← The Goal Digger Podcast | Top Business and Marketing Podcast for Creatives, Entrepreneurs, and Women in Business
The Goal Digger Podcast | Top Business and Marketing Podcast for Creatives, Entrepreneurs, and Women in Business
883: The Smartest Way to Turn Your Story into Sales, Leads, and Legacy
00:55:04
With Chandler Bolt and Jenna Kutcher
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- [00:02]
Jenna Kutcher
Thank you to Cozy for sponsoring the Gold Digger Podcast. Transform your living space today with cozy. Visit cozy.com spelled C-O-Z-E-Y.com the home of possibilities made easy.
- [00:16]
Chandler Bolt
Writing a book is kind of like learning how to ride a bike. Once you do it, you can do it again and again and again. And so you wrote the book that was true to your heart and that was the starting point. And now if you ever chose to do the next one, it would be 10 times easier.
- [00:31]
Jenna Kutcher
I'm Jenna Kutcher, your host of the Gold Digger Podcast. I escaped the corporate world at the age of 23 with nothing more than a $300 camera from Craigslist and a dream. Now I'm running a seven figure online business that feels even better than it looks. All from my house in small town Minnesota with my family here, we value time as our currency. We mix the woo and the work and we are in the pursuit of building businesses that give us the freedom to live lives that we love. I vi always loved turning big goals into reality and I'm here to help you do the same. This isn't just a peek behind the curtain. Come along with me and my guests as we tear the whole curtain down. Every week we tackle practical no fluff marketing strategies and host honest discussions on what works and what doesn't. Join me and my expert guests for actionable insights to help you grow your dream business with confidence. Pull up a seat and get ready to be challenged, inspired and empowered. This is the Gold Digger Podcast. Have you ever thought about writing a book? Not just to check it off your bucket list, but to actually grow your business on Autopilot. Imagine this one single book that acts like a 247 lead magnet, builds trust with your audience before they've even met you, and quietly funnels dream clients and customers into your world all while you're off doing your thing and living your life. Yeah, that's the magic of what we're talking about today. How a book isn't just a passion project, it can be your smartest business asset. My guest today is no stranger to the show. Chandler Volt is back for the third time because you guys love him and the results speak for themselves. He's the CEO of Self Publishing.com a seven times best selling author, a Forbes 30 under 30 honoree, and a straight up wizard when it comes to helping people write and launch books that actually make an impact in an income. And so if you're brand new to the idea of writing a book and want to start from square one, be sure to check out our past episodes together. They're linked in the show notes. Because this conversation, we're diving off the deep end and going next level. We're talking about the biggest mistakes entrepreneurs make when it comes to book strategies, how to use your book to grow your email list without spending all day on Instagram. Heck, Chandler doesn't even have an Instagram. And why publishing could be the most leveraged move you make this year. I also totally didn't expect this to happen. But. But I break down and cry in this episode about something I found out about my book. It was a surprising moment for all of us on the show and one of the most meaningful moments that this podcast might ever see. If this conversation gets your wheels turning, trust me, it will. Chandler is hosting a free class called how to launch your book to bestseller status in three easy steps. Even if you haven't written a single word yet or you don't have your book idea down pat, you can save your seat at self publishing.com forward slash Jenna that self publishing.com Jenna. We're also going to link that for you in the show notes. So if you are someone who's got a message to share and a business to grow, grab your favorite pen because, yes, this one's a note taker. And get ready to map out your book funnel blueprint. Chandler Bolt, welcome on back to the Gold Digger podcast. Okay, Chandler, what is the biggest mistake that entrepreneurs make when they publish a book and how does it keep their book from actually generating results like leads and revenue?
- [03:55]
Chandler Bolt
Yeah, I think the biggest mistake they make before publishing is they don't get around to writing it and they don't actually do it. But then the biggest mistake that they make around publishing is they don't align it closely to their business, so then it doesn't move the needle in their business. And I'll give a quick example in a story, kind of poke fun at one of my friends, Dan Martel, because he's a great example at one of these two things. And so for years I'm like, man, you got to get this book done. You got to do this book. I'm just kind of giving him a hard time and he put it off and then he did it. But he did the second thing really, really, really well, which is aligning the book with his business. The businesses exploded, his socials exploded, all that stuff since then. But then he came back and said, hey, I wish I would have done it years earlier. So, biggest mistake, they don't do it. Early enough, but then they don't align it to their business, which I think is something he's done an incredible job of.
- [04:46]
Jenna Kutcher
Oh, my gosh. And his book is so good. Like I have talked about, buy back your time if you haven't read it. Dan Martell. Dan, we love you, but that is so true. Is like you can wait on it or sit on the idea too long or you can miss, like, actually connecting it to something real that will change your business. And I also feel like in his instance as well is like I bought his book and then I bought a copy of it for almost every member of my team. Right. So, like, it was not just an intro of me to him. It was also like me becoming an evangelist for that book. Now let's start simple. Let's connect the dots of like, how can a book actually bring people into somebody's business? Because we gave a great example. But like, what does that actually look like?
