Tariffs, HanesBrands acquired, Willy Chavarria's apology — and a roundtable on the state of sneakers

Summary

The Glossy Podcast - Episode: Tariffs, HanesBrands Acquired, Willy Chavarria's Apology — and a Roundtable on the State of Sneakers

Release Date: August 15, 2025

Hosted by senior fashion reporter Danny Parisi and editor-in-chief Jill Manoff, this episode of The Glossy Podcast delves into significant developments impacting the fashion and luxury industries. Covering topics from international trade tariffs to major acquisitions and controversies within sneaker culture, the episode offers comprehensive insights into current market dynamics and future trends.

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1. Tariffs Update

Duration: [01:00 – 12:16]

Danny Parisi initiates the discussion with an in-depth update on the ongoing U.S.-China trade negotiations, highlighting the latest development where President Trump has delayed tariffs on China for an additional 90 days as of August 14, 2025. This extension exemplifies the unpredictability surrounding tariff implementations, complicating strategic planning for brands.

Key Points:

• Uncertainty and Planning Challenges: Both hosts agree that the constant changes in tariff policies create a chaotic environment for brands, making it nearly impossible to formulate long-term strategies. Jill Manoff notes, “[The unpredictability] makes it impossible to plan for anything when it changes all the time” (00:49).

• Impact on Small vs. Large Brands: Smaller brands like Rude struggle to negotiate favorable terms, as Jill explains, “They're just waiting for that to happen, and it could put them in a big bind” (05:51). In contrast, larger companies might better absorb the financial strain due to their extensive resources.

• Potential Price Increases: With tariffs currently at 30%, there is a looming threat of brands passing these costs onto consumers. Jill mentions specific rates, such as a 39% tariff on Swiss watches, which has alarmed the luxury watch industry (07:40).

• Complexity and Ethical Concerns: Danny raises concerns about the complexity of the tariff system, suggesting it could lead to corruption and underhanded deals as brands navigate the convoluted regulations (12:16).

2. Gildan's Acquisition of HanesBrands

Duration: [12:21 – 17:59]

The podcast shifts focus to a significant merger in the apparel industry: Gildan's acquisition of HanesBrands for $2 billion. This deal consolidates two major players in the basic apparel sector, particularly in the T-shirt market.

Key Points:

• Market Consolidation: Jill Manoff expresses surprise at characterizing Hanes as "under the radar," noting its iconic presence and recent collaborations with brands like Redone and Urban Outfitters (14:25).

• Strategic Motivations: Danny Parisi connects the acquisition to the current tariff uncertainty, suggesting that mergers and acquisitions (M&A) are strategic moves for companies to strengthen their position amid economic unpredictability. He cites other recent M&A activities, indicating a broader trend of consolidation in the fashion industry (17:23).

• Growth and Negotiation Power: Jill highlights that larger merged entities can negotiate better terms with suppliers and navigate tariff challenges more effectively, fostering resilience during turbulent economic periods (14:44).

3. Willy Chavarria's Apology and Adidas Collaboration Controversy

Duration: [17:59 – 24:44]

The episode addresses a controversy involving designer Willy Chavarria and Adidas over the creation of an Oaxacan-inspired sneaker. The design, reminiscent of traditional huarache sandals, sparked backlash due to the lack of involvement from the Oaxacan community.

Key Points:

• Cultural Appropriation Concerns: Willy Chavarria and Adidas faced criticism for creating a product inspired by Oaxacan culture without meaningful collaboration with local artisans. Jill Manoff questions whether this is part of a broader pattern of brands misappropriating cultural elements without proper representation (19:53).

• Apology and Remediation Efforts: Willy Chavarria publicly apologized and committed to working with the state of Oaxaca to compensate and involve the community in future projects, aiming to rectify the oversight (23:13).

• Industry-Wide Implications: The hosts discuss similar incidents with brands like Zara, Anthropologie, Louis Vuitton, and Carolina Herrera, emphasizing the growing need for brands to approach cultural inspirations with respect and genuine collaboration (22:37).

4. Roundtable Discussion: The State of Sneakers

Duration: [26:43 – 50:39]

Post-break, the episode transitions to a roundtable discussion with Jill Manoff and international reporter Zofia Zvaglinska, focusing on the evolving sneaker market.

Key Points:

a. Aesthetic Shifts in Sneaker Design

• Trend Toward Slim Profiles: The hosts observe a move from bulky, statement sneakers like the Balenciaga Triple S to slimmer, more understated models such as Adidas Samba and Puma Speed Cat (28:35).

• Influence of Female Consumers: Zofia notes that many of the current popular sneaker styles appeal to women seeking comfort and versatility, integrating seamlessly with various outfits (30:10).

b. Resale Market Dynamics

• Decline in Resale Prices: Danny Parisi highlights a 6% drop in the resale value of sneakers, with fewer models selling above retail prices compared to previous years (32:16).

• Niche Communities: Zofia reports that the sneaker enthusiast community has become more specialized, focusing on rare editions and authentic collections, as discussed with Brendan Dunn from StockX (34:12).

c. Influence of Athletes and Nostalgia

• Athlete-Endorsed Sneakers: The discussion points out that collaborations with athletes, such as those from the WNBA, continue to drive demand, with signature shoes like Caitlin Clark's selling at double their retail prices (40:33).

• Nostalgia-Driven Purchases: Both hosts mention a resurgence in the popularity of vintage and retro models, driven by consumers' desire to reconnect with styles from their youth (42:47).

d. Impact of Tariffs on Sneaker Brands

• Financial Strain on Brands: The conversation circles back to how tariffs are affecting sneaker brands, with companies like Puma experiencing significant stock drops due to increased costs (45:55).

• Consumer Resilience: Despite price hikes, core sneaker collectors remain loyal, indifferent to moderate price increases as the cultural and historical value of sneakers remains paramount (46:38).

e. Future Outlook and Sustainability

• Shift to Physical Communities: Donne (likely referring to Danny) suggests that sneaker culture is returning to physical spaces, emphasizing in-person community building rather than solely online interactions (37:11).

• Sustainable Practices: The hosts briefly touch upon sustainability, with brands needing to balance growth with ethical practices amidst economic and cultural challenges.

