Loading summary
Transcript46 lines
- [00:01]
Jill Manoff
This episode of the Glossy Podcast is brought to you by Triple Whale. Struggling to make sense of your data, Triple Whale offers a range of solutions designed to streamline your e commerce operations. With sonar, for instance, you can transform your brand's meta campaign performance in just a few clicks. Learn how brands like Zox Allen and paw.com get increased conversions, accurate attribution, and higher ROAS. Visit triplewhill.com meta to learn more. That's T R I P L E W h a l e.com meta.
- [00:46]
Danny Parisi
Hello and welcome back to the Glossy Week in Review podcast. I'm your host, Senior fashion reporter Danny Parisi, and I'm here with our editor in Chief, Jill Manoff. Hello, Jill.
- [00:55]
Jill Manoff
Hello. Last recording of the Year.
- [00:57]
Danny Parisi
Last recording of the year. That's right. This is our last regular episode of the week in Review of the year. At the end of the episode, I'll give you a little preview of what our podcast schedule is through the last two weeks and when we'll be back to normal programming. We recorded a couple of fun episodes ahead of time to run over the break. Jill, you and I will be done tomorrow. Then we're taking the holiday break. I hope everyone else has a restful holiday as well. But before that, we have one more final Week in Review episode. Today we're going to talk about some of the latest developments in the Saks deal to buy Neiman Marcus, which I did not realize a lot of people are involved in that. Like a lot of companies other than Saks are invested in that deal. So we'll talk about that. We'll look at into Texas earnings. Inditex is the parent company of Zara. They had some interesting earnings this week. And then finally, we will take a look at a little preview of who's showing menswear in Paris this January. The schedule just came out. Well, talk a little bit about some other Fashion Week preview stuff for next year, which of course we will be covering both with stories and on the podcast. But let's start with this Saks Nieman deal. This is something we've talked about a little bit. The parent company of Saks hbc, is currently in the midst of a deal to buy Neiman Marcus. It's like a $2.65 billion deal. The news from last week is that in their quest to finance this massive deal, they are tapping the junk bond market, which I am not a finance expert at all. So I had to, like, do a little reading to really understand what this means. But basically, a junk bond is a bond that's at higher risk of defaulting, which usually means that the yield is higher. So basically they are taking loans from an external creditor, I think is the term, or debtor. I'm really bad at this stuff.
- [02:42]
Jill Manoff
No, I looked it up too. Yeah, you're. You're on the right track. Go ahead.
- [02:46]
Danny Parisi
It's like, higher risk, and therefore the investor is expecting a higher yield, basically. So high risk, high reward.
- [02:52]
Jill Manoff
Kind of like nobody reported, like, is this them saying, like, this is risky? Like, like, what does this say about this deal? They. They don't think it'll go through. It's. It's interesting.
- [03:03]
Danny Parisi
I think it's more that they really, really want it to go through, and so they're willing to take a bigger risk to make sure that it actually closes. That's the way I kind of Reddit and, and the vibe that I've gotten from HBC and from Saks in general has been that, like, a little bit of, like, quiet desperation where they're like, really, really wanting this deal to go through and kind of like taking big risks in the pursuit of that. Like, we've talked several times about Saks just straight up not paying their vendors and how angry that has made a lot of brands that sell through Saks. And I think the, the messaging that is coming from Saks leadership is like, sorry, we're not paying you, but like, if you just stick with us until the deal closes, like, then everything will be fine. Like, that's the vibe I'm getting, is that they just really want to close this as soon as possible. And then they're like, all of our problems will be fixed. We'll pay everybody back, and it'll all be fine. I don't know if I believe them, but that's the vibe I'm getting.
- [04:00]
Jill Manoff
It's really. I want to say it's scandalous because if the deal goes through and you know, and which we have to talk about, I'm sure we've talked about it in the past about why the FTC let the deal go through, because literally now every luxury department store will be have the same ownership from Saks to Niemann to Bergdorf. I mean, in the States, which is.
- [04:21]
Danny Parisi
All the big American, like, luxury department stores except Nordstrom, pretty much, yes.
- [04:25]
Jill Manoff
And so therefore, like, the deal goes through and now that gives the new company, which is called Saks Global, like, even more power because really there's no competition. So it's like, will trust you, but, like, then they can do whatever they want.