- [05:31]
Chandler Bolt
Yeah, great question. I think I like to say a book is a. For me, it's a $7 million business card and it's what's a three pound business card? But it's also $7 million business card. Because this book right here is brought in probably about $7 million in the last year or so. But the way that we do that is you've got to, I think about three buckets. It's leads, sales, referrals. Right. So that's what I encourage people to think about with integrating a book into your business is how do I use this to get more leads, to get more sales, to get more referrals. Now, leads, these are the people who hear about my business because of the book. Right. Dan Martell is an example. Oh, wait, hold up. There's SAS Academy. There's the Martel Method. There's all this stuff I didn't know about that. I'm speaking for people reading that book, right. Until I read the book. Another example, Alex Hormozi. Hey, I read $100 million leads and then I found out about acquisition.com, russell Brunson. I, I read Traffic Secrets and then I found out about ClickFunnels. Right. It's a very proven model of get more leads, top of funnel. But then there's more sales that's turning more of the people who already know about you into paying customers. And so it's kind of like whether it's for you going from social to book saying, how are you really? Yeah. And let's continue the conversation here. And then. Okay. Wow, this is interesting. Now I'm creating a deeper relationship with Jenna. Oh, hold up. There's these other programs and stuff that she's got. Let's work together. So it's just integrating it into your sales funnel. That's how we do it. And then the referrals, it's turning active customers into active referrers, but in a way that is high value and builds goodwill. You know, not me just saying, hey, send businesses self publishing dot com. But hey, if you know anyone who's writing a book, just send them. In fact, I'll send them a copy of the book for you and tell them you sent it. Right. So it's adding value first and enabling people to refer you business. So I could talk on this for a really long time. But those are kind of the three pillars that I think about.
- [07:35]
Jenna Kutcher
I love that. And I feel like at the end of the day those three buckets are how we get results as business owners. Right. Like if you're not looking at lead sales and referrals in your business, no matter what your offer is, you're likely not getting a lot of results or you're not tying your actual efforts to real results. So I think those three buckets are prominent in every type of business that could be listening. So one thing I want to talk about. You and I have talked about a lot of different things about books, but one thing we've never really gone deep on is this idea of a book funnel. Okay, what the heck is a book funnel? Walk us through like we're third graders. What's a book funnel?
- [08:12]
Chandler Bolt
Book funnels are one of my favorite funnels. And book funnels have been dead for about a decade now. You know, books have been dead for I don't even know how long. But they're not dead. They are, I mean, better than ever. But a book funnel is. There's two things. There's one is the common free plus shipping funnel. Yeah, it's been one of historically one of our best converting funnels. It goes really well, which is essentially, hey, I'm going to give you a book for free, a physical copy of the book for free in exchange for you covering shipping and handling. And it's a very simple process. There's, you know, you've got a landing page, they cover the shipping and handling. You've got maybe order form bumps or additional products that they can add to cart. And the goal is to become a self liquidating offer. So to essentially break even on the cost of the book for, you know, the average order value of what they pay when they Go through that process. Right. So that is kind of your tried and true funnel. And the way I look at it is in doing that, you create a list of buyers instead of just a list of subscribers because you now have all those folks credit card on file. So a free plus shipping funnel, Tried and true funnel. Again, I love the quote that we get tired of our marketing before the market does. And that's a prime example where people think, oh, free plus shipping fun. Are you kidding me? It's been, how long has that been going on? Brendan Burchard back in the day, Tony Robbins back there. Okay, surely that doesn't work anymore, does it? Yeah, it does, but. So that's one. But then I also like to go a step further than that and say, hey, how can I give away my book for free in other formats? Either at the top of the funnel or integrated into the funnel. And so integrated into the funnel, it's pretty simple. You know, maybe you have a webinar funnel or you have something where there's a, there's a sales process, someone going from traffic to lead to webinar to maybe booking an appointment to purchasing. Well, how can I use the book anywhere and everywhere in that process to just give me a lift on show up rate or hey, if you, if you register, show up and stay to the end, I'll give you a free copy of my book. Okay, well now all of a sudden our show up rates up, our close rates up, our everything's up. But then I also like to do, I like to give away all different versions of the book for free. So audiobook, PDF, all that stuff. It's a little known thing that actually in the very beginning of my book, I do two things. There's the audiobook for free and then there's a video summary. And we find that just this works like crazy because you're adding value immediately and you're bringing them into your ecosystem. It has inherent value. I would pay $20 for an audiobook. You're giving it to me for free. Wow, this is great. But then it's also just, it's a way to continue the relationship and most importantly, take people from reader to subscriber. So those are kind of the different variations of book funnels that we use in the business.
- [11:07]
Jenna Kutcher
Okay, this is wild. So one thing that keeps like flashing red light in my head is you have to self publish if you want to do cool things like this. In my opinion. This is my opinion. We've talked about this before on other episodes, which we'll link in the show notes. But I went the traditional publishing route for my book and so I was working with HarperCollins. There's all these rules, there's all these promises. They are ancient, they're wonderful, but they are very set in old ways that don't necessarily convert. What I love about what you're talking about is when you self publish a book, you get to call the shots, you get to make the rules. And so you can say, hey, I want to do it this way or I'm going to test it this way or I can try it in this place. And that is just not possible in the traditional publishing world. And so I want to call that out because I think that it allows you to be wildly creative and it also allows you to experiment without having to answer to people that have different goals than you have as a business owner. One of the things that was so interesting for me in the process and I, I loved writing the book. I loved Mark, I loved everything about the book. I had such a wonderful experience. It was like so life giving and it's usually the opposite of that for certain people. And I loved it. But there wasn't a lot of room for creativity when it came to actually selling the book and then leveraging it inside of my business. It almost is this standalone entity that exists. And I was smart and savvy enough to have interesting call to actions throughout my book to get people into the ecosystem, but it kind of starts and stops there. And so it's like, point of sale is not necessarily in my control. The way that it's distributed is not necessarily my control. And I'm like, dang, you can be so creative when you self publish. Let's talk about that for a minute.