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Concluding Remarks

The episode wraps up with reflections on the discussed topics, underscoring the interconnectedness of international trade policies, corporate acquisitions, cultural sensitivity, and evolving consumer preferences in shaping the current landscape of the fashion and luxury industries. The dynamic nature of these elements presents both challenges and opportunities for brands striving to navigate an increasingly complex market.

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Notable Quotes:

• “Nobody can make a plan. Constant change.” — Jill Manoff (06:20)

• “Stronger larger amid all these tariffs.” — Jill Manoff (17:59)

• “We're honoring this culture, and we're getting all of the money from the honoring.” — Danny Parisi (21:13)

• “The sneaker culture is very much alive. It will never die.” — Noah Thomas (35:05)

• “Sponsors are more inclined to activate in physical spaces around sneakers.” — Zofia Zvaglinska (37:11)

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Timestamp Reference Key:

• MM:SS — Corresponds to the specific moment within the podcast transcript for easy navigation.

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This summary encapsulates the key discussions and insights shared in the episode, providing listeners and non-listeners alike with a comprehensive overview of the topics covered.

Transcript

[Danny Parisi]

Business growth doesn't just happen. Brands get blocked by bad data, slow decisions, and media that doesn't pull its weight. Tenuity is the only agency that helps brands eliminate waste and unlock real growth with strategy, with tech, with people who treat your business like their own. Love growth, hate waste. Find out what your media is really doing. Visit love growth, hate hatewaste.com hello and welcome back to the Glossy Podcast. I'm your host, senior fashion reporter Danny Parisi, and I'm here with our editor in chief, Jill Manoff. Hello, Jill.

[Jill Manoff]

Hello, Danny. How's it going?

[Danny Parisi]

It's going very well. I'm happy to see you. It is very, very warm in New York. Very humid, I would say in New York. I don't know what it's like in St. Louis, but it is pretty nasty.

[Jill Manoff]

That is bad. Ha ha ha.

[Danny Parisi]

Well, that's good. We were just talking about all the kids are going back to school now. It's so early. But yes, we have a fun episode. Well, I shouldn't say fun, actually. None of these stories are really that fun, but they're interesting. I'll say they're interesting. I want to start by doing a tariff update. I feel like we haven't talked about tariffs directly on the podcast in a little while. So we'll kind of dive into what' as of Thursday, August 14, which might be different by Friday, August 15, but who knows? Later we're going to talk about Gildan buying Hanes brands. Both are under the radar, like those brands that make T shirts that other people put their logos on. But both pretty big companies. This is like a multi billion dollar deal. We'll dive into that. Lastly, I want to talk about Willy Chavaria and Adidas, this Oaxacan slip on sneaker sandal kind of hybrid that got a pretty strong reaction from Mexico, from the community where the that inspired the design. We'll talk about some of the controversy there. And then later in the episode, after a short break, me, you, Jill and our international reporter Zofia. Zofia Zvaglinska, we recorded, I thought, a very great conversation about the state of the sneaker industry. We dove into both kind of aesthetically, what's popular right now, fewer big chunky sneakers, more kind of slim soccer inspired sneakers. But we also talked about the state of the market, some of the big players like Nike, but also newer ones like Hoka and on and all sorts of stuff. We also, all three of us went out and talked to some sneaker experts and gathered some information from them as well. So you'll hear little snippets from our conversations with those experts as well. That's after the break. But first, let's dive into the news from this week. So let's, like I said, I want to talk tariffs. If you go on the glossy website, you'll see we have written a ton about tariffs. And because we've been covering it so much, kind of have been steering away from it on the podcast for a little bit. But I thought we should dive back in. It is coming up in every conversation I have with designers. It is still a huge, huge thing on everybody's mind and there's a lot going on. So the biggest news, I think this week, and there's a lot of other things we can talk about, too, but the biggest news is that Trump once again delayed tariffs on China for yet another 90 days. Negotiations between the two countries are still going on. I think this was expected because there's been talks between the US And China in Stockholm. I think they were meeting for trade negotiations and I think everyone sort of knew that the deadline was probably gonna be extended again. But I think still it's yet another example of the extreme unpredictability of the tariff rollout. And just everyone I'm talking to is saying the same thing of just it's impossible to plan for anything when it changes all the time. So that's, I feel like that's the biggest news. I mean, Jill, you're writing the tariff briefing. You're talking to a ton of people about this. What have you heard?

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah, very similar. So, yes, Modern Retail has a weekly tariffs briefing tariffs newsletter that goes out on Mondays. If you're not signed up, get it while it's hot. But yes, I was going to tell you, like, I just returned from ETEL Boston. It's still in swing. But it's interesting because our last couple of events and some others that I've been to, it was all tariffs, tariffs, tariffs, tariffs, tariffs. This time I don't know if brands were, maybe they were trying to change the subject and nobody wants to go there because it's not great news. It's not maybe a great look to say I'm struggling here. But yeah, all the, all the talk this week, I would say more so was on AI. There was, it was very dominant and not as much tariffs at all. But, but yes, I'm with you. Nobody can make a plan. Constant change. Founders and leaders are telling me they're just wasting their time, all the time planning for different scenarios. They're even waiting to ship holiday Inventory until tariffs come down. They're just waiting for that to happen and it could put them in a big bind for like China. Another 90 day delay before we have an answer. That puts us at November 10th. Right now it's at 30%, which is hefty. So like they're kind of like, do, do we go there? But yeah, they're telling me they're not pulling back on marketing, but different folks telling me different things. Like, I talked to Marion park, similarly to the Rude, makes a lot of her shoes in Brazil, also Italy, but she was saying that she's trying, attempting to negotiate with her suppliers and those in her supply chain and she was questioning like, who's making progress there, who's seeing. I'm not like nobody's lowering their prices for me. Whereas others, probably larger brands that it is, are having more success. So it definitely puts smaller brands at a disadvantage. Like, like a lot of things.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, no, I think you're totally right. And I have had a little bit of the same experience where it seems like even though tariffs are coming up for me, a lot of my conversations, probably because I'm asking people, but also it's a little bit of like everyone is saying it's still top of mind but they don't really have a lot to say about it because it's kind of just the same. They're all just like sort of waiting around to see what the final numbers will be. But again, it changes so often it's like, no, it's really hard to like, you know, predict anything or plan anything.