- [04:40]
Danny Parisi
Yeah. Honestly, I mean it. I Definitely think that's kind of their, their hope is that this goes through. They have not a total monopoly because again there is Nordstrom and Nordstrom is pretty sizable. But it's like one of, it's a duopoly, you know, it's like there's like, there'll be like two parties in all of like American kind of department store, luxury department store, whatever you call this category. The other thing though is like how useful is having a monopoly on a thing that's maybe a little bit on the way out? It's like department stores, I mean they're still huge, but I don't know, it just feels like it's been slowly. People have been transitioning away from doing all their shopping at Saks or something the way they did throughout the 20th century. I feel like there's been a move toward all sorts of other options, E Commerce from a million other marketplaces and everything. So it's kind of like, okay, congratulations, you're, you're now the monopolist of this like shrinking thing. I mean it's still like several billion dollars. So it's not, it's not nothing. But I do wonder if even like having almost total control of this market will actually be that useful, you know?
- [05:49]
Jill Manoff
Yeah. And, but on the same side you see like all of the, there's kind of a race to get multi brand luxury retail. Right. And there are all of these other platforms that are popping up and you talked about all the people who are involved in this deal, but along with Hudson, like Amazon and Salesforce are investors and obviously they're digital first. So maybe there's big plans to evolve the, the E commerce presence of these companies in a big way, I would think.
- [06:16]
Danny Parisi
Yeah. Amazon and Salesforce are invested. Private equity company Apollo, which is huge, is also invested. Also Authentic Brands Group, they have a joint venture with Saks that's called like Authentic Luxury Group that's supposed to be, you know, strengthening the luxury kind of caliber of their luxury brands. And they have said that they plan to take a minority investment in Saks Global once the deal goes through. So it's like this is a lot of people involved and a lot of people who will be expecting returns once it happens. You know, like they're putting a lot of money into this deal, but that means they want, they will want to see results after the fact. And so I feel like the vibe I'm getting is that HPC and Sax are kind of like promising everybody the moon because they're just like desperate to like make this happen. You know, and then after it happens, it will be time to collect and I'm like, I'm worried for them and.
- [07:11]
Jill Manoff
Their ability to do that, you know. Yeah. Because then the whole plan will crumble and yeah, everybody will just pull out and I don't know that they'll go direct. They'll find, they'll go to my. Teresa.
- [07:21]
Danny Parisi
Yeah, well, and you mentioned like multi brand luxury. I mean, I was saying, you know, there's so many other options except kind of some of the other options are also not doing so hot. Like we talked about. Farfetch'd kind of like getting sold for pennies. Yuxneta Porter got sold to Mytheriza. Mytheresa is a big player and they're doing well, but it's definitely like in flux. So there could be that this new mega company, Sax Global will maybe be able to steal some of that and kind of establish themselves. I don't know. Do you shop at any of these department stores that frequently, Joe?
- [07:54]
Jill Manoff
I mean, no, but I like to go in and you know, probably do what a lot of people do, use them as a showroom, get inspired and then find it cheaper. I'm such a bargain shopper and mostly these days I'm doing what we talk about all the time. I'm a resale girl. So yeah, I'm not buying anything full price at a department store these days, that's for sure.
- [08:14]
Danny Parisi
Well, and also under, under Saks Global is Saks off fifth, which is the off price one. And like I know from, I haven't looked at the numbers, but I know from Nordstrom, like Nordstrom Rack is huge. It's like a huge part of their business. It's growing so much. So I wonder in the new kind of version of Saks Global when the Neiman deal is done where Saks off 5th will fit into that, if they'll try to do anything more with off price because I feel like that's where the consumer is at, you know. Like I think there's a lot of people who are very, very deal focused and there always are. Obviously, you know, know you want a good price, but especially like the last year or so.
- [08:51]
Jill Manoff
Totally. I don't know what model Saks off fifth uses, if it's similar to Nordstrom, because Nordstrom, a lot of their product is made for off price. You know, it's made for that market. It's lesser quality and. But I, I was talking to the folks behind Belmont Park Village this, this week for the, the luxury briefing and so interesting. Like they, they only sell past season merchandise through their, their retailers which like Tom Ford and, and all of that. And I prefer that as an off price shopper. And I think there are certain things that it's interesting, I don't. It's interesting that Nordstrom Rack is thriving because maybe people aren't as it's. Cause I'm in fashion, kind of more of an insider where I like, I want the real stuff if I'm like buying Tom Brown. I don't maybe want the diluted stuff if I'm buying Tom Brown.
- [09:45]
Danny Parisi
Yeah. And there's definitely a consumer who doesn't really care that much or who maybe cares enough to want like the Ralph Lauren logo, but doesn't really care that it's actually the diffusion line or whatever. I was just reading the other day like a full breakdown of the like many, many different Ralph Lauren lines where it's like ralph by Ralph Lauren, Lauren by Ralph Lauren. R.L. by Ralph Lauren. Like, and they all have.
