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- [00:04]
UBS Narrator
Craft matters in small ways like how a coffee is brewed, and in not so small ways like how your money is cared for. Which is why for 160 years, UBS has elevated banking to a craft, tailoring unique strategies that combine human expertise with the latest technologies, all happening across 24 time zones and 12 key financial hubs. With you at the heart of it all, UBS advice is our craft.
- [00:38]
Chris Chermack
You're listening to the Globalist, first broadcast on 26 December 2025 on Monocle Radio. The Globalist in association with U. Broadcasting from Midori House in London. This is a special Boxing Day edition of the Globalist. I'm Chris Chermack. Coming up on today's program, for me.
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Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
It was really going back to the the roots of the house. So really looking pretty much solely the Jeanne Longvin period.
- [01:27]
Chris Chermack
Peter Copping there. Leading us into a look at a busy year in fashion that included lots of musical chairs among designers. We'll unpack it all with our fashion director, Natalie Theodosi and with the producer of Monaco on Fashion, Lily Austin. After that, we head to the world of design with our design aficionados Nick Manis and Grace Charlton. We'll review some of the year's travel trends with our own Tom Webb.
- [01:52]
Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
And then people are saying, I'd love to go to Spain, but I hear that Barcelona is overcrowded and so you're seeing people starting to explore secondary cities.
- [02:01]
Chris Chermack
Chris Hartley, CEO of the Global Hotel alliance, gives us the hospitality perspective on the year. All that right here on the Globalist with me, Chris Turmack. A very happy Boxing Day to our British listeners, just 26 December to the rest of us around the world, hope you all had a wonderful past few days. If you celebrated. We are doing another day here on the globe list of sort of relaxed looks. Back at some of the top stories of the past year. And we're going to start off with the world of fashion, which has had a big year of musical chairs among major designers, not to mention the passing of the icon that is Giorgio Armani. And last but certainly not least, it's also been a big year for Monocle on Fashion, our very own show, the first full year. I'm cheating a little bit because it did start in October of the previous year. But here to walk us through all of these highlights are Monocle's fashion editor Natalie Theodosi and the producer of Monocle on Fashion, Lily Austin. Good morning to you both. Happy Boxing Day.
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Lily Austin
Happy Boxing Day, Chris.
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Natalie Theodosi
Good morning. Happy Boxing Day, Lily.
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Chris Chermack
I'm Assuming you know what Boxing Day is. Do you do anything special on Boxing Day? I never really understand what this holiday is, perfectly honest.
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Lily Austin
I mean, wasn't Boxing Day originally meant to be. It was when you gave your servants a present and it would be given in a box. Don't quote me on that. I'm actually not sure if that's. If that's a fact or if that's like a falsehood that I've been told at some point. But anyway, it's the time when you play of your presence. Right, guys?
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Chris Chermack
It is a time to play. Is that what you do, Natalie, on the 26th.
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Natalie Theodosi
So even after so many years in the UK, I've always wondered what Boxing Day really is. Like you, Chris, because in Cyprus it's much. Which is where I'm from, where my family is. It's much more about the 25th, but another excuse to celebrate or to kind of relax after a long day of. Of eating and, and drinking on Christmas. So I do like the concept, whatever it is.
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Chris Chermack
I do think that's a big part of it. Absolutely. Just relax and sort of do whatever you want. But anyway, we do want to talk monocle on fashion and fashion in general here. Lily, first of all, this is your globalist debut and it's been a year for Monaco on fashion, so just tell us about that.
- [04:25]
Lily Austin
Yeah, I mean, it's been an amazing year. We've had so many fantastic interviews with lots of designers from these really established no names such as Anya Heimarsch, to newer designers like Ksenia Schneider, who's a Ukrainian designer who's quite kind of up and coming and picking out the kind of through lines between them. There's been a lot of taking stock and changing of business plans in order to fit better with the world today. And that was really interesting. Not something I expected to see again and again, but was really interesting to hear about.
- [04:59]
Chris Chermack
Natalie, what's been your view on that? I find it interesting that Monaco on fashion has launched and been in this year where you've taken the show on the road, but also it's been such a year of change for the fashion industry. The musical chairs that we have spoken about many times before on different shows ourselves. What has it been like to do this show, really lean into fashion, Fashion at such a really interesting time for the fashion world?