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah, one thing they're saying is the last thing they want to do is pass the costs onto the consumer. Like the consumer is already dealing with inflation. They want to retain the loyalty that they have now rather than while everyone's discount or you know, looking for discounts and lower costs. They don't want to lose them. However, like a lot of them are increasing their prices 5 to 10% with tariffs of like 50% in Brazil and Switzerland. I know you're going to probably touch on this in a story of having their tariffs are 39% impacts the watch industry. Canada at 35, Mexico at 25. Like, there's talk, especially like this week. I've seen a lot of stories surfacing, not our own, but that almost like brands are in denial. Like Marion park was saying, I'm, you know, her price increases are going to hit and fall. So she kind of laughs that there are all these like great stories out there, like prices aren't even increasing in fashion. But she's like, oh, you just wait, it's coming. And others are saying the same thing. Like if you think you're just going to see a 5 to 10% increase, I mean that's still significant when the consumer is comparing prices. But basically the vibe is there will be larger increases or brands aren't going to be able to survive. Like where are those costs going?

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, no, a hundred percent. And I think there have been price increases already. But I think you're right that the real kind of wave is still coming. But every 90 day extension and every weird little carve out kind of delays it. But I was thinking about how having 180 days to plan for something is not the same as having 90, you know, 30 days to plan for it, like four times or whatever or six times, you know what I mean? Like it's a short deadline that keeps getting extended, means that every time you're trying to accomplish something in that short period of time, as opposed to if you had one big, you know, you got nine, you got 180 days or whatever and you know for sure it's not going to change after that. That's better. You know, that's like more, it's more solid and more stable. But right now it's really kind of like chaotic and I feel like the administration is kind of basically playing like economic chicken. It's like, see if I won't crash our economy and the entire world if you don't like give me a better deal. Which is kind of terrifying.

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah, like brands like, and retailers, like they all just sound, they sound very defeated and just trying to get through the year. Like everyone talks about getting through the year. But then like obviously we still have the same administrative administration in 2026 we're going to be dealing with this again. But I think we're just talking in annual figures. Like one that I talked to that sounded the most defeated or pissed off was the founder, a co founder of Standard and Strange, which is a retailer, independent retailer that gets basically all of their merchandise from Japan. And he's just like what, what the hell? Like there's, there's not much we can do here. And just was kind of waiting for some good news. But anyway, we'll watch, we'll see. I'm sure we're seeing a lot of M and A, which we're going to talk about today and a lot of.

[Danny Parisi]

Changes which I do think is tied to tariffs and I'll get to that in a second. But you mentioned the Swiss tariffs. I did want to say 39% tariff on Switzerland is like freaking everybody in the Swiss watch world out. Like that's a big deal. Some of those watches are tens of thousands of dollars or hundreds of thousands of dollars. So if each watch you have to pay thousands of dollars of tariffs on, that makes that product a lot harder to move. And the US is also a big consumer of luxury watches. I talked a little while ago to some of the big watch resellers who were saying it's good for us in the moment because people are buying or are interested in buying pre owned watches that are already here, that you don't have to pay tariffs on, blah, blah, blah, but, but there's only a limited supply of that as well. And so they were kind of predicting in the future that might, once that product that's already here is used up, it would be really crazy. So a lot of people in the watch industry that I'm talking to are very freaked out about that 39% tariff on Switzerland. But again, that might change, who knows?

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah, I think for the time being, I think it's gonna lead to fewer, more thoughtful purchases on behalf of the consumer. They know everything's going up. They're not going to just buy frivolous things, which I, I've been regretting a purchase I made over the weekend ever since I splurged, but I'm like, why am I doing this now anyway?

[Zofia Zvaglinska]

Yeah, yeah.

[Danny Parisi]

Last thing I want to say about tariffs is like the, the other thing is, I think in addition to the unpredictability, it's also, I think just making the whole system a lot more complex and kind of frankly a little sketchy. Like then there's all these weird little carve outs where it's like tariffs on this nation, but only for these products. And then this category of product is like tariffed at a different rate. And then there's like these really weird sort of one off deals where like the Trump administration is gonna take a 15% cut of every microchip sold by Nvidia to China, which is like this weird like extortion scheme. And I'm like, or you could just do collect taxes like a normal government. But it's very weird and I feel like it's creating, it's going to create a system that's very complex and hard to navigate and frankly rife with corruption and weird underhanded deals where it's like we'll classify this product as something else. A lot of other places in the world do operate in that kind of where Sort of bribery and slipping things under the radar is very normal. And I do feel like the system we're developing right now in the US is going to lead toward that. When it's so complex and confusing and built on these weird one off deals. I feel like it will incentivize more sort of, I don't know, underhanded behavior. That's just my thought.

[Jill Manoff]

Scandal. We'll see. Yikes.

[Danny Parisi]

Let's move on. Although I do think this second topic also ties to tariffs a little bit. But Gildan, which I think I'm saying, right, Gildan, which you probably know, if you've ever gotten a free T shirt from a local event with a like the community center logo on it or whatever, it's probably a gilded T shirt. They're one of those Companies that makes 100% cotton T shirts for others to put screen prints on or their logos on or whatever. But a really huge company. I mean I think their revenue is like $3 billion or something. This week they said that they are going to buy Hanes brand, which includes obviously Hanes, but also Wonder Bra and Legs and Legs L apostrophe E GGS that brand Legs, which is kind of a lot of brands in the same mode, like very kind of simple, unbranded comfort kind of stuff, which Gildan is also kind of in that same space. But they're going to pay $2 billion for that company for Hanes brand. So it's a pretty big deal and it's two pretty large players in that sort of unbranded plain basic clothes space kind of merging together. I thought that was very interesting. I have some thoughts about how tariffs might play into that. But Joe, what is your take on this acquisition?