- [10:08]
Jill Manoff
There was one that was like Mark by Mark. By Mark.
- [10:11]
Danny Parisi
Yeah, Jacobs by Mark for Marc Jacobs or like something crazy like that. But like I think a lot of those companies, they kind of, there's the, the product itself and then there's the brand name. And sometimes it's like you, some people just want the brand name and they don't really care if it's like this is actually the cheaper line that uses the worse materials or whatever. And some people don't care at all. And then they'll just like buy it for $2 from Sheehan or something. Speaking of Shein, let's talk a little bit about Inditex. And that was a weird transition, but it is related. So Inditex is the parent company of Zara. They posted their earnings this week. And it's one of those weird capitalist things where it's like the sales were up 9% but they were not up as much as they were last year at 14%. So that's bad. And then the analysts were all like, this didn't meet our expectations and stuff like that. But it is actually, I think Inditex has been doing really well. The main thing that they said was an issue for them was currency exchange. And again, not a finance expert here, but they do a lot of their business in euros. And right now the euro is like very weak compared to the dollar. It's almost at parity, which actually makes my job easier because I always have to convert euros to dollars for our stories. And now it's like almost the same thing. So anyway, I think they mostly were just hit by the weird kind of like exchange rates. But Inditex has been actually doing extremely well. Their stock is up like 40% this year, which I think is interesting given some of the stuff we've talked about where like if you want fast fashion, you'll go for the cheapest stuff, you'll go for Shein or whatever. And then if you want something better, you'll go for higher quality thing. And Zara is kind of in between. But they actually seem to be doing really well. So maybe they are actually capturing that person who wants something more high quality than cheap Instagram garbage, but also doesn't want to buy, you know. So I don't know. We've talked about like maybe some brands. There's just the consumer goes in either direction. But they do seem to actually be catching some of those people in the middle. So.
- [12:07]
Jill Manoff
Yeah. And for whatever reason more so than their competitor H and M, which they're outpacing, outselling H and M right now. But Zara is I guess like fashionable people approved. It reminds me of like Uniqlo. Like it's one of those that, that like people don't mind saying that they're wearing it. It's not embarrassing. And also Zara has a good array of brands. They've got one called that's getting gaining more traction called probably mispronouncing it Massimo Duty. But I really love it and it's a little bit higher end than Zara. And so I would think maybe people who are shopping that this day and age with the economy, maybe the people are trading down from buying something more high end because you get the same look via some of these other, other brands also they're really shaking it up and I guess evolving. They've expanded into beauty and we hear about new beauty launches all the time. They've. If you go on their site now they've got a great pre owned section. Things look good. But yeah, interesting. Yeah, the, the slowed growth, it's like not that big a deal. But I also thought it was compelling that their growth was 9% year over year. Whereas like this in the top prime shopping time for holiday. So this is like, this is where people the growth should be going up compared to the first nine months of the year which actually it declined like it was. I think it was not that much higher for the first nine months. Maybe 11% growth year over year. But the fact that it declined at holiday is something that's interesting and maybe cause for concern.
- [13:40]
Danny Parisi
No, that's a good point. I Mean, I think we talked around Black Friday about how there was a little bit of, like, softened holiday sales in general this year, which is like, like you said, that's usually the time for a lot of companies where stuff goes up and it's kind of like it feels like it didn't happen like that. I think Uniqlo is a really good point of comparison where it's affordable and like, kind of like fast fashion but not embarrassing. Like, I mean, when I was in high school, I was like, Zara is like the fancy thing. Like, that's like, I, you know, I could barely afford anything from Zara, and that felt like very premium to me. And, like, it's kind of funny to talk about it as fast fashion now, though. It, it objectively is, but it certainly, I think, has a little bit more premium reputation compared to some similar companies. But I just think that's a little bit of a risky place to be because if you're like, if you're like, I'm going to compromise on quality because I want a better price, then I'm like, why not keep going? You know? And I think a lot of people do do that. They're like, well, if I'm already not going to buy, you know, Gucci and I'm already compromising down to Zara, why not just keep compromising and just buy from Shein or something? I don't know. Coming back to Shein, because it's like the ultimate bottom of that kind of mindset, you know, like, there's nothing cheaper or worse quality.
- [15:00]
Jill Manoff
Yes. That's why they, it's important. Like, they need to. Zara needs to maintain this a cool factor in terms of, like, their collaborations. They've done with, like, Kate Moss and they've done one with Harry Lambert, like Harry Sty Styles stylist. You know, their stores look high end sometimes. Sometimes they're. Clothes are everywhere. But anyway, yeah, they're doing a good job. But yeah, it's a slippery slope. Like, they can't. They can't, I don't know, bend, I guess. They can't let that quality slip.