- [13:00]
Chandler Bolt
Well, you're 100% right. Even just the audiobook thing that I mentioned, if you don't negotiate out and carve out the audiobook rights, they won't allow you to do that. Sometimes they're a little bit particular about what calls to action you can do. Can you have opt ins in the book? Can all that. So you just. And even something as simple as, oh man, I had a friend and this happens all the time. My friends who traditionally publish like, hey, what can I do to sell more books? And I'll give them the rundown and one of the things I'll say, hey, let's start running some Amazon ads. The best way to have Evergreen sales is to have on platform ads directly to your book. And I'm like, okay, so dive into your account. He's like, oh, well, I can't.
- [13:39]
Jenna Kutcher
I don't know.
- [13:41]
Chandler Bolt
Yes, and that's exactly right. So the. On platform, in, in platform stuff on Amazon specifically, which, you know, there's a stat that says that, you know, about 70% of books sold are sold on Amazon and other online retailers. Well, wouldn't it be helpful to be able to actually press some buttons in that experience? Well, that's what you can do with yourself. Publish that you can't do when you're traditionally published, published. So all of those things just give you the freedom to do it how you want. And even free plus shipping funnels. Right. Just something like that. If you've got a. So this is one thing that you can do if you choose to go the traditionally publish route. It's just, it's a throwaway negotiation line item. But just negotiate the price on your author copies.
- [14:22]
Jenna Kutcher
Yeah.
- [14:22]
Chandler Bolt
And your ability to sell them through a free plus shipping funnel. Because the difference between you having to pay 10 or $13 versus the 3 to $5, is the difference in the math working or not? Are you even being able to do a free plus shipping funnel? So I don't want to bore people with all the, you know, maybe publishing jargon. This is just all the things that I see and I'm like, oh my gosh, if you just had these different things, you could sell a lot more books. But more importantly, move the needle more in your business from the book.
- [14:50]
Jenna Kutcher
Yeah. So I want to know, I mean, you have helped so many different authors get their books out into the world. And so let's say somebody listening to this, they already have a business or maybe they have a course or coaching program or something along those lines. How can they reverse engineer a book that then plugs right into their offer ecosystem? Like how would you think about a book? So if somebody's listening, they've got a business, they're like, this is fascinating. I didn't even think of this. What is the process to figure out? How does this plug into what they're already doing?
- [15:23]
Chandler Bolt
Yeah. So I think if you've got a course already, you've written a book, you just didn't know it yet. And the book is your course. You already thought through the structure, the things that you were going to say, all that. Now, sure, the book is maybe more strategies than tactics because the tactics will change and be outdated and whatever else. And the book is the 30,000 foot view, the course is the in the trenches implementation. But you've really already written the book, you just didn't know it yet. And I would say the same with a coaching program or with a business is ask yourself, what are the broken record conversations that you keep having over and over and over and over again in your business? And what if you just cover that in the book? And so for me, again, just use, I like to teach what we do because it's what's working. And I hate when people teach a theory and stuff that they're not actually doing. And so I look at it and I say, hey, all right, all of my stuff, some of my best stuff, is codified in my book. Now I give that book to every prospect and every customer by the time they get on the phone with my team, they sign up to work with us. They're my sales team's favorite conversations. Because it's not what do you do? Or how does it work? Or whatever, it's how do I work with you guys? And so it's just a totally different conversation. But then I also, it helps with the onboarding. So then it saves my team time in the onboarding. It helps with my employees onboarding where someone joins the company. I say, hey, read this book first. And, and so now we're all speaking the same language. So it just gives leverage in your business. And so that's how I think about plugging it into what you're already doing. And it's, I think a lot of times people think of it as a side quest. It's like, oh man, I'm going to do this book. It's going to be this huge distraction for my business. And if you do it correctly, it's actually not. It's the opposite. It brings you come back into your business and you say, leverage, leverage, leverage, leverage. I now don't have to do these 15 bajillion things because the book brings leverage to that.
- [17:23]
Jenna Kutcher
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I love that and I feel like one of the smartest ways, like if I were to ever do a book that's more business based or like strategy based, I would answer all the questions that I'm sick of answering inside of the book, right? Like here it is packaged and I think a lot of people, they feel like a broken record if you're answering the same questions over and over and over again. So to have a resource that isn't just digital, but it's like a tangible resource that you can send people to not only answers their questions, but it doesn't in a thoughtful way. Because how many times have we been asked something that we've been asked a million times? We're so sick of the answer ourselves that we barely answer it, or we leave out the good bits, or it's not even really exciting to listen to. I was just talking to some friends who wrote a book together, and we were saying we're like, people's best work is in their books. Because there is something so different from this digital era that we're in, where things live and die on the vine thanks to algorithms, or you can go in and edit it out. Having something that is tangible, that is real, that you can hold in your hands, that, you know could be printed a year from now or 10 years from now, changes the way that creators approach it. And I was telling them, I'm like, if somebody wants your best work, I would send them to the book. And every time, every single time, I just feel like the way that people enter into the book space is different. But it also is thoughtful, where you can answer something thoughtfully once you can include all the details in the bits that you might leave out as your eyes are rolling in the back of your head, like, I can't believe I have to answer this thing one more time. And the other thing that I love that you said, Chandler, is it is a beautiful separator in qualification. So a lot of people say they want the results that you teach, or they want the transformation that you've had, but they're not necessarily willing to get the skin in the game, whether it's through financial investment in buying the actual book, or it's in spending their time learning the process or hearing the story. And so if you feel like you constantly are getting in leads that aren't qualified, or they're not actually sure that they want what you have, or they're not willing to do the work if you keep hitting your head up against the wall of, like, why are these people saying they want this thing? But they're literally not taking any steps. I feel like a book is the most beautiful prerequisite you could invite into your ecosystem to qualify people and to answer all this stuff you're sick of answering so that you can actually get to the things that you love. And so I agree it's kind of one of those things that you could create once and leverage in so many different ways, whether it's exposure to new audiences or qualifying your current audience. And I feel like people are missing this about books.