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah, no, you're, you're probably right about the tariffs, but I thought it was so interesting in your intro and maybe it's because I'm a child of the 80s or like it was hotter back in the day, but when you called like Hanes kind of an under the radar brand, like I don't think of it as that. Like I, you know, I think of like you see it everywhere. First of all, it's like obviously still around is like the packed teas, packaged tees at like Target or like a Walmart and, and I used to get the teas and even the men's teas or the little boys teas and tanks, like ribbed white tanks all the time. I think I do still do sometimes maybe. But yeah, I think it's kind of iconic and they've recently Done collaborations with. Not. Yeah, they're still going, like with Redone. They did one with Carla Welch, Justin Bieber, stylist, Urban Outfitters, fairly recently. So anyway, I think of it less as under the radar. But I. And I also.

[Danny Parisi]

No, that's fair.

[Jill Manoff]

But I also did. Yeah, I didn't even know of Gildan. Like, I. It's like a huge company or I don't know it by name. And then when I'm like exploring, there's all these little bits that I forgot about. Like, for example, they acquired American Apparel in 2017. They acquired another American Apparel still around.

[Danny Parisi]

They're operating it still around. Although the aesthetic is very different. The logo is still the same, like the same font. But otherwise, like, the aesthetic is. Is, I'm gonna say, a lot tamer compared to the old American Apparel.

[Jill Manoff]

Yes. And they do private label for a lot of big brands. I mean, this was in there. Wikipedia, take it or leave it. But like Under Armour and New Balance. Their socks under their other label.

[Danny Parisi]

All the socks.

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah. So huge. Huge. And then it made me question, like, there's no objection from like the FTC. They seem like $3.5 billion companies, both of them. Like, they're very dominant in the T shirt space. But yeah, I do. I wouldn't say they have a monopoly. And so maybe that this shouldn't be like something to question. But at this very low price tier where Gildan, you get two T's for $10 on Amazon, 10 for $23. Anyway, they're all over Walmart and Amazon, both of them very cheapy. Cheapy price point tees.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah. Well, okay, so first off, I'm gonna say you're probably right. I shouldn't say under the radar for Hanes. Basically what I mean is like under clothes, sort of like undershirts and sort of like, you know what I mean? But I was familiar with Gildan. Like, I feel like I have like Little League baseball team T shirts that are made by Gildan or something like that. They're that kind of company. They actually also acquired a couple of years ago Comfort Colors, which was a very similar brand. Like they made plain T shirts and other people could like put their stuff on it. I'm actually wearing a comfort colors shirt right now with this band, Spanish Love Songs.

[Jill Manoff]

I've read that too, and I didn't even. I've never heard of comfort colors. Anyway.

[Danny Parisi]

Comfort Colors is my favorite of that type of like plain T shirt company. They make really nice stuff. But anyway, so Gildan is kind of like a Big player in that space. My thought on the tariff part of it is just that there's been a lot of mergers and acquisitions in fashion over even just the last couple months. I looked it up there, just a few. Meta bought a part of SLR luxottica Heron. Preston bought his brand back. Skechers was acquired by 3G Capital. Revolve bought Dion Lee, Andy Swim bought Richard Porer. Peter Kern bought La Perla. There's been a ton of. And not all of these are huge billion dollar deals. Some of them are just a medium brand acquiring a smaller brand. But I do think in a sort of tariff uncertain landscape similar to how we've talked about, like wholesale is more popular right now because you're kind of like cleaving together with your partners to kind of keep each other afloat. Feel kind of the same with acquisitions where it's like maybe individually we both can't stay afloat, but if we merge, we'll have enough capital and enough resources to kind of get through this period, you know, get through the year like you said.

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah, and enough power for those negotiations. It makes really good sense. Gildan said something like that. Like we're stronger together when. Stronger, larger amid all these tariffs. And you're right. I read a stat via Bloomberg that global deal values could hit $1 trillion in the third quarter of M&A for only the second time on record ever. Like huge time. Obviously some brands are a little desperate, like Hanes Brands sold off Champion to Authentic brand year. But it wasn't immediate. It wasn't this summer. But yeah, so much movement happening.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, for sure. Let's talk about our last topic. Willy Chavaria, who is a designer we've talked to and about at Glossy quite a bit. He's great. But he created this sneaker slip on sort of hybrid recently with Adidas. Part of his collaboration with Adidas, which was described as a Oaxacan slip on. Oaxaca is a state in Mexico. Basically it's very, very directly inspired by a huarache, which is a traditional handmade sandal that originates from Oaxaca. The problem was that basically nobody who is Oaxacan or from Oaxaca had any involvement with the creation of the shoe. And there was a pretty strong reaction, including Mexican President Claudia Sheinbaum made a comment about it. Basically the perception was that this large multinational European based company created a shoe that will probably make a lot of money that is directly copying this traditional indigenous article of clothing. And no one who actually is from that place or from that community had any involvement. And I feel like A lot of times I've talked to brands and designers, and when they do something that's inspired by a certain place or certain people, they often brag about. We worked with the artisans from this community to come up with this thing. And sometimes it's a little bit, I'm like, how much did you really work with them? But I do think that is the right way to do it if you want to make something so directly inspired. But Willy Trevaria came out along with Adidas and said, you're right, we didn't involve anybody from Oaxaca. We're sorry. And now they're working with the state of Oaxaca to compensate people there and kind of redo it. They're not going to pull the shoe or anything, but I think they're going to try to retroactively form a collaboration with some of the people there. Anyway, I'm going on and on. I mean, what's your take on this whole situation?

[Jill Manoff]

I mean, when you said huarache, however you said it, like, I had a little note here because, like, you know, huarachi sandals, how Americans, like, butcher it. Like, it's almost like a style. And I feel like a lot of brands have them. So I'm like, is this government busy in terms of, like, going after all of these different ones? Like, I don't know, like, maybe it's a little too close for comfort, what Adidas and Willy Trevoria are doing, or, like, I don't know what's the line there? Because it's become a very common style. It's, it's interesting. Then you got to say, you know, Willie Chavaria championing, championing his Mexican American culture, like, that's his jam. Like, that's what he does all the time. So I, more than maybe anybody, that, where we're, where we're like, gosh, don't you have a, like, somebody checking what goes out in the world? And we're always like, this is ridiculous at this point in time. I mean, I, I, I believe him when he said it wasn't his intention or like his intention was to honor the culture and artistry, but he should, you know, he should have gone, gone about it differently. Looking back, I, yeah, I don't think it was, like, meant to. I don't know. I guess what, what's being insinuated is like, rip it off, sell it for my own profit. That is kind of what, what we're doing here. But I don't know. I don't think it was like, I.