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Natalie Theodosi
Absolutely. I think it's been so much fun to just have a vehicle to talk about all these changes that are happening in real time. I mean, we would get editors and then stylists, buyers to come to our studio in Paris or record an interview in a quiet corner somewhere in Milan just as the shows were happening and all these big changes were being announced and taking place. So we did a lot of things in real time while on the move. So that has been really interesting. But at the same time, while covering all these, the big conglomerates and the big changes, it's as fascinating for us, I think, to talk to the independents as well. And it's people doing fashion on their own terms. And I think that has been equally, if not more inspiring than everything that's happening on the catwalks, which has to be frank, exposed, also the cracks in the system. And that in the fashion industry really needs to change and not just appoint new creators, but think about the bigger system and how things are happening and how we operate now.
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Chris Chermack
Lily, we're gonna play one clip that is a sort of take on the creative director, musical chairs from Peter Copping, but before that as well, I'm just curious, from your perspective, what were these fashion shows like this year? Did you have a favorite one that really did punch hold its weight?
- [06:48]
Lily Austin
Well, actually, for me, the sadness of the end of the year was Dario Batale. Well, they say that at Versace, it was by mutual agreement that he was going to be stepping down after his debut this year, but he was only in the position for nine months. Just had that one show, and I really, really loved that collection. I felt like it was a real return to the Gianni days of Versace. And I loved. I just loved it. I thought it was fun. It was like an interesting change from the Versace we've had that I feel had gotten a little bit stale. But as soon as Prada bought Versace, he has stepped down. And so, yeah, so it will be interesting to see what happens with that. I think that there was.
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Natalie Theodosi
Yeah, I think.
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Lily Austin
I mean, I think there is. It is interesting. The musical chairs that we've talked about throughout this year, it seemed like, okay, now we seem to be in a place of settling, but then something like this happens and you think, well, I don't know, are we going to continue to see creative directors being switched around every few months? It was a shame, but I loved that collection. I thought it was gorgeous.
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Chris Chermack
Well, Natalie, just introduce for us a little clip that we're going to hear.
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Natalie Theodosi
So Peter Kopping, we're speaking about musical chairs, and he's a great example of someone who's had a really impressive cv. I mean, he worked everywhere, from Balenciaga, Oscar de la Renta, Nina Ricci. At Balenciaga, he actually went back to being a number two and working with Demna on couture. And more recently he, as the musical chairs were quite starting. He was one of the first to start moving around. He took over the creative director position at Llanvan, which is a house that had been relatively dormant in the past few years. And in just two seasons, he's really helped revive the house. He's been going through the archives. He found a signature, beautiful collections, and I think we're going to be seeing a lot more of that brand and his clothing as it now develops and hits the shop floor. So a great example that when a brand takes their time and hires mindfully, it can really work and it can work quite quickly as well.
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Chris Chermack
Well, let's hear now from Peter Copping.
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Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
For me, it was really going back.
- [09:19]
Chris Chermack
To the roots of the house.
- [09:21]
Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
So really looking pretty much solely at the Jeanne Longvin period.
- [09:28]
Chris Chermack
I think also the incredible thing is.
- [09:31]
Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
That it seems very relevant today. Just looking the more I. I mean.
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Chris Chermack
I thought I knew a lot about.
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Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
It, but I think quite often with books, they always feature the same pieces, so you see a lot of the same things. But then just discovering the archive and the house and everything that it had, you know, there was more and more, more to see.
- [09:55]
Chris Chermack
That was Peter Copping. Natalie, sticking with you, I wanted to give our listeners a bit of an insight into both Monocle and Giorgio Armani. That was the biggest sort of story of somebody passing this year in the world of fashion. And also Monaco itself did a kind of behind the scenes look at Armani at the same time, which really gave us our own insights, I suppose, into what happened there.