- [22:48]
Chandler Bolt
I Completely agree. And it's, it's just enough of a hurdle that they have to take a step, which is the pre qualification, like you mentioned. But it's just low enough of a hurdle that it's an added value. And you don't feel bad asking them to do it. Like, I don't feel bad saying, hey, just get my book. And in a lot of cases I'll literally just give it to them and say, hey, just read this and then come back with questions. Or when my sales team, when someone's not ready to work with us, it's actually a very beautiful thing because what they'll do is they'll say, hey, it doesn't sound like you're ready to work with us, but I'm going to send you this bundle of resources. One is a free copy of this book. And so then all of the people who we disqualify from working with us thank us.
- [23:32]
Jenna Kutcher
Thank you so much.
- [23:33]
Chandler Bolt
Oh my gosh, that's incredible. And so they feel great. And then the people who work with us is helpful for them as well. And it just, to your point, it saves, it saves you a ton of time. But then I want to have a hurdle for them, but I also want to make it as easy as possible for them to actually consume the book. So that's why I will give them the audiobook or I will give them the PDF or the physical copy or whatever so that, yeah, I want them to take the step, but it's as easy as possible so that preferably they get done with that audiobook. We just had a seven hour conversation, now they're ready to go.
- [24:06]
Jenna Kutcher
Yeah, I love this. Okay, so you basically, you're gonna laugh when I say this, but you're like a book doula. Like, you are like helping bird books out into the world. Like, what a beautiful job.
- [24:18]
Chandler Bolt
You have called a lot worse.
- [24:19]
Jenna Kutcher
I don't know, but I'm like, when I think of what you do, it's like ushering in. Like, I often joke that like, I had twins because I had my daughter Quinn and my book were coming out very similar timelines and it felt like they were twins, right? Like the twin is the book. And so I felt like I was birthing a baby in a book at the same time. And so you have helped thousands of authors, even some of my audience, you've helped them since your last episode, get their books out into the world. So what are the key ingredients of a book that converts readers into an actual result? Whether that's an email, subscriber or a paying client. Like, what are some of those ingredients that a book must have?
- [25:00]
Chandler Bolt
Yeah, well, ingredient number one is you got to get pregnant. No, I'm kidding. No. You wouldn't believe how many people we've helped publish books that were pregnant and that it's the ultimate deadline.
- [25:12]
Jenna Kutcher
It's like, I gotta get this book.
- [25:14]
Chandler Bolt
Done before, before the baby comes. But yeah, we've probably helped. I don't even know how many dozens of folks from your audience since the last episode and since our last training. I think the core ingredients, I mean, number one, does it solve a problem for people and a problem that people care about? And I like to think about kind of the four P's of a best selling book. It's person, pain, promise, price. So person, write it to one person that you know. Right. And a lot of people struggle with voice or they struggle with how to say something or how to find their voice. Well, think about the one person that you're writing this book for and not an avatar. Someone you know. So let's say that that was Jenna for me. Well, then when I'm writing that book, all the questions are answered. Should I be serious or should I be funny? Well, how would I tell this? As if I'm writing a letter to Jenna. Okay, well, should I use this story or should I not? How would I say it to Jenna? Right. So just you start to answer all those questions. Then number two, the pain. So what's the pain that they have that they know that they have? That's really important. Not the pain that I know that they have. The pain that they're. They're problem aware. Right. As they would say. And so an example I like to use is let's say I've got back. Let's say I've got back pain.
- [26:28]
Jenna Kutcher
Yeah.
- [26:29]
Chandler Bolt
And I go to a chiropractor and he points out that I have bad posture. I'm sitting on my wallet, I'm, you've got bad posture, all this stuff. Well, he could write a book about posture. I would never read that book because that's a vitamin, not a pain pill. Right. But if he wrote a book about back pain and that same thing could still be in there. Right. I call this chocolate covered broccoli. It's the chocolate is what I'm there for and then the broccoli is on the inside. But if I just had a piece of broccoli, you'd say, oh, no thanks. Or at least most people would. And so if he writes a book on back pain and then in there is the posture stuff that I need. Well, now he's spoken to the pain that I have. And then the promise. What's the promise of the outcome that he, that you're promising with your book? Right. That's a compelling outcome. And then the price is pretty straightforward, depending on the format, that sort of thing. But if you do that well, well, then those four P's line up with the four P's of your business or of your offer. And if those are aligned, well, then now it actually makes the cash register ring in your business.