[Danny Parisi]

Mean, I think that's like the main issue, I think you're right. I don't think there was an intended sinister kind of intention behind it, But, I mean, it is a little bit like representation without participation. It's like we're honoring this culture, and we're getting all the money from the honoring, you know, And I think you're right that there is sort of an ambiguous line where there are certain. There's tons of types of clothing that originate from a specific time and place and have now just, like, you know, propagated out and are, you know, have become sort of a generic product. And as for, like, when and where those people have the right to, like, criticize, I mean, definitely not my place to say, but I think you're right that sometimes some things slip by. I'm sure there's lots of huaraches out there that no one from Oaxaca was involved with that didn't get as big a reaction. It might almost be like it's kind of a paradox. But because Willy Chavaria is Mexican American, and because it's kind of like, pitched as, like, this authentic thing, there was, like, maybe more scrutiny because, I mean, he is Mexican American, but he's not Oaxacan. As far as I can tell, he's not from that community. It's almost like the more you present yourself as authentic, or if you are presented as authentic, it might not necessarily be him. The more scrutiny there is. And almost if it was like some cheap Shein thing, I'm sure people would probably still not love it, but maybe there would just be less of a big deal about it. I don't know.

[Jill Manoff]

I so agree. And, yeah, brands just. I think they're learning. I mean, as more of these stories roll out, just to be. Be more careful and respectful, I think is the word. But there were stories out there that Zara and Anthropologie have been under. Under scrutiny for the same. Same fault. And as have Louis Vuitton and Carolina Herrera. They've been called out in the past and in hot water is how it's been worded. So, yeah, so if you're doing something, there's inspiration from everywhere, but really think through, like, where's it coming from?

[Danny Parisi]

And there's also. I think there's also a level of, like, what is this place or community that it comes from? Because I was thinking there's espadrilles or espadrilles, which is a Spanish shoe and comes from a specific part of Spain, but I feel like there's not as much of a. An outcry but it's also because Spain is like a big, wealthy country. Like, they're not hurting at all, you know, whereas, like, indigenous American communities have a much different situation. And it's a little bit of a different vibe when, like a huge, you know, European corporation, like, kind of copies their style. It's a little different than if they copied, like, German lederhosen or something. It's like, well, the Germans will be fine, you know, so there's. I do think there's some difference there. Speaking of these shoes, though, I feel like this is a good segue into our second segment, but they are sneaker sandal hybrids, and I feel like that is such a, like our conversation on the sneaker industry, which we will get to in a second. We touched a lot on, like, these hybrid sneakers or shoes with, like, sneaker ballet flats or sneaker clogs or whatever. There's like, a lot of that kind of thing going on and this shoe in it, you know, besides all the, like, cultural appropriation thing also kind of plays into that trend. So. Good segue.

[Jill Manoff]

Good segue. It's a cool shoe. And I mean, hopefully they'll. They'll get it together and yes, pay them, work with them, work again anyway, work with the community. But yeah, there was an interesting comment that Adidas did not respond to comment when asked if the shoe was still being sold. So it sounds like it is. They'll just like, right there. Wrong.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah.

[Jill Manoff]

And P.S. will, Echeveria is kind of killing it. I want a lot of his items out there right now with the little logo. Very cute.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, Very, very cool. Well, thank you so much for being here, Joe. That's going to be the end of our week in review segment. But like I said, stick around. We're going to take a super short break and when we come back, me, you and Zofia had a great conversation about the sneaker industry. We all went out and talked to some experts. I talked to Alex Lautier from Culture Media, formerly Culture Kicks. Zofia went out and talked to Brendan Dunn from Stockx. Jill, who did you talk to?

[Jill Manoff]

I talked to Noah Thomas, currently at Macy's, heading up kids and menswear. I believe in terms of fashion directing, but yeah, formerly of High Snobiety, one of the. One of two Mule Boys. Definitely a speak, a sneaker expert. So, yes, listen in. It's great.

[Danny Parisi]

Every brand says they want growth, but here's the thing about growth. Most of the time it's being held back by waste. Waste in your media plan. Waste in your measurement, waste in the way decisions get made. Tenuity is here to end that. Tenuity is an independent media agency built for brands that want to grow. Their humans are brilliant, their technology is powerful. Tinuity Tech shows you exactly what's working, what's wasting budget, and what to do next. They don't just talk about growth, they engineer it. Tenuity. Love growth. Hate waste. Find out what your media is really doing. Visit lovegrowth hatewaste.com hello again, everybody. This is senior fashion reporter Danny Parisi, and I am sitting down here with our editor in chief, Jill Manoff, and our international reporter, Zofia Zviglinska. Hello, guys. How's it going?

[Jill Manoff]

Good. Excited to talk sneakers.

[Danny Parisi]

Yes, we're talking sneakers. Today we are having a roundtable discussion about the state of the sneaker market. I want to go through what's hot right now, what's happening in sneakers, and where we think things are going. We will try not to spend too much time on looking backwards, but I am just going to give a quick. Here's my quick thesis statement on where we are, and then we can jump into some specifics. But obviously there was a huge sneaker craze in the last maybe six to eight years. Every brand on earth felt like they had to make a sneaker or collaborate with a sneaker brand. You had the Balenciaga triple S and all that kind of stuff. And it feels like now there's kind of been sort of a correction a little bit where a lot of brands, maybe we don't need to make sneakers or be as heavily invested in the space. A little bit of a move back toward regular footwear, other types of shoes. But the sneaker market is still huge. So I wanted to talk about sort of just where we are right now. What are the kids wearing? What are we wearing? What's popular? The first one that comes to mind for me is obviously the Adidas Samba had a huge moment in the last year or two. But in general, I feel like there's been this shift toward more of a slimmer profile. The chunky Balenciaga triple S that I mentioned is sort of out. The Nike Dunk is supposedly Nike's projecting the sales of dunks to go down like 70%. But meanwhile, there's been the Sambas, the Onitsuka Tigers, the Puma Speed Cat is huge. These are all kind of slimmer and more subtle kind of sneakers. I would say not super ostentatious in the way that really popular sneakers used to be in the last couple years. So that's kind of aesthetically what I'm seeing, but I don't know about you guys. What, what do you think is popular right now?