- [10:20]
Natalie Theodosi
That was definitely a big highlight of the year for me. I got to attend the final show and see the collection. The final one that was designed by Giorgio Armani was meant to be a big celebration of the brand's anniversary. And just a few weeks before it all happened, Giorgio Armani passed away. So definitely bittersweet. But it was a beautiful moment to be part of, I think something that will be part of fashion history. It happened in the Pinacoteca di Brera, right in the center of Milan where he lived. And the Armani offices are located. And it was just everyone came in their black tuxedos, very respectful. We got to see an exhibition of his work right after and it was just such a beautiful homage. And yes, like you say, we had our photographer go behind the scenes backstage and capture the models as they were getting dressed and the making of the show. So it was a really special story to report and get into the magazine.
- [11:25]
Chris Chermack
It was a wonderful piece of reporting in the magazine. I'd suggest everyone look up that. But for now, Natalie Theodosi and Lily Austin, thank you very much for joining us. This is the globalist.
- [11:41]
UBS Narrator
Craft is a matter of perspective, a unique outlook, an obsessive attention to detail. With UBS's Chief Investment Office House View, we're focused on identifying the latest investment opportunities and market risks to help you achieve your financial goals. So you get the big picture broken down into thought provoking insights. Delivered daily and curated by over 200 globally connected, locally active analysts. UBS banking is our craft.
- [12:18]
Chris Chermack
Lets turn to the world of design now. And for that, who better to join me in the studio than Monocle's design editor Nick Minise and associate editor for design and fashion, Grace Charlton. Good morning to you both.
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Nick Manis
Happy Boxing Day.
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Grace Charlton
Good morning Christy.
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Chris Chermack
Happy Boxing Day. I wanted to start with where we ended Design Miami.
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Grace Charlton
What I think was so remarkable about it is the actual upkeep of it because when we got there I kind of kept turning Grace and be like it feels a little bit Disneyland. It feels a little bit Disneyland. Like it feels a little bit too well put together. But we went to the art deco museum. Grace absolutely nerded out. I kind of just looked at the pretty pictures. But you know, you learn that there's an actual proper legacy to building in this place. It was, it was south beach was destroyed by a hurricane in the 1930s. It was this opportunity to bring in this entire new wave of design and they really kind of lent into that. And even though they've had kind of periods where they people have wanted to kind of knock it down, it still managed to find its way and keep, keep surviving. And obviously you've kind of got these amazing hotels on the beach that are quite iconic, but actually if you go a few streets back, there's just kind of regular apartments that are art deco and that's perhaps the most remarkable part.
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Nick Manis
Exactly. But we were there for Design Miami, which is a collectible design fair. What is collectible design, I hear you ask. It's like really rare one off pieces, sort of antiques by some of the biggest names you've ever heard, but also some contemporary design. It's whatever the opposite of mass market is.
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Chris Chermack
Well, speaking of collectibles, how's this for a segue because we can turn to the world of Monocle because there have been some very special collectible items year in the world of design. So I wanted to ask you Both about that highlights. I mean, Designers on Sofas, the Design Directory. It's been a special year.
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Grace Charlton
I mean, Designers on Sofas, lovely book. But I think the Design Directory is my kind of standout product of the year. It's the first time we've kind of done a dedicated design publication at Monocle. It's going to be an annual thing so people can keep an eye out for it. But I mean, Grace, you helped build a lot of the story list. What were kind of your standout parts of it.
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Nick Manis
It was really fun to just fully lean in and forget about all the, you know, culture, fashion, whatever, just design, design, design.
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Chris Chermack
Don't tell our globalist listeners.
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Nick Manis
We created a directory. So basically we combed through the last, I don't know, 100 issues of the magazine and looked at who we'd featured before and went through city by city, listed our top people so that people can actually pick up this magazine. And it's really useful if they're in Bangkok and they're like, oh, is there a good design store?
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Grace Charlton
This is how we want the Design Directory to be used. So it's at the back of the book. It's kind of a yellow pages sort of thing. I think there's a 60 odd cities in here. You flick to it, you're gonna find who you wanna commission. That's the whole idea. That's the principles behind. It's the idea that you can, you know, Monocle's been around for 18, 19 years. The idea that we've got this amazing kind of shared collective knowledge of great design studios and people you might wanna work with. And you can pick up this directory and find little stories about those people.
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Chris Chermack
And it will continue to be updated in 2026. Which brings us to final question. Grace, moving into 2026, what are you expecting? One of your highlights. Is Salone still going to be that thing that is the thing in the design world or is somebody else going to take that crown?