- [15:31]
Danny Parisi
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Do you want to move on? Talk about Paris?
- [15:34]
Jill Manoff
Yeah, for sure. And P.S. yeah. And you mentioned the currency. Somebody also mentioned that, like, one of the causes for, for the decline was floods in Spain. I did not dig in.
- [15:45]
Danny Parisi
That's right.
- [15:46]
Jill Manoff
I don't know what's happening there.
- [15:47]
Danny Parisi
Yeah, I saw that as well. They said it had a minor impact, but it seemed like there was a lot of kind of little things that, that ate into some of their growth.
- [15:55]
Jill Manoff
No mention of Sheehan.
- [15:58]
Danny Parisi
They didn't talk. That was purely my insertion. Let's. But let's talk about Paris a little bit. So there was actually we can talk about a couple fashion week kind of stuff because it's coming up very soon. It's always, I feel like as soon as one season is done, the other is like now almost here. So in Paris, they announced in January there's going to be obviously menswear week. And the Federation de la Haute Couture La Mode announced some of the designers who are going to be there. There's some very cool people who are going to be there. Willy Chavaria, who we I think are both big fans of, will be making his Paris debut, which is cool. Jacques Mousse is going to be there. Peter Copping will debut his first collection with Lanvin. There's going to be some cool new designers like S.S. daly who just won the LVMH Young Designers Award. I think it's exciting. I know menswear week tends to get a lot less attention than like kind of the main fashion week, but I always like seeing menswear stuff. I mean obviously I'm of a personal interest in it, but I feel like there's a lot of interesting stuff there and that's where a lot of exciting kind of designs come about. You know.
- [16:57]
Jill Manoff
I agree. I love menswear. I'm obsessed. I think that with, with like Willie, it's for me, you know, some fellow editors that we've heard speak about New York, they consider it kind of a flyover fashion week. Like I can't believe I, I even went to New York this season and I'm like, well you were slumming it, weren't you? I love New York Fashion Week as well. However, yeah, this is signals that Willie Chabaria is I guess raising the bar or like hitting the big leagues as some would see it. Good for him. But yeah, a couple of trends like that I, that I saw in terms of the show, the men's shows happening, more brands doing co ed shows including Jacques Moose and Land Bon. So I don't, I mean it could be a case for like more bang for your buck. You're not doing two shows but also more brands moving to doing like off calendar shows the way they also dries also Givenchy and some of them have have to do with like transitioning creative directors. But however, I think that's it's a good move like if you are one of the brands that are like I mean a draw in yourself. Like, everyone's going to watch the Loewe show. You want to have a moment as opposed to like everyone watching your show going, oh, that was great. And then going on to the next show, like you get to have more of a moment off calendar. If you can afford to like create a moment, I would say so. That's exciting.
- [18:25]
Danny Parisi
I was going to say the exact same thing. I think Louisville is definitely one of the brands that can get away with going off calendar. It's sort of like if you are bigger than the week itself, then you can do whenever you want. But if you aren't, then the week is great because you kind of like can ride off the attention from, you know, everybody else. So I was thinking about that. You know, I've. I feel like we've talked about the idea that big brands kind of like are agnostic to the calendar and just show whenever for years. And I started like covering fashion seriously in 2018. So it was only a little bit before the pandemic. And I feel like it's kind of been like that as almost as long as I've been covering. I'm wondering, Jill, since you've been covering it longer, was there ever a time when it was like super strict and everyone only showed during the official like schedule or.
- [19:13]
Jill Manoff
Yeah, it was a big thing when people started going off calendar. I think an early designer to do that was Alexander Wang. It was a very big deal. But yeah, I mean, you know, I've been doing this a long time, so it's like Bryant park days. Not only did everyone show the same week, everyone showed in the same location. These are the rules. You're in or you're out. So yeah, people are going rogue. And with the Alexander Wangs of the World Series seeing that, I don't know, we use the terms like media impact, value, but it create. You can create much a big, a big buzz. I would say it's new. I don't know when it started or when that first, those first couple of shows start happening. And there was also for a time talk about how they were going to be like kind of mid season seasons. I think that one was going to happen in was it December or January and also July, but more aligned with the men's shows, I guess. Yeah, it didn't really take.
- [20:06]
Danny Parisi
And it's kind of like one, one brand does it and then another is like, well, we'll show around then too or something. And then you kind of like create your own little mini fashion week off to the side but, yeah, I feel like if you're a younger designer or a newer designer or like, just a smaller brand in general, there's a lot of value of, like, putting your show right in the middle of all the other shows, because people are milling about, they're looking for shows to go to. Like, you can get some halo effect from that. But then if you're Loewe or if you're Saint Laurent, you know, if you. You can do sort of whatever you want. And people are gonna show up.