- [27:32]
Jenna Kutcher
I love this One thing that I love about what you were saying is like, even just nailing down the person like, this is going to help you in every area of your business, not just in writing a book. And I feel like a book makes you narrow your focus in a beautiful way of like, what do I actually want to say? Like, what do I truly want to say? What truly matters? Who am I speaking to? It crystallizes a lot of the nuance that exists in entrepreneurship that entrepreneurs are too busy ignoring. That can really help add that clarity and that definition that will take you to the next level. Like, I just think if you nail those things down in a book or outside of it, those are the pieces of the puzzle that I think a lot of people are missing while they're on the hamster wheel of all the other things a business takes. So how early in the process, let's say somebody is listening to this and they're like, gosh, I never really thought about writing a book, but now this is interesting. Like, how early in the process should someone be thinking about, like, okay, what is the business connection? Or what is the strategy here? Or what would the funnel be like? Is this something that's like an afterthought? Is it before you start writing, if somebody's listening and they've started a manuscript, is it too late? Like, walk us through that.
- [28:45]
Chandler Bolt
Yeah, great question. It's never too late. But I would also say it's never too early.
- [28:49]
Jenna Kutcher
Yeah.
- [28:50]
Chandler Bolt
And so we'll, we'll tell people, I'm sure, about the training we're hosting together. I would show up to that. We'll ideate it, we'll come up with ideas. Well, all that stuff. But I would think about if you can, before you start, begin with the end in mind. Stephen Covey. You know, let's, let's think about the four P's, let's align it to the business. Let's think about what are the broken record conversations that you have in your Business. What are the things that you just keep repeating over and over again or the things that you're tired of talking about? And if you start there, these are the objections that people have before doing business with me, or these are, you know, the reasons that they pick up the phone, like that kind of stuff. Okay, if you can start from there, obviously it's going to better connect to your business and better move the needle in your business. But even if you have most of the length of a book or a manuscript mostly written, chances are, I mean, it could be totally unrelated, in which case maybe you use it as a brand play, and maybe you wrote a memoir and it's only tangentially related to your business. Well, then, sure, you could publish that, and I would still tie it in, because now it's part of your brand, but it's not gonna make it rain like a on the money, you know, like the core business type book. But it can still move the needle in a meaningful way. But then I would just say, if you are at that point, how can you edit or massage that to tie into the business in some way? Which I feel like you did a good job of that.
- [30:15]
Jenna Kutcher
I was going to say, I feel like you're talking to me, but in a good way. Like, it's so interesting because, like, from a strategy standpoint, I did not follow the best strategy from a business standpoint. And what was so different about when I finally decided to write a book was that it wasn't about business for me, which was shocking. Right. Like, I've told you this before, but the first version of my manuscript was written as a business book. And as we widen the lens, I really had to let go of, like, the strategy piece of me that is so deeply ingrained in who I am and how I live in this world. It's like, I'm strategic. I like that. And so what I miss and what I missed out on is the ability to strongly tie my book back to my business. And I think that if I were to ever write another book, strategically, I'd be following all of your advice right now. And I don't. I don't regret the way that I did it, but it wouldn't make sense for the average person. Right. Because I already had a big brand and a big following. People were already invested in my life, and for most listeners, they might not be there yet. And so my experience is so separate from how you are teaching this, where I'm looking back and I'm like, dang, dang, dang. But at the same point too. My experience was mine alone, and it made sense for me. But it likely wouldn't make sense for most people listening. Which is why I keep having you. Come on, because I told you this. But, like, writing my book. And my book is, like, the best work I have ever done. It's the most meaningful work. It was really cute, Chandler. I might cry when I tell you this. But, oh, my gosh, I might cry. My grandpa recently passed away. Oh, shoot. And sorry. And we were cleaning out his apartment and my, like, book was there, right on his table. It was the one thing he, like, kept on his coffee table on top of all the photo albums and all the things. And he had written in all the margins and, like, underlined all the things. And, like, there's a chapter about him in the book and it was, like, circled and hearted and, like, all these things. And it was, like, the one thing that I wanted from his apartment. But it was, like, the only tangible extension of all the work I've done over the last decade was, like, this book, right? And just seeing, like, he even had his address label in the back cover of it. Like, if he ever lost that thing, see, somebody would know how to get it back to him. And so it's wild because I think that we look at books as, like, oh, this is, like, so much extra work and extra time. But, like, it's also such a tangible way to reach people. So all of this to say, I did not follow this strategy. And if I were coming at a book from a strategic marketing standpoint, I would follow yours. I don't regret how I did mine. But now, looking in hindsight, I'm like, ooh. But a book is, in my opinion, the most meaningful work most people will ever do if they ever do it. And I just wish more people would do it. It's a very long way to say that.
- [33:25]
Chandler Bolt
Well, hey, thank you for sharing that. I think that is so aligned with just my core belief. I mean, for me, it was. My dad handed me rich dad, poor dad at 16 years old. It changing my life forever. And just this feeling of, hey, books change lives.
- [33:41]
Jenna Kutcher
Yes.