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah, I would agree. You know, we see these cycles where shoe becomes hot and then every brand comes out with a similar version, which started probably the, the most, I don't know, best case, best example, the dad shoe, chunky, like you were talking about, moved to the samba. Now kind of this ballet sneaker. You know, there are, in between, there are kind of some stabs where brands are trying things and maybe they want to be the style that everyone kind of replicates. There are a lot, a couple iterations of this almost like boxing sneaker. It looked like a samba meets a shin guard kind of up your leg that didn't take off. I think that's not very practical for everyday wear. But yeah, I think we're in the ballet sneaker era. Plus the on in Hoka, which we got to get into because that kind of performance meets every day is also still, still thriving.

[Zofia Zvaglinska]

Yeah, definitely. I think that like the Puma ones as well, which had some kind of those early 90s callbacks, and then the Adidas Taekwondo, like, that's the one that I've been seeing everywhere where you have like a very slim, almost like, as you said, like ballet style, just with the Adidas stripes and then some extra ties around the ankles. So it almost feels like a ballerina. Those are the ones that I've been seeing a lot. And also I think that that's, that's because of how many women are now into like, the sneaker aesthetic. But it's a slightly different aesthetic to what it was with the Balenciaga, for example.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, and actually, I'm glad you mentioned the Adidas Taekwondo was, I believe, the number one shoe on the list index that just came out this quarter. And number three was the Puma speed cat ballerina shoe. At the same time, we're saying, like, the kind of ostentatious chunky sneakers are out. There's definitely been some weird experimentations with combining sneakers. There was the infamous New Balance snow fur, which I still think kind of looks insane, but sneaker, ballet flats, sneaker loafers, sneakers combined with all sorts of things. It's interesting though, because there was, this is just occurring to me now. There was years ago this sort of, like men's, like, dress shoe, but with a sneaker sole kind of thing that I thought, like was horribly tacky looking, but was seemingly very popular for several years. But now sneakers combined with loafers and Sneakers combined with other stuff is kind of in. Even though the sneaker dress shoe combination in menswear to me was out, the moment it appeared, I thought it was hideous looking. But.

[Zofia Zvaglinska]

Oh, one more. I have to mention the Nike Air Rift as well. So the one that kind of looks like a tabby but is a sneaker, that one's been really popular with the girls as well. And I feel like that's also an indication of who's wearing the sneakers. It's just a lot of women who want to be comfortable and wear something with a skirt.

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah, all about comfort. It was interesting. Like, we're gonna reference him a couple of times, but I talked with Noah Thomas, associate fashion director at Macy's, currently from Men's and Kids, but formerly digital fashion editor at Heistnobiety. But he was referenced when he was talking all about the HOKA and the on kind of surge and rage and everyone's loving that. He talked about like hybrid, I guess a hybrid working environment. It's kind of the evolution of pandemic, the new normal, however you want to call it. But you know, it's more. It's a little bit more polished if you want to wear on in his eyes versus like a casual, super casual Adidas or Jordan, maybe you could actually like wear it for work and play and post work and a little more versatile, which that makes sense to me.

[Danny Parisi]

A huge element of the sneaker market the last couple years has been resale and still is. I don't want to say it's like out or anything, but I was looking at some data and like resale prices are down. Value of resold sneakers in General dropped by 6%. And I think on StockX, less than half of sneakers are selling for more than retail price, which is down quite a bit from what it was in 2023. So sneakers are still like very, you know, a big part of people's wardrobes. But I feel like the gold rush of like super limited editions that sell for like quadruple the price. I mean, they still make those, but it feels like the fervor is dying down a little bit. I mean, what do you guys think about that?

[Zofia Zvaglinska]

Yeah, I spoke to Brendan Dunn, who's actually StockX's recently appointed senior director of community and engagement. And he was a big sneaker head. So a lot of his stuff went quite niche into, you know, the things that were exciting for sneakers at the beginning, including obviously that massive boom early on in the kind of late teens, 2000s and 2000s. But then he was also talking about how niche the sneaker market has become now because as a result of this almost oversaturation of different brand models, the people who are real sneaker fans have almost receded into super, super niche communities where you have to have very, very rare editions of certain sneakers. It's very different, I think, to the popular models that were driving the resale market way. And it seems like the sneaker real fan community is still alive, especially through resale sites. But it's a lot smaller and a lot more maybe specialist than it used to be. I think there's also a separation between those who are true fans and those who kind of jumped on the bandwagon because the Nike Panda was very popular at one point or another and they just wanted to get in on that resale boom.

[Jill Manoff]

Yes, on the same note, yeah, all my, all my sneaker knowledge comes from Noah. But I'm going to reference something he said. He talked about the sneaker culture is very much alive. He said it will never die. But he did point to like the coldness in terms of the resale market. There's no longer the folks that are just buying it in order to resell it because there are different dynamics happening in terms of the value of drops which we can get into. But yeah, just, he just kind of described it as a healthier place because people are buying. It's more about self expression versus hopping on the latest drop. I do want to point to something that he said about the fact about why the drops are dying and why that kind of hype and rush and all of that's happening that really drove the resale market. He talked about kind of almost like a brand as a media company. But yeah, I'll let him describe it.

[D]

You know, brands have to be lifestyle companies. Today you can't just do one thing because you're fighting for everyone's attention. Everything is against each other. A song is up against a YouTube video, that YouTube video is randomly up against a sneaker drop. I know that might not make sense, but I really believe that. So there are a lot of these companies that have to just really make a lifestyle, make you want to be.

[Danny Parisi]

A part of their world.

[D]

Which is why, you know, it doesn't seem out of the ordinary for a brand to have a festival, open up a pop up, that's a restaurant, have a clothing line, do a sneaker collab, drop an album. You know what I mean?

[Jill Manoff]

There's more than just the sneaker drop. Like people are getting excited about other things. There's A lot of competition.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, I mean, and one of the, I think, lasting legacies of the, the sneaker craze of the last decade is the way that sneakers are sold has kind of been exported out to the rest of the industry. The drop culture absolutely originated in sneakers and streetwear. And now people are dropping albums, they're dropping, you know, collection of handbags. Like they're, they. The drop has become like completely agnostic from sneakers and is a major part of the way fashion works. So I think he's got a really good point. And to that end, like, things are competing with each other even if they're not the same thing. So if you're going to be buying sneakers, you could also that attention and those, that money could go toward, I don't know, any number of other things too.