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Nick Manis
Obviously, obviously Salone remains on top. We've actually seen in the past year's Stockholm Furniture Week has been dropped. I think Paris is sort of moving into that January slot, but April and Salone is the dominant and it's where a lot of different industries are also getting involved, like cars, fashion, banana brands. Do you remember? Did you see the chicken?
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Grace Charlton
People really, really lean into Inter Milan. But I think it's that thing and it's funny as well. You know, I was in Paris the other day and I was talking to the team at Roche Bebois. You know, despite the fact that they have Maison Oberge, their huge trade fair that takes place in January, those brands, lots of those brands, including Roche, Bebois, still wait for Salone is still the global event.
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Chris Chermack
I think that's like the one where they will release the big stuff.
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Grace Charlton
That's where all the new releases come out. I think the one exception to participating in Salone tends to, you know, Salone is in Milan. It's all the Italian brands, but people from Australia and the like, all the Scandinavian brands are now holding for Three Days of Design in Copenhagen in June. So you kind of have these two kind of pillars at the moment, but there's no, there's no doubt about it. Salone is ten times bigger than Three Days of Design More. I think the other thing that I want to kind of touch on a little bit is just, you know, in Design Miami, to bring. To bring it kind of fullish circle is the rise of these collectible design fairs and salons. I mean, this has been huge. We've got Matter and Shape, which takes place in Paris. Where else have we been?
- [16:46]
Nick Manis
I mean, Design Miami goes to Paris as well. Paris is the home of collectible design in many ways. Apart from Miami, Miami's also the home of it. It's where it's from, but it's also going to appear at Salone. So Salone, the massive fair, the actual fair that takes place within the Ro Fiera trade hall, are also going to have their own separate collectible design section now called Raritas Latin, you probably speak Latin.
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Chris Chermack
One year of Latin.
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Nick Manis
And so they're also getting involved in the space as a way to. To sort of jump on the trend. They just announced it last month.
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Grace Charlton
And I think it's this thing that. The reason we keep talking about collectible design, it's. People want, you know, Grace and I have been talking about this a lot in our coverage. People want objects, furniture with stories behind them. They want things to be meaningful. And I think that's part of the appeal of it. And I think that's. There's probably also an element of wanting to be able to maybe not brag, but to be able to be. To confidently tell your friends that you've kind of got something rare or you've kind of got something unique. And I think that's perhaps part of the appeal of, you know, we're also seeing shifts in the audience that are interested in what's being shown at these fairs. So it's shifting younger generation, Gen Z, Generation Z. That's probably showing my age back in my day. But, you know, I think there's a shift for people wanting things that are a little bit rarer, a little bit unique. Precious little snowflakes like themselves.
- [18:03]
Chris Chermack
Monicle's Nick Minise and Grace Charlton, thank you very much for joining us. You're listening to the Globalist on Monocle Radio. From design to the world of hospitality and travel now, which has been something of a mixed bag this year with some questions about destinations like the United States, but the rise of others, including the Middle East. And here to talk us through some of the trends is Monocle's deputy head of radio, Tom Webb. Good morning, Tom. Hello. Happy Boxing Day to you.
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Tom Webb
Wonderful to see you on Boxing Day. And thank you for my gift. It was very thoughtful.
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Chris Chermack
It was. Well, we did have a wonderful Secret Santa round, didn't we, here in the office?
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Tom Webb
We did.
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Chris Chermack
So I wanted to actually start, Tom, with something from 2025. I thought you have to describe for our listeners your own personal harrowing trip to Thailand. The experience you had kind of throwing yourself into the news, as it were, by when you traveled there.