- [33:42]
Chandler Bolt
They change the lives of readers. They change the lives of authors. And so it's just. It's some of the most meaningful work that you create. To your point, with. With your grandpa. I mean, my brother and I wrote. The first book we ever wrote was about our parents. And it was basically about the 15 things our parents taught us growing up that we thought were normal. We got out in the real world, realized no One gets taught this stuff is his perspective as a musician, obviously plays in the band, need to breathe. My perspective as a business guy on these same 15 things, and it's one of those things is like they will forever have that. Our kids will forever have that, our grandkids. And I think that everyone, even if you. So we're going off into left field here and this is not business at all, but it's impact and it's creating something that long after you're off this earth, it's still here. It's making a difference to your point. It's physical. It's. You know, you and I do a lot of online business stuff. You know, grandma.
- [34:41]
Jenna Kutcher
Table. Right. Like, there's no webinars hanging out on grandpa's coffee. Right? I wish there was, but yeah, it is. It just hit me of like how. Yeah, it's a real life extension of who we are. Okay, so if I were to write another book, not signing myself up for it yet, how would you like step by step, start thinking about the process. Like, does it start with idea? Do I have to come to you with like, I have an idea? Does it have to be like, here's the goal, like what is required to enter into this process of self publishing a book?
- [35:17]
Chandler Bolt
So let's just use you as a super hypothetical example.
- [35:24]
Jenna Kutcher
Like, you did not commit to this.
- [35:27]
Chandler Bolt
No, I. Well, I think what's beautiful about the process that you've. You've went through is that writing a book is kind of like learning how to ride a bike. Once you do it, you can do it again and again and again. And so you wrote the book that was true to your heart and that was the starting point. And now if you ever chose to do the next one, it would be ten times easier.
- [35:46]
Jenna Kutcher
Yep.
- [35:47]
Chandler Bolt
And both on the topic and on the process, if you wrote a down the fairway business book. But you know, obviously you teach on this stuff all the time. Yeah, that's great. But then also the process, I mean, you now know how to do it. There's a reason why there's not a lot of people who have written one book. There's a ton of people who have written no books. And then you see people who have a bunch of books. Right. And that's because you learn the process. And so the way I would think about it, and we'll talk about this on the training as well, is is the more writing method is a framework that we teach. M O R E mind map outline, rough draft, editing. And so that's kind of how I think about it, go through the kernel of the idea, then turn it into an outline, then write the rough draft, then move into the editing process. But it all starts with the mind map. And for a lot of people, you're probably listening to this or watching this. Hold up, I'm not even there yet. I don't know what I would write about or I don't have ideas. And so start with that mind map and I think you'll find out there's a lot more that you can say than maybe you think.
- [36:48]
Jenna Kutcher
Okay, walk us through how to do a mind map. Here's a really quick, funny story, Chandler. The first time I ever met my husband, we were in this comm class. And our first assignment was to make a mind map. And he is convinced that I played dumb not knowing what a mind map was. I literally didn't know. And so I asked him to meet me in the basement of our dormitory hall so that we could make mind maps together. And he claims that that was like one of our first dates. If somebody's listening and they're either playing dumb or they really don't know what is a mind map. Or walk us through how to start one.
- [37:23]
Chandler Bolt
Well, first off, are you. Is this is disputed? Is this is such a dispute?
- [37:28]
Jenna Kutcher
He also claims that I had a low cut shirt on when I came to the basement of his dorm. I disagree on all that because you couldn't get this girl out of sweatpants when I was in college. So I disagree. I think he has a really altered reality of what that memory was.
- [37:43]
Chandler Bolt
You know, this sounds like me and my wife debating how we met and our first date and all this stuff. But that's a story for another time. So the mind map process I like to think about. All right, start with a blank sheet of paper. Circle in the middle of the page something that looks kind of like this as a little example. I still use this all the time for different things. So circle in the middle of the page with your idea, the thing that you could write about, the broken record conversations that you're having, whatever that thing is. Then set a timer for 15 minutes as soon as you're done listening to this. Or tonight before you go to bed and just brain dump everything you can think of on that topic. What are the stories that you have, lessons that you've learned, maybe client wins. That you would want to talk about in a book. Maybe it's the broken record conversations that you keep having over and over again. The questions people have before they work with you. Any of those things mind map. And then in that process you're going to start to see ideas flowing. Now you can group those into groups or themes, start to create the structure of the outline, which the better the outline the easier the book. That really kind of greases the wheels of the whole rest of the process.
- [38:49]
Jenna Kutcher
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We've even celebrated holidays in these coffee cozy homes away from home. And it got me thinking, if you've got a few trips on the calendar too, and your home's going to be empty, you should be hosting with Airbnb's co host network. You can have a local co host take care of everything. They can manage guest messages, check ins and all the details for you. It's not about turning your home into a business. It's about making it work for you on the days that you're not in it. So if travels on your calendar, this is your sign to start hosting. Your space could be creating memories for someone else while you're off making your own. Find a co host today@airbnb.com host okay, and I think too one thing we've been doing, Chandler, that's interesting that you really talk about and teach on is like one thing I realized is after writing my book, I kind of stopped writing. Like I wasn't writing consistently. And so one habit I've gotten into is every week somebody on my team gives me three story prompts and it's literally like, tell me a time when. And it could be like you had fear, but you did it anyways. You were embarrassed and you thought you'd never recover. You went into something with one expectation and walked out with something totally different. It's like literal, like we're making a story log in my in my business, which is something we did in the past, haven't updated it in so long. And it helps you to see how many stories you have, whether they are from a decade ago or from today. And it's honestly helped me so much in even just like acknowledging the different day to day stories. I feel like on social I've just been showing up more vulnerable More just like sharing my thoughts and what I'm thinking about and conversations I'm having. And so I think a lot of times people think like, well, I haven't written in so long, where do I even begin? Or I have no stories to tell. And it's like, oh my gosh, when you start to unearth it, it's almost like the floodgates just open and you not only look at life differently, but you kind of evaluate. Like for me, writing my book was like so therapeutic in so many ways of like thinking through all the different things that taught me the lessons I've learned along the ways and acknowledging those moments and those people and those things. And so I just feel like a mind map can start to unlock so many things that you have already experienced, so many stories that already exist, so many things that you might have even forgotten about that like come up to the surface. It's like literally just like twisting the key and opening the gates. And like, I feel like so many people I know that have written books, it's like once they get started, the floodgates open and you literally can't stop. That was my experience. I know so many people who have had that experience and I want my listeners to have that experience too.
