undercooked simultaneously. And who the hell serves hummus at a roast dinner anyway?

Andrew Muller (23:48)

Much depends on your definition of victory. There are certainly Christmas dinners at which sliding gracefully beneath the table in a brandy addled fog while the crockery flies overhead counts on balance. As a result, if you'd like to do better than resign denebriation and land the kind of glorious, unanswerable rhetorical called triumph, which shall silence all dissent and get you written out of everyone's will. It's a question of research, not into the truth, because nobody's interested in that anymore, but into the manias and delusions of your particular relations, about which you must seem even more maniacal and delusional. If you've a cousin who thinks the moon landings were a hoax, ask him if he is aware that the moon is flying flat. If your uncle goes full Qanon, sneer at him for knowing nothing of Arenon or Essenon.

Agony Andrew (24:47)

Dear Agony Andrew, every year I try to watch the Muppets Christmas Carol, and every year the family talks all the way through it, but falls deathly silent for the Snowman, which doesn't even have any speech in it. How do I convince them to respect my cultural superiority on this festive occasion?

Andrew Muller (25:09)

I assume that the obvious remedies have been tried and found wanting, sighing theatrically, periodically hissing shh. Or just yelping, Christ alive, will you people shut the fuck up? But I know for a fact that you, Christy, have up your sleeve a newish weapon in the shape of a male toddler, and that you are therefore in a position to explain to all present that if they do not zip their Y during the Muppets, which is a masterpiece, and your insistence on reverent appreciation is correct, there will be consequences if they call your bluff. The opening credits of the Snowman are the cue for your son to open his special present from Santa, a drum kit.

Lyn O'Donnell (25:55)

Dear Agony Andrew, every year my mom.

Agony Andrew (25:57)

Insists Christmas dinner must be just like.

Theatre Critic (26:01)

When you were little, despite the fact.

Agony Andrew (26:04)

Nobody liked her cooking. How do I gently suggest that we should book a restaurant this year without hurting her feelings?

Andrew Muller (26:11)

Fully fledged British citizen that you now are, you should surely have received at some point during the application process a grounding in the argot of passive aggressive euphemism in which the people of these islands largely communicate. You deal deftly with this dilemma with such phrases as, as, I can't ask you to make dinner for so many people and we wouldn't want you to go to any trouble, while also reassuring her that nobody cooks like you do. A foreigner such as your mother will not understand that these all translate broadly, as you couldn't pay me enough to bolt back one more reluctant mouthful of your inedible slop. It's amazing any of us survive to adulthood. Dear Agony Andrew, my neighbour's Christmas lights are visible from space and remain on until at least 1am When I politely.

Agony Andrew (listener) (27:06)

Mentioned this, he said, it's Christmas, mate.

Andrew Muller (27:09)

Is there a polite way to sabotage his display? You've asked nicely once, which is all neighbourly decorum demands, so we're now into fire with fire territory. Your particular neck of the East London woods is an especially vibrant one, offering your pick of any number of faiths and or traditions, which all have more frequent and more flamboyant celebrations than Britain's generally somewhat prim and abstemious interpretations of Christianity. And most of them are recruiting once the inconsiderate yobbo next door has tried to sleep through an eye full of Diwali, Hanukkah, Guru, Nanak, Gopurab, Ramadan, Yipeng, Timkat, Gahambar, or why not all of them, as if in exploratory theological rotation, in search of, if you will, enlightenment. He'll back off.

Agony Andrew (28:03)

Dear Agony Andrew, my brother's dog smells terrible and sheds everywhere, but he says it's his emotional support animal and insists on bringing it to Christmas lunch. Am I allowed to set boundaries or is that considered unseasonal?

Andrew Muller (28:18)

Come on, you're American. Everyone basically expects you to have some nonsense allergy or invented phobia or imaginary disorder which renders you helpless to deal with one or several facts of everyday life like a grown adult. Without yamming a fistful of pharmaceuticals you saw advertised during real Donut ices of Dubuque or whatever, you can surely concoct some fictitious malady or bogus syndrome which trumps your brother's inability to function normally in an ordinary social situation without some dilapidated, malodorous canine drooling on everyone's shoes. If he insists, tell him he'll be taking his chances with your emotional support, Alligator Ian.

Agony Andrew (listener) (29:04)

Dear Agony Andrew, as you know, my family is a complicated mix of cultural traditions, and the thorniest question every year is when to put up the Christmas tree. My American mother wants it up as early as possible and my Austrian father wants it up on Christmas Eve and and not before. That is the Austrian tradition. Can you settle this once and for all for us, please? Should we be enjoying the Christmas tree mostly in the run up to the big day or after?