- [19:06]
Tom Webb
Absolutely. I must say it began in a harrowing way, but then it became utterly luxurious. But, yes, Thailand experienced its worst typhoon and over 10 in end of November, which is highly unusual. The monsoon season supposed to end in September, but changes to the climate, it's shifting and it's becoming a lot later. So the tourism season in Thailand may. We may be seeing it at a much later time. So plane unable to land in Trang, circled around until it almost ran out of fuel and then went to Phuket, stayed on the Runway for five hours, didn't get off the plane back after refueling to Trang. And, and even though I'd missed my ferry connection by a whopping six hours and it was midnight and there was a storm, Thailand being Thai hospitality, they had arranged the transfer, which involved a boat through a storm, through a jungle, and then onto a long tail boat to one of the Trang islands in the dead of night during a storm. And it really was dramatic. I have been in some dramatic incidents on my travels. This was the most sitting on my back holding for dear life with the captain holding a torch above his head on one hand and the other hand on the tiller, but survived the storm and had an amazing trip.
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Chris Chermack
It is funny to think, I mean, I just, I can't even compare anything to that, even though I was also this year in Bali, just after the worst floods that Bali had had in about a decade. So we do sometimes throw ourselves into Newsy events. But that ended up being perfectly smooth because everywhere that we went was not where the flooding was. Whereas you were right in the middle of it. Until you weren't.
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Tom Webb
Until I was. Wasn't.
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Chris Chermack
We want to talk about some other things in terms of work wise. Obviously, one of the biggest travel events for you, the global travel market right here in London, was one that you went to. You spoke to so many people at that event. Was that the highlight for you? What did you learn?
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Tom Webb
It's an amazing thing, the world travel market. It happens in London every year. Despite being a global market, everyone wants to come to London because it's a great place to meet, great connectivity. And you do get all the world's travel ministers coming to one place so you can grab 20 of them and get a real sense of where their country is going and where tourism is going. There is a luxury boom that has been for a long time. But the big picture was that the tourism season has extended, particularly in Europe. Obviously the summer months are the big peak moments. But we have been seeing people going into Greece late October, November, even beginning of December. And while people might think that puts pressure on hospitality, it actually alleviates pressure because a lot of people are abandoned, abandoning those peak seasons because of high temperatures. And high temperatures is the other big theme. A lot of hotel groups are looking to the northern hemisphere, looking at Scotland, looking at Finland in particular. Finland's an interesting one because you do get wonderful summers that aren't red hot, they aren't 40 degrees. And also people are looking for more interesting locations that they can blog about and talk about Finland being one of those. So new routes, new locations and a longer holiday season.
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Chris Chermack
Is that partly some of what you're talking about there motivated by over tourism? Because it is something that we've heard a lot about over the past year. But is this sort of hospitality's answer to that? In some ways. I remember hearing you do an interview with someone from Iceland who talked about also extending the season, because that is one natural way. Either you go to maybe more far flung locations or you do this. You extend your seasons into times that people wouldn't expect.
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Tom Webb
It is a way to alleviate that problem. You cannot use the word overtourism with these ministers. They will not accept that word. They will skirt any sort of question around overtourism. But then they do admit that it is a strategy to market times that are away from the peak season. So Iceland's a great example. Their big push isn't the summer anymore. Their big push is the northern lights. Come to us in December, January. And yes, that is a play to stop those big over tourism moments in the summer for the midnight sun and perfect hiking conditions.
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Chris Chermack
So one other region you didn't mention there, obviously people going to Scandinavia as one example, the Nordics, but also the Middle East. I just feel we've heard a lot of talk about the Middle east from a lot of different ministers and tourism operators as well. Is it having as big a moment as they make it out to?
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Tom Webb
It really is. And the world travel market is so interesting because it's a big sort of sense of where countries are growing. And five years ago, the Middle east, they took out the biggest sort of platform and stages to market themselves. And that has been sort of tapering off because they don't really need to so much anymore because they have really become big players. And there was a keynote speech by the head of research for the world travel market that said the Middle east had outperformed any other region in terms of growth. Saudi Arabia is a great example. And I met the tourism minister there who really did just sell me the country because they've invested so much in the tourism experience. The moment you get off the plane, the air conditioned walkways and the huge investment into to UNESCO in the country that it is a pleasure to visit.
- [24:26]
Chris Chermack
Just finally then, Tom, moving into 2026 is there. I'll ask you either to make a prediction. Is there a place that you think is the next big thing or is there a place that you really want to visit in 2026?