[Zofia Zvaglinska]

Yeah. And I think, I think the, the way that like brands are communicating with these sneaker fans is also changing. You know, Donne talked about the fact that sneaker as a hobby is kind of back outside rather than being online like it used to be. And I think that's also pointed to some of those resale bits. And then I think he spoke about the way that the brands are talking with communities isn't maybe quite the same as what they used to. And for a lot of like sneaker heads, maybe that communication isn't coming off quite as authentic.

[E]

I think that the brands are more inclined these days to activate in physical spaces around sneakers and bring people out and have people congregate. That died down in the early part of this decade for obvious reasons. But I very much think that sneaker collecting sneaker culture, sneakers as a hobby is back outside in the past year in a way that it hasn't been for a long time. I still think that the default setting for sneaker brands existing on social media is to talk to people, not necessarily talk with them. So I think that people form communities around these things on social media. Absolutely. And before we had the term social media, we were filming forming these communities in different places, usually forums or comment sections. I think. Yeah, these, these conversations happen online, but they're not necessarily in conversation with the brands, they're more around the brands.

[Jill Manoff]

Yeah. That's interesting because just talking about social media and the role that it's playing in sneaker culture, when I was talking with Noah, I asked him about youth culture and whether it's the kids that are driving the trends nowadays, and he pointed to the fact that it's its influencers, it's social media. When I asked my 12 year old nephew, Sneakerhead, where he's, like, learning about all these shoes he was so hyped about. He said, you know, influencers. He pointed to TikTok and YouTube and the folks he's following are wearing them. So it's different. That's where, yeah, the education's coming from. And it doesn't necessarily. It's not necessarily, I don't know, teens, preteens that are driving it. It's just, yeah, people are finding their niche. They're finding their niche with the people that they resonate with online.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, I think it's a good point. I also went out and did an interview for this. I spoke with Alex Lotier, who's the CEO of Culture Media, formerly Culture Kicks, but they're a sneaker resale site and a media company. They do a lot of cool stuff. But we talked a lot about kind of one thesis he had was basically the types of sneakers that are popular right now or the ones that are growing in popularity are also, like, not super conducive to the resale market. Like, there's a lot of great on sneakers. You know, you mentioned on running earlier, they're huge and have. Have captured a big, you know, share of the sneaker market. But a lot of their sneakers just don't resell because they're not really made that way. They're not really made in super limited editions with. With the resale market in mind. So even though they're really popular, they're not necessarily selling for, you know, big multiples on. On the resale market. And also on that note, we should look forward a little bit at what is popular. And there is one category of shoe that Alex told me absolutely is. Is selling for more than retail on various resale platforms, and that's anything to do with the wnba. He had really, like, high praise for all of the sneakers that have come out of the WNBA and for the league in general and the athletes who we've talked about many times on this podcast as being huge cultural stars. We talked about. Sabrina Unescu, who plays for the New York Liberty, has a signature shoe that she wears, obviously, but has been worn by a bunch of NBA players. And Caitlin Clark's signature shoe, Alex said that it's selling for twice its retail price through their market and through others. So there's definitely still areas that are inspiring that amount of hype.

[Jill Manoff]

It's so interesting. And it's not just, you know, women buying this. When I was asking again, my nephew, I was asking him about the cool shoes and he Said quote, like among others, Caitlin Clark's Kobe, Kobe's with Nike in the Indiana Fever colorway. Very specific.

[Zofia Zvaglinska]

I think it's interesting that a lot of these kind of sneaker partnerships are around athletes. And obviously in terms of the people who are influencing young people right now, I think athletes have still got that aspirational quality that maybe some other content influences are not really having right now, especially with younger generations. So Gen Z and particularly with Gen Alpha, I think they're looking for a lot of legitimate reasons for someone to be a role model or someone to look up to. And I feel like athletes are that person. And it kind of feels a little bit like a full circle moment because obviously the whole sneaker kind of craze started with Michael Jordan and his heyday with the Chicago poles. So obviously that is a big kind of round circle compared to what the sneaker market has been about. And then it's kind of gone back to athletes. I'm wondering if we're going to see like a second cycle now where, you know, sneakers are going to come around through athletes and then going to disperse again through brands with different other kind of role models that people are looking up to.

[Jill Manoff]

On that note, you know, my nephew was talking about Jordan fours and Jordans a lot, but also a non athlete. Travis Scott, like every Travis Scott shoe he mentioned, Travis Scott in the blue Colorway looks to be a collab with fragment anyway, all of these things. But at the same time, these are not new shoes, which is interesting. I was like, are these brand new? Are they hot off the press? He's like, no, they're like a couple years old. And he was all over stockx and goat showing me these things. But at the same time, Noah talked about the fact that similarly, like the shoes that he's looking at, it's more so like that plays in that to that nostalgia trend. And it's not necessarily what's brand new. It's what he was like gunning for when he was a kid. And all of these brands are coming out with remakes kind of re releasing them. And in his eyes, they're hot as ever.

[D]

Yeah. So I think when it comes to sneakers, the older I get, the more I just want to, I, I want to, you know, grab shoes that I didn't have as a kid. And so I love all of the, the returns. Right. Like for example, Adidas just brought back the, the crazy ones and the twos, which is like the first Kobe sneakers when he was on Adidas that he even hated. But they're so legendary and it's so, you know, cool to be able to get your hands on them. The same with like, you know, Chad Muska, who's a legendary skateboarder and his shoe coming back out with S and, you know, the Kragers coming back out. For me, it's just, you know, what shoes did I see on TV? What shoes did my favorite basketball players have? Tracy McGrady, I couldn't get his shoe. You know, I'd get maybe one or two shoes a year. So now that I'm in a position where I can afford these shoes, those are the shoes that I really want. The Gilbert Arenas, Adidas, those kind of things.