- [44:31]
Chandler Bolt
I agree with that. I love that and I love the so parallels. Right. You're creating content for social. There's stories, there's takeaways, there's lessons. It's a muscle similar to the book writing process. And even just the, it's a really interesting. This kind of your story bank process, if you will. I think that's helpful for the book creation process because I don't know if you're anything like me, but I'm a very much a teach, teach, teach, kind of like I've got a book or I've got anything like I want to teach and I'm not going to tell stories because that's going to be wasting their time. They want to learn.
- [45:03]
Jenna Kutcher
Yeah.
- [45:03]
Chandler Bolt
But then I realized, hold up the most compelling and interesting, you know, sermons that I listen to or books that I read are very story based.
- [45:12]
Jenna Kutcher
Yes.
- [45:12]
Chandler Bolt
Huh. How about that? And so it's been something I've had to really consciously work on. So I'm, I'm going to give that process a try of just mind mapping all the things I want to teach, but then on the other side mind mapping the stories that I can tell. So, oh, this story, there's this story that, oh, that story matches with that lesson and that story matches with that lesson and kind of Bring in the content to life.
- [45:32]
Jenna Kutcher
Yeah, I love that. And that. You're exactly right. Like, I am the person who types out the slack message and then has to go back to the beginning and be like, hello, good morning. I hope you're well. Because it's like, I am straight to the point. Every email I write, I have to always go back to the beginning and add in the niceties and like, the greetings. Because I just am like. So like, literally, let's just rip off the band aid and get to it. And not everybody is like that, but I am the same way when it comes to teaching and tactics and strategies. And I have felt the same way even in webinars. Like, I often were like, I was a person where I was like, let's just get to it. And it's like, no, people remember stories. They need to relate. They need to know you relate to them or you understand them. And so I think it's also just a beautiful way of like, okay, how do I relate to them? Or why do I relate to them? Or when was the time that I actually felt this pain? And it's interesting too, because I think a lot of people who have built businesses, they're so far removed from those early days that they can have struggle connecting to the people that they want to serve because they've forgotten. What does it feel like to be a beginner? Or what does it feel like to have that pain and not know how to get the transformation? And I know for me, like, writing the book, like, brought me viscerally back to those early days of all the different things that I've been through. And it really kind of grounded me again into, like, why do I do this? And like, how did I get here? And like, what were the pivotal moments? And so I don't know. For me, writing a book was like, so amazing to like, be reminded of all of those things. And I, I know you agree with this, but I think everybody has a book within them. And I think that the more people that can see that and honor their own story or the things that they've learned, either the easy way or the hard way, like, the more that we are getting this out into the world and not like coveting or gatekeeping the things that could change other people's lives, because I just believe we're a bunch of people walking around thinking everybody knows what we know and it's not true.
- [47:32]
Chandler Bolt
And in fact, they don't know most of what you know. Correct.
- [47:35]
Jenna Kutcher
Correct.
- [47:36]
Chandler Bolt
I feel so seen on the, on the edit.
- [47:39]
Jenna Kutcher
Yes.
- [47:40]
Chandler Bolt
It's me. That's my life.
- [47:43]
Jenna Kutcher
Oh, my gosh. Okay, so one final thing that I want to talk about. So I just finished up an interview with two of my dear friends, and they wrote a book. They're amazing. And I literally remember talking to them about the whole book process two years ago when my book came out. And they were saying that they loved the creative side of writing a book, but they hate the selling of it. Like, that part feels vulnerable. They want to not do it. That, you know, it's just they're having all the resistance. And I think a lot of people are creative and they like being. Being in that creation mode. But the actual selling of the creation can feel really sticky. So can you help us walk through, like, some strategies or any tips you have around actually selling the book? Because I would gander to bet that there are people literally sitting on manuscripts or ideas for manuscripts, but the thought of selling that thing and putting it out into the world and getting it into the hands of their readers is the thing holding them back.