- [24:40]
Tom Webb
It's a great question. And again, learning from the world travel market, South America is growing faster than anyone can predict. Peru, Chile. This is because people are looking for the sort of more exciting activities, things that you're not seeing on Instagram, for example, and things that people are cherishing more, such as stargazing. You can really get amazing experiences in these South American countries. Paraguay is going to be huge in 2026. I predict their capital is the cheapest city in the world and people can buy whatever they want. Egypt is going to grow. It's not my favorite country to visit, but of course the new museum in Cairo is open and they've got amazing art projects that Monocle has covered around the pyramids. They are really appealing to tourists and again, it's very low price. They are investing heavily back in their tourism. And Turkey, of course, for those cheap package deals. They're really getting a good sense of how they can offer luxury package deals a lot quicker than their competitors. So those are the countries I'm watching.
- [25:40]
Chris Chermack
Tom Webb, Monocle's deputy head of radio. Thank you very much for joining us today. You're listening to the Globalist. And finally on today's program it is off to the Cote d' Azur for the international luxury travel market which ran towards the end of this year. Monaco Radio was in Cannes speaking to some of the biggest names in the luxury hospitality sector sector. Monaco's Laura Kramer caught up with Chris Hartley, CEO of the Global Hotel alliance to find out more about how the sector has been performing this year and the view for 2026. She started by asking him what role Global Hotel alliance plays in the industry.
- [26:36]
Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
A lot of people don't know about Global Hotel alliance because we're not a consumer facing brand as such. We were founded actually as a joint venture to help privately owned hotel groups to compete with the major players. Our primary role is to help the independents remain independent, to provide them with support in reaching customers around the world, which is very expensive to do especially for smaller groups. And we give them a shared platform where we have a loyalty program where they all participate and that gives them reach into a customer database that we all share about 35 million people. That gives them huge volumes that can be attracted to their hotels from different markets around the world. World at a lower cost of acquisition because many independents typically rely on third parties to drive business. Many of the listeners will know, for example the booking.coms and Expedias is an easy way to look for hotels, but that's a very expensive way for us. We want people to have a direct relationship with us. We're able to offer Nanadi a thousand hotels so that gives people a reason to come and look for hotels in the independent sector. And we've got some great brands as well.
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Laura Kramer
And how do you find these hotels and the independent brands that you're incorporating in? Do they apply? Do you go out and find them? How do they that work?
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Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
Well, there's sort of a finite group of independents out there. Although with a thousand hotels you say that's quite a big group. We're typically looking for upscale and luxury hotel groups. Some of them will be familiar. Take a market like London for example. We've got several brands there. For example the Cafe Royal, we've got Corinthia Group, we've got the Dole Collection that has hotels like the Malibone, we've got Sea Containers which is part of the Law Group. So in any given city we're going to have a choice of brands. They're typically luxury or upscale. Brands. So part of what we're doing is choosing brands to join the alliance that are independent. They want to be part of a bigger group, but at the same time, they want to continue to manage, operate and market their own hotels.
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Laura Kramer
You've done some recent research. Tell us about the findings. Because obviously we're, we're at ilt. Everybody wants to see where is the sector heading. Tell us what you're seeing.
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Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
So we're very positive heading into 2026 about travel. Generally, we're seeing customers talking about taking more leisure trips next year. What's fascinating, as someone slightly older in the industry, I've been doing this for about 30, 35 years, is the way that the customer profile is changing. So when I was growing up in the industry, the business traveler was your lucrative customers. They're the ones that spent all the money. Today, companies have become very conservative in terms of business travel costs through huge volumes of business travel. It's a trillion dollar market, but basically companies are controlling costs very carefully. So they don't let the typical corporate traveler go into a very luxurious hotel. They certainly are not going to allow them to spend $1,000 a night on a hotel. So if you want to drive demand, the right sort of price into luxury hotels, you're aiming at leisure travelers, you're aiming at international travelers. They stay longer. And what we're seeing in our customer research is that leisure travelers are actually planning more trips and business travelers and they're planning more international trips, and that's good for us.
- [29:36]
Laura Kramer
And you're also seeing that a lot more travelers are choosing to go off the beaten path, so to say. So more smaller cities, rural escapes. What's driving that?