[Jill Manoff]

I looked it up. All the shoes that he mentioned were kind of between the late 90s and through like 2006. So all a couple decades old, which is interesting.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, I was going to say I didn't even know Chad Muska was making shoes. If anyone listening has ever played Tony Hawk pro skater, you would recognize Chad Muska from that. But that's really interesting. On the topic of collaborations and who's popular. I mean, one of the recent sneakers that come out that I was really into was a Tyler creator collaboration with Converse, which is kind of unexpected, but he's a musician who is very, he's extremely fashionable and extremely fashion knowledgeable. And those sneakers are insanely cool. If you guys haven't seen them, you should look them up. But even though, like, you know, there's talk about collab, oversaturation and everything, sometimes a collaboration comes out, especially with someone like Tyler or like Travis Scott who really does know what they're doing. And it's not just kind of like we're just throwing names onto stuff. It can still be exciting, at least for me. I really love that Tyler sneaker. Let's also do two more topics, kind of more forward looking. I think a big one to talk about is Nike is still huge and will remain huge. But I feel like over the last year or two, there's been a lot of talk about them kind of bleeding market share to Adidas, to Puma, to on to hoka. There's also been a ton of leadership changes. They have a new CEO, Elliot Hill, and I feel like everybody, month or two, there's like three more, you know, different executives taking over at different levels of Nike. So there's definitely room for a lot of these other brands, I think, to butt in. And then lastly, I want to talk a little bit about tariffs just for a second, but obviously huge and impactful for everybody. But most sneakers are not made in the U.S. surprise. So like, I mean, I, I just saw Puma. In their last quarterly earnings, their shares dropped 16% when they said that they were expecting a full year loss, which they blamed primarily on tariffs. So it's definitely is going to eat into whatever growth like Puma or other brands are seeing is. I think a lot of it will be minimized because of tariff costs. So two big things affecting the sneaker market for sure. Yeah.

[Zofia Zvaglinska]

And we spoke a lot about, you know, this on previous kind of. We can review episodes, but obviously a lot of brands have been kind of changing their supply chain as a result, moving things out of different countries in Asia, you know, particularly like Vietnam and Indonesia, which were like hit with tariff rates of like 46 and 32%. And I think as a result, you know, a lot of these brands that had, I guess, like pretty low costs, but obviously those costs went up, had to also increase prices for some of their sneakers. But luckily, you know, when I spoke to Dunn at least, like, it seemed like for the real sneaker heads, that kind of thing, and those price increases were, weren't going to be affecting, you know, whether they decide to purchase a sneaker or not.

[E]

I will say that we haven't seen any material change in trades on StockX as a result of the sneaker prices. As a result of the sneaker retail increases that came from tariffs, I think that the primary market will absorb those costs way more than the secondary market will. Honestly, the core sneaker collectors are not going to be deterred by a $5 increase in the price on a pair of sneakers. If you really want that pair of sneakers, I think you're still going to buy it. That's my personal opinion.

[Zofia Zvaglinska]

You know, with him, it seems like regardless of the price that you're paying for the sneakers, it's more about, I guess, the design and the storyline and, you know, all of these kind of concurrent launches that are happening alongside it. Almost like a sneaker being kind of like a point in history. I think that that's the way that they look at it. It's almost like a memento from that. You know, Donne had over 100 sneakers that he has at any kind of given moment. And he kind of edits his collection regularly. So again, like, who gets the cull? Who gets, you know, who gets through? You know, who's the sneaker brands that he's keeping? Like all of those brands are ones that kind of either have that kind of nostalgia moment, like what you said, Jill, or Else, you know, they have a different kind of significance for him as well.

[Jill Manoff]

So interesting. Hopefully just a five dollar increase on the primary market. There was a crazy stat that in the short term prices will be increased 37%, which is a lot. We talked, I think in the past weekend review episode or even just chatting beforehand. I was like, wow, there are all these shoes that are so trendy right now. Sneakers that I'm like, when you look at it as something that's like a fashion item, if you're just paying like 125, it's seems really affordable. But yes, hike that up 30, 40 bucks and it's probably like another. It's still cheap for a fashion item. But yeah, that's significant.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, now's the time to invest in those like $5 Aldi sneakers or something. Is there 30% increase? There is not going to be so bad.

[Zofia Zvaglinska]

So I'll just on that point. I think on the last couple of weeks I've been researching, you know, the kind of resale sites but also kind of external retailers that sell sneakers. And the amount of sneakers from various brands that end up in sales is huge. So I'm wondering if there's been kind of overproduction across most companies and now as a result a lot of those popular models, you know, anything from like Adidas, Wales Bonner to some of the other kind of more popular ones from. I think it's from Puma or even the Sambas. Like a lot of those are still being sold through like very kind of intense sales. I think it was like 70% off or something. Like at least in the UK it feels like there's a bit of an oversaturation. I don't know if you guys are seeing that as well.

[Jill Manoff]

Not so much in sales, I was going to say. Well, but definitely more affordability. Like everyone is making. Even Dick Sports has a significant business in private label across all of its categories, including sneakers. So I think if you can get the look for less, maybe that's something they're going for. But I interesting about the sales. I didn't notice that myself.

[Danny Parisi]

Yeah, me neither. Okay, I think that's all the time we have to discuss sneakers this week. But thank you guys both for being here and thanks for going out and talking to some experts, including your nephew Joe.

[Jill Manoff]

I love to talk about it.

[Danny Parisi]

We should have him on the podcast for real in the future as a guest. I'm sure he'd love that.

[Jill Manoff]

I learned so much. He mentioned Yeezys, but said you don't want to wear Yeezys right now.

[Danny Parisi]

We didn't even touch on that. But as a quick aside, that also is both an example of a chunky sneaker that's not popular anymore, anymore, and was a huge blow to Adidas because that was like a billion dollar business that kind of fell apart. So your nephew was on the right track with that. But thank you guys both for being here. This was a great conversation.

[Jill Manoff]

Thanks so much. Thank you.

[Danny Parisi]

And thank you for listening to the Glossy Podcast. Don't forget to give us a rating and a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, wherever you listen to this, because that helps us out so much. And don't forget to subscribe to the Glossy Podcast to hear interviews with industry insiders and weekend review segments where we break down the news. The new episodes come out every Friday. Until the next time. Thanks for listening.