- [20:38]
Jill Manoff
Yes, for sure. And it's interesting, like, you mentioned the menswear shows that SS Daily is showing, and I was like, wait a minute. I know they showed before Harry Styles was in the first row, but front row, but yeah, it's the first on schedule. Runway, debut, debut. And when you're. You're talking about, like, just, I guess, kind of just getting into the mix. Like, a lot of these designers just do something. You know, they'll have a presentation on the side. Like, they're not part of the calendar. People just ass. So anyway, what does it mean? Like, it's just. Is it just more expensive to be on the calendar?
- [21:10]
Danny Parisi
Probably, yeah. Yeah. I mean, I guess you can do a show whenever and wherever you like. They can't stop you from doing it during the. The period that is like Paris Men's Week or whatever, even if you're not technically part of the. The calendar. Speaking of, there was another thing. I saw London Fashion Week announced, not who's showing. Well, actually, I think they did announce it, but the main thing I saw was that the actual schedule is a day shorter. I think it's only like three or four days or something, which I'm sure Zofia will appreciate. But I do think that's interesting. I don't know what to read into that decision. Maybe it's just to make it more focused and less spread out or maybe reduce fatigue or something. I don't know if anybody feels that, or maybe it's just purely a timing kind of thing, but I did think that was notable.
- [21:56]
Jill Manoff
Yeah, but man, those couple of days better be very compelling with the designer showing. Because speaking of flyover fashion weeks, a lot of people skip that because it's so like, just. They just go on to Milan. So, yeah, hopefully those are action packed.
- [22:10]
Danny Parisi
Yeah. Well, and as I said, we will definitely be covering all the fashion weeks. We'll maybe not attend all of them. As you said, summer flyover, we'll be definitely be at New York, because I'm here. Zofia, I'm sure will be at London, and we will definitely be covering Paris from Milan, either from afar or in person. But I'm looking forward to it. I know you and I are on the same page. I enjoy the fashion weeks. Like, I like going to shows. I like it practically. I like when they're all doing it on calendar because it makes it easier for me. But. But I understand the. The desire to go off calendar too.
- [22:43]
Jill Manoff
Yes. I'm so excited. And like, we're. We're always there. We're always covering it. Did you see, like, circling back to the. The new calendar announcements that for the couture calendar, Margiela and Fendi aren't showing because of the creative director transition? Like, don't you feel like I'm going to be like, the show goes on people? Like, I feel like they, you know, there are designers in place, maybe not a head designer. It's just. It's just interesting that people skip for that reason.
- [23:10]
Danny Parisi
Yeah. Well, as I feel like I've been to shows or heard about shows where they literally don't even have a creative director. And it's like, you know, the design team, like, puts something together. So I'm like, okay, you can do a show with if you don't even have a creative director, but I guess if you do have a creative director and they're new and they kind of. They don't want something out there that they didn't work on or. I don't know. I'm sure there's lots of internal stuff, but I'm kind of with you, like, make it happen. I think it's fun.
- [23:36]
Jill Manoff
Give the people what we want. Yeah, I could see that though, too, for sure.
- [23:40]
Danny Parisi
Cool. I think that's all the time we have this week. Thank you again, Jill, for this episode and also for doing week interview with me all year. It's so fun. I love doing this podcast with you.
- [23:48]
Jill Manoff
So fun. It was a great year.
- [23:50]
Danny Parisi
For those of you listening, don't forget to give us a rating and a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, wherever you listen to this. That helps us out so much. Don't forget to subscribe to the Glossy podcast because you'll hear interviews with industry insiders every Wednesday and weekend review episodes with me every Friday the rest of this year. The way this is going to work. So we have an episode hosted by Jill, looking back at some of some of the best interviews we did from this year. So you can get a nice little recap of some of the great interviews we had over the course of 2024, we are skipping the Week in Review episode on Friday the 27th. And then after that, we will have a really fun episode that Jill and I recorded with our managing editor, Tatiana, looking ahead to 2025 and talking about some of the big stories we expect to be covering and talking about next year that will go live on January 1st. And then after that, we'll be back to our regular programing interviews episodes on Wednesday and weekend review episodes on Friday. So we will be logged off, but we have several episodes coming for you guys over the break and then back to to regular schedule programming after that. So that's all. Thank you all for for listening throughout 2024. We are very grateful for all the support, all the nice comments, all the all the listens. So thank you all. And until next year, thanks for listen.