- [48:40]
Chandler Bolt
Yeah, I mean, I. I would say there's two components. There's the mindset, and then there's the tactical, which if you don't. If you don't master the mindset, nothing else matters. Which. I was someone who hated sales and marketing, and then I dropped out of school. And, you know, I'd had some businesses that had done decently well, but then I was kind of starting from scratch, and I had a mentor who said, chandler, you need to meet Sam. I'm like, okay, great. Who's Sam? Why do I need to know him? He said, well, Sam is sales and marketing. He said, if you build it, they will not come. Like, you got to tell them about it. So you got to learn sales and marketing, and you are the driver of your book's success if you truly believe that this book is going to change people's life. Well, you can't change their life if they don't read it. They won't read it if they don't buy it. And they can't buy it if they don't know about it. Right. And they can't know about it if you don't get really passionate about saying, hey, this is going to be helpful for you and you in. In learning sales and marketing. So you got to take the mindset first. And honestly, nothing. Nothing else matters if you don't have that. But then once you have that mindset for marketing, it's. It's moving into some very tactical stuff, one of which is this concept called a launch team. So it's a small group of people who support you in the topic of your book and pulling together. If you just do one thing, just do that. It's kind of a lot to unpack on, pack it on the training that we're doing. So show up for that. I'll walk through the whole process and it'll help you create a launch team. And if you just do one thing, create a launch team, your book will be more successful. But again, if you don't have the mindset and learn to love it, even though you. You might not love it up front, well, then the book's not going anywhere and it's not going to help people.
- [50:21]
Jenna Kutcher
Yeah. Okay, let's talk about this training. We've been teasing it. This is the comeback tour, because every year we do this and books are born. Chandler is the doula, and it is so exciting, and nothing brings me more joy. So what is this training that you're hosting? Tell me about it. Tell me why somebody should be on it, and I'll tell you where to go.
- [50:43]
Chandler Bolt
Yeah. So it's gonna be awesome. It's live on June 10th, so if you're seeing this before, then you can register. If you're seeing this after this, we'll also evergreen it so you can watch the replay. But we're going to talk about how to come up with an idea. We're going to talk about how to get the book written in as little as a weekend, which I know is kind of a crazy concept. But then we'll talk about the three steps to launching the book as well. It's going to be a lot of fun. Like you said. I think this is the comeback tour. I think since last time, I don't even know how many dozens of books we've launched from your community, but it's been pretty incredible. So it's self publishing dot com. Jenna. You can register for the training there, and it's gonna be awesome. I'll give you a free copy of the book when you show up. We practice what we preach here, literally. So show up. You'll get. You'll learn a bunch of good stuff. Get some free stuff. It'll be fun.
- [51:32]
Jenna Kutcher
Yes. Yes. I love this training just because I think so many people are just stuck either sitting and waiting to have the idea come or sitting on the idea itself or starting the manuscript and then thinking, now what Instead. So this is such a fun training, and I just think it's so beautiful. I want to be the godmother of all the books that are born. Because I just feel like books are such a beautiful thing. I feel like my grandpa reminded me of that just a few weeks ago, of just how powerful they are. And Chandler, I feel like you are just such a great teacher of this and simplifying the process, that often feels daunting and overwhelming. I feel like if you do a book right, it's not going to take you out of your business. It's only going to add to your business. And so I think that this is a big, a beautiful way to do that. So, self publishing.com Jenna for the free training. I'm so excited to do that as well. Chandler. Where can everybody find out more about you and learn from you and of course, sign up for the training?
- [52:29]
Chandler Bolt
Yeah, I mean, first and foremost, just show up to the training. So self publishing.com Jenna, register for the training. You'll get a free copy of my book, whatever format you want. We'll hook it up for you. Show up live. We're going to have a lot of fun. It's going be awesome. And you can find us@self publishing.com you can find me on social here and there. I don't have an Instagram, but I'm on LinkedIn and Facebook and all this. Maybe Instagram might be coming soon.
- [52:54]
Jenna Kutcher
I love that for you. I'm so happy for you. Awesome. Thanks for coming back on the podcast. As always, it's such a treat to have you back.
- [53:03]
Chandler Bolt
Thank you, Jenna.
- [53:05]
Jenna Kutcher
I love talking books with Chandler. I feel like he is a wizard and a leader in this industry when it comes to helping authors not only write their books, but get them out into the world in the most meaningful and impactful ways. And I love this idea of using a book strategically as a part of your business ecosystem, as a way to help people fall in love with you, as an offer to the world and a way to add value. I just feel like books are so, so powerful and I personally do not know anyone better than Chandler to help you get your book out into the world. So I love his free training. I attend it every single year. I have his book, I have his blueprint. It is so, so powerful. And I absolutely love hearing from all of you who have used his system and his blueprint to launch your book out into the world. And so if this is something that you are considering or if you've never considered it until this episode, but you are now, go save your seat for his free master class. Self publishing.com forward slash. Jenna, I will be on the training cheering you on and I'm excited excited to hear your ideas for books. And thank you so much for listening to this podcast. If you know somebody who has a book in them or you're like you've told your friend, you need to write a book about this, send this episode to them or any of my past episodes with Chandler to plant that seed in their mind and invite them to the free training. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Gold Digger Podcast. Whether I'm laughing or crying, you are along for the ride and until next time time keep on digging your biggest goals. Thanks for pulling up a seat for another episode of the Gold Digger Podcast. I hope today's episode fueled you with inspiration, gave you information that you can turn into action, and realigned you with your true north in life and business. If you've enjoyed today's episode, head on over to gold diggerpodcast.com for today's show Notes, discount codes for our sponsors, freebies to fuel your results, and so much more. And if you haven't yet, make sure you're subscribed so that you never miss a future show. We'll see you next time, Gold Diggers. Please note, this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements, and individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in the episode. Your support through affiliate links or sponsored content helps us continue to bring you valuable content. Thank you for being a part of the Gold Digger community.