Andrew Muller (29:31)

I can settle this one. Your Austrian father is completely correct. The clue is in the name. It's a Christmas tree, not a we haven't even had goddamn Halloween yet tree. And anybody who still has one up as late as December 27th should be arrested.

Emma Nelson (29:50)

Quite right, too. That was Monocle's own Agony aunt, Uncle Andrew Muller, you're listening to the Globalist. And we finish today's program with another agony uncle. Matt Wolf, International New York Times. The man who's seen every play in.

Theatre Critic (30:09)

The world all in the last two weeks. How are we just about crawling to the finish line? I saw 13 shows in as many nights and I don't think I've ever done that before in my life. It's like being in a show.

Emma Nelson (30:21)

Why did you do that?

Theatre Critic (30:22)

Well, and I didn't even see everything. I haven't yet seen the Red Shoes of Sadler's Wells. I haven't seen Twelfth Night at the Barbican. It's because everything opens prior to Christmas to get in before Christmas.

Emma Nelson (30:31)

And does. And does that actually work when it comes to a strategy by a city.

Theatre Critic (30:36)

I wonder whether it's sometimes overkill. From the point of view of audiences, there's too much for them to take in. But on the other hand, nobody wants to be reviewing over the holidays. So as a result, now there's nothing until High Noon and Woman in Mind in January.

Emma Nelson (30:47)

We've killed Matt Wolfe's voice simply by sitting in a theater.

Theatre Critic (30:51)

I know.

Emma Nelson (30:51)

I mean, you must have the immune system of a rhinoceros.

Theatre Critic (30:55)

Well, I did. Keep going. Or of a. Or of a bear.

Emma Nelson (30:58)

Indeed.

Theatre Critic (30:59)

Or of a bear. Right, look, I brought a bear.

Emma Nelson (31:01)

He brought me a bear. So he's brought me a bear, everybody. And he's brought me a wonderful bear.

Theatre Critic (31:04)

Isn't this sweet? He's lovely. We can give a clue to listeners. It's a bear with a little red cap and a duffel coat. But what you don't see are the gray eyebrow. And this is Paddington Bear from the musical of the same name at the Savoy Theatre which will probably outlive both of us.

Emma Nelson (31:22)

Excellent. Is it that good?

Theatre Critic (31:24)

Well, it's one of those shows. It absolutely taps the zeitgeist. There hasn't been a British musical like this in a very, very long time. Everyone responds to it in a different way. Kids will love it. There's some naughty bits for the adults. It's very kind of sweet about inclusion and diversity, but it's not saccharine on that topic. It tells, it tells the story really from the first movie about this pint sized Peruvian who happens to be a bear who gets caught up in the hurly burly of London and in so doing transforms all the people that the bear comes across. So the bear is an agent of good.

Emma Nelson (32:02)

And it's absolutely delightful to think that this has now hit the stage and how much has the world needed a new musical like Paddington?

Theatre Critic (32:10)

Well, I think first of all, there is nothing like a hit new musical in general to kind of turbocharge the theatric, but particularly a musical like this that actually says something about how we live now or how we would like to live now. God knows there's enough cruelty out in the world, which we might talk about in a few minutes. But a show that celebrates the possibility of generosity, of spirit and kindness is absolutely something to be treasured. And let's also give a shout out to Jessica Swale's book and Tom Fletcher's score in the theater. We live for a great new score. And this musical has won probably the best original British theatre score for music since Matilda, and that was 15 years ago.

Emma Nelson (32:50)

But what makes it. What makes it so good? Because it's not often that you. You heap such high praise on something.

Theatre Critic (32:56)

Well, I think it's been very cleverly produced, this show by Sonja Friedman and Liza Lumley, and they have spent a lot of time making sure that the songs fit the action, that they're revealing of character, that you've got ballads, you've got numbers that are very catchy. Victoria Hamilton Barrett, who plays the part that Nicole Kidman played in the movie, the kind of villainess of the piece. She's got a dazzling little number, dazzling little dead things, which absolutely stops the show. Bonnie Langford is in a doing as only she can do the splits. So really, it's for those of us.

Emma Nelson (33:28)

Who don't know Bonnie Langford, that's a name we haven't heard since the 1980s.

Theatre Critic (33:32)

She's a British theatrical legend that goes right the way back. She's from a British showbiz family and she's completely irrepressible and adorable. And she has a part here, tailor made for her skills. So there's something from every category to warm the heart.

Emma Nelson (33:46)

How lovely. And we imagine that this will travel. Oh, they'll have little legs.

Theatre Critic (33:50)

This will go globally, perhaps even to Peru.

Emma Nelson (33:52)

Excellent. We can't wait. Okay, so that is for everybody to go and see in London. But also, watch out, it'll be on the way in the next couple of years.

Theatre Critic (34:00)

Yes.