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Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
Well, we're seeing some interesting changes in the way leisure travelers are behaving. And that's partly driven by maybe it's perception, maybe it's reality. Depends where you live. My son lives in Barcelona and he tells me it's reality. The city's been taken over by tourists, but we are seeing changes in choices because people are seeing, saying, okay, I'd love to go to Spain, but I hear that Barcelona is overcrowded. You see prices are very high. And so you're seeing people starting to explore secondary cities. We've got a huge presence in Spain. So your cities like Valencia or Alicante or maybe even places like Seville or Salamanca, Granada, that people are now starting to explore more. So you're seeing more demand into those cities, which is great. That spreads out travel a little bit and it gives other cities an opportunity. Opportunity to shine. Obviously, what it means for us is we need presence in those cities to be able to satisfy that demand. We're also seeing seasonality changes. So sort of the idea that everyone's going to go on holiday in July and August and December, January, yes, it happens. And they're still among our best months of the year. But we've seen real strengthening of leisure demand in months like September and October where people who can are choosing to opt for holidays in the sort of off peak time of year. And so we're seeing a sort of evening out of demand rather than than peaks and troughs of seasonality that we typically saw before.
- [30:59]
Laura Kramer
And I wondered, especially because you work with independent brands, one of the biggest challenges that they face in many of these cities is Airbnb. And we're seeing a lot more pushback against this from cities saying, first of all, it drives up the cost of living for people. But also from another angle, as they've got people who they're employing now have to stay further away from the hotels that they're working in due to that. And I just wondered, how do you navigate that? What challenges that pose?
- [31:23]
Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
Well, we see the demand for leisure travel such that people in some cases are choosing a luxury home stay versus a hotel. Sometimes it's a pricing issue, sometimes it's a space issue. They have their own challenges because they've got their own regulation issues. Hotels are well established, they're regulated. And a lot of cities are pushing back because of the damage it's doing to the housing market. Again, I use Barcelona as an example. So many people have bought flats to put them onto Airbnb because it was so lucrative, lucrative that then that restricts the availability of housing for local people and or it's pushing up the price of housing. So there is this tension in that segment in particular. Nonetheless, we embrace it. We recognize that customers need choice and if you offer customers choice, they're more likely to stay in your ecosystem. So from our loyalty point of view, if we don't have a hotel in a destination, we'll always offer our luxury homestay partner plum guard guide as an alternative, which is a typical Airbnb call it, but at a luxury level of the market. So I don't see that going away. I see it evolving. I think governments are going to regulate it more, but ultimately it's a consumer choice and I think that's part of the next generation of traveler is they look as homestead as a serious option.
- [32:37]
Laura Kramer
Now, how would you describe then the mood across the industry? Do you Think it's optimistic, cautious, a little bit of both.
- [32:44]
Peter Copping / Chris Hartley
I'm an optimist. Generally, you need to be in our industry because for every year we express optimism, there's always something around the corner that can have an impact on travel. What I found over the last, again, sounding slightly old, but if you take a 20, 30 year view of the way people travel, they're less impacted by global events than they were. So if you look back to the 1990s, for example, when you had the first Gulf War, or you saw a complete freeze of international travel, just people stopped traveling everywhere. Now people are far more discerning, they're aware of that risk, is very isolated. And so you don't see that impact on travel from global events. Economic changes, yes, a little bit. Tends to affect business travel more. But again, you're seeing leisure travelers being very resilient. And so we are an optimist because we just see the huge, huge volume in demand. Our research again says that people put travel as a lifestyle choice. They put it above so many other things they want to do in life. Whether it's a career promotion or a family or a wedding, travel is right up there with things that people want to do. And so I'm an optimist for next year and beyond.
- [33:53]
Chris Chermack
Chris Hartley, CEO of Global Hotel alliance, speaking to Monaco's Laura Kramer at the ILTM in Cannes earlier this year. That's all the time we have for this edition of the Globalist. It was produced by Monica Lillis and our sound engineer was Jack Jewers. There is a special edition of the Briefing coming up at midday in London. The Globalist returns at the same time on Monday. I'm Chris Chermack.
- [34:16]
Tom Webb
Goodbye.
- [34:16]
Chris Chermack
Have a great Boxing Day, if indeed you celebrate it. And thanks for listening.
- [34:34]
UBS Narrator
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