Emma Nelson (34:01)

Back in London. What are we looking at now?

Theatre Critic (34:03)

Well, Christmas Day at the Almeida is kind of the anti Paddington.

Emma Nelson (34:06)

Excellent.

Theatre Critic (34:06)

This is a show about a northwest Jewish family coming together for Christmas. We where nobody gets on the Christmas table. Conversation is packed with rancor. As soon as the topic turns to the Middle east, opinions diverge, tempers flare, and it's very cunningly. Directed by James McDonald. The script is by Josh Grabiner. But the production is full of kind of ominous rumblings. There's talk about have you seen what's in the news? But they don't actually tell you what they're referring to. So there's a kind of undercurrent of dread that informs the whole thing. And I think what the play is wanting to say is that just when we think we've seen the worst, we haven't.

Emma Nelson (34:48)

Right now we've just had a little item on our program where families have, well, the likes of Hassan and Christine and Dina, the Monocle team have sat and asked Andrew Muller what to do when it comes to those delicate political moments around the table at Christmas. What is the appetite for basically seeing something which is a darkened version of what many of us will be experiencing on the 25th of December?

Theatre Critic (35:14)

Well, I was thinking about that and maybe the feeling is that however bad your Christmas dinner table is going to be, it won't be as bad as this particular family, which has Nigel Lindsay, who I absolutely love as the paterfamilias, presiding over several of his children who are sharing this squat of seems to be about 12 people, although they're not all there at the dinner table. And everyone has sort of a secret. The revelations pile up towards the end. It's got a very. There was a final scene written for the play that is now not the final scene was cut. So all I have to say is what was in that final scene? That must have been really ominous.

Emma Nelson (35:53)

Must have been an absolute terror. Okay, lovely. Let's now also talk about O Mary. What an unusual play. And why is it working?

Theatre Critic (36:02)

Well, O Mary is a real New York phenomenon. It began in kind of the queer alt cabaret off Broadway world of its original star, who's also its author, Cole Escola, who won a Tony Award on Broadway for their performance non binary performer. And it has broken the box office record at the Lyceum Theater, I don't know, a dozen times or more by now, which is astonishing because this is mainstream success for somebody really on the margins. And here it is coming to London with another brilliant non binary performer, Mason Alexander Park. And it's about Mary Todd Lincoln, the Mary of the title, who is of course the wife of the president Abe Lincoln, whom we encounter the day before. Spoiler ahead. Abe Lincoln is going to be shot while at the so be careful going to the theater. But Mary Lincoln doesn't really, Todd Lincoln doesn't really care about her husband. What she cares about is she wants to be a cabaret superstar. And anything that can get her center stage with a mic in her hand, belting out whatever the song of the moment is, that's the world she wants. She doesn't give a fig about politics. And it's kind of a glorious hymn to unbridled narcissism. And what makes it work is that it is shot through with sweetness and love. She's actually very endearing as a character. And Mason Alexander park, who's an American based here, bats it out of forgive the image, the Park.

Emma Nelson (37:21)

It's an interesting idea that you have something which ordinarily sounds that the plot that you've just described is out of its mind.

Theatre Critic (37:28)

Well, the production, brilliantly directed by Sam Pinkleton, is also out of its mind. And it's done as a series of blackout sketches. So unlike Christmas Day, for instance, which kind of rolls along continually for 90 minutes or whatever, this also very short, 80 minutes, there will be a scene and it'll stop. Total blackout and then another scene. So it's almost like comedy sketch review. But it just builds up such goodwill.

Emma Nelson (37:51)

Matt Wolf, we'll have to leave it there. Thank you so much for coming and bringing it.

Theatre Critic (37:54)

Thank you very much. Have a Paddingtonian Christmas.

Emma Nelson (37:58)

And indeed, and to you as well, thank you so much indeed for joining us in the theatre. You may now go and lie down. It's finished.

Theatre Critic (38:06)

It's over.

Emma Nelson (38:06)

It's over. And that is indeed all the time we have for today's edition of the Globalist. The warmest of thanks to all my guests and to the producers, Hassan Anderson, Chris Ch, Laura Kramer. Our researcher was Joanna Moser and our studio manager was Mariella Bevan. After the headlines. More music on the way. The Globalist is back at the same time tomorrow, but for now, from me, Emma Nelson, Goodbye. Thank you for listening. Happy Christmas.

UBS Narrator (38:54)

With ubs, you have a truly global partner incorporating new technologies, innovative approaches and unexpected opportunities, leading you to insights that help answer the questions that matter. Delivered with with passion, care and unmatched expertise. Because it's about rising with the dawn each day knowing that we can do even better. That's what banking is to us. Not just work, but a craft. UBS advice is our craft.